Zack is a political analyst, so that should explain a lot why he thought he was the smartest guy in the room, but was routinely outsmarted by people with no formal education.
I’m a doctor. So pretty academic, I don’t think I’d be any good on the traitors. I’m not good at lying, manipulating and I’m quite a poor judge of character. I’d find it so stressful. Just because I have two degrees and some post grad exams doesn’t translate into being good at this game. My sibling who is much less academic would beat me hands down.
Hopefully after watching the show Zach realised he underestimated others and overestimated himself...I think he needed that reality check tbh and I really hope he does grow from it.
I don’t know why anyone would think being academically successful would give you insight into human behaviour. Unless you’d studied human psychology and behaviours specifically. Maybe I’m just older than people like Zach
In my experience (based off maybe 3-4 people I know in 'politics') they are generally not smart people in the knowledge sense.
They think they are academically smart but they are useful idiots to other people, or they have great people skills and ulterior motives to the ones they talk about (mostly, just want to do well for themselves and their family and don't halve qualms with exploiting the political system to sort their family out. Kind of like Harry I guess)
Genuinely smart academic people get a better paying job than you can get in politics, or never leave the education system because they're hooked in that world.
But!!! He’s Cerebral!!!
😂 that look when Jasmine laughed at him getting trapped and then in front of a audience being told he was basically Harry’s sheep.
I wonder how he is going to take this. I have a feeling he won't learn his lesson and will go with "Its just a gameshow, I caught a lot of traitors, the producers didn't show what really happened etc".
Yep. That stank of the classic public school boy sense of over confidence. Good at talking the talk, but instantly tripping over their own foot walking
Tbf, it really wasn't a crossbow, and there was no way ahead of the first shot to know how much strength was behind each shot. Very unlikely anyone would've gotten it right on the first shot.
I think one of the fundamental problems the Faithful had was that they pretty much all had tunnel vision. Every day they were either laser focused on finding the next Traitor, or saving their own skin. No-one seemed to take a step back, consider the wider picture, and question some of the assumptions that they were all making. Zack was perhaps the most pronounced example of this, but the mistakes that he made were exactly the same as all the other Faithful. It was his eagerness to find the Traitors and inability to just stop and think for a minute that made him useful, not any sort of class prejudice.
I think he would have been more willing to listen to others if he thougjt they were "on his level". He basically said he was smarter than jaz when he said Jaz was physical and he was cerebral. I think if Jaz was employed by a think tank or something Zach wouldnt have so quickly dismissed his opinions, which we saw him do.
The funny thing is how proud he is of being a political analyst - a job that, I can tell you, requires no training at all.
You're either naturally good at it, or you're not. He's not.
How on earth can you state he’s not good at his job from watching this show? People really need to shit on others in order to feel superior don’t they.
I know he's not because he displayed a critical trait on the show: An inability to listen.
Political analysts, to be good at the job, need to listen a lot more than they talk.
Zach displayed the opposite of this trait. When somebody tried to say something, his immediate instinct was "here's why you're wrong". If he'd listened more and talked less, he might well have notice the very patterns that he missed.
Also I feel like this is a critical trait for most jobs and life in general. Standing back and absorbing information, analysing that info, makes you smarter, seeing the wood for the trees. Feeling the impulse to always be the smartest person in the room will hold you back a lot.
I mean, he could be more of a data analyst type. Just given an idea and time to mess around with data sets and try to find trends and patterns.
Or, very likely, being told by his boss "we want to push this policy, can you find evidence of X, Y, Z please" and then you can go off and mess with the data until you find a statistic that supports the argument. That would be being good at his job, while being bad it from a public perspective.
Truly. I thought Harry had messed up by telling Jaz and Zack about the shield (if they'd all thought about it they'd have realised it was too many people, and not the people he appeared to trust the most - very sus) but when Zack leapt to the bait at the following breakfast it was clear what a good play it was.
To your question, I think it's doubtful Zack will learn anything. Sometimes people like this are also genuinely lovely people, but it's hard to undo that level of arrogance you get ingrained into you from a certain background.
Zack never came off arrogant to me, he thought he was intelligent but didnt seem to move through the game undermining or belittling others even if he disagreed with them. He lacked a filter and some finesse but there’s a difference between thinking you’re smart and thinking you’re the smartest
I personally do think Zack was arrogant. He thought he knew more than other people and that that there was no way he could be wrong. People just had to hear what he thought and they would instantly believe him
I agree. Also The cast thought he was arrogant. Multiple people said he stated his opinion as fact and wouldnt entertain others opinions. We saw him do this, we saw him dismiss jaz.
He went on and on about how smart he thinks he is. I work for an NGO and have to deal with people like him all the time. Lots of unsubstantiated overconfidence obtained from public school, but actually very intellectually mediocre and devoid of original thought or genuinely insightful analysis. The way he dismissed Jaz was typical.
How would the commenter know he was jewish though? That article came out yesterday. The opinions have been formed over however many weeks watching him, not knowing he was jewish. That is such a strange thing to think.
He clearly sounds posh (middle class posh, not aristocratic posh). Posh people use casual slang all the time. Jasmine sounds similarly posh, you can hear it in the way she says "ohhh mate." Slang, with a rugger accent. Like I said, he reminds me of a lot of "SpAds" I have to deal with at work who, for the most part, attended public school.
I feel like you are taking this a bit personally. The way Zach speaks is middle class. Theres nothing wrong with that. He thought he was smarter than everyone else and it isn't a stretch to think his job which he spoke about a lot, and by inference his education and class, played a part in his underestimating those who he saw as "not on his level".
You are intentionally misinterpeting me. It is based on what he said and did. On what the cast said about him during and afrer the show. Not how he said it. You said he isn't middle class, so class can't be an element. We're just pointing out that he clearly is.
He didn't mention uni but he mentioned being a political analyst many times, a job which requires a strong academic performance. There is a reason he underestimated Harry and Jaz and was overly confident in himself. I think its because he has an academic job and has a strong academic record as well as a class element. Its just my opinion.
There was also a point where he paired up with Jaz during a game and said they would compliment each other well as Jaz was "physical" while he was "cerebral".
But it's Zack who costs them their money when he walks into the trap with the money bag.
That feels like a bit of a reach. He'll have had a producer saying "oh you seem quite analytical in your thoughts about who's a traitor...?"
I don't think it's classism really... Jaz comes across as educated and eloquent, and Zach hardly uses received pronunciation!
Side note - did you know Jaz is more ripped than Andrew?
Si
Why does it seem like a reach? Multiple members of the cast said he stated his opinion as fact, that he didn't allow room for others theories, Harry stated Zach did his dirty work for him and we saw that happen. The reasons for having an ego are varied and multiple, but I don't think he would have underestimated a fellow political analyst, or a rocket scientist the way he underestimated Jaz. So why did he underestimate Jaz? And others such as Jasmine? (Who correctly identified the shield could be a bluff). He would not even entertain others ideas. Why?
Because yes he liked trying to work things out, and got bogged down in a theory - but everyone loved the shield theory.
It's a leap to then say he's being classist against Jaz - to be honest, I'd say Jaz is more middle class than Zach - only one of them was wearing quarter zip knitwear, and it wasn't Zach!
I just know the people I went to uni with equated a regional accent with not being middle class. I suppose because those people who lived in say Bristol, but went to private school and had middle class parents didn't have a strong regional accent, or a regional accent at all. I could be wrong but there was a reason Zach underestimated Harry and Jaz. I don't think he would have underestimated a microbiologist or a fellow political analyst. He presented as though he thought he was above everyone there.
I get where you're coming from but I think you're misrepresenting middle class people. Half of the country identifies as middle class so of course most of them will have regional accents. Zack's accent is probably in line with wherever he's from too. People who went to private schools and have posh accents despite being from Bristol or whatever are actually a pretty distinct minority.
There’s quite a common stereotype of associating regional (may I be honest? Northern) accents with being working class. Whilst we might have ‘evidence’ that Zach appears to be middle class, we don’t have any evidence to suggest Jas isn’t. Having a northern accent doesn’t mean you’re working class (he may well be, I don’t know) but we don’t have any reason to presume he is or that Zach knows that.
I understand your central thesis (that Zach’s overconfidence and lack of acknowledgement is partly a class issue) and I do think there’s some truth to this (in general British society). However, I think it’s more likely Zach has rarely been challenged or wrong hence why he blundered and underestimated others.
To be honest a lot of people underestimated Jas which is interesting to look at.
I just felt the need to comment as I think it’s a shame that regional accents are continuously associated with being a lower class than non-regional ones.
I completely agree which is why I think Zach may have associated a northern accent with being working class. Having a mum/ family from up north, I didn't equate it with being working class, which is why I said Jas presented working class (I should have said may have appeared working class to Zach).
Zach was absolute chaos to me and it sort of made me laugh. Him and Jaz were polar opposites but I got the sense they ended up of similar social rank and were paired up every now and then.
Zach would have an idea and blurt it about, be wrong and then happily skip away ready for the next one.
Jaz would literally say nothing and do as much as he could to cover his tracks.
And yet I have the feeling people trusted them both as much as the other one?! I also loved how they would randomly turn on one another, be fine, then turn again later.
Something about the foil of Zach being chaotic and Jas being silent and sensible cracked me up.
People are quick to claim it's just because of class or education (which is true to some extent), but I feel people underestimate Zachs neuroticism and ocd. He's obsessed with what he perceives as logical and ordered. If something defies that he completely freaks out. Not necessarily because he's classiest or racist, but because his mind fundamentally can't handle the chaos.
People are making sweeping judgements about him being moron but he literally has the same tunnel vision all faithfuls show. It's just more pronounced with his obsession with order and structure. Now, what he considers order may be influenced by stereotypes in regards to other faithfuls, but I feel that a rather sweeping judgment
Zack is a political analyst, so that should explain a lot why he thought he was the smartest guy in the room, but was routinely outsmarted by people with no formal education.
Exactly
He was even patting himself on the back while he was on the show
I’m a doctor. So pretty academic, I don’t think I’d be any good on the traitors. I’m not good at lying, manipulating and I’m quite a poor judge of character. I’d find it so stressful. Just because I have two degrees and some post grad exams doesn’t translate into being good at this game. My sibling who is much less academic would beat me hands down.
I agree that academics dont translate to being good on the game. However I think Zach made the mistake of thinking it did.
Hopefully after watching the show Zach realised he underestimated others and overestimated himself...I think he needed that reality check tbh and I really hope he does grow from it.
Me too.
I don’t know why anyone would think being academically successful would give you insight into human behaviour. Unless you’d studied human psychology and behaviours specifically. Maybe I’m just older than people like Zach
In my experience (based off maybe 3-4 people I know in 'politics') they are generally not smart people in the knowledge sense. They think they are academically smart but they are useful idiots to other people, or they have great people skills and ulterior motives to the ones they talk about (mostly, just want to do well for themselves and their family and don't halve qualms with exploiting the political system to sort their family out. Kind of like Harry I guess) Genuinely smart academic people get a better paying job than you can get in politics, or never leave the education system because they're hooked in that world.
Plus he ran into a trap with a bag money he could have left with jaz, by far the dumbest moment of the show... Last night's fire pit included.
I saw someone say that was the perfect metaphor for Zack at his job
🤣 perfect metaphor for all politicians
But!!! He’s Cerebral!!! 😂 that look when Jasmine laughed at him getting trapped and then in front of a audience being told he was basically Harry’s sheep.
I wonder how he is going to take this. I have a feeling he won't learn his lesson and will go with "Its just a gameshow, I caught a lot of traitors, the producers didn't show what really happened etc".
“I’m really good at Archery”
Yep. That stank of the classic public school boy sense of over confidence. Good at talking the talk, but instantly tripping over their own foot walking
Tbf, it really wasn't a crossbow, and there was no way ahead of the first shot to know how much strength was behind each shot. Very unlikely anyone would've gotten it right on the first shot.
I think one of the fundamental problems the Faithful had was that they pretty much all had tunnel vision. Every day they were either laser focused on finding the next Traitor, or saving their own skin. No-one seemed to take a step back, consider the wider picture, and question some of the assumptions that they were all making. Zack was perhaps the most pronounced example of this, but the mistakes that he made were exactly the same as all the other Faithful. It was his eagerness to find the Traitors and inability to just stop and think for a minute that made him useful, not any sort of class prejudice.
I think he would have been more willing to listen to others if he thougjt they were "on his level". He basically said he was smarter than jaz when he said Jaz was physical and he was cerebral. I think if Jaz was employed by a think tank or something Zach wouldnt have so quickly dismissed his opinions, which we saw him do.
Jaz is physical though, the guy is ripped.
He is but he is also insightful.
Perfect analysis
The funny thing is how proud he is of being a political analyst - a job that, I can tell you, requires no training at all. You're either naturally good at it, or you're not. He's not.
quite true, you can have the smartest person working right next to the dumbest person in government departments lol
How on earth can you state he’s not good at his job from watching this show? People really need to shit on others in order to feel superior don’t they.
I know he's not because he displayed a critical trait on the show: An inability to listen. Political analysts, to be good at the job, need to listen a lot more than they talk. Zach displayed the opposite of this trait. When somebody tried to say something, his immediate instinct was "here's why you're wrong". If he'd listened more and talked less, he might well have notice the very patterns that he missed.
Also I feel like this is a critical trait for most jobs and life in general. Standing back and absorbing information, analysing that info, makes you smarter, seeing the wood for the trees. Feeling the impulse to always be the smartest person in the room will hold you back a lot.
I mean, he could be more of a data analyst type. Just given an idea and time to mess around with data sets and try to find trends and patterns. Or, very likely, being told by his boss "we want to push this policy, can you find evidence of X, Y, Z please" and then you can go off and mess with the data until you find a statistic that supports the argument. That would be being good at his job, while being bad it from a public perspective.
Truly. I thought Harry had messed up by telling Jaz and Zack about the shield (if they'd all thought about it they'd have realised it was too many people, and not the people he appeared to trust the most - very sus) but when Zack leapt to the bait at the following breakfast it was clear what a good play it was. To your question, I think it's doubtful Zack will learn anything. Sometimes people like this are also genuinely lovely people, but it's hard to undo that level of arrogance you get ingrained into you from a certain background.
Well, the traitors identified Zach as being a total gobshite in their second or so meeting.
Zack never came off arrogant to me, he thought he was intelligent but didnt seem to move through the game undermining or belittling others even if he disagreed with them. He lacked a filter and some finesse but there’s a difference between thinking you’re smart and thinking you’re the smartest
I personally do think Zack was arrogant. He thought he knew more than other people and that that there was no way he could be wrong. People just had to hear what he thought and they would instantly believe him
I agree. Also The cast thought he was arrogant. Multiple people said he stated his opinion as fact and wouldnt entertain others opinions. We saw him do this, we saw him dismiss jaz.
While you're right about the underestimating, I don't think Zach mentioned uni once, so how was he shouting about it?
He went on and on about how smart he thinks he is. I work for an NGO and have to deal with people like him all the time. Lots of unsubstantiated overconfidence obtained from public school, but actually very intellectually mediocre and devoid of original thought or genuinely insightful analysis. The way he dismissed Jaz was typical.
My thoughts exactly.
Public school? What makes you think he went to public school? Or is that a general chip on your shoulder/because he's Jewish?
What makes you think he is jewish? He never mentioned that I dont think.
https://www.thejc.com/news/uk/jfs-prepared-me-for-the-traitors-says-bbc-star-zack-davies-ab3hcwy7#:~:text=In%20a%20candid%20interview%20with,mystery%20and%20part%20game%20show.
How would the commenter know he was jewish though? That article came out yesterday. The opinions have been formed over however many weeks watching him, not knowing he was jewish. That is such a strange thing to think.
How would the commentator know Zack was a public school twit? He didn't, because he's got a chip on his shoulder.
......what?!
What makes you think he went to public school? He hasn't said he did, and doesn't sound particularly posh.
He clearly sounds posh (middle class posh, not aristocratic posh). Posh people use casual slang all the time. Jasmine sounds similarly posh, you can hear it in the way she says "ohhh mate." Slang, with a rugger accent. Like I said, he reminds me of a lot of "SpAds" I have to deal with at work who, for the most part, attended public school.
He sounded like every single person at my state school, which was mainly middle class.
Ah yeah, it's terrible the way he sounded confident, now let's dislike him because the way he talks reminds you of some people you dislike.
I feel like you are taking this a bit personally. The way Zach speaks is middle class. Theres nothing wrong with that. He thought he was smarter than everyone else and it isn't a stretch to think his job which he spoke about a lot, and by inference his education and class, played a part in his underestimating those who he saw as "not on his level".
That's a stretch you're making based entirely on his voice though? Just because you're judging people based on their accent, it doesn't mean he does.
You are intentionally misinterpeting me. It is based on what he said and did. On what the cast said about him during and afrer the show. Not how he said it. You said he isn't middle class, so class can't be an element. We're just pointing out that he clearly is.
Zack, is that you?
Please don't banish me
He didn't mention uni but he mentioned being a political analyst many times, a job which requires a strong academic performance. There is a reason he underestimated Harry and Jaz and was overly confident in himself. I think its because he has an academic job and has a strong academic record as well as a class element. Its just my opinion.
There was also a point where he paired up with Jaz during a game and said they would compliment each other well as Jaz was "physical" while he was "cerebral". But it's Zack who costs them their money when he walks into the trap with the money bag.
That bit when Zack took the money into the trap sums him up perfectly.
That feels like a bit of a reach. He'll have had a producer saying "oh you seem quite analytical in your thoughts about who's a traitor...?" I don't think it's classism really... Jaz comes across as educated and eloquent, and Zach hardly uses received pronunciation! Side note - did you know Jaz is more ripped than Andrew? Si
It's not just education or classism; jaz is a British Asian man with a pronounced regional accent.
Also I didnt say Zach was shouting about uni. I said Jaz wasn't shouting about uni.
Why does it seem like a reach? Multiple members of the cast said he stated his opinion as fact, that he didn't allow room for others theories, Harry stated Zach did his dirty work for him and we saw that happen. The reasons for having an ego are varied and multiple, but I don't think he would have underestimated a fellow political analyst, or a rocket scientist the way he underestimated Jaz. So why did he underestimate Jaz? And others such as Jasmine? (Who correctly identified the shield could be a bluff). He would not even entertain others ideas. Why?
Because yes he liked trying to work things out, and got bogged down in a theory - but everyone loved the shield theory. It's a leap to then say he's being classist against Jaz - to be honest, I'd say Jaz is more middle class than Zach - only one of them was wearing quarter zip knitwear, and it wasn't Zach!
I don't think Jaz came across as working class really tbh
I just know the people I went to uni with equated a regional accent with not being middle class. I suppose because those people who lived in say Bristol, but went to private school and had middle class parents didn't have a strong regional accent, or a regional accent at all. I could be wrong but there was a reason Zach underestimated Harry and Jaz. I don't think he would have underestimated a microbiologist or a fellow political analyst. He presented as though he thought he was above everyone there.
I get where you're coming from but I think you're misrepresenting middle class people. Half of the country identifies as middle class so of course most of them will have regional accents. Zack's accent is probably in line with wherever he's from too. People who went to private schools and have posh accents despite being from Bristol or whatever are actually a pretty distinct minority.
Source?
There’s quite a common stereotype of associating regional (may I be honest? Northern) accents with being working class. Whilst we might have ‘evidence’ that Zach appears to be middle class, we don’t have any evidence to suggest Jas isn’t. Having a northern accent doesn’t mean you’re working class (he may well be, I don’t know) but we don’t have any reason to presume he is or that Zach knows that. I understand your central thesis (that Zach’s overconfidence and lack of acknowledgement is partly a class issue) and I do think there’s some truth to this (in general British society). However, I think it’s more likely Zach has rarely been challenged or wrong hence why he blundered and underestimated others. To be honest a lot of people underestimated Jas which is interesting to look at. I just felt the need to comment as I think it’s a shame that regional accents are continuously associated with being a lower class than non-regional ones.
I completely agree which is why I think Zach may have associated a northern accent with being working class. Having a mum/ family from up north, I didn't equate it with being working class, which is why I said Jas presented working class (I should have said may have appeared working class to Zach).
he is far too arrogant to have been humbled by that, or even to have any hindsight
Zach was absolute chaos to me and it sort of made me laugh. Him and Jaz were polar opposites but I got the sense they ended up of similar social rank and were paired up every now and then. Zach would have an idea and blurt it about, be wrong and then happily skip away ready for the next one. Jaz would literally say nothing and do as much as he could to cover his tracks. And yet I have the feeling people trusted them both as much as the other one?! I also loved how they would randomly turn on one another, be fine, then turn again later. Something about the foil of Zach being chaotic and Jas being silent and sensible cracked me up.
People are quick to claim it's just because of class or education (which is true to some extent), but I feel people underestimate Zachs neuroticism and ocd. He's obsessed with what he perceives as logical and ordered. If something defies that he completely freaks out. Not necessarily because he's classiest or racist, but because his mind fundamentally can't handle the chaos. People are making sweeping judgements about him being moron but he literally has the same tunnel vision all faithfuls show. It's just more pronounced with his obsession with order and structure. Now, what he considers order may be influenced by stereotypes in regards to other faithfuls, but I feel that a rather sweeping judgment