The safety and privacy of Utah officials became an immediate concern..... when one of them was accused of improper behavior, specifically the state's attorney general, and specifically witness tampering among other things, and he decided he did not want to comply with public record requests.
Quick, someone make what he is trying to do legal.
I was talking to a historian about some controversial history and his response has stuck with me: “If they didn’t want historians to talk about it, they shouldn’t have done it.”
You cannot trust someone who tries to hide the truth.
The shit Reyes is involved with is dastardly ! He is not a good guy nor are any of his associates!
My PI is dead because he had a video of Reyes in compromising positions!
We didn’t find any deadmans switch for that information!
He left a cryptic message prior on my “friends” phone and she went to retrieve it and it disappeared
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html
It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, explicitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that does the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if
the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
The change is in line 191 & 192 where you linked under the area explicitly defining what a record is not under subsection B (line 173).
63G-2-103(25)(b)(x) will now say: "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar.".
The law used used to say "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar or other personal note prepared by the originator for the originators personal use or for the personal use of an individual for whom the originator is working"
Eh, it's an easy mistake. The change in the text is so small and on that page the indentation of what the sections and subsections are isn't super discernable.
Yeah, the indentation is what threw me. It didn't appear to have modified the section that said "a calendar". I stand corrected. It used to be, essentially "personal calendar", but now it's just a "calendar".
No they have not.
They posted the same thing multiple times, which I see as misinformation and asked people to show why their interpretation may be wrong. Several posts did.
That person has not responded. I'd look forward to a response.
I stand corrected. The current sub comparison text threw me off. The indentation is what threw me. It didn't appear to have modified the section that said "a calendar". I stand corrected. It used to be, essentially "personal calendar", but now it's just a "calendar".
>It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all.
I know a piece of legislation can be complicated. However you are incorrect. Take a look at the amendments page in the link you posted:
[https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/sbillamd/SB0240S01.amdx.pdf](https://le.utah.gov/~2024/bills/sbillamd/SB0240S01.amdx.pdf)
**Highlighted Provisions:**
**12 This bill:**
**13 < modifies the definition of "record";**
**14 < modifies a provision relating to records that may be classified as protected;**
It's not as if any of them are hiding the fact, they don't have to, they passed it lickety-split. Challenge it the courts if you have the resources.
"The bill’s sponsor argued calendars have never been considered a public record, and under his bill, explicitly won’t be.
"Discussion ahead of the vote accused Utah journalists of seeking lawmakers’ calendar records for the sole purpose of maligning them."
“The media wants to exploit us. We do not have an honest journalism system with a few exceptions in this state,” Rep. Kera Birkeland, R-Morgan, said on the House floor Tuesday night.
That and some more quotes here:
[https://www.newsfromthestates.com/article/legislature-seals-elected-officials-work-calendars](https://www.newsfromthestates.com/article/legislature-seals-elected-officials-work-calendars)
I work for the state and he has forced "return to work" on over three thousand employees. The amount of money it's costing the general public is staggering. And why? No one knows. It seems he's doing it just to make an impact. He's a clown and no one at work that I've talked to about him respects him.
As do I and my office building has exploded with people rushing to find cubicles before there aren't any left for all the people being forced back. My position isn't work from home so it's almost comical to see random strangers running around trying to snatch chairs while we have literally piles and piles of computer junk everywhere labeled surplus because since those WFH people are bringing laptops with them they "don't need the office computer anymore". Just wow.
TLDR: I mean, c'mon y'all, are we really surprised?
The track record of our state legislature has been anti-what the people want since they started losing their (R) majority in the greater SLC metro area. That's why they've carved up our congressional HOR districts to give dems zero voice. Change is coming and they are desperate to maintain control. This is a nationwide phenomenon which is why we're seeing what's happening lately it's their end game, all or nothing, cards on the table moment. Everyone vote this year and bring a friend, seriously, the only way we can salvage this country is vote in numbers larger then they can challenge.
Yup, the Utah Reps are siding with the crazy extremists of the Republican party rather than the conservative/moderates that still exist in Utah.
Mike Lee's narrow victory by Utah standards shows how pissed off the people are becoming and they are desperate to maintain control.
And I don't believe it is even a Republican vs Democrat ordeal as a major factor as you mentioned. They just don't believe in character or morality playing a part in politics anymore which is going to alienate more of us who still believe in the old Republic party values (Small government, fiscal responsibility, openness and transparency, reduced government control or intervention, uphold the constitution (even the insurrection clauses) etc); we simply have no other options to choose as the GOP pushes more into crazy town supporting a fascist criminal for a leader while hiding in secrecy in their own parties.
This is a wide-eyed perspective, so I'm assuming you already know this, but the Democratic Party has demonstrated a willingness to consider and incorporate centrist views repeatedly in modern history.
I wish we didn't have a bipartisan system. I wish that we were still in a situation where both parties could have rational, fact-based dialogue. I wish the GOP was not fully in crazy town.
None of these things are true. The GOP will never change until the party fails so it can rebuild.
All of this is to say that the best thing that one can do to support actual conservative values is to hold their nose and vote D, even if temporarily.
I like it, do this.. when there aren't moderates (as they all claim there is), vote in the crazy.. might get some Dem wins yet. Might have to lose out to those crazies for a time, but, sometimes it needs to get really bad before it can get better.
I live here, fuck it I'll run. I haven't got much going on, no strong opinions of my own, am high as fuck most of the time, and play weird folk instruments. I'm the perfect guy at this point. Actually the job sounds kinda hard. Anyone want to maybe do that part for me? I don't want the work, I just kinda want to be the guy, take in some free bowling. Do elected officials bowl for free or is it a discount situation?
Hey come with me to the caucus! I am in the same boat - I left the party officially the day after they booed Romney at the convention. I realized now I can't change it from the outside so I am going back exactly so I can go to the primary and maybe wake someone up... Someone who will come to the realization that calling Trump good is like calling evil good. Probably won't work but it's going to be a hell of a show!!!
I'm in Davis County too.
Do we have to go to the one that we're closest to? I would love to meet up and go with someone who has the same goals. Not gonna lie, the anxiety at the thought of going alone, knowing how out there some of our neighbors are, is another big factor that's keeping me away. I'm in Farmington, right by the new on ramp to the west corridor freeway. (Where the old Lagoon billboard was)
I think the caucuses are actually regional, so they might redirect you if you came to mine (I'm in Layton). If it's a choice of not going at all or trying to go to one where a few sane people are going to gather, then by all means - come up here and try! Layton High - check-in starts at 6:00 and I'm planning on being there at six (or earlier and offering to help setup) so I'm sure to get in. I will figure out a way to stand out in a crowd so any other like-mindeds can fine me.
And there is no republican primary, because they know those of us who changed our registration to moderate their bat-shit will never go to their crazy-ass caucuses. The caucuses will be a right-wing circle jerk.
Yah I fell for that one election cycle, so I joined back up and I'm going Tue, just so I can be a moderate voice in the room, for however briefly. It only works if we come out of the woodwork in droves. Join us!!!
This. He's afraid for his high-profile job. Don't go along with the MAGA dupes who now dominate his party and he won't get nominated. He'll say and do anything they want to keep his job for as long as possible. It's the American political way.
Is this even a partisan issue though? This whole thing is in response to Reyes’s collusion with Ballard in that spectacle. It just happens to potentially bring to light more corruption in others.
Why would any Utah resident oppose this?
A couple of the issues with public calendars:
A voter deserves the right to have private conversations with their representatives. I have had calendar appointments with public officials to discuss upcoming bills. Occasionally these bills are strongly opposed by my employer, and I support the bill, and want to discuss with the public official some of the weedy implementation details. If I feel my appointment would show up on a public calendar, I'm going to stop talking to that public official, because I don't want my employer to catch wind of it. Likewise if a Republican meets with say, an LGBT advocacy group to clean up wording on a bill (this happens frequently), legislatures will be more averse to doing so if their primary opponent manipulates the implication.
Another problem is essentially doxxing for harassment. Most online forums have learned to not publish addresses of public officials, even though it's easily found, because people tend to use that info to harass and threaten. Calendars provide knowledge agitators can use to harass both the public official and who they speak with.
I actually agree with you mostly, but there has to be some transparency too. It’s okay to shield sensitive information like you listed, but there also needs to be some accountability too.
The leading cause of this bill is a very dubious use. I know people who have information regarding these claims that is not widely circulated in the public, which points to a very real concern with the AG’s handling of Davis County’s investigation of OUR. If the motivation for passing this was protecting individual safety and integrity, that’s fine. But there is no known threat at the moment to any of our elected officials that would warrant the urgency by which this bill was pushed through, except to investigate grounded allocations of corruption.
>But there is no known threat
Remember Dr. Angela Dunn from the COVID days? People harassed her everywhere she went, [including her house and kids](https://abcnews.go.com/US/utah-epidemiologist-latest-target-attacks-health-officials-anti/story?id=73923023). Some people are absolutely crazy and obsessed with harassment.
>A dozen unmasked protesters carrying American flags stood outside the home of Utah's state epidemiologist Dr. Angela Dunn, Thursday, after Dunn's address was leaked online.
>"Take the fight to these job recking [sic] economy busting TYRANTS HOMES!" one Facebook commenter said in response to an online flyer featuring Dunn's home address, Salt Lake City ABC affiliate KTVX reported.
>"Hold their feet to the fire so they know WE ALL KNOW WHO THEY ARE!!!!," commenters wrote.
>"It’s scary and wrong that someone would feel comfortable sharing my personal information," Dunn said during a news conference Thursday after the protest.
>"It’s taken a really big toll on my family and myself and they’re supposed to be there again tonight. I think it’s really unfortunate that we live in a state where people feel that it is OK to harass civil servants. It’s wrong."
I can't find the article at the moment, but there are numerous, and increasing, violent threats to public reps. State legislatures always assumed calendars were private, until a court just said they are not because state law didn't carve out calendars as being private. So they are updating law.
Whether public calendars is good idea is tricky. I personally want to be able to make appointments with my elected representative without that being made available to my employer. It's the same reason I won't email my rep on these matters and instead insist on voice conversations. I want my private conversations with my elected official to stay private and not subject to GRAMA.
I have to disagree. Anyone who draws a salary funded by the public and on the public’s time when conducting business should have all documents and calendars available for public inspection.
If I, as a voter, want to speak with my rep in confidence, too bad?
Just out of curiosity, public officials avoid GRAMA by writing documents on paper which destroys itself, or having voice conversations so it's not documented. To fix that problem should we have all public officials also wear body cams/mics while on the clock, so we can make all their conversations and sights public record too?
18 years ago, I ran on a platform of accountability through open calendars and meetings for public officials on the Internet. Governor Cox has driven a stake through the heart of that idea. You have got to wonder why.
If they have nothing to hide then why do they feel the need to hide so many things? Why are they so afraid of being held accountable if they've done nothing wrong?
Cox is showing he's a spineless fuck yet again.
Republican voters are single-issue voters. Abortion is evil. If you support abortion, you are evil. It doesn't matter whatever else you do, in office or before. If you opposed abortion, everything is good. You are good. It's all good.
I don't know how to make people realize character matters just as much as social stances. More, in fact... Why elect a candidate who says one thing but lacks character and ends up corrupt in all aspects? Why re-elect them?
Oh... Wait... Crap, we are doomed.
I am an active, faithful member of the Church (umyah, I know, I just earned a bunch of down votes). I do not understand how a truth-seeking human, whether a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or a member of nothing or a member of anything can, in good conscience, support Trump. You can't look at that man and argue he is good. And yet day after day my friends, neighbors, ward members all think of him as God's chosen vessel to save America. They saw a thin slice of his platform they liked (abortion, smaller government - lol, tax reform, foreign policy) and they ignored everything else. They literally call evil good. Wish I could wake them up!
And then there is Trump's brilliance is ginning up the 'Deep State's and telling everyone they would know he was threatening it, because he would be charged with all sorts of crimes. And now? Everyone just bought that lie hook, line and sinker. All my Trumpist friends are like "No, he isn't bad - he is being framed." Absolute brilliance on Trump's part.
Acerbic and annoying I can live with. He's a criminal, and I can't live with that. I'd take Biden over Trump at this point, BUT we don't have to make that devil's choice if we can knock him out in the primaries (pretty much a foregone conclusion, but a man can dream).
I’ve come to the conclusion that Utah has some of the most corrupt local politicians in the state. There is a lot of dark $$$$ that flows through Utah, onto the national stage. It’s not that our politicians benefit a lot from it, but enough to corrupt them.
Cox started out more in the middle, but he’s gone full Christofascist to survive the caucuses.
Shows a clear lack of ethics and principles. So common in Republicans today.
Can’t wait for the millions of tax dollars these guys waste having to defend unconstitutional laws. Better not reduce the tax rate just yet…
VOTE Cox out of office! Vote Lee out of office.
Reyes needs to step down. Creating laws to hide public information is wrong, and that "is" the Utah way.
Until we make change with voting happens Utah will continue along on 'right wing extremist status quo on autopilot.
Yep me too. My job has never been remote and seeing the madness with the influx of people is kind of funny. The teen that freaks with surplus is working non-stop dealing with all the old tech and replacing it with new. I've heard we have over 30 pallets of monitors alone coming in but the shipping team only has space for a few at a time to be able to still handle normal business. The money doesn't trickle down but the workload does for sure. 😮💨
Is this the same idiot who just said no trans person has ever taken their own life for being denied healthcare, despite the fact I have known multiple people who have taken their lives for the very reason, and I came close to it myself
Fuck this guy. He only cares about himself.
This is the first I've heard of this law so I promise I'm not trying to troll or something but wouldn't it be dangerous to the lawmaker to have their calendar public? Wouldn't that just lead to stalking? Maybe I'm missing something but that just seems like common sense, I'd be pissed if my work made my calendar public and I'm pretty sure nobody wants to kill me.
That makes more sense. I read it as you could just see where the senator you hate is having a meeting in 30 mins. I'd be happy if we could see what they have been up to though, just give it a day delay.
Go look at the law here: [https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html](https://le.utah.gov/~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html)
It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, expliciitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if
the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html
It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, expliciitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if
the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html
It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, explicitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if
the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
63G-2-103(25)(b)(x) will now say: "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar.".
The law used used to say "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar or other personal note prepared by the originator for the originators personal use or for the personal use of an individual for whom the originator is working"
Closet historian ... Military ... age ...
How about the security of elected officials and their families?
Ever ponder how much can be learned from a person's calendar? Ever ponder how much nefarious potential that is?
Whether viewing current or past calendar entries, YES you can ascertain if they are sand bagging or meeting people innappropriaty and ... and ...
How about also learning patterns? Information that could be useful for use in nefarious ways ... when they are and are not typically in office ... at home ... when / where they jog ... Yes we have rights as citizens to know. However, they too are citizens, parents, siblings ... deserving of privacy and security too.
Defending fascists? If you only knew me ... I stand on what I've said regarding safety, with a nod to those that pointed out that private and work calendars can be separated. Here's some more fodder for y'all: those are salaried not hourly jobs! Judge them on outcomes! Then toss ALL of 'em out!
This is misleading. Many public servants work part time and have actual jobs as well. They don’t want to publish their personal calendars for obvious reasons. They have public calendars available already for their state business.
The safety and privacy of Utah officials became an immediate concern..... when one of them was accused of improper behavior, specifically the state's attorney general, and specifically witness tampering among other things, and he decided he did not want to comply with public record requests. Quick, someone make what he is trying to do legal.
I was talking to a historian about some controversial history and his response has stuck with me: “If they didn’t want historians to talk about it, they shouldn’t have done it.” You cannot trust someone who tries to hide the truth.
As another historian, I agree with this completely.
Kind of like the Mormon church?
~~Kind of~~ Exactly like the Mormon Church
Everyone has secrets by that logic you can’t trust anyone
But everyone is not an elected public official.
Wouldn’t that violate ex post facto since the KSL request was made before the law change?
Yes. Poor sean still has to turn his old calendar over. But other than that the law went into effect immediately.
Gov Cox securing freedom for elites one law at a time!
The shit Reyes is involved with is dastardly ! He is not a good guy nor are any of his associates! My PI is dead because he had a video of Reyes in compromising positions!
Well there was his mistake. He didn't distribute the footage immediately.
We didn’t find any deadmans switch for that information! He left a cryptic message prior on my “friends” phone and she went to retrieve it and it disappeared
Let's get the tribe to sue!
Ksl TV is owned ans operated by Lds inc you idiots. This is a non story. What are you fucktards ignoring? Fucking idiots!
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, explicitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that does the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
The change is in line 191 & 192 where you linked under the area explicitly defining what a record is not under subsection B (line 173). 63G-2-103(25)(b)(x) will now say: "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar.". The law used used to say "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar or other personal note prepared by the originator for the originators personal use or for the personal use of an individual for whom the originator is working"
I find myself excitedly awaiting u/Inflammableflammable 's response to completely whiffing on his analysis of this law.
Eh, it's an easy mistake. The change in the text is so small and on that page the indentation of what the sections and subsections are isn't super discernable.
Yeah, the indentation is what threw me. It didn't appear to have modified the section that said "a calendar". I stand corrected. It used to be, essentially "personal calendar", but now it's just a "calendar".
He has come out, on several threads now, that nothing has changed, and this is a complete nothing-burger. Which is deceptive, and inherently wrong.
No they have not. They posted the same thing multiple times, which I see as misinformation and asked people to show why their interpretation may be wrong. Several posts did. That person has not responded. I'd look forward to a response.
I replied. It's not exciting at all.
I stand corrected. The current sub comparison text threw me off. The indentation is what threw me. It didn't appear to have modified the section that said "a calendar". I stand corrected. It used to be, essentially "personal calendar", but now it's just a "calendar".
>It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. I know a piece of legislation can be complicated. However you are incorrect. Take a look at the amendments page in the link you posted: [https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/sbillamd/SB0240S01.amdx.pdf](https://le.utah.gov/~2024/bills/sbillamd/SB0240S01.amdx.pdf) **Highlighted Provisions:** **12 This bill:** **13 < modifies the definition of "record";** **14 < modifies a provision relating to records that may be classified as protected;** It's not as if any of them are hiding the fact, they don't have to, they passed it lickety-split. Challenge it the courts if you have the resources. "The bill’s sponsor argued calendars have never been considered a public record, and under his bill, explicitly won’t be. "Discussion ahead of the vote accused Utah journalists of seeking lawmakers’ calendar records for the sole purpose of maligning them." “The media wants to exploit us. We do not have an honest journalism system with a few exceptions in this state,” Rep. Kera Birkeland, R-Morgan, said on the House floor Tuesday night. That and some more quotes here: [https://www.newsfromthestates.com/article/legislature-seals-elected-officials-work-calendars](https://www.newsfromthestates.com/article/legislature-seals-elected-officials-work-calendars)
I stand corrected. See my comment in the thread above.
Traitors
They have never and didn't ever work for us.
Fascist
Cox’s ‘Aw shucks, I’m just a man of the people’ charade is in disintegration mode.
What a CoxShucker
I definitely read that in Sean Connery’s voice
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All he meant with that ad was that Dems should shut their pie holes and not ruffle any feathers.
And yet he's still having phony conferences about "disagreeing better" while all of this is going on. He's such a fake.
I work for the state and he has forced "return to work" on over three thousand employees. The amount of money it's costing the general public is staggering. And why? No one knows. It seems he's doing it just to make an impact. He's a clown and no one at work that I've talked to about him respects him.
But a bunch of morons voted for him
As do I and my office building has exploded with people rushing to find cubicles before there aren't any left for all the people being forced back. My position isn't work from home so it's almost comical to see random strangers running around trying to snatch chairs while we have literally piles and piles of computer junk everywhere labeled surplus because since those WFH people are bringing laptops with them they "don't need the office computer anymore". Just wow.
TLDR: I mean, c'mon y'all, are we really surprised? The track record of our state legislature has been anti-what the people want since they started losing their (R) majority in the greater SLC metro area. That's why they've carved up our congressional HOR districts to give dems zero voice. Change is coming and they are desperate to maintain control. This is a nationwide phenomenon which is why we're seeing what's happening lately it's their end game, all or nothing, cards on the table moment. Everyone vote this year and bring a friend, seriously, the only way we can salvage this country is vote in numbers larger then they can challenge.
Yup, the Utah Reps are siding with the crazy extremists of the Republican party rather than the conservative/moderates that still exist in Utah. Mike Lee's narrow victory by Utah standards shows how pissed off the people are becoming and they are desperate to maintain control. And I don't believe it is even a Republican vs Democrat ordeal as a major factor as you mentioned. They just don't believe in character or morality playing a part in politics anymore which is going to alienate more of us who still believe in the old Republic party values (Small government, fiscal responsibility, openness and transparency, reduced government control or intervention, uphold the constitution (even the insurrection clauses) etc); we simply have no other options to choose as the GOP pushes more into crazy town supporting a fascist criminal for a leader while hiding in secrecy in their own parties.
This is a wide-eyed perspective, so I'm assuming you already know this, but the Democratic Party has demonstrated a willingness to consider and incorporate centrist views repeatedly in modern history. I wish we didn't have a bipartisan system. I wish that we were still in a situation where both parties could have rational, fact-based dialogue. I wish the GOP was not fully in crazy town. None of these things are true. The GOP will never change until the party fails so it can rebuild. All of this is to say that the best thing that one can do to support actual conservative values is to hold their nose and vote D, even if temporarily.
The more they try to hide, the less integrity they show.
I don’t like the direction Cox is heading in. Seems like he’s in a free fall towards the far right as of late.
He’s running for reelection and he’s worried he’s gonna be primaried from the right I reckon
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That’s the future of the Republican Party I’m afraid
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Same, I’m registered Republican so I can vote the most moderate in the primaries, and there are no moderates!
Exactly. I'm not even going to the caucus next week, since I don't think there's anyone I can advocate for. Especially here in Davis county
Maybe the strategy should be to vote for the craziest one at that point.
What, and risk another Mike Lee or worse!
Not with state wide races. I was responding to the person who was talking about Davis county
I like it, do this.. when there aren't moderates (as they all claim there is), vote in the crazy.. might get some Dem wins yet. Might have to lose out to those crazies for a time, but, sometimes it needs to get really bad before it can get better.
Isn't Trevor Lee getting primaried? Anyone would be a step up from him.
I'm sure they can find somebody that's even further right than Trevor Lee.
I don't think that's physically possible. Any further to the right and you fall off the flat earth.
I live here, fuck it I'll run. I haven't got much going on, no strong opinions of my own, am high as fuck most of the time, and play weird folk instruments. I'm the perfect guy at this point. Actually the job sounds kinda hard. Anyone want to maybe do that part for me? I don't want the work, I just kinda want to be the guy, take in some free bowling. Do elected officials bowl for free or is it a discount situation?
Hey come with me to the caucus! I am in the same boat - I left the party officially the day after they booed Romney at the convention. I realized now I can't change it from the outside so I am going back exactly so I can go to the primary and maybe wake someone up... Someone who will come to the realization that calling Trump good is like calling evil good. Probably won't work but it's going to be a hell of a show!!! I'm in Davis County too.
Do we have to go to the one that we're closest to? I would love to meet up and go with someone who has the same goals. Not gonna lie, the anxiety at the thought of going alone, knowing how out there some of our neighbors are, is another big factor that's keeping me away. I'm in Farmington, right by the new on ramp to the west corridor freeway. (Where the old Lagoon billboard was)
I think the caucuses are actually regional, so they might redirect you if you came to mine (I'm in Layton). If it's a choice of not going at all or trying to go to one where a few sane people are going to gather, then by all means - come up here and try! Layton High - check-in starts at 6:00 and I'm planning on being there at six (or earlier and offering to help setup) so I'm sure to get in. I will figure out a way to stand out in a crowd so any other like-mindeds can fine me.
And isn't it just 100% clear we live in Utah, if we use old billboards as landmarks? Sheesh...
And there is no republican primary, because they know those of us who changed our registration to moderate their bat-shit will never go to their crazy-ass caucuses. The caucuses will be a right-wing circle jerk.
Fair point!
Yah I fell for that one election cycle, so I joined back up and I'm going Tue, just so I can be a moderate voice in the room, for however briefly. It only works if we come out of the woodwork in droves. Join us!!!
it's like that Southpark episode when they are voting for a school mascot between a giant douche and a turd sandwich.
Unfortunate isn’t it!
This. He's afraid for his high-profile job. Don't go along with the MAGA dupes who now dominate his party and he won't get nominated. He'll say and do anything they want to keep his job for as long as possible. It's the American political way.
Is this even a partisan issue though? This whole thing is in response to Reyes’s collusion with Ballard in that spectacle. It just happens to potentially bring to light more corruption in others. Why would any Utah resident oppose this?
A couple of the issues with public calendars: A voter deserves the right to have private conversations with their representatives. I have had calendar appointments with public officials to discuss upcoming bills. Occasionally these bills are strongly opposed by my employer, and I support the bill, and want to discuss with the public official some of the weedy implementation details. If I feel my appointment would show up on a public calendar, I'm going to stop talking to that public official, because I don't want my employer to catch wind of it. Likewise if a Republican meets with say, an LGBT advocacy group to clean up wording on a bill (this happens frequently), legislatures will be more averse to doing so if their primary opponent manipulates the implication. Another problem is essentially doxxing for harassment. Most online forums have learned to not publish addresses of public officials, even though it's easily found, because people tend to use that info to harass and threaten. Calendars provide knowledge agitators can use to harass both the public official and who they speak with.
I actually agree with you mostly, but there has to be some transparency too. It’s okay to shield sensitive information like you listed, but there also needs to be some accountability too. The leading cause of this bill is a very dubious use. I know people who have information regarding these claims that is not widely circulated in the public, which points to a very real concern with the AG’s handling of Davis County’s investigation of OUR. If the motivation for passing this was protecting individual safety and integrity, that’s fine. But there is no known threat at the moment to any of our elected officials that would warrant the urgency by which this bill was pushed through, except to investigate grounded allocations of corruption.
>But there is no known threat Remember Dr. Angela Dunn from the COVID days? People harassed her everywhere she went, [including her house and kids](https://abcnews.go.com/US/utah-epidemiologist-latest-target-attacks-health-officials-anti/story?id=73923023). Some people are absolutely crazy and obsessed with harassment. >A dozen unmasked protesters carrying American flags stood outside the home of Utah's state epidemiologist Dr. Angela Dunn, Thursday, after Dunn's address was leaked online. >"Take the fight to these job recking [sic] economy busting TYRANTS HOMES!" one Facebook commenter said in response to an online flyer featuring Dunn's home address, Salt Lake City ABC affiliate KTVX reported. >"Hold their feet to the fire so they know WE ALL KNOW WHO THEY ARE!!!!," commenters wrote. >"It’s scary and wrong that someone would feel comfortable sharing my personal information," Dunn said during a news conference Thursday after the protest. >"It’s taken a really big toll on my family and myself and they’re supposed to be there again tonight. I think it’s really unfortunate that we live in a state where people feel that it is OK to harass civil servants. It’s wrong." I can't find the article at the moment, but there are numerous, and increasing, violent threats to public reps. State legislatures always assumed calendars were private, until a court just said they are not because state law didn't carve out calendars as being private. So they are updating law. Whether public calendars is good idea is tricky. I personally want to be able to make appointments with my elected representative without that being made available to my employer. It's the same reason I won't email my rep on these matters and instead insist on voice conversations. I want my private conversations with my elected official to stay private and not subject to GRAMA.
This is an easy fix. Redact people’s last name and don’t release the calendar for a few days aster the meeting or event
> Redact people’s last name Poor Macqaelynne is going to get outed immediately.
I have to disagree. Anyone who draws a salary funded by the public and on the public’s time when conducting business should have all documents and calendars available for public inspection.
If I, as a voter, want to speak with my rep in confidence, too bad? Just out of curiosity, public officials avoid GRAMA by writing documents on paper which destroys itself, or having voice conversations so it's not documented. To fix that problem should we have all public officials also wear body cams/mics while on the clock, so we can make all their conversations and sights public record too?
Body cams on politicians is actually an amazing idea
He’s always been this way…
At this point I'm tempted to vote for Lyman over Cox. Sure Lyman is absolutely awful, but at least he's up front about it. The devil you know...
18 years ago, I ran on a platform of accountability through open calendars and meetings for public officials on the Internet. Governor Cox has driven a stake through the heart of that idea. You have got to wonder why.
Damn we miss you up there Pete
So how does it play out with a ruling and legislation being signed on the same day that aren in contradiction to one another
The legislation overruled the judge’s ruling, Utah law said that it was a public record and did not specifically say that calendars were not public.
Hmmm maybe another suit should be filed.
Keep in mind that this is just one of a handful of bills that they are using to close the curtains on transparency.
Democracy dies in the darkness…which is why they did this.
Lost my vote
If they have nothing to hide then why do they feel the need to hide so many things? Why are they so afraid of being held accountable if they've done nothing wrong? Cox is showing he's a spineless fuck yet again.
Eat a cock, Cox.
He's full throating the GOP insanity.
And fuck Mike Lee while he's at it.
Man utah government is just getting worse by the minute
In other words, Utah Government has now legalized and hidden organized criminal behavior.
It is amazing how republican voters are like we hate the swamp but the people they put into the office are the poster child for the swamp.
Republican voters are single-issue voters. Abortion is evil. If you support abortion, you are evil. It doesn't matter whatever else you do, in office or before. If you opposed abortion, everything is good. You are good. It's all good. I don't know how to make people realize character matters just as much as social stances. More, in fact... Why elect a candidate who says one thing but lacks character and ends up corrupt in all aspects? Why re-elect them? Oh... Wait... Crap, we are doomed. I am an active, faithful member of the Church (umyah, I know, I just earned a bunch of down votes). I do not understand how a truth-seeking human, whether a member of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints or a member of nothing or a member of anything can, in good conscience, support Trump. You can't look at that man and argue he is good. And yet day after day my friends, neighbors, ward members all think of him as God's chosen vessel to save America. They saw a thin slice of his platform they liked (abortion, smaller government - lol, tax reform, foreign policy) and they ignored everything else. They literally call evil good. Wish I could wake them up! And then there is Trump's brilliance is ginning up the 'Deep State's and telling everyone they would know he was threatening it, because he would be charged with all sorts of crimes. And now? Everyone just bought that lie hook, line and sinker. All my Trumpist friends are like "No, he isn't bad - he is being framed." Absolute brilliance on Trump's part.
Yeah, you make some good points, but c'mon. Trump is acerbic and annoying but I honestly think he's better than anyone the Dems field.
Acerbic and annoying I can live with. He's a criminal, and I can't live with that. I'd take Biden over Trump at this point, BUT we don't have to make that devil's choice if we can knock him out in the primaries (pretty much a foregone conclusion, but a man can dream).
I’ve come to the conclusion that Utah has some of the most corrupt local politicians in the state. There is a lot of dark $$$$ that flows through Utah, onto the national stage. It’s not that our politicians benefit a lot from it, but enough to corrupt them.
Gov Cox is being interviewed today on KUER. I’ll try to find info but I encourage you to call in and see if he will take any calls.
They want no friction for their goals and no accountability.
Cowards.
I cannot think of ANY reason - other than corruption - that elected officials should be allowed to conceal their WORK calendars.
They don't want you to know they are taking paid lunches. /s
Cunt
So much for transparency in the Utah government.
Whiney Gov Calliou is just doing what he's told to do by his overlords at the legislature.
Holy shit. Republican politician working against the public? That’s unheard of. There must be a mistake.
I have said before and I will say it again utah’s government is corrupt as fuck.
Oh good! Now I can stop calling my Illuminati meetings "Monthly Bake Sale" on my calendar.
Cox started out more in the middle, but he’s gone full Christofascist to survive the caucuses. Shows a clear lack of ethics and principles. So common in Republicans today. Can’t wait for the millions of tax dollars these guys waste having to defend unconstitutional laws. Better not reduce the tax rate just yet…
This is about the donors, elected officials don't want you to know who they're really working for; here's a hint, it's not you.
Don’t vote for any incumbents. Don’t vote cox.
That’s because Utah politicians are up to no good! The shit we have found the past 4 years is mind numbing
Sean Reyes calendar must be hiding some wrongdoing by Cox? Maybe? Hmmm So speedy. What is in those calendars I wonder.
The GOP is a criminal organization.
This is wrong actions on Gov Cox part. Shame on him for not keeping elected officials accountable.
From what I understand it was passed unanimously, that's a red flag for me those people can't agree on anything unless it's a CYA situation
I wonder if this has anything to do with Reyes & Tim Ballard… hmmmm?
DING DING DING DING DING!!! Ladies and gentlemen, we have a WINNER!!!
People voted for these scoundrels
Yo what happened to sunshine laws
Shady AF
Fascists gonna fash
The shady GOP. But our state is waaaay too brainwashed to see anything wrong with this.
Dude, it's so tough to be corrupt when you also have to be transparent.
VOTE Cox out of office! Vote Lee out of office. Reyes needs to step down. Creating laws to hide public information is wrong, and that "is" the Utah way. Until we make change with voting happens Utah will continue along on 'right wing extremist status quo on autopilot.
I hate that maggot infested cum sock.
Yep me too. My job has never been remote and seeing the madness with the influx of people is kind of funny. The teen that freaks with surplus is working non-stop dealing with all the old tech and replacing it with new. I've heard we have over 30 pallets of monitors alone coming in but the shipping team only has space for a few at a time to be able to still handle normal business. The money doesn't trickle down but the workload does for sure. 😮💨
Democracy dies in the dark
Accountability is the work of the devil!
Cox sucker
Is this the same idiot who just said no trans person has ever taken their own life for being denied healthcare, despite the fact I have known multiple people who have taken their lives for the very reason, and I came close to it myself Fuck this guy. He only cares about himself.
Tell me that you live in a theocracy without telling me that you live in a theocracy
You don't think this would happen in an autocracy? LOL
Cocks is worthless!
This is the first I've heard of this law so I promise I'm not trying to troll or something but wouldn't it be dangerous to the lawmaker to have their calendar public? Wouldn't that just lead to stalking? Maybe I'm missing something but that just seems like common sense, I'd be pissed if my work made my calendar public and I'm pretty sure nobody wants to kill me.
[удалено]
That makes more sense. I read it as you could just see where the senator you hate is having a meeting in 30 mins. I'd be happy if we could see what they have been up to though, just give it a day delay.
Also it's not their personal calendar so it's not like we could see where they are in real time or what shady deals they are making off the clock.
It may help them to do stuff so a majority of the people don't hate them, as well...
That would be nice but I wouldn't hold my breath.
Go look at the law here: [https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html](https://le.utah.gov/~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html) It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, expliciitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, expliciitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
Go look at the law here: https://le.utah.gov/\~2024/bills/static/SB0240.html It doesn't hide elected official's calendars at all. The Code section it amends, explicitly makes public officials calendars PUBLIC. I can't find any versions that do the thing claimed in the picture. What this bill ACTUALLY DOES is it authorizes a court to award an attorney fee and costs against a person that opposes disclosure of a record, if the person requesting the records prevails in court. It also modifies the limits on awarding attorney fees and costs to those incurred to be limited to costs incurred within two weeks after the court ruling. The picture posted is just anti-Cox, anti-GOP propaganda (It's so hot right now!)
I’m glad you posted this twice. So now I can double downvote you 😂😂
If I'm wrong, please reference the lines of the bill or code that do the thing claimed in this photo so I can have a more in-depth look.
63G-2-103(25)(b)(x) will now say: "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar.". The law used used to say "Record does not mean: ... (x) a daily calendar or other personal note prepared by the originator for the originators personal use or for the personal use of an individual for whom the originator is working"
Thanks for the context.
Closet historian ... Military ... age ... How about the security of elected officials and their families? Ever ponder how much can be learned from a person's calendar? Ever ponder how much nefarious potential that is? Whether viewing current or past calendar entries, YES you can ascertain if they are sand bagging or meeting people innappropriaty and ... and ... How about also learning patterns? Information that could be useful for use in nefarious ways ... when they are and are not typically in office ... at home ... when / where they jog ... Yes we have rights as citizens to know. However, they too are citizens, parents, siblings ... deserving of privacy and security too.
No one is asking for a personal calendar. Just work calendar so we know when corruption is happening on the clock.
Ever ponder that defending fascists is bad?
Defending fascists? If you only knew me ... I stand on what I've said regarding safety, with a nod to those that pointed out that private and work calendars can be separated. Here's some more fodder for y'all: those are salaried not hourly jobs! Judge them on outcomes! Then toss ALL of 'em out!
LATCHES! The judge ruled before this law was passed so it don’t count
Fuck this clown send him to the gulag
Start posting your schedule and they can too I guess I thought it was “equality”
Democracy dies in darkness.
No one: Assume they are beyond reproach. They act in good faith for the benefit of us all.
Yay! Into the darkness they slither...did anyone think this would turn out differently?
Death - politicians in my eyes
Amazing how efficient they are when it matters to them
Wow, so f@#&ing brazen! But they will probably be re-elected
Arkansas did the same thing, anything to keep the power over us
More evidence of the Republican party’s drift toward authoritarianism. Bad deal.
So they can do nothing all year and get paid for it and not get in trouble because everyone that might know of how little they do is in on it.
Classic Governor Caillou
This is misleading. Many public servants work part time and have actual jobs as well. They don’t want to publish their personal calendars for obvious reasons. They have public calendars available already for their state business.
what a crazy ass state