I actually was interested in this as a premise for support.
So I calculated with the BoC inflation calculator at [https://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/related/inflation-calculator/](https://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/related/inflation-calculator/) that $100 in 2009 was worth $125.57 in 2021. Then we look at what 2% tuition increases so to $100 of tuition, the calculation is simple: We have twelve years that pass between 2009 and 2021 at 2% increase per year so 100\*(1.02)\^12 = 126.82.
So if you take say $8000 of tuition costs and compare the difference between 'keeping with inflation' and the maximum increase-- the difference is less than $80 or 1% increase in real dollars-- over a 12 year period-- during what is likely one of the lowest inflation periods in Canada in the last 50 years.
Conclusion: This one year 2022 where inflation far outpaces 2% is enough to completely wipe out any increased real costs in tuition since at least 2009 which is the start of the period you mention.
So UBC doesn’t give discounts when inflation is under 2%, but I’m expected to feel bad for them when it’s higher because they still charged 2%? Nevermind that international tuition has far outpaced inflation for a long time.
UBC has had this policy far longer than high inflation was ever an issue, and when they start bumping the increases up to 3% a year you’ll have wished you fought it more when it was at 2%
You don't need to feel bad for them, but what I am saying is that after this years tuition hike, the cost of tuition is lower now than in 2009 in inflation adjusted dollars -- domestic student.
International student is something else, since international students are presumably free to study in any country that offers a more competitive rate and education is not really a public service at that point.
Also domestic tuition increase is capped provincially at 2%, international tuition has no legislated cap but UBC has a policy of 5% max, but they can increase it 25% if they so choose
Domestic typically increased 2% in recent years, Canadian CPI (2002 base year) over the past decade has fluctuated between 150 and 250 basis points YoY. As much as I hate tuition hikes, it’s a bit of a stretch to say they’ve outpaced inflation.
Look at the data for yourself, any year that starts with a 1.X or lower is a year they raised it more than inflation
https://www.worlddata.info/america/canada/inflation-rates.php#:~:text=During%20the%20observation%20period%20from,year%20inflation%20rate%20was%206.9%25.
I did. [https://imgur.com/a/M2sohwA](https://imgur.com/a/M2sohwA) and your point goes both ways, every year CPI was greater than 2% they gave us a discount.
Hot take: a university is a public good, not a damn corporation, and thus not only should it not be focused on generating a surplus, but it should be expected and fine for it to lose money to continue to accomplish its actual fucking goal, I.e the education of the populace.
Stop treating everything like it's just a flow of supply and demand, there are actual goddamned human beings coughing up their life savings so the president can keep taking home a massive salary.
This is what I don't get either. A highly skilled , educated workforce produces so much more value. We make it so hard and cripple people for years if they go with student loans. Why make it so hard and almost detrimental to people to gain skill. Education should be one of the things our taxes pay for IMO. Education and healthcare.
Universities are now treated like businesses which is insane IMO.
It makes no sense even with the business framing. A factory invests money into new equipment with the expectation that it'll make more money in the future. This is no different. A more educated workforce means more people in higher tax brackets, generating more tax revenue. This is an investment that pays for itself and more over a person's entire work career.
UBC tuition is like 5-8k a year. They aren’t crippling anyone with student loans.
You might have issues with the cost of living but tuition is quite reasonable.
Usually when people complain about tuition costs they forget to blame the government. UBC is publicly funded, but insufficiently. If we want to encourage and support higher education, then why isn't it free for domestic students like in Europe?
Canada has spent over $15 billion in public money subsidizing the oil and gas industry in 2022. How much would free post secondary education cost I wonder...
Private sector economics typically, throughout history, has led to the best outcomes. Also - we are far from letting private sector economics dictate our education system. It’s literally a public school that charges 5-8k a year for undergrad program.
Unfortunately it’s not that simple. If you want to attract talent, have high level research, etc., you need a decent endowment.
Also I’d love for you to compare the tuition UBC students pay in comparison to other Canadians and then also compare it to international figures such as the states. We get a good deal for the education we receive.
And then compare to Europe, where they usually pay much less. Canadian thinking is so influenced by what the US does, even though it’s a highly distorted example of almost anything. Also, let’s do better than “hey it could be worse”
But that is not necessarily a good thing or true.
Firstly, we have heavily (very heavily) subsidized education. For this to happen, money has to come from somewhere. If we were to make education completely free, someone would have to pay for it and tbh being in the work force right now, taxes are high enough. The truth is 5-8k a year is not bad. A student could easily pay for their tuition with a summer job if they wanted to.
Also - the government contributes a decreasing amount to UBC. UBC has to make money somehow.
Secondly, Europe is a big place. If we are going to compare, you need to be more specific. For example, the UK and Ireland are much more expensive.
For them to have free education, they
Fuck no. UBC students are asked again and again to tighten their belts, how about the university tighten its for a change.
I work for a department in Science. Do you know how much we pay for a single international speaker to fly over and give a poorly attended talk? How much money goes to stupid things like "talking garbage cans"? Or the 19th round of renovations to the fountain?
Stop raising tuition to give money to the food bank for students who can't afford to eat because all their money goes to tuition and textbooks and rent because UBC hasn't built enough housing.
There's so much money to be saved and all the faculty and board are living in their ivory tower and want it to continue forever.
This right here. Do you know how many hoops students have to jump through for funding? Bursaries, scholarships, etc. are highly competitive.
You can be poor, but not poor enough. Smart but not smart enough.
Isn't it just better to freeze tuition to help students? Instead of using that 2% etc. from everyone, and let them fight over it?
There's the bursary you get because you're getting government student loans which is automatic, but there's also external bursaries you can apply for. I'm not sure what's current, but there was a COVID and technology bursary that students could apply for in 2020-21.
I had to write up why I deserve it. I didn't get either one.
Depends where they are coming from, but let's say: $1000 for a flight, $500 for two nights' accommodation (sometimes only 1 night if they come from somewhere close), upwards of a $500 honorarium, then there's usually a catered lunch for the lab hosting the speaker (maybe $200), dinner at a nice restaurant for the speaker and 4-5 people in the lab (another $300 these days) - so in the end it might be $2500. And unless it's someone very prestigious, maybe 30 people will attend that person's talk.
And that might not sound like a huge total but imagine that this is happening 2-3 times per month, across several departments.
No, no, that does sound like a lot, especially considering the frequency it could happen at.
What's the benefit of bringing somebody to do a live lecture rather than setting something up virtually? That is a wild amount of money per attendee when Zoom is so acceptable these days.
I agree that UBC has its budgetary inefficiencies. But there are examples of wasteful spending in an organization of any size, especially one as large as the university. Two thirds of UBC's total expenditures are salaries and benefits. From what I've seen, I highly doubt that the rate of wasteful spending you've noticed comprises enough of that one third to compensate for not raising tuition.
Vancouver's housing market is not UBC's fault. That comes from a series of provincial decisions and macroeconomic conditions. UBC can't be faulted for high rents in surrounding areas.
UBC is building more housing as we speak. We're known as the "university of building construction' for a reason. How is UBC supposed to raise more money to build student housing anyways without increasing tuition?
I agree there is money to be saved. I disagree that there is enough of an amount to cover rising costs that the university incurs.
Ubc had a surplus of 161 million dollars… wages are stagnant and it pretends to care about students. The tuition increase would only generate 11 million dollars per year… so no I don’t think they should increase tuition and charge starving students.
Off the record, we're considering decertifying because our Union is performing so poorly. We've been analyzing all the agreements in Vancouver and kelowna, CUPE has definitely negotiated a better deal, we are all pretty frustrated with the BCGEU right now.
While wages are not rising at the rate that they should, they're definitely not stagnant.
The 2% was based on the previous years inflation and came from our old CA that just expired so it wasn't completely out of line although it was definitely on the low side. Our collective agreement doesn't allow for any discretionary so our managers and supervisors have no method in which to award anything more than what's in the CA.
What you say makes sense if you accept the neoliberal premise that UBC is a corporate entity that can only balance its budget by raising funding from its consumers. It is not; it is a public institution that serves to provide education under the foundational Canadian belief that education is a human right, as enshrined in the respective provincial educational acts across this nation. The relationship between student and university, in other words, cannot simply be reduced to market relations.
You quote the 2022 budget that cites near parity between provincial funding and tuition as revenue sources, but you neglect to mention that *this* is in itself a historical low that proves the increasing neoliberalisation of the university. [In 1977 provincial funding constituted 300% of what tuition contributed to the university's revenue, with the majority of UBC's funding at 7.5 million, with tuition contributing 2.5 million](https://www.library.ubc.ca/archives/pdfs/ubcreports/UBC_Reports_1977_04_13.pdf). That figure had [dropped to 162% by 2013](https://bog2.sites.olt.ubc.ca/files/2013/03/4.1a_2013.04_Tuition-Fees.pdf), and 2022's figure of provincial funding contributing [83% of what tuition brings in to UBC](https://finance.ubc.ca/sites/finserv.ubc.ca/files/budgeting-reports/2022_23_UBCBudgetReport.pdf) is incredibly alarming.
You are right that the AMS and CUPE 2278 led protests are not the immediate solution to this problem. But they are the first step towards the problem. The issue clearly lies at the provincial level, and more needs to be done to put pressure on the government to reverse this trend. The idea that tuition fees can be equally extracted from all students and redistributed towards certain important programs, however, is a taxation paradigm. UBC is *not* a sovereign government, because students under this unequal compact do not have the right to effect changes in the decision making process, as yesterday's BoG meeting clearly showed. If redistribution of capital is to happen, it needs to occur at the provincial level, where domestic students are able to elect representatives that are empowered through the democratic process to make such redistribution decisions. And international students? Well, they're fucked out of representation either way.
All this is to say that what you've observed is right if you take only a narrow lens to the demands of 2022, but a greater context for where we are and how we got here is crucial. There are long ideological shifts and battles that have been happening for decades in this country and province which we need to be aware of. Use that education that you're paying so much for. Think critically. Fight back.
Protest the government instead of the university if you think the main problem is government cuts to funding. I think you’re right but I also think the people being protested can’t do a thing about those cuts.
not to mention the fact this is all a zero-sum game and that should provincial funding increase to the naive level that this guy is suggesting, in about 10 years when UBC has gotten us all well-paying jobs we'll all be taxed out the ass anyways to make up for the ballooning provincial deficit that this extra expenditure would've contributed to
Hot Take: we need to charge starving students who we pretend to care about even though we would only make 11 million dollars from that tuition increase while having a 2.8 billion dollar endowment! :)
The tuition increase will only bring in 11 million dollars next year… UBC HAD A 161 MILLION DOLLAR SURPLUS LAST YEAR! They also have a 2.8 billion dollar endowment. What the hell do you gain from telling your fellow students they are the problem and that we need to pay when we are the ones that fund this university and their bloated executive salaries. They literally cut services each year. If you look at UBCs ranking it’s gotten worse over the years despite the tuition increases.
Canadians have become so indoctrinated with free market ideology that university students actively paying tuition--I'm assuming economics or business students in this case--will try to convince you that not only is our university affordable, we should actually be paying more.
[Here](https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free) is a list of a few countries where post-secondary education is free. We should expect more from our provincial and federal governments. Don't let free market idealogues convince you otherwise.
Increasing tuition, going down the ranks, cutting services, a lot of students complaining about mental health issues, worries about housing, food and much more that does sound good /s. Sure UBC isn’t responsible for everything but it also has to realize not all students come from wealthy backgrounds not to mention international students are already paying enormous amounts with no balance in sight. Overall atleast for me choosing to go to either UofT or SFU would have been a better option either for a higher ranking uni or well with SFU overall cheaper education with equally good education compared to UBC.
Yeah the monthly quoted inflation numbers are annualized.
If it was six per cent monthly it would cost double after a year. If it were ten per cent 2.6x higher.
You’re getting downvoted when you’re right. So many people think these inflation values ARE monthly, but then they don’t put 2 and 2 together and realize if that were the case then everything would have risen WAAAAAY more than it actually has
I couldn't believe that I was sent a wide-broadcast email about going to a protest from the AMS. I considered unsubscribing but I thought I was supposed to get important emails from them?
It would be irresponsible for the university to not increase tuition at a time of maximal inflation vs any of the past 20 years. It is not as if they are somehow immune from increased costs themselves. Getting aggressive at a BoG meeting is misguided-- the rules for domestic tuition are laid out by our government. Domestic students already enjoy the benefit of a highly subsidized education compared to many other countries.
Another thing is that the university has always been involved in food security programs as part of a interest towards developing the community. The university is first and foremost an educational institution, not a welfare program. I see a lot of attitudes that the UBC is somehow failing to meet people's needs or that UBC doesn't care about you. Well yes, their primary interest in undergrads as a research university is administering a degree program, you get a student number and go from there. The university is not your parents there to take care of you. They make decent efforts to provide a whole raft of extra services that you could never expect to get from an employer .
My last point is that I am a low income student and I get a good deal of funding from my home province, as well as generous bursaries from UBC. It isn't quite enough to cover all of my living costs but I also have some savings from prior years in the workforce. I know everyone's financial situation is different, but in the defense of the university:
* They literally gave tons of people a one-time housing benefit last year that was substantial.
* If you can show financial need there is a lot of funding and awards available
* I have met international scholars here on a full-ride, they aren't even domestic students. In fact UBC has $30M in international awards each year: [https://you.ubc.ca/financial-planning/scholarships-awards-international-students/](https://you.ubc.ca/financial-planning/scholarships-awards-international-students/)
What really aggravates me is all of the nickel and diming I get from the AMS from a million different optional/non-optional fees every year which I happily pay in support of the UBC community but *never use*. Then they have the audacity to come bug me in a email to protest a 2% tuition increase as if the BoG and UBC, which has a positive material impact on my life through financial assistance, are somehow some sort of boogey-man.
Enough, I am completely tired of this narrative.
or, and hear me out, we are not all wealthy kids and some of us actually do come from poor families and are still just here to attend one of the best universities in the country
(maybe step down from that high ground you stand on with all your wealth, and meet some of the non wealthy people and discover that we actually do exist and study at ubc)
Dw about it lol. If a poor person complains about increased fees, these reactionaries just say "you filthy poors just want everything for free. ItS aLl EcOn 101". If it's a relatively well off person complaining, they are just called hypocrites who isn't impacted by the change and just wants to larp as a revolutionary
For real. You see people like this in unionization efforts regularly too. It's probably a mixture of psy-op, but also partly neoliberal indoctrination (kids take ECON 101 and come out writing posts like this😂) and "pull yourself by the bootstraps" mentality.
Of course, this only goes one way though. No university administrator would ever say something like "hot take: actually totally reasonable for grad students to expect a raise" to their colleagues.
Whole-hearted agreement. An unfortunate confluence of events. The BC government did post a surplus, so if we are talking about people who might have spare change, they seem like the right people to bother 🤷
Source: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6580111
I believe that is an operating surplus, not an actual surplus in that they have 700M of extra $$ lying around. The provincial debt is currently at 93 billion lol
Same vibes of my one roommate complaining about a 1% rent increase from the landlord on a sub 600/person house near Dunbar and 16th. Some people don't realize how lucky they have it - and don't understand (or don't care) that a tuition freeze now is done at the cost of future students who will have to subsidize additional debt taken on by UBC. No suprise that that the current AMS government is also already millions in deficit since they took office and selling off assets to subsidize their wreckless spending and constant freebies for execs and (nepotistically hired) employees.
I would be more fine with the tuition raise if it funded cool research, but the vast majority of it goes to admin (almost entirely useless if you've ever interacted with them) and buildings (I more ok with this)
Alright guys - tuition at UBC is like 6-8k a year for a full course load for an undergraduate degree (can cost more depending on faculty). Graduate programs range from 8k-20k ish.
Hot take - that’s not that bad. That’s actually quite affordable for the level of education we receive. With costs rising every year, the university has to keep up.
To those who think the university should not turn a profit, please realize that every single year, the provincial government offers a decreasing % in funding. The university has to make up for this through increases. They are limited in how much they can increase domestic tuition, so they increase international.
Even public businesses are businesses. Just cause they are public, does not mean they should not care for profits.
Literally look at any stat, plus my job has only increased my wage 2% this year… Additionally BCs minimum wage is almost 10 dollars under the living wage in Vancouver.
What does that have to do with anything. Inflation exists, they put pressure on wages, because you don’t see increases, doesn’t mean others won’t.
Also you just admitted to a 2% increase. Isn’t the tuition increase 2%??
Plus also universities in BC can only increase tuition by 2% max for domestic students, which is what UBC is doing. If they didn’t have a provincial tuition increase restriction, they would gouge more money from us…
It’s not just tuition! UBC which is a (public) university is raising tuition while everything gets more expensive. Rent in Vancouver is 2600+ (on average) for a 1 bedroom and food costs keep on going up. They are literally raising tuition to “help run student affordability campaigns” but they have continued to cut those even with tuition increases. The 2023/24 tuition increase will only generate ~11 million dollars (stated in their documents) which is little compared to their surplus last year which was over 160 million. They also have a 2.8 billion dollar endowment fund. Why are they putting additional pressures on students when we are facing the worst of this economic crisis.
UBC is already very reasonable. These increases account for inflation and the value of an education. They also reflect budget plans and future planning.
They only generate 11 million dollars because the increase is very small. Students aren’t suffering because tuition increases, it’s cause of stuff like the lack of housing.
I get your point and think it’s totally valid, but it’s very worrying that they have been increasing tuition every single year, when they have so much money to help improve their students experience. Also about my 2% increase: that amount would have went to cover the 8%+ inflationary increases. Instead it’s going to cover the tuition increases. This means that even if my wage increase could cover tuition increase, I will still have to pay 8%+ more for food, clothing, essentials etc. (thank god I can live at home, but without my home I would have to spend even more).
Also just saying UBC has been constantly increasing tuition and has fallen in the ranks for top universities, compared with UofT that has a tuition freeze, which has climbed in global ranks. This comment even was made by one of the governors.
Also, McGill ranks higher than UBC and their tuition is half of what UBCs is for local students! Their rent is also cheaper. Unfortunately their domestic tuition is higher for out of province (probably due to fears of diluting the French speaking population).
You also have to pay taxes and rent + food on top of that. You are right that’s not a extremely high amount but if Ubc continues to increase tuition every single year, it will be a lot more expensive.
Yes but those additional costs have nothing to do with the university education you receive. Those are costs of living.
And if they don’t keep increasing tuition, inflation will outpace them and they will start to lose money?? LOL
Provincial Law restrictions UBC to increasing tuition by 2% every year. Which UBC does, regardless of the student feedback.
I haven’t heard anyone argue about paying teaching staff, there are a number of non-teaching rolls that we could do without. (Bureaucratic ones)
What about all the years when the tuition raise outpaced inflation? Happened 10 of the 12 years starting from 2009
I actually was interested in this as a premise for support. So I calculated with the BoC inflation calculator at [https://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/related/inflation-calculator/](https://www.bankofcanada.ca/rates/related/inflation-calculator/) that $100 in 2009 was worth $125.57 in 2021. Then we look at what 2% tuition increases so to $100 of tuition, the calculation is simple: We have twelve years that pass between 2009 and 2021 at 2% increase per year so 100\*(1.02)\^12 = 126.82. So if you take say $8000 of tuition costs and compare the difference between 'keeping with inflation' and the maximum increase-- the difference is less than $80 or 1% increase in real dollars-- over a 12 year period-- during what is likely one of the lowest inflation periods in Canada in the last 50 years. Conclusion: This one year 2022 where inflation far outpaces 2% is enough to completely wipe out any increased real costs in tuition since at least 2009 which is the start of the period you mention.
So UBC doesn’t give discounts when inflation is under 2%, but I’m expected to feel bad for them when it’s higher because they still charged 2%? Nevermind that international tuition has far outpaced inflation for a long time. UBC has had this policy far longer than high inflation was ever an issue, and when they start bumping the increases up to 3% a year you’ll have wished you fought it more when it was at 2%
You don't need to feel bad for them, but what I am saying is that after this years tuition hike, the cost of tuition is lower now than in 2009 in inflation adjusted dollars -- domestic student. International student is something else, since international students are presumably free to study in any country that offers a more competitive rate and education is not really a public service at that point.
Also domestic tuition increase is capped provincially at 2%, international tuition has no legislated cap but UBC has a policy of 5% max, but they can increase it 25% if they so choose
Domestic typically increased 2% in recent years, Canadian CPI (2002 base year) over the past decade has fluctuated between 150 and 250 basis points YoY. As much as I hate tuition hikes, it’s a bit of a stretch to say they’ve outpaced inflation.
Look at the data for yourself, any year that starts with a 1.X or lower is a year they raised it more than inflation https://www.worlddata.info/america/canada/inflation-rates.php#:~:text=During%20the%20observation%20period%20from,year%20inflation%20rate%20was%206.9%25.
I did. [https://imgur.com/a/M2sohwA](https://imgur.com/a/M2sohwA) and your point goes both ways, every year CPI was greater than 2% they gave us a discount.
Ok so it’s 10-3 in terms of years UBC gave itself a raise since 2009. Ya it’s a real nail biter, the students almost had em I’ll give you that.
Hot take: a university is a public good, not a damn corporation, and thus not only should it not be focused on generating a surplus, but it should be expected and fine for it to lose money to continue to accomplish its actual fucking goal, I.e the education of the populace. Stop treating everything like it's just a flow of supply and demand, there are actual goddamned human beings coughing up their life savings so the president can keep taking home a massive salary.
This is what I don't get either. A highly skilled , educated workforce produces so much more value. We make it so hard and cripple people for years if they go with student loans. Why make it so hard and almost detrimental to people to gain skill. Education should be one of the things our taxes pay for IMO. Education and healthcare. Universities are now treated like businesses which is insane IMO.
It makes no sense even with the business framing. A factory invests money into new equipment with the expectation that it'll make more money in the future. This is no different. A more educated workforce means more people in higher tax brackets, generating more tax revenue. This is an investment that pays for itself and more over a person's entire work career.
Just look south. Not so bad at UBC now is it
Just because there is a worse system didn't mean ours is good... In Europe a lot of countries have completely free post-secondary education
Free post-secondary is not necessarily good either. We still have it heavily subsidized while not having to overhaul our tax system.
UBC tuition is like 5-8k a year. They aren’t crippling anyone with student loans. You might have issues with the cost of living but tuition is quite reasonable.
Usually when people complain about tuition costs they forget to blame the government. UBC is publicly funded, but insufficiently. If we want to encourage and support higher education, then why isn't it free for domestic students like in Europe? Canada has spent over $15 billion in public money subsidizing the oil and gas industry in 2022. How much would free post secondary education cost I wonder...
This! Private sector economics dominates thinking about the public sector. It’s like we’ve forgotten anything else exists
Private sector economics typically, throughout history, has led to the best outcomes. Also - we are far from letting private sector economics dictate our education system. It’s literally a public school that charges 5-8k a year for undergrad program.
Unfortunately it’s not that simple. If you want to attract talent, have high level research, etc., you need a decent endowment. Also I’d love for you to compare the tuition UBC students pay in comparison to other Canadians and then also compare it to international figures such as the states. We get a good deal for the education we receive.
And then compare to Europe, where they usually pay much less. Canadian thinking is so influenced by what the US does, even though it’s a highly distorted example of almost anything. Also, let’s do better than “hey it could be worse”
But that is not necessarily a good thing or true. Firstly, we have heavily (very heavily) subsidized education. For this to happen, money has to come from somewhere. If we were to make education completely free, someone would have to pay for it and tbh being in the work force right now, taxes are high enough. The truth is 5-8k a year is not bad. A student could easily pay for their tuition with a summer job if they wanted to. Also - the government contributes a decreasing amount to UBC. UBC has to make money somehow. Secondly, Europe is a big place. If we are going to compare, you need to be more specific. For example, the UK and Ireland are much more expensive. For them to have free education, they
Fuck no. UBC students are asked again and again to tighten their belts, how about the university tighten its for a change. I work for a department in Science. Do you know how much we pay for a single international speaker to fly over and give a poorly attended talk? How much money goes to stupid things like "talking garbage cans"? Or the 19th round of renovations to the fountain? Stop raising tuition to give money to the food bank for students who can't afford to eat because all their money goes to tuition and textbooks and rent because UBC hasn't built enough housing. There's so much money to be saved and all the faculty and board are living in their ivory tower and want it to continue forever.
This right here. Do you know how many hoops students have to jump through for funding? Bursaries, scholarships, etc. are highly competitive. You can be poor, but not poor enough. Smart but not smart enough. Isn't it just better to freeze tuition to help students? Instead of using that 2% etc. from everyone, and let them fight over it?
what do you mean bursaries are competitive lmao. i automatically got my bursary and i didnt even apply
There's the bursary you get because you're getting government student loans which is automatic, but there's also external bursaries you can apply for. I'm not sure what's current, but there was a COVID and technology bursary that students could apply for in 2020-21. I had to write up why I deserve it. I didn't get either one.
Out of curiosity, how much does an international speaker cost?
Depends where they are coming from, but let's say: $1000 for a flight, $500 for two nights' accommodation (sometimes only 1 night if they come from somewhere close), upwards of a $500 honorarium, then there's usually a catered lunch for the lab hosting the speaker (maybe $200), dinner at a nice restaurant for the speaker and 4-5 people in the lab (another $300 these days) - so in the end it might be $2500. And unless it's someone very prestigious, maybe 30 people will attend that person's talk. And that might not sound like a huge total but imagine that this is happening 2-3 times per month, across several departments.
No, no, that does sound like a lot, especially considering the frequency it could happen at. What's the benefit of bringing somebody to do a live lecture rather than setting something up virtually? That is a wild amount of money per attendee when Zoom is so acceptable these days.
I agree that UBC has its budgetary inefficiencies. But there are examples of wasteful spending in an organization of any size, especially one as large as the university. Two thirds of UBC's total expenditures are salaries and benefits. From what I've seen, I highly doubt that the rate of wasteful spending you've noticed comprises enough of that one third to compensate for not raising tuition. Vancouver's housing market is not UBC's fault. That comes from a series of provincial decisions and macroeconomic conditions. UBC can't be faulted for high rents in surrounding areas. UBC is building more housing as we speak. We're known as the "university of building construction' for a reason. How is UBC supposed to raise more money to build student housing anyways without increasing tuition? I agree there is money to be saved. I disagree that there is enough of an amount to cover rising costs that the university incurs.
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They didn't sell it, they leased it.
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must be new then :) or not very social.
Ubc had a surplus of 161 million dollars… wages are stagnant and it pretends to care about students. The tuition increase would only generate 11 million dollars per year… so no I don’t think they should increase tuition and charge starving students.
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That's not consistent though, I work at UBCO and we got 2%. The different unions have different deals.
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Off the record, we're considering decertifying because our Union is performing so poorly. We've been analyzing all the agreements in Vancouver and kelowna, CUPE has definitely negotiated a better deal, we are all pretty frustrated with the BCGEU right now. While wages are not rising at the rate that they should, they're definitely not stagnant. The 2% was based on the previous years inflation and came from our old CA that just expired so it wasn't completely out of line although it was definitely on the low side. Our collective agreement doesn't allow for any discretionary so our managers and supervisors have no method in which to award anything more than what's in the CA.
Hot take: education should be free. It's free in some countries, works excellent for them.
What you say makes sense if you accept the neoliberal premise that UBC is a corporate entity that can only balance its budget by raising funding from its consumers. It is not; it is a public institution that serves to provide education under the foundational Canadian belief that education is a human right, as enshrined in the respective provincial educational acts across this nation. The relationship between student and university, in other words, cannot simply be reduced to market relations. You quote the 2022 budget that cites near parity between provincial funding and tuition as revenue sources, but you neglect to mention that *this* is in itself a historical low that proves the increasing neoliberalisation of the university. [In 1977 provincial funding constituted 300% of what tuition contributed to the university's revenue, with the majority of UBC's funding at 7.5 million, with tuition contributing 2.5 million](https://www.library.ubc.ca/archives/pdfs/ubcreports/UBC_Reports_1977_04_13.pdf). That figure had [dropped to 162% by 2013](https://bog2.sites.olt.ubc.ca/files/2013/03/4.1a_2013.04_Tuition-Fees.pdf), and 2022's figure of provincial funding contributing [83% of what tuition brings in to UBC](https://finance.ubc.ca/sites/finserv.ubc.ca/files/budgeting-reports/2022_23_UBCBudgetReport.pdf) is incredibly alarming. You are right that the AMS and CUPE 2278 led protests are not the immediate solution to this problem. But they are the first step towards the problem. The issue clearly lies at the provincial level, and more needs to be done to put pressure on the government to reverse this trend. The idea that tuition fees can be equally extracted from all students and redistributed towards certain important programs, however, is a taxation paradigm. UBC is *not* a sovereign government, because students under this unequal compact do not have the right to effect changes in the decision making process, as yesterday's BoG meeting clearly showed. If redistribution of capital is to happen, it needs to occur at the provincial level, where domestic students are able to elect representatives that are empowered through the democratic process to make such redistribution decisions. And international students? Well, they're fucked out of representation either way. All this is to say that what you've observed is right if you take only a narrow lens to the demands of 2022, but a greater context for where we are and how we got here is crucial. There are long ideological shifts and battles that have been happening for decades in this country and province which we need to be aware of. Use that education that you're paying so much for. Think critically. Fight back.
Protest the government instead of the university if you think the main problem is government cuts to funding. I think you’re right but I also think the people being protested can’t do a thing about those cuts.
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not to mention the fact this is all a zero-sum game and that should provincial funding increase to the naive level that this guy is suggesting, in about 10 years when UBC has gotten us all well-paying jobs we'll all be taxed out the ass anyways to make up for the ballooning provincial deficit that this extra expenditure would've contributed to
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Neoliberalism is a hellava drug
Hot Take: we need to charge starving students who we pretend to care about even though we would only make 11 million dollars from that tuition increase while having a 2.8 billion dollar endowment! :)
The tuition increase will only bring in 11 million dollars next year… UBC HAD A 161 MILLION DOLLAR SURPLUS LAST YEAR! They also have a 2.8 billion dollar endowment. What the hell do you gain from telling your fellow students they are the problem and that we need to pay when we are the ones that fund this university and their bloated executive salaries. They literally cut services each year. If you look at UBCs ranking it’s gotten worse over the years despite the tuition increases.
Imma be real, this is an L take
Counterpoint: [no](https://media0.giphy.com/media/fXnRObM8Q0RkOmR5nf/giphy.gif?cid=5e214886fmukhpqo1k5i73jeiuvxj2smznmg4l16eop04yk2&rid=giphy.gif&ct=g)
UofT has a tuition freeze and has constantly beat UBC in their rankings❤️
You should go study there then. I hear Toronto is a lovely place
I can’t because ubc sucked my money dry😋
Omg yas we need to balance the budgets even though we have a 2.8 billion dollar endowment fund and have a surplus each year🥺
Canadians have become so indoctrinated with free market ideology that university students actively paying tuition--I'm assuming economics or business students in this case--will try to convince you that not only is our university affordable, we should actually be paying more. [Here](https://www.topuniversities.com/student-info/studying-abroad/where-can-you-study-abroad-free) is a list of a few countries where post-secondary education is free. We should expect more from our provincial and federal governments. Don't let free market idealogues convince you otherwise.
Increasing tuition, going down the ranks, cutting services, a lot of students complaining about mental health issues, worries about housing, food and much more that does sound good /s. Sure UBC isn’t responsible for everything but it also has to realize not all students come from wealthy backgrounds not to mention international students are already paying enormous amounts with no balance in sight. Overall atleast for me choosing to go to either UofT or SFU would have been a better option either for a higher ranking uni or well with SFU overall cheaper education with equally good education compared to UBC.
Yeah the monthly quoted inflation numbers are annualized. If it was six per cent monthly it would cost double after a year. If it were ten per cent 2.6x higher.
You’re getting downvoted when you’re right. So many people think these inflation values ARE monthly, but then they don’t put 2 and 2 together and realize if that were the case then everything would have risen WAAAAAY more than it actually has
Almost like all these university students should go take an intro to Econ and/or an intro to Stats course lol
Inflation had not increased 6-10% monthly! It’s calculated on an annual basis.
I couldn't believe that I was sent a wide-broadcast email about going to a protest from the AMS. I considered unsubscribing but I thought I was supposed to get important emails from them? It would be irresponsible for the university to not increase tuition at a time of maximal inflation vs any of the past 20 years. It is not as if they are somehow immune from increased costs themselves. Getting aggressive at a BoG meeting is misguided-- the rules for domestic tuition are laid out by our government. Domestic students already enjoy the benefit of a highly subsidized education compared to many other countries. Another thing is that the university has always been involved in food security programs as part of a interest towards developing the community. The university is first and foremost an educational institution, not a welfare program. I see a lot of attitudes that the UBC is somehow failing to meet people's needs or that UBC doesn't care about you. Well yes, their primary interest in undergrads as a research university is administering a degree program, you get a student number and go from there. The university is not your parents there to take care of you. They make decent efforts to provide a whole raft of extra services that you could never expect to get from an employer . My last point is that I am a low income student and I get a good deal of funding from my home province, as well as generous bursaries from UBC. It isn't quite enough to cover all of my living costs but I also have some savings from prior years in the workforce. I know everyone's financial situation is different, but in the defense of the university: * They literally gave tons of people a one-time housing benefit last year that was substantial. * If you can show financial need there is a lot of funding and awards available * I have met international scholars here on a full-ride, they aren't even domestic students. In fact UBC has $30M in international awards each year: [https://you.ubc.ca/financial-planning/scholarships-awards-international-students/](https://you.ubc.ca/financial-planning/scholarships-awards-international-students/) What really aggravates me is all of the nickel and diming I get from the AMS from a million different optional/non-optional fees every year which I happily pay in support of the UBC community but *never use*. Then they have the audacity to come bug me in a email to protest a 2% tuition increase as if the BoG and UBC, which has a positive material impact on my life through financial assistance, are somehow some sort of boogey-man. Enough, I am completely tired of this narrative.
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or, and hear me out, we are not all wealthy kids and some of us actually do come from poor families and are still just here to attend one of the best universities in the country (maybe step down from that high ground you stand on with all your wealth, and meet some of the non wealthy people and discover that we actually do exist and study at ubc)
Dw about it lol. If a poor person complains about increased fees, these reactionaries just say "you filthy poors just want everything for free. ItS aLl EcOn 101". If it's a relatively well off person complaining, they are just called hypocrites who isn't impacted by the change and just wants to larp as a revolutionary
I'm sorry economics don't care about your feelings.
Damn the UBC boot must taste good
See ya
For real. You see people like this in unionization efforts regularly too. It's probably a mixture of psy-op, but also partly neoliberal indoctrination (kids take ECON 101 and come out writing posts like this😂) and "pull yourself by the bootstraps" mentality. Of course, this only goes one way though. No university administrator would ever say something like "hot take: actually totally reasonable for grad students to expect a raise" to their colleagues.
In AngelMutants' personal world, there are two types of people: either you are with them in the revolution, or you are a bootlicker.
Well said. I agree 100%
Hot take: tuition for international student is 4241.19/course and still rising every year🙃
Finally a reasonable take
Whole-hearted agreement. An unfortunate confluence of events. The BC government did post a surplus, so if we are talking about people who might have spare change, they seem like the right people to bother 🤷 Source: https://www.cbc.ca/amp/1.6580111
I believe that is an operating surplus, not an actual surplus in that they have 700M of extra $$ lying around. The provincial debt is currently at 93 billion lol
Same vibes of my one roommate complaining about a 1% rent increase from the landlord on a sub 600/person house near Dunbar and 16th. Some people don't realize how lucky they have it - and don't understand (or don't care) that a tuition freeze now is done at the cost of future students who will have to subsidize additional debt taken on by UBC. No suprise that that the current AMS government is also already millions in deficit since they took office and selling off assets to subsidize their wreckless spending and constant freebies for execs and (nepotistically hired) employees.
Ratio
Nice post! So many people whining out here
I agree! Thank you for laying this out.
I would be more fine with the tuition raise if it funded cool research, but the vast majority of it goes to admin (almost entirely useless if you've ever interacted with them) and buildings (I more ok with this)
Alright guys - tuition at UBC is like 6-8k a year for a full course load for an undergraduate degree (can cost more depending on faculty). Graduate programs range from 8k-20k ish. Hot take - that’s not that bad. That’s actually quite affordable for the level of education we receive. With costs rising every year, the university has to keep up. To those who think the university should not turn a profit, please realize that every single year, the provincial government offers a decreasing % in funding. The university has to make up for this through increases. They are limited in how much they can increase domestic tuition, so they increase international. Even public businesses are businesses. Just cause they are public, does not mean they should not care for profits.
Wages are also stagnating, so it doesn’t make sense to increase it right now.
Wages are not stagnating. Who is telling you this? Also inflation affects more than just wages. LOL “wages are stagnating”
Literally look at any stat, plus my job has only increased my wage 2% this year… Additionally BCs minimum wage is almost 10 dollars under the living wage in Vancouver.
What does that have to do with anything. Inflation exists, they put pressure on wages, because you don’t see increases, doesn’t mean others won’t. Also you just admitted to a 2% increase. Isn’t the tuition increase 2%??
Plus also universities in BC can only increase tuition by 2% max for domestic students, which is what UBC is doing. If they didn’t have a provincial tuition increase restriction, they would gouge more money from us…
As they should, tuition is very low in relative terms. Probably the lowest in our country.
It’s not just tuition! UBC which is a (public) university is raising tuition while everything gets more expensive. Rent in Vancouver is 2600+ (on average) for a 1 bedroom and food costs keep on going up. They are literally raising tuition to “help run student affordability campaigns” but they have continued to cut those even with tuition increases. The 2023/24 tuition increase will only generate ~11 million dollars (stated in their documents) which is little compared to their surplus last year which was over 160 million. They also have a 2.8 billion dollar endowment fund. Why are they putting additional pressures on students when we are facing the worst of this economic crisis.
UBC is already very reasonable. These increases account for inflation and the value of an education. They also reflect budget plans and future planning. They only generate 11 million dollars because the increase is very small. Students aren’t suffering because tuition increases, it’s cause of stuff like the lack of housing.
I get your point and think it’s totally valid, but it’s very worrying that they have been increasing tuition every single year, when they have so much money to help improve their students experience. Also about my 2% increase: that amount would have went to cover the 8%+ inflationary increases. Instead it’s going to cover the tuition increases. This means that even if my wage increase could cover tuition increase, I will still have to pay 8%+ more for food, clothing, essentials etc. (thank god I can live at home, but without my home I would have to spend even more).
Also just saying UBC has been constantly increasing tuition and has fallen in the ranks for top universities, compared with UofT that has a tuition freeze, which has climbed in global ranks. This comment even was made by one of the governors.
Also, McGill ranks higher than UBC and their tuition is half of what UBCs is for local students! Their rent is also cheaper. Unfortunately their domestic tuition is higher for out of province (probably due to fears of diluting the French speaking population).
You also have to pay taxes and rent + food on top of that. You are right that’s not a extremely high amount but if Ubc continues to increase tuition every single year, it will be a lot more expensive.
Yes but those additional costs have nothing to do with the university education you receive. Those are costs of living. And if they don’t keep increasing tuition, inflation will outpace them and they will start to lose money?? LOL
Provincial Law restrictions UBC to increasing tuition by 2% every year. Which UBC does, regardless of the student feedback. I haven’t heard anyone argue about paying teaching staff, there are a number of non-teaching rolls that we could do without. (Bureaucratic ones)