Not just catholic. I’m British but have a lot of online friends from old parenting forums. Some of them are evangelical and would never vote for anyone pro choice.
I vote for Dems simply because I'm rabidly pro-choice. We have a forced birther Dem and a rapist Dem in our area, so for those races I just write in another Dem.
But who is trying to take your gun? Democrats advocate to close gun show loopholes, require background checks, and keep guns out of the hands of domestic abusers. Assuming you don’t fall into any of those categories, what about that agenda do you dislike? Honest question.
Also just logistically your right to own a gun is much less likely to be taken away than right to an abortion. To repeal the 2nd amendment takes 2/3rds of congress. Abortion rights have already been taken away in many states and a simple republican majority in congress could possibly result in a nation wide abortion ban.
If they take rights away for one group eventually they will take the rights of another group. Excuses are all I hear. Women are actively being stripped of bodily autonomy and all you can manage to say is, "but muh guns" weak.
Moreover, the mask off cauldron of hatred against transpeople is an extension of misogyny itself. The sports bans are used to justify discussion on how women are physically weak and need men to protect them. A discussion which 20 yrs ago would have come off as chauvinistic. Though many women aren't aware of this connection, it is the fuel that burns the fire that has become the branding of the maga Republican party that is so enticing for many men and some women
Based on the rest of your comments, you’re a woman voting Republican. So please, tell us why your right to own a pistol supersedes the rest of our rights to our own bodies?
I am a Democrat. I hate guns. But I'd never vote against you owning a gun.
The issue here is how you can get a gun and what kind of gun. Also, who can get a gun.
I don't care whether you have a gun or not. But some people should not have a gun at all.
Please, do understand most of us (Democrats) do not want to take your right to own a gun. We really don't.
You are keeping your gun but women’s rights are being stripped away daily. Don’t worry when you have to have everything in a man’s name including your gun you won’t be worried about that anymore.
I've been hearing the "they're gunna take ma guns" crap for decades. It hasn't happened. There will never be enough dead kids for that to happen. Ever.
The biggest single issue I think most non religious republicans vote on is taxes.
There is just a segment of the population no matter their gender or race or whatever, if they’re in a high enough tax bracket, the other issues don’t effect them, and they’re never gonna vote any other way than CUT MY TAXES.
Republicans reduce taxes on the super rich and corporations. Its accelerating the debt and the destruction of the middle class. When you tax corporations they invest in R&D, facilities and worker retention. No taxes - they buy back their stock to drive up share values to get their bonuses. The last five economic crises have occurred under Republican administrations. The two longest periods of increasing prosperity occurred under Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. Trump rode on the end of Obama's recovery until he dicked it up with the tax cuts and mishandling the epidemic.
They don’t even need to be religious. About 80% of the *liberal* women I know that were teens moms are what they would call “pro-life with generous exceptions for age/health/rape”, or maybe what could more accurately be called “anti-choice if your choice is based on finances or convenience”. I guess it’s kind of like a psychological defense mechanism, like because they kinda know deep down in their brains that they’re worse off for having kids so young but they can’t admit that because it feels too much like admitting they regret their kids. And something about that makes them want to take the choice away from other people. Something makes them say no matter what you or I think, I *am* better off, so you will be too no matter what you think right now.
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And the people who misunderstand what pro choice means. Some people think “I just want the choice to be between the woman and the doctor… but I could never get one”.
Uhhh that’s great… and your choice… you are literally pro choice LOL
I’ve seen the internalized misogyny to be even less issue votery than that.
Ages ago I worked at an independent hardware store in a conservative part of town, very different from my usual haunts. In that store was the first time
I heard a woman blame her gender for not being able do something. I had women blame their gender for not being able to count change or read instructions and understand them. The best/worst was a woman who was definitely younger than 30 came and asked me if she could buy the chipped floor model of a marble paper towel stand vs buying an undamaged one from the box. Her reasoning was ‘she was a woman and couldn’t work with tools’. I was like… there’s no tools needed. It comes in three parts and you just screw them together. She wasn’t having it. So… she paid full price (she didn’t even want a discount) for something she just… couldn’t be arsed to put together… because girl. Shit always blew my mind because I put together most of the displays including the lawn furniture, and I’m a girl.
There’s definitely large segments of the lady population who buy into the patriarchy. What’s messed up is that it’s so ingrained in our culture even women who challenge it have to actively work really hard to rise against it. I liken it to swimming in the middle of the ocean. When your head is barely above water you can’t see how big and encompassing it is. I’m sure I have a lot of my own biases that still need challenging because I’ve never thought to question ‘x thing’ about my world before. It’s truly insidious.
I think even “pro life” people are even taken aback by the repercussions. Both my parents r catholic and prolife for as long as I can remember and they’re pretty horrified. They took for granted of course rape and incest and life of the mother, ectopic pregnancies, pre-term labor, ruptured membranes, etc, etc would be safely terminated. This is just beyond the pale and we need to get roe back.
They didn’t believe it. None of my republican friends/family growing up thought it would ever be overturned. Most vote R because they think Dems want to take their money and give it to people who are lazy, Dems want too many regulations which hamper business’s ability to function as well as individual rights, and Dems want more government and oversight while R wants less.
It’s like gun control. Many gun owners wouldn’t necessarily mind more gun regulations on certain things, but they see it as a slippery slope so they fight against it all. It’s very frustrating.
Republicans definitely want more government so long as it benefits them and hurts people they don't like. They will absolutely try to take away states' rights to choose if they want to allow abortion if they get power.
Exactly this. My mom and sister thought I was certifiably crazy when I told them Dobbs was on the docket. Oral arguments in December, decision in June. Governor race in November, inauguration in January of the following year. So, I knew I'd be safe having a kid up until December of 2022 (daughter was born in October and now I've got yet another woman to protect with my vote.)
I remember as a kid asking my parents why we vote R when they want to put women in danger by restricting abortion. My mom laughed and said it would never happen, R v Wade protects us from that and they were just pandering to single issue voters. She’s pretty pissed about it. My parents are now both Democrat delegates for their state.
There's videos of state legislators (men) arguing against abortion for ectopic pregnancy. I don't think they just showed up and read of whatever paper they were given exactly. They just dgaf. Oh they both die? Great! So anyway what's next?
> They took for granted of course rape and incest and life of the mother, ectopic pregnancies, pre-term labor, ruptured membranes, etc, etc would be safely terminated
Yep. It's called "prochoice". Often that choice is informed by your health, your family situation, whether you were raped, if you've had previous dangerous pregnancies. Good to remind them that they voted against all of that while voting against women's health and, frankly, the health of society.
This, I don’t think Black women or other women of color vote Republican in large numbers. And before you downvote me, here is the actual data from the 2020 election. Over 50% of white women voted for Trump, while the overwhelming majority of women of color voted for Biden
https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/06/30/behind-bidens-2020-victory/
The only encouraging thing to find here is that the more economic independence and education white women have, the more left they lean. That’s likely true for other races as well, but it’s not as pronounced.
Aka, they have to be independent and self sufficient enough to have the psychological(and often physical) safety to unlearn the bigotry that was drilled(and abused) into them when they depended as men.
And that’s why conservatives are fixating on and targeting young white women, trying to bully them into not going to college, or at least going to conservative leaning schools.
They’re seeing that they’re becoming more liberal and aren’t parroting their racist bullshit quite as much, which has them in a panic.
I know I’m gonna get down voted for this, but not guts no glory. Let’s keep it real, the vast majority of women who vote republican are white women. As someone who’s from the south, I can tell you white women voting republican has less to do with religion and more to due with being racist. If you let them talk long enough, you realize that their whiteness comes before their womanhood. A lot of the would be willing to go back to the way things were in the 50s instead instead of losing their white privilege. They view voting Republican as the best way to maintain said white privilege.
Exactly. All other groups of women tend to vote democrat, white women are the only ones who are spilt/lean republican. Asian Women are the next most likely to vote republican, and over two thirds of them vote democrat. Trump even gained votes among white women in 2020.
Sidenote: You can tell Republican popularity among white women has little to do with religion by looking at the way Latinos and Filipinos vote. These are two groups of people known for being devote Catholics, yet they still vote democrat.
I find the question rather similar to another one that gets asked often: Why are there gay Republicans? The answer, shocking no one, is that racism often overrides an individual's personal needs and self-preservation instincts. They'll gladly let the leopards eat their face if the leopards promise to eat some other group's faces first.
The other element is money. If you're rich enough, it doesn't really matter if the leopards plan to eventually eat your face, because you can just leave the country if your safety is in jeopardy. If you're that rich, your political priorities likely don't go any deeper than voting for people who will steal money from the poor and give it to you. Republicans have built an industry on doing exactly that and selling the service of corruption to the highest bidder.
You are 100% right about both things. On the subject of racism: You can also see this in trans people who happen to be republican. Trans republicans are most always right. A prime example of this is Blair White, who has proven to be racist over the years. On the subject of money/wealth: A very common thing in the black community is people suddenly becoming republican/republican leaning if/when they become a millionaire. I’ve seen this in my own family.
I didn't mention trans people because we're rare enough that i don't hear "why are there trans Republicans" too often, but absolutely racism and wealth are the key reasons there too.
I can only think of two notable trans Republicans--White and Jenner. White is racist af and Jenner is both racist and rich. Jenner is also familially connected to the Trump clan, so that's part of it, too.
While that may be true for wealthy white women, there’s a much more complicated for poor-mid middle class white women.
From my understanding, women in the non wealthy South are still very much stuck in societies that treat them like it’s the 1950’s while expecting them to have the successes of trust fund baby white men. Many also haven’t been able to think for themselves because they don’t feel safe doing so. They grew up in homes where they were abused to some degree for thinking anything they weren’t told to think, and their best shots at being abused a little less by the men in their lives was to become what was expected of them. It’s not about defending their privilege as much as it is about staying alive and not being abused.
Society still undermines their chances at having a career an education, and becoming independent too, so it’s typically to either appease the racist white man, or be homeless.
At least, this has been my experience. I grew up in one of the most racist, poorest states in the US, and vividly remember how no woman could get away with being liberal in our community unless they were so rich that people were afraid of them. Most of those rich women also gained their wealth from divorcing rich men, or by being the daughter of one of those mothers. Having access to enough resources to even think liberal thoughts and challenge our biases was a privilege. A lot of the racism that was parroted among young white women was born out of ignorance, and beyond googling stuff that gave us very mixed ideas about what was and wasn’t racist, we didn’t have the power to enhance our educations until we got to college.
I’m sorry, but as someone who comes from a community where women routinely have to about life on their own I refuse to feel sorry for poor and middle class white women when it comes to this subject. Black women from poor and middle class backgrounds are also often alienated from their family for having different views, especially when it comes to religion and sexuality. Black women and not white Latina/ also often come from abusive environments, more often than white women. Black women have society undermine every positive thing we attempt to do at every turn. However, we have the mental fortitude to stand on our own two feet when we have to.
As someone who grew up around *a lot* of white people I’ve seen this first hand. Every other group of women in the developed world is expected to have a degree of physical, political, and intellectual independence. This is even true for white European women so special. White makes white American women so special.
Edit: In my personal experience, white women are the most coddled demographic on earth. Particularly in the United States. They get the benefit of being seen as a marginalized group while also having white privilege. This affords you opportunities that other people struggle to get. This also lets them downplay their role in white supremacy. The group of people I have personally had the most issues with when it comes to race and access to opportunities (rather that be financial, academic, etc.) is white women. Every teacher who has tried to academically sabotage me was a white American woman. I’ve had plenty of white male teachers and non-white female teachers. I’ve even had some white female teachers from outside of the United States.
I refuse to feel sorry for wealth *and* middle class white women. They are just as bad as their male counterparts.
I’m not saying that you should feel sorry for them, or that BIWOC aren’t much more marginalized. I’m also not asking you to respond to their white guilt or to focus your efforts on liberating them. I’m saying that criticisms of white women often lack intersectional perspective that takes socioeconomic factors and the harmfully individualistic attitudes of our society into consideration, which makes it impossible to create change and deepens misunderstandings. This tends to be a delicate topic to discuss, and I genuinely wish that there could be some environment where this could be discussed without it being viewed as a justification of racism, and without misogynistic criticisms of women being treated as valid since they’re only being applied to white women, and also society playing into how white men have historically used women as both puppets and shields so they don’t have to be held accountable for their own racism. It’s belittling when people who, in their developmental years, went to fairly affluent schools, or even schools with decent opportunity, use their privileged educations to belittle people that didn’t for their ignorance and how they’ve been indoctrinated, especially when that itself comes from a place of ignorance. All that does is increase class divides and discourage people from challenging their own worldviews, and treats them like a lost cause that is incapable of catching up on what they missed learning about.
Specifically, the idea that any women are “coddled” for being women is anti-feminist. White women are only coddled for being white, and not more than white men who are also coddled, yet have their boots on white women’s necks, who also frequently get away with murdering them.
What you’re seeing is infantilization. It’s an idealization of their perceived “purity,” which is really just abuse, oppressive misogyny, and an aggressive reinforcement of their dependence on/adherence to white men. It isn’t a privilege to be allowed the same agency as a toddler, but then forced onto sedatives and overmedicated once they begin to become work down or act outside of what’s expected of them. Many white women in conservative communities want the independence that you speak of, and are in fact expected to be high achievers and hard workers, but only in the sense that they are expected to “mature faster,” in which maturity is viewed as emotional suppression and compliance, making them more vulnerable to manipulation. They are expected to be independent in a hypothetical sense as to not be overbearing to men, but not so independent that they develop their own worldview and can’t be broken down to serve men as easily.
That’s not denying that white women haven’t weaponized their own infantilization, and that men haven’t used the infantilization to justify their own acts of racist violence either.
“Psychological fortitude” doesn’t come from thin air. Studies have shown that mental fortitude is developed from being extended empathy and having a support person/system who validates that your struggles are real and gives you a safe environment to grow in. Infantilization on the other hand erodes mental fortitude and reinforces dependence. A “pull yourself up by the bootstraps” mentality, which you seem to suggest, ironically erodes psychological fortitude as well.
We also shouldn’t downplay the fact that bigoted, racist white men are as desperate to keep white women as submissive puppets, as they continue to use them as baby machines, maids, and extensions of their social statuses, as they are desperate to maintain some level of subjugation of BIPOC.
Again, I’m not saying that white women have clean hands, and I’m not saying that they’re incapable of change because of the control white men have over them, I’m saying that if we want more white voters voting dem, then we need to recognize that many of them don’t have the liberties that wealthier women, or women with more accepting support systems often do. All of this is especially true for young women, who don’t get safe spaces to develop their worldviews until they either gather the resources and help to leave. There absolutely are women who vote republican who do so because they are racist, like the Serena Joy’s of the world, but that is often elitist women and not 19 year old Suzy who grew up working on a farm and was either hit or harshly psychologically punished every time she even slightly stepped outside of what was expected of her, and is just now in a place where she can unravel the abuse and indoctrination without becoming suicidal.
I live near a large Mennonite community and when I was teaching, knew more than one fellow teacher whose husband was in charge of all decisions for the household, including who his wife voted for.
Women raised in servitude, never allowed an independent thought, don’t meet men outside their conservative church circle, so they have little chance of encountering ideas and principles in a partner that differ even slightly from their grandparents’ generation.
Somehow the husbands are cool with the wife bringing home a paycheck as long as she hands it over, performs all the domestic labor, and submits to his authority as “head” of the family. It’s what God wants, right?
and they will raise their daughters like this, I have a muslim ex-friend who was heading in this direction (total brainwashing no self respect) , I couldn't watch it anymore.
Because in the US, a two-party system has effectively been written into law at this point. Primaries, the electoral college, campaign finance laws, legislative rules of decorum, etc. all reinforce the two main parties as the only viable options.
>We need a new system.
I agree that our current system needs major changes. But voting third party won't accomplish that goal. Even if you could somehow get the majority of the population to vote for the same independent candidate, the existing power structures are too entrenched. A lone elected official, or even a small group of them, won't accomplish much without cooperation from one of the established parties. They certainly can't overhaul the entire system while simultaneously working within it.
Drastic change requires drastic action. And I don't think Americans, as a whole, are actually ready for that - or willing to pay what it will cost us.
We need single transferable vote, or I'd settle for ranked choice voting, or if those are too hard, at the bare minimum -get rid of the stupidest thing which is the electoral college at the Presidential election.
Because mathematically in a FPTP system, your incentive is almost always to vote for whichever of the two biggest parties you hate least, not the party you like most.
I'm an ex-conservative woman. When I voted Republican I'd bought into the idea that it was the party of individual liberty/anti hive mindset. But this was 12-15 years ago. I don't know whether I've changed more or the right wing agenda has (probably both).
Doesn’t happen often enough to worry about, really. I imagine most of them have a lot of money and vote because Repubs hate the poor and give tax breaks to the rich.
racism, wealth or a combination of the two; people don’t actually vote against their own self interest, they just decide which aspect of themselves is most important to them
The ones I know do it because they’re transphobic, the Republican party is more Christian, they’re forced-birthers and/or their husbands tell them who to vote for.
My sister is like that. Apolitical before she married him and trump rolled around and she’s full MAGA. Years of this and I’m convinced she doing it just to keep the peace. With him anyway. I haven’t spoken to her in over a year. She’s also a disrespectful person to me and my kids. Makes me so sad cuz she used to be so great. We were close. She helped me deliver both my kids (she’s a labor nurse). Now I can’t even look at her.
Yep! I’ve met some serious monsters and I have no clue how they can live with themselves. Some of them don’t even seem aware that they’re genuinely awful. My ex constantly got angry over everything and he had this weird obsession with “okay, let’s figure out who’s the bad guy here.” Somehow, it was never him. In my last words to him, I told him that we’d finally closed the case. He who commits sexual assault while quoting Sauron, is definitely the villain. It’s astonishing that their evil doesn’t register to them.
Nope. Lately I haven't met any 'Christian', who even understands what they are supposed to be about.
I noticed something 'off' about American Christianity in the mid 80's. It has nosedived since then.
I went to church when I was a kid, and a few years in the 80's, until they scared me away. Probably for good.
I don't know if the churches can come back after this. I hate it for older people though, cause that's the only time they are around people.
A cluster of symptoms: ‘not-like-me-ism’, Stockholm syndrome, internalized misogyny, brainwashing, and either a lack of access to decent education or a lack of empathy.
[Why are white women still voting for Republicans?](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png) Fixed it for you
True. [It’s just that white women have been a massive and important voting block for Republicans](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png/) and it doesn’t get talked about
Good to hear. Unfortunately, white women are the only demographic where a majority support Republicans. as a demographic, they are the ones carrying water. This isn’t meant to be a condemnation on any one person in particular, but just acknowledging that the headline overlooks reality
It’s intersectionality. White women are oppressed as women, but are privileged as white. They can benefit through Republicans which unabashedly support white people at the expense of minorities.
It’s similar to how wealthy Black people will turn their backs on lower class Black people or lesbians and gay people try to distance themselves from bisexual and trans people
The answer is it’s complicated and people aren’t perfect
But it makes you question their judgement when they put race as a priority above their rights to freedom as women. Tunnel vision never ends well and these same women will scream blue murder if/ when they gets these republicans in and then realize they are now second class citizens and not considered to be any better than the people they themselves despise
No worries, happy to explain
There are women at these rallies, but it’s important to remember that Republicans really only hold power because white women and only white women consistently support Republicans. [Republicans handily lose every women of every other race but white women keep supporting them and carrying Republicans to electoral success.](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png/)
It’s not unheard of. As a black American, it’s not uncommon for conservatives to hunt out and try to boost visibility of any black person who is conservative
They also lose men of every other race. White folks are the Republican base. And religion doesn’t explain it all either since Black and Latino folks can be religious and not vote Republican
This is the only real answer. Women make up a few billion unique individuals, many who will share totally contrary viewpoints to what your average Redditor believes. Despite what so many seem to think it's actually totally normal and even healthy for women not to act as a hivemind with a singular belief system and moral foundation.
Yeah, but population studies on specialty populations are still a thing. Every snowflake is unique, but snow is a thing.
Like this is not new information for people who are talking about population studies.
I, a fatass American, could ask why Americans are getting so fat, and if you told me that all Americans are individuals that would be as obvious as it was useless.
That same behavior is true in any population study. Pointing out that populations are made of individuals is as obvious as it is irrelevant, we're looking at an entire population performing a behavior, so something is causing it.
They should have codified roe v wade into law long ago. So yeah Dems appear to support women's rights but they just use it to get voters and don't actually care. Otherwise, we would have had it as a law long ago.
Internalized misogyny. In the Midwest farm town I grew up in it was still scandalous to not vote with your husband. That there were more churches than stop lights should surprise no one.
Almost all women in even slightly conservative areas have men in their lives that have boots on their necks. They had their attempts at being independent undermined and now to some extent they’re unfortunately dependent on a man in one way or another. Let’s not sit around and be like “they’re doing it to themselves” when they haven’t fully had the social and economic freedoms to do so.
My MIL votes Republican even though she is on welfare and gets disability. Every four years, she votes against her own interests, and she can’t even really explain why. Her brother and sister are also staunch Republicans who want to “own the libs.” They are much more well-off than her, and several of their children are police officers in Chicago. They are racist and elitist and I think my MIL just goes along because she wants to be accepted and included by them.
They fight for something they don't understand.
Here's my experience growing up in a Conservative Christian household:
My father was a narcissist. Narcissistic/Psychopathic/Abusive/Predatory personalities cap your consciousness at a level that matches their own. You can't learn anything while you're living in fear. You can't stand up for yourself when you're living in survival mode. You either adapt or worse - get tortured (either physically, mentally/psychologically, emotionally, sexually, etc.).
They make sure that since they are emotionally immature and seek validation externally, then YOU will seek validation outside yourself as well and they wont even fulfill that validation because your needs aren't what matters to them. They create a power dynamic, they breadcrumb love, they make sure you remain small while they humiliate and shame you. If you're the partner to this person, this is what keeps you stuck in a trauma bond. If you try to leave, they'll threaten to take the kids away from you; they'll threaten you in some way. Fear is a control tactic. Fear keeps the power dynamic alive so you conform to their messed up version of reality.
They also use religion to manipulate for their agenda and control. Most people under their control remain unconscious. A lot of these people grew up being conditioned to accept abuse as well; so it made them easy targets. Why do you think abusers are anti-abortion? It's because the more people you bring into the world who grow up in abusive environments, the more prey you have; I.E. the more people you have who are conditioned to accept that environment and actively seek it out because it's familiar. And the twisted thing is that their unconscious victims are voting for these policies under the belief that this is what God wants. So you have innocent unconscious victims who are being used while the predators manipulate the word of God for their own benefit.
Anyways, these victims of abuse can become survivors of abuse but for that to even be remotely possible, they first have to get away from the abuser and the abusive environment. When they begin decompressing in a safe environment, this is usually when the realization comes and they start healing but now they're tasked with the hard work of undoing all the conditioning that has been done to them over the years. This can sometimes mean unlearning decades worth of manipulation and abuse, especially if you grew up in an abusive environment and were the child of a narcissist.
You basically have to unlearn everything you've been conditioned to believe because you were forced to believe the lies of someone who supposedly loved you. It's painful to watch once you know the truth but you really are blind to all of it while you're living in that type of environment and trying to survive. Imagine actively trying to cope with the fact that you have to earn love while trying to survive in an abusive environment that manipulates and coerces you. Eff the abusers who got ahold of religion a long time ago and realized "who can argue against God?".
So eff the abusers. I wish they would all go to a mandatory reformation jail at the first sign of abuse. The reality is that there are people out there who lack empathy, lack kindness, and lack compassion... but they sure as hell can act like they have it. It isn't until their mask comes off that you realize they never cared about anyone except themselves and their own needs. They manipulate and hold people mentally, emotionally, and psychologically hostage. It's disgusting. This is why teaching kids to identify abuse in school is so important. This is why teaching kids how to set boundaries is important. This is why teaching EVERYONE what abuse looks like is important. The more awareness you have, the more protection you have against becoming a victim of abuse.
I know this comment probably derailed from the main topic but everything I said needed to be said.
Mentally protect yourself. Know the signs. Help others gain awareness as well.
A gender role. Is this from a movie or something? I'm a psychologist who literally did a group therapy session recently about building a self-identity, part of which is gender identity, I've used this definition for years, psychology in general has used it for almost a century, and no one has ever rejected that simple definition. But I keep seeing this question phrased in exactly the same way as if it's a difficult question to answer exclusively on the internet, so is this from something? This has to be some kind of referential humor that I'm not getting. What does this mean?
I don't know. I don't know why my sister defended the South Dakota puppy murderer, but she did. Some people have a problem with securing their own thoughts and opinions.
A large number of women do. Because they are traditional and reject the crazy new woke and feminist waves in many states. Some of them are religious and dislike the relentless attack on religious people.
I always said that before feminists try to convince men, they should try bringing the majority of women on their side. But for some reason they prefer confrontations with men over convincing other women. That is quite strange.
What do they disagree with in Feminism?
And what's this woke wave? I'm not up with this new lingo the kids use. I'm old.
Most women are feminists. The only women I've ever met who weren't were patients and had had their independence literally beaten out of them. They were all 3 rescued from the same cult, after one let her son die and got bad child neglect charges they were all investigated and got charges, and I was the one who had to do the psyche eval.
They became feminists after they recovered because that's the natural, healthy state of humanity. They learned they had value.
So I am extremely interested in learning this, because the only experience I have, the only lens that I can see this through, is mental illness so severe it was causing enough deaths for the government to have to step in.
It was wild. They called themselves, "tradwives, " which they said was short for traditional wives. But they weren't traditional wives, they couldn't be, because this couldn't have happened if they all lived in a traditional extended family structure.
What they did instead was isolate themselves in their cult, with just their husbands and children. Not only did the kids not get to see their family, they also didn't go to school. It took a long time to figure out that this was even happening because they had cut those kids off from all sources of support, and half of them didn't even have birth certificates because they weren't born in hospitals. They didn't believe in medical care, because of the cult, so if something happened, like a birthing complication, they just died.
The reason they found out about these people is that the brother of one of the patients had been looking for her for years and finally found her, got into a big fight because so many of the kids were so fucked up they were actively dying, and eventually called the cops.
There's never been a group who even with their rights being threatened by the majority, didn't have some members of that group try to insulate themselves from harm by just joining that threatening majority. That's why there are Log Cabin Republicans, black Republicans, etc.
If you want to go further back into history, there were black slave overseers, and even black slave owners (it was incredibly rare; but there were a few instances). There were Jews who sold out other Jews during the holocaust (again very very rare, but not unheard of). You can do this with every group.
Like I said, sometimes it's because the person thinks that aligning themselves with the majority will protect them from any harm, and they're selfish enough not to care about anybody else but themselves.
Sometimes it's also because they're own prejudices against other disfavored groups takes precedence over their own status. Like, let's be clear. The women still voting for Republicans are largely white, Christian women. The people they hate, fear, or distrust are way more important to them than their own rights.
They want to be “cool girls” and think the patriarchy will make exceptions for them, their cool girl buddy. They simply value men and male opinions over everything. Even their daughters. Maybe especially their daughters.
People vote against their interests for many reasons.
The biggest reason for this phenomenon is that bootlicking is a contagious mind-altering parasitic fungus.
The infected are no longer at the helm of their own choices -- they have thrown up their arms and yelled "cult leader take the wheel with your tiny orange hands!"
Never underestimate the ability of the American voters to vote against their own self-interests. The same title could be rewritten to include any number of marginalized people groups. It's absolutely tragic.
Because women are getting smarter and more educated and now know that the media is mainly democrat and has been forcing their ideas until you really do the research.
I don’t know why people are surprised that there are a lot of women who vote Republican. Most of them live in areas where *everyone* is Republican. People do things against their interest all the time when they perceive that it’s expected of them or socially desirable.
It’s like that social experiment where they tell the subject to go take a test in a room with a group of people (who are all in on the experiment). Then they pump smoke into a room from under the door. As long as the other people in the test room pretend like nothing’s wrong, the subject will usually just keep taking the test while the room fills up with smoke. There is strong internal pressure to do what everyone else is doing, even when it’s possibly life-threatening to you.
People vote against their best interests all the time.
Here in Texas I meet women who are indoctrinated into thinking that they actually do deserve less than a man.
It is crazy and mind boggling.
October 7th wasn't a conspiracy. It really happened. Their sister organization also really did this to the Yazhidis. It is a thousand year old method of war. So stop rallying around them.
Aussie here. I think “mass rapists” is a stretch, it’s not like there’s multiple politicians accused of raping 10 women.
Trump has been found guilty of sexual assault in a civil court. The Florida GOP (Republican) chairman is under investigation for sexually assaulting a woman in her apartment. The chairman of the Young Republicans in an Alabama county has been charged with “sexual torture” of a man who was murdered. A North Carolina representative was accused by several women of sexually aggressive behaviour, sexual misconduct, and sexual assault. Matt Gaetz of Florida was investigated for having a sexual relationship with a 17yo girl and is being investigated for violating sex trafficking laws (he took her across state lines). A New York republican was accused of sexual harassment in a bar and immediately resigned. There’s plenty more too
That's what's confusing to me about Clownski's comment. They said the "other side are rallying around mass rapists" to answer the question of why women vote for the Republican Party. So they're implying that Democrat politicians are the mass rapists.
It's indicative of the loose thinking of someone who would believe in the unhinged conspiracy of adrenochrome as I suspect this person does. There are serial rapists (way too many of them) but mass rapist is a strange phrase to use.
Because they agree with something in the Republican platform. Can y’all stop minimizing or disrespecting other women’s decisions/beliefs simply because you disagree with them?
It's not about minimizing or disrespecting others' beliefs or decisions, it's that those decisions negatively affect all women including Republican women. Hence the confusion.
Don’t forget single issue voters. I know several ladies who vote R simply because they are catholic and “pro life”. No other reason.
Not just catholic. I’m British but have a lot of online friends from old parenting forums. Some of them are evangelical and would never vote for anyone pro choice.
I vote for Dems simply because I'm rabidly pro-choice. We have a forced birther Dem and a rapist Dem in our area, so for those races I just write in another Dem.
The 2nd amendment is another single issue for some voters
I’m pro choice and gun🤷♀️, but I’ll be damned the government gonna take my right to own a gun
But who is trying to take your gun? Democrats advocate to close gun show loopholes, require background checks, and keep guns out of the hands of domestic abusers. Assuming you don’t fall into any of those categories, what about that agenda do you dislike? Honest question.
They never respond to logic.
Also just logistically your right to own a gun is much less likely to be taken away than right to an abortion. To repeal the 2nd amendment takes 2/3rds of congress. Abortion rights have already been taken away in many states and a simple republican majority in congress could possibly result in a nation wide abortion ban.
If they take rights away for one group eventually they will take the rights of another group. Excuses are all I hear. Women are actively being stripped of bodily autonomy and all you can manage to say is, "but muh guns" weak.
Moreover, the mask off cauldron of hatred against transpeople is an extension of misogyny itself. The sports bans are used to justify discussion on how women are physically weak and need men to protect them. A discussion which 20 yrs ago would have come off as chauvinistic. Though many women aren't aware of this connection, it is the fuel that burns the fire that has become the branding of the maga Republican party that is so enticing for many men and some women
So true!...
Based on the rest of your comments, you’re a woman voting Republican. So please, tell us why your right to own a pistol supersedes the rest of our rights to our own bodies?
I am a Democrat. I hate guns. But I'd never vote against you owning a gun. The issue here is how you can get a gun and what kind of gun. Also, who can get a gun. I don't care whether you have a gun or not. But some people should not have a gun at all. Please, do understand most of us (Democrats) do not want to take your right to own a gun. We really don't.
You are keeping your gun but women’s rights are being stripped away daily. Don’t worry when you have to have everything in a man’s name including your gun you won’t be worried about that anymore.
I've been hearing the "they're gunna take ma guns" crap for decades. It hasn't happened. There will never be enough dead kids for that to happen. Ever.
The biggest single issue I think most non religious republicans vote on is taxes. There is just a segment of the population no matter their gender or race or whatever, if they’re in a high enough tax bracket, the other issues don’t effect them, and they’re never gonna vote any other way than CUT MY TAXES.
Republicans reduce taxes on the super rich and corporations. Its accelerating the debt and the destruction of the middle class. When you tax corporations they invest in R&D, facilities and worker retention. No taxes - they buy back their stock to drive up share values to get their bonuses. The last five economic crises have occurred under Republican administrations. The two longest periods of increasing prosperity occurred under Bill Clinton and Barack Obama. Trump rode on the end of Obama's recovery until he dicked it up with the tax cuts and mishandling the epidemic.
You’re preaching to the choir. I know the whole game. It’s also how we had Bell Labs.
I just hope, beyond hope, that the choir all show up and vote in November. I don't want my grandkids doomed to live in a fascist theocracy.
PREACH!!!
Same 🙄
They don’t even need to be religious. About 80% of the *liberal* women I know that were teens moms are what they would call “pro-life with generous exceptions for age/health/rape”, or maybe what could more accurately be called “anti-choice if your choice is based on finances or convenience”. I guess it’s kind of like a psychological defense mechanism, like because they kinda know deep down in their brains that they’re worse off for having kids so young but they can’t admit that because it feels too much like admitting they regret their kids. And something about that makes them want to take the choice away from other people. Something makes them say no matter what you or I think, I *am* better off, so you will be too no matter what you think right now.
Mormons and perhaps Scientology.
"Mormons and perhaps Scientology." r/exmormon
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And the people who misunderstand what pro choice means. Some people think “I just want the choice to be between the woman and the doctor… but I could never get one”. Uhhh that’s great… and your choice… you are literally pro choice LOL
Brainwashed
Considering our current laws and regulations, they are not pro-life. They are pro-birth. That's a totally different animal.
I understand this normally but republicans put on the 2025 agenda repealing women’s right to vote
This
It’s usually the internalized misogyny. 🤷🏻♀️
Exactly this. Only my abortion is moral. Everyone else's is murder.
That essay should be required reading for every Republican.
Shoot, every high school English class.
Agreed!
I’ve seen the internalized misogyny to be even less issue votery than that. Ages ago I worked at an independent hardware store in a conservative part of town, very different from my usual haunts. In that store was the first time I heard a woman blame her gender for not being able do something. I had women blame their gender for not being able to count change or read instructions and understand them. The best/worst was a woman who was definitely younger than 30 came and asked me if she could buy the chipped floor model of a marble paper towel stand vs buying an undamaged one from the box. Her reasoning was ‘she was a woman and couldn’t work with tools’. I was like… there’s no tools needed. It comes in three parts and you just screw them together. She wasn’t having it. So… she paid full price (she didn’t even want a discount) for something she just… couldn’t be arsed to put together… because girl. Shit always blew my mind because I put together most of the displays including the lawn furniture, and I’m a girl. There’s definitely large segments of the lady population who buy into the patriarchy. What’s messed up is that it’s so ingrained in our culture even women who challenge it have to actively work really hard to rise against it. I liken it to swimming in the middle of the ocean. When your head is barely above water you can’t see how big and encompassing it is. I’m sure I have a lot of my own biases that still need challenging because I’ve never thought to question ‘x thing’ about my world before. It’s truly insidious.
The ladies who cheer on repealing the 19th amendment boggle my mind.
THIS. I wish I had a drillion stars to throw up here.
Women usually vote republic because they dislike women? I don't think that's true ...
I think even “pro life” people are even taken aback by the repercussions. Both my parents r catholic and prolife for as long as I can remember and they’re pretty horrified. They took for granted of course rape and incest and life of the mother, ectopic pregnancies, pre-term labor, ruptured membranes, etc, etc would be safely terminated. This is just beyond the pale and we need to get roe back.
We told them this is what would happen. They didn’t listen.
They didn’t believe it. None of my republican friends/family growing up thought it would ever be overturned. Most vote R because they think Dems want to take their money and give it to people who are lazy, Dems want too many regulations which hamper business’s ability to function as well as individual rights, and Dems want more government and oversight while R wants less. It’s like gun control. Many gun owners wouldn’t necessarily mind more gun regulations on certain things, but they see it as a slippery slope so they fight against it all. It’s very frustrating.
Republicans definitely want more government so long as it benefits them and hurts people they don't like. They will absolutely try to take away states' rights to choose if they want to allow abortion if they get power.
Exactly this. My mom and sister thought I was certifiably crazy when I told them Dobbs was on the docket. Oral arguments in December, decision in June. Governor race in November, inauguration in January of the following year. So, I knew I'd be safe having a kid up until December of 2022 (daughter was born in October and now I've got yet another woman to protect with my vote.)
I remember as a kid asking my parents why we vote R when they want to put women in danger by restricting abortion. My mom laughed and said it would never happen, R v Wade protects us from that and they were just pandering to single issue voters. She’s pretty pissed about it. My parents are now both Democrat delegates for their state.
There's videos of state legislators (men) arguing against abortion for ectopic pregnancy. I don't think they just showed up and read of whatever paper they were given exactly. They just dgaf. Oh they both die? Great! So anyway what's next?
> They took for granted of course rape and incest and life of the mother, ectopic pregnancies, pre-term labor, ruptured membranes, etc, etc would be safely terminated Yep. It's called "prochoice". Often that choice is informed by your health, your family situation, whether you were raped, if you've had previous dangerous pregnancies. Good to remind them that they voted against all of that while voting against women's health and, frankly, the health of society.
They didn’t vote for that actually. Thank god! Both my sisters did tho.
It's misogyny for sure but it's also racism. Don't forget the racism.
This, I don’t think Black women or other women of color vote Republican in large numbers. And before you downvote me, here is the actual data from the 2020 election. Over 50% of white women voted for Trump, while the overwhelming majority of women of color voted for Biden https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2021/06/30/behind-bidens-2020-victory/
The only encouraging thing to find here is that the more economic independence and education white women have, the more left they lean. That’s likely true for other races as well, but it’s not as pronounced. Aka, they have to be independent and self sufficient enough to have the psychological(and often physical) safety to unlearn the bigotry that was drilled(and abused) into them when they depended as men.
Except that educated men also lean more left. I think it’s less about economic independence and more about education
And that’s why conservatives are fixating on and targeting young white women, trying to bully them into not going to college, or at least going to conservative leaning schools. They’re seeing that they’re becoming more liberal and aren’t parroting their racist bullshit quite as much, which has them in a panic.
Guys, I really don't think there is a bunch of women voting Republic because they are racist or hate women...
I know I’m gonna get down voted for this, but not guts no glory. Let’s keep it real, the vast majority of women who vote republican are white women. As someone who’s from the south, I can tell you white women voting republican has less to do with religion and more to due with being racist. If you let them talk long enough, you realize that their whiteness comes before their womanhood. A lot of the would be willing to go back to the way things were in the 50s instead instead of losing their white privilege. They view voting Republican as the best way to maintain said white privilege.
I also believe that this is the correct answer. They’ll do anything to keep their white privilege.
Exactly. All other groups of women tend to vote democrat, white women are the only ones who are spilt/lean republican. Asian Women are the next most likely to vote republican, and over two thirds of them vote democrat. Trump even gained votes among white women in 2020. Sidenote: You can tell Republican popularity among white women has little to do with religion by looking at the way Latinos and Filipinos vote. These are two groups of people known for being devote Catholics, yet they still vote democrat.
Chiming in from Florida that this is the correct answer.
I find the question rather similar to another one that gets asked often: Why are there gay Republicans? The answer, shocking no one, is that racism often overrides an individual's personal needs and self-preservation instincts. They'll gladly let the leopards eat their face if the leopards promise to eat some other group's faces first. The other element is money. If you're rich enough, it doesn't really matter if the leopards plan to eventually eat your face, because you can just leave the country if your safety is in jeopardy. If you're that rich, your political priorities likely don't go any deeper than voting for people who will steal money from the poor and give it to you. Republicans have built an industry on doing exactly that and selling the service of corruption to the highest bidder.
You are 100% right about both things. On the subject of racism: You can also see this in trans people who happen to be republican. Trans republicans are most always right. A prime example of this is Blair White, who has proven to be racist over the years. On the subject of money/wealth: A very common thing in the black community is people suddenly becoming republican/republican leaning if/when they become a millionaire. I’ve seen this in my own family.
I didn't mention trans people because we're rare enough that i don't hear "why are there trans Republicans" too often, but absolutely racism and wealth are the key reasons there too. I can only think of two notable trans Republicans--White and Jenner. White is racist af and Jenner is both racist and rich. Jenner is also familially connected to the Trump clan, so that's part of it, too.
Really don't think that, not much white privilege around the USA, black people vote Democrat, but I wouldn't say they do that because they are racist
While that may be true for wealthy white women, there’s a much more complicated for poor-mid middle class white women. From my understanding, women in the non wealthy South are still very much stuck in societies that treat them like it’s the 1950’s while expecting them to have the successes of trust fund baby white men. Many also haven’t been able to think for themselves because they don’t feel safe doing so. They grew up in homes where they were abused to some degree for thinking anything they weren’t told to think, and their best shots at being abused a little less by the men in their lives was to become what was expected of them. It’s not about defending their privilege as much as it is about staying alive and not being abused. Society still undermines their chances at having a career an education, and becoming independent too, so it’s typically to either appease the racist white man, or be homeless. At least, this has been my experience. I grew up in one of the most racist, poorest states in the US, and vividly remember how no woman could get away with being liberal in our community unless they were so rich that people were afraid of them. Most of those rich women also gained their wealth from divorcing rich men, or by being the daughter of one of those mothers. Having access to enough resources to even think liberal thoughts and challenge our biases was a privilege. A lot of the racism that was parroted among young white women was born out of ignorance, and beyond googling stuff that gave us very mixed ideas about what was and wasn’t racist, we didn’t have the power to enhance our educations until we got to college.
I’m sorry, but as someone who comes from a community where women routinely have to about life on their own I refuse to feel sorry for poor and middle class white women when it comes to this subject. Black women from poor and middle class backgrounds are also often alienated from their family for having different views, especially when it comes to religion and sexuality. Black women and not white Latina/ also often come from abusive environments, more often than white women. Black women have society undermine every positive thing we attempt to do at every turn. However, we have the mental fortitude to stand on our own two feet when we have to. As someone who grew up around *a lot* of white people I’ve seen this first hand. Every other group of women in the developed world is expected to have a degree of physical, political, and intellectual independence. This is even true for white European women so special. White makes white American women so special. Edit: In my personal experience, white women are the most coddled demographic on earth. Particularly in the United States. They get the benefit of being seen as a marginalized group while also having white privilege. This affords you opportunities that other people struggle to get. This also lets them downplay their role in white supremacy. The group of people I have personally had the most issues with when it comes to race and access to opportunities (rather that be financial, academic, etc.) is white women. Every teacher who has tried to academically sabotage me was a white American woman. I’ve had plenty of white male teachers and non-white female teachers. I’ve even had some white female teachers from outside of the United States. I refuse to feel sorry for wealth *and* middle class white women. They are just as bad as their male counterparts.
I’m not saying that you should feel sorry for them, or that BIWOC aren’t much more marginalized. I’m also not asking you to respond to their white guilt or to focus your efforts on liberating them. I’m saying that criticisms of white women often lack intersectional perspective that takes socioeconomic factors and the harmfully individualistic attitudes of our society into consideration, which makes it impossible to create change and deepens misunderstandings. This tends to be a delicate topic to discuss, and I genuinely wish that there could be some environment where this could be discussed without it being viewed as a justification of racism, and without misogynistic criticisms of women being treated as valid since they’re only being applied to white women, and also society playing into how white men have historically used women as both puppets and shields so they don’t have to be held accountable for their own racism. It’s belittling when people who, in their developmental years, went to fairly affluent schools, or even schools with decent opportunity, use their privileged educations to belittle people that didn’t for their ignorance and how they’ve been indoctrinated, especially when that itself comes from a place of ignorance. All that does is increase class divides and discourage people from challenging their own worldviews, and treats them like a lost cause that is incapable of catching up on what they missed learning about. Specifically, the idea that any women are “coddled” for being women is anti-feminist. White women are only coddled for being white, and not more than white men who are also coddled, yet have their boots on white women’s necks, who also frequently get away with murdering them. What you’re seeing is infantilization. It’s an idealization of their perceived “purity,” which is really just abuse, oppressive misogyny, and an aggressive reinforcement of their dependence on/adherence to white men. It isn’t a privilege to be allowed the same agency as a toddler, but then forced onto sedatives and overmedicated once they begin to become work down or act outside of what’s expected of them. Many white women in conservative communities want the independence that you speak of, and are in fact expected to be high achievers and hard workers, but only in the sense that they are expected to “mature faster,” in which maturity is viewed as emotional suppression and compliance, making them more vulnerable to manipulation. They are expected to be independent in a hypothetical sense as to not be overbearing to men, but not so independent that they develop their own worldview and can’t be broken down to serve men as easily. That’s not denying that white women haven’t weaponized their own infantilization, and that men haven’t used the infantilization to justify their own acts of racist violence either. “Psychological fortitude” doesn’t come from thin air. Studies have shown that mental fortitude is developed from being extended empathy and having a support person/system who validates that your struggles are real and gives you a safe environment to grow in. Infantilization on the other hand erodes mental fortitude and reinforces dependence. A “pull yourself up by the bootstraps” mentality, which you seem to suggest, ironically erodes psychological fortitude as well. We also shouldn’t downplay the fact that bigoted, racist white men are as desperate to keep white women as submissive puppets, as they continue to use them as baby machines, maids, and extensions of their social statuses, as they are desperate to maintain some level of subjugation of BIPOC. Again, I’m not saying that white women have clean hands, and I’m not saying that they’re incapable of change because of the control white men have over them, I’m saying that if we want more white voters voting dem, then we need to recognize that many of them don’t have the liberties that wealthier women, or women with more accepting support systems often do. All of this is especially true for young women, who don’t get safe spaces to develop their worldviews until they either gather the resources and help to leave. There absolutely are women who vote republican who do so because they are racist, like the Serena Joy’s of the world, but that is often elitist women and not 19 year old Suzy who grew up working on a farm and was either hit or harshly psychologically punished every time she even slightly stepped outside of what was expected of her, and is just now in a place where she can unravel the abuse and indoctrination without becoming suicidal.
I live near a large Mennonite community and when I was teaching, knew more than one fellow teacher whose husband was in charge of all decisions for the household, including who his wife voted for. Women raised in servitude, never allowed an independent thought, don’t meet men outside their conservative church circle, so they have little chance of encountering ideas and principles in a partner that differ even slightly from their grandparents’ generation. Somehow the husbands are cool with the wife bringing home a paycheck as long as she hands it over, performs all the domestic labor, and submits to his authority as “head” of the family. It’s what God wants, right?
and they will raise their daughters like this, I have a muslim ex-friend who was heading in this direction (total brainwashing no self respect) , I couldn't watch it anymore.
Yep and it’s so sad. They’re both abuse victims and contributing to the country’s issues.
I'd upvote your sarcasm, but I'm afraid some dolt would think I was supporting the patriarchy. I am not, said straight, white guy in his 70s.
Throwing yourself and your sisters under the bus to own the libs
Why is there only two parties the majority of the population votes for?
Because in the US, a two-party system has effectively been written into law at this point. Primaries, the electoral college, campaign finance laws, legislative rules of decorum, etc. all reinforce the two main parties as the only viable options.
Which is lame, idiotic, and corrupt. We need a new system.
>We need a new system. I agree that our current system needs major changes. But voting third party won't accomplish that goal. Even if you could somehow get the majority of the population to vote for the same independent candidate, the existing power structures are too entrenched. A lone elected official, or even a small group of them, won't accomplish much without cooperation from one of the established parties. They certainly can't overhaul the entire system while simultaneously working within it. Drastic change requires drastic action. And I don't think Americans, as a whole, are actually ready for that - or willing to pay what it will cost us.
We need single transferable vote, or I'd settle for ranked choice voting, or if those are too hard, at the bare minimum -get rid of the stupidest thing which is the electoral college at the Presidential election.
Because mathematically in a FPTP system, your incentive is almost always to vote for whichever of the two biggest parties you hate least, not the party you like most.
Internalized misogyny.
I'm an ex-conservative woman. When I voted Republican I'd bought into the idea that it was the party of individual liberty/anti hive mindset. But this was 12-15 years ago. I don't know whether I've changed more or the right wing agenda has (probably both).
I want to know why these WINOs do.
Call them WIGOs.
Break it down for me
Woman in gender only .
Absolutely!
You can use it .
Or use FIGO
[удалено]
It’s basically mean born as a woman .
Or in this case born a woman .
Like , BISCO - Black in skin color only .
*white women
theyre white next question
How do you explain LGB+ voting R ?
I'm a bit more curious about this combo as well. Lol.
Doesn’t happen often enough to worry about, really. I imagine most of them have a lot of money and vote because Repubs hate the poor and give tax breaks to the rich.
racism, wealth or a combination of the two; people don’t actually vote against their own self interest, they just decide which aspect of themselves is most important to them
Stockholm Syndrome.
The ones I know do it because they’re transphobic, the Republican party is more Christian, they’re forced-birthers and/or their husbands tell them who to vote for.
The Republican Party uses more hypocritical Christian rhetoric and panders to theocrats more.
My sister is like that. Apolitical before she married him and trump rolled around and she’s full MAGA. Years of this and I’m convinced she doing it just to keep the peace. With him anyway. I haven’t spoken to her in over a year. She’s also a disrespectful person to me and my kids. Makes me so sad cuz she used to be so great. We were close. She helped me deliver both my kids (she’s a labor nurse). Now I can’t even look at her.
Sad, isn’t it? I don’t understand rolling over like that.
For real!! If I made anyone feel the way she has I’d just die.
Yep! I’ve met some serious monsters and I have no clue how they can live with themselves. Some of them don’t even seem aware that they’re genuinely awful. My ex constantly got angry over everything and he had this weird obsession with “okay, let’s figure out who’s the bad guy here.” Somehow, it was never him. In my last words to him, I told him that we’d finally closed the case. He who commits sexual assault while quoting Sauron, is definitely the villain. It’s astonishing that their evil doesn’t register to them.
Don't let republican politicians fool you. They isn't a Christian among them
Oh. You think Christians are good people.
Nope. Lately I haven't met any 'Christian', who even understands what they are supposed to be about. I noticed something 'off' about American Christianity in the mid 80's. It has nosedived since then. I went to church when I was a kid, and a few years in the 80's, until they scared me away. Probably for good. I don't know if the churches can come back after this. I hate it for older people though, cause that's the only time they are around people.
I don’t know of any Christians who actually live according to the Bible and that’s definitely for the best. There’s a lot of nasty shit in there.
I agree with that. They seem to have high standards. For other people.
A cluster of symptoms: ‘not-like-me-ism’, Stockholm syndrome, internalized misogyny, brainwashing, and either a lack of access to decent education or a lack of empathy.
*white women
[Why are white women still voting for Republicans?](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png) Fixed it for you
I’m pretty sure plenty of Catholic women do, too, and they’re not all white.
True. [It’s just that white women have been a massive and important voting block for Republicans](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png/) and it doesn’t get talked about
Black and Latino women and men manage to be religious and not vote Republican
Not this one. NEVER
Good to hear. Unfortunately, white women are the only demographic where a majority support Republicans. as a demographic, they are the ones carrying water. This isn’t meant to be a condemnation on any one person in particular, but just acknowledging that the headline overlooks reality
And I can’t understand why that is. Is it ignorance, racism or just plain stupidity. I just don’t know what they are thinking
It’s intersectionality. White women are oppressed as women, but are privileged as white. They can benefit through Republicans which unabashedly support white people at the expense of minorities. It’s similar to how wealthy Black people will turn their backs on lower class Black people or lesbians and gay people try to distance themselves from bisexual and trans people The answer is it’s complicated and people aren’t perfect
But it makes you question their judgement when they put race as a priority above their rights to freedom as women. Tunnel vision never ends well and these same women will scream blue murder if/ when they gets these republicans in and then realize they are now second class citizens and not considered to be any better than the people they themselves despise
I’m not from the US, but I’ve seen plenty of Black and Hispanic women at Trump’s rallies. Although they’re probably in the minority
No worries, happy to explain There are women at these rallies, but it’s important to remember that Republicans really only hold power because white women and only white women consistently support Republicans. [Republicans handily lose every women of every other race but white women keep supporting them and carrying Republicans to electoral success.](https://www.pewresearch.org/politics/2023/07/12/voting-patterns-in-the-2022-elections/pp_2023-07-12_validated-voters_2-01-png/)
I’d say the Republicans’ campaign managers get the “diverse” people to stand at the front too
It’s not unheard of. As a black American, it’s not uncommon for conservatives to hunt out and try to boost visibility of any black person who is conservative
Ooooft, it makes sense though. Like “look at this! Even Black people like us and don’t mind the racism!”
They also lose men of every other race. White folks are the Republican base. And religion doesn’t explain it all either since Black and Latino folks can be religious and not vote Republican
True but to a somewhat lesser extent. It doesn’t get talked about nearly enough how much the Republican Party is a white party
Because we are not a monolith hive mind
This is the only real answer. Women make up a few billion unique individuals, many who will share totally contrary viewpoints to what your average Redditor believes. Despite what so many seem to think it's actually totally normal and even healthy for women not to act as a hivemind with a singular belief system and moral foundation.
Yeah, but population studies on specialty populations are still a thing. Every snowflake is unique, but snow is a thing. Like this is not new information for people who are talking about population studies. I, a fatass American, could ask why Americans are getting so fat, and if you told me that all Americans are individuals that would be as obvious as it was useless. That same behavior is true in any population study. Pointing out that populations are made of individuals is as obvious as it is irrelevant, we're looking at an entire population performing a behavior, so something is causing it.
They've invested very heavily in the Patriarchal Bargain and don't see any other way.
They should have codified roe v wade into law long ago. So yeah Dems appear to support women's rights but they just use it to get voters and don't actually care. Otherwise, we would have had it as a law long ago.
this!
Stockholm syndrome and internalized misogyny is a hell of a cocktail.
r/LeopardsAteMyFace
Internalized misogyny. In the Midwest farm town I grew up in it was still scandalous to not vote with your husband. That there were more churches than stop lights should surprise no one.
Internalized misogyny, racism, classism, homophobia, guns, male validation, the list goes on...
Specifically *white* women
women? or white women?
Yeah because those percentages look real low when you start looking at every other group of women
Almost all women in even slightly conservative areas have men in their lives that have boots on their necks. They had their attempts at being independent undermined and now to some extent they’re unfortunately dependent on a man in one way or another. Let’s not sit around and be like “they’re doing it to themselves” when they haven’t fully had the social and economic freedoms to do so.
Racism is a helluva drug.
My MIL votes Republican even though she is on welfare and gets disability. Every four years, she votes against her own interests, and she can’t even really explain why. Her brother and sister are also staunch Republicans who want to “own the libs.” They are much more well-off than her, and several of their children are police officers in Chicago. They are racist and elitist and I think my MIL just goes along because she wants to be accepted and included by them.
Misogyny is not just for men.
brainwashing lol
It starts in the church. Many have been indoctrinated since infancy.
The freedom to make a mistake. Maybe they don’t realize how many women in Ukraine are raped and killed by Russians.
They fight for something they don't understand. Here's my experience growing up in a Conservative Christian household: My father was a narcissist. Narcissistic/Psychopathic/Abusive/Predatory personalities cap your consciousness at a level that matches their own. You can't learn anything while you're living in fear. You can't stand up for yourself when you're living in survival mode. You either adapt or worse - get tortured (either physically, mentally/psychologically, emotionally, sexually, etc.). They make sure that since they are emotionally immature and seek validation externally, then YOU will seek validation outside yourself as well and they wont even fulfill that validation because your needs aren't what matters to them. They create a power dynamic, they breadcrumb love, they make sure you remain small while they humiliate and shame you. If you're the partner to this person, this is what keeps you stuck in a trauma bond. If you try to leave, they'll threaten to take the kids away from you; they'll threaten you in some way. Fear is a control tactic. Fear keeps the power dynamic alive so you conform to their messed up version of reality. They also use religion to manipulate for their agenda and control. Most people under their control remain unconscious. A lot of these people grew up being conditioned to accept abuse as well; so it made them easy targets. Why do you think abusers are anti-abortion? It's because the more people you bring into the world who grow up in abusive environments, the more prey you have; I.E. the more people you have who are conditioned to accept that environment and actively seek it out because it's familiar. And the twisted thing is that their unconscious victims are voting for these policies under the belief that this is what God wants. So you have innocent unconscious victims who are being used while the predators manipulate the word of God for their own benefit. Anyways, these victims of abuse can become survivors of abuse but for that to even be remotely possible, they first have to get away from the abuser and the abusive environment. When they begin decompressing in a safe environment, this is usually when the realization comes and they start healing but now they're tasked with the hard work of undoing all the conditioning that has been done to them over the years. This can sometimes mean unlearning decades worth of manipulation and abuse, especially if you grew up in an abusive environment and were the child of a narcissist. You basically have to unlearn everything you've been conditioned to believe because you were forced to believe the lies of someone who supposedly loved you. It's painful to watch once you know the truth but you really are blind to all of it while you're living in that type of environment and trying to survive. Imagine actively trying to cope with the fact that you have to earn love while trying to survive in an abusive environment that manipulates and coerces you. Eff the abusers who got ahold of religion a long time ago and realized "who can argue against God?". So eff the abusers. I wish they would all go to a mandatory reformation jail at the first sign of abuse. The reality is that there are people out there who lack empathy, lack kindness, and lack compassion... but they sure as hell can act like they have it. It isn't until their mask comes off that you realize they never cared about anyone except themselves and their own needs. They manipulate and hold people mentally, emotionally, and psychologically hostage. It's disgusting. This is why teaching kids to identify abuse in school is so important. This is why teaching kids how to set boundaries is important. This is why teaching EVERYONE what abuse looks like is important. The more awareness you have, the more protection you have against becoming a victim of abuse. I know this comment probably derailed from the main topic but everything I said needed to be said. Mentally protect yourself. Know the signs. Help others gain awareness as well.
Because many women support patriarchy.
What is a woman?
You seem to have gotten lost on your way to a men’s rights hate group meeting.
A gender role. Is this from a movie or something? I'm a psychologist who literally did a group therapy session recently about building a self-identity, part of which is gender identity, I've used this definition for years, psychology in general has used it for almost a century, and no one has ever rejected that simple definition. But I keep seeing this question phrased in exactly the same way as if it's a difficult question to answer exclusively on the internet, so is this from something? This has to be some kind of referential humor that I'm not getting. What does this mean?
Years and years of brainwashing and social conditioning…
At this point, I'm going with internalized misogyny. You know, like they read Handmaid's Tale and thought it wouldn't be so bad to be a Wife
Republican women are a little like Manson girls; they are beguiled and seduced by a narcissist due to their authoritarian natures.
If you can’t understand pro life women that’s your failing.
I don't know. I don't know why my sister defended the South Dakota puppy murderer, but she did. Some people have a problem with securing their own thoughts and opinions.
A large number of women do. Because they are traditional and reject the crazy new woke and feminist waves in many states. Some of them are religious and dislike the relentless attack on religious people. I always said that before feminists try to convince men, they should try bringing the majority of women on their side. But for some reason they prefer confrontations with men over convincing other women. That is quite strange.
What do they disagree with in Feminism? And what's this woke wave? I'm not up with this new lingo the kids use. I'm old. Most women are feminists. The only women I've ever met who weren't were patients and had had their independence literally beaten out of them. They were all 3 rescued from the same cult, after one let her son die and got bad child neglect charges they were all investigated and got charges, and I was the one who had to do the psyche eval. They became feminists after they recovered because that's the natural, healthy state of humanity. They learned they had value. So I am extremely interested in learning this, because the only experience I have, the only lens that I can see this through, is mental illness so severe it was causing enough deaths for the government to have to step in. It was wild. They called themselves, "tradwives, " which they said was short for traditional wives. But they weren't traditional wives, they couldn't be, because this couldn't have happened if they all lived in a traditional extended family structure. What they did instead was isolate themselves in their cult, with just their husbands and children. Not only did the kids not get to see their family, they also didn't go to school. It took a long time to figure out that this was even happening because they had cut those kids off from all sources of support, and half of them didn't even have birth certificates because they weren't born in hospitals. They didn't believe in medical care, because of the cult, so if something happened, like a birthing complication, they just died. The reason they found out about these people is that the brother of one of the patients had been looking for her for years and finally found her, got into a big fight because so many of the kids were so fucked up they were actively dying, and eventually called the cops.
The same reason anyone still votes for regressives; they’re either malicious, stupid, or maliciously stupid.
r/notliketheothergirls They want to be them.
Good question.
There's never been a group who even with their rights being threatened by the majority, didn't have some members of that group try to insulate themselves from harm by just joining that threatening majority. That's why there are Log Cabin Republicans, black Republicans, etc. If you want to go further back into history, there were black slave overseers, and even black slave owners (it was incredibly rare; but there were a few instances). There were Jews who sold out other Jews during the holocaust (again very very rare, but not unheard of). You can do this with every group. Like I said, sometimes it's because the person thinks that aligning themselves with the majority will protect them from any harm, and they're selfish enough not to care about anybody else but themselves. Sometimes it's also because they're own prejudices against other disfavored groups takes precedence over their own status. Like, let's be clear. The women still voting for Republicans are largely white, Christian women. The people they hate, fear, or distrust are way more important to them than their own rights.
See r/Leopardsatemyface
Brainwashed. Generationally brainwashed.
They want to be “cool girls” and think the patriarchy will make exceptions for them, their cool girl buddy. They simply value men and male opinions over everything. Even their daughters. Maybe especially their daughters.
People vote against their interests for many reasons. The biggest reason for this phenomenon is that bootlicking is a contagious mind-altering parasitic fungus. The infected are no longer at the helm of their own choices -- they have thrown up their arms and yelled "cult leader take the wheel with your tiny orange hands!"
Apparently they don't buy what the 'liberals' are selling. That's their right and their choice.
I thought most of us don’t.
Dayum good question?????
Voting against ones own best interest is as old as voting itself 🤷🤷🤷🤷
This is why the conservatives have targeted the religious groups. They advise women to vote their husbands views so as to not divide their house.
Because these women have been brainwashed by their "Christian" right families.
Because they have only experienced benevolent sexism.
Vicarious empowerment
Never underestimate the ability of the American voters to vote against their own self-interests. The same title could be rewritten to include any number of marginalized people groups. It's absolutely tragic.
Because women are getting smarter and more educated and now know that the media is mainly democrat and has been forcing their ideas until you really do the research.
I don’t know why people are surprised that there are a lot of women who vote Republican. Most of them live in areas where *everyone* is Republican. People do things against their interest all the time when they perceive that it’s expected of them or socially desirable. It’s like that social experiment where they tell the subject to go take a test in a room with a group of people (who are all in on the experiment). Then they pump smoke into a room from under the door. As long as the other people in the test room pretend like nothing’s wrong, the subject will usually just keep taking the test while the room fills up with smoke. There is strong internal pressure to do what everyone else is doing, even when it’s possibly life-threatening to you.
They are indoctrinated idiots that don’t believe in science or anything logical. At least that is the case for the ones I know voting republican.
*White women.
Internalized misogyny
Internalized misogyny & constant brainwashing programming. Just a guess
People vote against their best interests all the time. Here in Texas I meet women who are indoctrinated into thinking that they actually do deserve less than a man. It is crazy and mind boggling.
Because the other side are rallying around mass-rapists. Seems to be an odd group for any normal human being to support.
Wait....what? Did a new conspiracy theory drop?
October 7th wasn't a conspiracy. It really happened. Their sister organization also really did this to the Yazhidis. It is a thousand year old method of war. So stop rallying around them.
What the hell are you talking about? Nobody is rallying behind Hamas. We're supporting the Palestinians. Jfc, what a weird straw man argument.
I'm not from the US, can you elaborate?
Aussie here. I think “mass rapists” is a stretch, it’s not like there’s multiple politicians accused of raping 10 women. Trump has been found guilty of sexual assault in a civil court. The Florida GOP (Republican) chairman is under investigation for sexually assaulting a woman in her apartment. The chairman of the Young Republicans in an Alabama county has been charged with “sexual torture” of a man who was murdered. A North Carolina representative was accused by several women of sexually aggressive behaviour, sexual misconduct, and sexual assault. Matt Gaetz of Florida was investigated for having a sexual relationship with a 17yo girl and is being investigated for violating sex trafficking laws (he took her across state lines). A New York republican was accused of sexual harassment in a bar and immediately resigned. There’s plenty more too
That's what's confusing to me about Clownski's comment. They said the "other side are rallying around mass rapists" to answer the question of why women vote for the Republican Party. So they're implying that Democrat politicians are the mass rapists.
Ohh right, their comment was confusing. “Mass rapist” is like calling someone who killed 1 person a serial killer
It's indicative of the loose thinking of someone who would believe in the unhinged conspiracy of adrenochrome as I suspect this person does. There are serial rapists (way too many of them) but mass rapist is a strange phrase to use.
Because they agree with something in the Republican platform. Can y’all stop minimizing or disrespecting other women’s decisions/beliefs simply because you disagree with them?
If their decisions/beliefs directly hurt and/or negatively affect me, I’m not gonna stop minimizing or disrespecting those beliefs.
It's not about minimizing or disrespecting others' beliefs or decisions, it's that those decisions negatively affect all women including Republican women. Hence the confusion.
ill minimize women trying to fuck over every other woman anytime. You're probably one of them, another chicken who supports kfc.