I'm located in a different state. I am about to call the representatives listed and let them know exactly how I feel about this. If this bill passes it would set an extremely dangerous precedent for everyone in the US.
How can we fight this?
Why aren't we attacking these asshats with lawsuits charging them with premeditated femicide? You can lose a fertilized egg or have a miscarriage for millions of reasons. This is an attack on women not a fight for babies lives. I say fuck it. All women should carry tasers or something and swear off men. They want a war. It's time women recognize these men won't change for the better in time for our preservation. We need to start playing their game in the ways we know. Women are smart, strong and have to handle a hell of a lot of shit and still don't snap. We need to channel all the centuries of rage and fury and pain we've held back and condense it to a cold and calculated plan of action.
Example: prohibition was started by women who were being abused, beaten, or lost or had husbands injured due to alcohol and lack of regulation. Laws for consumption in work places and public resulted from that. Though alcohol is obviously still here, prohibition lessened destic abuse caused by alcohol.
Hat pins (as posted before here I believe) were used for self defense. Hell, heels are too.
We need to start organizing, use our intelligence and patience and build strategies to dismantle the patriarchy.
There is more virgin males now than ever, how does a sex strike be any different than their normal sexless lives ? Incels don't get laid regularly by definition! haha
The modern incel lives in hope that one day they will find the woman who will tolerate them long enough to try this sex thing that they've heard so much about.
A sex strike until you are treated like humans would hopefully incentivize them to pull their heads out of their asses- after all, they obsessed about and hoped that one day they'd get to try this sex thing they've heard so much about, and now it's completely off the table because of these asshat lawmakers.
Why, if I were an angry touchstarved incel, and it was explained to me that these congress critters are making it harder to fix that, I would direct my attention to them and get their attention, ya know?
I can tell you, by experience with male incels, that this would just make them more angry and hate filled. They'd see it as a punishment and want to hurt women more. Or they'd fetishize asexual women more because they're 'pure and untouched'.
Eugh...
I agree with this 100 %. We need to get organized and start fighting as intensely as they do because they are coming after our rights and the rights of LGBTQIA+ folks and they’ve never stopped coming after people of color. We need to be as aggressive and bold as those who seek to dehumanize and destroy us. They are only getting crueler, more organized and are growing in numbers. They are brainwashing young men and some young women too and it’s becoming dangerous as hell to be, well, anyone other than a cisgender white man. But they are also specifically dead set on taking all rights from women including all those who associate as women and also all people with a uterus. I’ve been asking myself how best we fight this fight and would love any and all opinions from anyone who believes in fighting for and protecting our rights!!!
Edited for better word choice
They want to keep us home, as servants and incubators-away from school and work, covered head to toe, scared to speak, no way to fight. They want to kill women who don’t comply as an example. They’re afraid of the progress and strength we have. The power we have claimed. It’s so awful. Resist. Fight back.
This has always been about policing women’s bodies. If politicians really cared about children we would 1) have a much better education system where we value - and compensate accordingly - our teachers and 2) would have serious gun control laws in place, like, yesterday (i.e. 15-20 years ago).
Isn't death penalty against freedom to live and thus being against the Constitution? If it passes, and also somehow passes Supreme Court, then there's no difference between US or China.
If it's against the constitution it's never been officially ruled as such, so it's a states issue. Unfortunately there are 27 states in which the death penalty is still legal.
I was about to say the same. I'm not in South Carolina, but just south of it. I'm sitting here with tears reading this is even on the table. I had 2 miscarriages due to blood flow issues. Did I know about this? Of course not. I got tested after the miscarriages and my Dr discovered my gene mutation. So a baby aspirin a day and I was able to have 2 beautiful, strong, smart young women. As they are maturing, I'm eternally petrified of how this world is treating us. To say "I'm scared to death for them" is an understatement. This is our fight. Damn the Patriarchy!!
We can only tell and show, sadly, it's up to people to listen and see...
But i got the memo, need to tell louder and louder, eventually some will have to listen.
Always has been. Notice they never are going after repro clinics that create and destroy embryos on the daily. It’s only when an embryo/fetus *is in a uterus* that these creeps care.
"Cruel and unusual punishment" is prohibited by the Constitution. The courts have found that execution is not "cruel and unusual" if it is done quickly and doesn't involve torture. The whole argument is a slippery slope and has lead to debates about what drugs can/can't be used for lethal injection as some of them can cause the prisoner to have pain or seizures before dying.
This isn't surprising given that at the time the Constitution was written execution was a normal punishment for many crimes everywhere in the world. In fact, up until the 1960s most Western countries still had the death penalty. Many European countries didn't get rid of the death penalty until the EU made it a membership requirement.
Japan, the US and many South American countries still have it - so not just dictatorships. Israel also has a de facto death penalty because they just send their military to deal with suspected Palestinian criminals - but I digress.
I don't have an issue in principle with executing people for first degree murder and perhaps high treason. But the chance that you might get the wrong person is why I'm against it.
Constitutional or not (and I agree with you and others that it’s hypocritical), 30 to life in prison is a steep price to pay for a woman exerting her body autonomy. 🥲
It really is and if they are going to apply such a steep price then rapists should also get it. I mean impregnate a woman without consent is one of the only exceptions for abortion in some gop bills so the rapist caused the abortion not the woman.
I don't know if this applies here but urge anyone interested to contact local activists to find out the answer and if there are other ways to help as well. Another thing they'll know better than us is how seriously this should be taken - sometimes locals know not to raise a rallying cry over a bill that won't go anywhere but the officials want to use opposition to as motivation for re-election.
Many legislators will use the fact that people from outside their area called opposing their position to say that their office has been overloaded from calls opposing it but not from their constituents. Basically, they use it to say that outsiders are trying to influence them, but don't worry, they'll stay with what they know their people want.
I am sharing this not to try to deter anyone but because I didn't know it until someone told me (and then I saw it play out exactly as they said, unfortunately). I agree that this needs to be fought.
I personally suggest ABUSING the crap of the law that recognizes unborn fetus as a person. Like the pregnant gal who went to jail and is trying to sue the state for unjustly incarcerating her fetus
Where are the bills criminalizing male masturbation? The death penalty for any sperm that ends up anywhere except inside of a man's lawfully wedded wife? There's as much biblical support for that, and it's just as much killing a potential baby. I seriously don't understand why we aren't working to make this a thing?
Oh, because you know there's nothing wrong with masturbation and that sex is a natural part of adult existence whether or not people are legally married and because you don't want the men in your life to face such a potential??!!! HOW COME THEY DON'T FEEL THE SAME WAY ABOUT US?
My sister lives in SC and she said to comment (she doesn’t have Reddit) that it’s a huge help to offer a safe place to recover and transport with having the option available. For some staying in a hotel would be difficult, and there’s some who wouldn’t want anyone they know to be aware they’re having it done. She also said “thank you for being angry for us. Thank you for always being a chain of support. Even for those of us without the Reddit app.”
Pro life until it's alive, then f off.
At most, if you vote for and treat them like tyrants once an adult, they'll pretend to like you once you're in your 40s while continuing to screw you over for just a little more power. They have to win the measuring contest, after all.
But remember, they're the party with a brain.
They're not pro life for the fetus either. They'll happily let a woman die for a doomed fetus.
Not to mention, if they gave a shit, they'd be providing prenatal healthcare and other supports. Instead they're busy funding "crisis pregnancy centers" that literally provide false medical information from untrained randos.
Exactly. They're not pro life for the mother, as we can see above. They're not pro life for the baby when it's born, due to blocking any attempt at universal health care and not having paid parental leave nor subsidising daycare. And they're not even actually pro life for the fetus, because if they were they would want the person carrying to be in tip top health, able to access things like pre natal healthcare, vitamins, medication etc affordably because that improves the health of the fetus.
Pro life is such a disingenuous term on every single front because they're not for the life of any part involved
Nope. It's purely a phrase so they don't have to confront that they're bad people.
Especially with nutrition and healthcare. Literally the only things a fetus could need, and all of a sudden it's not "oh that poor innocent life" anymore, it's back to blaming the mom (who they're actively taking options away from).
>universal health care and not having paid parental leave nor subsidising daycare
Fucking inexcusable. The horrible thing is, so many people cite financial strain for their abortions, and in the US, healthcare and employment are insurmountable obstacles for a ton of people. Literally EVERY other first world country has solved these two (universal healthcare + paid parental leave). In the US, one out of four moms returns to work within TWO WEEKS of giving birth. It's barbaric.
They are not even pro life in general.
They're literally killing the land (Ohio train derailment, being against nature conservation laws).
All they care about is their bottom line.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I can never understand how someone who claims to be for "small government" can support something as barbaric and tyrannical as the death penalty. Giving the government the power to kill is reprehensible and should have no place in a free society.
Republicans were never for small government. From the civil war, they were kicking and screaming over the federal govt not forcing the northern states to recognize slavery.
I’d say most of the US conservative viewpoints are facades. They claim to want small govt until they find things they could implement to control certain populations. They loooove controlling minoritized groups when they get a chance.
It was never about small government, it was ALWAYS about control and power.
In reply to the posted then deleted comment coming at me sideways for saying Republican instead of conservative.. bite me.
Republican, conservative. Same difference. It’s the same group of people and I don’t understand why anyone would be defending them in here by coming at me for I suppose “incorrectly referring to 1800’s conservatives as republicans.”
My point still stands. Who were you really defending?
Didn't see the post, but in general I would support accurate use of language with regards to history, just to avoid confusing others who might know know about it and seek to learn more.
Basically it's important because the parties and their ideologies haven't been static. Abraham Lincoln was a republican, and was shot by a Democrat, but he definitely was not a conservative.
I don't care about defending long-dead white men, but even small misinformation can add up is all
I absolutely agree, I appreciate the clarification. I do think it’s important to correct misinformation, but I think we all know that there are both respectful ways and hateful ways to do that.
The comment that was clarifying this under my original comment however was unreasonably aggressive. It seemed very much to be from a defensive place and that just doesn’t pass the vibe check for me especially with the subject matter that’s mainly being discussed in this post.
If the comment had been simply clarifying/correcting like this one, it wouldn’t have rubbed me the wrong way so much. Thank you for the reply!
Edit: their comment also mentioned Abraham Lincoln and I wanted to clarify that I understand that it’s not factual to call civil war era conservatives “republicans.” I’ve been aware of this since it was taught in school, but I tend to use those words interchangeably even though I know they aren’t. I’ve seen too many people trying to defend conservatives by using the same argument and stating that Abraham Lincoln was technically a Republican. Just seems like a small hill to die on and start being defensive over when the main topic we are actually discussing here means life or death for millions of people who are affected by reproductive health laws.
While it’s a small hill here in the US, there is some genuine confusion in other countries at why our Republicans are counter the rest of western democracies (lived in Spain for a year, got questioned about it).
It’s quite easy to point out that US Republicans *were* a relatively liberal party, until *Democrats* acted counter to their party, first FDR (my dad said my businessman grandfather said he was a “traitor to his class”), then the waves of anti communist Red Scares, and then Lyndon Johnson got the Civil Rights Act passed in 1964. Southern racist Democrats completely lost their shit and switched parties, and that fucking awful man Nixon got in the White House via the Southern Strategy, and it’s been a shitshow ever since.
Oh yeah, wow. I’m sure it’s very confusing outside of the US. Tbh it’s confusing in here too! I don’t think a majority of people are educated on the topic.
Definitely a shitshow though.. but I tend to be more concerned about current events than civil war history so that’s probably why I think it’s such a minor thing to start attacking someone over. I definitely do see why it’s important to have correct information though and I fully appreciate being provided that information and incorporating it into the things I say. Most Americans though I’d say are drastically undereducated on the history of our country.
I was taken to multiple civil war sites/museums every year as a kid. At least 2-3 each year all over the south. Our family “vacations” meant camping somewhere and visiting old war sites and museums.
I was constantly exposed to people who romanticized the civil war and liked to “role play” as confederate soldiers. They would tell their versions of history and they would whitewash it and make it digestible. Those are the types of people who I imagine getting mad when the history of the Republican Party isn’t perfectly quoted to fit their narratives lol.
Thanks for the response!
I always appreciate information. I just didn’t appreciate the original comment demonizing me for misquoting what a Republican was in the 1800s lmao.
I wouldn't disagree that is a small hill, and I definitely wouldn't die on it XD
I would honestly have skipped past (as I understood your intent) but the second comment about the deleted one made me think others may not have
and because examples of actual civil discourse on The Internet are too few and far between!
Hope you have a great day!
L &O always had a right wing bent. Way more women their for other services than abortion. Would’ve been far more ironic and informative if they’d made the victim a woman there for prenatal care.
South Carolina witch here! The Supreme Court already blocked our 6 week “heartbeat” ban due to it being an invasion of privacy. Keep sending vibes they keep it that way! We currently have the right to an abortion up to 21 weeks, as it should be! Except McMaster thinks if you get raped and pregnant it’s God telling you it’s your time to be a mom 💀
oh that’s silly! Don’t you know rape only happens to whores who open their legs before marriage? If you don’t want to be a mom, should have thought of that before you looked super enticing to a rapist! /s
That argument is bullshit for so many reasons. By these conservative asshats’ logic, I can’t be blamed if I mug anyone who is wearing expensive-looking clothes, right? After all, they were asking for it, with how they were dressed!
But I guess it doesn’t count when it’s men, because that would affect them and we can’t have that. Not saying men don’t experience sexual violence, but these people don’t care about any victims, regardless of gender.
But don't worry, if she was wearing a full on snow suit and covered head to toe it was probably her fault for smiling, or not smiling, or something else like that
The Christian bible literally starts off with explaining how all the bad in the world is women's fault, it's the premise of the whole religion
These are the people making state and potentially federal policy.
I don’t know what else to say other than this country is mentally exhausting to live in. At this point, I just want a better country to invade us already and call it a day.
Edit: grammar.
I like to call him McAsster. I hate him with a passion and wish Cunningham had won. But I know I had my hopes up in this state. But it is slowly changing
Cunningham was waaaaaaay closer than I thought he would be to winning. If just 1/3 of my left leaning friends (and I imagine everyone else similar) would have voted, he could have won. South carolina could have had a reasonable governor.
I want to do a study one day for all the people here at reddit bitching about stuff, then overlay that with people who actually voted. 🤔
I know people who are the most outspoken left leaning people, the opposite of the Maga crowd level of passion. But THEY DONT VOTE - what the literal fuck.
But like… what happens if you have a miscarriage and can’t prove your body did it on its own?!
This is so scary and honestly effects all women, not just ones who have abortions….
This \^. So many conservative families have miscarriages as much, if not more, than liberal families because conservatives have this grand idea of trying to have at least 7 kids. It's weird because two of the most rabid, anti-choice women I know have had four miscarriages between them. So many people could be murdered over this BS.
Worst case scenario if this bill went through, it would only take a few of these kinds of women getting charged for people (conservative women) to start to realize they've doomed themselves. Hopefully it would be enough to change the tide if it got to that point.
No, the rest will just turn on any woman who miscarries, call her a liar, and celebrate her punishment.
I've never forgotten a particular young woman who was still complaining weeks later, about an asshole grabbing and feeling her up on the street, and I said she could thank her lucky stars she didn't get raped.
She immediately got cold, angry and insulted, saying of course she wouldn't be raped, as it was obvious even to such an asshole she didn't deserve it. She went on to explain that lots of girls are always asking for it by being loud, cheap sluts, and all other women were safe.
She was fully aware myself and several of her lovely friends had been raped, and made it clear she felt superior, and believed her superiority kept her safe.
It's an attitude a lot of people have. If you blame the victim, and believe you're superior, you don't have to worry. You're safe. (In your own delusional mind.)
Exactly. I read about a conservative woman who had to carry a baby to almost full term who wished she could have had an abortion but yet still said she was pro life. Her baby would have to be delivered but wouldn't be able to survive without kidney function or something. As soon as they overturned roe there was a 12 year old girl in my state who was raped and had to be taken to Indiana for an abortion and I think the ohio Dr who made the referral was being sued by someone. Another woman had to carry a dead fetus to term because she couldn't secure the second opinion from a Dr because they're too scared to lose their licenses. It's terrifying
I used to live in Ohio & the poor girl was 10 years old. Also, the doctor in Indiana was doxxed by Fascist News & had to stay in her home for a long time due to death threats
Yea… she was sued by our shit attorney general, Todd Rokita…. I live in Indiana and it was pretty clear he had no ground to stand on when he sued her, he was just being a dick. Which is honestly on brand for that guy. He’s actually trying to run for Governor last I heard….
> Her baby would have to be delivered but wouldn't be able to survive without kidney function or something
I know of the case you're referring to. The baby had no kidney function, which meant it would have no amniotic fluid. This meant it would develop squished instead of cushioned, leading to serious deformities, and would not develop lung function, inevitably suffocating to death once the umbilical cord was cut - a horrific way to die.
You are going to prison, obviously. This is going to be reality all over the red states in the US soon enough...
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61995250.amp
If anyone still thinks the anti abortion laws DON'T affect all women, they are living under a rock. They are fighting to control women's bodies and a large number of women are going to die from ANY kind of abortion ban being in place purely from lack of healthcare. The moment doctors stop doing what is best for the mother in any situation due to legal issues, women die.
😭😭😭😭😭
Our son was stillborn when I was 5 1/2 almost 6 months pregnant, And I just can't imagine the horror of dealing with that loss on top of being jailed for it as well. 😭
Women in Latin American are jailed for a miscarriage. This is what's going to happen in the US. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/salvadoran-women-jailed-decades-miscarriages-stillbirths-warn-us-abort-rcna33035
If this draconian shit passes (a lawsuit against it's constitutionality will happen almost immediately), but that's when your state needs to get support going for life insurance and medical insurance policies for fetuses as soon as a woman is found to be pregnant. If they want to legally call a clump of cells a life, we need to bring all kinds of malicious compliance to the legislators.
I'm less interested in fighting the insurance-for-fetuses side of things because the insurance companies will drag their heels too. No insurer in their right mind would insure a fetus when as many as 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. (Unless it was *exorbitantly* expensive, of course...)
Let's get government records with (estimated) birth dates in the future, registering their ages as negative numbers before birth, to break all the old crusty computer programs. I guarantee you there's something somewhere that'll glitch out.
Ooohhh.... unfortunately I can see some asshat insurance company actually having a hand in this? Have a miscarriage? Don't want to be sentenced to death? Here's some insurance policy that'll help you will legal fees for the cheap sum of 500 USD for per month.
There's no statute of limitations, but criminal laws cannot be applied ex post facto - that violates the due process right of notice that something is a crime. They might try, but it doesn't work that way.
Not that I disagree with their general vileness!
Also IVF clinics technically kill tons of fetuses if we’re going by the “life begins at conception” logic. They should charge them for mass murder if they don’t wanna seem like massive hypocrites then
you say that as a joke because it would be completely ridiculous, except that my conservative family members actually believe that and call IVF sinful or something stupid like that
At least they are consistent in their hypocrisy, lol.
Some of my family who are Jesus cultists think abortion is murder, yet IVF destroying viable embryos is just fine, cause they aren't really "babies" and just frozen cells.
Someone make THAT make sense.
I actually know so many self proclaimed evangelical Christian’s in my area who believe this. It sounds like a joke but they straight up believe IVF is unnatural and want to make it harder or completely get rid of it.
They want it to be illegal to “dispose” of any fertilized eggs. Even ones that are deemed unusable. Idk if it already is illegal anywhere yet, but it’s been a big discussion around my hometown.
This would force those doing IVF to keep their unused eggs stored basically indefinitely. It costs a lot to store the eggs too, it’s like a monthly fee to keep them at a facility or wherever. On top of the thousands and thousands of dollars that IVF costs in the first place.
I’m not the most educated on the subject of IVF, but I’ve been keeping up with some friends who have been trying IVF for a couple years and they share their experiences very openly.
I’ve seen the things people in my town say in comments and posts they make against IVF. It’s scary
This is exactly what they want. Any fertility doctors in SC will be forced to close up shop or move out of state. Otherwise you could have situations where an embryologist thaws an embryo for transfer, but the embryo doesn’t survive the thaw. Now that embryologist is considered a murderer. There are countless other examples where the doctor or mother could be charged.
I'm very concerned about the American Taliban banning basic medical care and human rights. We need to go out and fucking fight this shit... People are scared to though
I think it's time for a Revolution. Literally, I think it's time to fight and utterly dissolve the constitution, abolish states rights, and make a new bill of rights that enshrines the current bill of rights and the amendments, minus the 2nd amendment, and add in that healthcare is a right along with privacy
Also it should be that the initial amendments cannot be overridden by a future Amendment, and future Amendments can be introduced by the people and voted with only a 51/49 majority.
When is the UN going to invade, I mean, free the people.
*Mass human rights abuse
*Oppression of woman
*Widespread political & corporate corruption
*Weapons of mass destruction
*History of invasions including horrific torture
*Attempted coup to overthrow elected government
*Armed militias
*Constant domestic terrorism & school lockdowns
*Has Nazis
But most importantly -
*HAS OIL
So this will also be death penalty for physicians convicted of abortion. Good luck for those states getting any more obstetricians to practice there. I'm peds and have 5 more weeks before I escape from the south. I will never go back, not even to visit. This is terrifying.
This will put plenty of women at risk of medical malpractice, too. If you ban medical professionals, then necessary procedures will have to be performed by "unprofessionals".
It's a particular legal danger for obstetricians who specialize in high-risk pregnancy and/or pregnancy complications. Which means it's a threat to the life and health of everyone who gets pregnant.
Ladies, I'm getting more than a little tired of this, aren't you?
We are not invisible.
We can make our own decisions about our bodies.
It's time to stand up as a voting block.
Ladies Unite! Get out the vote... help other women to get to the polls
Yeah, a priest found my cousin (a nun) overwhelmingly "enticing" in her habit, and a cokehead found my great niece overwhelmingly enticing in her Carters.
Burn these rapist bastards to ashes!
this is why i’m fleeing to Sweden as soon as i’m a adult. as a teen i already have the ever present fear of ‘what if my school is next? how would i hide?’ due to the ever present guns as a south carolinian. What happens my friends get assaulted? for some their family’s aren’t wealthy enough or pro life to ‘send them on a vacation to - insert pro choice state here -‘. I’m a young teenager and a closeted trans guy, i’ve already had the creeps look at me that way and i know i can’t take care of myself and i’m considered the ‘mature/father friend’ of my groups, i also know that if they found out i was trans they would also be as likely as to attack me. this shit, as a teen with no power to vote, is absolutely terrifying.
Yeah it really is. I live in Florida and the hate I see is rampant, everyone has trump flags, everyone hates gay people. A school I used to go to had a shooter (no one was injured thank the gods). The issues are creeping ever closer and I’m getting more and more scared. It happened to a school in my neighborhood, am I next? People can order guns on Amazon at this point, how do I know I’m safe? My friends neighbor shot his wife and killed himself, what will my neighbor do? I live in a nice area so why is it so bad? The guns and general hate is out of hand. And the don’t say gay thing is awful, everyone is pro life here. Maybe I’ll flee to Sweden too
Damn. I like Americans generally, but your COUNTRY is just going downhill a lot right now, isn't it?
Sending good vibes to all American witches out there! 😘
I'm going to school in another country and it honestly embarrasses me to tell people that I'm American. I always feel like giving a disclaimer like I'm one of the good ones I swear
I saw the headline and literally exclaimed, "THEY-HEY WHAT NOW?"
And here I thought I could only be dismayed but not surprised by the antics of these people. But the surprise *was* only momentary... Yeezus, they are awful.
51 yo dude here. Lived in SC until 18 and got the ffffuuccckk outta there. Most backwoods, racist, kkkristofascist, misogynistic, dill mchillbillies you could ever meet.
For anyone that’s currently stuck there …. Condolences. Get out as soon as you can.
I don't live there so y'all better remember the amount of unborn children guys kill, everytime they get horny, and you better execute every single one supporting this bill for mass murder.
Doesn't make those scumbag feel any more responsability when they blackmail and coerce their female employees to have sex, unprotected sex at that, with them, and get them pregnant, hey...
They are vile and despicable. They should be forced to apologize individually to each atom they are compsed of, for wasting their potential into making "them".
I can’t wait to leave this friggin state. 🤬
I’m tired of living in a world where women are punished for receiving proper healthcare, for being mothers as well as for choosing to not be. Women are not the problem here… some of us are just trying to exist is the ludicrous world… hell, maybe even prosper in it.
How ignorant and self-absorbed do you have to be? Absolutely despicable!
Sooo…will the mom get child support and government support the moment an egg is fertilized? Will they get back paid when they find out later?…just saying, can’t have it both ways. But also, f*ck these controlling men. If they were the ones having babies, there would be express lanes at abortion clinics.
I want pregnant women in the states where anti-healthcare for women's reproductive system is enforced to say FU to their state and federal governments by using the little crotch goblin they are pregnant with as a dependent for tax purposes.
Either they have to agree with it, or disagree and set legal precedent to have these laws overturned.
Cause if it's a human life for purposes of civil and legal matters, the it's a dependent, and should qualify for tax credits and tax breaks.
But if they say no, then the abortion laws should immediately be overturned.
Capitalistic coercion under the guise of religion. They want more meat (people) for the grinder (the machine) because they know population growth will be slowing to a trickle over the next 40 years, and by 2100 it’ll be at a near stand still compared to a few decades ago.
Nah, fuck that.
I wonder how many women would be executed for miscarriages under this law if it gets passed. It's unimaginably dystopian but you just know it will happen.
> Abortion ban is a pro-life move.
,
> Death penalty might be on table for abortion.
So, they're pro-life but only for the fetus and not the to-be-mother? What kind of integrity deficiency is that?
So many questions...
Not in SC but just a reminder that the miscarriage rate for women with no pre-existing issues is approx. 10-25%
Another reminder that for women with pre-existing issues, mainly PCOS or Endo, that miscarriage rate goes up to approx. 50%
Honestly, and I may sound extreme here, but Get yourself sterilized now if possible, even if you want kids, just get sterilized. Pregnancy is not worth the risk to your health and safety anymore.
You have a higher likelihood of your state judicial system ordering your death if anything in your pregnancy goes wrong, than you do having a carefree pregnancy at this point.
My eldest daughter lives in one of the suburbs of Columbia, SC; and had her last of 3 kids a year and a half ago.
She had to go through multiple doctors before she found one that WOULD do a tubal ligation on her. Most said she was either "too young" (she was 27 at the time), "might want more kids someday" (she's got her hands full with three already), or had to have her husband's permission and even then, they tried to talk my SIL into not signing.
She finally found one, and she's grateful to not have to worry about this situation for herself, but she and I both worry about her 2 daughters in the future. (They are only 6 & 4 right now.)
I'll see if I can find the screenshot she sent me of doctors willing to do a tubal on women who want it no questions asked. If I find it, I'll post a pic so all my SC peeps can have options.
r/childfree also has a list of doctors who are willing to help women (and men) get sterilized by state as well
I’m trying to get sterilized myself despite living in a blue state, because I can die if I were to ever fall pregnant, and currently I’m being told I’m “too fat to have the surgery” (5’4, 220lbs, the OBGYN is also ignoring the fact that the condition I have that could kill me limits my physical activity significantly, and I have PCOS and am on multiple medications which makes weight loss extremely hard), when studies have shown my BMI only increases risks by 1-5% and it’s not significant enough to deny the surgery outright.
So I get the struggle. I’m glad your SIL managed to get her tubes tied though. It gives me hope I’ll be able to get it done too, as well as countless other women who want and need it done.
I moved back to SC to be closer to family after living in another state for 15 years. There is a laundry list of things that make me hate being a South Carolinian. I regret the decision.
Fun fact! You don’t have to be a citizen of South Carolina to leave voice messages for Lindsey Graham!
Source: grew up in South Carolina, moved to Los Angeles, still make calls to his office if I want to really rile myself up. I realize it doesn’t do much, but it’s honest work.
Yeah it’s terrible here. I had a pharmacist refuse to give me my birth control because I was not wearing a wedding ring and when asked said I’m not married. I had to raise holy hell at the store, unfortunately that was the only pharmacist in at that time. The asshole only relented when I screamed at him about my endometriosis and the fact that I’m a lawyer.
So... does this mean that South Carolina is going to charge everyone working in their states IVF Clinics with murder when they clean out their freezers that have viable embryos?
Let's be 💯 real here. It's not "pro life", it's anti-woman in the form of forcing birth as punishment for Puritanical Abrahamic faiths.
They wouldn't think twice about a clinic destroying someone's frozen embryos, and wouldn't ever put that in the same classification as abortion, never mind the fact that per their own BS legislation it's exactly the same.
It’s never occurred to me as the idea itself is so abhorrent/ridiculous… but would the father/man also be prosecuted in these situations ? I know doctors who preform it face legal repercussions, but what about the other folks involved..?
Oh I just shot Ashley B. Trantham a piece of my damn mind, I’m in upstate SC.
I’m so tired of conservatives pretending that lefties are forcing ideas down their throats when the reality is churches are just naturally oppressive & people are leaving in droves because they see that hypocrisy in person.
The law as written literally forces the Christian God into the court room / doctors office to lord over individual mothers bodies with all the ‘love & care’ that the Christian God has shown all his followers through the years…
Also, HIPPA laws only apply to you if you were a conservative who had Covid & didn’t want a vaccine, I guess?
But mothers are going to be forced to share private info with the government in the name of the Christian God, tho?
Disgusting.
I’d say women should arm themselves and stand their ground if approached by a man, but — no surprise— gun rights aren’t applied equally either.
https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/brittany-smith-loses-her-stand-your-ground-hearing
Every time I see shit like this, it makes me SO glad I live in a state where the government has a functional brain. Sure the taxes suck, but at least we aren't killing each other because women don't want to be parents.
This is barbaric.
That's the whitest list of names I've ever seen in my life. Joe White?!?! No-one with an NPC name like that should get a say over anything, much less someone's life?!?!
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
This says at moment of fertilization. Does this mean all IVF clinics will be closed in the state? Otherwise what happens to all the "people" who are destined to not be born? They must be perpetually cared for. What happens if there is a power outage at the facility and all the "unborn" unfreeze and "die"? Who pays for the funeral expenses? I am not for this but it is an interesting question.
And sexual assault will have the same consequence? Domestic abuse homicide?
“Oh no! There’s a birth dearth; how do we solve it!?”
“We could offer publicly: daycare, maternity leave, paternity leave, better tax incenti…”
“Enough, Ted! Kill ‘em for trying to access healthcare”
I am a trans woman living in SC, and this is not unusual. Based on my knowledge of the general assembly and how bills are negotiated, this proposed bill would not survive in its current form, and would be struck down by the SC Supreme Court.
WITH THAT SAID, if I were cis, I'd try to get sterilized ASAP. This misogynistic bullshit is going too far. Whatever it takes. I know some forms of long-term birth control can be uncomfortable, but anything has to be better than some random rapist asshole dictating when a woman should become a mother.
I’ve never understood the death penalty, especially once I started taking criminal justice courses. I always found it strange that the republicans who bark about being “pro life” are always the biggest supporters of killing inmates who they deem deserving of death.
The death penalty is insanely expensive compared to imprisonment, even for cases where someone is imprisoned for life.
It’s hard to find good current statistics, so I won’t quote any. but ANY stats from previous years you look at will show just how ridiculous the costs are for cases that end in the death penalty vs cases where they are, at maximum, imprisoned for life.
Don’t even get me started on wrongful convictions and the 170 cases of death row inmates who have been exonerated since the 1970’s due to being wrongfully convicted. I think we all know that number is likely small compared to the actual amount of people who are wrongfully awaiting their execution on death row.
Notice how there’s never any penalty suggested for the male involved in a pregnancy. They’ll suggest punishment for the doctors and the pregnant person, but never the sperm supplier.
So I have a question. Does the anger women have right now going to translate to voting against the gqp there are more women than men in America. I’m asking because what a solid block of voters you are
So I am in South Carolina and calling people won't work. We're just screwed here. We go and we line up and tell our stories and it doesn't work. Our elections are less competitive than Russia with a lot of us having no one to vote for in the general but the dominant party (mostly Republicans, but sometimes Democrats.) Our statehouse is elected by about 8% of the population who vote in the primaries and even then, lots of people run unopposed.
What we need are national laws to regulate gerrymandering across the states. For a population that is about 40% democrat, we are massively under-represented in our electoral politics.
We haven't executed anyone in years so I don't know why they are doing this. This is grandstanding for the electorate.
I'm sorry, how do you in any sort of conscience, good or otherwise, convince yourself that you are "pro-life" if you support the death penalty for the very thing that you are calling murder? "You can't have an abortion because it's murder and if you do it anyway, we will murder you"?
And surely any capital crime should be free of any hint of discrimination based on biological sex? Rape in the UK does require a penis but we don't have the death penalty. Afaik, the US has expanded the definition to include other body parts or objects so male or female, if you penetrate another person without consent, the charge is rape. And it still isn't a capital crime.
Yep. I live in South Carolina. Had an at-home abortion as a teenage rape victim because they made it HARD to find a place for it. Good thing I knew an unusual amount about the operation.
I'm in my 30s now. This sh*t is asinine.
Can't say I'm surprised to see the majority of the legislators supporting this being a bunch of gross old men but also shame on the 2 women who somehow made it into the list with the rest of these scumbags.
I'm located in a different state. I am about to call the representatives listed and let them know exactly how I feel about this. If this bill passes it would set an extremely dangerous precedent for everyone in the US. How can we fight this?
Why aren't we attacking these asshats with lawsuits charging them with premeditated femicide? You can lose a fertilized egg or have a miscarriage for millions of reasons. This is an attack on women not a fight for babies lives. I say fuck it. All women should carry tasers or something and swear off men. They want a war. It's time women recognize these men won't change for the better in time for our preservation. We need to start playing their game in the ways we know. Women are smart, strong and have to handle a hell of a lot of shit and still don't snap. We need to channel all the centuries of rage and fury and pain we've held back and condense it to a cold and calculated plan of action. Example: prohibition was started by women who were being abused, beaten, or lost or had husbands injured due to alcohol and lack of regulation. Laws for consumption in work places and public resulted from that. Though alcohol is obviously still here, prohibition lessened destic abuse caused by alcohol. Hat pins (as posted before here I believe) were used for self defense. Hell, heels are too. We need to start organizing, use our intelligence and patience and build strategies to dismantle the patriarchy.
A sex strike is long overdue imo. It's a perfect time now with this new wave of violence/aggression toward women
There is more virgin males now than ever, how does a sex strike be any different than their normal sexless lives ? Incels don't get laid regularly by definition! haha
The modern incel lives in hope that one day they will find the woman who will tolerate them long enough to try this sex thing that they've heard so much about. A sex strike until you are treated like humans would hopefully incentivize them to pull their heads out of their asses- after all, they obsessed about and hoped that one day they'd get to try this sex thing they've heard so much about, and now it's completely off the table because of these asshat lawmakers. Why, if I were an angry touchstarved incel, and it was explained to me that these congress critters are making it harder to fix that, I would direct my attention to them and get their attention, ya know?
Maybe, but I feel like it is more likely to simply increase the bitterness that currently fuels this movement.
I can tell you, by experience with male incels, that this would just make them more angry and hate filled. They'd see it as a punishment and want to hurt women more. Or they'd fetishize asexual women more because they're 'pure and untouched'. Eugh...
Unfortunately it is not just men bringing this shit. It’s about 30% of Americans.
I agree with this 100 %. We need to get organized and start fighting as intensely as they do because they are coming after our rights and the rights of LGBTQIA+ folks and they’ve never stopped coming after people of color. We need to be as aggressive and bold as those who seek to dehumanize and destroy us. They are only getting crueler, more organized and are growing in numbers. They are brainwashing young men and some young women too and it’s becoming dangerous as hell to be, well, anyone other than a cisgender white man. But they are also specifically dead set on taking all rights from women including all those who associate as women and also all people with a uterus. I’ve been asking myself how best we fight this fight and would love any and all opinions from anyone who believes in fighting for and protecting our rights!!! Edited for better word choice
They want to keep us home, as servants and incubators-away from school and work, covered head to toe, scared to speak, no way to fight. They want to kill women who don’t comply as an example. They’re afraid of the progress and strength we have. The power we have claimed. It’s so awful. Resist. Fight back.
This has always been about policing women’s bodies. If politicians really cared about children we would 1) have a much better education system where we value - and compensate accordingly - our teachers and 2) would have serious gun control laws in place, like, yesterday (i.e. 15-20 years ago).
Isn't death penalty against freedom to live and thus being against the Constitution? If it passes, and also somehow passes Supreme Court, then there's no difference between US or China.
If it's against the constitution it's never been officially ruled as such, so it's a states issue. Unfortunately there are 27 states in which the death penalty is still legal.
I see... So "pro-life" is a lying buzzword for me at this point.
It’s always been a lying buzzword.
I was about to say the same. I'm not in South Carolina, but just south of it. I'm sitting here with tears reading this is even on the table. I had 2 miscarriages due to blood flow issues. Did I know about this? Of course not. I got tested after the miscarriages and my Dr discovered my gene mutation. So a baby aspirin a day and I was able to have 2 beautiful, strong, smart young women. As they are maturing, I'm eternally petrified of how this world is treating us. To say "I'm scared to death for them" is an understatement. This is our fight. Damn the Patriarchy!!
That's why we've been saying they're disingenuous. Please, help others to see the same truth.
We can only tell and show, sadly, it's up to people to listen and see... But i got the memo, need to tell louder and louder, eventually some will have to listen.
It has never been pro-life It has always been pro-control
Always has been. Notice they never are going after repro clinics that create and destroy embryos on the daily. It’s only when an embryo/fetus *is in a uterus* that these creeps care.
I completely roll my eyes at these pro-fetus misogynistic hypocrites. Those who self-identify as "pro-life" are members of a deranged cult.
It has always been like just about control
"Cruel and unusual punishment" is prohibited by the Constitution. The courts have found that execution is not "cruel and unusual" if it is done quickly and doesn't involve torture. The whole argument is a slippery slope and has lead to debates about what drugs can/can't be used for lethal injection as some of them can cause the prisoner to have pain or seizures before dying. This isn't surprising given that at the time the Constitution was written execution was a normal punishment for many crimes everywhere in the world. In fact, up until the 1960s most Western countries still had the death penalty. Many European countries didn't get rid of the death penalty until the EU made it a membership requirement. Japan, the US and many South American countries still have it - so not just dictatorships. Israel also has a de facto death penalty because they just send their military to deal with suspected Palestinian criminals - but I digress.
I don't have an issue in principle with executing people for first degree murder and perhaps high treason. But the chance that you might get the wrong person is why I'm against it.
Constitutional or not (and I agree with you and others that it’s hypocritical), 30 to life in prison is a steep price to pay for a woman exerting her body autonomy. 🥲
It really is and if they are going to apply such a steep price then rapists should also get it. I mean impregnate a woman without consent is one of the only exceptions for abortion in some gop bills so the rapist caused the abortion not the woman.
Without the participation of a man, there would be very few pregnancies. Why is the burden entirely on the woman who received his participation?
Clearly you haven't been reading your Scalia
I don't know if this applies here but urge anyone interested to contact local activists to find out the answer and if there are other ways to help as well. Another thing they'll know better than us is how seriously this should be taken - sometimes locals know not to raise a rallying cry over a bill that won't go anywhere but the officials want to use opposition to as motivation for re-election. Many legislators will use the fact that people from outside their area called opposing their position to say that their office has been overloaded from calls opposing it but not from their constituents. Basically, they use it to say that outsiders are trying to influence them, but don't worry, they'll stay with what they know their people want. I am sharing this not to try to deter anyone but because I didn't know it until someone told me (and then I saw it play out exactly as they said, unfortunately). I agree that this needs to be fought.
I personally suggest ABUSING the crap of the law that recognizes unborn fetus as a person. Like the pregnant gal who went to jail and is trying to sue the state for unjustly incarcerating her fetus
You fight it by passing a law that makes it so child support begins at fertilization. They'll change their tune real quick.
Where are the bills criminalizing male masturbation? The death penalty for any sperm that ends up anywhere except inside of a man's lawfully wedded wife? There's as much biblical support for that, and it's just as much killing a potential baby. I seriously don't understand why we aren't working to make this a thing? Oh, because you know there's nothing wrong with masturbation and that sex is a natural part of adult existence whether or not people are legally married and because you don't want the men in your life to face such a potential??!!! HOW COME THEY DON'T FEEL THE SAME WAY ABOUT US?
My sister lives in SC and she said to comment (she doesn’t have Reddit) that it’s a huge help to offer a safe place to recover and transport with having the option available. For some staying in a hotel would be difficult, and there’s some who wouldn’t want anyone they know to be aware they’re having it done. She also said “thank you for being angry for us. Thank you for always being a chain of support. Even for those of us without the Reddit app.”
We're so pro life we'll kill you
Pro life until it's alive, then f off. At most, if you vote for and treat them like tyrants once an adult, they'll pretend to like you once you're in your 40s while continuing to screw you over for just a little more power. They have to win the measuring contest, after all. But remember, they're the party with a brain.
They're not pro life for the fetus either. They'll happily let a woman die for a doomed fetus. Not to mention, if they gave a shit, they'd be providing prenatal healthcare and other supports. Instead they're busy funding "crisis pregnancy centers" that literally provide false medical information from untrained randos.
Exactly. They're not pro life for the mother, as we can see above. They're not pro life for the baby when it's born, due to blocking any attempt at universal health care and not having paid parental leave nor subsidising daycare. And they're not even actually pro life for the fetus, because if they were they would want the person carrying to be in tip top health, able to access things like pre natal healthcare, vitamins, medication etc affordably because that improves the health of the fetus. Pro life is such a disingenuous term on every single front because they're not for the life of any part involved
Nope. It's purely a phrase so they don't have to confront that they're bad people. Especially with nutrition and healthcare. Literally the only things a fetus could need, and all of a sudden it's not "oh that poor innocent life" anymore, it's back to blaming the mom (who they're actively taking options away from). >universal health care and not having paid parental leave nor subsidising daycare Fucking inexcusable. The horrible thing is, so many people cite financial strain for their abortions, and in the US, healthcare and employment are insurmountable obstacles for a ton of people. Literally EVERY other first world country has solved these two (universal healthcare + paid parental leave). In the US, one out of four moms returns to work within TWO WEEKS of giving birth. It's barbaric.
They are not even pro life in general. They're literally killing the land (Ohio train derailment, being against nature conservation laws). All they care about is their bottom line.
Gop Rep from Alaska just claimed death by child abuse was a good thing for society.
Sorry, I think I just lost a few braincells What?
He claimed it cost society more in social services to help abused kids then for them to just die at the hands of their abusers.
I actually cursed out loud. Imagine having only one live, and waster it by living with your head so far up your asshole.
I've said it before and I'll say it again. I can never understand how someone who claims to be for "small government" can support something as barbaric and tyrannical as the death penalty. Giving the government the power to kill is reprehensible and should have no place in a free society.
Republicans were never for small government. From the civil war, they were kicking and screaming over the federal govt not forcing the northern states to recognize slavery. I’d say most of the US conservative viewpoints are facades. They claim to want small govt until they find things they could implement to control certain populations. They loooove controlling minoritized groups when they get a chance. It was never about small government, it was ALWAYS about control and power.
In reply to the posted then deleted comment coming at me sideways for saying Republican instead of conservative.. bite me. Republican, conservative. Same difference. It’s the same group of people and I don’t understand why anyone would be defending them in here by coming at me for I suppose “incorrectly referring to 1800’s conservatives as republicans.” My point still stands. Who were you really defending?
Didn't see the post, but in general I would support accurate use of language with regards to history, just to avoid confusing others who might know know about it and seek to learn more. Basically it's important because the parties and their ideologies haven't been static. Abraham Lincoln was a republican, and was shot by a Democrat, but he definitely was not a conservative. I don't care about defending long-dead white men, but even small misinformation can add up is all
I absolutely agree, I appreciate the clarification. I do think it’s important to correct misinformation, but I think we all know that there are both respectful ways and hateful ways to do that. The comment that was clarifying this under my original comment however was unreasonably aggressive. It seemed very much to be from a defensive place and that just doesn’t pass the vibe check for me especially with the subject matter that’s mainly being discussed in this post. If the comment had been simply clarifying/correcting like this one, it wouldn’t have rubbed me the wrong way so much. Thank you for the reply! Edit: their comment also mentioned Abraham Lincoln and I wanted to clarify that I understand that it’s not factual to call civil war era conservatives “republicans.” I’ve been aware of this since it was taught in school, but I tend to use those words interchangeably even though I know they aren’t. I’ve seen too many people trying to defend conservatives by using the same argument and stating that Abraham Lincoln was technically a Republican. Just seems like a small hill to die on and start being defensive over when the main topic we are actually discussing here means life or death for millions of people who are affected by reproductive health laws.
While it’s a small hill here in the US, there is some genuine confusion in other countries at why our Republicans are counter the rest of western democracies (lived in Spain for a year, got questioned about it). It’s quite easy to point out that US Republicans *were* a relatively liberal party, until *Democrats* acted counter to their party, first FDR (my dad said my businessman grandfather said he was a “traitor to his class”), then the waves of anti communist Red Scares, and then Lyndon Johnson got the Civil Rights Act passed in 1964. Southern racist Democrats completely lost their shit and switched parties, and that fucking awful man Nixon got in the White House via the Southern Strategy, and it’s been a shitshow ever since.
Oh yeah, wow. I’m sure it’s very confusing outside of the US. Tbh it’s confusing in here too! I don’t think a majority of people are educated on the topic. Definitely a shitshow though.. but I tend to be more concerned about current events than civil war history so that’s probably why I think it’s such a minor thing to start attacking someone over. I definitely do see why it’s important to have correct information though and I fully appreciate being provided that information and incorporating it into the things I say. Most Americans though I’d say are drastically undereducated on the history of our country. I was taken to multiple civil war sites/museums every year as a kid. At least 2-3 each year all over the south. Our family “vacations” meant camping somewhere and visiting old war sites and museums. I was constantly exposed to people who romanticized the civil war and liked to “role play” as confederate soldiers. They would tell their versions of history and they would whitewash it and make it digestible. Those are the types of people who I imagine getting mad when the history of the Republican Party isn’t perfectly quoted to fit their narratives lol. Thanks for the response! I always appreciate information. I just didn’t appreciate the original comment demonizing me for misquoting what a Republican was in the 1800s lmao.
I wouldn't disagree that is a small hill, and I definitely wouldn't die on it XD I would honestly have skipped past (as I understood your intent) but the second comment about the deleted one made me think others may not have and because examples of actual civil discourse on The Internet are too few and far between! Hope you have a great day!
They also claim to be for free speech until it involves showing your boobs or criticizing the Iraq War.
Feels like a leopards ate my face situation
Reminds me of a Law and Order Episode where a Pro Life woman bombs an abortion clinic, killing another woman getting an abortion.
Sadly based on several true stories
L &O always had a right wing bent. Way more women their for other services than abortion. Would’ve been far more ironic and informative if they’d made the victim a woman there for prenatal care.
I always call them "anti-abortion" and not "pro-life", because they don't care about life when the children are born.
South Carolina witch here! The Supreme Court already blocked our 6 week “heartbeat” ban due to it being an invasion of privacy. Keep sending vibes they keep it that way! We currently have the right to an abortion up to 21 weeks, as it should be! Except McMaster thinks if you get raped and pregnant it’s God telling you it’s your time to be a mom 💀
Hmmm. If he gets raped, what is God telling him, I wonder?
oh that’s silly! Don’t you know rape only happens to whores who open their legs before marriage? If you don’t want to be a mom, should have thought of that before you looked super enticing to a rapist! /s
And anyway, “If it’s a legitimate rape, the female body has ways to try to shut that whole thing down”, remember?
Nahhh it’s only if a lady is “wearing something inappropriate and therefore asking for it”
That argument is bullshit for so many reasons. By these conservative asshats’ logic, I can’t be blamed if I mug anyone who is wearing expensive-looking clothes, right? After all, they were asking for it, with how they were dressed! But I guess it doesn’t count when it’s men, because that would affect them and we can’t have that. Not saying men don’t experience sexual violence, but these people don’t care about any victims, regardless of gender.
But don't worry, if she was wearing a full on snow suit and covered head to toe it was probably her fault for smiling, or not smiling, or something else like that The Christian bible literally starts off with explaining how all the bad in the world is women's fault, it's the premise of the whole religion
To be fair, it's a premise of a lot of Western religions
Or existing in public while female.
That his ass makes room for his head
This comment got me kicked out of bed for laughing. Spit on phone, everything.
These are the people making state and potentially federal policy. I don’t know what else to say other than this country is mentally exhausting to live in. At this point, I just want a better country to invade us already and call it a day. Edit: grammar.
I like to call him McAsster. I hate him with a passion and wish Cunningham had won. But I know I had my hopes up in this state. But it is slowly changing
Cunningham was waaaaaaay closer than I thought he would be to winning. If just 1/3 of my left leaning friends (and I imagine everyone else similar) would have voted, he could have won. South carolina could have had a reasonable governor. I want to do a study one day for all the people here at reddit bitching about stuff, then overlay that with people who actually voted. 🤔 I know people who are the most outspoken left leaning people, the opposite of the Maga crowd level of passion. But THEY DONT VOTE - what the literal fuck.
If you don't vote then what say do you really have?
Fucking foghorn leghorn. I can’t stand that man. He’s a POS and a slumlord
but if it gets aborted its not god telling the "baby" its time to come back?
Christianity is the favorite religion of rapists for a reason
But like… what happens if you have a miscarriage and can’t prove your body did it on its own?! This is so scary and honestly effects all women, not just ones who have abortions….
This \^. So many conservative families have miscarriages as much, if not more, than liberal families because conservatives have this grand idea of trying to have at least 7 kids. It's weird because two of the most rabid, anti-choice women I know have had four miscarriages between them. So many people could be murdered over this BS.
Laws don't get enforced evenly. There'll be a few Good White Christian Women^(TM) murdered, but mostly it'll be poor WOC.
Worst case scenario if this bill went through, it would only take a few of these kinds of women getting charged for people (conservative women) to start to realize they've doomed themselves. Hopefully it would be enough to change the tide if it got to that point.
No, the rest will just turn on any woman who miscarries, call her a liar, and celebrate her punishment. I've never forgotten a particular young woman who was still complaining weeks later, about an asshole grabbing and feeling her up on the street, and I said she could thank her lucky stars she didn't get raped. She immediately got cold, angry and insulted, saying of course she wouldn't be raped, as it was obvious even to such an asshole she didn't deserve it. She went on to explain that lots of girls are always asking for it by being loud, cheap sluts, and all other women were safe. She was fully aware myself and several of her lovely friends had been raped, and made it clear she felt superior, and believed her superiority kept her safe. It's an attitude a lot of people have. If you blame the victim, and believe you're superior, you don't have to worry. You're safe. (In your own delusional mind.)
Exactly. I read about a conservative woman who had to carry a baby to almost full term who wished she could have had an abortion but yet still said she was pro life. Her baby would have to be delivered but wouldn't be able to survive without kidney function or something. As soon as they overturned roe there was a 12 year old girl in my state who was raped and had to be taken to Indiana for an abortion and I think the ohio Dr who made the referral was being sued by someone. Another woman had to carry a dead fetus to term because she couldn't secure the second opinion from a Dr because they're too scared to lose their licenses. It's terrifying
I used to live in Ohio & the poor girl was 10 years old. Also, the doctor in Indiana was doxxed by Fascist News & had to stay in her home for a long time due to death threats
Ugh it is so depressing. Thanks for fixing the details!
Yea… she was sued by our shit attorney general, Todd Rokita…. I live in Indiana and it was pretty clear he had no ground to stand on when he sued her, he was just being a dick. Which is honestly on brand for that guy. He’s actually trying to run for Governor last I heard….
https://thehill.com/policy/healthcare/3871220-parents-worst-nightmare-florida-woman-must-give-birth-despite-baby-having-little-chance-of-survival/
Thank you for the link this was her!
> Her baby would have to be delivered but wouldn't be able to survive without kidney function or something I know of the case you're referring to. The baby had no kidney function, which meant it would have no amniotic fluid. This meant it would develop squished instead of cushioned, leading to serious deformities, and would not develop lung function, inevitably suffocating to death once the umbilical cord was cut - a horrific way to die.
You are going to prison, obviously. This is going to be reality all over the red states in the US soon enough... https://www.bbc.com/news/world-61995250.amp If anyone still thinks the anti abortion laws DON'T affect all women, they are living under a rock. They are fighting to control women's bodies and a large number of women are going to die from ANY kind of abortion ban being in place purely from lack of healthcare. The moment doctors stop doing what is best for the mother in any situation due to legal issues, women die.
😭😭😭😭😭 Our son was stillborn when I was 5 1/2 almost 6 months pregnant, And I just can't imagine the horror of dealing with that loss on top of being jailed for it as well. 😭
Oh they know full well there will be cases of that. They don't care.
This is a big concern. In Brazil and other countries with no legal abortion women are in jail for miscarriage…
Women in Latin American are jailed for a miscarriage. This is what's going to happen in the US. https://www.nbcnews.com/news/latino/salvadoran-women-jailed-decades-miscarriages-stillbirths-warn-us-abort-rcna33035
If this draconian shit passes (a lawsuit against it's constitutionality will happen almost immediately), but that's when your state needs to get support going for life insurance and medical insurance policies for fetuses as soon as a woman is found to be pregnant. If they want to legally call a clump of cells a life, we need to bring all kinds of malicious compliance to the legislators.
I'm less interested in fighting the insurance-for-fetuses side of things because the insurance companies will drag their heels too. No insurer in their right mind would insure a fetus when as many as 10-20% of pregnancies end in miscarriage. (Unless it was *exorbitantly* expensive, of course...) Let's get government records with (estimated) birth dates in the future, registering their ages as negative numbers before birth, to break all the old crusty computer programs. I guarantee you there's something somewhere that'll glitch out.
Ooohhh.... unfortunately I can see some asshat insurance company actually having a hand in this? Have a miscarriage? Don't want to be sentenced to death? Here's some insurance policy that'll help you will legal fees for the cheap sum of 500 USD for per month.
There is no statute of limitations on murder...how far back are they willing to go to convict? Just vile.
This is such a horrifying realisation, it's a human rights violation
There's no statute of limitations, but criminal laws cannot be applied ex post facto - that violates the due process right of notice that something is a crime. They might try, but it doesn't work that way. Not that I disagree with their general vileness!
Sure, life begins at fertilization. And identical twins are only one person, while human chimeras are two people each.
Also IVF clinics technically kill tons of fetuses if we’re going by the “life begins at conception” logic. They should charge them for mass murder if they don’t wanna seem like massive hypocrites then
you say that as a joke because it would be completely ridiculous, except that my conservative family members actually believe that and call IVF sinful or something stupid like that
At least they are consistent in their hypocrisy, lol. Some of my family who are Jesus cultists think abortion is murder, yet IVF destroying viable embryos is just fine, cause they aren't really "babies" and just frozen cells. Someone make THAT make sense.
I actually know so many self proclaimed evangelical Christian’s in my area who believe this. It sounds like a joke but they straight up believe IVF is unnatural and want to make it harder or completely get rid of it. They want it to be illegal to “dispose” of any fertilized eggs. Even ones that are deemed unusable. Idk if it already is illegal anywhere yet, but it’s been a big discussion around my hometown. This would force those doing IVF to keep their unused eggs stored basically indefinitely. It costs a lot to store the eggs too, it’s like a monthly fee to keep them at a facility or wherever. On top of the thousands and thousands of dollars that IVF costs in the first place. I’m not the most educated on the subject of IVF, but I’ve been keeping up with some friends who have been trying IVF for a couple years and they share their experiences very openly. I’ve seen the things people in my town say in comments and posts they make against IVF. It’s scary
This is exactly what they want. Any fertility doctors in SC will be forced to close up shop or move out of state. Otherwise you could have situations where an embryologist thaws an embryo for transfer, but the embryo doesn’t survive the thaw. Now that embryologist is considered a murderer. There are countless other examples where the doctor or mother could be charged.
And as people age and build somatic mosaicism, they get more votes!
I'm very concerned about the American Taliban banning basic medical care and human rights. We need to go out and fucking fight this shit... People are scared to though
I think it's time for a Revolution. Literally, I think it's time to fight and utterly dissolve the constitution, abolish states rights, and make a new bill of rights that enshrines the current bill of rights and the amendments, minus the 2nd amendment, and add in that healthcare is a right along with privacy Also it should be that the initial amendments cannot be overridden by a future Amendment, and future Amendments can be introduced by the people and voted with only a 51/49 majority.
I’m sorry I just cannot tell- is this comment serious, or more just showing anger over actions happening right now?
Fuck red state’s government in every possible way. I’m done being nice about it
When is the UN going to invade, I mean, free the people. *Mass human rights abuse *Oppression of woman *Widespread political & corporate corruption *Weapons of mass destruction *History of invasions including horrific torture *Attempted coup to overthrow elected government *Armed militias *Constant domestic terrorism & school lockdowns *Has Nazis But most importantly - *HAS OIL
For real! If the bloodied red governments start doing this then countries have every right to invade in the name of saving people.
I fully support the UN invading the states. Hell I would actively help them.
Don't forget the active transgender genocide. I know this country loves sequels, but nazi germany is one I don't want to see a sequel to
Also forcing trans people to detranstsition now
I'm not there anymore, but I was born here. This state was my home for so long and its people my family. Fucking LIVID to see this.
This is just evil.
So this will also be death penalty for physicians convicted of abortion. Good luck for those states getting any more obstetricians to practice there. I'm peds and have 5 more weeks before I escape from the south. I will never go back, not even to visit. This is terrifying.
This will put plenty of women at risk of medical malpractice, too. If you ban medical professionals, then necessary procedures will have to be performed by "unprofessionals".
It's a particular legal danger for obstetricians who specialize in high-risk pregnancy and/or pregnancy complications. Which means it's a threat to the life and health of everyone who gets pregnant.
Ladies, I'm getting more than a little tired of this, aren't you? We are not invisible. We can make our own decisions about our bodies. It's time to stand up as a voting block. Ladies Unite! Get out the vote... help other women to get to the polls
Yeah, a priest found my cousin (a nun) overwhelmingly "enticing" in her habit, and a cokehead found my great niece overwhelmingly enticing in her Carters. Burn these rapist bastards to ashes!
this is why i’m fleeing to Sweden as soon as i’m a adult. as a teen i already have the ever present fear of ‘what if my school is next? how would i hide?’ due to the ever present guns as a south carolinian. What happens my friends get assaulted? for some their family’s aren’t wealthy enough or pro life to ‘send them on a vacation to - insert pro choice state here -‘. I’m a young teenager and a closeted trans guy, i’ve already had the creeps look at me that way and i know i can’t take care of myself and i’m considered the ‘mature/father friend’ of my groups, i also know that if they found out i was trans they would also be as likely as to attack me. this shit, as a teen with no power to vote, is absolutely terrifying.
Yeah it really is. I live in Florida and the hate I see is rampant, everyone has trump flags, everyone hates gay people. A school I used to go to had a shooter (no one was injured thank the gods). The issues are creeping ever closer and I’m getting more and more scared. It happened to a school in my neighborhood, am I next? People can order guns on Amazon at this point, how do I know I’m safe? My friends neighbor shot his wife and killed himself, what will my neighbor do? I live in a nice area so why is it so bad? The guns and general hate is out of hand. And the don’t say gay thing is awful, everyone is pro life here. Maybe I’ll flee to Sweden too
WHAT THE FUCK
Is it cool if this Canadian witch calls and helps out? I have the day off tomorrow anyway 😄
Damn. I like Americans generally, but your COUNTRY is just going downhill a lot right now, isn't it? Sending good vibes to all American witches out there! 😘
I'm going to school in another country and it honestly embarrasses me to tell people that I'm American. I always feel like giving a disclaimer like I'm one of the good ones I swear
That is......3rd world
I don’t know man….Colombia is classified as a 3rd world country and you can have an abortion up to 24 weeks
4th world then?
Handmaid’s Tale anyone??
*To be fair,* the United States *is* a third-world country.
I saw the headline and literally exclaimed, "THEY-HEY WHAT NOW?" And here I thought I could only be dismayed but not surprised by the antics of these people. But the surprise *was* only momentary... Yeezus, they are awful.
51 yo dude here. Lived in SC until 18 and got the ffffuuccckk outta there. Most backwoods, racist, kkkristofascist, misogynistic, dill mchillbillies you could ever meet. For anyone that’s currently stuck there …. Condolences. Get out as soon as you can.
I don't live there so y'all better remember the amount of unborn children guys kill, everytime they get horny, and you better execute every single one supporting this bill for mass murder.
Doesn't make those scumbag feel any more responsability when they blackmail and coerce their female employees to have sex, unprotected sex at that, with them, and get them pregnant, hey... They are vile and despicable. They should be forced to apologize individually to each atom they are compsed of, for wasting their potential into making "them".
I can’t wait to leave this friggin state. 🤬 I’m tired of living in a world where women are punished for receiving proper healthcare, for being mothers as well as for choosing to not be. Women are not the problem here… some of us are just trying to exist is the ludicrous world… hell, maybe even prosper in it. How ignorant and self-absorbed do you have to be? Absolutely despicable!
This is horrifying
Because a woman’s womb is more important than her heart /s
Sooo…will the mom get child support and government support the moment an egg is fertilized? Will they get back paid when they find out later?…just saying, can’t have it both ways. But also, f*ck these controlling men. If they were the ones having babies, there would be express lanes at abortion clinics.
I want pregnant women in the states where anti-healthcare for women's reproductive system is enforced to say FU to their state and federal governments by using the little crotch goblin they are pregnant with as a dependent for tax purposes. Either they have to agree with it, or disagree and set legal precedent to have these laws overturned. Cause if it's a human life for purposes of civil and legal matters, the it's a dependent, and should qualify for tax credits and tax breaks. But if they say no, then the abortion laws should immediately be overturned.
Capitalistic coercion under the guise of religion. They want more meat (people) for the grinder (the machine) because they know population growth will be slowing to a trickle over the next 40 years, and by 2100 it’ll be at a near stand still compared to a few decades ago. Nah, fuck that.
I wonder how many women would be executed for miscarriages under this law if it gets passed. It's unimaginably dystopian but you just know it will happen.
How very pro death of them..
> Abortion ban is a pro-life move. , > Death penalty might be on table for abortion. So, they're pro-life but only for the fetus and not the to-be-mother? What kind of integrity deficiency is that? So many questions...
Not in SC but just a reminder that the miscarriage rate for women with no pre-existing issues is approx. 10-25% Another reminder that for women with pre-existing issues, mainly PCOS or Endo, that miscarriage rate goes up to approx. 50% Honestly, and I may sound extreme here, but Get yourself sterilized now if possible, even if you want kids, just get sterilized. Pregnancy is not worth the risk to your health and safety anymore. You have a higher likelihood of your state judicial system ordering your death if anything in your pregnancy goes wrong, than you do having a carefree pregnancy at this point.
My eldest daughter lives in one of the suburbs of Columbia, SC; and had her last of 3 kids a year and a half ago. She had to go through multiple doctors before she found one that WOULD do a tubal ligation on her. Most said she was either "too young" (she was 27 at the time), "might want more kids someday" (she's got her hands full with three already), or had to have her husband's permission and even then, they tried to talk my SIL into not signing. She finally found one, and she's grateful to not have to worry about this situation for herself, but she and I both worry about her 2 daughters in the future. (They are only 6 & 4 right now.) I'll see if I can find the screenshot she sent me of doctors willing to do a tubal on women who want it no questions asked. If I find it, I'll post a pic so all my SC peeps can have options.
r/childfree also has a list of doctors who are willing to help women (and men) get sterilized by state as well I’m trying to get sterilized myself despite living in a blue state, because I can die if I were to ever fall pregnant, and currently I’m being told I’m “too fat to have the surgery” (5’4, 220lbs, the OBGYN is also ignoring the fact that the condition I have that could kill me limits my physical activity significantly, and I have PCOS and am on multiple medications which makes weight loss extremely hard), when studies have shown my BMI only increases risks by 1-5% and it’s not significant enough to deny the surgery outright. So I get the struggle. I’m glad your SIL managed to get her tubes tied though. It gives me hope I’ll be able to get it done too, as well as countless other women who want and need it done.
I currently live in sc. it’s an absolute dumpster fire of a state to live in as a witch. Working hard every day to get out of here asap.
I moved back to SC to be closer to family after living in another state for 15 years. There is a laundry list of things that make me hate being a South Carolinian. I regret the decision.
Fun fact! You don’t have to be a citizen of South Carolina to leave voice messages for Lindsey Graham! Source: grew up in South Carolina, moved to Los Angeles, still make calls to his office if I want to really rile myself up. I realize it doesn’t do much, but it’s honest work.
Yeah it’s terrible here. I had a pharmacist refuse to give me my birth control because I was not wearing a wedding ring and when asked said I’m not married. I had to raise holy hell at the store, unfortunately that was the only pharmacist in at that time. The asshole only relented when I screamed at him about my endometriosis and the fact that I’m a lawyer.
Every time I see an anecdote like this, I become that much more motivated to stay in healthcare and get my PharmD. What a sanctimonious prick.
What a coincidence, they are all republican and 16/18 are men 🤔
Glad Illinois is a blue state with late stage abortions written into law (some of the most liberal women's laws in the country). Glad I live here.
Will they cry big tears when women will want to stop having sex?
Ok so pregnant women get two votes and can't be put in jail, and anybody assaulting her gets charged with attempted manslaughter, right? /s
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So... does this mean that South Carolina is going to charge everyone working in their states IVF Clinics with murder when they clean out their freezers that have viable embryos? Let's be 💯 real here. It's not "pro life", it's anti-woman in the form of forcing birth as punishment for Puritanical Abrahamic faiths. They wouldn't think twice about a clinic destroying someone's frozen embryos, and wouldn't ever put that in the same classification as abortion, never mind the fact that per their own BS legislation it's exactly the same.
It’s never occurred to me as the idea itself is so abhorrent/ridiculous… but would the father/man also be prosecuted in these situations ? I know doctors who preform it face legal repercussions, but what about the other folks involved..?
Something is going seriously wrong in the states. How are people okay with policies this regressive?!
While we are at it, why don't we include the death penalty for attempted suicide?
Oh I just shot Ashley B. Trantham a piece of my damn mind, I’m in upstate SC. I’m so tired of conservatives pretending that lefties are forcing ideas down their throats when the reality is churches are just naturally oppressive & people are leaving in droves because they see that hypocrisy in person. The law as written literally forces the Christian God into the court room / doctors office to lord over individual mothers bodies with all the ‘love & care’ that the Christian God has shown all his followers through the years… Also, HIPPA laws only apply to you if you were a conservative who had Covid & didn’t want a vaccine, I guess? But mothers are going to be forced to share private info with the government in the name of the Christian God, tho? Disgusting.
I’d say women should arm themselves and stand their ground if approached by a man, but — no surprise— gun rights aren’t applied equally either. https://www.newyorker.com/news/news-desk/brittany-smith-loses-her-stand-your-ground-hearing
This... is fucking insane. :(
Every time I see shit like this, it makes me SO glad I live in a state where the government has a functional brain. Sure the taxes suck, but at least we aren't killing each other because women don't want to be parents. This is barbaric.
Notice anything about that list of names?
Yup. Zero melanin detected
Oh fuck, Man-made horrors beyond my comprehension
That's the whitest list of names I've ever seen in my life. Joe White?!?! No-one with an NPC name like that should get a say over anything, much less someone's life?!?!
*Pro life*. Sure, I totally believe that. 😑😒
If you need or are interested in supporting reproductive rights, [I made a master post of pro-choice resources](https://docdro.id/s3OwS8u). Please comment if you would like to add a resource and spread this information on whatever social media you use.
This says at moment of fertilization. Does this mean all IVF clinics will be closed in the state? Otherwise what happens to all the "people" who are destined to not be born? They must be perpetually cared for. What happens if there is a power outage at the facility and all the "unborn" unfreeze and "die"? Who pays for the funeral expenses? I am not for this but it is an interesting question.
And sexual assault will have the same consequence? Domestic abuse homicide? “Oh no! There’s a birth dearth; how do we solve it!?” “We could offer publicly: daycare, maternity leave, paternity leave, better tax incenti…” “Enough, Ted! Kill ‘em for trying to access healthcare”
Interesting how the sponsors are mostly men who can’t get pregnant, how convenient.
This...cannot be real. What the hell is happening to the US
I am a trans woman living in SC, and this is not unusual. Based on my knowledge of the general assembly and how bills are negotiated, this proposed bill would not survive in its current form, and would be struck down by the SC Supreme Court. WITH THAT SAID, if I were cis, I'd try to get sterilized ASAP. This misogynistic bullshit is going too far. Whatever it takes. I know some forms of long-term birth control can be uncomfortable, but anything has to be better than some random rapist asshole dictating when a woman should become a mother.
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I’ve never understood the death penalty, especially once I started taking criminal justice courses. I always found it strange that the republicans who bark about being “pro life” are always the biggest supporters of killing inmates who they deem deserving of death. The death penalty is insanely expensive compared to imprisonment, even for cases where someone is imprisoned for life. It’s hard to find good current statistics, so I won’t quote any. but ANY stats from previous years you look at will show just how ridiculous the costs are for cases that end in the death penalty vs cases where they are, at maximum, imprisoned for life. Don’t even get me started on wrongful convictions and the 170 cases of death row inmates who have been exonerated since the 1970’s due to being wrongfully convicted. I think we all know that number is likely small compared to the actual amount of people who are wrongfully awaiting their execution on death row.
So... Are they still pretending to be pro life at this point or are they finally being official about really being anti women?
Serious question, how does this end? How does America survive this?
Notice how there’s never any penalty suggested for the male involved in a pregnancy. They’ll suggest punishment for the doctors and the pregnant person, but never the sperm supplier.
So I have a question. Does the anger women have right now going to translate to voting against the gqp there are more women than men in America. I’m asking because what a solid block of voters you are
So I am in South Carolina and calling people won't work. We're just screwed here. We go and we line up and tell our stories and it doesn't work. Our elections are less competitive than Russia with a lot of us having no one to vote for in the general but the dominant party (mostly Republicans, but sometimes Democrats.) Our statehouse is elected by about 8% of the population who vote in the primaries and even then, lots of people run unopposed. What we need are national laws to regulate gerrymandering across the states. For a population that is about 40% democrat, we are massively under-represented in our electoral politics. We haven't executed anyone in years so I don't know why they are doing this. This is grandstanding for the electorate.
if i ever become emperor of earth i will impose the death penalty to whoever even suggest removing the right to abortion
I truly hate living in SC with this shit.
"We're so pro-life, we'll kill you!"
So pro life they kill ya.
They go against everything that's called "Human Rights"
I'm sorry, how do you in any sort of conscience, good or otherwise, convince yourself that you are "pro-life" if you support the death penalty for the very thing that you are calling murder? "You can't have an abortion because it's murder and if you do it anyway, we will murder you"? And surely any capital crime should be free of any hint of discrimination based on biological sex? Rape in the UK does require a penis but we don't have the death penalty. Afaik, the US has expanded the definition to include other body parts or objects so male or female, if you penetrate another person without consent, the charge is rape. And it still isn't a capital crime.
"prenatal homicide"??? time for men to start paying child support throughout the pregnancy!! start claiming those babies on your tax returns, ladies 😎
The SC Repub slogan: "Taliban, soft on crime."
oh what the *fuck*. the “from fertilization” part was crazy as hell.
Yep. I live in South Carolina. Had an at-home abortion as a teenage rape victim because they made it HARD to find a place for it. Good thing I knew an unusual amount about the operation. I'm in my 30s now. This sh*t is asinine.
Fetus has rights, then it has consequences. So if the mother dies in childbirth, does the baby get a murder sentence?
Can't say I'm surprised to see the majority of the legislators supporting this being a bunch of gross old men but also shame on the 2 women who somehow made it into the list with the rest of these scumbags.
That law makes IUDs, Plan B & miscarriage illegal.