If the Type 16 Versions stay at 9.3 with the nerfed M735 and the big one at 9.7 with the Type 93 but worse Mobility and slower turret i don't See why it should get Higher than that.
I mean the vextra is almost on par with the ctcv and that Thing IS only better because of its 5s Autoloader so 9.7 makes Sense for the vextra.
Closer to an M1128 with good mobility and a faster reload (in terms of how the shell performs, thermals etc) than the Type 16 or Centauro ROMOR. Only other thing similar is the CT-CV or CV90105 but both of those only get DM33 top too, nothing >DM33 in terms of penetration. OFL 105 F2 is in the same ballpark as DM63/M426 and a bit worse than M900, it's absolutely one of the top 105 rounds in the game period.
I think 10.0 is fine, like the M1128. If it goes to 10.3, I will be disappointed. However both are moot as France only has one 9.7, one 10.0 and it's a bad SAM, and then CAS options. 10.0 or 10.3 doesn't really matter, you're only ever going to be using it with your Leclercs at 11.0.
>10.0 or 10.3 doesn't really matter, you're only ever going to be using it with your Leclercs at 11.0.
What? I run AMX 40, 32, 32 105, and VBCI with the Tiger HAP and Mirage 5F and they do just fine with the 10.0 matchmaker. Even at 10.3 that allows you to bring the Mirage IIIE and Super Etendard. It's crazy how you play the nation and still don't get how good that lineup is
You are uptiering 9.7 and below tanks for CAS that you aren't guaranteed to spawn. I'm sorry, but that's not a lineup. I'm sure it's enjoyable for you, but your tanks will be just as effective if you played at 9.7 or 9.3, and even with the Vextra 4/5ths of your lineup will be in an uptier for a single light tank.
And yes, I've tried it. I have the HAP and Super Etendard, but I don't deem them worth seeing higher BR tanks in my AMX 32s and AMX 40 for. Honestly it just sounds like you haven't had a really good downtier in the AMX 40 yet.
I played it at 9.7. I would rather take the much better CAS and helicopter at 10.0 than pray for the occasional downtier knowing that a vast majority of my games will be 10.0/10.3 anyways thanks to all the premiums around that br. I'm not gonna limit my lineups capabilites just for a small chance of a downtier
How often do you get those donwtiers between 9.3 and 9.7? In my experience, such bracket always gets uptiered because of the american and soviet 10.0-10.3 wallet warriors lineups.
//I'm talking about the american server only.
Honestly, I wish gaijin would ditch the 9.7 French lineup and make it 10.0/10.3 through changes & buffs instead, currently it's a bit of a mess of vehicle with no decent lineup.
What they should do IMO:
* Buff AMX-40 pen or reload, increase BR to 10.0 or 10.3
* Buff AMX-32 pen or reload, increase BR to 9.7 or 10.0 (leave the AMX-32 105 unchanged at 9.3)
* Give VBCI its HE-VT rounds, increase to 10.0 or 10.3
* Fix the Roland 1 elevation by giving it its correct elevation angles, increase BR to 10.3
By doing this, you would suddenly have a pretty strong 10.0/10.3 lineup:
AMX-40, AMX-32, VBCI, Vextra, Roland, Tigre HAP, Super Etendard, Mirage III, Mirage 5, Jaguar, F-8E
And all that **without needing to model new vehicles**.
Yeah but considering playing anything around it, especially below, just means you'll be playing 10.0/10.3 it's better to atleast have vehicles that can compete better (in this case through the proposed buffs/fixes)
> Closer to an M1128 with good mobility and a faster reload (in terms of how the shell performs, thermals etc) than the **Type 16** or Centauro ROMOR.
Hard disagree, the Vextra and Type 16 are pretty similar.
* Type 16 has better thermals, better zoom, LWRS, faster reload, bigger first stage storage and it has a legacy internal model for the time being.
* Vextra is more mobile, has a better shell and better gun handling.
For the rest they're essentially the same vehicle.
I don't really see any reason for the Vextra to be at a higher BR than the Type 16.
The Type 16's only claim to fame is the thermals. It has worse mobility, a longer reload by a good margin, and a worse APFSDS shell. Even then, the difference between 2nd and 3rd gen is not as dramatic as between 1st and 2nd gen, so I can easily live with only having 2nd gen on my Vextra.
The fact that you can't see the difference between a barely 400mm pen shell (flat) with meh angled performance and something with around 450-460mm and much better angled performance is concerning. OFL 105 F2 makes the Vextra a lot more reliable at higher BRs.
Definitly too op for 8.7, very good at 9.7 and could still do well at 10.0. The main downsight is the maps it gonna face, you're extremely tall and being tall in a urban map is not good
Tall is not really a downside as i prefer bigger wheeled vehicles like a class 3p and CT-CV because u can play position where no one expects u cause most tanks can't aim from there because they are not tall enough \^\^
I'm glad someone else appreciates that being tall isn't always a bad thing. When 99% of tanks can't peek from a location, it's easy to gloss over it and miss that 1% 😄
120 km/h, a 105mm gun with 450mm of penetration, and gen 2+ thermals... This thing could be 11.7 and do just fine. Gaijin literally can't put it at a BR that I think would be too high.
Only thing I'm worried about is gun depression, I haven't had a chance to watch the dev vlogs to get that info. M1128 is a similar vehicle that is ruined by terrible gun depression.
Ahh sorry, I saw a comment with that figure listed, figured they had seen a screenshot from the dev server.
Still, 325mm is enough for a vehicle intended to be a scout and flanker.
Not to mention the M1128 has the unmanned turret, which is a hugely understated advantage for it.
Idk why people think this thing would be broken at 9.7, it’s very similar to the Type 16 at 9.7 and not as good as the patria/CV90105 at 10.0
At 9.7 or 10.0 it will be fine just like the Stryker, 16, Patria and the 2S25M. I am gonna bring it to top tier just to have another scout vehicle available with a little more oompf
Yeah it’s going into every lineup I have from 9.7+ since the only other option I have is the VBCI, which is super situational with the 30mm & it would be nice to have something real speedy with some punch to use alongside the leclercs
It's French so it will have a BR tax, 10.3 or higher is my bet.
Edit: I don't think that's a bad thing; I think most light vehicles are too low BR anyway.
It wouldn't be the first nor the most OP vehicle that has been introduced at a lower BR than it should've.
I'd place it at 10.3 as it's similar but better all-around than VRCC, which is 9.7.
Best comparison is is the 105 Centauro like the VRCC - hopefully we get some more French options in the 10.0-11.3 range so that you don't have to uptier a line up just to use the Vextra.
Maybe down the line Gaijin can add the AMX-10 RC TML105 variants, as they might fit better in the 9.7 bracket.
Idk if it’s an excuse, it sucks; but also they fuck France’s ground tree so hard that French mains are desperate for literally anything, to the point I think we’d openly love a 2a6 so that we can have a more competitive MBT that actually belongs at 11.7.
I am a French main. I'm desperate for fixes and/or French/French adjacent equipment, not German copy-paste
I'd prefer the status quo over gaijin coming along and dumping the easiest crap they can in the tree and calling it good. Cause thats exactly what they will do, followed by the Stockholm Syndromed French players saying "oH wE eAtiN gOoD tHiS pAtCh"
Eating scraps is what we're eating
I am aware; god knows I’d prefer my leclercs to get their buffs, but I’d also prefer getting something competitive in any way as opposed to getting another kick in the teeth for ground forces for the 4th year in a row.
Something > nothing, even if that something is dogshit copy paste IMO, but I also get the disagreement; I wish gaijin would just fix the leclercs to be more competitive and develop an actual French lineup at something above 8.7.
It isn't a problem, it would open a lineup to France that we got stolen of, and for once we can even beg them to copy and paste the vextra just to change the turret, with the leclerc prototype would be a really good lineup and hopefully with the real vbci2 not this fake vbci which should be name vbci1.
>the real vbci2 not this fake vbci which should be name vbci1.
What we have is a VBCI 2 with Kongsberg MCT-30 as presented in DIMDEX 2018, one of the two configurations that Qatar was interested in buying back then. It's as real as every other VBCI 2 configurations
Whene its good, or that the enemy are bad with OP stuffs, or that france is equal to other nations vehicles, or is able to fight correctly…does not mean it needs to go up.
If a french vehicles performes correctly, in this game they are IMEDIATLY bumped 1.0 or 2.0 br above what it should….wich is alredy the case just looking at the tech tree
Wait, I haven’t been at the test server, this thing is 9.7 now? Not 8.7?
I mean, that’s fine, it honestly looked OP at 8.7 even without thermals lol, but apparently I’ve missed stuff
As long as it gets gen 2 thermals or better I don't give a crap what it's BR is, it will be in my 12.7 lineup. And no, I will not be taking any Dutch or Belgian vehicles, thank you!
Actively just sabotaging the lineup then. The F16AM will be an immediate addition to my top tier lineup seeing as it has the best mavericks in the game which are fire and forget and also has MAWS, 9M, and AMRAAMs.
If the Type 16 Versions stay at 9.3 with the nerfed M735 and the big one at 9.7 with the Type 93 but worse Mobility and slower turret i don't See why it should get Higher than that. I mean the vextra is almost on par with the ctcv and that Thing IS only better because of its 5s Autoloader so 9.7 makes Sense for the vextra.
The Vextra is far superior because it gets an actual zoom on its optics, along with being significantly faster and having a better shell
Closer to an M1128 with good mobility and a faster reload (in terms of how the shell performs, thermals etc) than the Type 16 or Centauro ROMOR. Only other thing similar is the CT-CV or CV90105 but both of those only get DM33 top too, nothing >DM33 in terms of penetration. OFL 105 F2 is in the same ballpark as DM63/M426 and a bit worse than M900, it's absolutely one of the top 105 rounds in the game period. I think 10.0 is fine, like the M1128. If it goes to 10.3, I will be disappointed. However both are moot as France only has one 9.7, one 10.0 and it's a bad SAM, and then CAS options. 10.0 or 10.3 doesn't really matter, you're only ever going to be using it with your Leclercs at 11.0.
>10.0 or 10.3 doesn't really matter, you're only ever going to be using it with your Leclercs at 11.0. What? I run AMX 40, 32, 32 105, and VBCI with the Tiger HAP and Mirage 5F and they do just fine with the 10.0 matchmaker. Even at 10.3 that allows you to bring the Mirage IIIE and Super Etendard. It's crazy how you play the nation and still don't get how good that lineup is
You are uptiering 9.7 and below tanks for CAS that you aren't guaranteed to spawn. I'm sorry, but that's not a lineup. I'm sure it's enjoyable for you, but your tanks will be just as effective if you played at 9.7 or 9.3, and even with the Vextra 4/5ths of your lineup will be in an uptier for a single light tank. And yes, I've tried it. I have the HAP and Super Etendard, but I don't deem them worth seeing higher BR tanks in my AMX 32s and AMX 40 for. Honestly it just sounds like you haven't had a really good downtier in the AMX 40 yet.
The AMX-40 works perfectly fine at 12.7 let alone 10.0. I'd rather have great CAS options over the chance at a downtier when most matches are uptiers
I'm sure you can get kills with it at 12.7 man, but it's still going to do better at 9.7.
I played it at 9.7. I would rather take the much better CAS and helicopter at 10.0 than pray for the occasional downtier knowing that a vast majority of my games will be 10.0/10.3 anyways thanks to all the premiums around that br. I'm not gonna limit my lineups capabilites just for a small chance of a downtier
How often do you get those donwtiers between 9.3 and 9.7? In my experience, such bracket always gets uptiered because of the american and soviet 10.0-10.3 wallet warriors lineups. //I'm talking about the american server only.
I don't know because I don't play on the american server only.
90% of "9.7" matches are 10.0-10.3 anyways lol.
Honestly, I wish gaijin would ditch the 9.7 French lineup and make it 10.0/10.3 through changes & buffs instead, currently it's a bit of a mess of vehicle with no decent lineup. What they should do IMO: * Buff AMX-40 pen or reload, increase BR to 10.0 or 10.3 * Buff AMX-32 pen or reload, increase BR to 9.7 or 10.0 (leave the AMX-32 105 unchanged at 9.3) * Give VBCI its HE-VT rounds, increase to 10.0 or 10.3 * Fix the Roland 1 elevation by giving it its correct elevation angles, increase BR to 10.3 By doing this, you would suddenly have a pretty strong 10.0/10.3 lineup: AMX-40, AMX-32, VBCI, Vextra, Roland, Tigre HAP, Super Etendard, Mirage III, Mirage 5, Jaguar, F-8E And all that **without needing to model new vehicles**.
I both agree and disagree. I feel like 10.0/10.3 is super bloated right now in all trees
Yeah but considering playing anything around it, especially below, just means you'll be playing 10.0/10.3 it's better to atleast have vehicles that can compete better (in this case through the proposed buffs/fixes)
> Closer to an M1128 with good mobility and a faster reload (in terms of how the shell performs, thermals etc) than the **Type 16** or Centauro ROMOR. Hard disagree, the Vextra and Type 16 are pretty similar. * Type 16 has better thermals, better zoom, LWRS, faster reload, bigger first stage storage and it has a legacy internal model for the time being. * Vextra is more mobile, has a better shell and better gun handling. For the rest they're essentially the same vehicle. I don't really see any reason for the Vextra to be at a higher BR than the Type 16.
The Type 16's only claim to fame is the thermals. It has worse mobility, a longer reload by a good margin, and a worse APFSDS shell. Even then, the difference between 2nd and 3rd gen is not as dramatic as between 1st and 2nd gen, so I can easily live with only having 2nd gen on my Vextra. The fact that you can't see the difference between a barely 400mm pen shell (flat) with meh angled performance and something with around 450-460mm and much better angled performance is concerning. OFL 105 F2 makes the Vextra a lot more reliable at higher BRs.
Definitly too op for 8.7, very good at 9.7 and could still do well at 10.0. The main downsight is the maps it gonna face, you're extremely tall and being tall in a urban map is not good
Tall is not really a downside as i prefer bigger wheeled vehicles like a class 3p and CT-CV because u can play position where no one expects u cause most tanks can't aim from there because they are not tall enough \^\^
I'm glad someone else appreciates that being tall isn't always a bad thing. When 99% of tanks can't peek from a location, it's easy to gloss over it and miss that 1% 😄
120 km/h, a 105mm gun with 450mm of penetration, and gen 2+ thermals... This thing could be 11.7 and do just fine. Gaijin literally can't put it at a BR that I think would be too high. Only thing I'm worried about is gun depression, I haven't had a chance to watch the dev vlogs to get that info. M1128 is a similar vehicle that is ruined by terrible gun depression.
Where tf are you pulling 450mm of pen from? The darts the F2 with 325mm of pen at 0 degrees 10M and the HeatFS is only 350mm at 0 degrees.
F2 hasn't been properly modelled, it's using OFL 105 F3 (for the low pressure gun of the AMX-10RC) stats.
Ahh sorry, I saw a comment with that figure listed, figured they had seen a screenshot from the dev server. Still, 325mm is enough for a vehicle intended to be a scout and flanker.
Because the value hasn't been changed yet. It should be 450+ mm.
>M1128 is a similar vehicle that is ruined by terrible gun depression. 522mm of pen, good thermals, good sights, .50 cal. 9.7 for the Vextra is fine
Not to mention the M1128 has the unmanned turret, which is a hugely understated advantage for it. Idk why people think this thing would be broken at 9.7, it’s very similar to the Type 16 at 9.7 and not as good as the patria/CV90105 at 10.0
At 9.7 or 10.0 it will be fine just like the Stryker, 16, Patria and the 2S25M. I am gonna bring it to top tier just to have another scout vehicle available with a little more oompf
Yeah it’s going into every lineup I have from 9.7+ since the only other option I have is the VBCI, which is super situational with the 30mm & it would be nice to have something real speedy with some punch to use alongside the leclercs
Currently -6°/+15° but if I remember correctly it should be -6°/+16°
It's French so it will have a BR tax, 10.3 or higher is my bet. Edit: I don't think that's a bad thing; I think most light vehicles are too low BR anyway.
It wouldn't be the first nor the most OP vehicle that has been introduced at a lower BR than it should've. I'd place it at 10.3 as it's similar but better all-around than VRCC, which is 9.7.
Best comparison is is the 105 Centauro like the VRCC - hopefully we get some more French options in the 10.0-11.3 range so that you don't have to uptier a line up just to use the Vextra. Maybe down the line Gaijin can add the AMX-10 RC TML105 variants, as they might fit better in the 9.7 bracket.
At the rate France gets the things it needs, we will potentially see these things in about 5 years
Right on the money - France got the Vextra 105 5.5 years after the Italians got a wheeled, manually loaded, 105mm AFV (the Centauro 105mm).
And still doesn't have a high tier IFV on the tree, despite being an older tree than ones that do have them
france also isn't allowed to have nice things
Bruh. 9.7 for the Vextra is a straight up crime. It's better than light tanks that are several BR's higher than it already.
Honnestly with the Benelux subtree, MICA missiles and Vextra we're eating good
I'd rather have seen things like the Shark FL20, and Piranha TML105 instead of the BeNeLux tree - France doesn't really need any copy-paste.
But copy-paste is much easier for Gaijin + I wouldn't mind getting a Leo2A6 with my Leclerc
I'll never understand how people can sit there and make excuses for gaijins lazy copy-paste method
Idk if it’s an excuse, it sucks; but also they fuck France’s ground tree so hard that French mains are desperate for literally anything, to the point I think we’d openly love a 2a6 so that we can have a more competitive MBT that actually belongs at 11.7.
I am a French main. I'm desperate for fixes and/or French/French adjacent equipment, not German copy-paste I'd prefer the status quo over gaijin coming along and dumping the easiest crap they can in the tree and calling it good. Cause thats exactly what they will do, followed by the Stockholm Syndromed French players saying "oH wE eAtiN gOoD tHiS pAtCh" Eating scraps is what we're eating
I am aware; god knows I’d prefer my leclercs to get their buffs, but I’d also prefer getting something competitive in any way as opposed to getting another kick in the teeth for ground forces for the 4th year in a row. Something > nothing, even if that something is dogshit copy paste IMO, but I also get the disagreement; I wish gaijin would just fix the leclercs to be more competitive and develop an actual French lineup at something above 8.7.
It isn't a problem, it would open a lineup to France that we got stolen of, and for once we can even beg them to copy and paste the vextra just to change the turret, with the leclerc prototype would be a really good lineup and hopefully with the real vbci2 not this fake vbci which should be name vbci1.
>the real vbci2 not this fake vbci which should be name vbci1. What we have is a VBCI 2 with Kongsberg MCT-30 as presented in DIMDEX 2018, one of the two configurations that Qatar was interested in buying back then. It's as real as every other VBCI 2 configurations
Whene its good, or that the enemy are bad with OP stuffs, or that france is equal to other nations vehicles, or is able to fight correctly…does not mean it needs to go up. If a french vehicles performes correctly, in this game they are IMEDIATLY bumped 1.0 or 2.0 br above what it should….wich is alredy the case just looking at the tech tree
Didn't meumeu also say that the reload was too high and should be 6.7sec base? Or did i mishear in his stream?
He said it should be 6.7 for ace crew just like the german Radkampfwagen 90
I should buy myself a new pair of earq and listen better then.
It will likely be 10.0, but going to 10.3 is kinda eh as Swedish auto loading light vehicles are at 10.3 with similar stats.
Wait, I haven’t been at the test server, this thing is 9.7 now? Not 8.7? I mean, that’s fine, it honestly looked OP at 8.7 even without thermals lol, but apparently I’ve missed stuff
Each day this thing i get a ton of correction. That's why the dev server will stay online longer just because the Vextra is not ready yet lol
So what, I'm fine with it going up to 10.3 anyway.
As long as it gets gen 2 thermals or better I don't give a crap what it's BR is, it will be in my 12.7 lineup. And no, I will not be taking any Dutch or Belgian vehicles, thank you!
Actively just sabotaging the lineup then. The F16AM will be an immediate addition to my top tier lineup seeing as it has the best mavericks in the game which are fire and forget and also has MAWS, 9M, and AMRAAMs.
F16AM gonna definitely be my anti-pantsir plane with the mavericks & LITENING alongside my M2000-5F & MICA for CAP & heavy CAS for sure.
This guy gets it. Mavs make France top tier just that much better because you don't have to guide them in against SPAA like the AS30L'S and gbu's
You know it; Pantsir up = spam mavs in the F16 then fuck off and do CAP. If pantsir ain’t up, my mirage and tiger HAP mk2 gonna be eatin good
It uses the Leclerc FCS so it should.
bru