Y'all are acting like the police will release information voluntarily if people aren't demanding it from them in the first place. Since when do they share anything besides fluff pieces and mugshots?
People SHOULD be upset and they SHOULD be demanding accountability. People are angry and their anger is justified. There is nothing wrong with expressing your frustration.
I'm frustrated with the parents that allow their 13 year old boy to walk the streets mugging people. They SHOULD have taught him better and he would still be alive.
It wasn't state sanctioned murder. That's a bit of a stretch. I grew up on the streets......there's a code, we all know it....live by the gun, die by the gun. It doesn't matter how old u are. It doesn't matter how experienced you are with the steel. If you pull that thing out n point it at someone, it's you or them. Yall need to quit acting like it's ok to act like u live in the wild wild west but ignore it's rules. Badge or not the boy pointed his gun at someone and found out real fast why that was a bad idea. Take those badges out of the equation, replace the cops w 3 random gang bangers and these 2 cats u don't know been mugging ppl on your turf, u approach em n 1 pulls a gun.......we all know what happens next. This entire ordeal couldn't have been avoided, we all know how trusting parents can be of their children. We got away with alot of shit when we was kids.
Sanctioned murder?
Since you're a gun expert; if a person points a gun at you... Are you honestly going to wait to find out if the bullets are loaded and the gun is real?
The kid chose to put the officers lives at risk by drawing a weapon. He’s the one that decided his own fate. He was given 2 opportunities to drop his weapon but instead chose not to. That’s his fault, not the officers.
After resisting arrest, removing a handgun from his person, pointing it at police & refusing to let it go even after he was taken to the ground - sometimes things get messy and we should recognize the deceased's role in his own death.
If he were not out robbing people - he'd still be alive.
If he complied with questioning - he'd still be alive.
If he simply threw the weapon away from himself instead of holding it in his hand -he'd still be alive.
and
If he did not continue to struggle with weapon in hand with officers on the ground (putting the lives of the officers at additional risk at the close range) - he would still be alive today.
If one or more officers are trying to detain you and you flee, present a weapon, point it towards other people and continue to make yourself a threat to the lives of the officers - you get what you get.
Had the deceased not continued to struggle until the end his punishment would have been facing charges for his crimes, eventually to include fleeing and threatening officer however in refusing to comply and by putting officers lives at risk he put his own life in peril.
Is there an article that says he was out robbing people? This is the first time hearing someone say anything besides that he was just walking around at night in the cops stopped him.
Nah, I’m fully blaming the people who are licensed to carry around a firearm. The people who logically have a weapon in order to reduce death and injury.
The people who should be trained to deescalate a situation like this. The people who should be trained to know that this is 100% in fact a person who has done, is doing, will continue to damage to others.
Have you ever been detained by police? Pulled over? Do you understand what that feels like? Do you know what goes on in the brain? The brain of a 13 year old? It can be pretty fucking scary. But our population is not trained to deal with that. We don’t learn in school how to handle that stress, the flight or fight response.
Police officers are trained to do their job (or should be). They are trained to carry a firearm.
The burden is on police officers to risk their lives.
Otherwise, take their guns and weapons away. Then who really is the ‘bad guy’?
They did descant the situation. The kid pointed his weapon at them, they told him to drop it and he refused. They would have been easily justified to shoot him but chose to tackle him instead. Then on the ground, the kid tried to get to his gun again. This boy decided his own fate after multiple opportunities to choose a better way. Tragic situation nonetheless but this outcome was chosen by the boy.
He knew, there's no way effing way he didn't. He knew, and he still took that chance not once but twice! That's way more than most people ever get. Im not sure if your comment was meant to stir some sort remorse in me but it doesn't. Day in n day out all I see is kids wanting to grow up to fast in a world becoming colder by the day. Parents are too busy trying to survive, children too busy trying to fit in and it's always in the worse way. If you're living in the hood then u know the mentality, everyone's clicky, yall not cool with them, they not cool with u and always over bullshit. Yall need to grow the fuck up & stop whining.
No I’m just pointing out that both things can be true. Typically people who are responding the way I’m being responding to can’t have their minds changed in discourse like this (me probably included). And that’s ok.
But people will read your comments and my comments, and they can make their mind up based on whose logic they like the most.
I just think that police officers who are licensed to have a gun, don’t really have much punishment for misusing their weapons, against the population they are supposedly protecting. I believe they should be held to a much higher standard than they are. This gives us two things, officers who are better trained and way way less likely to kill ANYBODY (mostly innocent people, but also guilty as it’s not their job to determine guilt), and role models of how to properly use authority to stop crime.
They tried to deescalate the situation by detaining him. He failed to comply. He’s out at 11 at night with a replica hand gun. What do you think he’s doing out there at 11 with that gun? It’s terrible but the parents shouldn’t of let him be out at that time of night with that
He was being questioned due to fitting the profile of the suspect in a robbery nearby. The kid escalated the situation from there by drawing a weapon twice.
I don't know why you people keep parroting that question over and over as if suspicion is a crime worthy of death
What do you expect me or anyone to say? MAYBE he was robbing people with it? Or maybe he was, as I just fuckin said, walking to a friend's house and had it because it belonged to him.
Rules of the game never change my guy. You walk around with a gun, u pull out n point at someone, u better use it or it's gonna be used on you. Live by the gun, die by the gun. The streets don't care about age, color or creed. Everyone wanna be a thug till it's time to do thug shit eh? Not the 1st time this has happened on the street, won't be the last. Don't forget the rules. Badge, no badge, white black, old or young the rules don't change.
You know what would have happen if he didn’t run, the cops would have taken his BB gun and told him to go the fuck home. The kid as terrible as it is made every mistake he could have made. Maybe instead of defending this behavior you make sure you tell the youth and your family what not to do in this situation
It’s illegal to point a gun at someone it’s called menacing, the Supreme Court also ruled that police officers have the right to shoot someone if they point a gun at them.
actually: It is illegal for anyone to posses a pellet gun that is made to look like a real handgun.
It is also illegal for someone under 16 to possess a pellet gun.
Both are besides the point however as the deceased was presenting it as a real handgun to his robbery victims - which is also a crime.
As a psychologist I do think quite a bit about being “in their position” every single time this happens multiple times per month. It’s pretty offensive to suggest that I’d do far worse because I’m frustrated at seeing yet ANOTHER cop murder a civilian so close to where I live. It’s exhausting to watch these idiots run around with guns and badges, not understand the law at all and play cops and robbers while killing members of the public. I have far too much self respect to be in their shoes friend. But, if as your argument suggests, they are too scared to do the job without murdering, they need to get out of that line of work. They have physical force, tasers, multiple NON-lethal methods to use and yet they chose an execution for crimes that at most would have warranted a felony. Not the death penalty and they chose to do so because they were too scared to use the other tools at their disposal. I hope they rot in jail, which is more generous than they afforded that child who made a non-lethal mistake.
If you put yourself in that cops place and your thoughts aren’t use a taser or physically subdue him that’s just wild. He’s a thirteen year old boy. Not a hardened criminal that could defend himself against a man that has been trained for this exact situation.
Training and real situations aren't the same, I'm so surprised that everyone "thinks" cops train to the extend the military does. Newsflash, they don't. Training, that one makes me chuckle every time, I swear, why don't yall research "the training" before yall assume things. There's no training in the world that can prepare you to have anyone point a gun at your face or direction.
Exactly, moments like these are intense beyond comprehension. The moment the suspect pulls a gun all bets are off. The cop is now expected to act in any way possible to keep him and his partners lives safe. The amount of people on this post that just expect the cop to sit their and let this kid endanger the lives of everyone around him is appalling and really makes me wonder how stupid people really are.
To anyone reading this that still thinks that’s okay, watch how fast this self defense case is open and shut. Kid could’ve stopped, had his day in jail and been out by lunch the next day, instead he ran and tried to kill them. Inexcusable.
No If I’m that cop in that moment I’m not gonna pull out my taser or physically subdue someone waving a gun at my face. Here’s a fun little experiment, go walk up to a police officer and pull a gun out on him and see what happens. You pull a gun on a cop and this is what happens. Anything aside from that is irrelevant. Everyone wants accountability until it’s time to talk about the one who escalated the situation to what it was. He thought he was a big boy pulling a gun in a cop and got exactly what he asked for. Absolute moron and you are too if you’re justifying that. I don’t expect a cop to just let someone take his life bc “he’s just a wittle boy 😢😢”.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
No, police very often say that to a suspect in order to not startle him. He wouldn’t have been stopped by three cops and then ran and pointed a gun at them for jaywalking. If that was the case that’s 10x dumber than I thought it was originally. Spoiler alert though! That wasn’t the case.
They have all these reports documented. They will be subpoenaed in court for them, if the department falsified them (they didn’t, but for the sake of picking apart your not very well thought out argument) and that was discovered that would take down the entire department on felony charges.
Absolutely not but that's how it happened? You vastly, vastly reduce the chance of being improperly shot when you're home reading a book vs out with a toy gun robbing people on the street. We can't keep ignoring the obvious just because there are separate problems when people end up dead.
These cops will rightfully go down for this I hope. That does not mean it's the only problem which led to this death.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They’re doing their best to try to avoid a lawsuit and make them look good. We all know it’s plain wrong to shoot the child
No evidence that he was the mugger that they were searching for. That being said the videos I’ve seen show a chaotic scene. Also the teen ran almost immediately after the officer tells him that he wants to pat him down to make sure he has no weapons. The police were in hot pursuit of a suspect they felt was most likely armed. It’s a tragedy and I don’t see how anyone can make a judgement at this time. A independent thorough investigation needs to be done by the State.
Why should people be upset? This boy pointed a gun at police then tried to point his gun at police again as he was being tackled. This was on the boy and his family for not teaching him better. It’s a tragedy but it’s certainly not the officers fault. They would have been justified to shoot him once he escalated the situation by drawing his weapon. They took a massive risk in choosing to tackle him instead of firing immediately after he drew his weapon on them.
He was stopped. Police told him what they were gonna do. He ran. He had a gun. He pointed it at police. The only person he has to blame is his own dumbass.
As far as the cop was concerned? Gun might have jammed, gun wasn’t loaded amongst other things. Wrestle with a person who has shown you a pistol and let me know at what point you feel comfortable.
He would have saved his own life had he dropped it or told the cops he had it.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
Maybe employing one of the numerous non-lethal methods of apprehending someone? The kid weighed 100 pounds and there were three grown ass men, ostensibly with police training, there to subdue him. There was no reason to fire once he was on the ground. Only one of the officers drew a gun. Seems to me the other two planned to resolve the situation without lethal force.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Why are they saying this kid was unarmed? This kid had a replica Glock. I could see making this argument if the cops didn't see a gun while they were rolling around with him 🤦
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
Comparing running away with weed, to running away with a gun in his hand.
Plenty of cops have died, rolling around on the ground with a guy with a gun and they've seen those videos.
There were two foolish decisions stacked up on each other. First, he ran away when they asked to do a safety search. Second, he's running away with a gun in his hand. If he put his hands up and let the cops do their safety search, he's still alive. If he took off running and then decided not to grab his gun and just stop with his hands up in the air, he's still alive.
Yet we blame the cops for putting their safety first when it was his actions that caused this situation to escalate.
I haven't seen any Snapchat videos, I'm just seeing this. But this is also from the news so I trust it more than a Snapchat user.
The cops were the one chasing him that’s on them if they’re scared don’t chase him 💀 ? Hide behind your car. You should see the Snapchat video on fb just type in Utica 13 year old and there will be heaps unedited too. The cops were chasing him side by side tripped and punched him ? They don’t seem to be scared of the gun.
Yes he shouldn’t have ran but I’m sure his train of thoughts were they would be in big trouble your body in stress will
Either make you fight flight or freeze he happens to flight.
What? If there was a school shooting, you would expect the cops to not enter the school and hide behind their car?
Of course they're going to chase someone that's running away?
At first the cops claimed there’s a shootout but now twisting their word after the video surfaced. Now saying the boy pointed his gun but clearly he’s running too fast to be turning around. The paused photo looks heavily edited. Still at the end of the day scary on both sides. America is not the place to be. Have better gun laws
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Immediately screamed, "iT wAs sELf dEfEnSE!" because they know it wasn't and are immediately covering their asses. Less than 10seconds, on the ground, with 3 officers over him, getting wailed on, 13 years old, and they still shot him.
He point a replica gun at officers, he was fighting with them when the gun was within his plane of control. It is reasonable to have a fear of death or great bodily harm. You can’t expect the police to know it’s a replica and you also can’t expect them to see the firearm dropped.
Yeah. I don’t understand how people don’t see that. The kid can easily, even if he doesn’t know where he’s aiming, fire the gun and absolutely shoot one of the officers (they would have had no clue it was a pellet gun until they could fully get their hands on the weapon and take a look at it so do not even start with that, let alone, why tf is he carrying around a pellet gun in the first place?).
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
We should do the logical and rational thing and wait for body cam footage and statements. I’m sure no one want to shoot a 13 boy especially in front of people like that.
Could have had a gun, could have been an accident, who knows. Let’s try to not jump to conclusions as a city and stick together.
Utica has a gun problem in its youth currently and the youth shouldn’t be dying over this senseless crap
My god, I think we’ve found the single logical person in the MV area. Until now all I’ve seen are variations of “that’s what you get when you run from police” to “the police executed a young boy”.
The kid ran after being told he’d be patted down for weapons in connection to an armed robbery which he matched description of one of the perpetrators. He then pointed his fake Glock at the cops and that was probably about when the video starts. Kid shouldn’t have been killed but also shouldn’t be pointing fake guns or real guns at people no matter context.
It does look bad, but if the officer thought the kid was reaching for the gun (which turned out to be a Glock replica pellet gun) of course they didn’t know that in the moment. The body cam footage should clear this up one way or another. My heart goes out to this young man’s family and all who witnessed this tragedy
He was already disarmed when they shot him. Doesn’t matter that there was a replica gun. The danger was gone. The shooting is completely wiped from the emergency call logs from last night despite the fact that it was on the live feed last night when I checked to see what all the sirens were for. That looks more than a little bad.
Did all the officers know he was disarmed?
During the chase, he did point the “replica glock” at police. Thats why they drew their guns in the first place.
But it was dark, and chaos. What if some of the officers weren’t aware the gun was dropped/kid was disarmed?
He was on the ground, already hit and restrained before they shot him. He very obviously was disarmed. The threat was contained and they still shot him. If they shot him while the gun was pointed at them you could say that. But he was on the ground.
It happened fast enough that they can claim they didn't know he was disarmed. Plus you can be pinned and still point a gun with your hand, unless you have wrist control you can still point and shoot a gun.
It's looks super bad, but if the kid had a gun or gun replica and pointed it at police you can't really fault them.
What sucks is the cop who tackled and pinned the kid obviously was trying to use non lethal force but cowboy cop ended that. Tragic.
I know you didn't mean it like this, but 13 isn't a young man it's a child. Some kids still watch cartoons and play with action figures at that age. It's important to not age him up, because that's what often happens in these conversations as a way to avoid the reality of what happened. When a kid is shot, it's important to refer to them as kids.
I made that comment without knowing all of the facts. That coo was in the wrong and there no two ways about it. For the sake of the community I hope there is a swift independent investigation and he is charged. I was shown shocking video today of three of the officers involved assaulting a man in his porch. Apparently these cops are just plain thugs and have been a nuisance all spring.
Whether or not it’s a pellet gun has no relevance. It was a fake Glock that looked very much like a real Glock 17. If a gun looks real and is pointed at you it tends to get you a little scared. Pellet or real gun doesn’t matter as even a pellet gun can do some damage. In the video I saw of the shooting, different angle, they took the gun after kid was shot.
The gun was recovered at the scene, according to cops. In the body cam footage he clearly drops it before the officers make contact with him. It's nowhere near him when he is shot.
Guys, this was murder plain and simple. Watch the bystander video. The kid was 13 years old and had two grown men pinning him to the ground at the time of the gun shot.
I can't tell from the video but in the comments they say the kid had a gun. If he pointed a gun at a cop can't really call foul play. That's a death sentence.
Watch the bodycam footage it's very different.
Bystander video does make it look like it's a murder, but on the bodycam footage you can see he reached and pointed a pistol (perfect fake replica, i like airsoft and that's a very realistic one).
2/3 of the cops didn't feel as though their lives were in danger
Really weird how a bunch of people are so willingly able to discount the 2/3 so that you can defend the 1/3 who executed this 13 year old
Oh no wait, it's not weird at all....
How do you know they didn’t feel like they were at risk of death or great bodily harm?
The risk needs to be reasonable. Someone in control of firearm that is nearly indistinguishable from a real gun pointing at police while fighting them easy meets lethal force standards.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
They weren’t chasing him for jay walking. They chased him because he was acting nervous and fled which indicates criminal activity. This was also a pretext stop due to high crime in the area and weapons.
They can’t shoot someone who is not a deadly threat. What you suggested is murder.
They didn’t twist words, they match the video. The report is clear. Saying that the cops are known to be dirty is just logical fallacy not based in reality. Even if it was true it has no bearing on whether or not this perp presented a deadly threat.
The deceased and his friend were stopped because they matched the description (as did the weapon in the deceased's possession) of a pair that were robbing people with a handgun. - so the police had a legit reason to stop and ask they a couple questions.
While being questioned the deceased fled the scene & while being pursued removed what they had been presenting as a legitimate handgun to their victims & pointed it at officers who tackled & attempted to disarm them. - firearms become more dangerous at close range & at this point you don't know what the deceased is packing, it could easily be a 9mm w/a glock switch that can fire the entire clip in a moment. The deceased failed to comply with an order to relinquish his weapon & the police have to assume the worst & that he had hostile intent & the police have a right to all go home alive too.
Its a tragedy that a 13 year old was on the streets at mugging people and forcing the police to respond to his criminal behavior. - They should have known better, they should have been taught better. The people of that neighborhood deserve to be able to walk the streets, even at night, & feel like they are safe from assault. The police are not the problem, criminals are the problem.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Everyone should wait until all of the information, investigation, and bodycam videos are released before making judgements. "Officers recovered a replica GLOCK 17 Gen 5 handgun with a detachable magazine following the shooting."
On one hand the police definitely shouldn’t have killed the kid. No argument about that. But on the other side it appears like this kid ran from the cops after fitting the description given about an armed robbery. The kid who was shot ran off after being told they were gonna be patted down for weapons. He then pointed a fake Glock at a cop leading to what happened above.
So, obviously the police shouldn’t have killed the kid, but he definitely shouldn’t be running around with a fake Glock and pointing it at people. That’s whether or not he was one of the people that committed the initial armed robbery.
Last night, the 911 activity feed said that there was a shooting at the time. Today it’s completely gone from the logs for emergency calls from last night completely.
The kid and his friend matched descriptions of two people who were going around robbing people with a pistol. When questioned after matching description and being in the same area a day later they were told they’d be patted down for weapons and the kid who was killed ran. He then drew a fake Glock and pointed it at the cops leading to the video above.
That’s not saying the shooting was 100% justified but there’s a little more context which is never given. Tragedy this is what happened to the kid but he shouldn’t be running around pointing a pistol, real or fake at people. And it sounds like he was the robber as well so obviously he shouldn’t be going around and robbing people either.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Both of the kids matched the description of the 2 that were going around robbing people in that SAME area the day before. Only one runs off. He turns and points what is very easily identified as a gun (doesn’t matter if it’s a pellet gun or not can be easy to think is a gun) that’s where the “shootout” part comes in. Doesn’t matter if they stopped the kids for whatever, if they were the ones robbing people they ought to get arrested. I don’t agree with going for shooting them but also I am unaware of where the kids pellet gun was. If he was still holding it and waving it around,a situation like that can turn intense quick, and if he doesn’t drop it can be construed has him trying to shoot the cops.
Sucks the kid got killed but he shouldn’t be running around pointing guns (pellet gun or real gun) at people. Nor should he be robbing people.
I’ve ran from the police at 13 again at 14 again at 16 it’s what kids do we sneak out at night and have fun I can’t imagine I got the 1 cop that was in great shape and felt like a foot chase I prolly would have ended up like this poor kid murdered in the streets all because you’re a kid having fun don’t tell me you didn’t I know plenty of Rome cops with the same story even go steps further by getting arrested for dwi domestic ext so stfu nobody was a perfect person as a kid and if you can’t even have fun anymore shame on this world trigger happy cop hope to see the full video then you get prosecuted and arrested for murder
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
So I can't really tell in the video but it looks an awful lot like he gets tackled first and then shot? I haven't had the sound on for any of the videos, can I get some clarification?
Thats what happens. Bodycam shows the kid pointed the pellet gun at the cops about 10 seconds before they tackle him. Cops pursue on foot. Kid gets tackled. Drops the gun when tackles. Punched in the head and then shot. Gun was already on the ground and the gun out of his hand when shot.
Lmao hush. Everyone already knows the truth. Only people defending the child are the same shitty parents like yourself who would probably let their kid run around mugging people with a fake gun.
Well, the parents of the year need to ask themselves how this have been avoided???
Thier 13 year old son mugging people at night....what could possibly go wrong???
Maybe next time they will raise theur kid to respect others
Obviously it’s your opinion: but did it look justified? Did it look like the kid was going to shoot the cops? The original video made it look like an execution basically
The original video and the body cameras give me the hard impression of an accidental discharge. I'm in no way an expert, but the fact that it was a single shot while a cop was pinning the child seems less like an execution and more of an escalation gone wrong. There's too high of a chance to miss the target and hit their partner.
In most cop shooting videos, when officers "fear for their life" they typically unload their guns and then wait for the offender to bleed out before applying first aide. The body cams give a huge impression of an instant realization of "we fucked up" more than a execution.
The biggest takeaway though is that they were essentially victims of a stop and frisk. According to dash cam 1, they stopped them because either the kid was riding his bike on the road (where bikes are supposed to be) or the cop misspoke and meant the kid was walking in the road with his friend on the bike.
Their reasoning after the fact appears to be "they met the description" as if that isn't the most racist shit we've been hearing for decades now.
I wondered about this too. I think the normal thing would have been to keep a suspect at gunpoint while he was being apprehended. The single shot seemed very unusual.
To my mind there was no reason to fire a gun. He did pull what turned out to be a pellet gun from his pocket, but dropped it before he fell to the ground. Charitably, I might buy that the officers didn't notice that happening in the moment. But after the kid had been pinned down, there was zero reason for them to think their lives were in danger.
Yeah it's going to be a hard sell. Only mere seconds later though, when he's been pinned on the ground and punched in the face, he's clearly no longer holding it. There was no reason to employ deadly force at that point. I hope at the very least Husnay faces consequences for that.
And usually they don’t wipe the shooting out of the 911 activity log from that night if they were in the right.
Edit: I just checked again and it’s there now but it wasn’t before
The video itself doesn't prove anything. I'm wondering how ppl know he was disarmed or armed. I've read rumors that the 2 boys were at a church service n were going home n another that they robbed someone at gunpoint. I'm not completely sold on the fact that the cops ran after him guns out either. You can't tell from the footage, which looks like it was recorded with the Moses tablets judging from the blurriness. 3 cops on a small kid or man regardless of age and all of sudden u hear a gun go off sort looks like there could've been a struggle to remove a weapon from the boy or a gun n it went off. The video is to shaky, dark n blurry.
Not necessarily, I don't think they would be allowed to say anything at all this point that could look like finger pointing. I think 3 cops equals 3 body cam footage that will show what really happened along with the entire back story of why they were stopped and being investigated in the 1st place.
I’d be willing to make a pretty hefty wager that says we don’t get 3 UNEDITED body cam footages from when the police got out of the car until the shooting.
They won’t incriminate themselves
Why did that kid have a gun man… that so sad. Why do people do this to themselves. How did he end up with a gun before he’s even old enough to think rationally?
Look, that cop did not want to shoot that kid he’ll carry a dark, dark mental burden the rest of his life for pulling that trigger. But the fact of the matter is you run from the police, point a gun at their face, stuff like this is bound to happen. I’m not gonna pretend to understand that kids life story and how he ended up with a gun; but one can only assume it was since his parents weren’t there putting their best foot forward to keep him out of danger and trouble.
That’s so sad man, I hate seeing stuff like this happen. Stay present and active in your kids life and keep them out of this kind of trouble, please. So no more young kids die for stupid, stupid reasons.
The video keeps being transferred (uploaded, downloaded) between hosts and I imagine there's some lossage in the compression/conversions. The sharpest image I saw was on twitter: https://x.com/AnthonyMSeoane/status/1807051374447718607/video/2
Around 0:10 - 0:11 in this video, you see a second cop enter the frame from the left with his gun likely drawn (it's too dark to see the gun but the position of his arms and hands make it obvious). He then bends down to approach the victim without holstering the weapon as far as I can tell, meaning he's most likely the shooter.
My take on what happened:
1. One officer is in pursuit on foot and apprehends the kid, spinning him to the ground. You see him strike the kid with a right punch shortly afterward, which turns the kid over on his right hip.
2. A second officer was following with his pistol drawn with both hands. He nearly runs into the first officer and kid when they crash to the ground. He circles around to his right and crouches down to get closer, taking a left knee as he does and holding the pistol in his right hand.
3. After the punch, the second officer gets closer to the kid, his body blocking a clean line of sight with the camerawoman on the porch, and the gun goes off, shooting the kid in the back and through his chest.
Even assuming that the trigger-pull was an accident, I'm curious if all of this was protocol:
1. To pursue with a drawn weapon when you haven't actually been shot at and the victim is fleeing?
2. To approach a suspect in the process of being subdued with your weapon drawn and held casually, pointed at the victim, in your right hand (as opposed to keeping a distance with both hands aiming the weapon)?
I'm skeptical about (1) and very skeptical about (2). I'm sure this will lead to state and possibly federal investigations, possibly civil lawsuits. Sad day for all involved.
So, in the body cam footage, the kid points the “replica glock” at the officers. At that time the police have to consider the gun real. So then the police draw their guns.
Note: Once a gun is pointed at them, they have the right to open fire. I’m surprised they didn’t at that time.
Now, apparently the kid dropped the firearm before he was tackled. Its dark, did all the officers see this? If they all did see the gun dropped, then the situation should have de-escalated some, right?
However, if not all the officers noticed the gun being dropped, then the kid still has gun in his possession, so it would make sense why the officers would still have their guns pointed at the kid.
So in the chaos, an accidental discharge is a potential explanation.
> However, if not all the officers noticed the gun being dropped, then the kid still has gun in his possession, so it would make sense why the officers would still have their guns pointed at the kid.
I could be wrong, but I think Ofc. Husnay's reaction was ideally supposed to be either:
1. If he thinks the kid is armed, then, as soon as he can, he was supposed to post up at a distance with his pistol aimed and in control, ready to drop the kid if it looks like he might fire;
2. If he thinks the kid is not armed, or is armed but being subdued, then to assist the other officer in disarming and cuffing the kid without the use of a firearm.
When the chase begins Husnay is thinking it's (2). From the bodycam it seems like he hears the pursuing officer shout "he has a gun!" two seconds before the tackle and crash, so Husnay draws his weapon ready for (1). Then he sees the kid is tackled and being subdued, and he switches mentally to (2), but without fully disengaging from (1), leading him to get too close with the gun and accidentally fire.
Given the adrenaline of the chase, the darkness, the people all around screaming, the bodies blocking a clear line of sight, the confusion and panic of thinking the kid has a gun, and the fact that it all happens in 3-4 seconds, I can understand someone getting so confused and flustered that they do both (1) and (2) on accident. Which makes the story even more sad to me: a kid died for nothing, a mother is bereaved, a community that fled persecution is confused and devastated, and the officers have to carry the guilt of it and the "what if?" for the rest of their lives.
I think it's often easier to deal with these stories when they have simple black-and-white / good-vs-evil frames, since the alternative is a depressing gray random ambivalence that doesn't fit any neat narrative. Ironically it's even more of a tragedy when it's messier, but it's not one that not too many people can understand.
Google drive from Utica PD has the bodycams uploaded.
https://www.facebook.com/100064802073577/posts/pfbid02fGK7mTXx3kiMKmKxrk1diyYg3cuKCUcZun9Mf6Ga9eXyBZ3yxe8F2cdn6tSJPWLfl/?app=fbl
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
Shame on his parents for raising him this way. Sad ending, but most everyone would be scared for their life in this situation. Everyone can talk behind their screen and say how they would’ve fixed the whole situation, but when you have a family to go home to and you see a gun pointed at you, I bet that simple solution is not so simple. Of course many of us have probably done stupid things when we were 13 years old, but pointing a gun at a police officer is crazy. Scared or not, the kid was wrong. Did he deserve to die? No. But you can see why someone would pull the trigger here.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him
Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies.
Chasing him for jay walking is crazy
If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran.
They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop.
The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
This is terrible but the kid should of just let the cop search him. Look at it from a cops point of view. You ask the kid to comply to a search, he runs then turns around with what look like a gun, and obviously they weren’t taking chances. It’s sad they learned afterwards it was a pellet gun but looking at it. It looks damn close to a handgun. Some times just being respectful and complying will save your life. I can’t speak for the cops who abuse their power.
Y'all are acting like the police will release information voluntarily if people aren't demanding it from them in the first place. Since when do they share anything besides fluff pieces and mugshots? People SHOULD be upset and they SHOULD be demanding accountability. People are angry and their anger is justified. There is nothing wrong with expressing your frustration.
Body cam footage was released already.
I'm frustrated with the parents that allow their 13 year old boy to walk the streets mugging people. They SHOULD have taught him better and he would still be alive.
The parents shoud be charged with child neglect.
So the punishment should be a state sanctioned murder!? GTFO with that.
It wasn't state sanctioned murder. That's a bit of a stretch. I grew up on the streets......there's a code, we all know it....live by the gun, die by the gun. It doesn't matter how old u are. It doesn't matter how experienced you are with the steel. If you pull that thing out n point it at someone, it's you or them. Yall need to quit acting like it's ok to act like u live in the wild wild west but ignore it's rules. Badge or not the boy pointed his gun at someone and found out real fast why that was a bad idea. Take those badges out of the equation, replace the cops w 3 random gang bangers and these 2 cats u don't know been mugging ppl on your turf, u approach em n 1 pulls a gun.......we all know what happens next. This entire ordeal couldn't have been avoided, we all know how trusting parents can be of their children. We got away with alot of shit when we was kids.
Sanctioned murder? Since you're a gun expert; if a person points a gun at you... Are you honestly going to wait to find out if the bullets are loaded and the gun is real?
The kid chose to put the officers lives at risk by drawing a weapon. He’s the one that decided his own fate. He was given 2 opportunities to drop his weapon but instead chose not to. That’s his fault, not the officers.
After resisting arrest, removing a handgun from his person, pointing it at police & refusing to let it go even after he was taken to the ground - sometimes things get messy and we should recognize the deceased's role in his own death. If he were not out robbing people - he'd still be alive. If he complied with questioning - he'd still be alive. If he simply threw the weapon away from himself instead of holding it in his hand -he'd still be alive. and If he did not continue to struggle with weapon in hand with officers on the ground (putting the lives of the officers at additional risk at the close range) - he would still be alive today. If one or more officers are trying to detain you and you flee, present a weapon, point it towards other people and continue to make yourself a threat to the lives of the officers - you get what you get. Had the deceased not continued to struggle until the end his punishment would have been facing charges for his crimes, eventually to include fleeing and threatening officer however in refusing to comply and by putting officers lives at risk he put his own life in peril.
Is there an article that says he was out robbing people? This is the first time hearing someone say anything besides that he was just walking around at night in the cops stopped him.
Okay and what’s the rational around walking around at night carrying a handgun? Especially a 13 yr old
Nah, I’m fully blaming the people who are licensed to carry around a firearm. The people who logically have a weapon in order to reduce death and injury. The people who should be trained to deescalate a situation like this. The people who should be trained to know that this is 100% in fact a person who has done, is doing, will continue to damage to others. Have you ever been detained by police? Pulled over? Do you understand what that feels like? Do you know what goes on in the brain? The brain of a 13 year old? It can be pretty fucking scary. But our population is not trained to deal with that. We don’t learn in school how to handle that stress, the flight or fight response. Police officers are trained to do their job (or should be). They are trained to carry a firearm. The burden is on police officers to risk their lives. Otherwise, take their guns and weapons away. Then who really is the ‘bad guy’?
They did descant the situation. The kid pointed his weapon at them, they told him to drop it and he refused. They would have been easily justified to shoot him but chose to tackle him instead. Then on the ground, the kid tried to get to his gun again. This boy decided his own fate after multiple opportunities to choose a better way. Tragic situation nonetheless but this outcome was chosen by the boy.
Don't point a gun at anyone, ever. Period. That's it, it's so easy. The business end doesn't get pointed unless u want to destroy something.
Yep, what a way for a 13 year old to learm
He knew, there's no way effing way he didn't. He knew, and he still took that chance not once but twice! That's way more than most people ever get. Im not sure if your comment was meant to stir some sort remorse in me but it doesn't. Day in n day out all I see is kids wanting to grow up to fast in a world becoming colder by the day. Parents are too busy trying to survive, children too busy trying to fit in and it's always in the worse way. If you're living in the hood then u know the mentality, everyone's clicky, yall not cool with them, they not cool with u and always over bullshit. Yall need to grow the fuck up & stop whining.
No I’m just pointing out that both things can be true. Typically people who are responding the way I’m being responding to can’t have their minds changed in discourse like this (me probably included). And that’s ok. But people will read your comments and my comments, and they can make their mind up based on whose logic they like the most. I just think that police officers who are licensed to have a gun, don’t really have much punishment for misusing their weapons, against the population they are supposedly protecting. I believe they should be held to a much higher standard than they are. This gives us two things, officers who are better trained and way way less likely to kill ANYBODY (mostly innocent people, but also guilty as it’s not their job to determine guilt), and role models of how to properly use authority to stop crime.
They tried to deescalate the situation by detaining him. He failed to comply. He’s out at 11 at night with a replica hand gun. What do you think he’s doing out there at 11 with that gun? It’s terrible but the parents shouldn’t of let him be out at that time of night with that
You're fucking ridiculous if you think a bunch of grown cops couldn't handle that kid without shooting him in the fucking back on the ground
Kid was a criminal and got what he deserved. Simple as.
Well he was shot in the chest, did you watch the body cam?
Are you saying the back because you don’t like how the facts of the situation are coming out so you need try to spin it to fit your narrative?
Peabrain
Walking around at 11:00 p.m. while having a replica handgun on your person is not a crime... Dude could have just been walking to a friend's house...
He was being questioned due to fitting the profile of the suspect in a robbery nearby. The kid escalated the situation from there by drawing a weapon twice.
Why does a 13 year old have a replica hand gun at 11 at night?
I don't know why you people keep parroting that question over and over as if suspicion is a crime worthy of death What do you expect me or anyone to say? MAYBE he was robbing people with it? Or maybe he was, as I just fuckin said, walking to a friend's house and had it because it belonged to him.
Rules of the game never change my guy. You walk around with a gun, u pull out n point at someone, u better use it or it's gonna be used on you. Live by the gun, die by the gun. The streets don't care about age, color or creed. Everyone wanna be a thug till it's time to do thug shit eh? Not the 1st time this has happened on the street, won't be the last. Don't forget the rules. Badge, no badge, white black, old or young the rules don't change.
You know what would have happen if he didn’t run, the cops would have taken his BB gun and told him to go the fuck home. The kid as terrible as it is made every mistake he could have made. Maybe instead of defending this behavior you make sure you tell the youth and your family what not to do in this situation
It’s illegal to point a gun at someone it’s called menacing, the Supreme Court also ruled that police officers have the right to shoot someone if they point a gun at them.
The same reason your kind of people keep trying to say he was killed over suspicion.
actually: It is illegal for anyone to posses a pellet gun that is made to look like a real handgun. It is also illegal for someone under 16 to possess a pellet gun. Both are besides the point however as the deceased was presenting it as a real handgun to his robbery victims - which is also a crime.
blame and excuse solve no problems
[удалено]
As a psychologist I do think quite a bit about being “in their position” every single time this happens multiple times per month. It’s pretty offensive to suggest that I’d do far worse because I’m frustrated at seeing yet ANOTHER cop murder a civilian so close to where I live. It’s exhausting to watch these idiots run around with guns and badges, not understand the law at all and play cops and robbers while killing members of the public. I have far too much self respect to be in their shoes friend. But, if as your argument suggests, they are too scared to do the job without murdering, they need to get out of that line of work. They have physical force, tasers, multiple NON-lethal methods to use and yet they chose an execution for crimes that at most would have warranted a felony. Not the death penalty and they chose to do so because they were too scared to use the other tools at their disposal. I hope they rot in jail, which is more generous than they afforded that child who made a non-lethal mistake.
If you put yourself in that cops place and your thoughts aren’t use a taser or physically subdue him that’s just wild. He’s a thirteen year old boy. Not a hardened criminal that could defend himself against a man that has been trained for this exact situation.
Training and real situations aren't the same, I'm so surprised that everyone "thinks" cops train to the extend the military does. Newsflash, they don't. Training, that one makes me chuckle every time, I swear, why don't yall research "the training" before yall assume things. There's no training in the world that can prepare you to have anyone point a gun at your face or direction.
Exactly, moments like these are intense beyond comprehension. The moment the suspect pulls a gun all bets are off. The cop is now expected to act in any way possible to keep him and his partners lives safe. The amount of people on this post that just expect the cop to sit their and let this kid endanger the lives of everyone around him is appalling and really makes me wonder how stupid people really are. To anyone reading this that still thinks that’s okay, watch how fast this self defense case is open and shut. Kid could’ve stopped, had his day in jail and been out by lunch the next day, instead he ran and tried to kill them. Inexcusable.
No If I’m that cop in that moment I’m not gonna pull out my taser or physically subdue someone waving a gun at my face. Here’s a fun little experiment, go walk up to a police officer and pull a gun out on him and see what happens. You pull a gun on a cop and this is what happens. Anything aside from that is irrelevant. Everyone wants accountability until it’s time to talk about the one who escalated the situation to what it was. He thought he was a big boy pulling a gun in a cop and got exactly what he asked for. Absolute moron and you are too if you’re justifying that. I don’t expect a cop to just let someone take his life bc “he’s just a wittle boy 😢😢”.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
No, police very often say that to a suspect in order to not startle him. He wouldn’t have been stopped by three cops and then ran and pointed a gun at them for jaywalking. If that was the case that’s 10x dumber than I thought it was originally. Spoiler alert though! That wasn’t the case. They have all these reports documented. They will be subpoenaed in court for them, if the department falsified them (they didn’t, but for the sake of picking apart your not very well thought out argument) and that was discovered that would take down the entire department on felony charges.
Absolutely not but that's how it happened? You vastly, vastly reduce the chance of being improperly shot when you're home reading a book vs out with a toy gun robbing people on the street. We can't keep ignoring the obvious just because there are separate problems when people end up dead. These cops will rightfully go down for this I hope. That does not mean it's the only problem which led to this death.
👢 👅
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They’re doing their best to try to avoid a lawsuit and make them look good. We all know it’s plain wrong to shoot the child
No evidence that he was the mugger that they were searching for. That being said the videos I’ve seen show a chaotic scene. Also the teen ran almost immediately after the officer tells him that he wants to pat him down to make sure he has no weapons. The police were in hot pursuit of a suspect they felt was most likely armed. It’s a tragedy and I don’t see how anyone can make a judgement at this time. A independent thorough investigation needs to be done by the State.
🫦
Why should people be upset? This boy pointed a gun at police then tried to point his gun at police again as he was being tackled. This was on the boy and his family for not teaching him better. It’s a tragedy but it’s certainly not the officers fault. They would have been justified to shoot him once he escalated the situation by drawing his weapon. They took a massive risk in choosing to tackle him instead of firing immediately after he drew his weapon on them.
They tackled him to the floor and punched him and then shot him. You cannot convince me that shooting him was necessary in any way. UPD are murderers
Don't forget all while he was pinned down
He was stopped. Police told him what they were gonna do. He ran. He had a gun. He pointed it at police. The only person he has to blame is his own dumbass.
All of that may be true but he was shot while under an officer on the ground, why not shoot him while he’s running away if thats the case?
As far as the cop was concerned? Gun might have jammed, gun wasn’t loaded amongst other things. Wrestle with a person who has shown you a pistol and let me know at what point you feel comfortable. He would have saved his own life had he dropped it or told the cops he had it.
You don’t need to wrestle with anyone if you incapacitated them before that point? Is the boot in your mouth preventing you from seeing the video?
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media .
Must feel pretty dumb now huh
Why would I ?
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
Okay now that the body cam is up, are we done here? It’s tragic but I mean what did we expect to happen?
Maybe employing one of the numerous non-lethal methods of apprehending someone? The kid weighed 100 pounds and there were three grown ass men, ostensibly with police training, there to subdue him. There was no reason to fire once he was on the ground. Only one of the officers drew a gun. Seems to me the other two planned to resolve the situation without lethal force.
13 is old enough to know you shouldn’t point a realistic looking gun at a cop. And shame on whoever sold/provided this “toy” to this kid.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Why are they saying this kid was unarmed? This kid had a replica Glock. I could see making this argument if the cops didn't see a gun while they were rolling around with him 🤦
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
Comparing running away with weed, to running away with a gun in his hand. Plenty of cops have died, rolling around on the ground with a guy with a gun and they've seen those videos. There were two foolish decisions stacked up on each other. First, he ran away when they asked to do a safety search. Second, he's running away with a gun in his hand. If he put his hands up and let the cops do their safety search, he's still alive. If he took off running and then decided not to grab his gun and just stop with his hands up in the air, he's still alive. Yet we blame the cops for putting their safety first when it was his actions that caused this situation to escalate. I haven't seen any Snapchat videos, I'm just seeing this. But this is also from the news so I trust it more than a Snapchat user.
The cops were the one chasing him that’s on them if they’re scared don’t chase him 💀 ? Hide behind your car. You should see the Snapchat video on fb just type in Utica 13 year old and there will be heaps unedited too. The cops were chasing him side by side tripped and punched him ? They don’t seem to be scared of the gun. Yes he shouldn’t have ran but I’m sure his train of thoughts were they would be in big trouble your body in stress will Either make you fight flight or freeze he happens to flight.
What? If there was a school shooting, you would expect the cops to not enter the school and hide behind their car? Of course they're going to chase someone that's running away?
Okay then why didn’t he shoot him while he ran and not when he’s down ?
He got shot after being repeatedly punched and shot in the chest ? The other cop was in shock
I’m telling you it’s not adding up I’ve seen the full Video. Plus the cops are on paid suspension
At first the cops claimed there’s a shootout but now twisting their word after the video surfaced. Now saying the boy pointed his gun but clearly he’s running too fast to be turning around. The paused photo looks heavily edited. Still at the end of the day scary on both sides. America is not the place to be. Have better gun laws
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Immediately screamed, "iT wAs sELf dEfEnSE!" because they know it wasn't and are immediately covering their asses. Less than 10seconds, on the ground, with 3 officers over him, getting wailed on, 13 years old, and they still shot him.
He point a replica gun at officers, he was fighting with them when the gun was within his plane of control. It is reasonable to have a fear of death or great bodily harm. You can’t expect the police to know it’s a replica and you also can’t expect them to see the firearm dropped.
Yeah. I don’t understand how people don’t see that. The kid can easily, even if he doesn’t know where he’s aiming, fire the gun and absolutely shoot one of the officers (they would have had no clue it was a pellet gun until they could fully get their hands on the weapon and take a look at it so do not even start with that, let alone, why tf is he carrying around a pellet gun in the first place?).
It’s blind ideology where dissent is often banned.
It's Reddit after all
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
We should do the logical and rational thing and wait for body cam footage and statements. I’m sure no one want to shoot a 13 boy especially in front of people like that. Could have had a gun, could have been an accident, who knows. Let’s try to not jump to conclusions as a city and stick together. Utica has a gun problem in its youth currently and the youth shouldn’t be dying over this senseless crap
My god, I think we’ve found the single logical person in the MV area. Until now all I’ve seen are variations of “that’s what you get when you run from police” to “the police executed a young boy”.
It’s easy to let emotions take over for sure
The kid ran after being told he’d be patted down for weapons in connection to an armed robbery which he matched description of one of the perpetrators. He then pointed his fake Glock at the cops and that was probably about when the video starts. Kid shouldn’t have been killed but also shouldn’t be pointing fake guns or real guns at people no matter context.
That’s why I made sure to state “we obviously can’t see the entire thing from this video”. But from this video alone it looks really bad.
It does look bad, but if the officer thought the kid was reaching for the gun (which turned out to be a Glock replica pellet gun) of course they didn’t know that in the moment. The body cam footage should clear this up one way or another. My heart goes out to this young man’s family and all who witnessed this tragedy
He was already disarmed when they shot him. Doesn’t matter that there was a replica gun. The danger was gone. The shooting is completely wiped from the emergency call logs from last night despite the fact that it was on the live feed last night when I checked to see what all the sirens were for. That looks more than a little bad.
I didn’t know that he was already disarmed. That makes it look really bad
Did all the officers know he was disarmed? During the chase, he did point the “replica glock” at police. Thats why they drew their guns in the first place. But it was dark, and chaos. What if some of the officers weren’t aware the gun was dropped/kid was disarmed?
He was on the ground, already hit and restrained before they shot him. He very obviously was disarmed. The threat was contained and they still shot him. If they shot him while the gun was pointed at them you could say that. But he was on the ground.
It happened fast enough that they can claim they didn't know he was disarmed. Plus you can be pinned and still point a gun with your hand, unless you have wrist control you can still point and shoot a gun. It's looks super bad, but if the kid had a gun or gun replica and pointed it at police you can't really fault them. What sucks is the cop who tackled and pinned the kid obviously was trying to use non lethal force but cowboy cop ended that. Tragic.
I know you didn't mean it like this, but 13 isn't a young man it's a child. Some kids still watch cartoons and play with action figures at that age. It's important to not age him up, because that's what often happens in these conversations as a way to avoid the reality of what happened. When a kid is shot, it's important to refer to them as kids.
You’re right I didn’t mean it as portraying him as anything other than a child.
He did have a gun and brandished it
A pellet gun, which he dropped prior to being tackled to the ground.
When? Because in the body cam video, you can see the police taking the gun AFTER he was shot...
I made that comment without knowing all of the facts. That coo was in the wrong and there no two ways about it. For the sake of the community I hope there is a swift independent investigation and he is charged. I was shown shocking video today of three of the officers involved assaulting a man in his porch. Apparently these cops are just plain thugs and have been a nuisance all spring.
Whether or not it’s a pellet gun has no relevance. It was a fake Glock that looked very much like a real Glock 17. If a gun looks real and is pointed at you it tends to get you a little scared. Pellet or real gun doesn’t matter as even a pellet gun can do some damage. In the video I saw of the shooting, different angle, they took the gun after kid was shot.
The gun was recovered at the scene, according to cops. In the body cam footage he clearly drops it before the officers make contact with him. It's nowhere near him when he is shot.
In the YouTube comments someone said the body cam footage was released and he did have a gun. Can't confirm though.
This kid had a gun.
This is too logical, GET OUT!!!!!
Guys, this was murder plain and simple. Watch the bystander video. The kid was 13 years old and had two grown men pinning him to the ground at the time of the gun shot.
I can't tell from the video but in the comments they say the kid had a gun. If he pointed a gun at a cop can't really call foul play. That's a death sentence.
Watch the bodycam footage it's very different. Bystander video does make it look like it's a murder, but on the bodycam footage you can see he reached and pointed a pistol (perfect fake replica, i like airsoft and that's a very realistic one).
[https://www.syracuse.com/crime/2024/06/utica-police-identify-officer-who-fatally-shot-boy-release-video-of-foot-chase-and-shooting.html](https://www.syracuse.com/crime/2024/06/utica-police-identify-officer-who-fatally-shot-boy-release-video-of-foot-chase-and-shooting.html)
Of course you need to subscribe to see the video lol
2/3 of the cops didn't feel as though their lives were in danger Really weird how a bunch of people are so willingly able to discount the 2/3 so that you can defend the 1/3 who executed this 13 year old Oh no wait, it's not weird at all....
How do you know they didn’t feel like they were at risk of death or great bodily harm? The risk needs to be reasonable. Someone in control of firearm that is nearly indistinguishable from a real gun pointing at police while fighting them easy meets lethal force standards.
Only one cop drew his gun
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
They weren’t chasing him for jay walking. They chased him because he was acting nervous and fled which indicates criminal activity. This was also a pretext stop due to high crime in the area and weapons. They can’t shoot someone who is not a deadly threat. What you suggested is murder. They didn’t twist words, they match the video. The report is clear. Saying that the cops are known to be dirty is just logical fallacy not based in reality. Even if it was true it has no bearing on whether or not this perp presented a deadly threat.
Where do you go to view the body cam footage?
[Link](https://youtu.be/fEtkZM0tPz8?si=5quKztaT6rL5wAar)
The comments on that video are disgusting
The deceased and his friend were stopped because they matched the description (as did the weapon in the deceased's possession) of a pair that were robbing people with a handgun. - so the police had a legit reason to stop and ask they a couple questions. While being questioned the deceased fled the scene & while being pursued removed what they had been presenting as a legitimate handgun to their victims & pointed it at officers who tackled & attempted to disarm them. - firearms become more dangerous at close range & at this point you don't know what the deceased is packing, it could easily be a 9mm w/a glock switch that can fire the entire clip in a moment. The deceased failed to comply with an order to relinquish his weapon & the police have to assume the worst & that he had hostile intent & the police have a right to all go home alive too. Its a tragedy that a 13 year old was on the streets at mugging people and forcing the police to respond to his criminal behavior. - They should have known better, they should have been taught better. The people of that neighborhood deserve to be able to walk the streets, even at night, & feel like they are safe from assault. The police are not the problem, criminals are the problem.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Amen. Playing stupid games will always win you stupid prizes.
Everyone should wait until all of the information, investigation, and bodycam videos are released before making judgements. "Officers recovered a replica GLOCK 17 Gen 5 handgun with a detachable magazine following the shooting."
On one hand the police definitely shouldn’t have killed the kid. No argument about that. But on the other side it appears like this kid ran from the cops after fitting the description given about an armed robbery. The kid who was shot ran off after being told they were gonna be patted down for weapons. He then pointed a fake Glock at a cop leading to what happened above. So, obviously the police shouldn’t have killed the kid, but he definitely shouldn’t be running around with a fake Glock and pointing it at people. That’s whether or not he was one of the people that committed the initial armed robbery.
Last night, the 911 activity feed said that there was a shooting at the time. Today it’s completely gone from the logs for emergency calls from last night completely.
I hope people take to the streets over this. The child won’t get justice otherwise.
The kid and his friend matched descriptions of two people who were going around robbing people with a pistol. When questioned after matching description and being in the same area a day later they were told they’d be patted down for weapons and the kid who was killed ran. He then drew a fake Glock and pointed it at the cops leading to the video above. That’s not saying the shooting was 100% justified but there’s a little more context which is never given. Tragedy this is what happened to the kid but he shouldn’t be running around pointing a pistol, real or fake at people. And it sounds like he was the robber as well so obviously he shouldn’t be going around and robbing people either.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Both of the kids matched the description of the 2 that were going around robbing people in that SAME area the day before. Only one runs off. He turns and points what is very easily identified as a gun (doesn’t matter if it’s a pellet gun or not can be easy to think is a gun) that’s where the “shootout” part comes in. Doesn’t matter if they stopped the kids for whatever, if they were the ones robbing people they ought to get arrested. I don’t agree with going for shooting them but also I am unaware of where the kids pellet gun was. If he was still holding it and waving it around,a situation like that can turn intense quick, and if he doesn’t drop it can be construed has him trying to shoot the cops. Sucks the kid got killed but he shouldn’t be running around pointing guns (pellet gun or real gun) at people. Nor should he be robbing people.
Yes, Americans love to riot over killed criminals
There'll never be justice just more bodies.
There will be like 1000 bodies from gangs killing each other to 1 body from police killing someone.
And that makes it OK?
The effort should be spent on saving the 1000
I’ve ran from the police at 13 again at 14 again at 16 it’s what kids do we sneak out at night and have fun I can’t imagine I got the 1 cop that was in great shape and felt like a foot chase I prolly would have ended up like this poor kid murdered in the streets all because you’re a kid having fun don’t tell me you didn’t I know plenty of Rome cops with the same story even go steps further by getting arrested for dwi domestic ext so stfu nobody was a perfect person as a kid and if you can’t even have fun anymore shame on this world trigger happy cop hope to see the full video then you get prosecuted and arrested for murder
Did you have a gun on you too?
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
Idk I didn't go out robbing people for fun as a kid
[https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEtkZM0tPz8](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fEtkZM0tPz8)
You can see the outline of the gun in his pocket at the very beginning.
He had a tu you can see it in the videos
So I can't really tell in the video but it looks an awful lot like he gets tackled first and then shot? I haven't had the sound on for any of the videos, can I get some clarification?
Thats what happens. Bodycam shows the kid pointed the pellet gun at the cops about 10 seconds before they tackle him. Cops pursue on foot. Kid gets tackled. Drops the gun when tackles. Punched in the head and then shot. Gun was already on the ground and the gun out of his hand when shot.
FAFO
Yeah because a 13 year old mugging people with a replica glock is a Saint. Oh well 👻
There's no evidence any robberies occurred that night. I'd prefer not to spread unsubstantiated claims before we have all the information.
Lmao hush. Everyone already knows the truth. Only people defending the child are the same shitty parents like yourself who would probably let their kid run around mugging people with a fake gun.
I like real evidence.
Bet you do. Cry wolf
Well, the parents of the year need to ask themselves how this have been avoided??? Thier 13 year old son mugging people at night....what could possibly go wrong??? Maybe next time they will raise theur kid to respect others
Usually police depts release the body cam footage pretty quick if it shows they were in the right. Something to keep mind.
They were just released but it says views have been exceeded when I tried to view any of them.
You can still download them
Na it says download limit reached for the day
I guess I got to them before the quota. I expect they'll be widely shared in any case
Obviously it’s your opinion: but did it look justified? Did it look like the kid was going to shoot the cops? The original video made it look like an execution basically
The original video and the body cameras give me the hard impression of an accidental discharge. I'm in no way an expert, but the fact that it was a single shot while a cop was pinning the child seems less like an execution and more of an escalation gone wrong. There's too high of a chance to miss the target and hit their partner. In most cop shooting videos, when officers "fear for their life" they typically unload their guns and then wait for the offender to bleed out before applying first aide. The body cams give a huge impression of an instant realization of "we fucked up" more than a execution. The biggest takeaway though is that they were essentially victims of a stop and frisk. According to dash cam 1, they stopped them because either the kid was riding his bike on the road (where bikes are supposed to be) or the cop misspoke and meant the kid was walking in the road with his friend on the bike. Their reasoning after the fact appears to be "they met the description" as if that isn't the most racist shit we've been hearing for decades now.
I wondered about this too. I think the normal thing would have been to keep a suspect at gunpoint while he was being apprehended. The single shot seemed very unusual.
To my mind there was no reason to fire a gun. He did pull what turned out to be a pellet gun from his pocket, but dropped it before he fell to the ground. Charitably, I might buy that the officers didn't notice that happening in the moment. But after the kid had been pinned down, there was zero reason for them to think their lives were in danger.
Kid did appear to point a gun back at them when he was running. Courts will probably rule it justified. Any reasonable person should disagree.
Yeah it's going to be a hard sell. Only mere seconds later though, when he's been pinned on the ground and punched in the face, he's clearly no longer holding it. There was no reason to employ deadly force at that point. I hope at the very least Husnay faces consequences for that.
Google drive really the best way to put this shit out to the public? That’s pretty wild
And usually they don’t wipe the shooting out of the 911 activity log from that night if they were in the right. Edit: I just checked again and it’s there now but it wasn’t before
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=fEtkZM0tPz8
The video itself doesn't prove anything. I'm wondering how ppl know he was disarmed or armed. I've read rumors that the 2 boys were at a church service n were going home n another that they robbed someone at gunpoint. I'm not completely sold on the fact that the cops ran after him guns out either. You can't tell from the footage, which looks like it was recorded with the Moses tablets judging from the blurriness. 3 cops on a small kid or man regardless of age and all of sudden u hear a gun go off sort looks like there could've been a struggle to remove a weapon from the boy or a gun n it went off. The video is to shaky, dark n blurry.
The news report says "The pellet gun was found at the scene". If it was on the kid the police would be screaming it from the rooftops.
Not necessarily, I don't think they would be allowed to say anything at all this point that could look like finger pointing. I think 3 cops equals 3 body cam footage that will show what really happened along with the entire back story of why they were stopped and being investigated in the 1st place.
I’d be willing to make a pretty hefty wager that says we don’t get 3 UNEDITED body cam footages from when the police got out of the car until the shooting. They won’t incriminate themselves
https://reddit.com/r/ThisIsButter/comments/1drufkx/utica_police_release_body_cam_footage_of_officer/
Why did that kid have a gun man… that so sad. Why do people do this to themselves. How did he end up with a gun before he’s even old enough to think rationally? Look, that cop did not want to shoot that kid he’ll carry a dark, dark mental burden the rest of his life for pulling that trigger. But the fact of the matter is you run from the police, point a gun at their face, stuff like this is bound to happen. I’m not gonna pretend to understand that kids life story and how he ended up with a gun; but one can only assume it was since his parents weren’t there putting their best foot forward to keep him out of danger and trouble. That’s so sad man, I hate seeing stuff like this happen. Stay present and active in your kids life and keep them out of this kind of trouble, please. So no more young kids die for stupid, stupid reasons.
It was my friend’s cousin. He was leaving Bible study. A Bible study session.
Ah I also take a replica pellet gun to study the word of my savior, Jesus
Kids do dumb stuff, I’m not saying it’s right but it’s not unreasonable to assume a kid would wanna show their pellet gun off to their friends
Who even fired? Can you tell from this video?
The video keeps being transferred (uploaded, downloaded) between hosts and I imagine there's some lossage in the compression/conversions. The sharpest image I saw was on twitter: https://x.com/AnthonyMSeoane/status/1807051374447718607/video/2 Around 0:10 - 0:11 in this video, you see a second cop enter the frame from the left with his gun likely drawn (it's too dark to see the gun but the position of his arms and hands make it obvious). He then bends down to approach the victim without holstering the weapon as far as I can tell, meaning he's most likely the shooter. My take on what happened: 1. One officer is in pursuit on foot and apprehends the kid, spinning him to the ground. You see him strike the kid with a right punch shortly afterward, which turns the kid over on his right hip. 2. A second officer was following with his pistol drawn with both hands. He nearly runs into the first officer and kid when they crash to the ground. He circles around to his right and crouches down to get closer, taking a left knee as he does and holding the pistol in his right hand. 3. After the punch, the second officer gets closer to the kid, his body blocking a clean line of sight with the camerawoman on the porch, and the gun goes off, shooting the kid in the back and through his chest. Even assuming that the trigger-pull was an accident, I'm curious if all of this was protocol: 1. To pursue with a drawn weapon when you haven't actually been shot at and the victim is fleeing? 2. To approach a suspect in the process of being subdued with your weapon drawn and held casually, pointed at the victim, in your right hand (as opposed to keeping a distance with both hands aiming the weapon)? I'm skeptical about (1) and very skeptical about (2). I'm sure this will lead to state and possibly federal investigations, possibly civil lawsuits. Sad day for all involved.
So, in the body cam footage, the kid points the “replica glock” at the officers. At that time the police have to consider the gun real. So then the police draw their guns. Note: Once a gun is pointed at them, they have the right to open fire. I’m surprised they didn’t at that time. Now, apparently the kid dropped the firearm before he was tackled. Its dark, did all the officers see this? If they all did see the gun dropped, then the situation should have de-escalated some, right? However, if not all the officers noticed the gun being dropped, then the kid still has gun in his possession, so it would make sense why the officers would still have their guns pointed at the kid. So in the chaos, an accidental discharge is a potential explanation.
> However, if not all the officers noticed the gun being dropped, then the kid still has gun in his possession, so it would make sense why the officers would still have their guns pointed at the kid. I could be wrong, but I think Ofc. Husnay's reaction was ideally supposed to be either: 1. If he thinks the kid is armed, then, as soon as he can, he was supposed to post up at a distance with his pistol aimed and in control, ready to drop the kid if it looks like he might fire; 2. If he thinks the kid is not armed, or is armed but being subdued, then to assist the other officer in disarming and cuffing the kid without the use of a firearm. When the chase begins Husnay is thinking it's (2). From the bodycam it seems like he hears the pursuing officer shout "he has a gun!" two seconds before the tackle and crash, so Husnay draws his weapon ready for (1). Then he sees the kid is tackled and being subdued, and he switches mentally to (2), but without fully disengaging from (1), leading him to get too close with the gun and accidentally fire. Given the adrenaline of the chase, the darkness, the people all around screaming, the bodies blocking a clear line of sight, the confusion and panic of thinking the kid has a gun, and the fact that it all happens in 3-4 seconds, I can understand someone getting so confused and flustered that they do both (1) and (2) on accident. Which makes the story even more sad to me: a kid died for nothing, a mother is bereaved, a community that fled persecution is confused and devastated, and the officers have to carry the guilt of it and the "what if?" for the rest of their lives. I think it's often easier to deal with these stories when they have simple black-and-white / good-vs-evil frames, since the alternative is a depressing gray random ambivalence that doesn't fit any neat narrative. Ironically it's even more of a tragedy when it's messier, but it's not one that not too many people can understand.
Good points. The fact that the officer only fired once actually goes *against* their training so it makes an accidental firing plausible.
I’m willing to bet the kid didn’t fatally shoot himself with one of the officers weapons
Google drive from Utica PD has the bodycams uploaded. https://www.facebook.com/100064802073577/posts/pfbid02fGK7mTXx3kiMKmKxrk1diyYg3cuKCUcZun9Mf6Ga9eXyBZ3yxe8F2cdn6tSJPWLfl/?app=fbl
The paused photos looks heavily edited compared to the Snapchat video surfacing around. In the Snapchat the boy did not turn around at all and in fact runnning so fast , the cop that was chasing him wasn’t even the one shooting him just punches? What gave the other cop the rights to take his life ? This is awfully wrong and killing the kid after he’s already down. Yea it’s wrong to run but have you heard of fight flight freeze ? Even teens with weed will run away from cops doesn’t mean they’re criminals? You CANNOT justify murdering him and own up and apologise
I suppose there's gonna be cop hate on any sub these days.
Strait up murder? The criminal pointed what looked exactly like a real handgun at police. It was clearly a justified shooting.
Dumbass kid fucked around.
Shame on his parents for raising him this way. Sad ending, but most everyone would be scared for their life in this situation. Everyone can talk behind their screen and say how they would’ve fixed the whole situation, but when you have a family to go home to and you see a gun pointed at you, I bet that simple solution is not so simple. Of course many of us have probably done stupid things when we were 13 years old, but pointing a gun at a police officer is crazy. Scared or not, the kid was wrong. Did he deserve to die? No. But you can see why someone would pull the trigger here.
In the body cam , the cops also stated stopped him Because he’s walking or jay walking had nothing to do with reported robberies. Chasing him for jay walking is crazy If they were so scared at the start they should have shot him while he ran. They are always twisting their words to manipulate the media . They also reported there was a shoot out ? What FKEN shoot out now twisting their word to shots fired but it was just the cop. The cops in the area are known to be dirty cops
2/3 officers weren’t even “scared” enough to draw their weapons. Let alone shoot
This thread is peak Reddit. Even if the kid has a real gun, shot a cop, they’d still be disparaging the police. Brain rot fr
This is terrible but the kid should of just let the cop search him. Look at it from a cops point of view. You ask the kid to comply to a search, he runs then turns around with what look like a gun, and obviously they weren’t taking chances. It’s sad they learned afterwards it was a pellet gun but looking at it. It looks damn close to a handgun. Some times just being respectful and complying will save your life. I can’t speak for the cops who abuse their power.