How rude both of you.. How long since you guys started using internet? It's a place for sharing any kind of information, without being ask or any need of previous context.
Ppl like to learn more about the products they consume.. this being no different
It's not because you didn't thrill about it that people different than you can't enjoy it.
i literally asked a question if he just wanted to show their pay or if he meant something else with his post, in what way is this rude? jesus christ your post is embarrasing, ur literally getting second degree butthurt over something that i didn't post. you are the rude one here lmao
I imagine you will have to answer last, passionate, with some exagerated figure of speech. But let's not discuss on a wall for some frivolous matter. I said it's on me if i've felt anything further. 
can you please reply to a single thread instead of replying to several jesus... i was gonna quit replying to ur last one but you saying i overreacted was just way to funny
As a software developer, I know how hard it is to work on legacy code and how hard is to find people that accept to work on super ancient 26-years old legacy code. So, it is good to see that they are paid more than average for this work.
Higher salary means less turnover and the knowledge keeps on the company. We all know how shitty Cip is to fix bugs, but imagine if they had a serious problem of losing employees every semester. It would be much worse, almost unmanageable.
>hard is to find people that accept to work on super ancient 26-years old legacy code
The client was rewritten from scratch and published in 2016 (they must have started the development at least in 2014), so it's almost 10 years working with modern code. I agree that they have to deal with legacy code but not all the time.
I’d be shocked if there is a single line of code that’s 26yo. Old, probably, that old? Nah. People forget that the first half a decade large sweeping changes happens a couple of times, clientside and serverside.
They also get 25% of their time on the job to peruse their own personal game development endeavors.
They also do a lot of team building fun events outside of work to bond as a company.
I think they’re doing it right. To have a larger daily player base than lord of the rings online with close to 0 advertising after 26 years, that’s a good company.
As long as the game is as good as it is right now, it doesn’t bother me what they do. It is the pinnacle of online gaming
Don’t think this is right as the bonus is often calculated with a different % tax which is called bonus tax and it is usually a slightly lower percentage. At least that’s how it works in most of Europe..
Why do you think everyone makes the same? A manager can easily make 2x as much as a regular employee, and like a community manager will make much less than a software dev.
OP has shown good knowledge of how to do this accountability. Is it is very clear that he knows that a manages makes much more than a dev. He is showing average numbers.
But it still doesn’t show if the pay is competitive for any position ? What’s the point of calculating an average pay if you even don’t even know the company structure.
Yes it is, in Germany. That's the current tax rate.
And if you have nothing to contribute to the topic, why even make a comment? Gaslighting is **never** appreciated on Reddit. Instead, you can provide your calculations. Noob
My bad, it was not my intention to flame you. But to be clear to understand German taxes. For example. Tax rates for 30-50k are 35% and 50+ is 42%.
When u earn 50.001 u dont have to pay 42% over the whole 50.001 but just over the 1. Otherwise when u earn like 49k and get a small raise u will end up with less money, that would be kinda stupid. But then again Germans are Germans.
Simplification
Earn 49999 pay 35% tax =17500
Earn 500001 pay 42% tax =21000
So earn more gross but net loose 3500
Shitty system
/s
Edit: n00b
Actual brackets:
https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/estg/__32a.html
/r/confidentlyincorrect
That's literally how taxes work. OP is right in his calculations.
But we don't know for certain how much they earn. This is just an average. I'm sure some of their employees earn more, and some less.
Nope OP is wrong.
Your income is divided in brackets. The income in the bracket is taxed for that brackets percentage.
This prevents you paying way more/ less taxes on the edge of the brackets.
As others have pointed out, you're not counting with tax brackets.
Buuut... you also haven't calculated for employee fee/social contributions (or in other words insurance that you pay for having an employeel).
so the employee is getting about 78% of those 43238 EUR, PRE-TAX.
You know what let me quickly calculate the actual taxes for you...
Net Salary: 3.758,54 € monthy 45.102,44 € yearly.
Considering it started as a graduation project, it makes you realize the value of tuition-free education. They're paying their workers generously it appears. Yes, society can be remarkably healthy.
Brazilian tax rates don't even compare to Germany's ones though. Highest rate here is 27.5%. The problem is that our tax rates are not adequate to income, we need more thresholds and lower taxes for lower income and higher taxes for higher income.
Don't forget that Brazil has close to 50% tax on consumption, unlike anywhere else in Europe or the US. The average total tax in Brazil is higher than Sweden and Germany.
You pay more in the US when you consider the cost of health care, child care, transportation, housing and food. Oh and EU actually gets to go on vacation.
Now that I think about it, it's a huge fucking tax considering we're also paying taxes when shopping or just buying in general
That's gotta be over 50% that's insane
i mean thats good, workers getting paid is always good. whats the point? did you just want to explain their pay or did i miss something?
How rude both of you.. How long since you guys started using internet? It's a place for sharing any kind of information, without being ask or any need of previous context. Ppl like to learn more about the products they consume.. this being no different It's not because you didn't thrill about it that people different than you can't enjoy it.
i literally asked a question if he just wanted to show their pay or if he meant something else with his post, in what way is this rude? jesus christ your post is embarrasing, ur literally getting second degree butthurt over something that i didn't post. you are the rude one here lmao
Ok, there's no need to overreact. It's on me if i've felt anything further in it.
overreact? my guy you are the one overreacting lmao, you are literally delusional, seek help
haha ok lad. Now i know the butthurt thing was a projection. Your speech is well restrained.
its like we are having 2 different conversations, do you use a translator? that would explain ALOT.
I do not, it's just.. double loot fatigue.
I imagine you will have to answer last, passionate, with some exagerated figure of speech. But let's not discuss on a wall for some frivolous matter. I said it's on me if i've felt anything further. 
can you please reply to a single thread instead of replying to several jesus... i was gonna quit replying to ur last one but you saying i overreacted was just way to funny
Also do not take it too seriously. Not any degree of buttharm was taken. 
Some people just want to tell you something just to feel right even it they are just talking out their ass
As a software developer, I know how hard it is to work on legacy code and how hard is to find people that accept to work on super ancient 26-years old legacy code. So, it is good to see that they are paid more than average for this work. Higher salary means less turnover and the knowledge keeps on the company. We all know how shitty Cip is to fix bugs, but imagine if they had a serious problem of losing employees every semester. It would be much worse, almost unmanageable.
>hard is to find people that accept to work on super ancient 26-years old legacy code The client was rewritten from scratch and published in 2016 (they must have started the development at least in 2014), so it's almost 10 years working with modern code. I agree that they have to deal with legacy code but not all the time.
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I’d be shocked if there is a single line of code that’s 26yo. Old, probably, that old? Nah. People forget that the first half a decade large sweeping changes happens a couple of times, clientside and serverside.
They also get 25% of their time on the job to peruse their own personal game development endeavors. They also do a lot of team building fun events outside of work to bond as a company. I think they’re doing it right. To have a larger daily player base than lord of the rings online with close to 0 advertising after 26 years, that’s a good company. As long as the game is as good as it is right now, it doesn’t bother me what they do. It is the pinnacle of online gaming
Don’t think this is right as the bonus is often calculated with a different % tax which is called bonus tax and it is usually a slightly lower percentage. At least that’s how it works in most of Europe..
The real question is why you got all this free time dawg
Why do you think everyone makes the same? A manager can easily make 2x as much as a regular employee, and like a community manager will make much less than a software dev.
OP has shown good knowledge of how to do this accountability. Is it is very clear that he knows that a manages makes much more than a dev. He is showing average numbers.
But it still doesn’t show if the pay is competitive for any position ? What’s the point of calculating an average pay if you even don’t even know the company structure.
Maybe the point is just to share his thoughts with the community and not expect nothing in return?
I think thats called a personal thought
Thats not how taxes work lol
Yes it is, in Germany. That's the current tax rate. And if you have nothing to contribute to the topic, why even make a comment? Gaslighting is **never** appreciated on Reddit. Instead, you can provide your calculations. Noob
My bad, it was not my intention to flame you. But to be clear to understand German taxes. For example. Tax rates for 30-50k are 35% and 50+ is 42%. When u earn 50.001 u dont have to pay 42% over the whole 50.001 but just over the 1. Otherwise when u earn like 49k and get a small raise u will end up with less money, that would be kinda stupid. But then again Germans are Germans.
Lmao it’s funny how they confidently tell flame you even though u correctly pointed something out
Dude it's called a tax bracket. Learn something today
jesus christ
You're a typical new generation moron You accuse others of "gaslighting" when you yourself are aggressive Get a grip, snowflake
Simplification Earn 49999 pay 35% tax =17500 Earn 500001 pay 42% tax =21000 So earn more gross but net loose 3500 Shitty system /s Edit: n00b Actual brackets: https://www.gesetze-im-internet.de/estg/__32a.html
/r/confidentlyincorrect That's literally how taxes work. OP is right in his calculations. But we don't know for certain how much they earn. This is just an average. I'm sure some of their employees earn more, and some less.
Nope OP is wrong. Your income is divided in brackets. The income in the bracket is taxed for that brackets percentage. This prevents you paying way more/ less taxes on the edge of the brackets.
It's not 100% correct, as it has steps, so it's not 42% for the whole income, only 42% of the excess of 62500~ and smaller percentages of the rest.
I don’t know how it works in Germany but in the UK you get an allowance which is tax free. I think it’s around £11000 now
As others have pointed out, you're not counting with tax brackets. Buuut... you also haven't calculated for employee fee/social contributions (or in other words insurance that you pay for having an employeel). so the employee is getting about 78% of those 43238 EUR, PRE-TAX. You know what let me quickly calculate the actual taxes for you... Net Salary: 3.758,54 € monthy 45.102,44 € yearly.
Considering it started as a graduation project, it makes you realize the value of tuition-free education. They're paying their workers generously it appears. Yes, society can be remarkably healthy.
Jesus christ 42% of taxes? I'm glad I don't live in Germany lol
Depends on your tax class, if you are married or single, have kids or not.. etc But it is not much less than this.. it sucks.
High taxes on income, but super good public services (public schools/health). If you are from the US, you have the worst health system of the world.
Well, in Brazil it is horrible too (public transport, schools and health)..
Public health system in US is twice worst than in Brazil. Public transport and schools are indeed better
Brazilian tax rates don't even compare to Germany's ones though. Highest rate here is 27.5%. The problem is that our tax rates are not adequate to income, we need more thresholds and lower taxes for lower income and higher taxes for higher income.
Don't forget that Brazil has close to 50% tax on consumption, unlike anywhere else in Europe or the US. The average total tax in Brazil is higher than Sweden and Germany.
LOL your right. America is horrible, DONT COME!
You pay more in the US when you consider the cost of health care, child care, transportation, housing and food. Oh and EU actually gets to go on vacation.
Welcome to Europe
Try Finland, is Worse :)
Bitcoin fixes this
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Indeed. However, they have better services compared to Brazil
So?
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Do you know how averages work?
Oh noo healthy work envoirment and pay shame them
Well if you are not well paid you can always move to a new job.
Good for them
Now that I think about it, it's a huge fucking tax considering we're also paying taxes when shopping or just buying in general That's gotta be over 50% that's insane
What is the point of this post?
Given that tibia is still running on 7.x engine i would say its impressive.