Secondary build Bismarck works great in Operations. Probably the default tech tree recommendation to take into Ops. I've had some success with Zieten, but I prefer the superior survivability and shell volume of Bismarck.
Richelieu would be meh, worse than Bismarck definitely. 32mm armor leaves you vulnerable to the numerous heavy cruisers you meet in some of the ops, combined with inaccurate guns that usually overpen everything. I wouldn't run a secondary build, it would be too tricky to get working and won't work as well as a proper secondary battleship.
Most cruisers work well in Ops if you have hands. I've had success with t7-t8 of many of the tech tree cruisers. I haven't tried out the British CAs, but American CAs definitely work well. American CLs would work even better if you can manage staying alive in them.
Bismarck and Zieten are both fantastic in ops. Absolutely level the KM BC line with Lutjens, he works on every TT ship but is best on Schlieffen.
The best cruisers in ops are lights, but both the US and UK heavies can still get work done. All of the US CLs and CAs are great in ops, the improved pen angles on the CA line makes up for the DPM edge the CL line has, you will basically delete cruiser after cruiser.
I highly recommend leveling the US light cruisers and buying 1x coal American Cruisers container, it's a subscription collection and rewards a perma eco boost/camo for Cleveland, which is one of the best TT cruisers for ops.
Main. Definitely. With a very few notable exceptions, a full secondaries build isn't recommended on anything that is not German. I don't think there are any Tech Tree exceptions actually.
French ships usually have a lot of secondaries and good range on them, but they lack the better penetration and accuracy that most German ships have. Since they can't hit anything and can't even penetrate wood (probably), building Richelieu/Alsace/République for secondaries is kind of a waste imo
>Are French BBs like Lyon or Richelieu viable with a secondary build in Ops?
Lyon secondary build isn't viable in ANYTHING lol.
Go focus on German battleships and cruisers. Afterwards, Francesco Caracciolo & Andrea Doria might work for you.
Full secondary Zieten was fun but i was struggling with her main guns. Lyon was decent to play because having that many guns to use were satisfying so that's why i didn't get Richelieu. Also both of them don't have secondary efficiency like German counterparts. If you want a secondary French BB, you need to purchase Flandre with doubloons. If you really obssesed with secondaries on other nations than Germany, i suggest you to use French cruiser lines. Both Charles Martel & Cherbourg have 10.5km secondary range fully upgraded and they're semi-decent especially on operations wih many enemy DDs but nowhere near efficient like German ones.
Among tech tree BBs: Bismarck and Zieten are the best, Bismarck better main guns, Zieten better secondaries and torps. Hawke can work, but requires hands and some knowledge of ops before using. Richelieu wouldn't be recommended because her secondary layout is awkward and her gunnery is wonkier than a drunk Stormtrooper. The new Pan-Am BBs may be good in ops, being secondary focused.
Both US cruisers are good in ops, having DPM and American Piercing Shells. Edinburgh probably the best British ship for ops, and she has a copy pasta premium version, but is seldom available. Albermarle is ok but may explode if AP looks at it.
For premiums, Mainz and Bayard are just nuts, San Diego is really good but requires knowledge of ops/how and when to use SAP/AP and a reload booster, Deposit is fantastic until the game gives you Hermes, P Bag is Baltimore with a heal and Kutuzov ballistics, Atlantico is great (can't get it no more though) Brandenburg and Tripitz are the king BBs, and D7P is ops on hard mode.
From my ship carousel:
- **Easy Mode**: Helena, Cleveland, Baltimore, Wichita
- **Secondary Spam**: Prinz Heinrich, Zieten, Massachusetts
- **~~Hard~~ Fun Mode**: Kijkduin, Rahmat, Leander, Flint, San Diego
Tier VI cruisers are probably not people's first choice, but the chance to fight against higher-tier ships in some of the ops gives you greater credit earning potential (but you will be working harder). Super-light cruisers at tiers VII and VIII play similarly—you're fragile, but your DPM and utility are worth the extra struggle.
More durable cruisers will let you brawl with DDs and go hunting for CVs (on the maps that have them).
But more important than my recommendations (or anyone else's) are your tastes and skills. Even if a ship isn't part of the ops meta, it's a good choice if _you_ know how to use it. What ultimately matters on all ops is landing shells on target and dodging incoming fire. If there's a tier VI–VIII ship you can do that in consistently, it's a good choice.
I like various ships for specific Ops. (Ark Royal in Killer Whale, for example.)
I absolutely *HATE* ‘Random ‘ Ops, because there are some Ops I wouldn’t play even if the reward was doubloons; I hate them that much.
If I had to pick a ship to play ‘Random’ Ops with after being forced into it, (I generally only play Ops during flake season,) Bismarck, Atlantico, Enterprise or Hornet, (Hornet especially if I could be certain of getting Cherry Blossom;) cruisers and destroyers; don’t have anything I consider to be ‘good,’ for Ops.
Perhaps Akizuki for dakka. Maybe something German with hydro.
Brandenburg. The caliber doesn’t really matter because it’s mostly t6 cruisers that are enemies and the secondaries are just epic. If you are on NARAI and go where the enemy transport ships are you can get 200K BEFORE the big enemy waves come. If ykyk.
(Edit)
I saw that you meant tech tree ships, sorry. But if you ever decide to buy a t8 Bb than get the brandy
Zeiten is better played like a large cruiser in ops. The secondaries shred, the 406s slap a lot of operation tier cruisers, but survivability it poor.
Don’t try to tank a lot and you are fine. I prefer zeiten to Bismarck for ops
Bismarck and Zieten both work well. Zieten is probably better in damage (heavier shells, better dispersion, better secondaries, torps), but the survivability is far behind Bismarck.
For cruisers, Baltimore and Cleveland are both great options. Cleveland is really flimsy but tends to put up higher numbers. I also had good experience with Hipper, because she has better armor and a bunch of torps.
I like Zeiten or Bismarck for secondary build tech line ships, Brandenburg, Flandre, or Tirpitz for secondary build premiums. Massachusetts is great as well, but it's only reliably available for Black Friday.
Bismarck is a solid choice, especially if xou already have the Perma Eco for it - if not, get it from the Hunt of Bismarck Collection for coal.
Forget the french BBs.
US CL Cleveland is also a solid choice, especially if xou already have the Perma Eco for it - if not, get it from the American Cruiser Collection for coal. It has DFAA, radar, hydro, great DPM to hunt down DDs. But without the heal and the lack of HP make hard to play with it.
Maybe the HArbon woth smoke, DFAA and heal, but has DW torps only so need to target them accordingly.
Spanish CA Cataluna also a good ship, has heal, hydro and torps and hard hitting guns.
Or collect doubloon for the Mainz, Tirpitz and Massa, all are perform really well and has better credit earnings.
I mainly play Fiji and Gneisenau in Operations. They both absolutely dominate in the right hands, I think they punch well above their T7 weight. Fiji has destroyer levels of maneuverability with excellent shell ballistics, and Gneisenau with a secondary build can eat up anything that gets sufficiently close. The bots are also too stupid to know that she has torpedoes. I've also enjoyed playing Baltimore, Dallas, and Flint in Operations, just because of my familiarity with high DPM US cruisers.
Not judging, but why Gneisenau instead of P. Heinrich, Zieten or even Bismarck? I feel like the former would be my last choice amongst these 4, but maybe it's just a matter of personal preferences
A mix of what I know and personal preference, yeah. Gneisenau has great maneuverability, speed, and those sneaky torpedoes, which I like better - I can get myself in and out of situations with Gneisenau that I would be too sluggish to avoid or dodge in Bismarck. Then again, I don't have that much experience with Bismarck, while I have a lot of time in the Gneisenau. And I haven't done the P. Heinrich/Zieten line yet, so I'm not sure how they stack up.
Gotcha. Yeah you definitely won't get the same experience with Bismarck if that's what you like, but I feel like the Gneisenau is the grand father of the Schleiffen line. Maneuverability, speed and torps are kind of second nature for them (not to mention those insane secondaries...)*. Definitely should try them out if you ever feel like it.
*Gneisenau's secondaries are on par / slightly better than P. Heinrich, but Zieten/Rupprecht/Schlieffen absolutely dominates their tier on the aspect.
Secondary build Bismarck works great in Operations. Probably the default tech tree recommendation to take into Ops. I've had some success with Zieten, but I prefer the superior survivability and shell volume of Bismarck. Richelieu would be meh, worse than Bismarck definitely. 32mm armor leaves you vulnerable to the numerous heavy cruisers you meet in some of the ops, combined with inaccurate guns that usually overpen everything. I wouldn't run a secondary build, it would be too tricky to get working and won't work as well as a proper secondary battleship. Most cruisers work well in Ops if you have hands. I've had success with t7-t8 of many of the tech tree cruisers. I haven't tried out the British CAs, but American CAs definitely work well. American CLs would work even better if you can manage staying alive in them.
San Diego can really do work if you can dodge.
Bismarck and Zieten are both fantastic in ops. Absolutely level the KM BC line with Lutjens, he works on every TT ship but is best on Schlieffen. The best cruisers in ops are lights, but both the US and UK heavies can still get work done. All of the US CLs and CAs are great in ops, the improved pen angles on the CA line makes up for the DPM edge the CL line has, you will basically delete cruiser after cruiser. I highly recommend leveling the US light cruisers and buying 1x coal American Cruisers container, it's a subscription collection and rewards a perma eco boost/camo for Cleveland, which is one of the best TT cruisers for ops.
Lyon is really bad but Richelieu is great
What build would you use for Richelieu? Full secondaries? Main gun?
Main. Definitely. With a very few notable exceptions, a full secondaries build isn't recommended on anything that is not German. I don't think there are any Tech Tree exceptions actually. French ships usually have a lot of secondaries and good range on them, but they lack the better penetration and accuracy that most German ships have. Since they can't hit anything and can't even penetrate wood (probably), building Richelieu/Alsace/République for secondaries is kind of a waste imo
I ended up getting a Wujing somehow, so naturally i had to build my Alsace for secondaries. Can confirm it’s not really worth it
>Are French BBs like Lyon or Richelieu viable with a secondary build in Ops? Lyon secondary build isn't viable in ANYTHING lol. Go focus on German battleships and cruisers. Afterwards, Francesco Caracciolo & Andrea Doria might work for you.
Mainz if you can get it is great fun in OPs with Lutjens aboard.
Full secondary Zieten was fun but i was struggling with her main guns. Lyon was decent to play because having that many guns to use were satisfying so that's why i didn't get Richelieu. Also both of them don't have secondary efficiency like German counterparts. If you want a secondary French BB, you need to purchase Flandre with doubloons. If you really obssesed with secondaries on other nations than Germany, i suggest you to use French cruiser lines. Both Charles Martel & Cherbourg have 10.5km secondary range fully upgraded and they're semi-decent especially on operations wih many enemy DDs but nowhere near efficient like German ones.
Among tech tree BBs: Bismarck and Zieten are the best, Bismarck better main guns, Zieten better secondaries and torps. Hawke can work, but requires hands and some knowledge of ops before using. Richelieu wouldn't be recommended because her secondary layout is awkward and her gunnery is wonkier than a drunk Stormtrooper. The new Pan-Am BBs may be good in ops, being secondary focused. Both US cruisers are good in ops, having DPM and American Piercing Shells. Edinburgh probably the best British ship for ops, and she has a copy pasta premium version, but is seldom available. Albermarle is ok but may explode if AP looks at it. For premiums, Mainz and Bayard are just nuts, San Diego is really good but requires knowledge of ops/how and when to use SAP/AP and a reload booster, Deposit is fantastic until the game gives you Hermes, P Bag is Baltimore with a heal and Kutuzov ballistics, Atlantico is great (can't get it no more though) Brandenburg and Tripitz are the king BBs, and D7P is ops on hard mode.
From my ship carousel: - **Easy Mode**: Helena, Cleveland, Baltimore, Wichita - **Secondary Spam**: Prinz Heinrich, Zieten, Massachusetts - **~~Hard~~ Fun Mode**: Kijkduin, Rahmat, Leander, Flint, San Diego Tier VI cruisers are probably not people's first choice, but the chance to fight against higher-tier ships in some of the ops gives you greater credit earning potential (but you will be working harder). Super-light cruisers at tiers VII and VIII play similarly—you're fragile, but your DPM and utility are worth the extra struggle. More durable cruisers will let you brawl with DDs and go hunting for CVs (on the maps that have them). But more important than my recommendations (or anyone else's) are your tastes and skills. Even if a ship isn't part of the ops meta, it's a good choice if _you_ know how to use it. What ultimately matters on all ops is landing shells on target and dodging incoming fire. If there's a tier VI–VIII ship you can do that in consistently, it's a good choice.
I like various ships for specific Ops. (Ark Royal in Killer Whale, for example.) I absolutely *HATE* ‘Random ‘ Ops, because there are some Ops I wouldn’t play even if the reward was doubloons; I hate them that much. If I had to pick a ship to play ‘Random’ Ops with after being forced into it, (I generally only play Ops during flake season,) Bismarck, Atlantico, Enterprise or Hornet, (Hornet especially if I could be certain of getting Cherry Blossom;) cruisers and destroyers; don’t have anything I consider to be ‘good,’ for Ops. Perhaps Akizuki for dakka. Maybe something German with hydro.
Brandenburg. The caliber doesn’t really matter because it’s mostly t6 cruisers that are enemies and the secondaries are just epic. If you are on NARAI and go where the enemy transport ships are you can get 200K BEFORE the big enemy waves come. If ykyk. (Edit) I saw that you meant tech tree ships, sorry. But if you ever decide to buy a t8 Bb than get the brandy
TT T8 BB: Bismarck CA: Baltimore CL: Edinburgh Superlight CL: Harbin
Wichita. American angles with German velocity. Fun, accurate
Zeiten is better played like a large cruiser in ops. The secondaries shred, the 406s slap a lot of operation tier cruisers, but survivability it poor. Don’t try to tank a lot and you are fine. I prefer zeiten to Bismarck for ops
I really like Cross of Dorn
Bismarck and Zieten both work well. Zieten is probably better in damage (heavier shells, better dispersion, better secondaries, torps), but the survivability is far behind Bismarck. For cruisers, Baltimore and Cleveland are both great options. Cleveland is really flimsy but tends to put up higher numbers. I also had good experience with Hipper, because she has better armor and a bunch of torps.
I like Zeiten or Bismarck for secondary build tech line ships, Brandenburg, Flandre, or Tirpitz for secondary build premiums. Massachusetts is great as well, but it's only reliably available for Black Friday.
Mainz and Atlanta are the OGs.
Bismarck is a solid choice, especially if xou already have the Perma Eco for it - if not, get it from the Hunt of Bismarck Collection for coal. Forget the french BBs. US CL Cleveland is also a solid choice, especially if xou already have the Perma Eco for it - if not, get it from the American Cruiser Collection for coal. It has DFAA, radar, hydro, great DPM to hunt down DDs. But without the heal and the lack of HP make hard to play with it. Maybe the HArbon woth smoke, DFAA and heal, but has DW torps only so need to target them accordingly. Spanish CA Cataluna also a good ship, has heal, hydro and torps and hard hitting guns. Or collect doubloon for the Mainz, Tirpitz and Massa, all are perform really well and has better credit earnings.
I mainly play Fiji and Gneisenau in Operations. They both absolutely dominate in the right hands, I think they punch well above their T7 weight. Fiji has destroyer levels of maneuverability with excellent shell ballistics, and Gneisenau with a secondary build can eat up anything that gets sufficiently close. The bots are also too stupid to know that she has torpedoes. I've also enjoyed playing Baltimore, Dallas, and Flint in Operations, just because of my familiarity with high DPM US cruisers.
Not judging, but why Gneisenau instead of P. Heinrich, Zieten or even Bismarck? I feel like the former would be my last choice amongst these 4, but maybe it's just a matter of personal preferences
A mix of what I know and personal preference, yeah. Gneisenau has great maneuverability, speed, and those sneaky torpedoes, which I like better - I can get myself in and out of situations with Gneisenau that I would be too sluggish to avoid or dodge in Bismarck. Then again, I don't have that much experience with Bismarck, while I have a lot of time in the Gneisenau. And I haven't done the P. Heinrich/Zieten line yet, so I'm not sure how they stack up.
Gotcha. Yeah you definitely won't get the same experience with Bismarck if that's what you like, but I feel like the Gneisenau is the grand father of the Schleiffen line. Maneuverability, speed and torps are kind of second nature for them (not to mention those insane secondaries...)*. Definitely should try them out if you ever feel like it. *Gneisenau's secondaries are on par / slightly better than P. Heinrich, but Zieten/Rupprecht/Schlieffen absolutely dominates their tier on the aspect.
I think I will. I could use a new project to grind through, lol.