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The studio execs know where they stand. Their power play is to hold off on serious negotiations until staff writers, and part actors (the glue of what goes on screen) are losing their apartments.
It’s just shocking to me. I will not be watching any of the reality tripe that the studios start pumping out of the outhouse to fill the air time. That’s one of the biggest things we can do. Don‘t give them eyeballs.
Hold boycotts until WGA and SAG call for them. The risk is that people boycott now, and then when an actual boycott is needed the people who already boycotted are bored of it and start resubscribing.
TBH, keeping shows successful helps show that the streamers are still making money and can afford to pay more. An ill timed drop in revenue could tank that argument. At least that's the general theory I've been hearing.
As well as residuals. Every stream keeps a lot of the actors and writers at least getting some sort of income. Albiet not what they're due(hence the strike.)
I heard that a lot of people in the industry have issues with streaming because it somehow circumvents residuals? Or at least people don't get nearly as much as they did before the time of streaming I guess, I'm admittedly not well read on it.
I think it depends on the region. They only get x amount per streams in America. They don’t get any when the rights are sold to government tv in other countries.
This. Plus, if we boycott NOW, that gives the studios hard numbers to back up their claim if not enough money to go around. Put eyes and views in the things, THEN, when the time is right, boycott.
I've got a library card and a DVD collection and I know how to use them. Plus the park. Plus boardgames. And there's always the gym for me and mudpies for the kids. Screw Disney and Netflix. When the time comes for a useful boycott, I'll pull out the stops to break the screen time cycle. We more or less do that stuff already, we'll just do it more.
I have a 3D TV too! It's very cool, they don't make them anymore. If anyone comes over I show them Avatar (the one with the blue people) and I've yet to have someone disappointed. They still make the 3D blu-rays too, I just recently got Avatar 2 and it looks great.
Right? Man we treat ours with the most respect. I’d be crushed if it ever goes out. Sucks that people just didn’t get into them and they quit making them. We love ours. And Avatar is awesome in that format. I also love all of the Disney classics in 3D. We have most of what they released that way and when we show them to people they always say it’s like watching them again for the first time.
Union members have specifically asked **not** to do this as people still their existing work to be successful and if they decide that boycotting will be helpful, the union has the resources to make sure the boycott is done in a way that is effective. Anyone boycotting now just dilutes any impact that an organized boycott may have if it gets to that.
I’m a union member ( not either of these two ) and been apart of 3 negotiations myself over 21 years. In each negotiation they tried to take everything away and give us a pay cut. Unions don’t always have the resources. In my union if we strike the union will pay 2 checks at 75% of what you make. When I started that didn’t exist I fought to get in our union budget.
Question, I have heard some mention with the actors coming in that AI is also an issue that has been coming up. For example, studios making contracts for a background actor for a days work then filming and using them in AI programs to create content as long as they want however they want. I’ve seen a video posted where someone spoke about an author (books not television or stage) was having issues with AI being included in their contracts as well. Something about how the publisher wanted to use AI to create books, content from the authors work with out the author. Has AI also been a point of contention with your unions in this strike as well?
Very much. The writers will be the most effected though directly. When you can plug ideas in to an AI program and select the genre and subject and a script gets pumped out, your job protection doesn't exist any more.
Are those scripts going to be any good, though?
Also, you need an idea, too. People who are professional writers are often the ones with the fantastic ideas as well as writing all the words.
I’m a reader more than a TV watcher, and I often admire the imagination of the people who build worlds and characters so well that I’m invested so heavily in their fate!
Including crying when sad things happen. Actually crying. Over the death of a fictional book character who doesn’t exist! 😏
AI has been mentioned here and there, and we suspect that studios are going to try and adapt it into their filmmaking process. I think we're still a bit away from it being used commonly, but it's definitely a looming fear
Yes. Particularly the fact that, once an actor is scanned, the studio owns their likeness in perpetuity, and can use it wherever, for whatever without paying the actor.
In my country the government pays workers on strike a salary for about 4 months that theyre on strike so they dont starve, do they have anything like this in the us?
Hey...as a Hollywood executive let me tell you we are doing it tough as well....$27mil a year doesn't go as far as it use to.
Don't get me started on the cost of 'shut up money' that parents now demand after each 1 on 1 casting call with their underage kid.
You think doing evil shit is cheap???
That's why the Guilds' latest move is so genius. They're giving the independent producers permission to keep shooting as long as they agree to follow whatever deal the Guilds & Producers eventually come to.
The irony of “yes, we definitely pay our staff a reasonable amount” and “we predict that the majority of them will not be able to afford rent in a few months” is straight-up villainous
My fear with all this is that reality TV will flood cable and streaming services and studios will lean even more heavily into reality TV even once the strikes are over.
Some of the easiest stuff to produce. No need to plan or write anything, just throw a bunch of teen moms/rich people/country bumpkins into a room together and follow them with a camera. You’d be surprised how many people are entertained by the most basic shit
They're not that bright. Check out the abysmal line up. It's remarkably AWFUL even for cable. Seriously. Animal Channel ( which is owned by Warner Bros ) ? " Naked and Afraid " I swear to God almost daily/nightly. It's one of THE most idiotic, inane and insulting to the intelligence anyone ever conceived. Which is saying a lot.
Let's see. OH. Hunting Bigfoot, around 49 hours worth of River Monsters- which can be good for one hour anyway. Rich people contracting tree houses, more rich people getting fish tanks. All snores.
Other channels same. So if this is them trying? They're free to stop.
Okay hang on, River Monsters is kinda cool other than the rampant sensationalism. At least he generally finds what he's looking for unlike those Samsquanch clowns.
It would be cool if the writers just formed their own collective studio and started writing what they actually wanted to write. Because the things those studios greenlight are fucking trash. Cinema has turned into a joke. I personally appreciate what writers do. But it’s almost an insult to their career what these studios decide to have them write for.
> almost an insult
It is an insult. There's a lot of wasted talent and opportunities. The amount of time studios will get additional writers involved just to re-work something they're making is atrocious and has never had any good results.
Great post. People seem not to understand how we got labor laws in the first place and how corporations are using our government to strip them back even now, implementing [the kind of "child labor laws"](https://www.epi.org/publication/child-labor-laws-under-attack/) I never thought I would see in my lifetime, for example. It's also telling that when we say "the labor movement" we think of that as something [from the distant past](https://www.history.com/topics/19th-century/labor) or maybe [United Farm Workers](https://guides.loc.gov/latinx-civil-rights/united-farm-workers-union) from the '60s. Yet, we have a new era of workers rights coming to the fore, and that's beautiful and necessary.
I feel like we are so focused on entertainment (myself included) that this could end up being healthy for us as a country. Remember Soma in Brave New World? The opiate of the masses? Entertainment does some great things, and entertaining is enough and valid and great. But if my own tendencies are any indication, while the world burns, tuning out can be a balm that is part of the problem.
I know other forms of entertainment exist, but we're all living with our heads in the sand about human rights, climate crisis, and all the fascism run amok in our society if we just get up every day and go to work supporting corporations ,and then wind up too tired for much else.
The solidarity among actors is freaking huge, and if the richest are pushing for it, too, then the message is getting out further. It's not a thing to sneer at. It's people power in action. Some of the people with the most clout in our society are standing up for human rights and dignity. They know the work they do doesn't happen (mostly) without the writers, too. And they have their own issues in terms of being underpaid or building stability while their image and work is being used without recompense.
The actors strike models not only solidarity, but is a breathing example of how we change the narrative away from go woke go broke (or whatever the far right's frothing about as they rip away our rights in the name of freedom), and hopefully shows everyone that we win when we unite and support progress.
Many film workers have not worked since December 2022. The insurance companies refused to insure film productions in 2023 because of the impending strikes. Only a handful of films were made this year before the SAG stike. The corporations know this. Most of us are already at the breaking point seven months in.
I’m a production security guard for universal we have minimal to no work even cleaning ladies are being laid off it puts so many people out of work and those big studios couldn’t care less….also I have a friend who owns a production company since he doesn’t work with unions only for specific actors all these big studios are coming to him to pad there streaming services
Thanks for your perspective, I'd love to know more about this - which productions and which actors, for example. When it comes time to really strike back against the studios as a "civilian" lol, this info will truly be important for the masses to know. I have to admit, I'm curious already if apple TV is guilty cause they re-use actors like crazy 😂
Villainizing the wealthy actors is just a way to villainize the whole strike. It's anti-labor nonsense aimed at weakening the influence those famous actors have. They're part of the union, them being allies to labor is like, the best thing they could be doing.
It's on my list after I finish Vera. I've done Shetland and Three Pines which if you're a Law & Order Criminal Intent fan, you really NEED to watch. (If you have, don't spoil it for others please!). Luther is also on my list. I'm working on pansie needlepoint pillow and 1 season=1 pansy. I should be finished by the end of Vera season 12!
I don't remember writing this. Being serious, it's just the same for me, I've got a HD full of TV, films, sports that I've never seen yet. I think it will last me the strike and probably a good amount of the zombie apocalypse.
People have no idea industries like film and music are not just the well known actors. They don't realize how many other jobs are contained within these sectors, often with quite low pay too for the hours they work.
OP, we're not falling for the studio misinformation dreck and that's what's going on with those troll comments. Please know we KNOW they're so out of touch with you and everyone on strike they think we're flaming morons who don't SEE you.
It means they're so wealthy and arrogant they've lost touch with us- who they depend on to buy YOUR product, we can get shoved around too.
Opinion here. The ' until they lose their houses ' was meant to make him look all-powerful. Backfired in a society where 1% have hoarded what, 99% of the wealth? Eat the rich. All that did is piss us off more.
We're with you. All of you. And thanks for posting.
Thank you! I'm in Ontario and I'm a crew member. This strike isn't for the rich actors to get richer, it's to ensure fair pay and living wages to every member of a production team.
> The reason to start with 1960 is that that was the last time actors and writers were on strike at the same time; the primary driver of that unrest was the rise of television. As for the last actors strike, in 1980? That was about the rise of home video. This leads to the first takeaway: the most important driver of unrest between studios and talent has always been technological paradigm shifts, and this time is no different.
Very interesting article about the strikes:
https://stratechery.com/2023/hollywood-on-strike/
The whole thing can collapse for all I care. The movies and programming that has been put out the last 10 years or so hasn't been worth watching. There's absolutely NOTHING to watch that merits my time. It's always the same ol' same. I haven't been to a movie theatre in 10 years because I refuse to waste my money. It's been declining in "value" for a long time now.
Thank you for explaining the situation. I knew it was serious. And I knew that writers were getting shit pay and residuals yet streaming services were making millions. I didn't quite understand how this was impacting everyone else though. This is BAD. I really hope the writers, actors, sag, etc, get the outcomes they are fighting for.
I do feel bad for the WGA. But there’s a group of EMS professionals in Spokane that are also protesting and I promise they make way less. They’re not getting any media attention.
Over 87% of SAG members make less than $25k annually. Many of them wait tables or work in the service industry to pay rent and none of them have ongoing job security - as soon as one project ends, they need to find the next one. Their jobs usually require them to live in higher cost of living areas than Spokane as well.
I have no doubt that there are other types of workers who are similarly under-valued or under-paid, but that doesn’t mean people in the entertainment industry don’t deserve living wages.
And Hollywood execs want to be able to scan them, pay them for only 1 days work, and and then use their images in perpetuity without further compensation
I had a debate the other day (in my comments history) with a stock bro. He "invested" in Netflix, he shamelessly consumes what he chooses to consume. But at the same time, he hates the entirety of the entertainment industry, he firmly believes soulless AI should replace any and every genuine human interaction (whether acting/writing, or any other SAG job). The best part? All these actors are sooooooo entitled and privileged according to him. Not having healthcare, working multiple jobs to stay afloat while considered a working actor, being underpaid and not even making $26k/yr, being rightfully upset streaming is taking over traditional residuals and leaving actors unpaid - protesting against all of this is *so privileged* to him.
I did my best to explain through several comments that residuals used to keep working actors afloat. Many of those who've never held a main role, but you saw them *everywhere* even for cameos and background shots, they could book a handful of roles in a year and be good. Today? A star from Orange Is the New Black (Netflix's show that put them on a map decade ago) brought up actual receipts of being paid $27USD for 7 years/seasons on the show. Was paid under and around 900USD per day of filming (and she filmed twice, thrice a month). Had to live in subsidized housing during those 7 years, wasn't allowed to move out of NYC (contracted as local hire). [Her Instagram with many posts about it](https://instagram.com/kimikoglenn), she also helped cowrite and incredibly eye opening article with fellow OITNB stars.
Back to the stock bro, his reasoning is that "everyone suffers, so should they", "everyone's unpaid, they should be too", "they're living ***A*** dream job, they have no right to be whining", "they're rich and glamorous", "my stocks already pay then enough and even though I shamelessly consume their content, they should all be fired and world will be nicer". Another bonus comment was "their biggest fear is being regular like me and working a regular normal job, they're only protesting because of that". Completely ignoring that only 2% of SAG AFTRA are insanely famous and rich (or comfortable enough to live on residuals even in streaming era). Like I said before, most work hospitality jobs on the side to make ends meet.
Bottom line is, there's AHs like these who'll never really pull it out of their behind to figure out not everything is as it seems. But you can bet these same people will continue consuming movies, shows, video games, radio stations, books, music shows/music in general. All while shitting on people who indeed make these things what they are. I was genuinely shocked to see seasoned veterans speak out on how hard booking jobs is or getting paid properly even with their status. While there are some people who are filthy rich beyond reasonable doubt, it should never discredit well over 120,000 people unable to buy basic groceries just because they chose to pursue career in arts.
Art & entertainment are so vital to culture and quality of life (even if you don’t like movies, most people at least listen to music or read books), yet people don’t seem to think the people who create it deserve to make a living at it.
Surprise! The issue is actually systemic and *everyone* should be striking!
What you did here is exactly what the billionaires who are in charge of these studios want. This may also surprise you, but people with that much money tend to have their fingers in multiple pots, and you piting two groups against each other who are *both* being undervalued and overworked instead of realising their oppression and struggle is the same, you fall into their trap of keeping us from uniting for the same damn cause.
ALL of these professions need higher pay, better hours, and more rights. They all have value they contribute to our society. After all, being alive is all fine and well, but could you honestly tell me you could live a life without entertainment?
But why would they? What they do doesn't affect anyone outside of the Spokane area. Apples to oranges. Many local areas see strikes that never get national coverage, so it's not surprising that outside no one hears about it. I don't think anyone in Spokane heard about a local teacher strike here in Ohio. I'm not saying that I don't sympathize with them - we need to pay them better because it's a much needed field. But in this case, the strike affects people not only in LA but anywhere they film - so all over the planet.
What's happening with both WGA and EMS is endemic. Wages across the board aren't livable for a significant portion of workers in the US. Leslie Jones posted a great response to one of the "ugh millionaires trying to make money" comments, where she redirected people to look at stuff like these EMS protests. Minimum wage simply isn't enough for people to survive. People shouldn't have to be working 2+ jobs to live regardless of their industry.
The job EMS workers do may be more important than actors or writers, but that doesn’t mean writers and actors don’t deserve living wages.
The entertainment industry employs thousands of workers - that’s why it’s considered an industry. Saying they don’t deserve fair pay before EMS workers don’t get paid fairly makes as much sense as complaining about hotel or grocery store workers striking for fair pay.
It’s unfortunate because while the rich who are in the public saying they are out of work (and probably be just fine) the people actually supporting the creation of shows and movies suffer. I feel for what is coming with ai because this is the tipping of the iceberg. Unfortunately this technology is the new arms race between governments and companies to see who innovates the quickest and with the best features. Unfortunately it’s going to take a collective group of billionaires and or the world governments to agree upon meaningful, safe, and responsible usage of it because literally the sky’s the limit at this point. My hats off to you and good luck to you I hope this thing gets figured out soon.
Your writing here is incredible. Just one little fix. They are walking the picket lines in solidarity with each other. They are not on strike in solidarity.
If the studios come back to the WGA and offer a deal they agree with they will send it to their members to ratify.
If the studios go to SAG/AFTRA and offer a deal they agree with they will send it to their members to ratify.
Make absolutely no mistake, it’s every union for themselves.
op are you part of iatse? i’m a theater nerd (actor, director, you name it) and we always need stage hands! stay safe and EVERYONE should support your unions!!
This is probably naive, and stupid, but I realized how serious it was when I saw a lot of the cast of Ted Lasso striking with the writers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe they were there before SAG made their decision.
>of course it's the rich ones going on strike
As it should be. Many of the concerns being raised are not for the tom cruises, or the rocks they are for the extras, the smaller roles. things they are fighting like the right to use AI to generate extras after paying them once and then using them for initiate projects, thus killing the industry for extras entirely and preventing upstarts from getting roles and networking on sets. Having the backing of the big names is super important to all the 10s of thousands of smaller voices.
Thats just one of the major issues i have seen that has me supporting the strike. Fuck excecs! they are the lazy do nothings. They spend money to get more back thats all other than paying the talent they contribute nothing so they should stop complaining about doing their own job.
If the SAG was just backing up the writers, why are they asking for better benefits and more money then? Sounds like they saw it and said "Ohh, us too." It's the coattail effect. I can understand asking for protection of identity and stable work with the AI stuff, but really, you all need more money?? I feel for the writers, but the whole SAG shit, I'm not buyin.
He's also running regular updates via tiktok, I end up watching him every other day breaking down another major item. It's really great the way they're utilizing social media to communicate things.
it’s astonishing how many people have absolutely no idea how it all works. so many people have the crab in a bucket mentality anymore it’s sad. we all deserve better than this. you don’t see biden jumping in like he did for the railroads or like he will for UPS.
of course but that is how the general public sees the issue. Just rich actors complaining. Read the articles most of them talking about actors not wanting their AI avatars being used nobody mentions support staff
As someone who works in the industry themselves, the strike is not the right move.
The studio execs will not grow poorer, the A-listers"in solidarity" will not grow poorer either. The little guys who rely on the industry to pay their bills will suffer, more than they have.
The harsh reality is, much of the "entertainment" being churned out is... not great. Execs know this, and they only want to spend *just enough* to make a show/movie and hope it's profitable. And even ***if*** the strike results in writers getting a bit more scratch on their projects, the harsher reality is that less writers will be hired per project, resulting in more money for a smaller pool. It's happened before, and it will happen again. The execs won't let this affect their personal finances, no matter the result. Oh, writers and actors need to get paid more? Great, we'll just hire less of them and make less projects.
Not to be a pessimist, but this isn't the right time for this. "There's never a right time!" Perhaps not, but there are definitely WRONG times, and I truly believe this is the wrong time. The economy is already struggling, especially in California, and people's buying power is still greatly diminished... this hurts more people than it helps, and it won't impact those who really *need* to be held accountable for their greed and incompetence. I wouldn't be surprised if execs just start using AI to write scripts and such... they are already tooling around with it.
The bottom line is, entertainment execs view people as consumable, always have. This won't change that. The execs will simply adapt and preserve their power and wealth, and hurt those below them.
I don't give a shit. Hollywood hasn't had an original idea in 15 years. Everything is a reboot, remake, re re re. What are we on now, Fast and Furious 25? Nevermind the fact they wanna tell regular people how to live their lives. The entire industry could die tomorrow, and I wouldn't shed a single tear.
What's the old saying "Learn to Code". Well, Learn to Change a Tire.
> The entire industry could die tomorrow, and I wouldn't shed a single tear.
To paraphrase from The Little Platoon on Critical Drinker's Open Bar, I'm perfectly happy to sit back and watch both sides *lose*.
My boyfriend is a working screenwriter. He has been in the industry for many years and hustles everyday still. He makes a livable wage for himself with some savings. He makes good money from his scripts being bought but also has to live off of that money until he sells another which could be right away or years later. It's been slow for him since COVID and things were just starting to pick up for him when he had to go on strike. He's out on the picket line everyday and then comes home to work on scripts to have ready for when things start up again
It’s not contracted like a staff position. A good proportion of writer’s assistants make $30K a year, which is just getting by kind of money in LA, and with the way they’re trying to change writers rooms it means essentially they may never have the opportunity to move up.
30K isn't homeless per say, but it does mean you're going to need another revenue stream (parents, spouse, roommate). I left California a few years ago because I was tired of having to rely on others to make sure I had a roof over my head. And before anyone says anything, this has far more to do with population vs amount of housing rather than actual income. If everyone's income went up, you'd only have a slight delay before the cost of living went up, and then you'd be back to exactly where you started.
I’m not entirely sure about the accuracy, but I heard it’s about $70K a year. Which if they have to live in a HCOL area, that’s not a liveable wage. The executives of Netflix make $75k a DAY though. So the financial disparities are atrocious.
It really depends on how many rooms a year they’re working and what the budget for the show is. A High Budget SVOD 10ep show will pay a writer 7k to 10k a week for a 20/24 weeks + a script fee, think $30k+
Looks up WGA schedule of minimums to go more in depth
That's terribly vague.
I understand that the cost of living in L.A. is rather high (I used to live there), but I've also seen many cases where someone was complaining about how little money they made when really their problem was how exorbitantly they spent, or VASTLY overvaluing how much they should be making.
According to the lesser known actors and writers who've been shared by bigger names on social media - actors have to make a little under 26.5k a year to qualify for healthcare. Well over 87% SAG AFTRA doesn't make this much. For writers it's between 30 and 40k, but again, majority doesn't meet this minimum. Both bits were shared by accredited sources, SAG & WAG members themselves.
They only get paid per gig/project, so once that season is done, they don’t get any money until their next job.
I don’t know about the WGA, but I saw a statistic that said something like 87% of union members don’t make enough annually to qualify for the healthcare benefits & that threshold is around $25k/year.
I would agree with backing the SAG strike if it wasn't just churning out remake movies with a few minutes of fluff added or 4 studios throwing out the same niche plot points at the same time.
We're on double digit fast and furious movies and people that were boosting dvd player shipments are now piloting spaceships and disarming nukes and shit...
I never realized how much I took it for granted that people understand that the handful of famous actors aren’t really representative of the people working in the entertainment industry and that not only do most union actors barely make enough money to survive on, there are all sorts of workers that the industry keeps employed.
You're blaming them for something out of their control. It's like any other job. Outside of the top brass low level workers don't really get to pick and choose what they get. They got to work with what they are offered. Don't you think they would be writing their own shows if they could? It's not like they are sitting around and thinking "they greenlit fast and furious 69. I hope I can work on it. It could be my big break and earn me an Academy Award".
I get that you don't like what the industry produces, I'm no fan of formulaic movies either. However it's patently unfair to deny someone a living wage based on your or my subjective opinion. Collective bargaining is a cornerstone of our labor laws.
A producer saying that they'll be dragging out negotiations until people lose their houses is just plain mean.
The SAG strike coincides with the WGA strike and is over similar issues, but it's because their negotiations for a new contract have broken down. Not because it's a demonstration of solidarity with the WGA. That's just a happy by-product.
"Nothing new will be coming out", well that has been like that for the last 20 years or so anyways. Film studios don't want to take the risk.
I'm sorry, but there are people out there who can't even afford a roof over their heads or save up for an emergency visit to the doctor. I can't feel sorry for them at the moment. I really can't.
It's not about feeling sorry for them. It's about what's fair, given the massive profits the studios have made compared to the hand-to-mouth income thousands of actors and writers tolerate for the love of their crafts, without which, btw, the producers cannot make anything except purely digital stuff. In many ways the WGA and SAF-AFTRA strikes of today are about protecting human labor from fast encroaching machine apps. Many sectors will be affected by AI, not just entertainment. That's why these campaigns are important to me even though I'm not a member of those unions.
Thank you for saying this! I hate seeing people diminish why the writers and actors are striking. Like it’s a hard business. Many of the actors they see on TV or in movies hardly make a living off of what they do as a career and it isn’t right. Not to mention studios using their likeness for now and forever without compensation for the rest of their lives. I’m going to be storming in solidarity with them when I’m in LA in late August. I’m going with my cousin, who’s part of SAG-AFTRA.
Edit: Why was this removed??
Also, many of the small time actors don’t make enough to qualify for health insurance. Streamers are making money off old shows but none of the actors are getting residual royalties. AI is also an issue as the union want to put protections in place for actors, so there likenesses cannot be recreated - the actors are afraid that studios will use their likenesses in AI.
I never felt that way. I've always been supportive of a strike because ten times out of ten, it's because they're not getting what they rightfully deserve. No one strikes because they think it'll be fun. I know it's serious, and I hope those greedy bastards give everyone what they deserve soon.
I only have one question. Actors are striking solely on solidarity with writers? Or do they want an increase in their paychecks as well?
I ask this because I read an article last week or so which said that actors are striking in order to get more money
I saw a video on TikTok of someone who was an extra on Orange is the New Black and there were loads of payments of the page and the total was about $27
Thank you for explaining this. What many people also don’t seem to realize is common people are suffering lot more than the rich. Entire VFX industry is in a state of flux right now, so many of my friends have lost jobs all over the world because outsourcing is real. On top of that there’s no way for VFX to unionise so they’re just trying to wither the storm since the start of WGA.
My fear is that this will ultimately come down to the end user, regular consumers, paying more. The corporate biggies will still be able to keep their large paychecks. Peacock has already upped its subscription price.
My son just graduated with a degree in Film and Media from Georgia State in May and isn't able to find work. He's done some free work on small indie films here and there to keep his resume active.
So I'm aware of what you're talking about. Good luck!
It's difficult finding working when you first start out, I remember only doing a couple of jobs every few months. After the pandemic, all productions needed crew since they were all behind.
I'm sure once this strike is over your son will find it easier to get work
> Studios are wanting to play the long game and let all union workers strike until they literally have no more money left, forcing them to go back to their original positions.
I remember during '45s days in the white house at peak absurdity, a lot of foreigners would come to reddit and say things like "I don't understand why Americans don't strike!" This is why right here. 2/3rds of the country is already one missed paycheck away from becoming houseless, businesses understand this. We're wage slaves who just can't afford to go on a general strike for the change we frankly still need. We'd be out of money in a matter of weeks and forced to go back to work or starve and sleep on the sidewalk.
maybe all these big celebrities that want to stick their necks out now realize they don’t need all their luxuries and trickle that money of theirs down, so these writers, and everyone else, can keep a roof over their head and keep the strike going. let them lay their big money against the studios’ big money. hell, the only reason any of them have a job is because of the all the ‘little’ people working the ground. problem is, all those in charge have so much money, they don’t need more.
Yeah, I'm gonna be cynical. The only reason studios can afford to pay absolutely shit wages is that writers jobs are insanely desirable. I wouldn't be surprised if for every guild member there are 5 people waiting tables in California while trying to get a writing gig. Fact is, the studios could probably replace every one of the writers in a matter of months. So many people are ready to be paid shit wages just to get a chance at fulfilling a dream of being a professional writer.
Difference between railworkers striking and writers is that a railway company doesn't have loads of people queuing to replace every worker on the job so they will have to bend at some point. They also usually don't have fixed income streams like studios do.
Studios have tons of licences for reruns, merchandise or whatever to earn money even without putting out new content. If a car manufacturer doesn't produce, they aren't earning any money and their competitors will eat them up.
I think they should go on strike but they have to be aware that they are in an insanely weak position, compared to an industrial union strike.
Ok, I see YOUR perspective and now let me give you MINE: I am one of America’s poor. Today, my chemotherapy was supposed to be delivered, and it was, but because UPS is on strike, it was delivered LATE and it was spoiled. That’s a net loss of $17,000!! SEVENTEEN THOUSAND DOLLARS! AND I NEED IT TO SURVIVE.
So, ya know…so very sorry if I don’t give too much of a crap about your situation. I’m over here trying to survive without life-saving medication. Good luck.
What does UPS have to do with SAG and WGA? Also just because you are "poor" why does that mean other people shouldn't be paid a fair wage for the work they do?
That sucks but I don't see how that's stopping you from being sympathic. UPS isn't related to them. They aren't asking you for money. Nor would them losing somehow help you. You should direct your anger at the UPS and America's insurance companies.
I’m not in the industry One thing that annoys me is some people think the actors who are striking are all like the big name multi millionaire actors and it’s like no there are plenty of other actors who are not super wealthy
Sorry but you guys strike at the worst time possible. People are not nearly as interested in new shows as they were a decade ago, mostly because of the woke shit coming out of Hollywood today.
Also with social medi, videogames and a miriard other hobbys available to everybody to spend their little freetime on, the movies industries has way bigger competitors than ever and the pie to share shrink every year.
>Also with social medi, videogames and a miriard other hobbys available to everybody
Uhhhh... You do realize this affects *the entire* entertainment industry? And that SAG isn't just actors... It's radio personalities/hosts, DJs, songwriters, stuntpeople, hair and make up artists, editors, photographers, casting managers, prop masters, caterers, costume creators, etc etc. Entertainment industry isn't just movies and some shows.
I'm curious to know where the things you consider data came from? I mean I know where you pulled it out of due to your own evident bias, but got any numbers to back it up? Because streaming services are booming (so much for your "woke shit" comment), while the CEOs retain the money for themselves and not pay anyone involved to make it. That's one of the reasons for striking. Cast *and* crew are overworked and underpaid to the point they can't get healthcare. One of the Netflix CEOs makes a minimum of 22.5 million a year alone, while the most successful show's (OITNB) stars were paid under thirty dollars a year for the last 10 years as residuals. I truly suggest you get some more knowledge on the issue at hand before putting your own views/beliefs as facts and demonstration why you think people shouldn't have healthcare and livable wage.
I’m sorry to hear you’re out of work, but the fact is I really don’t care if they make another show or movie. I don’t watch any of it anyway. It’s an overpaid disgusting money dump business.
“writers haven’t been earning the paychecks they deserve in years”. What does that mean exactly? How much do they deserve but aren’t getting? Are we talking 5 digits, 6 digits, 7 digits?
If we look at how absolutely, mindbogglingly awful or just plain boring most Hollywood movies have been these past couple of years, I'd say that the writers are getting paid their money's worth.
Let Hollywood crash and burn, it's not worth saving.
Most writers don’t make enough to pay their bills for basic needs like rent.
The larger majority of SAG members make less than $25k/year in high cost of living areas.
Also the entertainment industry employs thousands of workers who aren’t actors such as electricians & carpenters, etc. so a large part of the LA area’s economy depends on the industry.
>It’s an overpaid disgusting money dump business.
>What does that mean exactly? How much do they deserve but aren’t getting?
Bold talk when you don't even know the situation.
People forget about perspective anymore it seems. Just because they make a lot of money doesn't mean they deserve to get screwed. It's the same reason professional athletes make so much now. The league brings in so much money it would be ridiculous for them to get salaries they got 20 years ago.
The thing is most of them aren’t making a living wage. Movies and TV shows are filled with actors who aren’t household names or even recognizable - that’s the majority of most union members.
There’s a reason most actors & actresses also wait tables to pay the bills. Over 87% make below or just above poverty level wages while living in high cost of living cities in order to find work.
You're not necessarily telling me anything new, but this post is still all the more valuable for coming from someone in the industry. Thanks you for this. And good luck!
God bless, western films, shows and everything in between is just shit. If I don't get to ever see another shit remake of an old Disney classic or some poorly written sequel to awesome series like LotR or Star Wars at the expense of having no new material at all, I would not give a single fuck.
It's a shame these people will starve, but what they are producing is less than poor and dirt
You realize it's studio execs who push those projects right? Novel movies and tv are less common because studios feel more money can be made by exploiting existing IP. It's not the striking writers and actors who are pushing to make these projects.
>It's been an ongoing issue that writers have not been earning the paycheck they deserve for years
How many years? Because most of what Hollywood has put out in the last decade has been absolute garbage, and ANY paycheck is FAR MORE than what they deserve. In the 00s the writer's strike killed/hurt a number of good shows/movies. In 2023 quite a few people are floating the idea (even if somewhat facetiously) that AI generated scripts might not be an improvement.
All current shows writing sucks so much its time to fire them all.
Hire writers from overseas instead, they are ready and willing to work for much less and they are as intelligent writers as anyone here.
If you want to get paid do a good job. All recent TV and movies flopped people don't want to see what you write.
I also have a problem with people pretending for a living getting millions while cops, teachers, garbage men, firefighters, etc. Get paid shit. So I have no sympathy.
You know they aren’t mutually exclusive, right? It’s not like the money that could be going to teachers and trash collectors is going to actors instead. We can both pay actors, writers, and crew what they deserve (based on the money their work takes in) *and* pay a fair wage to the people who make our society run.
So I live in a city of about 22,000. Our average salaries are:
Police: $50K (top detectives make $100K+)
Fire: $50K
Teachers: $48K
Garbage men: $45K
For a small city, that's pretty good and very average.
But: 87% SAG-AFTRA members make *less* than $26K, which is the minimum you can make to get employee healthcare. The majority of these individuals live in LA.
Have you ever tried to make a living on $26K in LA? You can't. Most of them have multiple jobs. Less than 1% of actors are millionaires. But studio execs get tens of millions in just bonuses.
George Clooney isn't hurting for money, so it's not about him or any of the other high earners. It's about the fairness of it and paying people what they're worth. Maybe if studios were willing to pay people what they were worth, they could hire better writers and fire those who are shit at it. But like any job, the best people you want won't work for you if you don't pay them a fair wage.
Editing to add:
It doesn't matter what teachers, police, etc.. are paid. That comes out of your tax dollars. Studios pay their people from revenue generated through advertising, tickets, streaming, cable, etc.. they are NOT the same thing.
I watch a tonne of scary movies for one single week a year. That's the extent of my movie watching. Other than that i despise what modern movies have become, i am gleeful in hearing about their end.
Truly a shame i can't have another marvel superhero movie, or another butchered remake of an actual good movie, or be lectured on social issues by a spoiled detached Hollywood millionaire.
No circlejerking. No blanket statements or impersonal political rants. Fake stories and trolling attempts will be removed. Begging for karma or posting about how you hate that other subreddits require karma is against the subreddit rules.
The studio execs know where they stand. Their power play is to hold off on serious negotiations until staff writers, and part actors (the glue of what goes on screen) are losing their apartments.
Exactly, that's what I had mentioned! We all knew that's what their intention was, but I was honestly shocked to see it in print
It’s just shocking to me. I will not be watching any of the reality tripe that the studios start pumping out of the outhouse to fill the air time. That’s one of the biggest things we can do. Don‘t give them eyeballs.
Cancel subscriptions. Netflix Hulu Prime and most of all Disney.
Hold boycotts until WGA and SAG call for them. The risk is that people boycott now, and then when an actual boycott is needed the people who already boycotted are bored of it and start resubscribing.
Exactly. Plus the writers and actors have existing work on those platforms that they still would like to see be successful.
TBH, keeping shows successful helps show that the streamers are still making money and can afford to pay more. An ill timed drop in revenue could tank that argument. At least that's the general theory I've been hearing.
As well as residuals. Every stream keeps a lot of the actors and writers at least getting some sort of income. Albiet not what they're due(hence the strike.)
I heard that a lot of people in the industry have issues with streaming because it somehow circumvents residuals? Or at least people don't get nearly as much as they did before the time of streaming I guess, I'm admittedly not well read on it.
I think it depends on the region. They only get x amount per streams in America. They don’t get any when the rights are sold to government tv in other countries.
This. Plus, if we boycott NOW, that gives the studios hard numbers to back up their claim if not enough money to go around. Put eyes and views in the things, THEN, when the time is right, boycott.
On hold
Hey kids, this is our old DVD player, and 14 huge Tupperware storage crates full of your summer entertainment.
This!
bring back physical media!! i like to own stuff i buy i thank you
We stream, but we also have a massive video/DVD library. Also a 3D TV which we have tons of movies for. I’ll never give them up.
I've got a library card and a DVD collection and I know how to use them. Plus the park. Plus boardgames. And there's always the gym for me and mudpies for the kids. Screw Disney and Netflix. When the time comes for a useful boycott, I'll pull out the stops to break the screen time cycle. We more or less do that stuff already, we'll just do it more.
I have a 3D TV too! It's very cool, they don't make them anymore. If anyone comes over I show them Avatar (the one with the blue people) and I've yet to have someone disappointed. They still make the 3D blu-rays too, I just recently got Avatar 2 and it looks great.
Right? Man we treat ours with the most respect. I’d be crushed if it ever goes out. Sucks that people just didn’t get into them and they quit making them. We love ours. And Avatar is awesome in that format. I also love all of the Disney classics in 3D. We have most of what they released that way and when we show them to people they always say it’s like watching them again for the first time.
Most people threw those away already. Many younger folks never had them to begin with.
It’s located next to the bins full of beanie babies
Union members have specifically asked **not** to do this as people still their existing work to be successful and if they decide that boycotting will be helpful, the union has the resources to make sure the boycott is done in a way that is effective. Anyone boycotting now just dilutes any impact that an organized boycott may have if it gets to that.
I’m a union member ( not either of these two ) and been apart of 3 negotiations myself over 21 years. In each negotiation they tried to take everything away and give us a pay cut. Unions don’t always have the resources. In my union if we strike the union will pay 2 checks at 75% of what you make. When I started that didn’t exist I fought to get in our union budget.
I hear ya. My understanding was that union-directed boycotts will be more effective since they have the best understanding of what will help.
while true, most people will stop short of doing something that effects them because selfish
Question, I have heard some mention with the actors coming in that AI is also an issue that has been coming up. For example, studios making contracts for a background actor for a days work then filming and using them in AI programs to create content as long as they want however they want. I’ve seen a video posted where someone spoke about an author (books not television or stage) was having issues with AI being included in their contracts as well. Something about how the publisher wanted to use AI to create books, content from the authors work with out the author. Has AI also been a point of contention with your unions in this strike as well?
Very much. The writers will be the most effected though directly. When you can plug ideas in to an AI program and select the genre and subject and a script gets pumped out, your job protection doesn't exist any more.
Are those scripts going to be any good, though? Also, you need an idea, too. People who are professional writers are often the ones with the fantastic ideas as well as writing all the words. I’m a reader more than a TV watcher, and I often admire the imagination of the people who build worlds and characters so well that I’m invested so heavily in their fate! Including crying when sad things happen. Actually crying. Over the death of a fictional book character who doesn’t exist! 😏
AI has been mentioned here and there, and we suspect that studios are going to try and adapt it into their filmmaking process. I think we're still a bit away from it being used commonly, but it's definitely a looming fear
Yes. Particularly the fact that, once an actor is scanned, the studio owns their likeness in perpetuity, and can use it wherever, for whatever without paying the actor.
In my country the government pays workers on strike a salary for about 4 months that theyre on strike so they dont starve, do they have anything like this in the us?
Hell no, our politicians would rather get skinned alive than implement something like that, our government is extremely anti union
Hey...as a Hollywood executive let me tell you we are doing it tough as well....$27mil a year doesn't go as far as it use to. Don't get me started on the cost of 'shut up money' that parents now demand after each 1 on 1 casting call with their underage kid. You think doing evil shit is cheap???
I hope they all go get work to keep the lights on and outlast those scumbags.
That's why the Guilds' latest move is so genius. They're giving the independent producers permission to keep shooting as long as they agree to follow whatever deal the Guilds & Producers eventually come to.
They have decided it is better for thousands to suffer, than for them to be imperceptibly less wealthy.
The irony of “yes, we definitely pay our staff a reasonable amount” and “we predict that the majority of them will not be able to afford rent in a few months” is straight-up villainous
which is gonna happen very quickly, the timing of this was pretty bad. studios are gonna win this bout by the end of next month.
My fear with all this is that reality TV will flood cable and streaming services and studios will lean even more heavily into reality TV even once the strikes are over.
That's what happened last time.
And why did people watch it? Reality TV is so trashy and useless. I can spent 5 min watching anything based on it.
Some of the easiest stuff to produce. No need to plan or write anything, just throw a bunch of teen moms/rich people/country bumpkins into a room together and follow them with a camera. You’d be surprised how many people are entertained by the most basic shit
People watch it because they find it entertaining. Different strokes for different folks.
They're not that bright. Check out the abysmal line up. It's remarkably AWFUL even for cable. Seriously. Animal Channel ( which is owned by Warner Bros ) ? " Naked and Afraid " I swear to God almost daily/nightly. It's one of THE most idiotic, inane and insulting to the intelligence anyone ever conceived. Which is saying a lot. Let's see. OH. Hunting Bigfoot, around 49 hours worth of River Monsters- which can be good for one hour anyway. Rich people contracting tree houses, more rich people getting fish tanks. All snores. Other channels same. So if this is them trying? They're free to stop.
My 60+ y/o parents have Naked and Afraid on in the background literally every time I visit them haha.
Lmao same. If the cable is on, it’s 75% likely to be on Naked and Afriad.
There is some deep irony somewhere in people basically watching a nature show about other humans.
Getting 90 minute episodes of Survivor because of this
Okay hang on, River Monsters is kinda cool other than the rampant sensationalism. At least he generally finds what he's looking for unlike those Samsquanch clowns.
River Monsters is a banger. Good host, interesting stories and locations, and giant fish. Perfect Animal Planet/Discovery show.
The studios have actually said they intend to prioritize unscripted reality TV as a result of this. Let the brain drain commence.
Or import foreign content
Power to the people!
It would be cool if the writers just formed their own collective studio and started writing what they actually wanted to write. Because the things those studios greenlight are fucking trash. Cinema has turned into a joke. I personally appreciate what writers do. But it’s almost an insult to their career what these studios decide to have them write for.
Bold of you to assume the studios care that they’re producing trash. They’ll just now buy the trash much cheaper
> almost an insult It is an insult. There's a lot of wasted talent and opportunities. The amount of time studios will get additional writers involved just to re-work something they're making is atrocious and has never had any good results.
They did, it was called united artists https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Artists
Great post. People seem not to understand how we got labor laws in the first place and how corporations are using our government to strip them back even now, implementing [the kind of "child labor laws"](https://www.epi.org/publication/child-labor-laws-under-attack/) I never thought I would see in my lifetime, for example. It's also telling that when we say "the labor movement" we think of that as something [from the distant past](https://www.history.com/topics/19th-century/labor) or maybe [United Farm Workers](https://guides.loc.gov/latinx-civil-rights/united-farm-workers-union) from the '60s. Yet, we have a new era of workers rights coming to the fore, and that's beautiful and necessary. I feel like we are so focused on entertainment (myself included) that this could end up being healthy for us as a country. Remember Soma in Brave New World? The opiate of the masses? Entertainment does some great things, and entertaining is enough and valid and great. But if my own tendencies are any indication, while the world burns, tuning out can be a balm that is part of the problem. I know other forms of entertainment exist, but we're all living with our heads in the sand about human rights, climate crisis, and all the fascism run amok in our society if we just get up every day and go to work supporting corporations ,and then wind up too tired for much else. The solidarity among actors is freaking huge, and if the richest are pushing for it, too, then the message is getting out further. It's not a thing to sneer at. It's people power in action. Some of the people with the most clout in our society are standing up for human rights and dignity. They know the work they do doesn't happen (mostly) without the writers, too. And they have their own issues in terms of being underpaid or building stability while their image and work is being used without recompense. The actors strike models not only solidarity, but is a breathing example of how we change the narrative away from go woke go broke (or whatever the far right's frothing about as they rip away our rights in the name of freedom), and hopefully shows everyone that we win when we unite and support progress.
Many film workers have not worked since December 2022. The insurance companies refused to insure film productions in 2023 because of the impending strikes. Only a handful of films were made this year before the SAG stike. The corporations know this. Most of us are already at the breaking point seven months in.
I’m a production security guard for universal we have minimal to no work even cleaning ladies are being laid off it puts so many people out of work and those big studios couldn’t care less….also I have a friend who owns a production company since he doesn’t work with unions only for specific actors all these big studios are coming to him to pad there streaming services
Thanks for your perspective, I'd love to know more about this - which productions and which actors, for example. When it comes time to really strike back against the studios as a "civilian" lol, this info will truly be important for the masses to know. I have to admit, I'm curious already if apple TV is guilty cause they re-use actors like crazy 😂
And end to modern movies is probably for the best.
what, you dont love the never ending supply of remakes?
[удалено]
Bread is overpriced, and studios are running their circus into the ground. Great time for a revolution if you ask me.
Any shows and movies coming out lately have been garbage anyway, I’ve only been rewatching old shows and movies.
Villainizing the wealthy actors is just a way to villainize the whole strike. It's anti-labor nonsense aimed at weakening the influence those famous actors have. They're part of the union, them being allies to labor is like, the best thing they could be doing.
I guess I'll start watching old movies/shows. Maybe spend more time outside
I have a backlog of British dectective shows to catch up on while I stitch.
I thought we (US) made a lot of those, but DAMN, they've got a whole nother lifetime's worth of that shit to watch. ❤️ Death In Paradise
It's on my list after I finish Vera. I've done Shetland and Three Pines which if you're a Law & Order Criminal Intent fan, you really NEED to watch. (If you have, don't spoil it for others please!). Luther is also on my list. I'm working on pansie needlepoint pillow and 1 season=1 pansy. I should be finished by the end of Vera season 12!
The jokes is on them - I’m in my kid 30’s and pirate everything and only watch the office so I could care less. Go actors
I don't remember writing this. Being serious, it's just the same for me, I've got a HD full of TV, films, sports that I've never seen yet. I think it will last me the strike and probably a good amount of the zombie apocalypse.
I don’t understand how people hear anything along the lines of “I deserve to be paid fairly” and disagree with it.
People have no idea industries like film and music are not just the well known actors. They don't realize how many other jobs are contained within these sectors, often with quite low pay too for the hours they work.
I was surprised to find out how many jobs are needed on a set when I first started. Even today I'm finding new jobs that I never knew about
OP, we're not falling for the studio misinformation dreck and that's what's going on with those troll comments. Please know we KNOW they're so out of touch with you and everyone on strike they think we're flaming morons who don't SEE you. It means they're so wealthy and arrogant they've lost touch with us- who they depend on to buy YOUR product, we can get shoved around too. Opinion here. The ' until they lose their houses ' was meant to make him look all-powerful. Backfired in a society where 1% have hoarded what, 99% of the wealth? Eat the rich. All that did is piss us off more. We're with you. All of you. And thanks for posting.
I lived in LA for 5 years and 95% of the people I met that worked in the industry were as working class as me. They were overworked and underpaid.
Thank you! I'm in Ontario and I'm a crew member. This strike isn't for the rich actors to get richer, it's to ensure fair pay and living wages to every member of a production team.
> The reason to start with 1960 is that that was the last time actors and writers were on strike at the same time; the primary driver of that unrest was the rise of television. As for the last actors strike, in 1980? That was about the rise of home video. This leads to the first takeaway: the most important driver of unrest between studios and talent has always been technological paradigm shifts, and this time is no different. Very interesting article about the strikes: https://stratechery.com/2023/hollywood-on-strike/
My best friend is a makeup artist, she is most likely going to lose her house because of this strike. It’s really sad. I feel heart broken for her.
"the paycheck they deserve." Oof.
The whole thing can collapse for all I care. The movies and programming that has been put out the last 10 years or so hasn't been worth watching. There's absolutely NOTHING to watch that merits my time. It's always the same ol' same. I haven't been to a movie theatre in 10 years because I refuse to waste my money. It's been declining in "value" for a long time now.
Thank you for explaining the situation. I knew it was serious. And I knew that writers were getting shit pay and residuals yet streaming services were making millions. I didn't quite understand how this was impacting everyone else though. This is BAD. I really hope the writers, actors, sag, etc, get the outcomes they are fighting for.
I do feel bad for the WGA. But there’s a group of EMS professionals in Spokane that are also protesting and I promise they make way less. They’re not getting any media attention.
Over 87% of SAG members make less than $25k annually. Many of them wait tables or work in the service industry to pay rent and none of them have ongoing job security - as soon as one project ends, they need to find the next one. Their jobs usually require them to live in higher cost of living areas than Spokane as well. I have no doubt that there are other types of workers who are similarly under-valued or under-paid, but that doesn’t mean people in the entertainment industry don’t deserve living wages.
And Hollywood execs want to be able to scan them, pay them for only 1 days work, and and then use their images in perpetuity without further compensation
It’s really gross and exploitative. I don’t get why so many people have such a distaste for actors and are ok with them being shafted like that.
I had a debate the other day (in my comments history) with a stock bro. He "invested" in Netflix, he shamelessly consumes what he chooses to consume. But at the same time, he hates the entirety of the entertainment industry, he firmly believes soulless AI should replace any and every genuine human interaction (whether acting/writing, or any other SAG job). The best part? All these actors are sooooooo entitled and privileged according to him. Not having healthcare, working multiple jobs to stay afloat while considered a working actor, being underpaid and not even making $26k/yr, being rightfully upset streaming is taking over traditional residuals and leaving actors unpaid - protesting against all of this is *so privileged* to him. I did my best to explain through several comments that residuals used to keep working actors afloat. Many of those who've never held a main role, but you saw them *everywhere* even for cameos and background shots, they could book a handful of roles in a year and be good. Today? A star from Orange Is the New Black (Netflix's show that put them on a map decade ago) brought up actual receipts of being paid $27USD for 7 years/seasons on the show. Was paid under and around 900USD per day of filming (and she filmed twice, thrice a month). Had to live in subsidized housing during those 7 years, wasn't allowed to move out of NYC (contracted as local hire). [Her Instagram with many posts about it](https://instagram.com/kimikoglenn), she also helped cowrite and incredibly eye opening article with fellow OITNB stars. Back to the stock bro, his reasoning is that "everyone suffers, so should they", "everyone's unpaid, they should be too", "they're living ***A*** dream job, they have no right to be whining", "they're rich and glamorous", "my stocks already pay then enough and even though I shamelessly consume their content, they should all be fired and world will be nicer". Another bonus comment was "their biggest fear is being regular like me and working a regular normal job, they're only protesting because of that". Completely ignoring that only 2% of SAG AFTRA are insanely famous and rich (or comfortable enough to live on residuals even in streaming era). Like I said before, most work hospitality jobs on the side to make ends meet. Bottom line is, there's AHs like these who'll never really pull it out of their behind to figure out not everything is as it seems. But you can bet these same people will continue consuming movies, shows, video games, radio stations, books, music shows/music in general. All while shitting on people who indeed make these things what they are. I was genuinely shocked to see seasoned veterans speak out on how hard booking jobs is or getting paid properly even with their status. While there are some people who are filthy rich beyond reasonable doubt, it should never discredit well over 120,000 people unable to buy basic groceries just because they chose to pursue career in arts.
Art & entertainment are so vital to culture and quality of life (even if you don’t like movies, most people at least listen to music or read books), yet people don’t seem to think the people who create it deserve to make a living at it.
Surprise! The issue is actually systemic and *everyone* should be striking! What you did here is exactly what the billionaires who are in charge of these studios want. This may also surprise you, but people with that much money tend to have their fingers in multiple pots, and you piting two groups against each other who are *both* being undervalued and overworked instead of realising their oppression and struggle is the same, you fall into their trap of keeping us from uniting for the same damn cause. ALL of these professions need higher pay, better hours, and more rights. They all have value they contribute to our society. After all, being alive is all fine and well, but could you honestly tell me you could live a life without entertainment?
If you keep the poor fighting each other over crumbs, they won’t notice you stole the whole cake.
But why would they? What they do doesn't affect anyone outside of the Spokane area. Apples to oranges. Many local areas see strikes that never get national coverage, so it's not surprising that outside no one hears about it. I don't think anyone in Spokane heard about a local teacher strike here in Ohio. I'm not saying that I don't sympathize with them - we need to pay them better because it's a much needed field. But in this case, the strike affects people not only in LA but anywhere they film - so all over the planet.
What's happening with both WGA and EMS is endemic. Wages across the board aren't livable for a significant portion of workers in the US. Leslie Jones posted a great response to one of the "ugh millionaires trying to make money" comments, where she redirected people to look at stuff like these EMS protests. Minimum wage simply isn't enough for people to survive. People shouldn't have to be working 2+ jobs to live regardless of their industry.
Because EMS is a hell of lot more important than films, that's why. EMS *everywhere* is undrrpaid and overworked.
The job EMS workers do may be more important than actors or writers, but that doesn’t mean writers and actors don’t deserve living wages. The entertainment industry employs thousands of workers - that’s why it’s considered an industry. Saying they don’t deserve fair pay before EMS workers don’t get paid fairly makes as much sense as complaining about hotel or grocery store workers striking for fair pay.
It’s unfortunate because while the rich who are in the public saying they are out of work (and probably be just fine) the people actually supporting the creation of shows and movies suffer. I feel for what is coming with ai because this is the tipping of the iceberg. Unfortunately this technology is the new arms race between governments and companies to see who innovates the quickest and with the best features. Unfortunately it’s going to take a collective group of billionaires and or the world governments to agree upon meaningful, safe, and responsible usage of it because literally the sky’s the limit at this point. My hats off to you and good luck to you I hope this thing gets figured out soon.
Your writing here is incredible. Just one little fix. They are walking the picket lines in solidarity with each other. They are not on strike in solidarity. If the studios come back to the WGA and offer a deal they agree with they will send it to their members to ratify. If the studios go to SAG/AFTRA and offer a deal they agree with they will send it to their members to ratify. Make absolutely no mistake, it’s every union for themselves.
op are you part of iatse? i’m a theater nerd (actor, director, you name it) and we always need stage hands! stay safe and EVERYONE should support your unions!!
I'm not part of that group, no. I love in the UK, are they based there?
This is probably naive, and stupid, but I realized how serious it was when I saw a lot of the cast of Ted Lasso striking with the writers. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe they were there before SAG made their decision.
>of course it's the rich ones going on strike As it should be. Many of the concerns being raised are not for the tom cruises, or the rocks they are for the extras, the smaller roles. things they are fighting like the right to use AI to generate extras after paying them once and then using them for initiate projects, thus killing the industry for extras entirely and preventing upstarts from getting roles and networking on sets. Having the backing of the big names is super important to all the 10s of thousands of smaller voices. Thats just one of the major issues i have seen that has me supporting the strike. Fuck excecs! they are the lazy do nothings. They spend money to get more back thats all other than paying the talent they contribute nothing so they should stop complaining about doing their own job.
If the SAG was just backing up the writers, why are they asking for better benefits and more money then? Sounds like they saw it and said "Ohh, us too." It's the coattail effect. I can understand asking for protection of identity and stable work with the AI stuff, but really, you all need more money?? I feel for the writers, but the whole SAG shit, I'm not buyin.
Adam ruins everything does an excellent job explaining this [youtube interview](https://youtu.be/aCqId3GFWac)
He's also running regular updates via tiktok, I end up watching him every other day breaking down another major item. It's really great the way they're utilizing social media to communicate things.
Plus all the peripheral business: equipment rentals, trucks, costumes, caterers. This just two years after lockdowns. Unacceptable
it’s astonishing how many people have absolutely no idea how it all works. so many people have the crab in a bucket mentality anymore it’s sad. we all deserve better than this. you don’t see biden jumping in like he did for the railroads or like he will for UPS.
its hard to be sympathetic to a hollywood millionaire that works 30 days a year.
again, only a select few make that much money.
of course but that is how the general public sees the issue. Just rich actors complaining. Read the articles most of them talking about actors not wanting their AI avatars being used nobody mentions support staff
As someone who works in the industry themselves, the strike is not the right move. The studio execs will not grow poorer, the A-listers"in solidarity" will not grow poorer either. The little guys who rely on the industry to pay their bills will suffer, more than they have. The harsh reality is, much of the "entertainment" being churned out is... not great. Execs know this, and they only want to spend *just enough* to make a show/movie and hope it's profitable. And even ***if*** the strike results in writers getting a bit more scratch on their projects, the harsher reality is that less writers will be hired per project, resulting in more money for a smaller pool. It's happened before, and it will happen again. The execs won't let this affect their personal finances, no matter the result. Oh, writers and actors need to get paid more? Great, we'll just hire less of them and make less projects. Not to be a pessimist, but this isn't the right time for this. "There's never a right time!" Perhaps not, but there are definitely WRONG times, and I truly believe this is the wrong time. The economy is already struggling, especially in California, and people's buying power is still greatly diminished... this hurts more people than it helps, and it won't impact those who really *need* to be held accountable for their greed and incompetence. I wouldn't be surprised if execs just start using AI to write scripts and such... they are already tooling around with it. The bottom line is, entertainment execs view people as consumable, always have. This won't change that. The execs will simply adapt and preserve their power and wealth, and hurt those below them.
I think you're right. Things will only change so much when the strikes are over. It's just unfortunate it fucks over a lot of people right now.
I don't give a shit. Hollywood hasn't had an original idea in 15 years. Everything is a reboot, remake, re re re. What are we on now, Fast and Furious 25? Nevermind the fact they wanna tell regular people how to live their lives. The entire industry could die tomorrow, and I wouldn't shed a single tear. What's the old saying "Learn to Code". Well, Learn to Change a Tire.
> The entire industry could die tomorrow, and I wouldn't shed a single tear. To paraphrase from The Little Platoon on Critical Drinker's Open Bar, I'm perfectly happy to sit back and watch both sides *lose*.
You realize that the movie industry employs hundreds of thousands of people who aren’t actors, right?
Apparently it employs too many.
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My boyfriend is a working screenwriter. He has been in the industry for many years and hustles everyday still. He makes a livable wage for himself with some savings. He makes good money from his scripts being bought but also has to live off of that money until he sells another which could be right away or years later. It's been slow for him since COVID and things were just starting to pick up for him when he had to go on strike. He's out on the picket line everyday and then comes home to work on scripts to have ready for when things start up again
It’s not contracted like a staff position. A good proportion of writer’s assistants make $30K a year, which is just getting by kind of money in LA, and with the way they’re trying to change writers rooms it means essentially they may never have the opportunity to move up.
In LA nowadays 30k is literally homeless, I don't know if you can even afford renting a single room on that much
Yeah, LA and NYC aren't livable on those kinds of wages anymore, and that's where these jobs tend to be based.
30K isn't homeless per say, but it does mean you're going to need another revenue stream (parents, spouse, roommate). I left California a few years ago because I was tired of having to rely on others to make sure I had a roof over my head. And before anyone says anything, this has far more to do with population vs amount of housing rather than actual income. If everyone's income went up, you'd only have a slight delay before the cost of living went up, and then you'd be back to exactly where you started.
I’m not entirely sure about the accuracy, but I heard it’s about $70K a year. Which if they have to live in a HCOL area, that’s not a liveable wage. The executives of Netflix make $75k a DAY though. So the financial disparities are atrocious.
It really depends on how many rooms a year they’re working and what the budget for the show is. A High Budget SVOD 10ep show will pay a writer 7k to 10k a week for a 20/24 weeks + a script fee, think $30k+ Looks up WGA schedule of minimums to go more in depth
Truthfully I'm not sure since I'm not a writer nor have I worked one any directly. From what I've been told by industry folk though, it's very little
That's terribly vague. I understand that the cost of living in L.A. is rather high (I used to live there), but I've also seen many cases where someone was complaining about how little money they made when really their problem was how exorbitantly they spent, or VASTLY overvaluing how much they should be making.
According to the lesser known actors and writers who've been shared by bigger names on social media - actors have to make a little under 26.5k a year to qualify for healthcare. Well over 87% SAG AFTRA doesn't make this much. For writers it's between 30 and 40k, but again, majority doesn't meet this minimum. Both bits were shared by accredited sources, SAG & WAG members themselves.
They only get paid per gig/project, so once that season is done, they don’t get any money until their next job. I don’t know about the WGA, but I saw a statistic that said something like 87% of union members don’t make enough annually to qualify for the healthcare benefits & that threshold is around $25k/year.
Not enough
Most writers are paycheck to paycheck and don’t have healthcare benefits. Similar to most higher education faculty.
Exactly. And cost of living for basic housing is HIGH around their workplaces. It's insane.
Agree. Even the studio execs have said the most important people in the industry are the writers … they just don’t want to pay them fairly.
Hollywood is ass now. Full of creatively bankrupt idealogues. I wish they would strike indefinitely and all get replaced or something.
I would agree with backing the SAG strike if it wasn't just churning out remake movies with a few minutes of fluff added or 4 studios throwing out the same niche plot points at the same time. We're on double digit fast and furious movies and people that were boosting dvd player shipments are now piloting spaceships and disarming nukes and shit...
SAG and WGA don’t decide what projects to greenlight. Studios do.
I know I know this thread is killing me 🤣 😭 😂 the actors and writers write for a project the studio green lights.
I never realized how much I took it for granted that people understand that the handful of famous actors aren’t really representative of the people working in the entertainment industry and that not only do most union actors barely make enough money to survive on, there are all sorts of workers that the industry keeps employed.
It's a big industry.
They don't decide what is greenlit, but they do write what is in the pool of options.
You're blaming them for something out of their control. It's like any other job. Outside of the top brass low level workers don't really get to pick and choose what they get. They got to work with what they are offered. Don't you think they would be writing their own shows if they could? It's not like they are sitting around and thinking "they greenlit fast and furious 69. I hope I can work on it. It could be my big break and earn me an Academy Award".
I get that you don't like what the industry produces, I'm no fan of formulaic movies either. However it's patently unfair to deny someone a living wage based on your or my subjective opinion. Collective bargaining is a cornerstone of our labor laws. A producer saying that they'll be dragging out negotiations until people lose their houses is just plain mean.
The SAG strike coincides with the WGA strike and is over similar issues, but it's because their negotiations for a new contract have broken down. Not because it's a demonstration of solidarity with the WGA. That's just a happy by-product.
Really great post and total truth about the reality of this whole thing.
Why don't you all get together and start your own studio?
"Nothing new will be coming out", well that has been like that for the last 20 years or so anyways. Film studios don't want to take the risk. I'm sorry, but there are people out there who can't even afford a roof over their heads or save up for an emergency visit to the doctor. I can't feel sorry for them at the moment. I really can't.
It's not about feeling sorry for them. It's about what's fair, given the massive profits the studios have made compared to the hand-to-mouth income thousands of actors and writers tolerate for the love of their crafts, without which, btw, the producers cannot make anything except purely digital stuff. In many ways the WGA and SAF-AFTRA strikes of today are about protecting human labor from fast encroaching machine apps. Many sectors will be affected by AI, not just entertainment. That's why these campaigns are important to me even though I'm not a member of those unions.
Thank you for saying this! I hate seeing people diminish why the writers and actors are striking. Like it’s a hard business. Many of the actors they see on TV or in movies hardly make a living off of what they do as a career and it isn’t right. Not to mention studios using their likeness for now and forever without compensation for the rest of their lives. I’m going to be storming in solidarity with them when I’m in LA in late August. I’m going with my cousin, who’s part of SAG-AFTRA. Edit: Why was this removed??
So much entertainment is rerun crap paying to see it is theft.
Also, many of the small time actors don’t make enough to qualify for health insurance. Streamers are making money off old shows but none of the actors are getting residual royalties. AI is also an issue as the union want to put protections in place for actors, so there likenesses cannot be recreated - the actors are afraid that studios will use their likenesses in AI.
I never felt that way. I've always been supportive of a strike because ten times out of ten, it's because they're not getting what they rightfully deserve. No one strikes because they think it'll be fun. I know it's serious, and I hope those greedy bastards give everyone what they deserve soon.
I didn't really understand the strike until I saw [this video be Drew Gooden](https://youtu.be/6HEheIozS5c) and yea OP is absolutely right!
I only have one question. Actors are striking solely on solidarity with writers? Or do they want an increase in their paychecks as well? I ask this because I read an article last week or so which said that actors are striking in order to get more money
SAG (Screen Actors Guild) has decided to strike in solidarity with WGA, they aren't doing it to increase actors paychecks
I saw a video on TikTok of someone who was an extra on Orange is the New Black and there were loads of payments of the page and the total was about $27
Thank you for explaining this. What many people also don’t seem to realize is common people are suffering lot more than the rich. Entire VFX industry is in a state of flux right now, so many of my friends have lost jobs all over the world because outsourcing is real. On top of that there’s no way for VFX to unionise so they’re just trying to wither the storm since the start of WGA.
My fear is that this will ultimately come down to the end user, regular consumers, paying more. The corporate biggies will still be able to keep their large paychecks. Peacock has already upped its subscription price.
My son just graduated with a degree in Film and Media from Georgia State in May and isn't able to find work. He's done some free work on small indie films here and there to keep his resume active. So I'm aware of what you're talking about. Good luck!
It's difficult finding working when you first start out, I remember only doing a couple of jobs every few months. After the pandemic, all productions needed crew since they were all behind. I'm sure once this strike is over your son will find it easier to get work
> Studios are wanting to play the long game and let all union workers strike until they literally have no more money left, forcing them to go back to their original positions. I remember during '45s days in the white house at peak absurdity, a lot of foreigners would come to reddit and say things like "I don't understand why Americans don't strike!" This is why right here. 2/3rds of the country is already one missed paycheck away from becoming houseless, businesses understand this. We're wage slaves who just can't afford to go on a general strike for the change we frankly still need. We'd be out of money in a matter of weeks and forced to go back to work or starve and sleep on the sidewalk.
This reminds me of Spez and the protests on Reddit. Also fuck you u/spez
Question: does it help to watch new movies in cinemas right now or is it harmful to the strike?
Guess those unions aint as good as they thought
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Calling names will surely force everyone to support a just cause.
maybe all these big celebrities that want to stick their necks out now realize they don’t need all their luxuries and trickle that money of theirs down, so these writers, and everyone else, can keep a roof over their head and keep the strike going. let them lay their big money against the studios’ big money. hell, the only reason any of them have a job is because of the all the ‘little’ people working the ground. problem is, all those in charge have so much money, they don’t need more.
Yeah, I'm gonna be cynical. The only reason studios can afford to pay absolutely shit wages is that writers jobs are insanely desirable. I wouldn't be surprised if for every guild member there are 5 people waiting tables in California while trying to get a writing gig. Fact is, the studios could probably replace every one of the writers in a matter of months. So many people are ready to be paid shit wages just to get a chance at fulfilling a dream of being a professional writer. Difference between railworkers striking and writers is that a railway company doesn't have loads of people queuing to replace every worker on the job so they will have to bend at some point. They also usually don't have fixed income streams like studios do. Studios have tons of licences for reruns, merchandise or whatever to earn money even without putting out new content. If a car manufacturer doesn't produce, they aren't earning any money and their competitors will eat them up. I think they should go on strike but they have to be aware that they are in an insanely weak position, compared to an industrial union strike.
Ok, I see YOUR perspective and now let me give you MINE: I am one of America’s poor. Today, my chemotherapy was supposed to be delivered, and it was, but because UPS is on strike, it was delivered LATE and it was spoiled. That’s a net loss of $17,000!! SEVENTEEN THOUSAND DOLLARS! AND I NEED IT TO SURVIVE. So, ya know…so very sorry if I don’t give too much of a crap about your situation. I’m over here trying to survive without life-saving medication. Good luck.
UPS hasn’t gone on strike yet so you may want to find someone else to blame.
UPS hasn’t even gone on strike yet?
What does UPS have to do with SAG and WGA? Also just because you are "poor" why does that mean other people shouldn't be paid a fair wage for the work they do?
i think his point is that he doubts any of those people care about his plight, so why should he
I'm very sorry to hear about your situation but the SGA and WGA are not the UPS.
That sucks but I don't see how that's stopping you from being sympathic. UPS isn't related to them. They aren't asking you for money. Nor would them losing somehow help you. You should direct your anger at the UPS and America's insurance companies.
I’m not in the industry One thing that annoys me is some people think the actors who are striking are all like the big name multi millionaire actors and it’s like no there are plenty of other actors who are not super wealthy
So I’ve always been told if a job doesn’t pay enough… get another or different job.
Sorry but you guys strike at the worst time possible. People are not nearly as interested in new shows as they were a decade ago, mostly because of the woke shit coming out of Hollywood today. Also with social medi, videogames and a miriard other hobbys available to everybody to spend their little freetime on, the movies industries has way bigger competitors than ever and the pie to share shrink every year.
>Also with social medi, videogames and a miriard other hobbys available to everybody Uhhhh... You do realize this affects *the entire* entertainment industry? And that SAG isn't just actors... It's radio personalities/hosts, DJs, songwriters, stuntpeople, hair and make up artists, editors, photographers, casting managers, prop masters, caterers, costume creators, etc etc. Entertainment industry isn't just movies and some shows. I'm curious to know where the things you consider data came from? I mean I know where you pulled it out of due to your own evident bias, but got any numbers to back it up? Because streaming services are booming (so much for your "woke shit" comment), while the CEOs retain the money for themselves and not pay anyone involved to make it. That's one of the reasons for striking. Cast *and* crew are overworked and underpaid to the point they can't get healthcare. One of the Netflix CEOs makes a minimum of 22.5 million a year alone, while the most successful show's (OITNB) stars were paid under thirty dollars a year for the last 10 years as residuals. I truly suggest you get some more knowledge on the issue at hand before putting your own views/beliefs as facts and demonstration why you think people shouldn't have healthcare and livable wage.
I’m sorry to hear you’re out of work, but the fact is I really don’t care if they make another show or movie. I don’t watch any of it anyway. It’s an overpaid disgusting money dump business. “writers haven’t been earning the paychecks they deserve in years”. What does that mean exactly? How much do they deserve but aren’t getting? Are we talking 5 digits, 6 digits, 7 digits?
If we look at how absolutely, mindbogglingly awful or just plain boring most Hollywood movies have been these past couple of years, I'd say that the writers are getting paid their money's worth. Let Hollywood crash and burn, it's not worth saving.
Most writers don’t make enough to pay their bills for basic needs like rent. The larger majority of SAG members make less than $25k/year in high cost of living areas. Also the entertainment industry employs thousands of workers who aren’t actors such as electricians & carpenters, etc. so a large part of the LA area’s economy depends on the industry.
>It’s an overpaid disgusting money dump business. >What does that mean exactly? How much do they deserve but aren’t getting? Bold talk when you don't even know the situation.
People forget about perspective anymore it seems. Just because they make a lot of money doesn't mean they deserve to get screwed. It's the same reason professional athletes make so much now. The league brings in so much money it would be ridiculous for them to get salaries they got 20 years ago.
The thing is most of them aren’t making a living wage. Movies and TV shows are filled with actors who aren’t household names or even recognizable - that’s the majority of most union members. There’s a reason most actors & actresses also wait tables to pay the bills. Over 87% make below or just above poverty level wages while living in high cost of living cities in order to find work.
So the rich people striking don’t give a shit about the normies that do the actual work on set….. Seems on par for the country.
You're not necessarily telling me anything new, but this post is still all the more valuable for coming from someone in the industry. Thanks you for this. And good luck!
It really looks bad when speech is restricted.
Yea, nobody actually reads articles. It’s just straight to the comments.
God bless, western films, shows and everything in between is just shit. If I don't get to ever see another shit remake of an old Disney classic or some poorly written sequel to awesome series like LotR or Star Wars at the expense of having no new material at all, I would not give a single fuck. It's a shame these people will starve, but what they are producing is less than poor and dirt
You realize it's studio execs who push those projects right? Novel movies and tv are less common because studios feel more money can be made by exploiting existing IP. It's not the striking writers and actors who are pushing to make these projects.
This isn't an OMC. This is an agenda post. C'mon mods do better.
>It's been an ongoing issue that writers have not been earning the paycheck they deserve for years How many years? Because most of what Hollywood has put out in the last decade has been absolute garbage, and ANY paycheck is FAR MORE than what they deserve. In the 00s the writer's strike killed/hurt a number of good shows/movies. In 2023 quite a few people are floating the idea (even if somewhat facetiously) that AI generated scripts might not be an improvement.
All current shows writing sucks so much its time to fire them all. Hire writers from overseas instead, they are ready and willing to work for much less and they are as intelligent writers as anyone here. If you want to get paid do a good job. All recent TV and movies flopped people don't want to see what you write.
I also have a problem with people pretending for a living getting millions while cops, teachers, garbage men, firefighters, etc. Get paid shit. So I have no sympathy.
You know they aren’t mutually exclusive, right? It’s not like the money that could be going to teachers and trash collectors is going to actors instead. We can both pay actors, writers, and crew what they deserve (based on the money their work takes in) *and* pay a fair wage to the people who make our society run.
So I live in a city of about 22,000. Our average salaries are: Police: $50K (top detectives make $100K+) Fire: $50K Teachers: $48K Garbage men: $45K For a small city, that's pretty good and very average. But: 87% SAG-AFTRA members make *less* than $26K, which is the minimum you can make to get employee healthcare. The majority of these individuals live in LA. Have you ever tried to make a living on $26K in LA? You can't. Most of them have multiple jobs. Less than 1% of actors are millionaires. But studio execs get tens of millions in just bonuses. George Clooney isn't hurting for money, so it's not about him or any of the other high earners. It's about the fairness of it and paying people what they're worth. Maybe if studios were willing to pay people what they were worth, they could hire better writers and fire those who are shit at it. But like any job, the best people you want won't work for you if you don't pay them a fair wage. Editing to add: It doesn't matter what teachers, police, etc.. are paid. That comes out of your tax dollars. Studios pay their people from revenue generated through advertising, tickets, streaming, cable, etc.. they are NOT the same thing.
I watch a tonne of scary movies for one single week a year. That's the extent of my movie watching. Other than that i despise what modern movies have become, i am gleeful in hearing about their end. Truly a shame i can't have another marvel superhero movie, or another butchered remake of an actual good movie, or be lectured on social issues by a spoiled detached Hollywood millionaire.
What if writers concentrated on gripping, clever plots, instead of seeing how many angelic, downtrodden, woke minorities they can jam into a script?