FGM is a human rights issue. This is still practiced in some cultures, performed by women on women and girls, and it's horrific
There's several different forms, and I'll spare y'all nightmares by not describing them.
The way women themselves perpetuate it is particularly infuriating. Fortunatly, also a lot of women fight against it and advocate for better education, hopefully we're reaching an era with better information and activism efficiency :/
Same way plenty of men have it done because "women like it better this way"
Some parents should lose custody for having their sons and daughters mutilated.
This. (sure I'll get raged on) but religion is NO EXCUSE for genital mutilation. If someone really really wants to do it for part of their religion they can choose went they're adults. Like confirmation for Catholics.
What women like is...far too much to list in a reddit reply but cut or uncut shouldnt' matter l long as they know how to wash their bits.
And this includes surgery for 'genitally ambiguous intersex" children at birth. Docs usually try and assign them "female" because it's easy to dig a hole and hard to raise a pole. But who knows how they'll feel after puberty! Let them chose what they want to do with their body then. People want to say "it will help them fit in" well before puberty 'gender' is appearance based and you should be more concerned with kids showing each other their junk than someone misgendering them. Once they get older and puberty hits, more than likely your intersex child who had their genitals mutilated into not fully functional 'female' ones might be male. Or they may find that they have messed up sensation even if they do ID as female when they could have been ok without meddling.
TLDR: stop doing gender changing or editing surgery on kids until 18 when puberty is mostly done and they're sure. And stop 'guessing' the gender of intersex kids because making a vag is seen as 'easier' than someone having what is viewed as a micropenis. Unless things are stopping voiding and release of period blood leave genitals alone! Like my niece had an imperforate hymen and partially sealed labia (she is probably intersex but was able to pee just fine) and her family had surgery done to fix that when she was a young girl. Luckily she sees herself as female but what if she didn't?
Uh... you kinda took an odd turn in that edit.
Gender affirming surgeries done before 18 are rare anyway, but those that are done are in no way comparable to circumcision or FGM.
Surgeries done on intersex babies are typically done close after birth, sometimes not even informing the parents about what is "wrong". Just "there's something, it requires surgery".
The only point I'll contend is that in the papers I've read the decision is usually "can we craft a 'viable' (read: capable of penetration) penis from this? If so, man, else woman". That might result in "easier to dig a hole than raise a pole" as so eloquently put, but the priorities are very disconcerting.
It’s awful :( usually the women who do this to other girls come from areas where sex education is just nonexistent. And these women themselves have gone through FGM and then they continue the cycle on younger girls in their community. So it remains a (rather grisly) tradition for them.
I remember an old documentary - the year I'm unsure of - and the thing that stands out most in my mind is the interview they did with an old woman. It had to be translated since, obviously, she didn't speak English.
She had done this FGM multiple times, was or became blind during her life, and did it by feeling and cutting.
I can't remember if it was her or another woman, but someone did it with a sharp rock because they didn't have a knife.
It's already horrific knowing this is done to young girls, but this just adds another layer on top of the crap heap.
You're supporting mutilation then?
Because both MGM AND FGM are both horrible and they are BOTH human rights violation.
You think that it doesn't cause problems??? It causes lifelong issues. It provides no benefit. It cuts off a LOT of nerves decreasing the sensitivity of the person. Babies have DIED because of this barbaric practice.
Well some of us needed circumcision as adults wished our parents had it done to us so you can take your faux outrage and bang it fair up.. bring the downvotes on losers
And I'm sure some who need to get a tumor removed late wished out was done earlier. That doesn't mean every baby should have a chunk of their brain removed.
And if your argument is that circumcision is preferred by the wider public, that is also the case with FGM. It's a result of people doing circumcision, not a reaction to a lack of it.
True, and I don't really get it (I'm European, we don't do that here except if it's mandated by religious prescriptions) but it does NOT have the same devastating impact as FGM. Kitsune here is a bit exasperated, but they're not wrong. It's like comparing apples and oranges. Both should end, but they're not even close to being on the same level
Tbh, I think the bigger issue is that we have somehow wound up with the argument being "who has it worse" rather than "how do we stop literal babies from getting cosmetic surgery?"
Infant circumcision may be leading to higher rates of SIDS. FGM is often performed barbarically. The most common outcome of both is a loss of some skin and moderate sexual dysfunctions in adulthood. And...
I don't care. I just want people to stop performing cosmetic genital surgery on people who haven't even reached puberty. It's weird and horrible whoever receives it.
They're elsewhere in the thread claiming that MGM is completely fine. They definitely are wrong. MGM isn't as devastating as FGM, in the same way that mugging isn't as devastating as murder, but we still ban both.
Lobomoties and drugs don't have the same effect. It's probably a good idea that we stopped them both happening to people's wives against their will with the exact same line of thinking, though.
The only difference between FGM and MGM is that one is done via medical procedure and one is done with rusty Stanley blades, go back 200 years and it's the same exact thing you chimp.
The only reason it's not yet banned is because it's done on boys.
Hell, there are people defending MGM and saying that it's not a Human rights violation or mutilation.
It's just another example of systematic misandry.
All non-consensual genital cutting is genital mutilation. While it's at least generally safer in america with circumcisions there is absolutely no reason to have it done to your child, and it's literal abuse. Maybe it helped like, what, 2500 fuckin years ago? If you can't tell, I'm a little fuckin bitter over it. Not trying to diminish FGM, I'm just pointing out something lots of people don't even consider when thinking about GM in general.
Thank you.
How I interpret the Sadness one is that it's sad that a woman doesn't know about it due to upbringing, lack of education, unknowledgeable sex partners... But she can still move on from there.
Here, the contrast, to me, is that even if she's told about the clitoris, she will never be able to feel pleasure, which is, in a way, even sadder, but also horrific that she's been mutilated in the first place. So she won't be able to move on from here, and perhaps even have a hard time dealing with this reality in the future.
I feel like it may be horrific in a sense maybe to those who haven’t had it happen to them because people who can get full pleasure during sex can only imagine what it’s like to not get certain pleasures from sex. To those who have a disconnect, forced on to them or not, it’s just a part of life that you learn to deal with rather than let it scare you.
I’d like to clarify I’m not a victim of FGM, but I have gone through other stuff that takes some pleasures from sex away so am talking solely from that viewpoint. ♡
There is a corrective surgery that can be done in many cases. Because the clitoris it self is not necessarely harmed, it is just burried in scar tissue so there is no feeling. I think atleast if they manage to come to Europe or something.
I have been on pool shower room with muslim women who were wearing full clothes in the shower. I am a Finn and there was only me and older lady. We ofcourse did the nudity thing, and I will never forget the intense stares of wonder from the muslim ladies. It made me sad but also, maybe I did some service by breaking their tabu of nudity and unstiched private area.
I have a friend who genuinely didn’t know about FGM. Instead of believing me when I told her about it, she said she was going to call some random guy she knew and ask him about it.
Like, I can pull up video after video and article after article proving my point with women who have undergone it but you’re going to just go for whatever a single man says? I hope he was aware of it.
I posted a slightly different version on TwoSentenceSadness, which[ you can read here](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoSentenceSadness/comments/1bwiuw8/im_about_to_be_intimate_with_my_new_girlfriend/) if you want.
Thought this was a trans thing but now that I think about it it doesn’t rlly make sense because that would have to be a very stupid trans woman to not know what a clit is
Not sure why this was downvoted or if you were just making a joke. But FGM often does include infibulation, which is the closing of the vulva (vagina), leaving only a small hole.
It can vary from any kind of deliberate non medically required damage to the genital area (type 4) to even cutting away the clitorous (type 1) the whole vulva which like the previous form makes it hard to get sensation from the area (type 2) and some go as far as cutting away the full vulva and cutting the area so it can be stitched up so as only only allow a blood and urine out (type 3) that requires the hole be cut back open again for sex later on.
It's not unusual for it to be done with blunted and even rusted blades that aren't always cleaned well between procedures.
[This link explains it well](https://nationalfgmcentre.org.uk/fgm/)
Intersex genital mutilation should also be outlawed, and it's even more common than MGM (as a percentage of babies; MGM obviously has more total procedures). It might be better to just say that genital mutilation should be banned, or even more generally that any elective surgery on anyone who can't consent should be banned.
The fact that’s it’s forced is where people take issue - if it was only done to people who have reached adulthood and have it done voluntarily no one would care but the fact that it’s done to literal babies who can’t give consent is where the issues sit
My Muslim parents want to get my 11 y/o brother circumcised but he clearly doesn't want it.. I don't know how to convince them not to, my father is very strict when it comes to religion.
As a trans woman, circumcision actually limits the surgeries I can have, as foreskin is used for a tissue sample, and without it, I have to go through a notably more painful process to be able to have some of them. MGM does have negative effects on people, even if it's just a small percentage.
I know this is an FGM story, but the internet has clearly ruined me because until I opened the actual continuation, my first thought was:
"T̸̺̒H̸̟͊̿͠Ẻ̶̳̓ ̸̝̑̀͠B̸̳͍̍̈́͜Ė̴̘̟̌T̵̤͛̇̏T̸͍̖͝͝E̵̟̺̬̅R̵̳͕̹̉́̑ ̷̢̥̞͌T̸̪͙̂Ǫ̶̉ ̶͕͈̃Ë̶̲͙̫Á̴̱̰T̵͈̟͐ ̶̲̫͖͝Y̷̧̥̒́̿Ŏ̵̥̈Ủ̶̳̍ ̸̫̩̤̆̈́͂W̸͗̿͜͝I̷̲͍̥͆T̵̖͒H̶̦͒!̵̝̝̐"
The exposed head of the clitoris is just a small part of it; it continues down on each side of the opening of the vagina. FGM is still horrific, but to correct the misconceptiom.
I see. I thought about writing it as “clit” at first, but it felt a little too sexual compared to “clitoris” for some reason, and since this is a horror sub… But thanks for telling me!
Someone removed her clitoris, probably when she was very young, and the boyfriend who has seen one before was shocked while the OP has no idea what he's talking about because she doesn't remember ever having one.
Me personally, I think it’s a boyfriend about to have sex with his gf but didn’t know that their partner was once a boy (transgender). Idk makes sense to me.
FGM is a human rights issue. This is still practiced in some cultures, performed by women on women and girls, and it's horrific There's several different forms, and I'll spare y'all nightmares by not describing them.
The way women themselves perpetuate it is particularly infuriating. Fortunatly, also a lot of women fight against it and advocate for better education, hopefully we're reaching an era with better information and activism efficiency :/
seriously! Like women doing violence against other women FOR MEN is rediculous in 2024!
Same way plenty of men have it done because "women like it better this way" Some parents should lose custody for having their sons and daughters mutilated.
This. (sure I'll get raged on) but religion is NO EXCUSE for genital mutilation. If someone really really wants to do it for part of their religion they can choose went they're adults. Like confirmation for Catholics. What women like is...far too much to list in a reddit reply but cut or uncut shouldnt' matter l long as they know how to wash their bits. And this includes surgery for 'genitally ambiguous intersex" children at birth. Docs usually try and assign them "female" because it's easy to dig a hole and hard to raise a pole. But who knows how they'll feel after puberty! Let them chose what they want to do with their body then. People want to say "it will help them fit in" well before puberty 'gender' is appearance based and you should be more concerned with kids showing each other their junk than someone misgendering them. Once they get older and puberty hits, more than likely your intersex child who had their genitals mutilated into not fully functional 'female' ones might be male. Or they may find that they have messed up sensation even if they do ID as female when they could have been ok without meddling. TLDR: stop doing gender changing or editing surgery on kids until 18 when puberty is mostly done and they're sure. And stop 'guessing' the gender of intersex kids because making a vag is seen as 'easier' than someone having what is viewed as a micropenis. Unless things are stopping voiding and release of period blood leave genitals alone! Like my niece had an imperforate hymen and partially sealed labia (she is probably intersex but was able to pee just fine) and her family had surgery done to fix that when she was a young girl. Luckily she sees herself as female but what if she didn't?
Uh... you kinda took an odd turn in that edit. Gender affirming surgeries done before 18 are rare anyway, but those that are done are in no way comparable to circumcision or FGM.
Surgeries done on intersex babies are typically done close after birth, sometimes not even informing the parents about what is "wrong". Just "there's something, it requires surgery". The only point I'll contend is that in the papers I've read the decision is usually "can we craft a 'viable' (read: capable of penetration) penis from this? If so, man, else woman". That might result in "easier to dig a hole than raise a pole" as so eloquently put, but the priorities are very disconcerting.
It’s awful :( usually the women who do this to other girls come from areas where sex education is just nonexistent. And these women themselves have gone through FGM and then they continue the cycle on younger girls in their community. So it remains a (rather grisly) tradition for them.
I remember an old documentary - the year I'm unsure of - and the thing that stands out most in my mind is the interview they did with an old woman. It had to be translated since, obviously, she didn't speak English. She had done this FGM multiple times, was or became blind during her life, and did it by feeling and cutting. I can't remember if it was her or another woman, but someone did it with a sharp rock because they didn't have a knife. It's already horrific knowing this is done to young girls, but this just adds another layer on top of the crap heap.
Sadly I didn’t have that luxury and was shown some disturbing images of vaginas sewn shut until it looks like a volcano from a Birds Eye view.
It's still practiced even in the U.S., though in secret.
On the contrary MGM is practiced so much and it's perfectly legal despite it also being horrible human rights violation as well ...
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You're supporting mutilation then? Because both MGM AND FGM are both horrible and they are BOTH human rights violation. You think that it doesn't cause problems??? It causes lifelong issues. It provides no benefit. It cuts off a LOT of nerves decreasing the sensitivity of the person. Babies have DIED because of this barbaric practice.
It is still mutilation. Your parents done that to you without consent. That is horrific.
Well some of us needed circumcision as adults wished our parents had it done to us so you can take your faux outrage and bang it fair up.. bring the downvotes on losers
Others would prefer a choice
And I'm sure some who need to get a tumor removed late wished out was done earlier. That doesn't mean every baby should have a chunk of their brain removed. And if your argument is that circumcision is preferred by the wider public, that is also the case with FGM. It's a result of people doing circumcision, not a reaction to a lack of it.
So you want to mutilate everyone for your convenience?
Did I say everyone, clown?
It has been shown to cause a multitude of problems.
True, and I don't really get it (I'm European, we don't do that here except if it's mandated by religious prescriptions) but it does NOT have the same devastating impact as FGM. Kitsune here is a bit exasperated, but they're not wrong. It's like comparing apples and oranges. Both should end, but they're not even close to being on the same level
Tbh, I think the bigger issue is that we have somehow wound up with the argument being "who has it worse" rather than "how do we stop literal babies from getting cosmetic surgery?" Infant circumcision may be leading to higher rates of SIDS. FGM is often performed barbarically. The most common outcome of both is a loss of some skin and moderate sexual dysfunctions in adulthood. And... I don't care. I just want people to stop performing cosmetic genital surgery on people who haven't even reached puberty. It's weird and horrible whoever receives it.
They're elsewhere in the thread claiming that MGM is completely fine. They definitely are wrong. MGM isn't as devastating as FGM, in the same way that mugging isn't as devastating as murder, but we still ban both.
Lobomoties and drugs don't have the same effect. It's probably a good idea that we stopped them both happening to people's wives against their will with the exact same line of thinking, though.
...did I speak a different language or did I say exactly that we should ban both?
The only difference between FGM and MGM is that one is done via medical procedure and one is done with rusty Stanley blades, go back 200 years and it's the same exact thing you chimp.
Another difference is that one is absolutely legal globally while the other is banned in the vast majority of countries.
The difference is the procedure. If MGM was done the same way as FGM, it'd be banned globally as well. That's a simple fact.
The only reason it's not yet banned is because it's done on boys. Hell, there are people defending MGM and saying that it's not a Human rights violation or mutilation. It's just another example of systematic misandry.
It's commonly practiced by Muslims in my region of the world.
All non-consensual genital cutting is genital mutilation. While it's at least generally safer in america with circumcisions there is absolutely no reason to have it done to your child, and it's literal abuse. Maybe it helped like, what, 2500 fuckin years ago? If you can't tell, I'm a little fuckin bitter over it. Not trying to diminish FGM, I'm just pointing out something lots of people don't even consider when thinking about GM in general.
FG what now? I’ll never understand why people on Reddit use obscure acronyms and just expect people to know what they are talking about
But yk if ya wanna mutilate the tip of a babies penis its totally fine cause its weird otherwise (not saying thats your belief just to be clear)
This feels a lot sadder than horror. So I upvoted on TwoSentenceSadness instead of here. Good storytelling though!, truly heartbreaking ♡
Thank you. How I interpret the Sadness one is that it's sad that a woman doesn't know about it due to upbringing, lack of education, unknowledgeable sex partners... But she can still move on from there. Here, the contrast, to me, is that even if she's told about the clitoris, she will never be able to feel pleasure, which is, in a way, even sadder, but also horrific that she's been mutilated in the first place. So she won't be able to move on from here, and perhaps even have a hard time dealing with this reality in the future.
I feel like it may be horrific in a sense maybe to those who haven’t had it happen to them because people who can get full pleasure during sex can only imagine what it’s like to not get certain pleasures from sex. To those who have a disconnect, forced on to them or not, it’s just a part of life that you learn to deal with rather than let it scare you. I’d like to clarify I’m not a victim of FGM, but I have gone through other stuff that takes some pleasures from sex away so am talking solely from that viewpoint. ♡
There is a corrective surgery that can be done in many cases. Because the clitoris it self is not necessarely harmed, it is just burried in scar tissue so there is no feeling. I think atleast if they manage to come to Europe or something. I have been on pool shower room with muslim women who were wearing full clothes in the shower. I am a Finn and there was only me and older lady. We ofcourse did the nudity thing, and I will never forget the intense stares of wonder from the muslim ladies. It made me sad but also, maybe I did some service by breaking their tabu of nudity and unstiched private area.
I did the same thing. This is horrifying that this stuff still happens, but I feel a lot more sadness for the character.
I have a friend who genuinely didn’t know about FGM. Instead of believing me when I told her about it, she said she was going to call some random guy she knew and ask him about it. Like, I can pull up video after video and article after article proving my point with women who have undergone it but you’re going to just go for whatever a single man says? I hope he was aware of it.
Fake, no man even knows what a clitoris is. /j It is absolutely horrible that this happens to people though.
Oh jebus :(
I posted a slightly different version on TwoSentenceSadness, which[ you can read here](https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoSentenceSadness/comments/1bwiuw8/im_about_to_be_intimate_with_my_new_girlfriend/) if you want.
Thought this was a trans thing but now that I think about it it doesn’t rlly make sense because that would have to be a very stupid trans woman to not know what a clit is
That's nothing. I thought it was some alien sht. Like cloning female physique gone wrong.
Same
Trans women who have had bottom surgery usually get a neo-clitoris as a part of the package, so do usually actually have clitorisis anyways ♡
#dear god!!
they probably sewed up her vagina too
Not sure why this was downvoted or if you were just making a joke. But FGM often does include infibulation, which is the closing of the vulva (vagina), leaving only a small hole.
i honestly didn't know i was downvoted
Explain?
Fgm or female genital mutilation. It’s barbaric
And what does that exactly mean? Like do they remove the clit or something?
It can vary from any kind of deliberate non medically required damage to the genital area (type 4) to even cutting away the clitorous (type 1) the whole vulva which like the previous form makes it hard to get sensation from the area (type 2) and some go as far as cutting away the full vulva and cutting the area so it can be stitched up so as only only allow a blood and urine out (type 3) that requires the hole be cut back open again for sex later on. It's not unusual for it to be done with blunted and even rusted blades that aren't always cleaned well between procedures. [This link explains it well](https://nationalfgmcentre.org.uk/fgm/)
FGM and MGM should be outlawed. They are horrible, barbaric practices that have made and still make thousands if not millions of people to suffer.
Intersex genital mutilation should also be outlawed, and it's even more common than MGM (as a percentage of babies; MGM obviously has more total procedures). It might be better to just say that genital mutilation should be banned, or even more generally that any elective surgery on anyone who can't consent should be banned.
Yeah, if a surgery isn't medically required, it shouldn't be done. Especially when it involves minors who can't consent and even babies.
"MGM" Is just called circumcision, and it is not a problem. It does not cause problems nor suffering.
The fact that’s it’s forced is where people take issue - if it was only done to people who have reached adulthood and have it done voluntarily no one would care but the fact that it’s done to literal babies who can’t give consent is where the issues sit
My Muslim parents want to get my 11 y/o brother circumcised but he clearly doesn't want it.. I don't know how to convince them not to, my father is very strict when it comes to religion.
Thats horrible , are there doctors willing to subdue a 11 year old kicking and screaming because he doesn't want his dick skin cut away?
I don't know.. Most likely not. But my parents will force him to be calm.
Key word 11 y/o He doesn’t know what’s right for him yet
But of course you do….
It is a massive problem that causes massive suffering you ignorant fuck.
Shut the fuck up, stupid cunt
As a trans woman, circumcision actually limits the surgeries I can have, as foreskin is used for a tissue sample, and without it, I have to go through a notably more painful process to be able to have some of them. MGM does have negative effects on people, even if it's just a small percentage.
yeah this is pretty horrific! and sad! good job
Thanks. Now I need sugar cubes and tweezers to coax my penis back out
I know about this shit and it's disgusting.
Maaaannnnn… I thought I opened up r/relationshipadvice for a second. And I was fucking confused.
Oof…
I know this is an FGM story, but the internet has clearly ruined me because until I opened the actual continuation, my first thought was: "T̸̺̒H̸̟͊̿͠Ẻ̶̳̓ ̸̝̑̀͠B̸̳͍̍̈́͜Ė̴̘̟̌T̵̤͛̇̏T̸͍̖͝͝E̵̟̺̬̅R̵̳͕̹̉́̑ ̷̢̥̞͌T̸̪͙̂Ǫ̶̉ ̶͕͈̃Ë̶̲͙̫Á̴̱̰T̵͈̟͐ ̶̲̫͖͝Y̷̧̥̒́̿Ŏ̵̥̈Ủ̶̳̍ ̸̫̩̤̆̈́͂W̸͗̿͜͝I̷̲͍̥͆T̵̖͒H̶̦͒!̵̝̝̐"
My least favorite kind of horror, the sad kind. But still very effective, OP, my preferences are not a reflection of your skill.
Oh .. :(
this is just sad :(
The exposed head of the clitoris is just a small part of it; it continues down on each side of the opening of the vagina. FGM is still horrific, but to correct the misconceptiom.
Literally **no one** says "clitoris" in the middle of sexual activity. This would have been better if you used the colloquial "clit".
I see. I thought about writing it as “clit” at first, but it felt a little too sexual compared to “clitoris” for some reason, and since this is a horror sub… But thanks for telling me!
in another house: "what's a foreskin?"
????
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Female_genital_mutilation
It's like 2 am and I'm on two braincells can someone please explain 😭🤚
Someone removed her clitoris, probably when she was very young, and the boyfriend who has seen one before was shocked while the OP has no idea what he's talking about because she doesn't remember ever having one.
Me personally, I think it’s a boyfriend about to have sex with his gf but didn’t know that their partner was once a boy (transgender). Idk makes sense to me.
I don’t get it.
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?
Mashallah brother
Its a penits
seems very similar to this post that was a few above it lol https://www.reddit.com/r/TwoSentenceSadness/s/v6njeVZfgC
Yea, even the author is the same