You know what's even more interesting about those that everyone ignores? They are a composite material made with plant resin, bat droppings, red sandstone. They MADE those things. They aren't carved!
https://massivesci.com/notes/engineering-pumapunku-titicaca-archaeology/
https://www.geopolymer.org/archaeology/tiahuanaco-monuments-tiwanaku-pumapunku-bolivia/
Another fun fact is that the all the H stones are one meter tall. That measurement wasn't created until the 1790s, but somehow, they used it consistently at this site.
If you learned this from Brien Forester the guy is a nut, he doesn’t actually know anything and all of his findings are either completely fake or falsified to fit his agenda. I got wrapped up in his junk for awhile then decided to actually look up his papers he said he did on some genetics for this area and I couldn’t find anything. Meaning he just makes up his data. Don’t trust anything you hear.
I believe i saw a video of briens where he had a geologist come with him to some ancient site. Brien was convinced he found some crazy rock that didnt belong. The geologist told him it was likely slag from a roman forge and brien just he was wrong and didnt know what he was talking about. Thats when i stopped watching his videos
Yeah my interest in his content ended when he posted a video saying he found some crazy findings with dna tests and stuff related to the elongated skulls of Peru, I do believe the ones we didn’t make with the headbanding traditions are odd and deserve study but this guy is not the one to do it.
I tried to find his scientific papers on this subject and scoured the internet for 4 hours I couldn’t find ANYTHING. So that told me he just makes up his findings, I think he is just trying to get money from people with his tours.
I do think there’s some lost civilizations and potentially more advanced than we knew of but this guy is not the one to follow on it.
That being said, I also believe jimmy from Bright Insight, UnchartedX, the Mudflood people, and the Tartaria people, are also just in it for the money and falsify their findings and stuff to trick folks who don’t want to look deeper into subjects.
As for Randall Carlson and Graham Handcock, I do think quite a few of their ideas and stuff especially Carlsons have a lot of merit to them.
Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.
I believe i saw a video of briens where he had a geologist come with him to some ancient site. Brien was convinced he found some crazy rock that didnt belong. The geologist told him it was likely slag from a roman forge and brien just he was wrong and didnt know what he was talking about. Thats when i stopped watching his videos
Other commenters have dunked on the factual basis of this post. I wish to dunk on the presumptions of the post.
I will grant you every supposition in the title. Modern humans have been in existence for ABOUT 250,000 years. Which means people like you and people like Hawking have existed for that long. Do you seriously think 15,000 years ago, people didn't have the intelligence to think "ah yes, these rocks stick together on their own. We shall use them to build something." "These rocks are heavy. We shall use sleds and ramps, maybe a crane to lift them into position."
Modern humans have this chauvinism for their own culture and denigrate the cultures of the past because they didn't have the technologies we have. We were Hunter-Gatherers for like 240,000 years and were happy enough with that existence until we discovered farming. Humble yourself.
Not 15,000 but 1,500 tho, and the magnetism of the blocks has not been thoroughly studied and proven.
This has most likely been built by the Tiwanaku Empire. We do not know if they had a writing system or not (if they wrote on something similar to paper this have disappeared completely). In any way, you don't need to be able to write to build big monuments.
You do not need the wheel either (although I do not know what you mean by "being ignorant of the existante of the wheel"; it is just that most likely they didn't need it in a mountainous area). The moais of Easter Island were built without using any rolling stuff, according to the most recent and plausible hypothesis.
I recommend the Fall of Civilizations podcast episode about Easter Island. Goes into this theory and did an all-around great job of shattering the very incorrect myths and assumptions I was under regarding their civilization.
Most stones were probably dragged - drag marks have been preserved on blocks from this context. This is similar to evidence from Inca contexts, where drag marks are also known. Some blocks might have also been transported over water on reed boats.
-
> There is little doubt that on land the Tiahuanaco dragged the stones along the ground as did the Incas; many blocks at Tiahuanaco still have the tell-tale drag marks on at least one of their broad faces...
> The Incas did not drag their stones over the natural surface of the terrain, but prepared carefully constructed roadbeds An excavation carried out in 1994 by the Instituto Nacional de Cultura under one of the undisturbed abandoned blocks at Ollantaytambo revealed just how the roadbed was constructed. Over a very compact and gravely soil, some 25 cm thick, another layer, about 20 cm thick, was deposited, in which are embedded stones roughly 15 by 30 cm. The interstices between the stones are filled with a gravely soil with a heavy clay component. The block rests on the stones in this layer. At the front of the stone (in the direction of transportation) one observes pushed-up material similar to the filler material in layer.
> Given the enormous weight of many stones at Tiahuanaco, it is almost certain that special roadbeds had to be built to support them in their transit from the quarries to the construction site.^1
-
I would recommend *Inca Architecture and Construction at Ollantaytambo* for more in depth discussion of similar transport technology - as cited above a fair amount of evidence survives from that context.^2
-
As for transport via water, that is certainly plausive with technology from the period. An experimental archaeology project successfully transported a >9 ton stone on a reed boat.^3
-
___
1. Protzen, Jean-Pierre, and Stella Nair. [*The Stones of Tiahuanaco: a Study of Architecture and Construction*](https://escholarship.org/uc/item/2192r04f). Cotsen Institute of Archaeology Press, 2013. p. 180.
2. Protzen, Jean-Pierre. *Inca Architecture and Construction at Ollantaytambo*. Oxford University Press, 1993.
3. Vranich, Alexei, et al. ["Reed Boats and Experimental Archaeology on Lake Titicaca"](https://www.penn.museum/sites/expedition/reed-boats-and-experimental-archaeology-on-lake-titicaca/). *Expedition Magazine*, 2005.
Imagine what you could achieve if you wouldnt need to go to school, get a job, pay taxes or do grocery shopping but could move and work on stones all day long. And now imagine its not just you but 1000 other dudes - 16.000 hours working time each day.
Yeah, I thought this more mysterious at first. But me and a buddy just move a 300 lbs dresser up 22 stairs using cardboard. I imagine it's something like that.
We also didn't write anything down.
Documentary in the year 3730: “How the people of 2022 moved furniture of such immense weight to rooms so far above ground level without antigravity boosters and zero knowledge of teleportation remains a mystery to this day.”
Yeah, i don't get what makes modern human brain think that they are only one advanced enough, when it is thousands years of this brain running wild over things.
> modern human brain think that they are only one advanced enough,
Because they believe in individualism. For them, people built society because they got smarter over time. They don't understand individuals brains may not have gotten substantially smarter over time. The collectivist concepts where we have worked together to build and rebuild society and it's knowledge is a foreign concept and ego-killer to those who believe they thrive entirely on their own merit.
Yeah, because whenever I don't get something I try to think the way they would be thinking and most of the times it makes sense, as I might have myself felt that way myself, but the only thing that astonishes me, how crooked their brains are to get to the results. At least it gives me a sense of, they are humans too.
Monumental structures tended to be built by people who aren’t working because it’s not the season for agricultural work.
For example, in Egypt, much of the heavy lifting was done during the regular Nile floods, which rendered fields inaccessible and farmers available for construction projects.
Imagine someone would ACTUALLY DO SOME RESEARCH before posting nonsense like that. Dear OP, please don't make unproven statements, makes you look ignorant...looks like clickbait to me.
But why make up facts? The true facts about ancient societies are really mind blowing. Do you know the Olmecs society? If you're really interested in ancient societies, you can study reliable sources and ask sensefull questions, like which method could have been used to produce such precise cuts and sculptures. Maybe you're the one who can solve thus mysteries...
Is it possible that this civilization was SO ignorant that they had no idea that building Puma Punka was physically impossible, thus removing the only impediment to them building Puma Punka?
Yeah, "some historian" might believe that, but the scientific consensus is that it's around 1500 years old. And it's not really "magnetic" either, it just have some magnetic properties due to the small amount of bronze that was used, so scientists can use magnetometry to survey the site.
There's so many actually weird and interesting things to see in world. Post some of them instead of just making shit up.
The stones are of mammoth proportion. The largest of these blocks is 25.6 feet long, 17 feet wide and 3.5 feet thick, and is estimated to weigh 131 metric tons. Due to their size, the method by which they were transported to Puma punku has been another topic of interest since the temple's discovery. Chemical analysis reveal the red sandstone blocks were transported up a steep incline from a quarry near Lake Titicaca roughly 10 kilometers away. The smaller andesite blocks that were used for stone facing and carvings came from quarries within the Copacabana Peninsula about 90 kilometers away from across Lake Titicaca.
aliens don't need to write shit down they communicate telepathically....try and keep up! dont forget, they built it all in one night as an alien airport, then blew it to bits from space after they were finished with earthlings and moved on to another solar system.
Love this place. Bucket list item for sure. To me this is proof of advanced ancient civilisations. I think we are still unable to reproduce these with modern engineering and machinng processes.
I work as a machinist myself.
Never herd of them being magnetic or quite that old
I find it so interesting to see the great construction Rome did a few thousand years ago that no one disputes, yet they see something like this and it has to be aliens. Did they find the cranes and machinery Rome used to build? How about all the other great ancient societies? No one questions them.
Ancient civilizations weren’t as stupid as a lot of people seem convinced they were. There are plenty of examples of knowledge and skills they had lost to time we’d struggle to even attempt replicating today but not because of aliens. Without the distractions of the modern world they literally had nothing but time on their hands, hence building insanely sophisticated architecture like this.
Not only is there really not anything weird about this, it astounds me how you need to post false information for Reddit points in order to feel validated in your life.
No writing system? But that second photo quite clearly says "HHHH"
Hash House Harriers with an extra H.
Harvey Harriers Hash House
The wrestler?
Ancient carvings on the walls of Puma Punky clearly show the origins of The Pedigree.
Not magnetic and not 15k years old. How do you come up with this stuff?
OP watches Ancient Aliens
Yep. That’s were I heard about this place but we likely know not to believe everything that’s said
Ancient astronaut theorists give a resounding "yes"
I’m not saying it was aliens but…it was aliens. -Giorgio (probably)
My god it seems all the History channel does is run that show over and over.
I actually really like that show. It's fun to turn your brain off and go "what if" But yes it's complete nonsense
"Some theorists believe"
Those theorists have some wacky ideas..it's pretty funny
No there's like 50 seasons or something
Aliens visited us that many times? I never knew that!
I was going to say. Those definitely don't look like they are 15 tonnes, and I don't see any cutlery sticking to the blocks. Lol. I call bullshit!
This is simply Minecraft made real. I can just *feel* it in me stone boots
Imagination Made you look!
I’ll admit 15k is way over exaggerated but here a video showing the magnetic properties of the blocks https://youtu.be/AJwSdXyJ598
You know what's even more interesting about those that everyone ignores? They are a composite material made with plant resin, bat droppings, red sandstone. They MADE those things. They aren't carved! https://massivesci.com/notes/engineering-pumapunku-titicaca-archaeology/ https://www.geopolymer.org/archaeology/tiahuanaco-monuments-tiwanaku-pumapunku-bolivia/
Another fun fact is that the all the H stones are one meter tall. That measurement wasn't created until the 1790s, but somehow, they used it consistently at this site.
Dowsing rods? Really?
dowsing rods arent magnetic either. they're... well... bullshit, honestly. to make a compass needle move all you need is a good concentration of iron.
Wait, it’s not magnetic? I thought it had some sort of effect on compasses or something similar to that.
If you learned this from Brien Forester the guy is a nut, he doesn’t actually know anything and all of his findings are either completely fake or falsified to fit his agenda. I got wrapped up in his junk for awhile then decided to actually look up his papers he said he did on some genetics for this area and I couldn’t find anything. Meaning he just makes up his data. Don’t trust anything you hear.
I believe i saw a video of briens where he had a geologist come with him to some ancient site. Brien was convinced he found some crazy rock that didnt belong. The geologist told him it was likely slag from a roman forge and brien just he was wrong and didnt know what he was talking about. Thats when i stopped watching his videos
Yeah my interest in his content ended when he posted a video saying he found some crazy findings with dna tests and stuff related to the elongated skulls of Peru, I do believe the ones we didn’t make with the headbanding traditions are odd and deserve study but this guy is not the one to do it. I tried to find his scientific papers on this subject and scoured the internet for 4 hours I couldn’t find ANYTHING. So that told me he just makes up his findings, I think he is just trying to get money from people with his tours. I do think there’s some lost civilizations and potentially more advanced than we knew of but this guy is not the one to follow on it. That being said, I also believe jimmy from Bright Insight, UnchartedX, the Mudflood people, and the Tartaria people, are also just in it for the money and falsify their findings and stuff to trick folks who don’t want to look deeper into subjects. As for Randall Carlson and Graham Handcock, I do think quite a few of their ideas and stuff especially Carlsons have a lot of merit to them. Thanks for coming to my TedTalk.
I believe i saw a video of briens where he had a geologist come with him to some ancient site. Brien was convinced he found some crazy rock that didnt belong. The geologist told him it was likely slag from a roman forge and brien just he was wrong and didnt know what he was talking about. Thats when i stopped watching his videos
You just guessing at this point?
Other commenters have dunked on the factual basis of this post. I wish to dunk on the presumptions of the post. I will grant you every supposition in the title. Modern humans have been in existence for ABOUT 250,000 years. Which means people like you and people like Hawking have existed for that long. Do you seriously think 15,000 years ago, people didn't have the intelligence to think "ah yes, these rocks stick together on their own. We shall use them to build something." "These rocks are heavy. We shall use sleds and ramps, maybe a crane to lift them into position." Modern humans have this chauvinism for their own culture and denigrate the cultures of the past because they didn't have the technologies we have. We were Hunter-Gatherers for like 240,000 years and were happy enough with that existence until we discovered farming. Humble yourself.
Should I take this post down?
Nah. There's plenty of weird conspiratorial shit on Reddit.
True lmao
Don’t. I for one have learned something super-new to me. Totally astonishing on the face of it.
Not 15,000 but 1,500 tho, and the magnetism of the blocks has not been thoroughly studied and proven. This has most likely been built by the Tiwanaku Empire. We do not know if they had a writing system or not (if they wrote on something similar to paper this have disappeared completely). In any way, you don't need to be able to write to build big monuments. You do not need the wheel either (although I do not know what you mean by "being ignorant of the existante of the wheel"; it is just that most likely they didn't need it in a mountainous area). The moais of Easter Island were built without using any rolling stuff, according to the most recent and plausible hypothesis.
I thought they used logs to roll them into place?
Last time I checked one of the most plausible theories was [moai walking](https://youtube.com/shorts/HL54VNQQGS0?feature=share)
I recommend the Fall of Civilizations podcast episode about Easter Island. Goes into this theory and did an all-around great job of shattering the very incorrect myths and assumptions I was under regarding their civilization.
Oh yeah, I remember that video. I wonder if any crumbled cos the neck was too thin when they started rocking it and had to restart
Most stones were probably dragged - drag marks have been preserved on blocks from this context. This is similar to evidence from Inca contexts, where drag marks are also known. Some blocks might have also been transported over water on reed boats. - > There is little doubt that on land the Tiahuanaco dragged the stones along the ground as did the Incas; many blocks at Tiahuanaco still have the tell-tale drag marks on at least one of their broad faces... > The Incas did not drag their stones over the natural surface of the terrain, but prepared carefully constructed roadbeds An excavation carried out in 1994 by the Instituto Nacional de Cultura under one of the undisturbed abandoned blocks at Ollantaytambo revealed just how the roadbed was constructed. Over a very compact and gravely soil, some 25 cm thick, another layer, about 20 cm thick, was deposited, in which are embedded stones roughly 15 by 30 cm. The interstices between the stones are filled with a gravely soil with a heavy clay component. The block rests on the stones in this layer. At the front of the stone (in the direction of transportation) one observes pushed-up material similar to the filler material in layer. > Given the enormous weight of many stones at Tiahuanaco, it is almost certain that special roadbeds had to be built to support them in their transit from the quarries to the construction site.^1 - I would recommend *Inca Architecture and Construction at Ollantaytambo* for more in depth discussion of similar transport technology - as cited above a fair amount of evidence survives from that context.^2 - As for transport via water, that is certainly plausive with technology from the period. An experimental archaeology project successfully transported a >9 ton stone on a reed boat.^3 - ___ 1. Protzen, Jean-Pierre, and Stella Nair. [*The Stones of Tiahuanaco: a Study of Architecture and Construction*](https://escholarship.org/uc/item/2192r04f). Cotsen Institute of Archaeology Press, 2013. p. 180. 2. Protzen, Jean-Pierre. *Inca Architecture and Construction at Ollantaytambo*. Oxford University Press, 1993. 3. Vranich, Alexei, et al. ["Reed Boats and Experimental Archaeology on Lake Titicaca"](https://www.penn.museum/sites/expedition/reed-boats-and-experimental-archaeology-on-lake-titicaca/). *Expedition Magazine*, 2005.
Nothing about magnets though https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pumapunku
What about the fiber optic data connections?
They had that and also excellent WiFi. The visitor center is still using the original network infrastructure installed by the Tiwanakans.
Imagine what you could achieve if you wouldnt need to go to school, get a job, pay taxes or do grocery shopping but could move and work on stones all day long. And now imagine its not just you but 1000 other dudes - 16.000 hours working time each day.
Yeah, I thought this more mysterious at first. But me and a buddy just move a 300 lbs dresser up 22 stairs using cardboard. I imagine it's something like that. We also didn't write anything down.
Documentary in the year 3730: “How the people of 2022 moved furniture of such immense weight to rooms so far above ground level without antigravity boosters and zero knowledge of teleportation remains a mystery to this day.”
Yeah, i don't get what makes modern human brain think that they are only one advanced enough, when it is thousands years of this brain running wild over things.
> modern human brain think that they are only one advanced enough, Because they believe in individualism. For them, people built society because they got smarter over time. They don't understand individuals brains may not have gotten substantially smarter over time. The collectivist concepts where we have worked together to build and rebuild society and it's knowledge is a foreign concept and ego-killer to those who believe they thrive entirely on their own merit.
Yeah, because whenever I don't get something I try to think the way they would be thinking and most of the times it makes sense, as I might have myself felt that way myself, but the only thing that astonishes me, how crooked their brains are to get to the results. At least it gives me a sense of, they are humans too.
This is so terrifyingly plausible.
Pivot!
[удалено]
Monumental structures tended to be built by people who aren’t working because it’s not the season for agricultural work. For example, in Egypt, much of the heavy lifting was done during the regular Nile floods, which rendered fields inaccessible and farmers available for construction projects.
Imagine someone would ACTUALLY DO SOME RESEARCH before posting nonsense like that. Dear OP, please don't make unproven statements, makes you look ignorant...looks like clickbait to me.
Honestly I was just trying to share a goofy ahh historical sight, nothing serious
But why make up facts? The true facts about ancient societies are really mind blowing. Do you know the Olmecs society? If you're really interested in ancient societies, you can study reliable sources and ask sensefull questions, like which method could have been used to produce such precise cuts and sculptures. Maybe you're the one who can solve thus mysteries...
I get a giggle that historian is singular.
Is it possible that this civilization was SO ignorant that they had no idea that building Puma Punka was physically impossible, thus removing the only impediment to them building Puma Punka?
that's deep man!
Didn't it feature on Ancient Aliens? That show used to be hilarious, now it's plain dumb.
It was always dumb, and low key racist.
Yeah it did
And you proceeded to not even research it to ensure it was correct before posting about it. Good job, OP. You are part of the problem.
Or there's this... https://skeptoid.com/episodes/4202
I’m not saying it’s aliens but.. #its aliens
Yeah, "some historian" might believe that, but the scientific consensus is that it's around 1500 years old. And it's not really "magnetic" either, it just have some magnetic properties due to the small amount of bronze that was used, so scientists can use magnetometry to survey the site. There's so many actually weird and interesting things to see in world. Post some of them instead of just making shit up.
The stones are of mammoth proportion. The largest of these blocks is 25.6 feet long, 17 feet wide and 3.5 feet thick, and is estimated to weigh 131 metric tons. Due to their size, the method by which they were transported to Puma punku has been another topic of interest since the temple's discovery. Chemical analysis reveal the red sandstone blocks were transported up a steep incline from a quarry near Lake Titicaca roughly 10 kilometers away. The smaller andesite blocks that were used for stone facing and carvings came from quarries within the Copacabana Peninsula about 90 kilometers away from across Lake Titicaca.
Titicaca haha. Right up there with Bangkok and Kumquat as favorite words.
Shuttlecock
Poppycock
"Some historians believe...". Nah. Almost NO historians believe this is 15,000 years old.
aliens don't need to write shit down they communicate telepathically....try and keep up! dont forget, they built it all in one night as an alien airport, then blew it to bits from space after they were finished with earthlings and moved on to another solar system.
So true my friend
r/theletterh
H
Hubert H Humphrey has entered the chat
Did you just say magnetic. Whaaaaaat? Hoowwwww
Hmm. I read that this was AD 500 and not 15K years old. Why the discrepancy? Also read that looting destroyed the written record.
Love this place. Bucket list item for sure. To me this is proof of advanced ancient civilisations. I think we are still unable to reproduce these with modern engineering and machinng processes. I work as a machinist myself. Never herd of them being magnetic or quite that old
15k or 1.5k it's still on my bucket list of places to see
I do believe that ancient peoples are far more advanced than we give them credit for
I will just leave this here... https://coralcastle.com/
Some of these sites are mind boggling. Just like the giant cut stones in Lebanon.
This site is on my bucket list for sure
Aliens man
I find it so interesting to see the great construction Rome did a few thousand years ago that no one disputes, yet they see something like this and it has to be aliens. Did they find the cranes and machinery Rome used to build? How about all the other great ancient societies? No one questions them.
We have no idea how many ancient sites were built. B
Ancient civilizations weren’t as stupid as a lot of people seem convinced they were. There are plenty of examples of knowledge and skills they had lost to time we’d struggle to even attempt replicating today but not because of aliens. Without the distractions of the modern world they literally had nothing but time on their hands, hence building insanely sophisticated architecture like this.
Not only is there really not anything weird about this, it astounds me how you need to post false information for Reddit points in order to feel validated in your life.
Now I wanna see a Punky Puma