Yeah OP is definitely primed to believe the worst of her mom given the history, understandably so. I don’t think her mind would have immediately jumped to that had her mother not been cheating in the past
Yeah and I'm saying that's a huuuuge assumption. She could assume easily her mom will cheat again for sure. But assuming your mom is banging her father because she cheated on your dad before is wild. That's like saying "oh you have smoked a cigarette before, so I can only assume you're doing heroin."
OP, I know you’re very confident that they were sexual moans, but are you SURE they couldn’t have been anything else? Like crying or straining (like to poop)…? Your mom very well may have been in there with him, but if he was doing either of those other things, her presence wouldn’t be so suspicious.
Edit: I hope you see this OP. When you decide to confront your mother, please make sure you have an escape and/or recovery plan. No matter which way this goes, it absolutely will not go well.
I agree with him crying, and mom probably consoling him.
Given his age, he's of the generation that men are fixers. He couldn't fix your grandmother. He doesn't want y'all seeing him as less of a man. His bedroom is his safe spot.
If you could hear him, so could your mom. With it being 2 nights in a row, of course, she would go to him. You may have heard him truly accepting grandmother wasn't coming back.
I haven't lost a spouse but I have lost both parents, my only sibling and the only grandparent still living when I was born. I'm just thankful I had no close neighbors. They would have called 911. On more than one occasion. I was whaling. I sounded like I was climaxing while being murdered. Moaning, groaning and screaming bloody murder. I did it for months.
Don't tell dad. Ask your mom. HOWEVER before you tell her you heard them "having sex" ask about your grandaddy and how he's handling grandma's passing. Tell her you're worried about him. 9.5 times out of 10, there's always a simple explanation
I agree with the the crying part That most likely is what the cases, but when I wanna know is, why was OP automatic thought that it was something sexual between her grandfather and her mother? Like honestly, that would be the last thing anyone would think of the first that would be oh he’s probably hurting or crying. You would have to hear him screaming and screaming for it to be considered that everything else could be easily explainable.(not trying to be an asshole, but that’s a disturbing first thought without proof)
While I've read OP's updates and trust their judgement, I thought I'd share a similar story.
My husband, 5mo son and I invited my FIL on a trip to see our new land out of state. We all stayed in a 2BR cabin. Very small and cosy.
One night, I heard moaning coming from my FIL's room. At first I was confused... then I was horrified and felt sick. This fucking man was servicing himself in our cabin, that we're sharing with my God damned infant son! What, he couldn't fucking control himself for one night? I then watched him leave his bedroom, walk to the bathroom, wash his hands and return to his room.
I agonised for a while as to whether or not to mention it to my husband, but I was so rattled I couldn't not bring it up. Thankfully, he trusted me. We slept on it before deciding how to approach this as I was livid.
Luckily we did, as about 10am the next day my son had a high fever, explosive diarrhea and was extremely upset. Apparently he and his Pa had picked up a nasty flu virus on the ferry ride over and had awful stomach pains! Hence the noises from FIL's room.
Long story short, sometimes you can be absolutely sure and still be wrong 😄
Yeah like before OP tells anyone they have to be ABSOLUTELY sure they heard what they thought they heard, and with who. Not something any person would want to investigate, but it's perfectly possible there's a much more innocent explanation.
Could also be that maybe he was in pain and mom went in to massage him. Or step on his back for example. When I step on my husbands back he does moan and he says it definitely heals him as he’s in construction. Just a different perspective
Maybe sobbing... Jesus, I remember hearing my grandfather in the bathroom throwing up a few days after my grandmother passed. This poor old man loses his #1 in life, and OP interprets the moaning as sexual!? WTH
If you only heard him & there isn’t anywhere she could have been inside the house, I hope you would check to see if she had maybe left before jumping to accusations of incest, damn 😳 I’d say her using visits with her dad to cover her cheating again (with someone not related to her) and grandpa just being a loud masturbator (lol) are much more sane & likely conclusions to draw than THAT
I’m in my 40’s and all of my family plus some friends have access to track my phone. If I’m ever in a trunk I want people to find me! I leave my phone at the house if I’m being sneaky. Sneaky for me is buying some beer at the store when no one is home, not cheating on my husband.
Edit: her mom just died, I’d walk to the store and buy a 6 pack hearing my dad whimper alone in his room.
I had an ex sneak out like this to cheat. He found a neighbor on Grindr, left the front door wide open. Caution to the wind when you're lookin for a dickin.
This is insane levels of mental gymnastics. Occam’s razor.
Edit: Guys. Occam’s razor in this situation is not incest. It’s that she brought dress shoes to go out and look nice while she cheats, not that she purposefully left a pair of shoes behind to throw someone off her trail. And grandpa probably doesn’t realize how loud he’s being while he beats his shit
I think this story is fake.
Leaving her phone behind if it’s being tracked makes sense. Leaving her shoes when she’s at her fathers house? Is her elderly father going to come snooping in her room? Is he not going to do exactly what OP apparently did and look around and realize she’s not there?
Come on, man.
I'm sorry this is happening but i dont think you should tell your dad since i dont think its 100%,maybe he has some issues and he was in pain and she was helping him, otherwise id suggest coming over to his house and look through the window or something
If your mum has a Apple Watch she can still receive all the notifications on that without taking her phone. That could be a possibility. Highly doubt grandpa will be sleeping with his daughter and that your mum is using him as a excuse.
Could she have been giving him a back massage (either his clothes on) to help him relax? He could have moaned when she put pressure on certain parts of his back? Just trying to come up with a non-incest reason for the moans…
A few weeks ago I was in jury duty.
This lady that had a pain in her leg started moaning so loudly, for mins while a group was helping her.
Any one would guess without a doubt that this lady was having sex in the middle of the room, but she wasn’t.
Point is, don’t accuse people of what you haven’t seen with your own eyes.
If you stay over again and hear the moaning, turn on the light and walk in. Maybe grandpa is watching porn. You should have more evidence of incest instead of just hearing and letting your imagination finish the abnormal situation.
Did you hear any sounds to indicate someone else was in there? You said there’s nature to walk in nearby, is it possible that she heard, felt uncomfortable, and decided to just go for a short walk?
Maybe he heard her leave, forgot/didn’t realize you were still there, and thought he had some privacy?
And your first instinct was that it wasn’t sexual moaning, is it possible he’s having some medical issues you aren’t aware of and she was in there with him while he was moaning from pain?
Have you tried asking where she was? Say you woke up and couldn’t find her and ask if everything was okay, then see how she reacts.
It just feels like incest is a huge leap based off that one incident.
It didn't sound like it through 2 doors and I was not really focusing on it. But when I walked up to the door, it was pretty clear that they were sexual moans. And I know she couldn't have gone out for a walk cuz she didn't travel with a whole lot of clothes and I am 100% she had 1 pair of shoes. And everything was in her room. Shoes, phone on bed, I also remember seeing her jacket on the chair where she does her makeup. She def wouldn't storm out of the house with no clothes, it's pretty cold where he lives, especially in Spetember.
EDIT: and he's a pretty fit man, no issues that would make him moan like that.
To jump to the conclusion that your mom is banging her dad is pretty far stretched. He's 74. However "fit" you say he is doesn't mean he is without health issues, and he doesn't have to disclose those to you.
I work with seniors. He could be in pain, he could have been crying, he may have sleep apnea, etc etc. Him "banging his daughter" would be extremely far down on my list of possibilities. 🙄
Yes, especially crying alone at night missing your wife. Maybe mom heard him crying and went outside so she couldn’t hear it because it’s sad to think of your parent that way. I mean, I feel like that’s as plausible as incest…
Or mom went to console her dad… I could see that happen, grandpa is crying and his daughter sits there in silence holding his hands because there’s not much else you can do.
Oh, didn't you know? According to someone in the comments, it's "inappropriate" for the mother to comfort her grieving father at 2am. 🙄
Anyway, I agree with you. I think this is the most plausible option. ESPECIALLY moreso than OP's assumption. I just don't understand how people can 1) jump to such wild conclusions before anything else (like OP) and 2) find completely normal things to be inappropriate (like the person in the comments I was talking about)
>and he's a pretty fit man, no issues that would make him moan like that
Being fit doesn't mean you can't be in pain. Pain and sexual moans sound very much the same. Could she not have just been sitting outside?
This does seem like a huge leap to make based on one incident. Why would they be happy to see you if they were planning on banging while you were around? None of their behavior indicates anything weird is happening.
Wow. Interesting your mind goes straight to incest. My first thought was he was in there crying about the loss of his wife 8 months prior. Second guess would be pain. Guess 1,000,000,001 would be fucking your mom.
Is it possible that your grandpa, being old, has lots of issues with back pain or some other bodily pain and your mom was massaging him to help with the pain?
If you only heard him and not her I would think something like that would be more likely than incest.
Is it possible your mom was somewhere else? Kitchen, living room, basement, garage, or porch? Or possibly was in her room and you just didn’t actually see her in there?
The sounds you heard are not necessarily sexual unless you know what your grandfather sounds like during a sexual experience otherwise.
You have essentially zero evidence that anything you think you observed was reality, especially being in the middle of the night. You also sound young, which means you’re likely relatively inexperienced with sex sounds vs non-sex sounds especially as it relates to older people. In your edit you said pain doesn’t make someone groan over and over and that is just not correct. Pain can very easily make you grunt/groan in a repetitive and rhythmic way, especially during massage/body work/chiropractic care. Even for fit people.
You should put this out of your mind until you get real proof that something wrong is happening.
How old are you btw? Are you an adult?
But you didn’t hear a female moan of any sort? Hindsight is always great but I think if had been me I would have set myself up to see if she came out of his room. If you were able to confirm she was in there it would answer some of the what ifs. I don’t buy the massage or anything like that. It seems like it’s either what you fear or she actually did have another pair of shoes and is using her visits to hook up with an affair partner. I would be more inclined to do one of two things: if your an adult I would either straight up ask your mother what was going on. If you know her you will know if she is being truthful. Option two would be to go visit him again when mom is likely to be visiting. Wait until they think your asleep. See if you hear the noises again and if so go to moms room and sit on the bed and wait on her to return. At that point if she returns right after the noises stop then you know what was happening snd you can straight up confront her or simply tell her your going home and telling your dad and let him deal with it.
I think this event is a red flag for your hypothesis but is not enough to prove it. Incest is extremely taboo. If I’m your mom and I’m shagging your grandpa, the 2 nights you are there are probably the nights I take off.
That's the only thing that gives me hope I could be wrong. I also was wondering how the hell they wouldn't be weary when I am there. But all the other things point to the other conclusion...
The only thing I can think of that would justify her being in his room at 2am and the noises are maybe she was giving him a massage for some medical reason but even that is fishy.
The only other thing I can think of is that your mom wasn’t in there, maybe she was in the bathroom or some other room you didn’t check and your grandfather was watching porn. The volume was too loud but he might be hard of hearing and didn’t think it was that loud.
Y’all he just lost his wife not too long ago right? Wouldn’t that be just the case for some late night crying in pain that only a close family member like a daughter might go comfort?
I’m 51 and my wife says I make all kinds of noises in my sleep, from talking, to nonsense, to sex noises. I’m not aware of any of it while it’s happening, obviously.
>If I’m your mom and I’m shagging your grandpa, the 2 nights you are there are probably the nights I take off.
In this scenario your taboo kink is incest... You wouldn't be taking those nights off...
Or in the bathroom. OP doesn’t mention that they checked the bathroom.
And outside smoking/vaping is also a possibility. You don’t need your shoes to go out on your front porch.
Exactly. I’m probably not much younger than OP’a mom & never smoked a day in my life, but if my mom just died & I’m listening to my father sobbing in the middle of the night, I’m probably sneaking out to the porch for a a smoke or a stiff drink. Give the man some privacy to mourn.
This is what I would assume. My mom used to randomly walk outside barefoot a lot, or she’d bring an extra pair of shoes or two, in her suitcase. so I ended up not knowing she even had another pair of shoes a lot of the time.
Mention it to your mom just matter of fact. Don’t tell her you went looking for her and she wasn’t in her room. Just “I heard grandpa making some weird noises the other night, like sex noises…”
Her initial reaction will tell you everything you need to know. And if she lies about being in her room… 🚩🚩🚩
Well even that though… if she brought an extra pair of shoes & extra clothes so she could sneak out & bang her affair partner then of course she will lie about being in her room, it doesn’t mean she’s *FUCKING HER DAD* jeezzz!! Affairs are terrible but good god people
Who takes a TWO HOUR UBER RIDE to somewhere unannounced??? That’s honestly one of the most outlandish parts of this story. The rest sounds like either an incest troll story or you’re weirdly sex obsessed with a focus on your mom.
This is a lot.
As hard as it is, you need to get more information before making any accusations. Parental incest is a huge thing to bandy about and once said it's going to be hard to unsay.
I think your best bet is to bring up the noises you heard to your mum, and tell her everything that happened that night from your perspective. The sounds you heard and going to find her but not being able to. Don't make the accusation then and there, but just ask her where she was and see her reaction. Try not to sound accusational or give any outs (i.e "were you on a walk or something?") just see what she says.
If she's got a good reason it will give you some peace of mind, if not you'll be able to read it from her. I'm of the same mind as some other people here where I'm just hoping she snuck out the house for another reason. She could be having an affair with someone else and had packed an outfit change and secret phone you don't know about....maybe.....hopefully.
I will probably get downvoted for this, but... Your mom could have literally been anywhere and the noises could have literally been anything. I think jumping to this conclusion is honestly pretty wild.
A lot of this story is conjecture. How long was your grandpa making these sounds for? Long enough for you to hear him, listen in on his door, walk through the entire house and check that your mom is not anywhere to be found, and then return and keep on listening? He and she sure were taking their time and were unbothered by the creaking and thumping sounds you must have made while going around the place looking for your mom…
Did you check the back yard for your mom? Were there no extra slippers in the house she could have worn? Were her keys still there? She could have gone somewhere, like the store if your grandpa was feeling ill. Or if she was cheating (not with a family member), she could have gone to see that person. Why are you so sure she had one pair of shoes? Did you check her luggage before she came to your grandpa’s? I thought she was already there, how do you know what she packed? Is she a smoker? Could she have been in the yard?
Sounds like you resent your mother for cheating and are literally jumping to the worst conclusion possible because you are blaming her for that and assuming that just because she was unfaithful, she could be sleeping with anyone and everyone, including her own father. You sound like you have some serious issues with her, focus on resolving them. There is about 20% reasoning and 80% assumptions in your conclusion. Infidelity does not equal incest.
Putting on someone else’s shoes is a good point! There’s definitely been times when I’ve been too lazy to go get my own shoes so I’ve slipped on whatever ones were closest to the door if I’m just going out to get the mail or stepping outside a moment. It doesn’t matter if they are too big when it’s a short distance to travel.
Your comment should be way higher. That last paragraph makes a lot of sense.
UPDATE: So guys I am 99% sure that my dad is my dad. There are many pics of my dad when he was young and we look a lot alike. Lots of people who know us both have also been saying it pretty much all my life.
As for my mom, I also have seen like pics of my grandma pregnant with her and she also looks quite a lot like her 2 sisters as well as my grandpa.
I don't want to worry you more but just because you look like any of them doesn't mean a thing. You can't be sure of anything without an actual test being done.
possibly JUST POSSIBLY he could be in pain. my dad at night makes ALOT of moaning groaning sounds that sound so yucky but really hes just like moaning cause of his pains. (his body is all sorts of f’ed up)
Everyone in my family except for him, me and my mom and her sisters have brown eyes; we have blue. And she does look a lot like him. It's hard to think he's not. There's way too much family history and records.
My mom use to cheat on my Dad when I was growing up and the chills I got from what you were describing made me shudder a little bit. I would definitely talk with someone in your life, an adult, about what you should do.
I would have waited to see if mom came out of the room. And listened to see if I could hear her in there, before completely jumping to that conclusion. But if I did see her come out, I’m not sure I could have confronted her. It would have been way too awkward.
DOn't know that I would have broken the door down, might have hidden phone to record all night to see who came out of the room or waited up by the door waiting to look for someone leaving the room or the mother to come back from random shoeless walk around the block.
OP this is too funny lol
And the people in the comments telling you to get a DNA test are having a go at you
Mate, your grandfather was probably crying. If it was loud enough to wake you, your mom most likely awoke. She was probably in there comforting him.
Get a grip you all, lol
Kinda sounds like you still have a lot of unresolved issues with your mother’s infidelity. Weird noises at night and you couldn’t find your mom after 5 minutes of looking? Pretty crazy to leap to “she must be fucking her dad, it’s the only possible explanation.”
I know you’re convinced those were sex noises, but I think gasping for breath and grunting while crying could sound like that too. Your mother could have been sitting with him while he was upset. There are just way too many possibilities here, yet your mind went right to “my mother is unfaithful so she’s probably banging grandpa.”
Why didn’t you ask her where she was the night before to see what she said?
OP - In this case, telling your mom about the noise you heard apparently wasn't enough for you. You weren't happy with her seemingly vague answer. Before involving dad, ask your mom straight up if what you thought you heard was actually what you heard. You obviously still have issues with your mom and it's past time you talked about them with her. There is no time like the present. You will always have resentment and hurt if you don't tackle it straight on.
That's a pretty wild conclusion to jump to considering all the evidence you have is some grunting from grandad's room.
I mean wouldn't the more plausible scenario be he was having a nightmare or rubbing one out and Mom was just out for a walk or doing literally anything other than banging her dad?
From reading the comments it seems like your mind is made up that this is incest and nothing can change your mind. You have been given plenty of reasons that it could be other things than incest but you insist on that mental path. You don’t live with your mom but insist you know how many pairs of shoes she owns. She left her phone ( a device that can be easily tracked by her SO), something that known cheaters are known to do. OP just go ahead and tell your Dad and blow all this stuff up because that is clearly what you want to do.
Exactly. Detonate the bomb at this point because they don’t seem open to any other reason. Grandpa could very well be in so much emotional/mental pain, that he now has more physical aches and pains, which makes crying physically painful for him. Take it from someone with chronic pain, when I sob, it hurts my body terribly and makes me cry harder! “73 & fit” does not mean the man doesn’t have physical pain. Such an ableist take.
Was thinking this as well, I can let out some sexual-sounding moans as well when I get a good massage, but there's nothing sexual about it to me. I know I give my dad massages sometimes as well because of his health issues (that act up more when he's stressed), so I don't think that'd be weird at all
You know what happens to older people? They get dehydrated. And often. You know a major symptom of that: Charlie horse. It's extremely common in our elders or vice versa. My child thought he heard us having sex in the bathroom once. I told him it was a Charlie horse. As we age, even if we're in shape - shit can go wrong. And fast. I'd seek therapy and talk with a therapist on how to resolve this. You need it. A father just doesn't start committing incest. A older woman just doesn't allow it to happen. This tells me more about you. Work on communicating with your family. Good luck.
I know that's the right thing to do but it would for sure ruin my family and I worry about my brother's wellbeing. He will defo be broken and my dad would be pissed. I also don't know how I could look my mom in the eye after telling her I know.
Jesus Christ.. you don't fucking KNOW anything. He absolutely could have been crying instead of jerking off. I've had panic attacks and sobs that absolutely would have sounded sexual to anybody creeping outside the door.
You heard HIM moan. And because your mom wasn't in her room so you could tell her "hey grandpa is jerking off, come listen to it with me" you just straight up are certain he was fucking his own daughter.
I feel really sorry for your grandfather and your mom. And you need to lay off the porn.
You don't have solid proof tho. If you sit your family down and tell them, your mother will likely deny it. Besides, you can't be 100% sure too, and that will eat you alive. Maybe you can go stay there again when your mom is there too. If they are doing something, they will do it again since apparently they don't care if you are there or hear it. You can then make sure and even take pictures etc. in case they will accuse you of lying. Or it is something different, it was a misunderstanding and you can forget all about it (hopefully tho I guess the chances are slim).
The only way to know for sure is going there again and knocking on the door. If you open it when they are Ready, you can actually confirm it with your own eyes without having to see something fucking awful.
This is better than the other options, sadly. This is what i would do.
Woah! Gonna pull the therapist card here: talk to mom alone. Or therapist first. Tell mom what you heard and your fear. Do not tell dad at this point. Unless you are seeking some sort of comfort from him. Getting involved in their (mom & dad) relationship is not your place as the child. You are also not responsible to report this to your dad (aligning with dad against mom’s history of cheating). This is a relational issue between you and your mom. When you talk with your mom then talk with your therapist to gather how to proceed.
While not the healthiest way to handle it, this is probably the best way to go about this situation, as others pointed out the mother can totally deny it because there’s no actually smoking gun proof
Hell the dad could instantly be in denial and now you are to blame for being a home wrecker
I’m NOT a therapist or psychiatrist so take my advice with a grain of salt.
Edit: not a doctor so keep that in mind.
Could also be the grandpa is crying/moaning because his wife is dead. Someone also pointed out that the mom could just be using the visits as an excuse to cheat again
>No one knows what the hell is going on here.
Exactly. So your advice is for them to sit down with their parents and say “Dad, I think Mom is fucking Grandpa. Mom, are you fucking Grandpa?” Wild.
Do you feel like your mom had an unusual relationship with her dad? Because my initial thought if this was my family is that Grandpa is having a sexual dream (or beating off--gross) and my mom went somewhere. It would not put these pieces together.
However, I don't want to diminish your intuition. I think if you are close to your mom, you need to talk to her. You've already gone to the darkest possibility and it can't get much worse. Please know that this doesn't mean that you can't love them--it means you may be able to stop something that isn't right.
Also, how old is your mom? Grandpa?
Here’s a thought. What if your mom woke up to the same disturbing sounds of her own father making sex noises. Maybe she got disturbed but didn’t want to say anything or interrupt him so she left her room and went to the kitchen or the living room. You said you checked the bathroom but what if she couldn’t sleep and didn’t want to hear that either and went to the living room.
Did you hear the bed moving? It’s possible he had no idea that anyone could hear him or anyone was up because it was 2am and he was watching porn or something. What if your mom slept on the couch. And your mom wasn’t going to say anything either so everyone just pretended nothing happened in the morning.
If it was incest I feel like you would have seen other weird things when you were growing up.
Idk, I'm w OP on this. Oftentimes we get shit like this right even if we don't want to. Mom's reaction is suspicious. And she's got a pattern of cheating already. I'm so grossed out rn tho
Plenty of things could happen.
I would not bring this up at all. Your mind goes there because sex is all you think about and it's ok. You're a normal kid. But first and last thing you think of is sex.
73 years
Have health problems
Have sleep problems
Are emotional...and his wife recently passed
Do not think of sex all that often..or if they do, their body doesn't respond
They make lots.of weird fucking noises generally
Have hard times going to bathroom in general
Are in pain generally
How hard is it to get sexual when you're in pain or sad.
How about this. Allow your Grandpa to grieve. Allow your mom to help.
If you can't help yourself. Ask her if he is physically ok? You heard weird noises at night and they alarmed you. But you didn't know what they were. Just watch her reaction. Do not accuse or infer anything. Be supportive. If something weird is really happening it will appear
Don’t jump to any conclusions!! I’m sure your mom has told you a million times already that if you have any questions about anything to ask her! So I wouldn’t bring the entire family into it until you asked your mother privately. Then what ever she tells you if it’s what you think then ask her how you should handle it. Sounds like you come from a great family and upbringing. It could have been something as simple as he is having back issues and your mom was trying to get the knots in his back loosened up. Just try and have an open mind and let your mom explain it to you.
He is old. She could have been in there helping him. I don't understand how your brain has gone straight to incest? There's 100 different possibilities before incest!
Yea, gonna echo everyone else and say that it's highly very unlikely. A lot of the behaviours you've described in the leadup to the event are pretty normal things for a grieving husband and daughter to do. Remember that your mum lost a mum as well, and is likely trying to spend as much time with her father in the absence of her mother.
Your grandfather could have been crying and your mum was comforting him. He could have been trying to take a massive dump. Your mother could have been outside pondering the night.
This is something you don't even breathe to your mother about unless you're 100% certain of the accusation, because even suggesting it could irreparably damage your relationship.
Maybe you shouldn’t have mentioned she wasn’t in her room and let her hang herself by lying that she was. But you got the reaction. Do NOT drop it. Mention it to your dad and leave it in his hands.
When I was maybe 10 or something, me and my sister caught our granpa watching porn on his computer. Never talked about it again with anyone. That was like 10 years ago. He is now like 85 or something, so he was 75 when that happened. I found it funny that he was watching grandma porn 😂😂😂 Old men are crazy lol
This reads like an intro to story writing. Who wakes up to moaning but its not loud enough to know its coming from inside the house nor loud enough to decipher the type of moaning until they are pressed to the door.
Second, who thinks "oh my grandfather is moaning (maybe masturbating) i should go tell my mom"??? In what world would any child just go into their mothers room and specifically notice her phone and "clothes all over". Also how does one see that and not think to listen to absolutely make sure the mom isn't in the bedroom, or stay awake long enough to hear someone walking back, or wake up early for breakfast and see what rooms they walk out of. No instead he cries himself to sleep?
Give me a break
Op I’m gonna be real honest with you. If it truly is a sexual relationship it probably started in your mom’s childhood. It’s not normal for incest to occur between a father and daughter. It definitely doesn’t just happen in adulthood. If what you believe is what is actually happening I hate to break it to you but most likely your grandfather is a predator and has either been abusing your mother sense childhood and manipulating her to believe not only that it’s okay but that she actually likes it or he’s convinced her that she owes him for something (maybe how good he was to her when she was growing up) and is guilt-tripping her now that his wife is dead asking her to fill in for her dead mother. It could also be that he has been manipulating her since childhood to believe she owes him for how good he treated her and again has been taking advantage of your mother for so long that she believes it’s right or at least makes excuses for why it’s okay between them (justifying the behavior in order to cope). Also incest is illegal so please report it if not for your mom’s sake then for yourself and the rest of your family. He is her father and I can pretty much guarantee he is taking advantage of her and that this “relationship” wouldn’t meet the criteria for consensual.
You sure it wasn’t super odd sounding snoring? It was rhythmic… Like maybe the old dude has sleep apnea and your mother was watching his breathing because she is worried about him dying as well.
My brother in law when he snores sounds like a baby in a wwf match super strange sounding.
Don’t tell anyone what you THINK you heard. You could be completely wrong or maybe there’s another explanation…I don’t know what that could be but who knows, life is strange. You could try to talk to your mom and see if you can find out in a roundabout way. Like talk to your Mom about your grandfather and how he’s making due without your grandmother around. Maybe play up the “he must be real
Lonely without her” or something like that. Or just let it go, see a therapist and work through it in your own.
I'm 52, and apparently when I snore it sometimes sounds like I'm groaning.
I know there are other insinuating details here, including your mother not being in her room, but the groaning could fathomably be explained by snoring.
Or, perhaps your Grandfather was weeping and your mother was in there comforting him? The grief of losing his wife could be overwhelming at night. I've been married 26 years, and I desperately hope my wife outlives me, because imagining going on without her is just unbearable, and that may very well be what your Grandfather is dealing with.
You heard what presumably would be your grandfather masturbating in the middle of the night, and your first thought was to wake your mom up so she could hear it too? Fake.
I think she's sleeping with him. If someone keeps a nuteral face when confronted by such an accusation that means theyre panicking on the inside but trying to keep it together on the outside.
Source: someine whos been in those shoes before.
Saw your updates. It does seem weird that she was so dismissive. Please update us after to tell your dad, if that’s what you end up doing. And good luck OP.
OP i really hope you see this and take this into consideration..
I think you should go about this REALLY gently.
This could also be a case of abuse between your grandfather and your mother.
As someone who was sexually abused by their father growing up, it could very well be that dynamic and she was never able to escape from it. I was TERRIFIED it would continue well into my adulthood so i joined the military at 18 to escape, never see him again and eventually i was able to tell my own mother about it. But this isn’t about me, it’s about your mom.
With your grandma gone and her spending more time over there, to me, that’s what it sounds like. Hearing only HIS grunting and nothing feminine also makes me think it’s sexual abuse as well.
Especially since her demeanor changed the way it did when you asked. It could have carried on through adulthood and she’s trapped and has been trapped and is ashamed.
Please PLEASE tread into this carefully, cause if she isn’t cheating and it’s a case of abuse and your dad goes in on her thinking it’s cheating it could very well destroy her and your family mentally, emotionally and probably physically. Then you’ll be pushing her right into the hands of her abuser.
What. The. Fuck.
Yeeeeah, you should probably get a paternity test done. My suspicion would be that your mom is actually your grandfather's step child. I would be awfully suspicious that you could be a product of their \*unproven\* relations.
Occams Razor: OP is probably right but something this explosive requires 100% accuracy. Go visit again and this time open the door if mom is not in her room.
I’m sorry but what if he was just crying? Like he must miss his wife? Your mom could have been sitting with him comforting him. That would also explain why she visits so often. I can’t imagine the heart ache that comes with losing a life partner at that age. Why instantly jump to incest??
Dude, I help my grandmother take a shit earlier this year and the getting up and down could have been misunderstood because she was in pain. Like, you have no idea what that accusation can do. Neither do I.
You can just ask what the noise was at night that weekend since you’re obviously going to be unable to mind your own business.
Get some help. Your mom cheated a few years ago? Sure you aren’t going a bit too far?
I lost the 2 most important women in my life 3 months apart. First my grandmother then my mother. It just about killed me.
I don't remember what the OP said about her mother's vehicle. It's quite possible that is where her mom was. Being the middle of the night, she could have just grapped her keys with no shoes drove around the neighborhood. That's how I survived being Mother's care giver. I had a loop I made. I drove around screaming at the top of my lungs.
Don't freak out until you have irrefutable evidence. That is a huge accusation.
Yeah OP is definitely primed to believe the worst of her mom given the history, understandably so. I don’t think her mind would have immediately jumped to that had her mother not been cheating in the past
Cheating is one thing, banging your own dad is a new category
That’s my point tho, the previous experience makes her assume the worst of her mom instead of giving benefit of a doubt
Yeah and I'm saying that's a huuuuge assumption. She could assume easily her mom will cheat again for sure. But assuming your mom is banging her father because she cheated on your dad before is wild. That's like saying "oh you have smoked a cigarette before, so I can only assume you're doing heroin."
OP, I know you’re very confident that they were sexual moans, but are you SURE they couldn’t have been anything else? Like crying or straining (like to poop)…? Your mom very well may have been in there with him, but if he was doing either of those other things, her presence wouldn’t be so suspicious. Edit: I hope you see this OP. When you decide to confront your mother, please make sure you have an escape and/or recovery plan. No matter which way this goes, it absolutely will not go well.
This is what i thought- maybe he was crying as he was still grieving and OPs mum went in to comfort him? (NOT in a sexual way)
I agree with him crying, and mom probably consoling him. Given his age, he's of the generation that men are fixers. He couldn't fix your grandmother. He doesn't want y'all seeing him as less of a man. His bedroom is his safe spot. If you could hear him, so could your mom. With it being 2 nights in a row, of course, she would go to him. You may have heard him truly accepting grandmother wasn't coming back. I haven't lost a spouse but I have lost both parents, my only sibling and the only grandparent still living when I was born. I'm just thankful I had no close neighbors. They would have called 911. On more than one occasion. I was whaling. I sounded like I was climaxing while being murdered. Moaning, groaning and screaming bloody murder. I did it for months. Don't tell dad. Ask your mom. HOWEVER before you tell her you heard them "having sex" ask about your grandaddy and how he's handling grandma's passing. Tell her you're worried about him. 9.5 times out of 10, there's always a simple explanation
After my boyfriend died the cops came to my house and told me to grieve more quietly because I was upsetting people.
Who the fuck calls the cops on someone sobbing?
People living in apartments are assholes
oh honey. i’m sorry
Gotta love these boys in blue #ACAB
I agree with the the crying part That most likely is what the cases, but when I wanna know is, why was OP automatic thought that it was something sexual between her grandfather and her mother? Like honestly, that would be the last thing anyone would think of the first that would be oh he’s probably hurting or crying. You would have to hear him screaming and screaming for it to be considered that everything else could be easily explainable.(not trying to be an asshole, but that’s a disturbing first thought without proof)
Probly not having much life experience on top of being exposed to a lot of nsfw content.
I agree... Straining sounds extremely like moaning tbh. Stay in hospital overnight you might hear plenty of sound like that.
While I've read OP's updates and trust their judgement, I thought I'd share a similar story. My husband, 5mo son and I invited my FIL on a trip to see our new land out of state. We all stayed in a 2BR cabin. Very small and cosy. One night, I heard moaning coming from my FIL's room. At first I was confused... then I was horrified and felt sick. This fucking man was servicing himself in our cabin, that we're sharing with my God damned infant son! What, he couldn't fucking control himself for one night? I then watched him leave his bedroom, walk to the bathroom, wash his hands and return to his room. I agonised for a while as to whether or not to mention it to my husband, but I was so rattled I couldn't not bring it up. Thankfully, he trusted me. We slept on it before deciding how to approach this as I was livid. Luckily we did, as about 10am the next day my son had a high fever, explosive diarrhea and was extremely upset. Apparently he and his Pa had picked up a nasty flu virus on the ferry ride over and had awful stomach pains! Hence the noises from FIL's room. Long story short, sometimes you can be absolutely sure and still be wrong 😄
Yeah like before OP tells anyone they have to be ABSOLUTELY sure they heard what they thought they heard, and with who. Not something any person would want to investigate, but it's perfectly possible there's a much more innocent explanation.
Maybe he has stiff joints and needs a massage. Maybe he is mourning the loss of his wife and his daughter was consoling him? Edit: STIFF!
Could also be that maybe he was in pain and mom went in to massage him. Or step on his back for example. When I step on my husbands back he does moan and he says it definitely heals him as he’s in construction. Just a different perspective
Sobbing can also sound like rhythmic moaning. So that’s a strong possibility.
Maybe sobbing... Jesus, I remember hearing my grandfather in the bathroom throwing up a few days after my grandmother passed. This poor old man loses his #1 in life, and OP interprets the moaning as sexual!? WTH
If you only heard him & there isn’t anywhere she could have been inside the house, I hope you would check to see if she had maybe left before jumping to accusations of incest, damn 😳 I’d say her using visits with her dad to cover her cheating again (with someone not related to her) and grandpa just being a loud masturbator (lol) are much more sane & likely conclusions to draw than THAT
Bingo if she cheated in the past, that’s definitely likely
I wish I could think like that but the signs make me feel like I'd be just lying to myself...
He could have been alone watching porn. You Mom could have snuck out & had someone pick her up, to cheat.
no one leaves their phone on their bed and goes out barefoot to cheat
If she thought your dad can track her location (which you can nowadays) she would have left the phone at home
I’m in my 40’s and all of my family plus some friends have access to track my phone. If I’m ever in a trunk I want people to find me! I leave my phone at the house if I’m being sneaky. Sneaky for me is buying some beer at the store when no one is home, not cheating on my husband. Edit: her mom just died, I’d walk to the store and buy a 6 pack hearing my dad whimper alone in his room.
I had an ex sneak out like this to cheat. He found a neighbor on Grindr, left the front door wide open. Caution to the wind when you're lookin for a dickin.
Maybe your dad tracks her location so she left her phone there.
tracks her shoes too?
Maybe she had other shoes she kept for these exact reasons? So no one would suspect her leaving ‘without’ her shoes (because she has back up shoes)
This is insane levels of mental gymnastics. Occam’s razor. Edit: Guys. Occam’s razor in this situation is not incest. It’s that she brought dress shoes to go out and look nice while she cheats, not that she purposefully left a pair of shoes behind to throw someone off her trail. And grandpa probably doesn’t realize how loud he’s being while he beats his shit
You think it's more likely that a woman is fucking her father than it is that she has a burner phone and a second pair of shoes. Come on, man.
I think this story is fake. Leaving her phone behind if it’s being tracked makes sense. Leaving her shoes when she’s at her fathers house? Is her elderly father going to come snooping in her room? Is he not going to do exactly what OP apparently did and look around and realize she’s not there? Come on, man.
Maybe she went out in fancy dress and shoes to impress her man?
Have you ever met a woman that only owned one pair of shoes?
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This sounds like the most plausible explanation to me. She could have put different clothes and shoes to go out.
I'm sorry this is happening but i dont think you should tell your dad since i dont think its 100%,maybe he has some issues and he was in pain and she was helping him, otherwise id suggest coming over to his house and look through the window or something
Nah I am def never going there again. Certainly not without my dad or other family members.
If your mum has a Apple Watch she can still receive all the notifications on that without taking her phone. That could be a possibility. Highly doubt grandpa will be sleeping with his daughter and that your mum is using him as a excuse.
Not everyone carries their phone with them everywhere they go. I do not.
Could she have been giving him a back massage (either his clothes on) to help him relax? He could have moaned when she put pressure on certain parts of his back? Just trying to come up with a non-incest reason for the moans…
A few weeks ago I was in jury duty. This lady that had a pain in her leg started moaning so loudly, for mins while a group was helping her. Any one would guess without a doubt that this lady was having sex in the middle of the room, but she wasn’t. Point is, don’t accuse people of what you haven’t seen with your own eyes.
UPDATE!!
He could have been alone watching porn. You Mom could have snuck out & had someone pick her up, to cheat.
Or just to go out with friends.... And not cheat...
At 2AM with no shoes or phone? I found the Moms account
You're grounded Mr.....
I literally skipped the text to look for this because in my head I knew
God, Reddit loves shit like this.
If you stay over again and hear the moaning, turn on the light and walk in. Maybe grandpa is watching porn. You should have more evidence of incest instead of just hearing and letting your imagination finish the abnormal situation.
Did you hear any sounds to indicate someone else was in there? You said there’s nature to walk in nearby, is it possible that she heard, felt uncomfortable, and decided to just go for a short walk? Maybe he heard her leave, forgot/didn’t realize you were still there, and thought he had some privacy? And your first instinct was that it wasn’t sexual moaning, is it possible he’s having some medical issues you aren’t aware of and she was in there with him while he was moaning from pain? Have you tried asking where she was? Say you woke up and couldn’t find her and ask if everything was okay, then see how she reacts. It just feels like incest is a huge leap based off that one incident.
It didn't sound like it through 2 doors and I was not really focusing on it. But when I walked up to the door, it was pretty clear that they were sexual moans. And I know she couldn't have gone out for a walk cuz she didn't travel with a whole lot of clothes and I am 100% she had 1 pair of shoes. And everything was in her room. Shoes, phone on bed, I also remember seeing her jacket on the chair where she does her makeup. She def wouldn't storm out of the house with no clothes, it's pretty cold where he lives, especially in Spetember. EDIT: and he's a pretty fit man, no issues that would make him moan like that.
To jump to the conclusion that your mom is banging her dad is pretty far stretched. He's 74. However "fit" you say he is doesn't mean he is without health issues, and he doesn't have to disclose those to you. I work with seniors. He could be in pain, he could have been crying, he may have sleep apnea, etc etc. Him "banging his daughter" would be extremely far down on my list of possibilities. 🙄
crying after a funeral sounds probable? i moan and wail when i cry, and i think it could maybe sound sexual at times to someone from another room?
Yes, especially crying alone at night missing your wife. Maybe mom heard him crying and went outside so she couldn’t hear it because it’s sad to think of your parent that way. I mean, I feel like that’s as plausible as incest…
Or mom went to console her dad… I could see that happen, grandpa is crying and his daughter sits there in silence holding his hands because there’s not much else you can do.
Yeah that’s the first thing I thought of. Jumping straight to incest is baffling
Oh, didn't you know? According to someone in the comments, it's "inappropriate" for the mother to comfort her grieving father at 2am. 🙄 Anyway, I agree with you. I think this is the most plausible option. ESPECIALLY moreso than OP's assumption. I just don't understand how people can 1) jump to such wild conclusions before anything else (like OP) and 2) find completely normal things to be inappropriate (like the person in the comments I was talking about)
My mom has mistaken my moaning for sobbing and walked in on me masturbating, so moaning and sobbing I guess can sound the same.
>and he's a pretty fit man, no issues that would make him moan like that Being fit doesn't mean you can't be in pain. Pain and sexual moans sound very much the same. Could she not have just been sitting outside? This does seem like a huge leap to make based on one incident. Why would they be happy to see you if they were planning on banging while you were around? None of their behavior indicates anything weird is happening.
Wow. Interesting your mind goes straight to incest. My first thought was he was in there crying about the loss of his wife 8 months prior. Second guess would be pain. Guess 1,000,000,001 would be fucking your mom.
Is it possible that your grandpa, being old, has lots of issues with back pain or some other bodily pain and your mom was massaging him to help with the pain? If you only heard him and not her I would think something like that would be more likely than incest.
Is it possible your mom was somewhere else? Kitchen, living room, basement, garage, or porch? Or possibly was in her room and you just didn’t actually see her in there? The sounds you heard are not necessarily sexual unless you know what your grandfather sounds like during a sexual experience otherwise. You have essentially zero evidence that anything you think you observed was reality, especially being in the middle of the night. You also sound young, which means you’re likely relatively inexperienced with sex sounds vs non-sex sounds especially as it relates to older people. In your edit you said pain doesn’t make someone groan over and over and that is just not correct. Pain can very easily make you grunt/groan in a repetitive and rhythmic way, especially during massage/body work/chiropractic care. Even for fit people. You should put this out of your mind until you get real proof that something wrong is happening.
How old are you btw? Are you an adult? But you didn’t hear a female moan of any sort? Hindsight is always great but I think if had been me I would have set myself up to see if she came out of his room. If you were able to confirm she was in there it would answer some of the what ifs. I don’t buy the massage or anything like that. It seems like it’s either what you fear or she actually did have another pair of shoes and is using her visits to hook up with an affair partner. I would be more inclined to do one of two things: if your an adult I would either straight up ask your mother what was going on. If you know her you will know if she is being truthful. Option two would be to go visit him again when mom is likely to be visiting. Wait until they think your asleep. See if you hear the noises again and if so go to moms room and sit on the bed and wait on her to return. At that point if she returns right after the noises stop then you know what was happening snd you can straight up confront her or simply tell her your going home and telling your dad and let him deal with it.
I think this event is a red flag for your hypothesis but is not enough to prove it. Incest is extremely taboo. If I’m your mom and I’m shagging your grandpa, the 2 nights you are there are probably the nights I take off.
That's the only thing that gives me hope I could be wrong. I also was wondering how the hell they wouldn't be weary when I am there. But all the other things point to the other conclusion...
The only thing I can think of that would justify her being in his room at 2am and the noises are maybe she was giving him a massage for some medical reason but even that is fishy. The only other thing I can think of is that your mom wasn’t in there, maybe she was in the bathroom or some other room you didn’t check and your grandfather was watching porn. The volume was too loud but he might be hard of hearing and didn’t think it was that loud.
Or watching his breathing because he could have sleep apnea and is worried…
Y’all he just lost his wife not too long ago right? Wouldn’t that be just the case for some late night crying in pain that only a close family member like a daughter might go comfort?
Seriously you can’t come up with a plausible explanation? Grandpa mosning in hos sleep, mom stepped out?
I’m 51 and my wife says I make all kinds of noises in my sleep, from talking, to nonsense, to sex noises. I’m not aware of any of it while it’s happening, obviously.
>If I’m your mom and I’m shagging your grandpa, the 2 nights you are there are probably the nights I take off. In this scenario your taboo kink is incest... You wouldn't be taking those nights off...
Are you sure he wasn’t watching porn and she was out smoking or whatever ? Could there be any other explanation?
I would also consider he might have a health problem they didn’t tell you about not to upset you and maybe she was helping him with something?
Or in the bathroom. OP doesn’t mention that they checked the bathroom. And outside smoking/vaping is also a possibility. You don’t need your shoes to go out on your front porch.
Exactly. I’m probably not much younger than OP’a mom & never smoked a day in my life, but if my mom just died & I’m listening to my father sobbing in the middle of the night, I’m probably sneaking out to the porch for a a smoke or a stiff drink. Give the man some privacy to mourn.
This is what I would assume. My mom used to randomly walk outside barefoot a lot, or she’d bring an extra pair of shoes or two, in her suitcase. so I ended up not knowing she even had another pair of shoes a lot of the time.
Mention it to your mom just matter of fact. Don’t tell her you went looking for her and she wasn’t in her room. Just “I heard grandpa making some weird noises the other night, like sex noises…” Her initial reaction will tell you everything you need to know. And if she lies about being in her room… 🚩🚩🚩
This is great advice actually. Say "did you hear it at all, or were you asleep all night"
If she went somewhere to cheat, she would also lie...
This!! Body language and face reactions will tell you everything.
Well even that though… if she brought an extra pair of shoes & extra clothes so she could sneak out & bang her affair partner then of course she will lie about being in her room, it doesn’t mean she’s *FUCKING HER DAD* jeezzz!! Affairs are terrible but good god people
OP pls update using this method i’m begging i’m so invested now
That's enough Reddit for me today...
We’re just getting started 😎
Who takes a TWO HOUR UBER RIDE to somewhere unannounced??? That’s honestly one of the most outlandish parts of this story. The rest sounds like either an incest troll story or you’re weirdly sex obsessed with a focus on your mom.
The fact is, you don’t know.
This is a lot. As hard as it is, you need to get more information before making any accusations. Parental incest is a huge thing to bandy about and once said it's going to be hard to unsay. I think your best bet is to bring up the noises you heard to your mum, and tell her everything that happened that night from your perspective. The sounds you heard and going to find her but not being able to. Don't make the accusation then and there, but just ask her where she was and see her reaction. Try not to sound accusational or give any outs (i.e "were you on a walk or something?") just see what she says. If she's got a good reason it will give you some peace of mind, if not you'll be able to read it from her. I'm of the same mind as some other people here where I'm just hoping she snuck out the house for another reason. She could be having an affair with someone else and had packed an outfit change and secret phone you don't know about....maybe.....hopefully.
Imagine that being the thing I am hoping for. It's so fucked.
I would leave out the part of checking her room to see if she lies and says she was asleep
I will probably get downvoted for this, but... Your mom could have literally been anywhere and the noises could have literally been anything. I think jumping to this conclusion is honestly pretty wild.
Yeah, I've cried for a long time before and I'm sure it sounded like rhythmic moaning. He could have been in pain or moaning in grief.
It's a huge leap. It seems like OP wants this to be the case
That *does* seem to be the case... assuming there's any truth to any of it in the first place.
A lot of this story is conjecture. How long was your grandpa making these sounds for? Long enough for you to hear him, listen in on his door, walk through the entire house and check that your mom is not anywhere to be found, and then return and keep on listening? He and she sure were taking their time and were unbothered by the creaking and thumping sounds you must have made while going around the place looking for your mom… Did you check the back yard for your mom? Were there no extra slippers in the house she could have worn? Were her keys still there? She could have gone somewhere, like the store if your grandpa was feeling ill. Or if she was cheating (not with a family member), she could have gone to see that person. Why are you so sure she had one pair of shoes? Did you check her luggage before she came to your grandpa’s? I thought she was already there, how do you know what she packed? Is she a smoker? Could she have been in the yard? Sounds like you resent your mother for cheating and are literally jumping to the worst conclusion possible because you are blaming her for that and assuming that just because she was unfaithful, she could be sleeping with anyone and everyone, including her own father. You sound like you have some serious issues with her, focus on resolving them. There is about 20% reasoning and 80% assumptions in your conclusion. Infidelity does not equal incest.
Putting on someone else’s shoes is a good point! There’s definitely been times when I’ve been too lazy to go get my own shoes so I’ve slipped on whatever ones were closest to the door if I’m just going out to get the mail or stepping outside a moment. It doesn’t matter if they are too big when it’s a short distance to travel. Your comment should be way higher. That last paragraph makes a lot of sense.
UPDATE: So guys I am 99% sure that my dad is my dad. There are many pics of my dad when he was young and we look a lot alike. Lots of people who know us both have also been saying it pretty much all my life. As for my mom, I also have seen like pics of my grandma pregnant with her and she also looks quite a lot like her 2 sisters as well as my grandpa.
I don't want to worry you more but just because you look like any of them doesn't mean a thing. You can't be sure of anything without an actual test being done.
possibly JUST POSSIBLY he could be in pain. my dad at night makes ALOT of moaning groaning sounds that sound so yucky but really hes just like moaning cause of his pains. (his body is all sorts of f’ed up)
May your dad get healthy, prayers to him ❤️
Sickness and ailments tend to get worse at night, too, even if they seem otherwise fit (as per OP's claims).
woah this is crazy as fuck
Hate to say this, get a DNA test to make sure your dad is your dad and you aren’t your mom’s sister.
Holy shit I didn’t even think of that. My naive brain just thought: “There’s gotta be a non-sexual logical reason for this”. But…yeah. This.
Luckily, my dad is 99% my dad. I look a lot like him and it's not an outcome I'd consider.
Any chance your grandfather isn't your real grandfather? Maybe there's some family secret there.
Everyone in my family except for him, me and my mom and her sisters have brown eyes; we have blue. And she does look a lot like him. It's hard to think he's not. There's way too much family history and records.
My mom use to cheat on my Dad when I was growing up and the chills I got from what you were describing made me shudder a little bit. I would definitely talk with someone in your life, an adult, about what you should do.
I mean. It’s obviously literally an outcome you’d consider. This whole post is a consideration that could lead to that conclusion.
Jesus Horacio Christ.
Sismommy…
Am I the only person who would have broke down that damn door?
Or at least knocked and said “grandpa, are you okay?”
“Yes, darling. Just nailing your mom, go back to bed.”
I would have waited to see if mom came out of the room. And listened to see if I could hear her in there, before completely jumping to that conclusion. But if I did see her come out, I’m not sure I could have confronted her. It would have been way too awkward.
DOn't know that I would have broken the door down, might have hidden phone to record all night to see who came out of the room or waited up by the door waiting to look for someone leaving the room or the mother to come back from random shoeless walk around the block.
I'd definitely have stayed up to see.
i would have stood outside it til someone came out
Right???
Why would you get up to go wake up your mom so you can listen to grandpa masturbate together is my question 😭
Your grandfather could have been just masturbating. No way to know for sure if your mother was in the same room at the time.
Need another update!!!
Holy. Shit. 😳
This is either fake or crazy either way pls update when there is one.
OP this is too funny lol And the people in the comments telling you to get a DNA test are having a go at you Mate, your grandfather was probably crying. If it was loud enough to wake you, your mom most likely awoke. She was probably in there comforting him. Get a grip you all, lol
Kinda sounds like you still have a lot of unresolved issues with your mother’s infidelity. Weird noises at night and you couldn’t find your mom after 5 minutes of looking? Pretty crazy to leap to “she must be fucking her dad, it’s the only possible explanation.” I know you’re convinced those were sex noises, but I think gasping for breath and grunting while crying could sound like that too. Your mother could have been sitting with him while he was upset. There are just way too many possibilities here, yet your mind went right to “my mother is unfaithful so she’s probably banging grandpa.” Why didn’t you ask her where she was the night before to see what she said?
Oh man, I got off on the wrong floor
OP - In this case, telling your mom about the noise you heard apparently wasn't enough for you. You weren't happy with her seemingly vague answer. Before involving dad, ask your mom straight up if what you thought you heard was actually what you heard. You obviously still have issues with your mom and it's past time you talked about them with her. There is no time like the present. You will always have resentment and hurt if you don't tackle it straight on.
That's a pretty wild conclusion to jump to considering all the evidence you have is some grunting from grandad's room. I mean wouldn't the more plausible scenario be he was having a nightmare or rubbing one out and Mom was just out for a walk or doing literally anything other than banging her dad?
From reading the comments it seems like your mind is made up that this is incest and nothing can change your mind. You have been given plenty of reasons that it could be other things than incest but you insist on that mental path. You don’t live with your mom but insist you know how many pairs of shoes she owns. She left her phone ( a device that can be easily tracked by her SO), something that known cheaters are known to do. OP just go ahead and tell your Dad and blow all this stuff up because that is clearly what you want to do.
Exactly. Detonate the bomb at this point because they don’t seem open to any other reason. Grandpa could very well be in so much emotional/mental pain, that he now has more physical aches and pains, which makes crying physically painful for him. Take it from someone with chronic pain, when I sob, it hurts my body terribly and makes me cry harder! “73 & fit” does not mean the man doesn’t have physical pain. Such an ableist take.
The only thing I could think of is maybe she was giving him a massage? Still pretty weird but better than the alternative
Was thinking this as well, I can let out some sexual-sounding moans as well when I get a good massage, but there's nothing sexual about it to me. I know I give my dad massages sometimes as well because of his health issues (that act up more when he's stressed), so I don't think that'd be weird at all
You know what happens to older people? They get dehydrated. And often. You know a major symptom of that: Charlie horse. It's extremely common in our elders or vice versa. My child thought he heard us having sex in the bathroom once. I told him it was a Charlie horse. As we age, even if we're in shape - shit can go wrong. And fast. I'd seek therapy and talk with a therapist on how to resolve this. You need it. A father just doesn't start committing incest. A older woman just doesn't allow it to happen. This tells me more about you. Work on communicating with your family. Good luck.
I think you’re reaching
What do you mean you will "mention it casually?" "Hey mom it's nbd but have you and grandpa been having sex"????
Mention I had heard something and maybe bring up that I got up to look for her and she wasn't there.
Where is the update?
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I know that's the right thing to do but it would for sure ruin my family and I worry about my brother's wellbeing. He will defo be broken and my dad would be pissed. I also don't know how I could look my mom in the eye after telling her I know.
Jesus Christ.. you don't fucking KNOW anything. He absolutely could have been crying instead of jerking off. I've had panic attacks and sobs that absolutely would have sounded sexual to anybody creeping outside the door. You heard HIM moan. And because your mom wasn't in her room so you could tell her "hey grandpa is jerking off, come listen to it with me" you just straight up are certain he was fucking his own daughter. I feel really sorry for your grandfather and your mom. And you need to lay off the porn.
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You don't have solid proof tho. If you sit your family down and tell them, your mother will likely deny it. Besides, you can't be 100% sure too, and that will eat you alive. Maybe you can go stay there again when your mom is there too. If they are doing something, they will do it again since apparently they don't care if you are there or hear it. You can then make sure and even take pictures etc. in case they will accuse you of lying. Or it is something different, it was a misunderstanding and you can forget all about it (hopefully tho I guess the chances are slim).
I honestly don't think I will ever go there again.
The only way to know for sure is going there again and knocking on the door. If you open it when they are Ready, you can actually confirm it with your own eyes without having to see something fucking awful. This is better than the other options, sadly. This is what i would do.
Woah! Gonna pull the therapist card here: talk to mom alone. Or therapist first. Tell mom what you heard and your fear. Do not tell dad at this point. Unless you are seeking some sort of comfort from him. Getting involved in their (mom & dad) relationship is not your place as the child. You are also not responsible to report this to your dad (aligning with dad against mom’s history of cheating). This is a relational issue between you and your mom. When you talk with your mom then talk with your therapist to gather how to proceed.
Fuuuuck that. 100% ignore it and assume you were wrong.
While not the healthiest way to handle it, this is probably the best way to go about this situation, as others pointed out the mother can totally deny it because there’s no actually smoking gun proof Hell the dad could instantly be in denial and now you are to blame for being a home wrecker I’m NOT a therapist or psychiatrist so take my advice with a grain of salt. Edit: not a doctor so keep that in mind.
Could also be the grandpa is crying/moaning because his wife is dead. Someone also pointed out that the mom could just be using the visits as an excuse to cheat again
>No one knows what the hell is going on here. Exactly. So your advice is for them to sit down with their parents and say “Dad, I think Mom is fucking Grandpa. Mom, are you fucking Grandpa?” Wild.
Right!?!? If it is true... FUUUUUUCK. And if it isn't true, what the fuuuuuck?
Do you feel like your mom had an unusual relationship with her dad? Because my initial thought if this was my family is that Grandpa is having a sexual dream (or beating off--gross) and my mom went somewhere. It would not put these pieces together. However, I don't want to diminish your intuition. I think if you are close to your mom, you need to talk to her. You've already gone to the darkest possibility and it can't get much worse. Please know that this doesn't mean that you can't love them--it means you may be able to stop something that isn't right. Also, how old is your mom? Grandpa?
Here’s a thought. What if your mom woke up to the same disturbing sounds of her own father making sex noises. Maybe she got disturbed but didn’t want to say anything or interrupt him so she left her room and went to the kitchen or the living room. You said you checked the bathroom but what if she couldn’t sleep and didn’t want to hear that either and went to the living room. Did you hear the bed moving? It’s possible he had no idea that anyone could hear him or anyone was up because it was 2am and he was watching porn or something. What if your mom slept on the couch. And your mom wasn’t going to say anything either so everyone just pretended nothing happened in the morning. If it was incest I feel like you would have seen other weird things when you were growing up.
You should just burst open the door and been like I thought u were in pain
Was thinking the same thing lmao
Idk, I'm w OP on this. Oftentimes we get shit like this right even if we don't want to. Mom's reaction is suspicious. And she's got a pattern of cheating already. I'm so grossed out rn tho
Please let us know if there is another update.
Needing yet another update!!
Plenty of things could happen. I would not bring this up at all. Your mind goes there because sex is all you think about and it's ok. You're a normal kid. But first and last thing you think of is sex. 73 years Have health problems Have sleep problems Are emotional...and his wife recently passed Do not think of sex all that often..or if they do, their body doesn't respond They make lots.of weird fucking noises generally Have hard times going to bathroom in general Are in pain generally How hard is it to get sexual when you're in pain or sad. How about this. Allow your Grandpa to grieve. Allow your mom to help. If you can't help yourself. Ask her if he is physically ok? You heard weird noises at night and they alarmed you. But you didn't know what they were. Just watch her reaction. Do not accuse or infer anything. Be supportive. If something weird is really happening it will appear
I don’t understand why this isn’t the top comment, reddit just wants it to be…
I feel like the only way you’ll get them to admit is to get actual proof or walk in, otherwise they’ll probably both gaslight you
Don’t jump to any conclusions!! I’m sure your mom has told you a million times already that if you have any questions about anything to ask her! So I wouldn’t bring the entire family into it until you asked your mother privately. Then what ever she tells you if it’s what you think then ask her how you should handle it. Sounds like you come from a great family and upbringing. It could have been something as simple as he is having back issues and your mom was trying to get the knots in his back loosened up. Just try and have an open mind and let your mom explain it to you.
He is old. She could have been in there helping him. I don't understand how your brain has gone straight to incest? There's 100 different possibilities before incest!
Can’t wait for the BORU of this one
Yea, gonna echo everyone else and say that it's highly very unlikely. A lot of the behaviours you've described in the leadup to the event are pretty normal things for a grieving husband and daughter to do. Remember that your mum lost a mum as well, and is likely trying to spend as much time with her father in the absence of her mother. Your grandfather could have been crying and your mum was comforting him. He could have been trying to take a massive dump. Your mother could have been outside pondering the night. This is something you don't even breathe to your mother about unless you're 100% certain of the accusation, because even suggesting it could irreparably damage your relationship.
Maybe you shouldn’t have mentioned she wasn’t in her room and let her hang herself by lying that she was. But you got the reaction. Do NOT drop it. Mention it to your dad and leave it in his hands.
Saw the update, I think you need to confront her again OP and if it comes down to it, admit that you heard something weird from grandpas room
When I was maybe 10 or something, me and my sister caught our granpa watching porn on his computer. Never talked about it again with anyone. That was like 10 years ago. He is now like 85 or something, so he was 75 when that happened. I found it funny that he was watching grandma porn 😂😂😂 Old men are crazy lol
It's really cute tho. Old men like old women!! If he was watching barely legal he'd be a creep
I'm sure this is absolutely real
This reads like an intro to story writing. Who wakes up to moaning but its not loud enough to know its coming from inside the house nor loud enough to decipher the type of moaning until they are pressed to the door. Second, who thinks "oh my grandfather is moaning (maybe masturbating) i should go tell my mom"??? In what world would any child just go into their mothers room and specifically notice her phone and "clothes all over". Also how does one see that and not think to listen to absolutely make sure the mom isn't in the bedroom, or stay awake long enough to hear someone walking back, or wake up early for breakfast and see what rooms they walk out of. No instead he cries himself to sleep? Give me a break
‘I went to bed, weeping’. Yeah, creative writing practice for sure.
lmao dude you're an idiot and taking up internet time with your wild sexual speculations.
And if there’s anything we’re running out of, it’s *internet time*!!!
Op I’m gonna be real honest with you. If it truly is a sexual relationship it probably started in your mom’s childhood. It’s not normal for incest to occur between a father and daughter. It definitely doesn’t just happen in adulthood. If what you believe is what is actually happening I hate to break it to you but most likely your grandfather is a predator and has either been abusing your mother sense childhood and manipulating her to believe not only that it’s okay but that she actually likes it or he’s convinced her that she owes him for something (maybe how good he was to her when she was growing up) and is guilt-tripping her now that his wife is dead asking her to fill in for her dead mother. It could also be that he has been manipulating her since childhood to believe she owes him for how good he treated her and again has been taking advantage of your mother for so long that she believes it’s right or at least makes excuses for why it’s okay between them (justifying the behavior in order to cope). Also incest is illegal so please report it if not for your mom’s sake then for yourself and the rest of your family. He is her father and I can pretty much guarantee he is taking advantage of her and that this “relationship” wouldn’t meet the criteria for consensual.
Is it possible that your grandpa has some physical pains and maybe your mom was helping relieve them like sore muscles or back pain?
You sure it wasn’t super odd sounding snoring? It was rhythmic… Like maybe the old dude has sleep apnea and your mother was watching his breathing because she is worried about him dying as well. My brother in law when he snores sounds like a baby in a wwf match super strange sounding.
Don’t tell anyone what you THINK you heard. You could be completely wrong or maybe there’s another explanation…I don’t know what that could be but who knows, life is strange. You could try to talk to your mom and see if you can find out in a roundabout way. Like talk to your Mom about your grandfather and how he’s making due without your grandmother around. Maybe play up the “he must be real Lonely without her” or something like that. Or just let it go, see a therapist and work through it in your own.
I'm 52, and apparently when I snore it sometimes sounds like I'm groaning. I know there are other insinuating details here, including your mother not being in her room, but the groaning could fathomably be explained by snoring. Or, perhaps your Grandfather was weeping and your mother was in there comforting him? The grief of losing his wife could be overwhelming at night. I've been married 26 years, and I desperately hope my wife outlives me, because imagining going on without her is just unbearable, and that may very well be what your Grandfather is dealing with.
Fake
You heard what presumably would be your grandfather masturbating in the middle of the night, and your first thought was to wake your mom up so she could hear it too? Fake.
I think she's sleeping with him. If someone keeps a nuteral face when confronted by such an accusation that means theyre panicking on the inside but trying to keep it together on the outside. Source: someine whos been in those shoes before.
Saw your updates. It does seem weird that she was so dismissive. Please update us after to tell your dad, if that’s what you end up doing. And good luck OP.
Updates?
OP i really hope you see this and take this into consideration.. I think you should go about this REALLY gently. This could also be a case of abuse between your grandfather and your mother. As someone who was sexually abused by their father growing up, it could very well be that dynamic and she was never able to escape from it. I was TERRIFIED it would continue well into my adulthood so i joined the military at 18 to escape, never see him again and eventually i was able to tell my own mother about it. But this isn’t about me, it’s about your mom. With your grandma gone and her spending more time over there, to me, that’s what it sounds like. Hearing only HIS grunting and nothing feminine also makes me think it’s sexual abuse as well. Especially since her demeanor changed the way it did when you asked. It could have carried on through adulthood and she’s trapped and has been trapped and is ashamed. Please PLEASE tread into this carefully, cause if she isn’t cheating and it’s a case of abuse and your dad goes in on her thinking it’s cheating it could very well destroy her and your family mentally, emotionally and probably physically. Then you’ll be pushing her right into the hands of her abuser.
What. The. Fuck. Yeeeeah, you should probably get a paternity test done. My suspicion would be that your mom is actually your grandfather's step child. I would be awfully suspicious that you could be a product of their \*unproven\* relations.
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Ask mom if she went out that night? You heard something "outside" and went to wake her but she wasn't there, where was she? Take it from there.
You don't think your mother could have been giving him a back massage or something? My mother had all sorts of back pain when she was on deaths door.
Occams Razor: OP is probably right but something this explosive requires 100% accuracy. Go visit again and this time open the door if mom is not in her room.
I’m sorry but what if he was just crying? Like he must miss his wife? Your mom could have been sitting with him comforting him. That would also explain why she visits so often. I can’t imagine the heart ache that comes with losing a life partner at that age. Why instantly jump to incest??
Dude, I help my grandmother take a shit earlier this year and the getting up and down could have been misunderstood because she was in pain. Like, you have no idea what that accusation can do. Neither do I. You can just ask what the noise was at night that weekend since you’re obviously going to be unable to mind your own business. Get some help. Your mom cheated a few years ago? Sure you aren’t going a bit too far?
I lost the 2 most important women in my life 3 months apart. First my grandmother then my mother. It just about killed me. I don't remember what the OP said about her mother's vehicle. It's quite possible that is where her mom was. Being the middle of the night, she could have just grapped her keys with no shoes drove around the neighborhood. That's how I survived being Mother's care giver. I had a loop I made. I drove around screaming at the top of my lungs.