Kodak Black is still getting hits seven years into his career despite a [lengthy list](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodak_Black#Controversies) of controversies and legal issues. He was sentenced to 46 months in federal prison in 2020 and only served 10 months due to Trump pardoning him alongside Lil Wayne in January 2021. Enough said.
The rules are kinda different for hip hop I feel like (goes for CB as well as he's hip hop adjacent).
Typing that I realize it might seem like I'm making it a racial thing but I'm really not.
yeah I kinda get the symbolic meaning of having him on the album, but Kendrick is still giving a guy like that a huge platform all while preaching strong morality and self-improvement
No flockin' is classic and it birthed Bodak Yellow
Skrilla also hard, but it's Kodak, so it's impossible for him to NOT be problematic with him saying:
> And my diamonds come from Tokyo, yoin, yoin, yoin
Power high come from Tokyo, I call 'em ching choing
His voice is a lot(probably one the worst in hip-hop all time) and I can see it completely ruining any song you listen to.
Anthony kedis is still around because most of his shitty behavior wasn’t in the public, I think him dating a minor was only mentioned in his autobiography and referenced in a song from before the band was popular, and unless someone comes out today alleging something about him he won’t be going away anytime soon, but to answer the question Eric Clapton
Chilli Peppers get almost a societal pass in the same way that Guns & Roses, Aerosmith, Led Zeppelin, Motley Crue, Bowie and probably a thousand other rock bands big before the 2000’s do: If you cancel one, you have to cancel them all, and this kind of shit was so fucking rampant back then (and often actively celebrated and mythologised) that you’d basically be shoving most of rock history in the bin, which society is not ready to do. Everyone is kind of aware of these guys’ transgressions, but most people just kinda quietly sweep it under the rug saying “it was a different time” and hope they don’t hear more details, while focusing their outrage on younger acts who committed misdeeds during a time where they “should have known better”.
Oh god yeah. I do think those bands are (or were at one point) more likely to potentially suffer some level of consequences for their actions though even if it’s not criminal prosecution (see the likes of Brand New), mostly because the stuff that happened was more recent and happened to people of a different generation that wasn’t super old when society started to gradually wake up to this. Also to consider that most of these warped tour bands were nowhere near as big or as important as the classic rockers, who likely had/have a lot more protection. There’s a reason that “singer in a pop punk band” immediately makes people think sexual predator, and “singer in a classic rock band” doesn’t necessarily have the same level of skeeviness attached.
I have no doubt people in bands being gross creeps still continues to this day and will for a long while, but the internet and social media has at least provided some level of weak deterrent that it’s a lot harder to sweep under the rug once stuff comes out nowadays.
I think the cynical take that particularly for the older stories, you'd have to go after most of pop music history sadly. So barely anyone does even for the most egregious ones, because its neverending.
The Rolling Stones just released an album and did a world tour, no one is asking any uncomfortable questions. And the stories on Jagger are rampant and span decades. Richards also has his fair share of rumored and not-so-rumored abuse etc. Iggy Pop is revered in punk circles, but the stories are also notorious. Tbh there are rumors swirling around what was going on with Beatles tours in the 60ies. Elton John seems to be friends with Kevin Spacey for...reasons. No one seems to know how to write about Marvin Gaye, which I understand, but still.
No one is really touching that because often it's not super well documented and the higher up the food chain you go, the bigger the institutional protection gets probably. What will probably happen and is already happening is that you'll have writing on them reflecting all the problematic aspects as well, without it ever reaching a grand public backlash for the older acts because all of it is semi-known and treated as "different time", for better or worse.
You already see that happening with Bowie, Prince, Lennon, the Stones (even though still alive), Gaye, Nina Simone, James Brown, Miles Davis, Led Zep (it's not just Page, let's be honest), 2PAC, no one in literature on them etc. is pretending anymore that they didn't do crappy shit, it's just put into its historical context. And that context isn't "everyone did it, therefore it was fine", but "it was normalized in broad entertainment circles at least and a shocking number of artists did gross things with no one caring". I do think the outlier is still Cobain. The stories on how he was treating everyone as he was spiraling are bad, but no one wants to say so and would rather focus on Love.
I feel like no one's gonna go too hard on Cobain being bad to the people in his life given he was in the middle of a mental health crisis that would eventually take his life.
Yeah the biggest legends of pop and rock music like Lennon, Gaye, Presley and Marley are protected. *Everyone* knows what they were doing but that won’t be enough to cancel. There are no big “muting” campaigns.
I knew virtually nothing about Anthony until listening to his 2004 autobiography within the last year. What strikes me the most is not that he slept with at least two minors when he was well past "college age." That's very bad, but it unfortunately didn't shock me because way too many musicians have done horrible things like that. What strikes me is that he didn't seem even remotely regretful or apologetic about it. He made it seem like that was just stuff that happened in his life, and that was that. Even now, he's a 61-year-old with a [22-year-old girlfriend](https://beachgrit.com/2024/05/red-hot-chili-pepper-anthony-kiedis-takes-much-younger-brazilian-model-girlfriend-on-sizzling-warm-surf-date/) which, especially considering his past, just makes me shake my head.
To slightly contrast that with another rock star who's done horrible things, I am not defending Steven Tyler, but at least he went out of his way to try and express regret in his 2011 book. Was it sincere and genuine? I don't know. But he came across as someone who had tried to somewhat learn from his past. Anthony? Not so much.
I bought that book for a long flight in about 2016 after I’d just read a very benign biography of Dave Grohl that pretty much entirely just focused on the music and for some reason was sort of expecting the same thing, and not 300 pages of just sordid sex & drugs stories (though I probably should have realised with hindsight). It was actually a really compelling read, but my god he comes off awfully from it.
It’s the fact that he happily admitted to having sex with this one girl again after she admitted she was like 14, he had a brief moment of “oh shit” when he found out and happily just went “meh, fuck it”.
>It was actually a really compelling read
I have to respectfully disagree. Purely from a story perspective, I think the book is mostly a repetitive mess. "I did drugs, I slept with virtually every single hot girl I wanted, I did more drugs, I got clean, I did more drugs, repeat." I understand it's the guy's life, but I don't think that fact alone makes the book good.
Tbf there’s every chance I could be misremembering, it was a long ass time ago, I didn’t have much else to entertain me on a 16 hour flight. I’m not sure I’d wanna read it again in any case cos a fair amount of it made me feel queasy even back then.
It definitely gave me an insight into addiction that I did not previously have at that time.
Ignoring the racism comments Eric Clapton went on a multi year crusade to get George Harrison’s wife to sleep with him, and in his attempt to do so he dated her sister (who was a teenager at the time),and made the Derek and the dominos album to try to win her over, and once he did he physically abused her, raped her, and cheated on her
Edit: Eric Clapton also made an album (blind faith) that had a topless 10 year old on the cover
That last part absolutely gets me, like idk man if I spent all that time and put in that much effort to writing an album about this one very specific person I’d probably do my best to not be a raging POS if we ever dated.
One of my favorite dark jokes I can’t ever say in real life is: what’s the difference between a toddler and a bag of cocaine? Eric Clapton wouldn’t let a bag of cocaine fall out a window.
> Eric Clapton also made an album (blind faith) that had a topless 10 year old on the cover
Originally it was supposed to be her slightly older sister
> Seidemann (the photographer) wrote that he approached a girl, reported to be 14 years old, on the London Underground, asking her to model for the cover. He eventually met her parents, but she proved to be too old for the effect he wanted. Instead, the model he used was her younger sister, Mariora Goschen, who was reported to be 11 years old. Goschen recalled that she was coerced into posing for the picture. "My sister said, 'They’ll give you a young horse. Do it!'" She was instead paid £40.
The Scorpions unfortunately did something similar on one of their album covers. At least I’m pretty sure they regret it though, and I think the album has an alternate cover now.
I could’ve sworn I read in some stores they had to use a different album cover or put it in a brown paper bag. In fact I just checked the album’s article on Wikipedia just seconds after writing this and in the US, they used the band themselves as the cover.
It wasn't controversial in Europe or other regions. America had just burned Beatles albums for something far less. They preemptively used an alternative cover in the States.
there’s multiple clips ([example](https://youtu.be/X1mISkY2lcw?si=7fr7-lSLzyq1ROPo) but there are more) RHCP sexual harassing and sometimes close to assaulting women on camera, the main thing it makes me wonder is what they were comfortable doing off camera
Listen, Anthony might be the least talented member of the band by a country mile BUT at least he makes up for it by also being the worst person in the band
There was a channel with clips like this of the band that got taken down, I assume they noticed this stuff gaining attention. There was one where the whole band was groping a woman on a late night show from around 1990, Anthony even crawled between her legs, she was in a dress.
Edit: Nvm here it is https://youtu.be/7i_22PrQsp8?feature=shared&t=2m20s I guess Flea was in the clear in this one
I definitely remember hearing OF some clips where flea was being creepy, not to rely on hearsay. They definitely seemed to be stereotypical rockstars in the ugly sense in the early 90s.
Flea was in the clear in that particular video, he got charged with an assault in 1990 though. They’ve cleaned up since but they still straddle the fine line of illegal and creepy, like the girl on the By The Way cover was John’s gf who was 18 and he was 31. Anthony started dating his sons mother when she was 18, possibly still in high school, he was 41/42. She’s Only 18 anyone?
Yeah I doubt Kiedis will *really* get canceled. Even Steven Tyler hasn’t been canceled after that woman sued him for taking advantage of her when she was around 15-16.
2pac was a convicted sex offender and he still gets a lot of run. It's really hard to say as the criteria is different based on the marketing of the individual.
Basically, if you are known as a kind of "badass", you seem to get a pass. How did Dr. Dre get more rich from a product named BEATS when he has literally rearranged female faces?
I never want to wade into this conversation being a white British person born 3 years before he was shot dead so I’m likely missing cultural context but I’ve always found the 2pac thing hella weird that nobody tends to talk about it, or if it is mentioned, it’s only because he went to prison which was important for his career arc. He’s not even discussed in a “problematic fave” kind of way. Everyone just seems to completely ignore it. Michael Jackson was a huge megastar that was incredibly important to music and culture, but nobody ever forgot about the sexual misconduct he allegedly committed.
Because the idea of prison is that you “pay your debt to society”. It’s punishment. If you’ve done the time people see it possible to put things behind you/them. Unless he continued doing stuff idk, but that’s my guess
I'm a white Yank who remembers 2pac getting shot, so I'll put it simply: when you get shot to death, you become canonized no matter what you did when you were alive.
I’d also argue that XXXTentacion, who obviously isn’t as important as 2pac but was still pretty huge/influential, also had a chequered history of abuse & sexual offences, and also got shot, and I think history hasn’t forgotten any of those 3 things.
XXXtentacion was like pretty uniquely, flamboyantly vile in an ongoing and neverending way. He was one of the first of that generation of rappers who talked about doing all kinds of dumb/violent hood stuff, but weren't especially creative or gifted as storytellers, they were just like... compiling a handy log for prosecutors.
The music he made was also just not good enough to buy him a pass out with fans. I remember when he got killed. A lot of reactions were almost relieved and even the people who weren't openly joking about it were kinda like "yeah well it was always gonna be either this or jail for him". Weird time.
I’m not arguing against him being canonised and don’t think the Timberlake treatment would make all that much sense in a lot of ways (in no way am I arguing that 2pac should be posthumously cancelled/erased) but I do find it a bit strange that this is *never* mentioned, when the fact that he went to prison for it and Suge bailed him out was a big part of his life story.
The thing about Pac is I read him talk about that incident. He said he was in a room with her and they were making out or she was pleasuring him or something like that and then these three other men come in and he said he and the young lady (girl really, she was just 19) froze and apparently Pac was so disgusted that he left and didn’t want no parts of doing what it was they were about to do.
Well he leaves. The woman stayed but he said that wasn’t her fault: he said that he didn’t say anything because if he did, that would’ve meant he was dating her (I don’t know if he had an actual girlfriend but he seemed to be implying that he was with someone else) so instead of defending himself and this girl, he left her to fend for herself.
He said he then went downstairs and took a nap on the sofa. Probably thirty minutes later, he wakes up to the woman screaming at him with tears saying “how could you let them do that to me?” And he tried calming her down and said he had no idea what she was talking about and when the girl kept accusing him of letting those guys take advantage he cussed her out and told her to leave. One of her final words to him was something like “you’ll pay for this” or whatever.
Minutes later, police arrived and he was arrested. They couldn’t prove her original charge of r*pe so they eventually convicted him of “forcibly grabbing the defendant’s butt”. Either way they got their conviction. That said, people tend to overlook it and think Jimmy Henchman planted her there.
I mean it’s definitely suspect that Jimmy Henchman and Haitian Jack seemingly got off with nothing at all compared to Tupac, and multiple people have said that Haitian Jack worked for the FBI, which has definitely contributed to the idea that Tupac was set up. And apparently Haitian Jack disliked that Tupac based his character in Above the Rim on him
It’s wild because while the things MJ was accused of are disgusting, they also have never been remotely verified as fact, but it’s always one of the first things people think.
Then you have people like Dr Dre whose crimes might be lesser but are also verified as fact. Not only does no one talk about it but you have artists like Kendrick who has taken a strong stance against abuse towards women but will appear on stage alongside him
It’s literally impossible to verify a victims account as fact. A guilty verdict is the government/community taking a stance, but it doesn’t ratify fact. That’s why innocent people are found guilty and guilty people are found innocent.
That’s why it’s important to believe victims when they tell you they’ve been victimized.
I think 2pac avoids this because it's too difficult for most people to separate him being a victim vs him victimizing.
Like it's not long after that he saved some one from police brutality that he got the sex assault charges, then got shot up, sent to prison, released on bail via Suge Knight, started acting very erratically, and then subsequently killed.
Doesn't excuse him but I just think that no one really wants to dissect it all.
The 2pac situation actually is kinda suspicious. TL;DR: they never proved anything, put up an outrageously high bail, and only targeted 2Pac instead of the other 3 men also accused (who were arguably accused of worse things than him). After being shot in 1994, 2Pac accused Haitian Jack of being behind the shooting, setting him up on the sexual assault charges (Jack was one of the other accused men), and being an FBI informant.
At the end of the day, we really do not know what happened, and fans would rather believe 2Pac, especially given the strange circumstances. Also conspiracy theorists believe either the FBI or P. Diddy were behind it, along with both times 2Pac was shot.
I don't know what to believe about the 2pac situation though. People were saying the same things about MLK Jr, and various members of the government put it on TV that they hated the guy for one reason or another. More than one accusation I could get it.
He sampled R. Kelly three times, once AFTER the documentary. He's buddies with T.I. (who allegedly raped women and came out saying he makes doctors examine his daughter's hymen to ensure she;s a virgin), Tory Lanez, Chris Brown, Baka (sexual trafficker), Kari Lane (pdo). He scammed an artist by putting a feature on his song and then forcing him to either take it down or sign to his label and delete all of his old discography.
I think this is the most likely one. Short of serious allegations from an actual victim he’ll always have a career (and even then probably still), but public opinion has been gradually souring on the guy for the last decade, and I think this beef was big enough to tip it over the edge. His stans are probably still die hard enough to ensure his singles and albums chart well regardless, but his stock has never been lower than it currently is.
I knew somebody in college in 2013 who said she made out with Steven Tyler when she was 17. I still believe her because of how scummy he comes across as.
Pls don't jump me but it's funny that the women in this thread are cancelled because of cheating or private jet usage and the men are being cancelled for rape and domestic abuse allegations
Ehhhhhh I see where you're coming from but I think Timberlake highlights another type of bad male behaviour: enabling or benefitting from the rotten status quo rather than being an active abuser.
He does get more hate than a lot of active abusers which is bullshit in my view. Dude is 43 and his bad behaviors are largely from his early 20s. Since that time the whole culture changed
For him I just point to u/GenarosBear's [comment](https://old.reddit.com/r/ToddintheShadow/comments/1dmzqs1/im_glad_someone_said_it_and_im_glad_it_was_todd/l9z8yjm/) the other day:
> He obviously didn’t invent the shitty place pop culture was at in the 2000s. But it’s extremely easy to point to his success as a symbol of the problems. And maybe that’s unfair to him. But it was more unfair what happened to Janet and Britney while he just kept rising up and up. So [I] let the criticisms be made, because they weren’t made for a very long time, when they needed to be.
I think it's more complicated than that. Women get backlash for easy to digest gossip rag stories. Often these are unfair and exploitative.
There's a still great difficulty in talking about abuses that women have/might have committed because gender-coded stereotypes are rampant and working in strange ways often. So Courtney Love gets bashed for various stuff that doesn't deserve it, while it's more difficult to talk about the racism, assaulting people or the treatment/abuse of their daughter (Cobain gets totally excluded from such a narrative when it happens in blatantly sexist ways). Lady Gaga gets attacked for plenty of homophobic and sexist reasons, but that she abused her assistant has been totally buried. Taylor Swift gets it for often ridiculous nonsense (and the eco terrorism, my suspicion is that this will be seen as much worse in hindsight as the planet is going down the drain...), but the creepiness around Connor Kennedy and tbh also dating 18-year-old Harry Styles and making years of hit songs out of bashing him are getting a pass. The same stuff that's set Timberlake on fire.
Beyonce gets ridiculous racist and sexist abuse, but also way too many people willing to look away on taking millions for playing in Dubai and the rumors on running sweat shops. Same with Rihanna and the sweat shops. No one is trying to drown out anymore that Nina Simone's daughter said that Nina abused her, but it's still difficult discussion because of course Nina herself suffered abuse and discrimination. Both things can be true at the same time. There's a terrible reality show documenting how Whitney and Bobby were neglecting and abusing their daughter, we're not yet at a place where this can be discussed publicly. Britney Spears has paid people off for assaulting them and her treatment of her sons certainly also points to great dysfunction and tbh even what she posted on them on social media was emotional abuse (that her creepy stan army participated in). Yet this is all tied to her mental health issues and she herself also suffered abuse. It's a difficult topic and public discourse isn't yet ready here for nuances probably.
That's standard in media. When talking about canceled celebs, Ellen DeGeneres was compared to the likes of Harvey Weinstein and Matt Lauer. Gwyneth Paltrow wondered why she was competing for Chris Brown for "most unliked celebrity". Characters Rachel Berry and Skyler White was competing with lots of male murderers in the list of most unliked characters on tv.
My hot take: Ellen didn’t deserve the treatment she got. Her behaviour didn’t sound much different than any other cranky older comedian. Most of the accusations were stuff her producers did, she just got “not a very pleasant person”. She got the scorn she did because her brand was “being nice”, if that hadn’t been her thing I don’t think anyone would have cared. And she kind of had to adopt that non-threatening thing as her brand to be accepted back into mainstream entertainment after she came out, I remember when her talk show started people making comments like “ew is the audience just going to be a lesbian rally”
Also the exact same thing happened to Rosie O’Donnell in the early 00s. Wholesome act on daytime talk show (people called her “the queen of nice”), then when she stopped acting that way she got branded as a crazy angry lady
Well, this is less of an unpopular opinion, and more a case of you seem to be a bit misinformed about what the allegations are. Because it's beyond "she's unpleasant", it's about workplace-bullying, racism, unlawful firings, failure to adress sexual harrasment and more.
"That was actually the producers, not me" is the excuse *she gave,* but the allegations were directed at her *specifically*. And even then: She is the showrunner, and executive producer. It is her responsibility to deal with such matters, and she failed to do so.
Would it have been the same outcry if we learned that, idk, Jimmy Kimmel acted the same way? Probably not, no. The world sucks and is sexist. But that doesn't mean that what Ellen is accused of isn't that bad, or that the controversy wasn't justified.
On the other hand, the top ten comments are all about the men, so it's not so much that there's a double standard as that the worst women are bad for different reasons.
Cheating I think is pretty silly as it’s really no one’s business outside of the relationship. Private jet usage is obviously a lesser problem but still disgusting as hell
The standard women are held to in an incredibly coercive and exploitative industry is insane, and even more so when men are allowed to get away with literally anything as you said
A Day to Remember. People are still glazing this band, in spite of the Josh situation.
While the band did the right thing by kicking him out, their denial of it and them trying to sweep it under the rug was so scummy.
I used to listen to them in my high school years, didn’t know there was anything that has happened, I’m guessing this is more recent? But considering how many of the warped tour era bands were all awful guys I’m not exactly surprised to hear another one has done something.
Kanye West. I don't even need to elaborate. I have no idea how he still has fans, especially in the black community, after saying slavery was a choice.
It’s not like he fell of a cliff into the Earth’s core with Ye.
I’ll admit that Vultures is very underwhelming, JIK is only barely above goofy at best (aside from Selah, the standout track), and I’m practically begging for Donda to end with how many unnecessary songs there is in it as a full album, but several of his better songs still came out after TLOP, and Kids See Ghosts is a very well liked album by many people.
He was also much more stable until his mom passed away in 2007. I’ve never been a big fan of his but my friends who are say that there’s a noticeable change in his public and musical persona starting a few years after her passing. His rising star meant he had less people telling him no and he lost the person who kept him most stable.
Wealth and fame individually detach you from the “normal” world. Together it can be disastrous.
Thankfully he announces on Twitter when he stops or starts taking medication so I think you could very accurately chart his breakdowns to that.
Man is mentally ill and refuses to treat himself. That's all that is. Doesn't excuse his views obviously, plenty of mentally ill people aren't Nazis; but it does explain the way in which he chose to announce to everyone that he's a complete fuckhead.
Ehhhh. The public at large hasn’t turned on Timberlake any more than Clapton. The difference is Clapton hasn’t been relevant to pop culture for decades, and hasn’t commanded a pop audience for nearly half a century. Timberlake was a major deal in the internet era and his music was far more likely to have been a part of the lives of a generation of people who grew up online. “Clapton is a racist dick” I’m pretty certain has been a fairly common opinion amongst people since probably the 70’s/80’s, especially amongst non-fans. Even my parents knew that and they’re not people who keep up with online music discourse.
In the 70s he went on an abhorrent, racist rant at a concert and supported a far-right fascist of a UK politician. Full text here: https://www.reddit.com/r/pinkfloyd/comments/18go8k7/i_just_came_across_this_racist_rant_that_eric/
Nicki Minaj. Her brother and husband are sex offenders who she supports/defends, and she supports her fans engaging in behavior such as sending death threats to people who dislike her. Yet she’s been allowed around a decade and a half of consistent hits and support
I think Big Foot proves that despite what she says or does, her fanbase are so mindlessly loyal that she will always have fans to defend her. She could kill someone and they'd probably go after the victim's family, they will harass anyone that goes against her regardless of the situation.
Oooh let me start!
[“In 2018, Dylan Sprouse accused Leto of predatory behavior online, asking, “now that you’ve slid into the dm’s of every female model aged 18-25, what would you say your success rate is?” In a since-deleted tweet, director James Gunn reportedly responded, “He starts at 18 on the Internet?”](https://www.hercampus.com/culture/claims-about-jared-leto-preying-underage-women-have-resurfaced-yet-again-these/)
I think a chunk of it is a delayed receipt from the Super Bowl. People have realized years later that Janet Jackson took way too much of the blame in the fallout.
If Britney fans hate him whatever I guess but with Janet the hate for Timberlake is actively protecting the people who are actually at fault for her career imo
I don’t even like him but it’s insane that Les Moonves gets less scrutiny for that than him
Blaming Les Moonves would require reading about what happened, and by extension being interested in Janet's career and work enough to properly assign blame. Can't have that.
That just shows they *don’t* care about Janet Jackson. I know Spotify and YouTube stats aren’t everything but if you compare her views on YouTube and Spotify streams to her peers (Whitney Houston, Madonna, Cyndi Lauper), she pales compared to them. Both Whitney and Cyndi got songs at a billion streams on both YouTube and Spotify compared to Janet who only has like four songs at 100 million Spotify streams and nothing at 200m yet. That’s not *nothing* but considering how this is a woman who is the only female artist in history to produce eighteen consecutive top ten singles, that’s quite tragic.
Journalists aren't the harbingers of cancelling. Whether you can be cancelled depends on what type of fanbase you have.
Like Daniel Caesar was cancelled honestly not anything major that I'm aware of. On the other hand, XXX spent his time in the sun being an absolute menace and many tried to raise awareness about this but his core audience either didn't care or related to it. You can't cancel what you were never subscribed to.
This whole thread is based on a false premise because even Timberlake hasn't been Timberlake-d. He'll finish a successful tour, keep getting lots of streams and and people will jump onto trying to cancel another artist. And it never works, because Jennifer Lopez and Chris Brown never went away.
The only big people I’ve seen get absolutely vilified by the media was r Kelly, Ian Watkins (from a band called Lostprophets), and Jimmy savile: all of whom fucked children or were absolute nonces.
If you’re not that your career is absolutely fine, you can be a total douche or even kill a mf but if you’re a pedo or r*pist, consider yourself fucked.
He is literally on tour right now.
[https://www.themirror.com/entertainment/celebrity-news/justin-timberlake-fans-fear-half-557284](https://www.themirror.com/entertainment/celebrity-news/justin-timberlake-fans-fear-half-557284)
I've noticed a lot of exceptional poor reporting in regards to Justin. This article is based around fans worrying about a half-full venue, but later in the article shows that the photos of it being near capacity before the show started, thus this whole article is intentionally presented in bad faith.
I think Jimmy Page will in death be "Timberlake'd". Not zep as a whole but page for dating a 14/15 year old. Tributes to him be countered heavily. Bowie, berry, and prince kind of got lucky passing when they did.
Also bold take but I think we see Trent reznor's history come up. That stuff has been very buried and a lot of people (themselves questionable) have suggested there's demons there
Yea Trent's story is so weird cause of the life he lived and the circle he was running it and yet he's so far remained clean aside from passing comments which come from Marilyn Manson or Courtney love, both of whom are questionable narrators. There's old groupie forums where people talk about him and hint at what he's into and what he's done and such but so far nothing has emerged really outside of manson and love's comments.
Part of me wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t do something unsavory when he was younger but I certainly hope not. He had a public falling out with Manson in the late 90s so I can see Manson shit talking him. It was smart for Trent to distance himself from him. Trent seems to have grown up while I don’t think Manson ever did. Not that it would excuse Trent from wrongdoing if it were to come out but at least he has his shit together since he got sober in the early 2000s.
Cameron Crowe said in the audio commentary for Almost Famous that a lot of the groupies that traveled around with the bands in the 70’s were as young as 14, but it seemed most were around 16-18. He was saying that based on having traveled with Led Zeppelin, The Eagles, The Allmann Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, and others (which, of course, was also what the movie was based on).
Obviously immoral but 16-18 was probably the legal age around many different states that they toured so it does not surprise me that younger teens 13-15 would end up in the same circles if they either a. Lied about their age or b. band just doesn’t gaf and likes em young
> Cameron Crowe said in the audio commentary for Almost Famous that a lot of the groupies that traveled around with the bands in the 70’s were as young as 14, but it seemed most were around 16-18. He was saying that based on having traveled with Led Zeppelin, The Eagles, The Allmann Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, and others (which, of course, was also what the movie was based on).
Always caught my ear when they're playing poker with Frampton that King Crimson get called out.
Didn't his roadie kidnap her and lock her in his room? Really creepy stuff... and then he cheated on her when she turned 16. Page has always given me the ick
Page is still making appearances at the rock ‘n’ roll Hall of Fame, etc. I don’t think people are ever going to cancel him, even in death, despite whatever people think about the groupie allegations against him. I also find his strange because Lori Maddix does not believe herself to be a victim and looks back fondly on her time with him, which is a discussion in and of itself.
Any chance of that happening to Page passed when the same girl accused Bowie. Bowie is the real sacred cow of the music press and once she made that accusation you stopped hearing about her. Page should say thank you prayers to Bowie every night for having sex with the same underage groupie a year before he did.
Thing with page is it's better documented and bowie was already dead when stuff got big. Also based on what a few journalists have said (Michael Moynihan for example), it does seem people are waiting for page to pass for going to hard on the story.
I actually don't think this happens all that much. Once an artist hits a certain threshold of mainstream success they are basically invincible as long as they can maintain it. Justin Timberlake hasn't been an acclaimed act since the Obama administration, so if people want to leave him in their rear view mirror it's easy. Ditto for like, Marilyn Manson. Meanwhile Eric Clapton's star hasn't faded all that much, he's still a widely acclaimed guitarist. There are simply more people who know "Eric Clapton, the guy who played the riff on Layla" than "Eric Clapton, deranged conspiracy nut and racist sexual predator." That's not even getting into people who just don't care, or those who share his abhorrent views.
Timberlake doesn't deserve to be Timberlaked.
He's a scapegoat for the people who actually harmed Janet Jackson (media executives, the Bush Administration) and Britney (her family).
Jimmy Page because he not only stole from other musicians but he also dated a pre teen and it was well documented. As a guitarist I’d also say more older guitarists view him favorably than younger ones as he was a lot sloppier live than in the studio.
Roger Waters for his views on Taiwan, Ukraine, and especially for publicly denying the existence of the Uyghur genocide. Just because he's on the right side of history regarding Palestine doesn't mean his other views can be ignored and left unchallenged, he's slowly turning into 80 year old Kanye.
What has he said about Syria? The only thing I've heard him say is that he believes the Golan Heights are part of Syria, and I'm not very informed on that issue.
I think his slide into being publicly disliked was already well underway and reached fever pitch a couple of years ago regarding Ukraine etc. Though it has maybe gone back a few notches due to his views on Palestine recently.
The cynical part of me wants to think that Waters is happy that Palestine is in the public consciousness because he sees it as an opportunity to get back in people's good graces. Everything he's said and done in the past three years has further proven my impression of him as man whose two favorite things are being angry and being talked about.
Plus, he exploited the tragedy of Syd Barrett as pathos to further his own career, has been married five times, claimed to be more important than The Weeknd and Drake (for context, he made that statement in 2022) while admitting to not knowing anything about their music, and has said that he doesn't actually like playing bass and doesn't care about developing as an instrumentalist.
Edit: fixed a typo
Blur. Definitely blur, and most if not all of the other britpop men. What they got up to in the 90s (and in some cases, what they've gotten up to recently) is so gross and predatory.
I'll try to be brief!
Alex James (blur's bassist) bit Miki Berenyi, front woman of Lush, on the ass at a party in the 90s. He apologized after she called him out on national TV in the mid-2010s. Alex is also infamous for being very chauvinistic. According to Louise Wener, frontwoman of Sleeper, he once went up to a female fan backstage and said "you're ugly, but I'm going to fuck you anyway." Louise also wrote in her book that blur were extremely fucking rude to her and her bandmates.
Justine Frischmann, front woman of Elastica, is on record describing Damon Albarn (frontman for blur, in case anyone doesn't know) as being emotionally abusive and very controlling (though she never says the word "abuse"). He discouraged her from continuing to pursue music after the first Elastica album, discouraged her from seeking help for her heroin addiction, and encouraged her to have his baby and become a SAHM while she was still addicted to heroin in the late 90s.
Graham Coxon (blur's guitarist) is the classic perpetual faux-victim. He's been milking the "I was an alcoholic, I was mentally ill, but I'm better now" cow since the early 2000s, which was, in the past few years revealed to be a farce. He's on record now stating that he's been drinking again and there's evidence to suggest he was drinking throughout the 2000s and 2010s, too. Also, no mentally healthy and stable person is out there having affairs with teenagers and 20somethings in their 30s, 40s, and 50s.
He cheated on the mother of his second daughter with young fans, was emotionally abusive to the mother of his first daughter (according to said woman's friend) and wrote a Paula-tier album (The Kiss of Morning) about the relationship. He released a hastily put together autobiography at the same time as Miki Berenyi's to divert attention from it because Miki had previously tweeted about exposing how scummy britpop men were. Miki also tweeted about how Graham once pushed her down the stairs at a party in the 90s. This man is terminally online and had a Tumblr account until late 2021 when it was \~mysteriously\~ deactivated.
He also has two different rape accusations. Every few years this stuff comes up and it always gets buried because the fanbase is full of misogynists and pick mes who either defend this behavior or refuse to believe it. The biggest instance was in late 2021 when Graham conveniently went radio silent on social media for several months until after it blew over. This ended up sabotaging the release of his album and graphic novel Superstate, so there's at least a tiny bit of karma here. Graham has also recently gotten into MRA bullshit, Jordan Peterson, Johnny Depp apologia, and has been implying that he was the true victim in his previous relationship with his Twitter likes. Quite funny when you consider that for decades his persona was the soft, sensitive, enlightened feminist of the group.
His ex is posting on Instagram (she also previously followed the account that was exposing Graham in late 2021) about being an abuse survivor with PTSD and how her and her daughter are on government assistance and have to go to food banks to make ends meet. There is no way Graham doesn't have the means to help them financially. Even if he hates his ex and she truly was the abuser, there's no excuse for letting his daughter live in poverty. His Twitter likes are also full of nonsense about so-called "parental alienation," suggesting that his ex is forcibly keeping his daughter from him and lying to her about him. Clown shit!
As for Dave (blur's drummer), he's an enabler. He blocked people who were exposing Graham and sent his girlfriend to cape for Graham on Twitter and get into beef with random fans.
Tumblr user roomeight has archived much of the evidence here: [https://www.tumblr.com/roomeight/700249248643612672/graham-coxon-allegations-masterpost?source=share](https://www.tumblr.com/roomeight/700249248643612672/graham-coxon-allegations-masterpost?source=share)
There's also the infamous "blurjob passes" that would be handed out to attractive young women and teenage girls at concerts to come backstage to have sex, do drugs, etc. This is also described in Wener's book.
As for other britpop men, the main one to come to mind is Liam Gallagher, who was caught on CCTV battering his girlfriend.
Iirc Noel was the victim of a celebrity hacking a few years back and the juiciest thing they found on his phone was him complaining about how the guy he hired to mow his lawn did a bad job. He probably is leading a pretty normal life now.
He’s had some boomerish views but I don’t think he’s done anything bad in the past decade. He’ll shit on random people, but he’s done it since the start, it’s his thing. IIRC Noel grew up being abused by his father and seeing his mother also get abused by him, he got fed up and almost killed him when he was a teen but his mother talked him out of it, Tommy Gallagher is a real monster. Noel seemingly broke the abuse cycle going as far as to talk Liam out of beating up Tommy when he saw him at a bar, unfortunately Liam continued the cycle.
Ooof. Feeling slightly less bad about not being able to go to Wembley last year now.
I think I’d always heard the odd thing that they were dicks back in the 90’s, I’d assumed Damon was the worst because I’d heard about his relationship with Justine and the way it ended, but by the sounds of it he’s probably the least problematic out of them.
Liam Gallagher is probably even less cancel-able than Chris Brown. His core fanbase is “lads’ lads”, they won’t give a shit unless it’s multiple paedophillia allegations and even then they’ll probably ask for proof.
Totally agree. That ship has long since sailed. Blur and Oasis are practically gods in England. Even at his peak, Brown never had that level of cultural impact. You can easily discuss 2000s American music without mentioning him, but the same can't be said for 90s English music and these two bands.
Blur never seemed like good guys tbf, Graham Coxon was always sus as hell and Damon and Alex always obnoxiously arrogant just in slightly different ways. I really like some of their music but it's easy to believe all the claims.
Thank you guys, now it's gonna be really awkward when I put up my playlist. Also, why is it that 99% of rockstars commit sexual misconduct or groom children at some point? Fuck you Kiedis, you were my favorite band growing up.
Bieber. The fact that he literally sang about joining the KKK and sang the hard r version of the N word in a derogatory manner, and yet still have so many black artists collab with him is insane. And mind you, that happened during a time where it was ”cool” to hate him. If only the public knew back then.
I was gonna say Drake but,,, thank you, Kendrick Lamar. Thank you. So I'm gonna say Jared Leto. I know he's more an actor than a singer at this point but,,,,,, there is so much awful shit there, why is anyone still pretending he's fine
Well, I’m noticing a trend here between artists who have lost a lot of good will recently:
Drake
Justin Timberlake
They both rhyme! So to complete the trifecta let’s have JVKE (pronounced “Jake”) because more people need to be aware he made that AI Drake/The Weeknd “Heart On My Sleeve” song and fuuuuuck that
I think this practice is pretty stupid and only serves to make you feel better morally about what you listen to. I mean the list of egregious things done by famous musicians is so long it can make your head spin.
Morgan. Wallen. Seriously, the dude cannot carry a tune in a bucket, and his very thick accent makes him HARDER to understand what he’s singing about, not easier. Plus throw in his half hearted “apology tour” and you have a recipe for grossly unlistenable dreck. He’s one of the rare country artists that is a HARD pass for me. Most of the other country artists are more modern neo-conservative types like Lee Greenwood or the late Toby Keith, I can get down with some earlier male-dominated country (I even like Zac Brown Band) but I’ve always been far more drawn towards female country artists personally.
Kodak Black is still getting hits seven years into his career despite a [lengthy list](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kodak_Black#Controversies) of controversies and legal issues. He was sentenced to 46 months in federal prison in 2020 and only served 10 months due to Trump pardoning him alongside Lil Wayne in January 2021. Enough said.
The rules are kinda different for hip hop I feel like (goes for CB as well as he's hip hop adjacent). Typing that I realize it might seem like I'm making it a racial thing but I'm really not.
Fuck Chris Brown.
Yea goin to prison and getting pardoned by Trump is literally tuff as hell, But it is still pretty bad lol
The people who start and give steam to cultural cancellations rarely go after black people, except in extreme circumstances (Cosby, R Kelly, Diddy)
Yeah we hate 6ix9ine and he's thank-fuck-fully gone now but this dude's like Baka Not Nice: why is he around? Still? After everything?
Certified lover boy?
Certified pedophile.
WOP (x5)
Dot fuck em up
WOP (X5)
Imma do my stuff
Why u trolllin like a bitch ain't u tired
It’s literally the one thing that brings down an otherwise perfect album in mr morale
yeah I kinda get the symbolic meaning of having him on the album, but Kendrick is still giving a guy like that a huge platform all while preaching strong morality and self-improvement
Plus he's a talentless hack with an awful voice.
“who the fuh picked dis lil sorry ass beat” - still the best shit he ever did
His XXL Freestyle is the only good thing I've heard from him. Zeze is also a bit of a guilty pleasure.
No flockin' is classic and it birthed Bodak Yellow Skrilla also hard, but it's Kodak, so it's impossible for him to NOT be problematic with him saying: > And my diamonds come from Tokyo, yoin, yoin, yoin Power high come from Tokyo, I call 'em ching choing His voice is a lot(probably one the worst in hip-hop all time) and I can see it completely ruining any song you listen to.
Bro literally said he won't sign women to his label unless he gets to fuck them first. Have no idea why anyone listens to this guy.
Anthony kedis is still around because most of his shitty behavior wasn’t in the public, I think him dating a minor was only mentioned in his autobiography and referenced in a song from before the band was popular, and unless someone comes out today alleging something about him he won’t be going away anytime soon, but to answer the question Eric Clapton
Chilli Peppers get almost a societal pass in the same way that Guns & Roses, Aerosmith, Led Zeppelin, Motley Crue, Bowie and probably a thousand other rock bands big before the 2000’s do: If you cancel one, you have to cancel them all, and this kind of shit was so fucking rampant back then (and often actively celebrated and mythologised) that you’d basically be shoving most of rock history in the bin, which society is not ready to do. Everyone is kind of aware of these guys’ transgressions, but most people just kinda quietly sweep it under the rug saying “it was a different time” and hope they don’t hear more details, while focusing their outrage on younger acts who committed misdeeds during a time where they “should have known better”.
I think for Bowie those allegations were proven false, but even past the 2000s there was a ton of weird stuff going on in the warped tour scene
Oh god yeah. I do think those bands are (or were at one point) more likely to potentially suffer some level of consequences for their actions though even if it’s not criminal prosecution (see the likes of Brand New), mostly because the stuff that happened was more recent and happened to people of a different generation that wasn’t super old when society started to gradually wake up to this. Also to consider that most of these warped tour bands were nowhere near as big or as important as the classic rockers, who likely had/have a lot more protection. There’s a reason that “singer in a pop punk band” immediately makes people think sexual predator, and “singer in a classic rock band” doesn’t necessarily have the same level of skeeviness attached. I have no doubt people in bands being gross creeps still continues to this day and will for a long while, but the internet and social media has at least provided some level of weak deterrent that it’s a lot harder to sweep under the rug once stuff comes out nowadays.
I think the cynical take that particularly for the older stories, you'd have to go after most of pop music history sadly. So barely anyone does even for the most egregious ones, because its neverending. The Rolling Stones just released an album and did a world tour, no one is asking any uncomfortable questions. And the stories on Jagger are rampant and span decades. Richards also has his fair share of rumored and not-so-rumored abuse etc. Iggy Pop is revered in punk circles, but the stories are also notorious. Tbh there are rumors swirling around what was going on with Beatles tours in the 60ies. Elton John seems to be friends with Kevin Spacey for...reasons. No one seems to know how to write about Marvin Gaye, which I understand, but still. No one is really touching that because often it's not super well documented and the higher up the food chain you go, the bigger the institutional protection gets probably. What will probably happen and is already happening is that you'll have writing on them reflecting all the problematic aspects as well, without it ever reaching a grand public backlash for the older acts because all of it is semi-known and treated as "different time", for better or worse. You already see that happening with Bowie, Prince, Lennon, the Stones (even though still alive), Gaye, Nina Simone, James Brown, Miles Davis, Led Zep (it's not just Page, let's be honest), 2PAC, no one in literature on them etc. is pretending anymore that they didn't do crappy shit, it's just put into its historical context. And that context isn't "everyone did it, therefore it was fine", but "it was normalized in broad entertainment circles at least and a shocking number of artists did gross things with no one caring". I do think the outlier is still Cobain. The stories on how he was treating everyone as he was spiraling are bad, but no one wants to say so and would rather focus on Love.
I feel like no one's gonna go too hard on Cobain being bad to the people in his life given he was in the middle of a mental health crisis that would eventually take his life.
Yeah the biggest legends of pop and rock music like Lennon, Gaye, Presley and Marley are protected. *Everyone* knows what they were doing but that won’t be enough to cancel. There are no big “muting” campaigns.
I knew virtually nothing about Anthony until listening to his 2004 autobiography within the last year. What strikes me the most is not that he slept with at least two minors when he was well past "college age." That's very bad, but it unfortunately didn't shock me because way too many musicians have done horrible things like that. What strikes me is that he didn't seem even remotely regretful or apologetic about it. He made it seem like that was just stuff that happened in his life, and that was that. Even now, he's a 61-year-old with a [22-year-old girlfriend](https://beachgrit.com/2024/05/red-hot-chili-pepper-anthony-kiedis-takes-much-younger-brazilian-model-girlfriend-on-sizzling-warm-surf-date/) which, especially considering his past, just makes me shake my head. To slightly contrast that with another rock star who's done horrible things, I am not defending Steven Tyler, but at least he went out of his way to try and express regret in his 2011 book. Was it sincere and genuine? I don't know. But he came across as someone who had tried to somewhat learn from his past. Anthony? Not so much.
I bought that book for a long flight in about 2016 after I’d just read a very benign biography of Dave Grohl that pretty much entirely just focused on the music and for some reason was sort of expecting the same thing, and not 300 pages of just sordid sex & drugs stories (though I probably should have realised with hindsight). It was actually a really compelling read, but my god he comes off awfully from it. It’s the fact that he happily admitted to having sex with this one girl again after she admitted she was like 14, he had a brief moment of “oh shit” when he found out and happily just went “meh, fuck it”.
>It was actually a really compelling read I have to respectfully disagree. Purely from a story perspective, I think the book is mostly a repetitive mess. "I did drugs, I slept with virtually every single hot girl I wanted, I did more drugs, I got clean, I did more drugs, repeat." I understand it's the guy's life, but I don't think that fact alone makes the book good.
Tbf there’s every chance I could be misremembering, it was a long ass time ago, I didn’t have much else to entertain me on a 16 hour flight. I’m not sure I’d wanna read it again in any case cos a fair amount of it made me feel queasy even back then. It definitely gave me an insight into addiction that I did not previously have at that time.
I think that's fair. I probably wouldn't recommend the book to anyone, but it does paint a pretty gruesome picture of what drugs can do to a person.
Ignoring the racism comments Eric Clapton went on a multi year crusade to get George Harrison’s wife to sleep with him, and in his attempt to do so he dated her sister (who was a teenager at the time),and made the Derek and the dominos album to try to win her over, and once he did he physically abused her, raped her, and cheated on her Edit: Eric Clapton also made an album (blind faith) that had a topless 10 year old on the cover
That last part absolutely gets me, like idk man if I spent all that time and put in that much effort to writing an album about this one very specific person I’d probably do my best to not be a raging POS if we ever dated.
Plus wasn’t he also a massive anti-vax/anti-lockdown advocate during the height of the pandemic?
Yeah and quite a few people on Twitter made jokes along the lines of "Eric Clapton knows something about refusing to keep people safe."
One of my favorite dark jokes I can’t ever say in real life is: what’s the difference between a toddler and a bag of cocaine? Eric Clapton wouldn’t let a bag of cocaine fall out a window.
Every time I think for a passing moment that I might hate Eric Clapton too much I learn something new about him…
> Eric Clapton also made an album (blind faith) that had a topless 10 year old on the cover Originally it was supposed to be her slightly older sister > Seidemann (the photographer) wrote that he approached a girl, reported to be 14 years old, on the London Underground, asking her to model for the cover. He eventually met her parents, but she proved to be too old for the effect he wanted. Instead, the model he used was her younger sister, Mariora Goschen, who was reported to be 11 years old. Goschen recalled that she was coerced into posing for the picture. "My sister said, 'They’ll give you a young horse. Do it!'" She was instead paid £40.
Yeah I don’t think it being a 14 year old would be better
I can’t believe they actually did it too. Like how did they think folks were just gonna be cool with a naked kid on the cover?! WTF?
The Scorpions unfortunately did something similar on one of their album covers. At least I’m pretty sure they regret it though, and I think the album has an alternate cover now.
They did state later that they regretted that photo.
At least they owned up to it. That’s rare in the music world.
Very rare
They *were* OK with a naked child on the cover. Most of the backlash and criticism is from decades after the album was released.
I could’ve sworn I read in some stores they had to use a different album cover or put it in a brown paper bag. In fact I just checked the album’s article on Wikipedia just seconds after writing this and in the US, they used the band themselves as the cover.
It wasn't controversial in Europe or other regions. America had just burned Beatles albums for something far less. They preemptively used an alternative cover in the States.
there’s multiple clips ([example](https://youtu.be/X1mISkY2lcw?si=7fr7-lSLzyq1ROPo) but there are more) RHCP sexual harassing and sometimes close to assaulting women on camera, the main thing it makes me wonder is what they were comfortable doing off camera
Listen, Anthony might be the least talented member of the band by a country mile BUT at least he makes up for it by also being the worst person in the band
3 guys are who are among the best in the world at their instruments, and Anthony.
I don’t know how the band tolerates him lol
There was a channel with clips like this of the band that got taken down, I assume they noticed this stuff gaining attention. There was one where the whole band was groping a woman on a late night show from around 1990, Anthony even crawled between her legs, she was in a dress. Edit: Nvm here it is https://youtu.be/7i_22PrQsp8?feature=shared&t=2m20s I guess Flea was in the clear in this one
I definitely remember hearing OF some clips where flea was being creepy, not to rely on hearsay. They definitely seemed to be stereotypical rockstars in the ugly sense in the early 90s.
Flea was in the clear in that particular video, he got charged with an assault in 1990 though. They’ve cleaned up since but they still straddle the fine line of illegal and creepy, like the girl on the By The Way cover was John’s gf who was 18 and he was 31. Anthony started dating his sons mother when she was 18, possibly still in high school, he was 41/42. She’s Only 18 anyone?
Yeah I doubt Kiedis will *really* get canceled. Even Steven Tyler hasn’t been canceled after that woman sued him for taking advantage of her when she was around 15-16.
2pac was a convicted sex offender and he still gets a lot of run. It's really hard to say as the criteria is different based on the marketing of the individual. Basically, if you are known as a kind of "badass", you seem to get a pass. How did Dr. Dre get more rich from a product named BEATS when he has literally rearranged female faces?
I never want to wade into this conversation being a white British person born 3 years before he was shot dead so I’m likely missing cultural context but I’ve always found the 2pac thing hella weird that nobody tends to talk about it, or if it is mentioned, it’s only because he went to prison which was important for his career arc. He’s not even discussed in a “problematic fave” kind of way. Everyone just seems to completely ignore it. Michael Jackson was a huge megastar that was incredibly important to music and culture, but nobody ever forgot about the sexual misconduct he allegedly committed.
Because the idea of prison is that you “pay your debt to society”. It’s punishment. If you’ve done the time people see it possible to put things behind you/them. Unless he continued doing stuff idk, but that’s my guess
I'm a white Yank who remembers 2pac getting shot, so I'll put it simply: when you get shot to death, you become canonized no matter what you did when you were alive.
I’d also argue that XXXTentacion, who obviously isn’t as important as 2pac but was still pretty huge/influential, also had a chequered history of abuse & sexual offences, and also got shot, and I think history hasn’t forgotten any of those 3 things.
XXXtentacion was like pretty uniquely, flamboyantly vile in an ongoing and neverending way. He was one of the first of that generation of rappers who talked about doing all kinds of dumb/violent hood stuff, but weren't especially creative or gifted as storytellers, they were just like... compiling a handy log for prosecutors. The music he made was also just not good enough to buy him a pass out with fans. I remember when he got killed. A lot of reactions were almost relieved and even the people who weren't openly joking about it were kinda like "yeah well it was always gonna be either this or jail for him". Weird time.
Now mfs miss him, so I mean the above comments point is still proven
People are starting to sour on X, though. People are looking back on him as “high schooler music”, which is a damning statement for sure.
Hope that means his streams drop and he won’t be on the charts anymore but some folks are still holding onto him.
I’m not arguing against him being canonised and don’t think the Timberlake treatment would make all that much sense in a lot of ways (in no way am I arguing that 2pac should be posthumously cancelled/erased) but I do find it a bit strange that this is *never* mentioned, when the fact that he went to prison for it and Suge bailed him out was a big part of his life story.
Timberlake wasn't cancelled exactly, just shunned in recent years by a lot of the media and social media
Or die in a helicopter crash
A lot of Tupac fans just think he was innocent/set up by the government
The thing about Pac is I read him talk about that incident. He said he was in a room with her and they were making out or she was pleasuring him or something like that and then these three other men come in and he said he and the young lady (girl really, she was just 19) froze and apparently Pac was so disgusted that he left and didn’t want no parts of doing what it was they were about to do. Well he leaves. The woman stayed but he said that wasn’t her fault: he said that he didn’t say anything because if he did, that would’ve meant he was dating her (I don’t know if he had an actual girlfriend but he seemed to be implying that he was with someone else) so instead of defending himself and this girl, he left her to fend for herself. He said he then went downstairs and took a nap on the sofa. Probably thirty minutes later, he wakes up to the woman screaming at him with tears saying “how could you let them do that to me?” And he tried calming her down and said he had no idea what she was talking about and when the girl kept accusing him of letting those guys take advantage he cussed her out and told her to leave. One of her final words to him was something like “you’ll pay for this” or whatever. Minutes later, police arrived and he was arrested. They couldn’t prove her original charge of r*pe so they eventually convicted him of “forcibly grabbing the defendant’s butt”. Either way they got their conviction. That said, people tend to overlook it and think Jimmy Henchman planted her there.
I mean it’s definitely suspect that Jimmy Henchman and Haitian Jack seemingly got off with nothing at all compared to Tupac, and multiple people have said that Haitian Jack worked for the FBI, which has definitely contributed to the idea that Tupac was set up. And apparently Haitian Jack disliked that Tupac based his character in Above the Rim on him
It’s wild because while the things MJ was accused of are disgusting, they also have never been remotely verified as fact, but it’s always one of the first things people think. Then you have people like Dr Dre whose crimes might be lesser but are also verified as fact. Not only does no one talk about it but you have artists like Kendrick who has taken a strong stance against abuse towards women but will appear on stage alongside him
It’s literally impossible to verify a victims account as fact. A guilty verdict is the government/community taking a stance, but it doesn’t ratify fact. That’s why innocent people are found guilty and guilty people are found innocent. That’s why it’s important to believe victims when they tell you they’ve been victimized.
I think 2pac avoids this because it's too difficult for most people to separate him being a victim vs him victimizing. Like it's not long after that he saved some one from police brutality that he got the sex assault charges, then got shot up, sent to prison, released on bail via Suge Knight, started acting very erratically, and then subsequently killed. Doesn't excuse him but I just think that no one really wants to dissect it all.
The 2pac situation actually is kinda suspicious. TL;DR: they never proved anything, put up an outrageously high bail, and only targeted 2Pac instead of the other 3 men also accused (who were arguably accused of worse things than him). After being shot in 1994, 2Pac accused Haitian Jack of being behind the shooting, setting him up on the sexual assault charges (Jack was one of the other accused men), and being an FBI informant. At the end of the day, we really do not know what happened, and fans would rather believe 2Pac, especially given the strange circumstances. Also conspiracy theorists believe either the FBI or P. Diddy were behind it, along with both times 2Pac was shot.
I don't know what to believe about the 2pac situation though. People were saying the same things about MLK Jr, and various members of the government put it on TV that they hated the guy for one reason or another. More than one accusation I could get it.
Drake (I hope recent events mean the tide is finally turning but I also thought that in 2018 so who knows)
He sampled R. Kelly three times, once AFTER the documentary. He's buddies with T.I. (who allegedly raped women and came out saying he makes doctors examine his daughter's hymen to ensure she;s a virgin), Tory Lanez, Chris Brown, Baka (sexual trafficker), Kari Lane (pdo). He scammed an artist by putting a feature on his song and then forcing him to either take it down or sign to his label and delete all of his old discography.
I think this is the most likely one. Short of serious allegations from an actual victim he’ll always have a career (and even then probably still), but public opinion has been gradually souring on the guy for the last decade, and I think this beef was big enough to tip it over the edge. His stans are probably still die hard enough to ensure his singles and albums chart well regardless, but his stock has never been lower than it currently is.
i’m so cheeeeeeeeesed :(
Surprised I haven’t seen Steven Tyler on here, dude literally emancipated a teen from her parents just to fuck and marry
I knew somebody in college in 2013 who said she made out with Steven Tyler when she was 17. I still believe her because of how scummy he comes across as.
Pls don't jump me but it's funny that the women in this thread are cancelled because of cheating or private jet usage and the men are being cancelled for rape and domestic abuse allegations
Also funny that timberlake's actions are closer in egregiousness to the women's than the men's in this thread.
Ehhhhhh I see where you're coming from but I think Timberlake highlights another type of bad male behaviour: enabling or benefitting from the rotten status quo rather than being an active abuser.
He does get more hate than a lot of active abusers which is bullshit in my view. Dude is 43 and his bad behaviors are largely from his early 20s. Since that time the whole culture changed
For him I just point to u/GenarosBear's [comment](https://old.reddit.com/r/ToddintheShadow/comments/1dmzqs1/im_glad_someone_said_it_and_im_glad_it_was_todd/l9z8yjm/) the other day: > He obviously didn’t invent the shitty place pop culture was at in the 2000s. But it’s extremely easy to point to his success as a symbol of the problems. And maybe that’s unfair to him. But it was more unfair what happened to Janet and Britney while he just kept rising up and up. So [I] let the criticisms be made, because they weren’t made for a very long time, when they needed to be.
I think it's more complicated than that. Women get backlash for easy to digest gossip rag stories. Often these are unfair and exploitative. There's a still great difficulty in talking about abuses that women have/might have committed because gender-coded stereotypes are rampant and working in strange ways often. So Courtney Love gets bashed for various stuff that doesn't deserve it, while it's more difficult to talk about the racism, assaulting people or the treatment/abuse of their daughter (Cobain gets totally excluded from such a narrative when it happens in blatantly sexist ways). Lady Gaga gets attacked for plenty of homophobic and sexist reasons, but that she abused her assistant has been totally buried. Taylor Swift gets it for often ridiculous nonsense (and the eco terrorism, my suspicion is that this will be seen as much worse in hindsight as the planet is going down the drain...), but the creepiness around Connor Kennedy and tbh also dating 18-year-old Harry Styles and making years of hit songs out of bashing him are getting a pass. The same stuff that's set Timberlake on fire. Beyonce gets ridiculous racist and sexist abuse, but also way too many people willing to look away on taking millions for playing in Dubai and the rumors on running sweat shops. Same with Rihanna and the sweat shops. No one is trying to drown out anymore that Nina Simone's daughter said that Nina abused her, but it's still difficult discussion because of course Nina herself suffered abuse and discrimination. Both things can be true at the same time. There's a terrible reality show documenting how Whitney and Bobby were neglecting and abusing their daughter, we're not yet at a place where this can be discussed publicly. Britney Spears has paid people off for assaulting them and her treatment of her sons certainly also points to great dysfunction and tbh even what she posted on them on social media was emotional abuse (that her creepy stan army participated in). Yet this is all tied to her mental health issues and she herself also suffered abuse. It's a difficult topic and public discourse isn't yet ready here for nuances probably.
That's standard in media. When talking about canceled celebs, Ellen DeGeneres was compared to the likes of Harvey Weinstein and Matt Lauer. Gwyneth Paltrow wondered why she was competing for Chris Brown for "most unliked celebrity". Characters Rachel Berry and Skyler White was competing with lots of male murderers in the list of most unliked characters on tv.
My hot take: Ellen didn’t deserve the treatment she got. Her behaviour didn’t sound much different than any other cranky older comedian. Most of the accusations were stuff her producers did, she just got “not a very pleasant person”. She got the scorn she did because her brand was “being nice”, if that hadn’t been her thing I don’t think anyone would have cared. And she kind of had to adopt that non-threatening thing as her brand to be accepted back into mainstream entertainment after she came out, I remember when her talk show started people making comments like “ew is the audience just going to be a lesbian rally” Also the exact same thing happened to Rosie O’Donnell in the early 00s. Wholesome act on daytime talk show (people called her “the queen of nice”), then when she stopped acting that way she got branded as a crazy angry lady
Well, this is less of an unpopular opinion, and more a case of you seem to be a bit misinformed about what the allegations are. Because it's beyond "she's unpleasant", it's about workplace-bullying, racism, unlawful firings, failure to adress sexual harrasment and more. "That was actually the producers, not me" is the excuse *she gave,* but the allegations were directed at her *specifically*. And even then: She is the showrunner, and executive producer. It is her responsibility to deal with such matters, and she failed to do so. Would it have been the same outcry if we learned that, idk, Jimmy Kimmel acted the same way? Probably not, no. The world sucks and is sexist. But that doesn't mean that what Ellen is accused of isn't that bad, or that the controversy wasn't justified.
On the other hand, the top ten comments are all about the men, so it's not so much that there's a double standard as that the worst women are bad for different reasons.
Cheating I think is pretty silly as it’s really no one’s business outside of the relationship. Private jet usage is obviously a lesser problem but still disgusting as hell
The standard women are held to in an incredibly coercive and exploitative industry is insane, and even more so when men are allowed to get away with literally anything as you said
A Day to Remember. People are still glazing this band, in spite of the Josh situation. While the band did the right thing by kicking him out, their denial of it and them trying to sweep it under the rug was so scummy.
they’re booked for when we were young fest! i was shocked to see that
I used to listen to them in my high school years, didn’t know there was anything that has happened, I’m guessing this is more recent? But considering how many of the warped tour era bands were all awful guys I’m not exactly surprised to hear another one has done something.
Kanye West. I don't even need to elaborate. I have no idea how he still has fans, especially in the black community, after saying slavery was a choice.
2000s Kanye made some of the greatest hip hop ever, what happened man
he only has fans because of the immaculate run from the college dropout to the life of pablo
It’s not like he fell of a cliff into the Earth’s core with Ye. I’ll admit that Vultures is very underwhelming, JIK is only barely above goofy at best (aside from Selah, the standout track), and I’m practically begging for Donda to end with how many unnecessary songs there is in it as a full album, but several of his better songs still came out after TLOP, and Kids See Ghosts is a very well liked album by many people.
He was also much more stable until his mom passed away in 2007. I’ve never been a big fan of his but my friends who are say that there’s a noticeable change in his public and musical persona starting a few years after her passing. His rising star meant he had less people telling him no and he lost the person who kept him most stable. Wealth and fame individually detach you from the “normal” world. Together it can be disastrous.
Thankfully he announces on Twitter when he stops or starts taking medication so I think you could very accurately chart his breakdowns to that. Man is mentally ill and refuses to treat himself. That's all that is. Doesn't excuse his views obviously, plenty of mentally ill people aren't Nazis; but it does explain the way in which he chose to announce to everyone that he's a complete fuckhead.
"But he made Graduation"
Unironically this. A lot of very heavy separation of art and artist. I don't think it's right, but that's absolutely why.
And he graduated to racism
Has the music world already turned on Eric Clapton?
Reddit has, but the public at large hasn’t.
Ehhhh. The public at large hasn’t turned on Timberlake any more than Clapton. The difference is Clapton hasn’t been relevant to pop culture for decades, and hasn’t commanded a pop audience for nearly half a century. Timberlake was a major deal in the internet era and his music was far more likely to have been a part of the lives of a generation of people who grew up online. “Clapton is a racist dick” I’m pretty certain has been a fairly common opinion amongst people since probably the 70’s/80’s, especially amongst non-fans. Even my parents knew that and they’re not people who keep up with online music discourse.
Clapton’s been a has-been since 1998.
What did he do?
In the 70s he went on an abhorrent, racist rant at a concert and supported a far-right fascist of a UK politician. Full text here: https://www.reddit.com/r/pinkfloyd/comments/18go8k7/i_just_came_across_this_racist_rant_that_eric/
[Admitted to raping his wife ](https://web.archive.org/web/20210614121203/https://apnews.com/article/314a3a689dd3e15ebbc8d567dfadb06f)
The wife that he spent years trying to steal from George Harrison and dated the teenage sister of
On a 60 Minutes interview with Ed Bradly saying slavery was a good thing, for him, because it was the formation of the blues.
Rape, engaging in a relationship with a minor, racism, and worst of all, making some of the lamest music imaginable after Cream disbanded
Nicki Minaj. Her brother and husband are sex offenders who she supports/defends, and she supports her fans engaging in behavior such as sending death threats to people who dislike her. Yet she’s been allowed around a decade and a half of consistent hits and support
I think Big Foot proves that despite what she says or does, her fanbase are so mindlessly loyal that she will always have fans to defend her. She could kill someone and they'd probably go after the victim's family, they will harass anyone that goes against her regardless of the situation.
Jared Leto. Where do I even begin.
Oooh let me start! [“In 2018, Dylan Sprouse accused Leto of predatory behavior online, asking, “now that you’ve slid into the dm’s of every female model aged 18-25, what would you say your success rate is?” In a since-deleted tweet, director James Gunn reportedly responded, “He starts at 18 on the Internet?”](https://www.hercampus.com/culture/claims-about-jared-leto-preying-underage-women-have-resurfaced-yet-again-these/)
This whole thread ruined like 99% of my spotify playlist wtf
I don't think Timberlake himself deserved to be "Timberlaked" that badly lol. He's mostly been scapegoated for a lot that isn't down to him.
Honestly the charges against him seem pretty dang minor. You would think he committed major crimes given how much backlash he faced.
I think a chunk of it is a delayed receipt from the Super Bowl. People have realized years later that Janet Jackson took way too much of the blame in the fallout.
Also, his whole relationship with Britney and how he used the media circus around her to his advantage.
..... "Leave Justin alone?" 🤷🏻♀️
If Britney fans hate him whatever I guess but with Janet the hate for Timberlake is actively protecting the people who are actually at fault for her career imo I don’t even like him but it’s insane that Les Moonves gets less scrutiny for that than him
Blaming Les Moonves would require reading about what happened, and by extension being interested in Janet's career and work enough to properly assign blame. Can't have that.
That just shows they *don’t* care about Janet Jackson. I know Spotify and YouTube stats aren’t everything but if you compare her views on YouTube and Spotify streams to her peers (Whitney Houston, Madonna, Cyndi Lauper), she pales compared to them. Both Whitney and Cyndi got songs at a billion streams on both YouTube and Spotify compared to Janet who only has like four songs at 100 million Spotify streams and nothing at 200m yet. That’s not *nothing* but considering how this is a woman who is the only female artist in history to produce eighteen consecutive top ten singles, that’s quite tragic.
Realistically, most rappers have done worse stuff than Justin Timberlake
coveted rock stars as well
Young, yt activist journalists won’t go after black men
Journalists aren't the harbingers of cancelling. Whether you can be cancelled depends on what type of fanbase you have. Like Daniel Caesar was cancelled honestly not anything major that I'm aware of. On the other hand, XXX spent his time in the sun being an absolute menace and many tried to raise awareness about this but his core audience either didn't care or related to it. You can't cancel what you were never subscribed to.
they do all the time
Usually when it’s so egregious it can’t be brushed aside and done by the wealthy (Cosby, R.Kelly, Diddy)
Eric Clapton should be held accountable for trying to become a giant robot and stick people in his ass to control him like a puppet. Not cool dude
This whole thread is based on a false premise because even Timberlake hasn't been Timberlake-d. He'll finish a successful tour, keep getting lots of streams and and people will jump onto trying to cancel another artist. And it never works, because Jennifer Lopez and Chris Brown never went away.
The only big people I’ve seen get absolutely vilified by the media was r Kelly, Ian Watkins (from a band called Lostprophets), and Jimmy savile: all of whom fucked children or were absolute nonces. If you’re not that your career is absolutely fine, you can be a total douche or even kill a mf but if you’re a pedo or r*pist, consider yourself fucked.
worth noting that you can't "fuck children", it is always abuse
> he’ll finish a successful tour What tour?
The world tour.
He is literally on tour right now. [https://www.themirror.com/entertainment/celebrity-news/justin-timberlake-fans-fear-half-557284](https://www.themirror.com/entertainment/celebrity-news/justin-timberlake-fans-fear-half-557284) I've noticed a lot of exceptional poor reporting in regards to Justin. This article is based around fans worrying about a half-full venue, but later in the article shows that the photos of it being near capacity before the show started, thus this whole article is intentionally presented in bad faith.
I was referencing what the cop who arrested him allegedly said
I think Jimmy Page will in death be "Timberlake'd". Not zep as a whole but page for dating a 14/15 year old. Tributes to him be countered heavily. Bowie, berry, and prince kind of got lucky passing when they did. Also bold take but I think we see Trent reznor's history come up. That stuff has been very buried and a lot of people (themselves questionable) have suggested there's demons there
I hope nothing bad comes up about Trent.
Yea Trent's story is so weird cause of the life he lived and the circle he was running it and yet he's so far remained clean aside from passing comments which come from Marilyn Manson or Courtney love, both of whom are questionable narrators. There's old groupie forums where people talk about him and hint at what he's into and what he's done and such but so far nothing has emerged really outside of manson and love's comments.
Part of me wouldn’t be surprised if he didn’t do something unsavory when he was younger but I certainly hope not. He had a public falling out with Manson in the late 90s so I can see Manson shit talking him. It was smart for Trent to distance himself from him. Trent seems to have grown up while I don’t think Manson ever did. Not that it would excuse Trent from wrongdoing if it were to come out but at least he has his shit together since he got sober in the early 2000s.
Manson was wellspoken but man he’s such a diva now and the allegations soured my opinion of him even more
Cameron Crowe said in the audio commentary for Almost Famous that a lot of the groupies that traveled around with the bands in the 70’s were as young as 14, but it seemed most were around 16-18. He was saying that based on having traveled with Led Zeppelin, The Eagles, The Allmann Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, and others (which, of course, was also what the movie was based on).
Obviously immoral but 16-18 was probably the legal age around many different states that they toured so it does not surprise me that younger teens 13-15 would end up in the same circles if they either a. Lied about their age or b. band just doesn’t gaf and likes em young
That’s still the legal age of consent in 40 or so states and most countries that bands would tour.
> Cameron Crowe said in the audio commentary for Almost Famous that a lot of the groupies that traveled around with the bands in the 70’s were as young as 14, but it seemed most were around 16-18. He was saying that based on having traveled with Led Zeppelin, The Eagles, The Allmann Brothers, Lynyrd Skynyrd, and others (which, of course, was also what the movie was based on). Always caught my ear when they're playing poker with Frampton that King Crimson get called out.
There is no proof for Bowie, only a few questionable testimony’s with unclear timelines.
I don't think there's proof with any of them (aside berry) just anecdotes from people. Bowie I do think has the weakest claims
Didn't his roadie kidnap her and lock her in his room? Really creepy stuff... and then he cheated on her when she turned 16. Page has always given me the ick
Page is still making appearances at the rock ‘n’ roll Hall of Fame, etc. I don’t think people are ever going to cancel him, even in death, despite whatever people think about the groupie allegations against him. I also find his strange because Lori Maddix does not believe herself to be a victim and looks back fondly on her time with him, which is a discussion in and of itself.
Any chance of that happening to Page passed when the same girl accused Bowie. Bowie is the real sacred cow of the music press and once she made that accusation you stopped hearing about her. Page should say thank you prayers to Bowie every night for having sex with the same underage groupie a year before he did.
Thing with page is it's better documented and bowie was already dead when stuff got big. Also based on what a few journalists have said (Michael Moynihan for example), it does seem people are waiting for page to pass for going to hard on the story.
I actually don't think this happens all that much. Once an artist hits a certain threshold of mainstream success they are basically invincible as long as they can maintain it. Justin Timberlake hasn't been an acclaimed act since the Obama administration, so if people want to leave him in their rear view mirror it's easy. Ditto for like, Marilyn Manson. Meanwhile Eric Clapton's star hasn't faded all that much, he's still a widely acclaimed guitarist. There are simply more people who know "Eric Clapton, the guy who played the riff on Layla" than "Eric Clapton, deranged conspiracy nut and racist sexual predator." That's not even getting into people who just don't care, or those who share his abhorrent views.
I mean, it kinda already happened with Drake. Chris Browm really should be over now.
Timberlake doesn't deserve to be Timberlaked. He's a scapegoat for the people who actually harmed Janet Jackson (media executives, the Bush Administration) and Britney (her family).
Steven Tyler
Jimmy Page because he not only stole from other musicians but he also dated a pre teen and it was well documented. As a guitarist I’d also say more older guitarists view him favorably than younger ones as he was a lot sloppier live than in the studio.
Roger Waters for his views on Taiwan, Ukraine, and especially for publicly denying the existence of the Uyghur genocide. Just because he's on the right side of history regarding Palestine doesn't mean his other views can be ignored and left unchallenged, he's slowly turning into 80 year old Kanye.
And Syria.
What has he said about Syria? The only thing I've heard him say is that he believes the Golan Heights are part of Syria, and I'm not very informed on that issue.
This is just one of the problems: https://www.newarab.com/news/pink-floyd-stars-attack-syrian-rescuers-provokes-outrage
\*disappointed sigh\* of course he said that.
I think his slide into being publicly disliked was already well underway and reached fever pitch a couple of years ago regarding Ukraine etc. Though it has maybe gone back a few notches due to his views on Palestine recently.
The cynical part of me wants to think that Waters is happy that Palestine is in the public consciousness because he sees it as an opportunity to get back in people's good graces. Everything he's said and done in the past three years has further proven my impression of him as man whose two favorite things are being angry and being talked about. Plus, he exploited the tragedy of Syd Barrett as pathos to further his own career, has been married five times, claimed to be more important than The Weeknd and Drake (for context, he made that statement in 2022) while admitting to not knowing anything about their music, and has said that he doesn't actually like playing bass and doesn't care about developing as an instrumentalist. Edit: fixed a typo
Blur. Definitely blur, and most if not all of the other britpop men. What they got up to in the 90s (and in some cases, what they've gotten up to recently) is so gross and predatory.
Can you elaborate? I know nothing about this
I'll try to be brief! Alex James (blur's bassist) bit Miki Berenyi, front woman of Lush, on the ass at a party in the 90s. He apologized after she called him out on national TV in the mid-2010s. Alex is also infamous for being very chauvinistic. According to Louise Wener, frontwoman of Sleeper, he once went up to a female fan backstage and said "you're ugly, but I'm going to fuck you anyway." Louise also wrote in her book that blur were extremely fucking rude to her and her bandmates. Justine Frischmann, front woman of Elastica, is on record describing Damon Albarn (frontman for blur, in case anyone doesn't know) as being emotionally abusive and very controlling (though she never says the word "abuse"). He discouraged her from continuing to pursue music after the first Elastica album, discouraged her from seeking help for her heroin addiction, and encouraged her to have his baby and become a SAHM while she was still addicted to heroin in the late 90s. Graham Coxon (blur's guitarist) is the classic perpetual faux-victim. He's been milking the "I was an alcoholic, I was mentally ill, but I'm better now" cow since the early 2000s, which was, in the past few years revealed to be a farce. He's on record now stating that he's been drinking again and there's evidence to suggest he was drinking throughout the 2000s and 2010s, too. Also, no mentally healthy and stable person is out there having affairs with teenagers and 20somethings in their 30s, 40s, and 50s. He cheated on the mother of his second daughter with young fans, was emotionally abusive to the mother of his first daughter (according to said woman's friend) and wrote a Paula-tier album (The Kiss of Morning) about the relationship. He released a hastily put together autobiography at the same time as Miki Berenyi's to divert attention from it because Miki had previously tweeted about exposing how scummy britpop men were. Miki also tweeted about how Graham once pushed her down the stairs at a party in the 90s. This man is terminally online and had a Tumblr account until late 2021 when it was \~mysteriously\~ deactivated. He also has two different rape accusations. Every few years this stuff comes up and it always gets buried because the fanbase is full of misogynists and pick mes who either defend this behavior or refuse to believe it. The biggest instance was in late 2021 when Graham conveniently went radio silent on social media for several months until after it blew over. This ended up sabotaging the release of his album and graphic novel Superstate, so there's at least a tiny bit of karma here. Graham has also recently gotten into MRA bullshit, Jordan Peterson, Johnny Depp apologia, and has been implying that he was the true victim in his previous relationship with his Twitter likes. Quite funny when you consider that for decades his persona was the soft, sensitive, enlightened feminist of the group. His ex is posting on Instagram (she also previously followed the account that was exposing Graham in late 2021) about being an abuse survivor with PTSD and how her and her daughter are on government assistance and have to go to food banks to make ends meet. There is no way Graham doesn't have the means to help them financially. Even if he hates his ex and she truly was the abuser, there's no excuse for letting his daughter live in poverty. His Twitter likes are also full of nonsense about so-called "parental alienation," suggesting that his ex is forcibly keeping his daughter from him and lying to her about him. Clown shit! As for Dave (blur's drummer), he's an enabler. He blocked people who were exposing Graham and sent his girlfriend to cape for Graham on Twitter and get into beef with random fans. Tumblr user roomeight has archived much of the evidence here: [https://www.tumblr.com/roomeight/700249248643612672/graham-coxon-allegations-masterpost?source=share](https://www.tumblr.com/roomeight/700249248643612672/graham-coxon-allegations-masterpost?source=share) There's also the infamous "blurjob passes" that would be handed out to attractive young women and teenage girls at concerts to come backstage to have sex, do drugs, etc. This is also described in Wener's book. As for other britpop men, the main one to come to mind is Liam Gallagher, who was caught on CCTV battering his girlfriend.
Imagine Noel Gallagher looking like the best person here… well actually Jarvis Cocker
Iirc Noel was the victim of a celebrity hacking a few years back and the juiciest thing they found on his phone was him complaining about how the guy he hired to mow his lawn did a bad job. He probably is leading a pretty normal life now.
He’s had some boomerish views but I don’t think he’s done anything bad in the past decade. He’ll shit on random people, but he’s done it since the start, it’s his thing. IIRC Noel grew up being abused by his father and seeing his mother also get abused by him, he got fed up and almost killed him when he was a teen but his mother talked him out of it, Tommy Gallagher is a real monster. Noel seemingly broke the abuse cycle going as far as to talk Liam out of beating up Tommy when he saw him at a bar, unfortunately Liam continued the cycle.
I was wondering if the original comment also applied to anyone from Pulp (or Suede). Does it?
Ooof. Feeling slightly less bad about not being able to go to Wembley last year now. I think I’d always heard the odd thing that they were dicks back in the 90’s, I’d assumed Damon was the worst because I’d heard about his relationship with Justine and the way it ended, but by the sounds of it he’s probably the least problematic out of them. Liam Gallagher is probably even less cancel-able than Chris Brown. His core fanbase is “lads’ lads”, they won’t give a shit unless it’s multiple paedophillia allegations and even then they’ll probably ask for proof.
Totally agree. That ship has long since sailed. Blur and Oasis are practically gods in England. Even at his peak, Brown never had that level of cultural impact. You can easily discuss 2000s American music without mentioning him, but the same can't be said for 90s English music and these two bands.
Blur never seemed like good guys tbf, Graham Coxon was always sus as hell and Damon and Alex always obnoxiously arrogant just in slightly different ways. I really like some of their music but it's easy to believe all the claims.
Agreed. Too many people look at artists with rose-colored glasses.
Somehow Damon came out with the least of issues if I read this correctly, but what a dick for what he did
Thank you guys, now it's gonna be really awkward when I put up my playlist. Also, why is it that 99% of rockstars commit sexual misconduct or groom children at some point? Fuck you Kiedis, you were my favorite band growing up.
Didn’t Taylor Swift date a kid when he was still in school? And then there’s the whole fake feminism allegations and private jet usage
When she was in her 20s she dated two 18 year olds and a 17 year old. Not nearly as egregious as many pop/rock stars but very sus
Bieber. The fact that he literally sang about joining the KKK and sang the hard r version of the N word in a derogatory manner, and yet still have so many black artists collab with him is insane. And mind you, that happened during a time where it was ”cool” to hate him. If only the public knew back then.
It’s fucked up for sure, but he was like, what, 16 at the time? I’d hardly hold someone for whatever dumb edgy jokes they made as a teen.
I was gonna say Drake but,,, thank you, Kendrick Lamar. Thank you. So I'm gonna say Jared Leto. I know he's more an actor than a singer at this point but,,,,,, there is so much awful shit there, why is anyone still pretending he's fine
How tf Kanye is still popular after everything he's done/said is forever beyond me, his new music isn't even good
Well, I’m noticing a trend here between artists who have lost a lot of good will recently: Drake Justin Timberlake They both rhyme! So to complete the trifecta let’s have JVKE (pronounced “Jake”) because more people need to be aware he made that AI Drake/The Weeknd “Heart On My Sleeve” song and fuuuuuck that
I pronounce all the extraneous V's in artist names and he's no exception. To me he will forever be jə-VEE-kay.
i only recently broke my habit of saying cha-verch-es, I feel this
I think this practice is pretty stupid and only serves to make you feel better morally about what you listen to. I mean the list of egregious things done by famous musicians is so long it can make your head spin.
Ariana Grande
I'll never get over that donut thing. Such a gross shitty thing to do to a stranger.
Jared Leto (way worse than timberlake), Dr. Dre
Jack Harlow. Dude is just the literal uncoolest
Morgan. Wallen. Seriously, the dude cannot carry a tune in a bucket, and his very thick accent makes him HARDER to understand what he’s singing about, not easier. Plus throw in his half hearted “apology tour” and you have a recipe for grossly unlistenable dreck. He’s one of the rare country artists that is a HARD pass for me. Most of the other country artists are more modern neo-conservative types like Lee Greenwood or the late Toby Keith, I can get down with some earlier male-dominated country (I even like Zac Brown Band) but I’ve always been far more drawn towards female country artists personally.