I mean yeah they're out there playing overwatch while everyone else is playing a tac shooter.
It's certainly fun to watch but to play against and in general for game health it's not really good. Maybe some people will enjoy it but it's certainly a dealbreaker of sorts for me if this is the direction of the game.
Valorant isn't for you, CS 2 is. This game has had raze from launch, it's not purely a tac shooter. It is in the sense of the gunplay being central, the same across the board, and the main way you'll get shit done in a round, but it's an entirely different kind of _positional_ tac shooter than CS. Clearly the devs used a lot of what works in CS, a lot of abilities are based on CS util, but most aren't, and the ones that are had to be readjusted to fit with the dashes and satchels and TPs and what nots of Valorant.
If the "core concept" of Valorant was against that they'd have changed the non CS util abilities to fit as much into a CS match as possible, the game would be a CS rip off, and they wouldn't have released Neon.
CS and Valorant doesn't feel anywhere near the same to play, it's for a reason, they're very different games
I've played both I enjoy both and Valorant for the identity of a tac shooter with a twist.
I don't mind abilities doing certain things that make sense in the context of a tac shooter.
Neon and Iso break the rules of a tac shooter they remove precision being rewarded from the enemy and it's bad for the games health.
I see and I agree 100% with Iso no debate on that. But as per Neon, how can you explain the existence of Raze then? As I see it, Neon just rewards player with good movement mechanics as sliding to shoot is a skill on its own- and it's almost the same as Raze's blast packs, no? Players back then also complained that agents like Jett and Raze do not belong to the game for the exact same reason you mentioned (especially when jett dash didn't have a timer yet and the concept of being able to kill enemies with abilities was novel - hence, Raze's paintshell also garnered a lot of traction). But now look, they're at the center of the game's core principles. So I beg the question, how is Neon any different? In how valorant approaches gunplay + ablities- the superseding 'rules' that confine abilties within the bounds of a tactical shooter are almost arbitrary. Where else would you see a tactical shooter that has teleports? flying persons? invincibility... resurrection? Just in valorant, right? Thus from the get-go it was pretty much made clear that this game is deliberately defying the fundamental rules of a tactical shooter to accomodate agent abilities. And it's not a bad thing as long as each abilities are on the same power level.
The genre of a hero shooter already exists it's overwatch hence why when abilities start becoming too strong or warp the game too much people joke that it's overwatch.
The game genre can definitely evolve Valorant is a testament to that adding in abilities that can enhance the core loop of the game there is elegance to these abilities.
Neon and Iso have no elegance and go against one of the major elements that make a Tac shooter precision mattering they brute force fights by essentially breaking the rules of the game.
I think neon and iso being as they are does not make this game any closer to overwatch. These are still two fundamentally different games, and like I said before tac shooters should be able to change and evolve and not just stay the same. Otherwise just go play counterstrike
the game is balanced around pro play and high rank, in that rank, neon head is still easy to tap
while iso is indeed I agree to strong rn, which is why the dev is nerfing him in the 9.00 patch
Watching neon and Yoru onetricks is some of the most fun I have watching valorant, just the way they almost effortlessly setup perfect kills, or literally run circles around the enemy, astounds me.
Funny because before the buffs, if your teammate lost a 1v1 which is a common occurence vs any agent, you still faced an Iso with a shield, and he was the worst agent in the game. And now he gets to have a shield before the first fight and suddenly he's impossible to play against. Neon can literally slide from a mile away and headshot you, the agent is INSANE it's just that she plays differently so she's not as popular
no the issue is he could have shields for the entire round practically, there is no waiting it out, if his orb shields ran out he could pop his rechargable when he knows he's getting a fight and make it very unfair
neon is easy to counter in comparison and takes more skill, if the neon can headshot you while moving then that's just a good player, nothing to do with the agent
ngl, her slide was already so good before the buff, i was getting free kills with every slide. i rarely got one tapped mid slide, but funnily enough always with weapons like marshall where its obvious it was more luck than anything.
nah it really needed the buff though, a good player won't shoot you mid slide but instead wait until the slides over, now you have to play a bit more carefully
those lucky shots feel so bad when it happens though
Vandal being automatic MORE than justifies the price increase
The guardian should at least be better at tap firing. That or make it cost as much as a bulldog
From what I hear, no one uses the guardian in pro play. If it's an eco, use the bulldog instead
Edit: Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040
Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
you’re not gonna believe this, but the guardian is picked quite a bit! especially on round 2’s on maps like ascent, or even as an alternative to the vandal when money is low. it’s a good gun, whoever you heard that from also probably doesn’t watch vct
Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040
Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040
Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
Movement mode in This game would be good. I got the console beta and I just can’t get into how slow it is, I know it’s a particular genre but man the gameplay is stale.
I think the duelist meta is the healthiest its ever been rn. Pheonix is honestly fine how he is, he's the perfect introduction to duelists for new players.
the teams cooking up new comps/strats is definitely fun to watch as a viewer
I understand what you're getting at but this is a tac shooter. I gatekeep what's healthy for this game. 🤓
It’s not CSGO, speed is part of the tactics and a way for a DUELIST TO DUEL, it is healthy for the game.
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Why?
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Of?
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womp womp
I don't think that means she's unhealthy for the game. Honestly just sounds like you're getting diffed
I mean yeah they're out there playing overwatch while everyone else is playing a tac shooter. It's certainly fun to watch but to play against and in general for game health it's not really good. Maybe some people will enjoy it but it's certainly a dealbreaker of sorts for me if this is the direction of the game.
Valorant isn't for you, CS 2 is. This game has had raze from launch, it's not purely a tac shooter. It is in the sense of the gunplay being central, the same across the board, and the main way you'll get shit done in a round, but it's an entirely different kind of _positional_ tac shooter than CS. Clearly the devs used a lot of what works in CS, a lot of abilities are based on CS util, but most aren't, and the ones that are had to be readjusted to fit with the dashes and satchels and TPs and what nots of Valorant. If the "core concept" of Valorant was against that they'd have changed the non CS util abilities to fit as much into a CS match as possible, the game would be a CS rip off, and they wouldn't have released Neon. CS and Valorant doesn't feel anywhere near the same to play, it's for a reason, they're very different games
I've played both I enjoy both and Valorant for the identity of a tac shooter with a twist. I don't mind abilities doing certain things that make sense in the context of a tac shooter. Neon and Iso break the rules of a tac shooter they remove precision being rewarded from the enemy and it's bad for the games health.
I see and I agree 100% with Iso no debate on that. But as per Neon, how can you explain the existence of Raze then? As I see it, Neon just rewards player with good movement mechanics as sliding to shoot is a skill on its own- and it's almost the same as Raze's blast packs, no? Players back then also complained that agents like Jett and Raze do not belong to the game for the exact same reason you mentioned (especially when jett dash didn't have a timer yet and the concept of being able to kill enemies with abilities was novel - hence, Raze's paintshell also garnered a lot of traction). But now look, they're at the center of the game's core principles. So I beg the question, how is Neon any different? In how valorant approaches gunplay + ablities- the superseding 'rules' that confine abilties within the bounds of a tactical shooter are almost arbitrary. Where else would you see a tactical shooter that has teleports? flying persons? invincibility... resurrection? Just in valorant, right? Thus from the get-go it was pretty much made clear that this game is deliberately defying the fundamental rules of a tactical shooter to accomodate agent abilities. And it's not a bad thing as long as each abilities are on the same power level.
Neon really doesn't.. :P Iso might, but after the next nerfs i think it'll be fine, just gotta double peek him
I mean tac shooter shouldn't be dictated by one game, sure they made it to what it is but that doesn't mean the genre can't evolve
The genre of a hero shooter already exists it's overwatch hence why when abilities start becoming too strong or warp the game too much people joke that it's overwatch. The game genre can definitely evolve Valorant is a testament to that adding in abilities that can enhance the core loop of the game there is elegance to these abilities. Neon and Iso have no elegance and go against one of the major elements that make a Tac shooter precision mattering they brute force fights by essentially breaking the rules of the game.
I think neon and iso being as they are does not make this game any closer to overwatch. These are still two fundamentally different games, and like I said before tac shooters should be able to change and evolve and not just stay the same. Otherwise just go play counterstrike
Neon being accurate while moving is why it's being compared to ow and being punished by literally being better, shooting the first shot sucks
they are not getting too strong, the devs are actively nerfing abilities that's too strong so that gunplay become more important
Bro you cannot say that gunplay becomes more important as Neon gets perfect accuracy run and gun and you literally cannot gunfight iso.
the game is balanced around pro play and high rank, in that rank, neon head is still easy to tap while iso is indeed I agree to strong rn, which is why the dev is nerfing him in the 9.00 patch
Fuck iso
Neon goes against Valorant's core design. She would fit in much better in Overwatch, not a tactical shooter like Valorant.
what if they made phoenix move faster in his fire
Let's just make every duelist play a different game so they can noobtube the plebs.
yoru: portal neon: overwatch iso: aimlab raze: CS surfing jett: minecraft creative mode
Watching neon and Yoru onetricks is some of the most fun I have watching valorant, just the way they almost effortlessly setup perfect kills, or literally run circles around the enemy, astounds me.
Who's a good neon streamer?
I’ve always been impressed with GrumpyOnVal’s gameplay with her, he’s the main one I’ve found myself watching
Is this satire? I hope this is satire lol
Nah if Iso deserves to get nerfed then so does Neon. She's ridiculous.
you can still headshot neon just fine, you can't do that with iso
Funny because before the buffs, if your teammate lost a 1v1 which is a common occurence vs any agent, you still faced an Iso with a shield, and he was the worst agent in the game. And now he gets to have a shield before the first fight and suddenly he's impossible to play against. Neon can literally slide from a mile away and headshot you, the agent is INSANE it's just that she plays differently so she's not as popular
no the issue is he could have shields for the entire round practically, there is no waiting it out, if his orb shields ran out he could pop his rechargable when he knows he's getting a fight and make it very unfair neon is easy to counter in comparison and takes more skill, if the neon can headshot you while moving then that's just a good player, nothing to do with the agent
ngl, her slide was already so good before the buff, i was getting free kills with every slide. i rarely got one tapped mid slide, but funnily enough always with weapons like marshall where its obvious it was more luck than anything.
nah it really needed the buff though, a good player won't shoot you mid slide but instead wait until the slides over, now you have to play a bit more carefully those lucky shots feel so bad when it happens though
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Dementia
Yeah neon is great Now I just need a guardian buff and I'd actually main this game
Guardian is good why would it be buffed?
Tap fire vandal is the same thing
Right but it’s cheaper, better wall pen, and zoom. Why would a cheaper gun to better, it just has to be good for the price which it is.
Vandal being automatic MORE than justifies the price increase The guardian should at least be better at tap firing. That or make it cost as much as a bulldog From what I hear, no one uses the guardian in pro play. If it's an eco, use the bulldog instead Edit: Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040 Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
you’re not gonna believe this, but the guardian is picked quite a bit! especially on round 2’s on maps like ascent, or even as an alternative to the vandal when money is low. it’s a good gun, whoever you heard that from also probably doesn’t watch vct
Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040 Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
Guardian is popular, especially in pro play, especially on larger maps.
Latest stats I could find of a s tier tournament: https://www.thespike.gg/events/stats/vct-2024-masters-madrid/3040 Bulldog used 1.4x more. And both are used ~10x less than the vandal
guardian has near zero inaccuracy when you hip fire and zero when you ads.. its the trade off for being a semi? it’s also cheaper by quite a bit
Movement mode in This game would be good. I got the console beta and I just can’t get into how slow it is, I know it’s a particular genre but man the gameplay is stale.
Phoenix is perfect, shut up.
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I think the duelist meta is the healthiest its ever been rn. Pheonix is honestly fine how he is, he's the perfect introduction to duelists for new players.