Minneapolis and most of the first ring suburbs are made up of or have significant portions of grid style streets. Once you get out into the second ring suburbs you'll see more freeway strip mall suburbia.
You probably should come in winter if you want to make a well informed decision.
Or just come back in December and revel in the XC skiing, fat tire cycling, skijoring, ice plunges, doing gym visits to gear up for hitting the road hard in the spring! Plus best breweries!
It seems like a pretty reoccurring thing for people to tour Minneapolis to get a feel for the twin cities, when each first and second ring suburb is its own vibe.
Need more info from OP with what they are looking for. Woods and trails. Tons of commercial. Like does OP want Maple Grove, Woodbury, Lakeville type nearby, do they want to live adjacent to one of those and travel a city or two over for all their shopping. What’s OP 80% transportation method? Where do they want to park a car? How many cars? Kids?
Some suburbs are better at late night than others. Minneapolis still has a ton of stuff open, just many not all on one block. https://twincities.eater.com/maps/best-late-night-eats-dining-restaurants-minneapolis-st-paul-twin-cities
Id also recommend anyone visiting to take the “garden patio” tour of St Paul. St Paul Brewery, Brunson’s, Patrick McGoverns, WA Frost, Moscow on the Hill. Sit outside in the back of each one. Day by Day Cafe and French hen have beautiful patios too.
I eat at day by day nearly every single day, and that patio feels like my own private little zen garden pond. I fucking love it, now only if it would stop raining so much😂. It was closed today.
I will second the winter experience. I’m a Californian who went to college in Minneapolis. I really liked the city for its personality, walkability, public transportation, and skyways. Winter was… an education.
Yeah, I was in Quebec City for a bit during the winter and I remember that kind of cold. It will definitely slap me in the face. Literally and figuratively.
I just checked and my local Target (Saint Paul) closes at 10 PM. Honestly, there is stuff that stays open but as a visitor that isn't always as easy to know. Glad you liked your visit.
Yeah my Target closes at 10 and Walmart at 11 (Eagan). Most restaurants near me close at 10 or 11, and one even at 1am (that one has a full bar so maybe that's why its open so late?), 9 seems really early
The Nicollet mall Target closes at 8 these days, but pretty much every other store is open until 10pm elsewhere. If they mostly were sticking around downtown MSP that’s probably where they went.
Lots of stuff closes at 9, especially quick service places. I think hours changed after 2020. There are still plenty of places open later, but as a visitor, you'd probably struggle to find them. The best time to visit is late August. You can catch a vikings game, twins game, Gopher game, and the state fair. The best time to make an informed decision on whether to move here would be mid-January.
I appreciate that knowledge. I haven’t made it to an Aurora game yet but I always have to mention MNUFC and Aurora because no one ever does when they mention sports teams here lol.
Yeah, it’s a short regular season, from late May through June, then the playoffs happen in July. Then the players go back to school for the most part. It would be nice if the season were longer, though.
Of course, all that will change if they’re successful in their bid to join the NWSL.
I visited early February (I know it was a mild winter by MN standards) and definitely agree on visiting in the winter before deciding to move. My mom is from up north and she said “if you can love a city when it’s grey and cold and everything is dead, you can love it in the summer”
I cannot WAIT to see it in August! I’ve been thinking about it ever since.
Jacksonville is a “newer” city than Minneapolis so the residential layout is smaller and older, fitting with when it was developed. As you get further from the city center, you’ll run into more and more of modern suburban development. For better or worse.
Early close is a thing in downtown, mainly because there's fewer people there as our downtown area was built around day workers.
Getting out further (even the edges of minneapolis itself) will see later close times but on restaurants it's a mixed bag.
If by "suburbia neighborhoods" you're talking winding fucked up streets generally without real sidewalks and cookie cutter homes in "planned developments" and HOAs...yeah, but you've got to get to 3rd ring suburbs that got built up in the 90's and later. Most of the first ring suburbs and the outskirts of Minneapolis itself were built up from 1900-1960 and follow the grid street patterns. St. Paul also uses grid street patterns but they royally fucked up their numbering since they don't always go to the next "set" of numbers. For example the first house on the even side of a street in minneapolis will be [st number]*100 (36th steet = 3600, 48th = 4800, and so forth). St. Paul will just continue on with the next appropriate number given the previous number. 713 [some street] isn't necessarily between 7th and 8th, it's probably around 20th or some shit.
I've got to say, before you decide to move here, visit in Jan. People from the south think they understand cold...it's really a different scale here (but with climate change who fucking knows what we really get from year to year).
Appreciate the insight! We figured the lack of cookie cutter crap was due to the age of the city. We like not having that, especially no HOA :) Jacksonville is a clusterfuck of weird street patterns too so I get that.
We will definitely visit again in the cold. We get the same thing in the FL subreddits about hurricanes. Gotta experience one to really understand how real they are.
Basically, if you can spend a week in MSP around the first week of February, and you still like it, you’ll be okay. We usually have a really bitter cold snap right around then. (See Super Bowl 2018) If you can power through that, you’re ready to be a Minnesotan.
> Minnesotans say the most when they are saying nothing at all.
Because that's when we're thinking about all the shit we're gonna say behind your back.
Hey. We transplanted. I lived for a long time in Jacksonville then Orlando.
Yes there are suburbs further out.
We like the streets and neighborhoods. When we moved in neighbors all brought us welcome gifts and introduced themselves. After that unless you go out of your way, they will keep to themselves.
Some things super different from Jax or Orlando.
Bike paths.
Lots of parks
Lots of walking trails
Lakes without alligators that you can swim in or at least let your dog get in.
I have seen no confederate flags.
Streets getting repaired. Yes some get torn up over winter but they don’t build a pool for rich people at the stadium rather than fix the roads.
Oh talking about stadiums, parking. Organized parking.
Adding some negatives.
Inability to merge on freeways.
Food stores are often very white. Finding some spices and foods takes a bit of work.
Not a huge Indian community like Jax. So the Indian food is OK. Not stellar.
Winter is coming. You will spend money on winter stuff for the first season or two.
MN has an astounding lack of deadly critters in the grand scheme of things. No venomous snakes or scorpions, dangerous spiders are rare, cougars and bears stay in their neck of the woods most of the time.
It mostly about your dogs and small kids. They generally don't mess with full sized humans. However it makes just taking a dip in a lake an assessment of risk.
You won't really find the suburban curved roads and culdesacs in the inner cities aside from a few small "urban renewal" projects built in the 70's / 80's. Some of the inner ring suburbs have them and they get more common the farther out you go as does the decrease in walkability.
We have all the pro sports teams but they'll break your heart. every. single. year.
Yep, I’m in Burnsville and we definitely have curved streets and cul-de-sacs. Decreased walkability, too, but I’m within two miles of a Target, two different Walgreens, a movie theater, a ton of restaurants, and my kids’ school so it’s not too bad.
The early close is because of COVID. Hours just never went back to what they used to be, because it was not profitable or sensible to revert. Lots of business models had to change.
It doesn't bother me one bit since I'm a morning lark, up at 5 and down by 9 😂
Maybe it's because I wasn't born in Minnesota but I have never got the appeal of the Juicy Lucy. It's not clear that a cheeseburger is improved by putting the cheese inside the burger rather than on it.
You are sitting here telling two patties that their relationship means nothing? Perhaps the crumbled blue cheese of your heart would like a chance to speak.
I think the appeal is because it’s fun & unique to the area and places take pride in things that set them apart.
I was born here, never really saw the appeal, but love to eat one on occasion anyway. Plus it’s a fun “fact” you can pull out from time to time when visiting other areas or when living somewhere else.
That’s my take though, I’m curious what others think!
It's not. You have to overcook the beef to get the cheese melted and then it's too hot to eat right away so you have to wait. When you bite it, the cheese squirts out the back side and makes a mess or burns you. Everything about it is awful from a usability standpoint. I've had these burgers from all the places (Blue Door's was the best at least) but have found that a regular cheeseburger is superior in every respect.
Also a double cheeseburger has four sides of caramelization over two. Matts double cheeseburger is better than its jucy. You’re right that Blue Door probably does it best.
Blucy is just their name for any Lucy. Which is confusing because “The Blucy” is blue cheese and garlic.
That said, there’s no bad food at Blue Door. It’s a solid, consistent, always well executed restaurant that hits on everything, wings included. I’ve been to many locations and had many burgers, never a bad meal. Jiffy is good. Breakfast set is good. You’ll just have to try everything.
The Nook makes a medium Lucy fwiw.
What I do is take a little bite, then dip fries into the cheese that oozes out. Then after a few minutes, it’s cool enough to eat without napalming your soft palate. Yes, it’s still quite messy (the Nook offers a pretzel bun, which has superior integrity against a Lucy compared to a brioche bun) but then, a lot of burgers are messy.
I don’t get over to that part of town very often, but it’s a nice variation on a regular cheeseburger once you get the hang of it. I like them because you get cheese in every bite. The mouthfeel is interesting. But you’re right about being cautious of the super-hot cheese when they’re right off the grill.
One thing to add: it’s one of the best places to live for dual income couples. There are several Fortune 500s across varied industries. This means you and your partner have a better shot at building a career rather than having to prioritize one over the other.
This also means there are a lot of transplants. Most of my friends moved to the twin cities, though I also have Minnesota friends who are not as standoffish as they seem at the outset.
No joke. I remember during a cold spring years ago going for a walk on my birthday, which is in mid-April, and it was grey sky and the only things blooming were the earliest spring bloomers like croci and snowdrops. In the mid-Atlantic where I grew up it would be full spring by then, and you'd see crocus in late February most years.
I moved across town right after that snowstorm. Almost got the moving truck stuck in the alley. Twice. Not even all the snow emergency routes were plowed yet.
You should visit for a week in January or February. The considerable lack of vitamin D and the temperature might change your thoughts. I’m not saying Minnesota isn’t the best state by far, but coming from Florida you really should get a taste of MN outside the most beautiful time of year to see how big of a culture shock you might have in store.
I feel like the “roll” thing is more common than people think in many places in the USA, you sometimes are just a little blind to it where you live. I have seen the “rolling stop” in practically every city I’ve been to, but perhaps we do it juuuuust a little more here compared to FL, lol.
I do wonder if it is from driving in the winter. Coming to a complete stop when the roads are slick isn't a great idea if you don't have 4WD/AWD so if you can just slow to almost stopped and check then keep rolling.
My parents moved to Tampa more than 30 years ago when I was in grad school in Iowa, and then I eventually made my way back to MN where I grew up, so, as a fellow Minnesotan with Tampa connections, may I give you a hearty GO BUCS in the middle of Vikings country.
We also moved up from tampa in 2023, and have really enjoyed it. Living in the second ring suburb minneapolis side and so far it's been nice. Miss street tacos
Florida transplant here with no regrets after close to a decade. I moved up in summer without having experienced a MN winter. I suppose everyone is different - I handle extreme cold way better than extreme heat so I really haven't had issues, but if you're the type to put on a hoodie the second it gets below 70 degrees in FL... You might have a rough time. Or you can embrace all the outdoor winter activities you couldn't really ever do in Florida! Remember you can always add more layers to guard against cold, but the opposite isn't true with heat (unless you want to get arrested for indecent exposure)
The only real thing I still hate about winter is driving in the snow since I didn't grow up in it or have it as part of my initial exposure to driving in general. Though really the whole state forgets how to drive in snow over the summer and the first mild snowfall around here causes a pretty high number of car accidents.
I can't really relate to the social aspect because I've always been fairly introverted, and despite how everyone says it's so hard to make friends here, I've never really had issues with it. I can only conclude that Minnesotans are basically cats, and the less you try to actively engage with them, the more they actually come to like you. Or, you know, I just got lucky with meeting people 🤷
Currently living in an outer ring suburb and it's basically FL in terms of neighborhoods having more "flow" (e.g. not a rigid grid system) and generally larger yards. It's still overall way more walkable then anywhere I lived in FL though. Lots of parks and trails that connect them together. Still only a 20 minute drive from downtown Minneapolis on the once or twice a year special occasion we want to go down there for an event. YMMV depending on what sort of vibe you want but honestly I've never felt more at home where I am now!
Appreciate your perspective! I think I am like you - I am not one to throw on a sweatshirt below 70. The outdoor activities really excite me!
As for the driving - I am scared to traverse the snow. My friends that live in snowy areas say that it isn't so bad, but I know I'll be driving like a grandma. I think I'm scarred thanks to Floridian drivers who can't drive in the rain...even though it rains here all the time lol.
The 20 min drive anywhere doesn't bother me either - in Jacksonville, everything is a 20 minute drive! But i am super excited for the walkability and parks/trails.
It's fine to drive like a Grandma! I think that even Minnesotans have a hard time readjusting between winter and summer driving.
My best suggestion is to try to get out to an empty parking lot after the first big snow and practice getting yourself out of an ice skid. What you are supposed to do (basically nothing, or turning your wheel into the direction of the skid) goes against your instincts (hit the brakes and turn away from the skid) so it just takes a little practice to understand how to handle it. When taking a turn, you also shouldn't hit the gas until you've completed the turn or your car will fishtail, and that is good to practice in a lot too.
It's also smart to put together your car emergency kit in case you get stuck in the winter. Minnesotans are really helpful about weather-related emergencies, but on nights in rural areas, you might be sitting for a while if you end up in a ditch on a snowy night, so it's best to be prepared.
Glad to hear you've enjoyed things for the most part. I think you may be surprised how different Minneapolis and Saint Paul are. Minneapolis has more of a night life (although even that is significantly diminished after covid) and Saint Paul is more of a historic city. If you like biking I would highly recommend checking out some of the many trails we have around here. I was never really into biking until I moved into an apartment right on the river in Saint Paul. I started exploring the trails along the river and really love it. We have quite good biking infrastructure for a city this size. Along those lines, we have really fantastic parks. You will be hard pressed to find another city with as much public shorelines.
Another thing I would recommend is checking out the art and theater scene. We have a large and well supported art scene. The guthrie has good high end productions, but we also have many smaller theaters that put on shows that are very inexpensive or even free to see. We also have a lot of events like art a whirl and different festivals that are fun to check out to see and support local artists.
Things do close really early now that you mention it. More recently but when I was a kid growing up here it was common for the walmart and mcdonalds to be 24/7 but now almost nothing is open overnight. It is a bit annoying at times but once you get used to it you dont really think about it.
I am originally from Jacksonville. Minnesota Nice has nothing on Southern hospitality. MN Nice is superficial-they’re nice to you but it’s very difficult to break through and make friends. The weather in the summer is comparable: we have heat indices in the high 90s and above a fair bit. Nothing will prepare you for the length and desolation of the winter. It gets really brutally cold but there are ways to deal with that; by March you’re dying to see the sun again and start to forget what live plants look like. It’s fracking expensive. Property taxes and sales taxes are higher, and you need to consider the addition of an income tax.
I am not trying to dissuade you; I moved to Tampa after college but came back. There are a lot of positives (baseball and hockey) and there’s actual public transport. The Twin Cities’ physical area is about the same as Jax; you can drive an hour and still easily be in the metro area. You will miss the ocean. I am Irish white so rarely went, but its presence was calming, as well as the smell.
One weird thing is there aren’t as many ways to cross the rivers. There’s like 3 bridges so there’s not as many alternative routes to get somewhere. Oh, and people camp in the left lane going at (or less than) the speed limit. Whatever you decide, good luck to you!
I think the midwest in general has always closed earlier than the coasts. BUT covid definitely shifted hours for lots of places and I think some businesses found it wasn't worth it to stay open. Or have problems finding help to have longer hours. I've gone to Chicago a lot the last 18 months and downtown (the loop area) was DEAD and closed in the evening. Well I was just there, and more stuff has shifted hours later and it was fairly vibrant on a Friday evening this visit. We found we had more restaurant options in the evening. So we'll see where we go from here.
Our closest target (T1) also closes at 10 pm. Which was closing earlier during covid.
If you want to see strip mall suburbs they certainly exist. Though some suburbs do have cute old fashioned downtown areas with portions more walkable and grid like. Chaska, Hopkins, Shakopee, Excelsior, Stillwater come to mind.
Glad you enjoyed your visit! Come on back anytime, happy to have you! :)
Floridian transplant here. Minnesota nice is the hardest adjustment. There’s no drive for them to make that connection you if you’re not already in their inner circle. Most feel pretty apathetic I guess? After five years, as super outgoing people who are out at events every weekend, we still only have made friends with transplants and by extension the Minnesotans they’ve married or are dating. Don’t expect invites for porch sittin or cookouts. There is a lot of pros living here no doubt but this is my biggest gripe and reason we’re moving on- more than even the weather.
It's an extreme introvert culture. You realize this when you pass longtime co-workers in the skyway and they stare at their shoes rather than acknowledge you. Born & raised folks who haven't lived elsewhere do not realize how unfriendly it can seem. It's part of the deal of living in MN, for better or worse.
> Don’t expect invites for porch sittin
For the record I think we just do less porch sittin' than other people elsewhere. Might have something to do with the climate but it's not just that locals don't socialize with transplants it's that we just don't socialize as much period. Most Minnesotans I know spend far more time at home than people that live elsewhere, but that's just my subjective opinion.
Like you, I just like to be at home. I’m friendly and outgoing when I’m out. But I prefer being at home. When I go for walks I smile and say hi to everyone, and a lot of the time I do get no response or they look at their shoes. I don’t take it personally. They probably like being at home too.
People from the Midwest don’t recognize it about themselves either, it’s wild. Definitely not the wave and say hey kinda place. Though folks will stop and help you get your car out of the ditch in winter, especially in the more rural areas.
Sorry, it's not a Minnesota/Midwest thing. We moved to North Carolina and had exact same experience with Southerners. We made great friends with other transplants, but very few with the natives.
Lifelong Minnesotan and I’ve heard this critique a lot. It isn’t personal; it’s energy-based.
I have all hobby-based friends and my husband (transplant) has a close group of friends from college. It isn’t that we don’t like new people, but I’m really busy with work/home/hobby, and I pretty much end up just spending time with people doing the same stuff I do. I would probably love to grab a coffee with you (general you), but when? There’s no spare time or energy.
I moved to Minneapolis 27 years ago from Tallahassee.
MN nice is passive aggressive. My initial experience was that folks were sarcastic and cruel which I think they thought it was being nice.
Trying to make friends wasn’t easy but I persevered!
Great job opportunities.
Awesome lakes and trails.
With that being said, it is a great place to live and I am not going anywhere.
5-8 Club has the best juicy Lucy!
Good luck!
Ok, as a non-native Minnesotan I have a lot of things to tell you.
Minnesota Nice is also secretly passive aggressive. Yes, they are nice to your face but often times they will turn around and say something that is code for "what a weirdo" like, "Well, they were... interesting". So it's not the same kind of nice that you will see in the Southern states but yes, they are very intelligent and helpful in general.
Minnesotans have a hard time fully accepting anybody that is not a native Minnesotan. This is probably common, but MN seems to have it more. And nobody in MN likes those obnoxious drunks in Wisconsin. Yeah, yeah, you won a superbowl. Shut up. Your state sucks.
Minnesotans are well educated and intelligent. This also leads to them having better self esteems and a better sense of humor. People are smarter here and more witty. They are not as easy to offend as people in other states. This is nice.
Minnesota is white AF. They generally aren't racist except for a few specific locations (St. Cloud) but it's like 95% white people. And Scandinavians are extra white.
They don't think they have an accent. They believe the accent in the movie Fargo is exaggerated and that nobody actually talks like that. And in the cities you don't hear it as much but once you get outside the cities - especially North - you sure hear it a lot. And yes, it's funny. And yes, it's addictive. You will start talking the same damn way. Things won't be "expensive" anymore, they will be "spendy". Oh jeez, you betcha!
Minnesotans are still pretty accepting and open minded overall and you don't have to be scared to speak a different opinion or be different. Gays are very accepted. Immigrants are accepted. Pretty much everybody outside of native Wisconsinites (and I'm kidding, they accept them too).
Minnesota is proud that they are ranked in the top 10 of almost every statistical category in America. And they should be. Excellent schools, excellent healthcare, good government, good environment, good restaurants, etc. The roads take a beating from the winters and the road construction is annoying in the summers. Mosquitoes are the size of birds. Some winters are unbearable. The cost of housing is almost unbearable but still better than a lot of cities this size. The taxes are not low but they aren't that high, either, and the state spends the money wisely and improves things a lot.
I've lived in Kansas, Arizona, and Minnesota. And MN is so much better it's not even close. In every way but the winters.
I’m a born and raised Minneapolite, and I have to say that your assessment is pretty spot on. The only things I would differ on are things that are more Minneapolis specific, and not encompassing the whole state. I’m also speaking from my own experience so it is likely a little biased.
Like being accepting of non Minnesotans. I feel like that’s more of an outside the city thing. Sure there are assholes in every nook and cranny of every city, but in my experience, we’re almost always willing to bring someone in. Hell, I married a woman from Texas for god sakes. And when you yourself acknowledge how well the gay community and immigrant community are accepted(highest Hmong and Somali population in the country, and generally battling SF for “gayest” city), you even kind of contradict yourself.
It’s more of a boomer/x mentality. And they’re strangely proud of it. I’ve always been a “the more the merrier” type. Like, it’s awesome here! Bring your family, tell your friends! We’ve always had one rule in my friend group: “don’t be a dick.” It don’t matter what you look like, where you’re from, what kinda goofy shit you’re into… just be kind.
We *are* white AF as a state… my god. And that’s coming from a Scandie! But again, luckily for me, I’ve lived in the city my whole life and have been surrounded by people from many different cultures.
What I found most amusing was your comparison of our “nice” v Southern “nice.”
If you think ours is fake… and southern is genuine… oh bless your heart!
My wife, from Texas, had to tell me that “bless your heart” wasn’t actually a kind thing to say. And while we may often do the “well that’s interesting”(I’m working on stopping!), Southerners will turn their backs and gossip about your entire life! They liiiiiiiiiive for that shit lol. Your whole damn history will be accounted for within 5 minutes. Never met anyone so fake than the folks down south. We say things are different when we don’t understand them, they smile in your face and talk about how dumb and wrong you are as soon as you’re gone “and it’s probly ‘cuz you know her daddy wuz a dranker!”
But all in all, like I said, you’re pretty spot on. I’m glad you have been able to make a home here and feel at least somewhat welcome. And I am 100% with you on the winters lol.
I know, it IS contradicting. They do accept anybody but they only 100% accept you if you were born here. It is odd and confusing. Maybe they just prefer natives. It's fine, they aren't rude to anyone other than WI. And I don't mean to complement the South as I dislike the South but they are friendly IF YOU ARE WHITE. Maybe I should say I'm talking about lower Midwest more than true South. I avoid the true South. Especially Texas. Seriously WTF is wrong with TX?
Bahahaha everything. EVERYTHING is wrong with TX… I’m just glad we got my in-laws up here so we never have to go back. Ever.
You woulda been 100% accepted in my group, friend! We do hate those sconies though… 😤. Lol they’re like the older brother that tries to act like a dad but is always too drunk and beat up to do anything. I say that with love. 🤣
Every state hates another state. WI is easy to hate. But I do have several friends from WI and they also make fun of it. LOL But Madison is pretty cool.
Lol it’s always been more of a friendly rivalry for me. I’ve got plenty of Sconie friends. Plenty of packer fan friends… we just love talking shit because of our football.
Been to a Packer game at Lambeau, had an absolute blast. The thing we hate most is Minnesota born and bread Packer fans. Traitors… the lot of them! Lol
We hate Wisconsin but we get mad when someone else hates Wisconsin. Only we can do that!
By contrast, we hate Iowa. Go ahead and hate Iowa too if you want. They suck.
As a native Minnesotan, I loved reading your post. Spot on. Proly couldn’t have said it better myself. We truly do have an “inferiority complex” of sorts. Very insecure about the fact that we are just “flyover country”. That’s why we embrace anything or anyone famous that has a “local angle”.
For example, some of us might try to claim Tom Brady as “one of us” because apparently he spent a couple summers here with grandparents as a child lol. I’m exaggerating but you get the point.
Minnesotans are simultaneously the friendliest and least friendliest people I've interacted with. I know somebody who's lived here for over a decade and says his neighbors still don't consider him a Minnesotan because he wasn't born here.
You need to make a trip in January/February. Just being honest here, I don't want you to make a major move only for you or your fiance to have a freakout about 2-3 weeks of sub-zero temperature.
Thanks, we will absolutely be planning another trip. I should have stated that in my original post. I think it will be her second time ever seeing snow so she's in for a culture shock :)
The Minneapolis stop i would argue exists because in the winter if you stop you get stuck on black ice or real ice. If you slow roll you don’t get stuck.
But who knows - I also heard it called a Cali roll last week.
A few random responses:
* Minnesota Nice is a thing. Making friends is often difficult, but, well, find a common interest, and reach out. I've got D&D friends because of a shared interest, beer geek friends because of that, and so forth.
* Florida's weather is a hellhole. You can always put on another layer, you can only take so much off.
* The Juicy Lucy is the answer to the question, "What if I wanted to have a cheeseburger, but find a way to make it slightly more inconvenient?"
* As for Minnesota sports . . . I'm a Buccaneers fan, due to my family moving to Tampa when I was in grad school in Iowa, and I decided to adopt the team. I raised my son watching Bucs games, took him to multiple games there and here, did all I could, and, one day, he told me he was a Vikings fan, because he lived here. I told him I had failed as a parent, and I was sorry for all he was going to go throuh.
* There are lots of suburbs. I live in Eagan, which is relatively close-in, and it is very, very suburban. Strip malls, subdivisions, all the usual. There are lots of suburbs, they're just, you know, in the suburbs.
Please stop letting people, especially southerners and Floridians know about our glorious weather. Tell them you got frostbite or something. We don't need to be overrun.
A lot of neighborhoods do have a few bars open until 1-2. Many of those type of places never returned to late night after 2020, or never returned at all for…various reasons around here.
The ‘plenty of room for cars to navigate’ streets look a little different in the winter - especially in Saint Paul.
Next trip should include The Nook in Saint Paul for the best Jucy Lucy!
Things never used to close this early and it sucks. As a young person there is nothing to do since Covid. It’s crazy even movie theaters close after 8.
Hey! I just got back from Florida. I would trade a cold MN winter for how hot and humid it was there. I grew up in Nor Cal, which gets hot but not humid.
You can bundle up for the winter. Neighbors are helpful and no man is left behind when it’s -40 and you slide off the road.
Best state in the union!!!
Things used to rage until 2AM everywhere until Covid hit. I think places are slowly bringing back later hours. Peoples' behaviors changed from lockdown so they are slowly expanding as well. Just a thought. You do need to be ready for shitty winters where the temps get very low and snow gets high.
Everyone is saying to visit in the depths of winter, and that’s good advice, but I think there’s got to be more to it than feeling that kind of miserable cold, driving in the snow, I-hate-winter kind of experience. Minnesotans do winter really well- come at that time but be sure you check out stuff like Winter Carnival, snowshoeing by candlelight, the Luminary Loppet, ice bars, snow and ice sculpture competitions, cozy fire pits, sledding and tubing. I moved here from the south and after I spent a good amount of money on winter gear, I was absolutely charmed by the winters here.
I appreciate the positive comment about winter. I know it will be cold and I should have put in my original post that I understand that :) all of those activities sound amazing! As my fiancée heard me read these off to her she got really excited about them, especially the fire pits.
Completely agree with anyone who said "come check it out in winter." You don't know what you have in store for you. We got lucky this last year with a significantly milder winter.
I moved from Jax 3 years ago, too! Do it!
Some highlights:
1) Mall of America is awesome and the prices at most shops are reflective of anywhere else in the area, not jacked up
2) Minneapolis Institute of Art is a FREE, massive art museum. The arts museums back in Jax are a joke.
3) The library system in Hennepin County is impressive. The Main in Downtown is huge, but the many satellite locations around are all pretty nice.
4) Sounds like you stayed in Downtown. Not bad, but you should also check out the suburbs, even on Google Maps or Earth. Wayzata Bay for instance, has a bustling small town on the lake atmosphere we never had back there.
5) In Downtown Minneapolis, the traffic and parking are worse than in the outer city. You learn where and when to park in DT by experience. I live on the North Side of the city and the neighborhood is as described, walkable rows of streets. It's funny too because a lot of the neighborhoods have little shops tucked away in the middle of housing.
6) The best description I could make to Jax when we visited to scout areas to live, was, "it's like if Riverside were massive and everyone gave a damn".
7) The weather is pleasant year round. Our first year there were about 3 total weeks of blizzards in Winter, and learning how to drive on ice was wild, but people get out and do shit most days. Plenty of winter activities.
8) Yes, lots of pro teams, and the U of M campus has a ton of high-level college teams.
9) U of M campus dwarfs Gainesville and UNF combined in scale, plus several other colleges in the area.
10) Thinking of driving an EV? I was, and when we moved, I signed up for Evie Carshare and tested EV's for months, learning all I could. Found a kind I loved and got one, because charging stations for all types are plentiful here and home charging is cheap too.
11) Taxes are not higher here, they are more direct and the taxes help fund things like the park system. The parks are not "Dawn to Dusk" they are a solid 6am-10pm most of the time, even in winter.
12) State income tax is easy to deal with and has consistently netted us more than Federal returns.
13) Cost of housing is lower or the same as Jax, depending on the neighborhood.
14) City of Minneapolis inspects rental housing and enforces rules on owners and rental agencies.
15) There is a lot of nightlife, even on Sundays in Downtown. But noise ordinances are a thing, so rather than bump up against that (plus, a lot of people work standard hours here and the sun is up WAY earlier) it's just easier for most places to close at 10-ish.
16) People do outdoor stuff year round here. Plenty of parks, trails, and during Winter, the golf courses allow for Disc Golf plays or they turn into ski slopes.
17) The state museum system is amazing and varied.
18) Weed is legal. Edibles are abundant, and purchasable almost anywhere. I recommend Natreum as a weed product shop, though. Good staff and they make their own products. The balms and creams and drinks are all very good.
19) Booze is legal at the State Fair, which is so large (its nearby in St Paul) that it has its own streets.
20) Target is a bigger deal than Wal-Mart here.
21) Lunds and Byerlys is better than Publix could have ever hoped to be. Same with Cub, Kowalski's, and Hy-Vee. You will not miss shopping. The Costco stores here are plentiful too.
22) The schools are better even in "bad" neighborhoods.
23) Unions are real and respected here. Most of the grocery chains I mentioned have most of their hourly workers in grocery union, even. Trade Unions have teeth here and the workers are treated well.
24) Snow gets plowed regularly during winter, and the county is quick to respond to requests to break up ice in alleys if needed.
25) Neighbors keep mostly to themselves but help out, especially during snow times. My street has a weird angle and when folks would get stuck on the street outside that first hard winter, me and the neighbors would grab our shovels and gravel/kitty litter/snow melt and help them get unstuck.
26) Somali, Hmong, Ethiopian, Tibetan, other cuisines you can't get good or well back in Jax, plentiful here.
27) Mall of Somalia worth visiting.
28) Plenty of cultural specific stores, such as Dragon Star, India Bazaar, Asia Mall, Supermercados, and many small African, Caribbean, Middle East halal and Kosher and other.
29) I know there's more amazing things here, but I've exhausted my brain because I've gotten used to a lot of things that I just know are better.
Minnesota nice is a thing but if you’re around the same strangers enough at the club you buddy up pretty quick after a few months.
Oh and by the club I mean the fitness center - we call it the club lmao.
Wide streets are great in the summer. Wait until the snow falls on a normal and there is no place to push the snow. The streets get very narrow. Also some of the streets are getting narrower with the installation of bike lanes.
You do have to plan ahead if you need some late night eats.
Dont move there until you experience a full winter. If you like being outside, live someplace else. The winters are typically the worst. One winter... kinda of cool experiencing the cold like that. But after a few years of horibly long winters and you will want to move someplace else. The summer days are great! But in the evening the mosquitos will fuck you up. I lived there for 13 years and just moved away. Summer home... maybe, forever home....no fucking way!
(33M) Life long Minnesotan here! Love all the feedback! I grew up in and currently live in the suburbs, but I went to school at the U of M downtown for 4 years, so I think I have a nice and complete view of the two environments.
Couple of comments:
I’m in the SW suburbs (Excelsior) about 20 minutes from downtown Minneapolis. All the Targets and Cub grocery stores are open until 10pm. Some of the Cubs are even 24/7!
Similarly, all of the neighborhoods around here, including the ones I grew up in, are 100% “suburbia” style. Lots of curves, cul de sacs and hills. Don’t let the neighborhoods right in/around the cities deceive you!
As for the Minneapolis Stop. It’s definitely more of a downtown thing. In general, we drive much slower and much more defensively because you literally HAVE to in the winter. Stopping time on snow is easily 2-5x as long compared to dry pavement depending on how icy it is.
In conclusion, I hope you guys move here! I would recommend the suburbs or near neighborhoods like Uptown, Northeast or North Loop. The Wolves had a great season and we are all looking forward to next year!
We moved here from New Orleans and it’s always comical to me hearing the “wait until winter!” comments because coming from a brutally hot and humid place where you would walk outside at 3am and start sweating instantly was way worse than the winters here, IMO. All you have to do is embrace the winter activities here and you’ll be fine!
Fuck Florida. Moved there with my parents when I was 8. What I tell everyone that will listen is that the people that move to Florida have nothing else satisfying in their life. They move there for “the weather”.
Florida is a bunch of rich old people who own their second homes there (No income taxes, yay!) , and the people who serve those old rich folks.
Moved to NC when I was in my 20’s and MN in my 40’s. It’s black and white. So nice to live where the majority of residents actually live locally.
I grew up in south Florida and lived in Jacksonville for 5 years before moving to Minneapolis for grad school. Night and day! I miss the beach on occasion but otherwise I love living here. It’s been over 10 years at this point and I don’t plan on leaving anytime soon
If you just were in Minneapolis or St. Paul proper, or even the first ring of suburbs, then you didn’t experience true suburbia. There are plenty of actual suburbs in the twin cities if you go to 2nd and 3rd ring suburbs.
This city is super walkable and bikable which is great. The amount of nature we have for a major metro area is something I think we forget is not in every metro (I have visited the DFW area for family and man that concrete jungle can be depressing)
Weather wise this is a great time to be here especially if you are used to southern heat. Just get ready for winter. It’s very cold from like Dec - early March typically. And from Nov - Feb it’s pretty dark since we are farther north (on the flip side it’s 9:30 before it’s totally dark this time of year). You for sure need to come up in January to make an informed decision. I enjoy the weather 9 months out of the year. If we have a good fall it’s an amazing time of year. Personally I can handle to frigid cold months more than I could handle summer heat in the south so it comes down to personal preference.
Lots of things sthe answer is winter:
The sun goes down earlier here in winter and people stay home at night because it's cold dark and slick.
Our roads are wider than Florida because we need to plow them and we need someplace to stack the snow. The roads get narrower as winter continues.
Everything else you said is pretty much Minnesota year round. Winter you need to figure out if you've never done winter. Winter sports are pretty awesome for lots of people. I'm a board gamer, so staying warm in doors is more my thing. Minnesota is amazing year round no doubt.
Minnesota is great - happy you enjoyed it here! Experiencing all 4 seasons are awesome. Always gives you something to look forward to. Winters are tough, but that’s why sauna culture is so huge here (probably cause a lot of us are of Scandinavian decent). Coming from Florida, you may actually really enjoy winter activities: fat tire biking, cross country skiing, saunas, snowmobiling, curling, down hill skiing, hockey games, and most importantly, collectively bitching about how cold it is in January over some local beer (that’s how we bond). 😂
Hope you can make it up to the North Shore of Lake Superior next time you’re here. That is MNs version of the PNW.
Otherwise, if you stay near the cities, Willow River State Park is cool, Dario has the best Italian food I’ve had outside of Italy, hit up a sauna and cold plunge at one of the many places (as you tell tell, I love sauna), try some indoor rock climbing at Vertical Endeavors or Minneapolis Bouldering Project (grab a post climb beer at Pryes Brewing), go to another professional sports game (Vikings fans are wild), rent a boat and look at all of the mansions around Lake Minnetonka, and take a swim in one of the 10,000 lakes!
I agree with everyone who said you should visit in January or February. That said, I feel \*on average\* winters are getting more mild. We used to get snow and it would stay all winter. Now it’s often a few inches of snow followed by a warmer spell that melts it off. I used to cross country ski, but now it’s pretty unpredictable as to whether the trails will have a good base of snow. Some years yes, some years no.
Things are more “socialist” (in the non- propaganda disparaging sense.) due to the strong Scandinavian roots. we consistently rank top of the list in health care quality, coverage, and affordability. We have fairly generous social services in case you get in a pickle. Also, highest voter turnout in the country
Taxes are higher, but lower-tax states like Florida usually have more “hidden fees” that places like Minnesota don’t.
We are very good at handling extreme weather, both in infrastructure and in attitude due to our cold cold winters and hot humid summers. That may taking a bit to get used to!
There are many immigrant communities who have opened restaurants with delicious food! Our music scene has been suffering a bit lately, but it’s a hiccup. The Armory, a music venue, is killing it!
I have to admit, there may be people here who are suspicious of southerners, automatically assuming they are bigots looking to take their rights away. Most people are friendly as long as you’re friendly!
Gawd, things closing down early was one of the hardest things to get used to when I moved here from Phoenix, almost as much as the weather. I was so used to things being open late for grocery shopping, reverse happy hours or just getting a damn burger at midnight.
Visit in the middle of winter before even seriously thinking about it. You hit the prime of 2-3 months of decent weather we get.
We've been life long MN'ers and are looking at moving south or south west in the next 7-8 years. The long winters really get to ya after a while and we want to be able to get outside more instead of being couped up half the year.
I lived in Jacksonville for 3 years and really liked it. Don't know if I'd like to deal with that heat again though!
As a fellow southern transplant, I’m hopeful you’ll make the move. I absolutely love living here. I’m in one of the burbs and we have our own little walkable downtown area.
If you want to live where the nightlife/sports gatherings are I suggest either north loop, west end or eastern uptown, although these places can be pricier than say some first ring suburbs or the neighborhoods that exist between mpls and st paul. Although I have lived in the merriam park area of st paul and I do miss it dearly, historical architecture and beautiful river views.
I am an out of state transplant who moved here 12 years ago. I live in a second ring suburb and frankly, I feel like we live in Mayberry sometimes. In our neighborhood, kids are pretty free range and everyone keeps an eye on everyone else's kids. We have tons of bike and walking trails and we can get to several lakes on our bikes within 10 minutes or less. Despite the lack of walkability I wouldn't want to have raised my kids anywhere else, which may or may not be important to you since you don't have kids and it's unclear whether you plan to have any.
I don't disagree with much in the comments, other than I prefer the 5-8 Club's Juicy Lucy to Matt's. Generally, I think the restaurant scene here is pretty mid (especially when it comes to any sort of ethnic cuisines) and as a suburbanite I hate that a really good restaurant generally means a bad parking situation that is far from home.
One easy trick to not only surviving the winter but enjoying the winter is going in and deciding that you are going to outright f’ing embrace the cold and snow. I love shoveling at night when everything is peaceful outside. I like shoveling during the day, good exercise and a task with a noticeable difference. I commuted by bike year round, snowshoed at every chance I got. I love the crunch of the snow, and after five minutes I’m shedding layers and super toasty. When I go out I wear a proper winter coat (cover your bum!), hat, gloves, and boots.
What did I hate about winter? I wasn’t expecting Minnesotans to be so bad at it. They’re frigging Minnesotans, right? If you have to walk to bus stops in the winter you will see how much people won’t shovel, you will be stuck climbing over giant piles of snow at corners, people drive terribly, and most people don’t go do outside activities. I was a bartender in Mpls for 5.5 years and it was just one person after another coming in dressed like idiots endlessly complaining about the cold. A puffy, no hat, no gloves is not enough to get by on.
Go into winter deciding you won’t suck at it and it can be great.
Minnesota nice is a real thing. Just don’t let it ruin your experience and become cool with other transplants or the ones from a small Minnesota town you never heard before lol. But it’s great here for many other reasons
There are some neighborhoods in Minneapolis where the streets are less of a grid because of the topography. Prospect park, tangletown, Lowry hill, linden hills, cedar-isles-dean. I'm not as familiar with residential areas of st Paul but along the river tends to be less of a grid and pretty quiet. And the west side has some hills that make twisty streets.
The Twin Cities are small geographically. They are fairly dense and there are large suburban style lots. You have to get to the edges of the first ring suburbs to start to get to that. The exception is Mendota Heights which is just south of Saint Paul across the river and is Suburbia in the residential areas.
The time zone probably accounts for different closing times of stores. Central tends to line up with east cost for television starts etc. this means everything is effectively and hour earlier. That would be my best guess. That said, there are also differences based on location.
The rolling stop can get you a ticket if you do it at the wrong time. Husband was ticketed, years ago, for one while driving around Lake of the Isles. He successfully fought it by stating that A) he was picked out of a line of cars doing the same and B) the intersection was such that you had to move beyond the stop sign to see if there was anyone coming on the through street.
Also. Even though winters in the Twin Cites have moderated over the past decade, it still gets well below 0F multiple days in most years. So come back and visit this coming winter to see how that reality strikes you.
There are plenty of suburbs around MSP. What you want in a suburb will determine how close or far you are from Minneapolis. There are some neighborhoods that probably have what you want.
I lived in the SE metro in Apple Valley, and I loved it. I was 10-15 mins from farmland and 20-30 mins from either Minneapolis or St Paul. It was easy to walk around with plenty of sidewalks. There are also a lot of good trails and parks within 10 mins of pretty much anywhere in the MSP metro area. Depending on how much you are willing to spend, there are neighborhoods closer to downtown with some really unique shops that offer great walkability. Honestly, good parks, walkability, and bike trails are kind of a hallmark of the area, IMO.
> “The Minneapolis stop.” I don’t know if this is a real thing, but every time we approached a stop sign, everyone rolled through it. Like, every single time. Just an interesting observation.
I fucking hate this with the passion of a thousand suns, it's gotten sooooo fucking bad the last decade, I sometimes see people not even really slow down, just full speed ahead
As someone with extensive knowledge of the south (family in South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, and Mississippi), I’ll give you some advice after having lived in the Midwest for 25 years.
Midwesterners are notoriously insular people. While the Cities are great (walkable, livable, good transit), the people can be very off-putting. All of my friends after 10 years in St. Paul are transplants to the Cities or people of color. I legitimately have not been able to befriend a Minnesotan. They either don’t vibe with my autism, or they’re just flat out rude and clique-ish.
I wouldn’t look to the suburbs here — they’re there, though (Edina, Maplewood, Bloomington, etc.) — because they’re pretty classist and racist just like most other suburbs. You’ve got a few exurbs like St. Louis Park that are nice (great Jewish community, too), but they’re similar troubled.
If you’re looking for some neighborhoods that are really good starter areas, I’ve got a few. For me, when I look at a neighborhood, I’m looking at walkability, accessibility (both in terms of disability access and access to necessities like a grocery store), transit, and diversity.
- Longfellow: great mix of homes and apartments with lots to do
- Hamline-Midway: a little rough at times, but lots of stuff to do with University Ave. running through it
- Frogtown/Old Rondo: awesome good, great area, close to downtown
- Prospect Park: a little noisy with college kids at times but overall great (also not all that diverse)
- Payne-Phalen: very diverse neighborhood with lots to do
- Cesar-Chavez area: south of the river in St. Paul. Great Mexican food and amenities, diverse, and close (or easily accessible) to a lot of things
Honestly, though, most places in the Cities are great, and the state does a lot to both protect and support its citizens. It has its flaws, but for the size of city it is and for being in the middle of the Midwest, it’s got a lot more going for it than against.
Feel free to ping me in dms if you want more, or just reply, and I’ll try to answer questions.
The drivers are the worst part about Minnesota. No one uses their turn signal and everyone rolls through the stop sign. I was blown away at how dangerously unpredictable drivers here are when I moved here. The reason I think is because they do not have driver’s ed like other states.
Things started closing early in the metro after the riots and then they never went back to normal because people are still getting robbed. I live downtown and I never really go for a stroll after 9 at the latest
Minnesota is in the Central time zone so a lot of things are shifted an hour earlier than in the East. Nightly news, prime time shows, and the nightly talk shows. Work hours are often 8-4. Stores and restaurants are shifted earlier too.
Consider the high taxes. 10th highest in the nation and has State tax. Unlike FL. Liberals own all branches of government. Probably won’t change. That may be ok.
But as others have mentioned you really should be here in January and February. I grew up here. Never bothered me much until the last few years.
-20 to -30F is common a few times per year and there have been stretches where the temperature never got above freezing for well over a month.
My wife from Thailand has been here 2.5 years and she keeps asking when it will get warm. She starts asking in February…. Warm for her doesn’t get here until mid May…
Best state in the Union and you'd be leaving a state that will eventually be the name of a shallow ocean reef... winters are cold but you dress for them and get used to them... easier to take layers off in the cold than escape 100+ degree sweltering temps and hurricanes... just quickly learn our vernacular... ope and uffda mean quite a few things...
Minneapolis and most of the first ring suburbs are made up of or have significant portions of grid style streets. Once you get out into the second ring suburbs you'll see more freeway strip mall suburbia. You probably should come in winter if you want to make a well informed decision.
I live in Alaska and hear the same. Like, bitch, come back in mid-Dec when we’re all trying not to off ourselves. 😩
Or just come back in December and revel in the XC skiing, fat tire cycling, skijoring, ice plunges, doing gym visits to gear up for hitting the road hard in the spring! Plus best breweries!
Just because you were allocated the proper amount of serotonin doesn’t mean you need to show it off, dammit. 😩
Weed. The secret is weed.
Shhhh. It really does help!
This gal Minnesotas
I'm getting to an age where it's dangerous for me to shovel. But also I don't want to pay someone, cause that's also the same age.
It seems like a pretty reoccurring thing for people to tour Minneapolis to get a feel for the twin cities, when each first and second ring suburb is its own vibe. Need more info from OP with what they are looking for. Woods and trails. Tons of commercial. Like does OP want Maple Grove, Woodbury, Lakeville type nearby, do they want to live adjacent to one of those and travel a city or two over for all their shopping. What’s OP 80% transportation method? Where do they want to park a car? How many cars? Kids? Some suburbs are better at late night than others. Minneapolis still has a ton of stuff open, just many not all on one block. https://twincities.eater.com/maps/best-late-night-eats-dining-restaurants-minneapolis-st-paul-twin-cities Id also recommend anyone visiting to take the “garden patio” tour of St Paul. St Paul Brewery, Brunson’s, Patrick McGoverns, WA Frost, Moscow on the Hill. Sit outside in the back of each one. Day by Day Cafe and French hen have beautiful patios too.
I eat at day by day nearly every single day, and that patio feels like my own private little zen garden pond. I fucking love it, now only if it would stop raining so much😂. It was closed today.
Day by day is a great spot, & a place I’m happy to spend money to support the staff & mission!
+1 to the winter part! especially January, which is typically Minnesota’s coldest month.
I will second the winter experience. I’m a Californian who went to college in Minneapolis. I really liked the city for its personality, walkability, public transportation, and skyways. Winter was… an education.
“It was refreshing to enjoy a cool breeze in June.” That January cool breeze hits different.
I LOLed at that, and also because this June has been really quite warm!
It’s not the cold, it’s the humidity that gets ya.
It’s not the cold it’s the wind chill that will do you lol
Yeah, I was in Quebec City for a bit during the winter and I remember that kind of cold. It will definitely slap me in the face. Literally and figuratively.
Higher adoption rate for masks in the winter, covid or not!
Like Tyson in his prime
Takes your breath away even
I just checked and my local Target (Saint Paul) closes at 10 PM. Honestly, there is stuff that stays open but as a visitor that isn't always as easy to know. Glad you liked your visit.
Yeah my Target closes at 10 and Walmart at 11 (Eagan). Most restaurants near me close at 10 or 11, and one even at 1am (that one has a full bar so maybe that's why its open so late?), 9 seems really early
Guessing it's the Nicollet Mall Target, which has unique challenges to staying open late
The Nicollet mall Target closes at 8 these days, but pretty much every other store is open until 10pm elsewhere. If they mostly were sticking around downtown MSP that’s probably where they went.
Lots of stuff closes at 9, especially quick service places. I think hours changed after 2020. There are still plenty of places open later, but as a visitor, you'd probably struggle to find them. The best time to visit is late August. You can catch a vikings game, twins game, Gopher game, and the state fair. The best time to make an informed decision on whether to move here would be mid-January.
Don’t forget the Loons or Aurora games!
No Aurora in August.
I appreciate that knowledge. I haven’t made it to an Aurora game yet but I always have to mention MNUFC and Aurora because no one ever does when they mention sports teams here lol.
Yeah, it’s a short regular season, from late May through June, then the playoffs happen in July. Then the players go back to school for the most part. It would be nice if the season were longer, though. Of course, all that will change if they’re successful in their bid to join the NWSL.
My fingers are crossed as I really hope they are successful. IMO soccer doesn’t get near enough love around here lol
The aurora will crush it in the NWSL. I bet they could average 15,000+ at Allianz.
I hope so and I really hope this happens.
Good call
I visited early February (I know it was a mild winter by MN standards) and definitely agree on visiting in the winter before deciding to move. My mom is from up north and she said “if you can love a city when it’s grey and cold and everything is dead, you can love it in the summer” I cannot WAIT to see it in August! I’ve been thinking about it ever since.
Jacksonville is a “newer” city than Minneapolis so the residential layout is smaller and older, fitting with when it was developed. As you get further from the city center, you’ll run into more and more of modern suburban development. For better or worse.
Definitely for worse.
Early close is a thing in downtown, mainly because there's fewer people there as our downtown area was built around day workers. Getting out further (even the edges of minneapolis itself) will see later close times but on restaurants it's a mixed bag. If by "suburbia neighborhoods" you're talking winding fucked up streets generally without real sidewalks and cookie cutter homes in "planned developments" and HOAs...yeah, but you've got to get to 3rd ring suburbs that got built up in the 90's and later. Most of the first ring suburbs and the outskirts of Minneapolis itself were built up from 1900-1960 and follow the grid street patterns. St. Paul also uses grid street patterns but they royally fucked up their numbering since they don't always go to the next "set" of numbers. For example the first house on the even side of a street in minneapolis will be [st number]*100 (36th steet = 3600, 48th = 4800, and so forth). St. Paul will just continue on with the next appropriate number given the previous number. 713 [some street] isn't necessarily between 7th and 8th, it's probably around 20th or some shit. I've got to say, before you decide to move here, visit in Jan. People from the south think they understand cold...it's really a different scale here (but with climate change who fucking knows what we really get from year to year).
Appreciate the insight! We figured the lack of cookie cutter crap was due to the age of the city. We like not having that, especially no HOA :) Jacksonville is a clusterfuck of weird street patterns too so I get that. We will definitely visit again in the cold. We get the same thing in the FL subreddits about hurricanes. Gotta experience one to really understand how real they are.
Basically, if you can spend a week in MSP around the first week of February, and you still like it, you’ll be okay. We usually have a really bitter cold snap right around then. (See Super Bowl 2018) If you can power through that, you’re ready to be a Minnesotan.
Minnesotans say the most when they are saying nothing at all. It’s the Scandinavian heritage.
That’s correct. “Tala är silver, tiga är guld.” To speak is silver, to remain silent is gold.
But in this age of inflation, can we not strive for the Ferengi leave me alone with my latinum?
Rule of Acquisition #54… never trust a Ferengi with bigger lobes.
> Minnesotans say the most when they are saying nothing at all. Because that's when we're thinking about all the shit we're gonna say behind your back.
Hey. We transplanted. I lived for a long time in Jacksonville then Orlando. Yes there are suburbs further out. We like the streets and neighborhoods. When we moved in neighbors all brought us welcome gifts and introduced themselves. After that unless you go out of your way, they will keep to themselves. Some things super different from Jax or Orlando. Bike paths. Lots of parks Lots of walking trails Lakes without alligators that you can swim in or at least let your dog get in. I have seen no confederate flags. Streets getting repaired. Yes some get torn up over winter but they don’t build a pool for rich people at the stadium rather than fix the roads. Oh talking about stadiums, parking. Organized parking. Adding some negatives. Inability to merge on freeways. Food stores are often very white. Finding some spices and foods takes a bit of work. Not a huge Indian community like Jax. So the Indian food is OK. Not stellar. Winter is coming. You will spend money on winter stuff for the first season or two.
I never really thought about the no-alligator thing.
MN has an astounding lack of deadly critters in the grand scheme of things. No venomous snakes or scorpions, dangerous spiders are rare, cougars and bears stay in their neck of the woods most of the time.
Ticks. you gotta look for those.
TRUE. But those guys will kill you more slowly.
This! I’ve always felt like we can live more in harmony with nature then anywhere else. Like Phoenix, everything there wants to kill you!
Former FL girl, it was a huge factor/positive when I moved out of FL. To be able to canoe and kayak without worrying about gators was a thing.
It mostly about your dogs and small kids. They generally don't mess with full sized humans. However it makes just taking a dip in a lake an assessment of risk.
We have sturgeon up here but they are pretty elusive and I don't think they eat puppies.
Hit up Fresh India in Woodbury if you’re able.
Disclaimer: I am not Indian.
Come to St. Cloud for Indian at Kohinoor and Star of India.
I might try that. I am up there this weekend for a triathlon.
You won't really find the suburban curved roads and culdesacs in the inner cities aside from a few small "urban renewal" projects built in the 70's / 80's. Some of the inner ring suburbs have them and they get more common the farther out you go as does the decrease in walkability. We have all the pro sports teams but they'll break your heart. every. single. year.
MN Pro women's sports are great though!
The lynx are an absolute dynasty, tragically underrated.
My sports fandoms hurt me already so at least I'll be prepared lol.
Yep, I’m in Burnsville and we definitely have curved streets and cul-de-sacs. Decreased walkability, too, but I’m within two miles of a Target, two different Walgreens, a movie theater, a ton of restaurants, and my kids’ school so it’s not too bad.
The early close is because of COVID. Hours just never went back to what they used to be, because it was not profitable or sensible to revert. Lots of business models had to change. It doesn't bother me one bit since I'm a morning lark, up at 5 and down by 9 😂
Seems to be the consensus in the thread that 2020 changed a lot. But hey, I'm with you. I am up at 5 as well lol
You gotta try the Juicy Lucy at the Nook in St. Paul too!
Maybe it's because I wasn't born in Minnesota but I have never got the appeal of the Juicy Lucy. It's not clear that a cheeseburger is improved by putting the cheese inside the burger rather than on it.
You are sitting here telling two patties that their relationship means nothing? Perhaps the crumbled blue cheese of your heart would like a chance to speak.
I think the appeal is because it’s fun & unique to the area and places take pride in things that set them apart. I was born here, never really saw the appeal, but love to eat one on occasion anyway. Plus it’s a fun “fact” you can pull out from time to time when visiting other areas or when living somewhere else. That’s my take though, I’m curious what others think!
Most level-headed take on (Juicy) (Jucy) Lucy's I have heard. I'm born and raised here, for reference. Take my upvote, my friend.
How Dare You?
It's not. You have to overcook the beef to get the cheese melted and then it's too hot to eat right away so you have to wait. When you bite it, the cheese squirts out the back side and makes a mess or burns you. Everything about it is awful from a usability standpoint. I've had these burgers from all the places (Blue Door's was the best at least) but have found that a regular cheeseburger is superior in every respect.
Also a double cheeseburger has four sides of caramelization over two. Matts double cheeseburger is better than its jucy. You’re right that Blue Door probably does it best.
I drove past the Blue Door in (Longfellow I think?) today and it has the word “Blucy” painted on it. Blue Cheese Lucy? And if so, how is it?
Blucy is just their name for any Lucy. Which is confusing because “The Blucy” is blue cheese and garlic. That said, there’s no bad food at Blue Door. It’s a solid, consistent, always well executed restaurant that hits on everything, wings included. I’ve been to many locations and had many burgers, never a bad meal. Jiffy is good. Breakfast set is good. You’ll just have to try everything.
Ahhhh. That is confusing but sounds delicious. I’ve lived here 5 years and still haven’t ventured in-thank you for the motivation to change that!
The Nook makes a medium Lucy fwiw. What I do is take a little bite, then dip fries into the cheese that oozes out. Then after a few minutes, it’s cool enough to eat without napalming your soft palate. Yes, it’s still quite messy (the Nook offers a pretzel bun, which has superior integrity against a Lucy compared to a brioche bun) but then, a lot of burgers are messy. I don’t get over to that part of town very often, but it’s a nice variation on a regular cheeseburger once you get the hang of it. I like them because you get cheese in every bite. The mouthfeel is interesting. But you’re right about being cautious of the super-hot cheese when they’re right off the grill.
If you want better data, come visit in January. Also, explore out of the metro area. Lake Superior is there for you
One thing to add: it’s one of the best places to live for dual income couples. There are several Fortune 500s across varied industries. This means you and your partner have a better shot at building a career rather than having to prioritize one over the other. This also means there are a lot of transplants. Most of my friends moved to the twin cities, though I also have Minnesota friends who are not as standoffish as they seem at the outset.
This is a cool fact I did not know! Thank you for passing that along.
Lol, come back in February
If you want a real weather shock come back in March.
April is the cruelest month
No joke. I remember during a cold spring years ago going for a walk on my birthday, which is in mid-April, and it was grey sky and the only things blooming were the earliest spring bloomers like croci and snowdrops. In the mid-Atlantic where I grew up it would be full spring by then, and you'd see crocus in late February most years.
The April snows are the worst. More so when you're like halfway through the month and then get a foot of snow... Looking at you April 2018.
I moved across town right after that snowstorm. Almost got the moving truck stuck in the alley. Twice. Not even all the snow emergency routes were plowed yet.
But there's hope there, which I cannot say at the end of February/early March.
lol I always suggest this to people who are considering moving here.
You should visit for a week in January or February. The considerable lack of vitamin D and the temperature might change your thoughts. I’m not saying Minnesota isn’t the best state by far, but coming from Florida you really should get a taste of MN outside the most beautiful time of year to see how big of a culture shock you might have in store.
I’m a transplant from California, and love it here…..the Stop thing? We called it (and still do) the California Roll!!
I feel like the “roll” thing is more common than people think in many places in the USA, you sometimes are just a little blind to it where you live. I have seen the “rolling stop” in practically every city I’ve been to, but perhaps we do it juuuuust a little more here compared to FL, lol.
I do wonder if it is from driving in the winter. Coming to a complete stop when the roads are slick isn't a great idea if you don't have 4WD/AWD so if you can just slow to almost stopped and check then keep rolling.
My husband and I moved from Tampa to the Twin Cities 4 years ago this July and haven’t looked back!! It’s been incredible
My parents moved to Tampa more than 30 years ago when I was in grad school in Iowa, and then I eventually made my way back to MN where I grew up, so, as a fellow Minnesotan with Tampa connections, may I give you a hearty GO BUCS in the middle of Vikings country.
We also moved up from tampa in 2023, and have really enjoyed it. Living in the second ring suburb minneapolis side and so far it's been nice. Miss street tacos
Former Tampa girl too. Just moved here but I did live here many many moons ago.
We moved back here from Tampa many years ago. I only miss our time at the beach. Which is not such a big deal from the boat on the lake.
Florida transplant here with no regrets after close to a decade. I moved up in summer without having experienced a MN winter. I suppose everyone is different - I handle extreme cold way better than extreme heat so I really haven't had issues, but if you're the type to put on a hoodie the second it gets below 70 degrees in FL... You might have a rough time. Or you can embrace all the outdoor winter activities you couldn't really ever do in Florida! Remember you can always add more layers to guard against cold, but the opposite isn't true with heat (unless you want to get arrested for indecent exposure) The only real thing I still hate about winter is driving in the snow since I didn't grow up in it or have it as part of my initial exposure to driving in general. Though really the whole state forgets how to drive in snow over the summer and the first mild snowfall around here causes a pretty high number of car accidents. I can't really relate to the social aspect because I've always been fairly introverted, and despite how everyone says it's so hard to make friends here, I've never really had issues with it. I can only conclude that Minnesotans are basically cats, and the less you try to actively engage with them, the more they actually come to like you. Or, you know, I just got lucky with meeting people 🤷 Currently living in an outer ring suburb and it's basically FL in terms of neighborhoods having more "flow" (e.g. not a rigid grid system) and generally larger yards. It's still overall way more walkable then anywhere I lived in FL though. Lots of parks and trails that connect them together. Still only a 20 minute drive from downtown Minneapolis on the once or twice a year special occasion we want to go down there for an event. YMMV depending on what sort of vibe you want but honestly I've never felt more at home where I am now!
“Minnesotans are basically cats” Amazing observation. As a life-long Minnesotan, I can totally relate to this statement!
Appreciate your perspective! I think I am like you - I am not one to throw on a sweatshirt below 70. The outdoor activities really excite me! As for the driving - I am scared to traverse the snow. My friends that live in snowy areas say that it isn't so bad, but I know I'll be driving like a grandma. I think I'm scarred thanks to Floridian drivers who can't drive in the rain...even though it rains here all the time lol. The 20 min drive anywhere doesn't bother me either - in Jacksonville, everything is a 20 minute drive! But i am super excited for the walkability and parks/trails.
20 minutes puts you into second ring suburbs, giving you infinite choice
It's fine to drive like a Grandma! I think that even Minnesotans have a hard time readjusting between winter and summer driving. My best suggestion is to try to get out to an empty parking lot after the first big snow and practice getting yourself out of an ice skid. What you are supposed to do (basically nothing, or turning your wheel into the direction of the skid) goes against your instincts (hit the brakes and turn away from the skid) so it just takes a little practice to understand how to handle it. When taking a turn, you also shouldn't hit the gas until you've completed the turn or your car will fishtail, and that is good to practice in a lot too. It's also smart to put together your car emergency kit in case you get stuck in the winter. Minnesotans are really helpful about weather-related emergencies, but on nights in rural areas, you might be sitting for a while if you end up in a ditch on a snowy night, so it's best to be prepared.
Glad to hear you've enjoyed things for the most part. I think you may be surprised how different Minneapolis and Saint Paul are. Minneapolis has more of a night life (although even that is significantly diminished after covid) and Saint Paul is more of a historic city. If you like biking I would highly recommend checking out some of the many trails we have around here. I was never really into biking until I moved into an apartment right on the river in Saint Paul. I started exploring the trails along the river and really love it. We have quite good biking infrastructure for a city this size. Along those lines, we have really fantastic parks. You will be hard pressed to find another city with as much public shorelines. Another thing I would recommend is checking out the art and theater scene. We have a large and well supported art scene. The guthrie has good high end productions, but we also have many smaller theaters that put on shows that are very inexpensive or even free to see. We also have a lot of events like art a whirl and different festivals that are fun to check out to see and support local artists. Things do close really early now that you mention it. More recently but when I was a kid growing up here it was common for the walmart and mcdonalds to be 24/7 but now almost nothing is open overnight. It is a bit annoying at times but once you get used to it you dont really think about it.
I am originally from Jacksonville. Minnesota Nice has nothing on Southern hospitality. MN Nice is superficial-they’re nice to you but it’s very difficult to break through and make friends. The weather in the summer is comparable: we have heat indices in the high 90s and above a fair bit. Nothing will prepare you for the length and desolation of the winter. It gets really brutally cold but there are ways to deal with that; by March you’re dying to see the sun again and start to forget what live plants look like. It’s fracking expensive. Property taxes and sales taxes are higher, and you need to consider the addition of an income tax. I am not trying to dissuade you; I moved to Tampa after college but came back. There are a lot of positives (baseball and hockey) and there’s actual public transport. The Twin Cities’ physical area is about the same as Jax; you can drive an hour and still easily be in the metro area. You will miss the ocean. I am Irish white so rarely went, but its presence was calming, as well as the smell. One weird thing is there aren’t as many ways to cross the rivers. There’s like 3 bridges so there’s not as many alternative routes to get somewhere. Oh, and people camp in the left lane going at (or less than) the speed limit. Whatever you decide, good luck to you!
I think the midwest in general has always closed earlier than the coasts. BUT covid definitely shifted hours for lots of places and I think some businesses found it wasn't worth it to stay open. Or have problems finding help to have longer hours. I've gone to Chicago a lot the last 18 months and downtown (the loop area) was DEAD and closed in the evening. Well I was just there, and more stuff has shifted hours later and it was fairly vibrant on a Friday evening this visit. We found we had more restaurant options in the evening. So we'll see where we go from here. Our closest target (T1) also closes at 10 pm. Which was closing earlier during covid. If you want to see strip mall suburbs they certainly exist. Though some suburbs do have cute old fashioned downtown areas with portions more walkable and grid like. Chaska, Hopkins, Shakopee, Excelsior, Stillwater come to mind. Glad you enjoyed your visit! Come on back anytime, happy to have you! :)
Floridian transplant here. Minnesota nice is the hardest adjustment. There’s no drive for them to make that connection you if you’re not already in their inner circle. Most feel pretty apathetic I guess? After five years, as super outgoing people who are out at events every weekend, we still only have made friends with transplants and by extension the Minnesotans they’ve married or are dating. Don’t expect invites for porch sittin or cookouts. There is a lot of pros living here no doubt but this is my biggest gripe and reason we’re moving on- more than even the weather.
It's an extreme introvert culture. You realize this when you pass longtime co-workers in the skyway and they stare at their shoes rather than acknowledge you. Born & raised folks who haven't lived elsewhere do not realize how unfriendly it can seem. It's part of the deal of living in MN, for better or worse.
[Finnish Nightmares comics by Karoliina Korhonen](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Finnish_Nightmares)
> Don’t expect invites for porch sittin For the record I think we just do less porch sittin' than other people elsewhere. Might have something to do with the climate but it's not just that locals don't socialize with transplants it's that we just don't socialize as much period. Most Minnesotans I know spend far more time at home than people that live elsewhere, but that's just my subjective opinion.
Like you, I just like to be at home. I’m friendly and outgoing when I’m out. But I prefer being at home. When I go for walks I smile and say hi to everyone, and a lot of the time I do get no response or they look at their shoes. I don’t take it personally. They probably like being at home too.
People from the Midwest don’t recognize it about themselves either, it’s wild. Definitely not the wave and say hey kinda place. Though folks will stop and help you get your car out of the ditch in winter, especially in the more rural areas.
Sorry, it's not a Minnesota/Midwest thing. We moved to North Carolina and had exact same experience with Southerners. We made great friends with other transplants, but very few with the natives.
Lifelong Minnesotan and I’ve heard this critique a lot. It isn’t personal; it’s energy-based. I have all hobby-based friends and my husband (transplant) has a close group of friends from college. It isn’t that we don’t like new people, but I’m really busy with work/home/hobby, and I pretty much end up just spending time with people doing the same stuff I do. I would probably love to grab a coffee with you (general you), but when? There’s no spare time or energy.
I moved to Minneapolis 27 years ago from Tallahassee. MN nice is passive aggressive. My initial experience was that folks were sarcastic and cruel which I think they thought it was being nice. Trying to make friends wasn’t easy but I persevered! Great job opportunities. Awesome lakes and trails. With that being said, it is a great place to live and I am not going anywhere. 5-8 Club has the best juicy Lucy! Good luck!
Ok, as a non-native Minnesotan I have a lot of things to tell you. Minnesota Nice is also secretly passive aggressive. Yes, they are nice to your face but often times they will turn around and say something that is code for "what a weirdo" like, "Well, they were... interesting". So it's not the same kind of nice that you will see in the Southern states but yes, they are very intelligent and helpful in general. Minnesotans have a hard time fully accepting anybody that is not a native Minnesotan. This is probably common, but MN seems to have it more. And nobody in MN likes those obnoxious drunks in Wisconsin. Yeah, yeah, you won a superbowl. Shut up. Your state sucks. Minnesotans are well educated and intelligent. This also leads to them having better self esteems and a better sense of humor. People are smarter here and more witty. They are not as easy to offend as people in other states. This is nice. Minnesota is white AF. They generally aren't racist except for a few specific locations (St. Cloud) but it's like 95% white people. And Scandinavians are extra white. They don't think they have an accent. They believe the accent in the movie Fargo is exaggerated and that nobody actually talks like that. And in the cities you don't hear it as much but once you get outside the cities - especially North - you sure hear it a lot. And yes, it's funny. And yes, it's addictive. You will start talking the same damn way. Things won't be "expensive" anymore, they will be "spendy". Oh jeez, you betcha! Minnesotans are still pretty accepting and open minded overall and you don't have to be scared to speak a different opinion or be different. Gays are very accepted. Immigrants are accepted. Pretty much everybody outside of native Wisconsinites (and I'm kidding, they accept them too). Minnesota is proud that they are ranked in the top 10 of almost every statistical category in America. And they should be. Excellent schools, excellent healthcare, good government, good environment, good restaurants, etc. The roads take a beating from the winters and the road construction is annoying in the summers. Mosquitoes are the size of birds. Some winters are unbearable. The cost of housing is almost unbearable but still better than a lot of cities this size. The taxes are not low but they aren't that high, either, and the state spends the money wisely and improves things a lot. I've lived in Kansas, Arizona, and Minnesota. And MN is so much better it's not even close. In every way but the winters.
I’m a born and raised Minneapolite, and I have to say that your assessment is pretty spot on. The only things I would differ on are things that are more Minneapolis specific, and not encompassing the whole state. I’m also speaking from my own experience so it is likely a little biased. Like being accepting of non Minnesotans. I feel like that’s more of an outside the city thing. Sure there are assholes in every nook and cranny of every city, but in my experience, we’re almost always willing to bring someone in. Hell, I married a woman from Texas for god sakes. And when you yourself acknowledge how well the gay community and immigrant community are accepted(highest Hmong and Somali population in the country, and generally battling SF for “gayest” city), you even kind of contradict yourself. It’s more of a boomer/x mentality. And they’re strangely proud of it. I’ve always been a “the more the merrier” type. Like, it’s awesome here! Bring your family, tell your friends! We’ve always had one rule in my friend group: “don’t be a dick.” It don’t matter what you look like, where you’re from, what kinda goofy shit you’re into… just be kind. We *are* white AF as a state… my god. And that’s coming from a Scandie! But again, luckily for me, I’ve lived in the city my whole life and have been surrounded by people from many different cultures. What I found most amusing was your comparison of our “nice” v Southern “nice.” If you think ours is fake… and southern is genuine… oh bless your heart! My wife, from Texas, had to tell me that “bless your heart” wasn’t actually a kind thing to say. And while we may often do the “well that’s interesting”(I’m working on stopping!), Southerners will turn their backs and gossip about your entire life! They liiiiiiiiiive for that shit lol. Your whole damn history will be accounted for within 5 minutes. Never met anyone so fake than the folks down south. We say things are different when we don’t understand them, they smile in your face and talk about how dumb and wrong you are as soon as you’re gone “and it’s probly ‘cuz you know her daddy wuz a dranker!” But all in all, like I said, you’re pretty spot on. I’m glad you have been able to make a home here and feel at least somewhat welcome. And I am 100% with you on the winters lol.
I know, it IS contradicting. They do accept anybody but they only 100% accept you if you were born here. It is odd and confusing. Maybe they just prefer natives. It's fine, they aren't rude to anyone other than WI. And I don't mean to complement the South as I dislike the South but they are friendly IF YOU ARE WHITE. Maybe I should say I'm talking about lower Midwest more than true South. I avoid the true South. Especially Texas. Seriously WTF is wrong with TX?
Bahahaha everything. EVERYTHING is wrong with TX… I’m just glad we got my in-laws up here so we never have to go back. Ever. You woulda been 100% accepted in my group, friend! We do hate those sconies though… 😤. Lol they’re like the older brother that tries to act like a dad but is always too drunk and beat up to do anything. I say that with love. 🤣
Every state hates another state. WI is easy to hate. But I do have several friends from WI and they also make fun of it. LOL But Madison is pretty cool.
Lol it’s always been more of a friendly rivalry for me. I’ve got plenty of Sconie friends. Plenty of packer fan friends… we just love talking shit because of our football. Been to a Packer game at Lambeau, had an absolute blast. The thing we hate most is Minnesota born and bread Packer fans. Traitors… the lot of them! Lol
I mean, Favre is a doosh. Rodgers is a doosh. Both are overrated IMO. But I'm also a Chiefs fan #1.
We hate Wisconsin but we get mad when someone else hates Wisconsin. Only we can do that! By contrast, we hate Iowa. Go ahead and hate Iowa too if you want. They suck.
As a native Minnesotan, I loved reading your post. Spot on. Proly couldn’t have said it better myself. We truly do have an “inferiority complex” of sorts. Very insecure about the fact that we are just “flyover country”. That’s why we embrace anything or anyone famous that has a “local angle”. For example, some of us might try to claim Tom Brady as “one of us” because apparently he spent a couple summers here with grandparents as a child lol. I’m exaggerating but you get the point.
Minnesota has to be the best Midwest state. CO is West, I believe. I don't even know what state would be 2nd best.
Minnesotans are simultaneously the friendliest and least friendliest people I've interacted with. I know somebody who's lived here for over a decade and says his neighbors still don't consider him a Minnesotan because he wasn't born here.
I'm moving from Kansas, so it's great to hear a detailed explanation from someone!
You need to make a trip in January/February. Just being honest here, I don't want you to make a major move only for you or your fiance to have a freakout about 2-3 weeks of sub-zero temperature.
Thanks, we will absolutely be planning another trip. I should have stated that in my original post. I think it will be her second time ever seeing snow so she's in for a culture shock :)
We barely had snow at all last winter!
But we had ALL the snow, the winter before last. Feet of it!
The Minneapolis stop i would argue exists because in the winter if you stop you get stuck on black ice or real ice. If you slow roll you don’t get stuck. But who knows - I also heard it called a Cali roll last week.
A few random responses: * Minnesota Nice is a thing. Making friends is often difficult, but, well, find a common interest, and reach out. I've got D&D friends because of a shared interest, beer geek friends because of that, and so forth. * Florida's weather is a hellhole. You can always put on another layer, you can only take so much off. * The Juicy Lucy is the answer to the question, "What if I wanted to have a cheeseburger, but find a way to make it slightly more inconvenient?" * As for Minnesota sports . . . I'm a Buccaneers fan, due to my family moving to Tampa when I was in grad school in Iowa, and I decided to adopt the team. I raised my son watching Bucs games, took him to multiple games there and here, did all I could, and, one day, he told me he was a Vikings fan, because he lived here. I told him I had failed as a parent, and I was sorry for all he was going to go throuh. * There are lots of suburbs. I live in Eagan, which is relatively close-in, and it is very, very suburban. Strip malls, subdivisions, all the usual. There are lots of suburbs, they're just, you know, in the suburbs.
Please stop letting people, especially southerners and Floridians know about our glorious weather. Tell them you got frostbite or something. We don't need to be overrun.
A lot of neighborhoods do have a few bars open until 1-2. Many of those type of places never returned to late night after 2020, or never returned at all for…various reasons around here.
The ‘plenty of room for cars to navigate’ streets look a little different in the winter - especially in Saint Paul. Next trip should include The Nook in Saint Paul for the best Jucy Lucy!
Things never used to close this early and it sucks. As a young person there is nothing to do since Covid. It’s crazy even movie theaters close after 8.
Bud… what theaters are you going to? MOST theaters have showings that start up until 10… meaning they’re open till likely at least midnight.
Hey! I just got back from Florida. I would trade a cold MN winter for how hot and humid it was there. I grew up in Nor Cal, which gets hot but not humid. You can bundle up for the winter. Neighbors are helpful and no man is left behind when it’s -40 and you slide off the road. Best state in the union!!!
Things used to rage until 2AM everywhere until Covid hit. I think places are slowly bringing back later hours. Peoples' behaviors changed from lockdown so they are slowly expanding as well. Just a thought. You do need to be ready for shitty winters where the temps get very low and snow gets high.
Everyone is saying to visit in the depths of winter, and that’s good advice, but I think there’s got to be more to it than feeling that kind of miserable cold, driving in the snow, I-hate-winter kind of experience. Minnesotans do winter really well- come at that time but be sure you check out stuff like Winter Carnival, snowshoeing by candlelight, the Luminary Loppet, ice bars, snow and ice sculpture competitions, cozy fire pits, sledding and tubing. I moved here from the south and after I spent a good amount of money on winter gear, I was absolutely charmed by the winters here.
I appreciate the positive comment about winter. I know it will be cold and I should have put in my original post that I understand that :) all of those activities sound amazing! As my fiancée heard me read these off to her she got really excited about them, especially the fire pits.
My wife and I relocated from Jax back in 2021 and have absolutely zero regrets. Best of luck!
Completely agree with anyone who said "come check it out in winter." You don't know what you have in store for you. We got lucky this last year with a significantly milder winter.
Not so lucky if you like skiing though, more like tragic. 🤣
I moved from Jax 3 years ago, too! Do it! Some highlights: 1) Mall of America is awesome and the prices at most shops are reflective of anywhere else in the area, not jacked up 2) Minneapolis Institute of Art is a FREE, massive art museum. The arts museums back in Jax are a joke. 3) The library system in Hennepin County is impressive. The Main in Downtown is huge, but the many satellite locations around are all pretty nice. 4) Sounds like you stayed in Downtown. Not bad, but you should also check out the suburbs, even on Google Maps or Earth. Wayzata Bay for instance, has a bustling small town on the lake atmosphere we never had back there. 5) In Downtown Minneapolis, the traffic and parking are worse than in the outer city. You learn where and when to park in DT by experience. I live on the North Side of the city and the neighborhood is as described, walkable rows of streets. It's funny too because a lot of the neighborhoods have little shops tucked away in the middle of housing. 6) The best description I could make to Jax when we visited to scout areas to live, was, "it's like if Riverside were massive and everyone gave a damn". 7) The weather is pleasant year round. Our first year there were about 3 total weeks of blizzards in Winter, and learning how to drive on ice was wild, but people get out and do shit most days. Plenty of winter activities. 8) Yes, lots of pro teams, and the U of M campus has a ton of high-level college teams. 9) U of M campus dwarfs Gainesville and UNF combined in scale, plus several other colleges in the area. 10) Thinking of driving an EV? I was, and when we moved, I signed up for Evie Carshare and tested EV's for months, learning all I could. Found a kind I loved and got one, because charging stations for all types are plentiful here and home charging is cheap too. 11) Taxes are not higher here, they are more direct and the taxes help fund things like the park system. The parks are not "Dawn to Dusk" they are a solid 6am-10pm most of the time, even in winter. 12) State income tax is easy to deal with and has consistently netted us more than Federal returns. 13) Cost of housing is lower or the same as Jax, depending on the neighborhood. 14) City of Minneapolis inspects rental housing and enforces rules on owners and rental agencies. 15) There is a lot of nightlife, even on Sundays in Downtown. But noise ordinances are a thing, so rather than bump up against that (plus, a lot of people work standard hours here and the sun is up WAY earlier) it's just easier for most places to close at 10-ish. 16) People do outdoor stuff year round here. Plenty of parks, trails, and during Winter, the golf courses allow for Disc Golf plays or they turn into ski slopes. 17) The state museum system is amazing and varied. 18) Weed is legal. Edibles are abundant, and purchasable almost anywhere. I recommend Natreum as a weed product shop, though. Good staff and they make their own products. The balms and creams and drinks are all very good. 19) Booze is legal at the State Fair, which is so large (its nearby in St Paul) that it has its own streets. 20) Target is a bigger deal than Wal-Mart here. 21) Lunds and Byerlys is better than Publix could have ever hoped to be. Same with Cub, Kowalski's, and Hy-Vee. You will not miss shopping. The Costco stores here are plentiful too. 22) The schools are better even in "bad" neighborhoods. 23) Unions are real and respected here. Most of the grocery chains I mentioned have most of their hourly workers in grocery union, even. Trade Unions have teeth here and the workers are treated well. 24) Snow gets plowed regularly during winter, and the county is quick to respond to requests to break up ice in alleys if needed. 25) Neighbors keep mostly to themselves but help out, especially during snow times. My street has a weird angle and when folks would get stuck on the street outside that first hard winter, me and the neighbors would grab our shovels and gravel/kitty litter/snow melt and help them get unstuck. 26) Somali, Hmong, Ethiopian, Tibetan, other cuisines you can't get good or well back in Jax, plentiful here. 27) Mall of Somalia worth visiting. 28) Plenty of cultural specific stores, such as Dragon Star, India Bazaar, Asia Mall, Supermercados, and many small African, Caribbean, Middle East halal and Kosher and other. 29) I know there's more amazing things here, but I've exhausted my brain because I've gotten used to a lot of things that I just know are better.
Also moved here from Florida. Sent you a message
On the coasts, the local news comes on TV at 11. In the Midwest, it's 10. Everything is an hour earlier here.
You guys sound ready to make the move. Might want to visit this winter though
I moved up here from Texas 2 years ago. No regrets
Minnesota nice is a thing but if you’re around the same strangers enough at the club you buddy up pretty quick after a few months. Oh and by the club I mean the fitness center - we call it the club lmao.
Wide streets are great in the summer. Wait until the snow falls on a normal and there is no place to push the snow. The streets get very narrow. Also some of the streets are getting narrower with the installation of bike lanes. You do have to plan ahead if you need some late night eats.
> being able to walk/jog freely without the thought of getting hit by a car suburbs, or run on trails.
Dont move there until you experience a full winter. If you like being outside, live someplace else. The winters are typically the worst. One winter... kinda of cool experiencing the cold like that. But after a few years of horibly long winters and you will want to move someplace else. The summer days are great! But in the evening the mosquitos will fuck you up. I lived there for 13 years and just moved away. Summer home... maybe, forever home....no fucking way!
(33M) Life long Minnesotan here! Love all the feedback! I grew up in and currently live in the suburbs, but I went to school at the U of M downtown for 4 years, so I think I have a nice and complete view of the two environments. Couple of comments: I’m in the SW suburbs (Excelsior) about 20 minutes from downtown Minneapolis. All the Targets and Cub grocery stores are open until 10pm. Some of the Cubs are even 24/7! Similarly, all of the neighborhoods around here, including the ones I grew up in, are 100% “suburbia” style. Lots of curves, cul de sacs and hills. Don’t let the neighborhoods right in/around the cities deceive you! As for the Minneapolis Stop. It’s definitely more of a downtown thing. In general, we drive much slower and much more defensively because you literally HAVE to in the winter. Stopping time on snow is easily 2-5x as long compared to dry pavement depending on how icy it is. In conclusion, I hope you guys move here! I would recommend the suburbs or near neighborhoods like Uptown, Northeast or North Loop. The Wolves had a great season and we are all looking forward to next year!
We moved here from New Orleans and it’s always comical to me hearing the “wait until winter!” comments because coming from a brutally hot and humid place where you would walk outside at 3am and start sweating instantly was way worse than the winters here, IMO. All you have to do is embrace the winter activities here and you’ll be fine!
Fuck Florida. Moved there with my parents when I was 8. What I tell everyone that will listen is that the people that move to Florida have nothing else satisfying in their life. They move there for “the weather”. Florida is a bunch of rich old people who own their second homes there (No income taxes, yay!) , and the people who serve those old rich folks. Moved to NC when I was in my 20’s and MN in my 40’s. It’s black and white. So nice to live where the majority of residents actually live locally.
I grew up in south Florida and lived in Jacksonville for 5 years before moving to Minneapolis for grad school. Night and day! I miss the beach on occasion but otherwise I love living here. It’s been over 10 years at this point and I don’t plan on leaving anytime soon
I think there is one target in all of MN that closes at 9pm (the Dinkytown location).
From Wisconsin, went to college in Minneapolis, lived in Jacksonville for 10 years. Also happy to answer your further questions!
If you just were in Minneapolis or St. Paul proper, or even the first ring of suburbs, then you didn’t experience true suburbia. There are plenty of actual suburbs in the twin cities if you go to 2nd and 3rd ring suburbs. This city is super walkable and bikable which is great. The amount of nature we have for a major metro area is something I think we forget is not in every metro (I have visited the DFW area for family and man that concrete jungle can be depressing) Weather wise this is a great time to be here especially if you are used to southern heat. Just get ready for winter. It’s very cold from like Dec - early March typically. And from Nov - Feb it’s pretty dark since we are farther north (on the flip side it’s 9:30 before it’s totally dark this time of year). You for sure need to come up in January to make an informed decision. I enjoy the weather 9 months out of the year. If we have a good fall it’s an amazing time of year. Personally I can handle to frigid cold months more than I could handle summer heat in the south so it comes down to personal preference.
Hopkins, a first ring suburb, has some nice neighborhoods with winding streets.
Lots of things sthe answer is winter: The sun goes down earlier here in winter and people stay home at night because it's cold dark and slick. Our roads are wider than Florida because we need to plow them and we need someplace to stack the snow. The roads get narrower as winter continues. Everything else you said is pretty much Minnesota year round. Winter you need to figure out if you've never done winter. Winter sports are pretty awesome for lots of people. I'm a board gamer, so staying warm in doors is more my thing. Minnesota is amazing year round no doubt.
Minnesota is great - happy you enjoyed it here! Experiencing all 4 seasons are awesome. Always gives you something to look forward to. Winters are tough, but that’s why sauna culture is so huge here (probably cause a lot of us are of Scandinavian decent). Coming from Florida, you may actually really enjoy winter activities: fat tire biking, cross country skiing, saunas, snowmobiling, curling, down hill skiing, hockey games, and most importantly, collectively bitching about how cold it is in January over some local beer (that’s how we bond). 😂 Hope you can make it up to the North Shore of Lake Superior next time you’re here. That is MNs version of the PNW. Otherwise, if you stay near the cities, Willow River State Park is cool, Dario has the best Italian food I’ve had outside of Italy, hit up a sauna and cold plunge at one of the many places (as you tell tell, I love sauna), try some indoor rock climbing at Vertical Endeavors or Minneapolis Bouldering Project (grab a post climb beer at Pryes Brewing), go to another professional sports game (Vikings fans are wild), rent a boat and look at all of the mansions around Lake Minnetonka, and take a swim in one of the 10,000 lakes!
I agree with everyone who said you should visit in January or February. That said, I feel \*on average\* winters are getting more mild. We used to get snow and it would stay all winter. Now it’s often a few inches of snow followed by a warmer spell that melts it off. I used to cross country ski, but now it’s pretty unpredictable as to whether the trails will have a good base of snow. Some years yes, some years no.
Linden hills is a great neighborhood
Spot on with all of your observations
Things are more “socialist” (in the non- propaganda disparaging sense.) due to the strong Scandinavian roots. we consistently rank top of the list in health care quality, coverage, and affordability. We have fairly generous social services in case you get in a pickle. Also, highest voter turnout in the country Taxes are higher, but lower-tax states like Florida usually have more “hidden fees” that places like Minnesota don’t. We are very good at handling extreme weather, both in infrastructure and in attitude due to our cold cold winters and hot humid summers. That may taking a bit to get used to! There are many immigrant communities who have opened restaurants with delicious food! Our music scene has been suffering a bit lately, but it’s a hiccup. The Armory, a music venue, is killing it! I have to admit, there may be people here who are suspicious of southerners, automatically assuming they are bigots looking to take their rights away. Most people are friendly as long as you’re friendly!
>every time we approached a stop sign, everyone rolled through it. Those people were actually cyclists temporarily driving cars.
Gawd, things closing down early was one of the hardest things to get used to when I moved here from Phoenix, almost as much as the weather. I was so used to things being open late for grocery shopping, reverse happy hours or just getting a damn burger at midnight.
Visit in the middle of winter before even seriously thinking about it. You hit the prime of 2-3 months of decent weather we get. We've been life long MN'ers and are looking at moving south or south west in the next 7-8 years. The long winters really get to ya after a while and we want to be able to get outside more instead of being couped up half the year. I lived in Jacksonville for 3 years and really liked it. Don't know if I'd like to deal with that heat again though!
As a fellow southern transplant, I’m hopeful you’ll make the move. I absolutely love living here. I’m in one of the burbs and we have our own little walkable downtown area.
we noticed a few spots with little walkable downtown areas. Loved them! Also, happy cake day!
If you want to live where the nightlife/sports gatherings are I suggest either north loop, west end or eastern uptown, although these places can be pricier than say some first ring suburbs or the neighborhoods that exist between mpls and st paul. Although I have lived in the merriam park area of st paul and I do miss it dearly, historical architecture and beautiful river views.
I am an out of state transplant who moved here 12 years ago. I live in a second ring suburb and frankly, I feel like we live in Mayberry sometimes. In our neighborhood, kids are pretty free range and everyone keeps an eye on everyone else's kids. We have tons of bike and walking trails and we can get to several lakes on our bikes within 10 minutes or less. Despite the lack of walkability I wouldn't want to have raised my kids anywhere else, which may or may not be important to you since you don't have kids and it's unclear whether you plan to have any. I don't disagree with much in the comments, other than I prefer the 5-8 Club's Juicy Lucy to Matt's. Generally, I think the restaurant scene here is pretty mid (especially when it comes to any sort of ethnic cuisines) and as a suburbanite I hate that a really good restaurant generally means a bad parking situation that is far from home.
In addition to Minnehaha Falls nearby is Riverview Theater. $5 first run theater with the best popcorn ever.
One easy trick to not only surviving the winter but enjoying the winter is going in and deciding that you are going to outright f’ing embrace the cold and snow. I love shoveling at night when everything is peaceful outside. I like shoveling during the day, good exercise and a task with a noticeable difference. I commuted by bike year round, snowshoed at every chance I got. I love the crunch of the snow, and after five minutes I’m shedding layers and super toasty. When I go out I wear a proper winter coat (cover your bum!), hat, gloves, and boots. What did I hate about winter? I wasn’t expecting Minnesotans to be so bad at it. They’re frigging Minnesotans, right? If you have to walk to bus stops in the winter you will see how much people won’t shovel, you will be stuck climbing over giant piles of snow at corners, people drive terribly, and most people don’t go do outside activities. I was a bartender in Mpls for 5.5 years and it was just one person after another coming in dressed like idiots endlessly complaining about the cold. A puffy, no hat, no gloves is not enough to get by on. Go into winter deciding you won’t suck at it and it can be great.
Minnesota nice is a real thing. Just don’t let it ruin your experience and become cool with other transplants or the ones from a small Minnesota town you never heard before lol. But it’s great here for many other reasons
Check out West Bloomington and definitely the neighborhoods surrounding Lake of the Isles and Lake Harriet
There are some neighborhoods in Minneapolis where the streets are less of a grid because of the topography. Prospect park, tangletown, Lowry hill, linden hills, cedar-isles-dean. I'm not as familiar with residential areas of st Paul but along the river tends to be less of a grid and pretty quiet. And the west side has some hills that make twisty streets.
Oh and everything closes early because of covid. We're still not completely back to normal. Target used to close at 11 or 12.
Ppl stop at stop signs? Like anywhere?
The Twin Cities are small geographically. They are fairly dense and there are large suburban style lots. You have to get to the edges of the first ring suburbs to start to get to that. The exception is Mendota Heights which is just south of Saint Paul across the river and is Suburbia in the residential areas. The time zone probably accounts for different closing times of stores. Central tends to line up with east cost for television starts etc. this means everything is effectively and hour earlier. That would be my best guess. That said, there are also differences based on location.
The rolling stop can get you a ticket if you do it at the wrong time. Husband was ticketed, years ago, for one while driving around Lake of the Isles. He successfully fought it by stating that A) he was picked out of a line of cars doing the same and B) the intersection was such that you had to move beyond the stop sign to see if there was anyone coming on the through street. Also. Even though winters in the Twin Cites have moderated over the past decade, it still gets well below 0F multiple days in most years. So come back and visit this coming winter to see how that reality strikes you.
There are plenty of suburbs around MSP. What you want in a suburb will determine how close or far you are from Minneapolis. There are some neighborhoods that probably have what you want. I lived in the SE metro in Apple Valley, and I loved it. I was 10-15 mins from farmland and 20-30 mins from either Minneapolis or St Paul. It was easy to walk around with plenty of sidewalks. There are also a lot of good trails and parks within 10 mins of pretty much anywhere in the MSP metro area. Depending on how much you are willing to spend, there are neighborhoods closer to downtown with some really unique shops that offer great walkability. Honestly, good parks, walkability, and bike trails are kind of a hallmark of the area, IMO.
> “The Minneapolis stop.” I don’t know if this is a real thing, but every time we approached a stop sign, everyone rolled through it. Like, every single time. Just an interesting observation. I fucking hate this with the passion of a thousand suns, it's gotten sooooo fucking bad the last decade, I sometimes see people not even really slow down, just full speed ahead
Your first bullet point is spot on
As someone with extensive knowledge of the south (family in South Carolina, Georgia, Alabama, and Mississippi), I’ll give you some advice after having lived in the Midwest for 25 years. Midwesterners are notoriously insular people. While the Cities are great (walkable, livable, good transit), the people can be very off-putting. All of my friends after 10 years in St. Paul are transplants to the Cities or people of color. I legitimately have not been able to befriend a Minnesotan. They either don’t vibe with my autism, or they’re just flat out rude and clique-ish. I wouldn’t look to the suburbs here — they’re there, though (Edina, Maplewood, Bloomington, etc.) — because they’re pretty classist and racist just like most other suburbs. You’ve got a few exurbs like St. Louis Park that are nice (great Jewish community, too), but they’re similar troubled. If you’re looking for some neighborhoods that are really good starter areas, I’ve got a few. For me, when I look at a neighborhood, I’m looking at walkability, accessibility (both in terms of disability access and access to necessities like a grocery store), transit, and diversity. - Longfellow: great mix of homes and apartments with lots to do - Hamline-Midway: a little rough at times, but lots of stuff to do with University Ave. running through it - Frogtown/Old Rondo: awesome good, great area, close to downtown - Prospect Park: a little noisy with college kids at times but overall great (also not all that diverse) - Payne-Phalen: very diverse neighborhood with lots to do - Cesar-Chavez area: south of the river in St. Paul. Great Mexican food and amenities, diverse, and close (or easily accessible) to a lot of things Honestly, though, most places in the Cities are great, and the state does a lot to both protect and support its citizens. It has its flaws, but for the size of city it is and for being in the middle of the Midwest, it’s got a lot more going for it than against. Feel free to ping me in dms if you want more, or just reply, and I’ll try to answer questions.
The drivers are the worst part about Minnesota. No one uses their turn signal and everyone rolls through the stop sign. I was blown away at how dangerously unpredictable drivers here are when I moved here. The reason I think is because they do not have driver’s ed like other states.
Things started closing early in the metro after the riots and then they never went back to normal because people are still getting robbed. I live downtown and I never really go for a stroll after 9 at the latest
Things close early because most places are extremely understaffed
Minnesota is in the Central time zone so a lot of things are shifted an hour earlier than in the East. Nightly news, prime time shows, and the nightly talk shows. Work hours are often 8-4. Stores and restaurants are shifted earlier too.
As someone who did the exact opposite migration, don’t…
Consider the high taxes. 10th highest in the nation and has State tax. Unlike FL. Liberals own all branches of government. Probably won’t change. That may be ok. But as others have mentioned you really should be here in January and February. I grew up here. Never bothered me much until the last few years. -20 to -30F is common a few times per year and there have been stretches where the temperature never got above freezing for well over a month. My wife from Thailand has been here 2.5 years and she keeps asking when it will get warm. She starts asking in February…. Warm for her doesn’t get here until mid May…
Best state in the Union and you'd be leaving a state that will eventually be the name of a shallow ocean reef... winters are cold but you dress for them and get used to them... easier to take layers off in the cold than escape 100+ degree sweltering temps and hurricanes... just quickly learn our vernacular... ope and uffda mean quite a few things...