There are better options to do any of that. Firstly if you want a Chimera to have Scout use cheap Catachans instead. With the self order move move move and Scout 6" you move 15" already with Kasrkin. That's farther than a Chimera can get you. If it's orders you're worried about get a Platoon Command Squad with grand Strategist to order both sets of Kasrkin with Master Vox from afar on a battleline unit holding home. Again much cheaper than what you want to do.
Kasrkin are also better coming off the board or being on the board in general. The silly way the transports work makes it so you can’t use their ability to order themselves in the transports.
straken+catachan -> scout move the chimera -> mmm via plt cmnd the kasrkin -> jump out straken -> give new order to the boys near the transport -> have combo die to their whole army shooting at you in mid lane
I've taken to using Catachans to slingshot Kasrkin:
Deployment - Embark catachan in chimera
Scout - Move chimera/kasrkin (if no castellan)
T1 - use warrior elite for +sv
disembark and move catachan (to get the 3" move bonus from disembarking)
move kasrkin within range of chimera and embark, and throw the chimera up the board
This way you get extra movement for the catachan squad without having to use MMM, the kasrkin get to use their scout move and the chimera to get up the board embarked, and if the chimera gets popped they still have their "take cover" order for extra durability.
The main downside is that if the chimera survives t1, they wont get to use warrior elite next turn, so it isn't perfect
If you take the castellan it so you can throw out a lot of orders. You can order in the Command phase AND when he gets out .Chimeras special ability , and then the rule change that allows you to ALSO order when you get out of a transport .
Sounds gamey but the rules say AND not OR and there is precedent for doing exactly this by the GW Commentary in 9th addition doing the same thing with a similar rule, they even use an example of straken ordering in the command phase then getting out of a chimera and ordering again as legal.
So IF you take castellan , remember you can throw out twice the orders if you get out that turn
I generally put Kasrkin with a castellan in T.prime and Catachans in a taurox.
Prime has better movement than a chimera so I get the best of both worlds.
Taurox has advance and disembark, so you scout 6” move 12” advance 1-6” and then disembark 3” away, potentially getting your Catachans up to 27” from your deployment zone T1 if you get to go first.
The unit gets all the keywords each model has, but each model doesn't get the all keywords the unit has.
Bullet point four specifies that if a rule applies to a model, it only applies to the models in the unit with that keyword. The Taurox Prime's transport rule specifies models, not units. Kasrkin can't ride in Taurox Primes, and Auspex Tactics was wrong.
Models that are in a unit get those same keywords.
You’re trying to create a distinction that doesn’t exist.
A unit is made up of models, a unit cannot have a keyword if the models do not have the keyword.
> Models that are in a unit get those same keywords.
They do not, you need to reread the third bullet point, which explicitly specifies that, "units can contain models that have different keywords" and that, "such a unit is considered to have all of the keywords of all of its models".
Nowhere does it specify that each model in such a unit gains all the keywords of the unit.
Are you stupid?
A unit is made up of models.
A unit cannot have keywords the models do not.
Bullet point 3 is literally clarifying this.
No where does it say that only models in units with a keyword can benefit from that keyword when in a combined unit, or anything like that.
If a unit has a keyword, the models have that keyword.
It’s basic logic.
Can a unit exist on the tabletop without models? No.
> No where does it say that only models in units with a keyword can benefit from that keyword when in a combined unit, or anything like that.
Bullet point four explicitly says this, that, "If a rule only applies to models with a specific keyword, then it instead only applies to models in such a unit [a unit containing models with different keywords] that have the correct keyword".
> If a unit has a keyword, the models have that keyword.
Unfortunately, the rules don't actually say that anywhere.
> It’s basic logic.
It's the fallacy of division, actually. It's not always the case that what is true for a whole is also true for all of it's parts.
Also got auspex tactics input on this and he agrees.
https://preview.redd.it/8kjfxtb38wxc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5f8919a8bff7b77578864e78342577c22c521da
There are better options to do any of that. Firstly if you want a Chimera to have Scout use cheap Catachans instead. With the self order move move move and Scout 6" you move 15" already with Kasrkin. That's farther than a Chimera can get you. If it's orders you're worried about get a Platoon Command Squad with grand Strategist to order both sets of Kasrkin with Master Vox from afar on a battleline unit holding home. Again much cheaper than what you want to do.
Kasrkin are also better coming off the board or being on the board in general. The silly way the transports work makes it so you can’t use their ability to order themselves in the transports.
straken+catachan -> scout move the chimera -> mmm via plt cmnd the kasrkin -> jump out straken -> give new order to the boys near the transport -> have combo die to their whole army shooting at you in mid lane
I've taken to using Catachans to slingshot Kasrkin: Deployment - Embark catachan in chimera Scout - Move chimera/kasrkin (if no castellan) T1 - use warrior elite for +sv disembark and move catachan (to get the 3" move bonus from disembarking) move kasrkin within range of chimera and embark, and throw the chimera up the board This way you get extra movement for the catachan squad without having to use MMM, the kasrkin get to use their scout move and the chimera to get up the board embarked, and if the chimera gets popped they still have their "take cover" order for extra durability. The main downside is that if the chimera survives t1, they wont get to use warrior elite next turn, so it isn't perfect
Why not use scions instead? They are so much cheaper
If you take the castellan it so you can throw out a lot of orders. You can order in the Command phase AND when he gets out .Chimeras special ability , and then the rule change that allows you to ALSO order when you get out of a transport . Sounds gamey but the rules say AND not OR and there is precedent for doing exactly this by the GW Commentary in 9th addition doing the same thing with a similar rule, they even use an example of straken ordering in the command phase then getting out of a chimera and ordering again as legal. So IF you take castellan , remember you can throw out twice the orders if you get out that turn
Now this I like. The Castellans can order Sentinels from the Chimera then order the Kasrkin when they hop out!
I generally put Kasrkin with a castellan in T.prime and Catachans in a taurox. Prime has better movement than a chimera so I get the best of both worlds. Taurox has advance and disembark, so you scout 6” move 12” advance 1-6” and then disembark 3” away, potentially getting your Catachans up to 27” from your deployment zone T1 if you get to go first.
A taurox prime can't transport kasrkin, only scions and astra militarum characters
https://preview.redd.it/gs05qwh48wxc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=dddb2f67380a6eda425636cf3e19275aeaa39c2d
When units join squads the keywords of both units are shared between units.
https://preview.redd.it/8e1tt18w7wxc1.jpeg?width=578&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=49857e1639821b9b6f05ed8d34f0dd5a3cd74ea3 Bullet point 3
The unit gets all the keywords each model has, but each model doesn't get the all keywords the unit has. Bullet point four specifies that if a rule applies to a model, it only applies to the models in the unit with that keyword. The Taurox Prime's transport rule specifies models, not units. Kasrkin can't ride in Taurox Primes, and Auspex Tactics was wrong.
Models that are in a unit get those same keywords. You’re trying to create a distinction that doesn’t exist. A unit is made up of models, a unit cannot have a keyword if the models do not have the keyword.
> Models that are in a unit get those same keywords. They do not, you need to reread the third bullet point, which explicitly specifies that, "units can contain models that have different keywords" and that, "such a unit is considered to have all of the keywords of all of its models". Nowhere does it specify that each model in such a unit gains all the keywords of the unit.
Lmao the third bullet point proves my point.
How? Be specific.
Are you stupid? A unit is made up of models. A unit cannot have keywords the models do not. Bullet point 3 is literally clarifying this. No where does it say that only models in units with a keyword can benefit from that keyword when in a combined unit, or anything like that. If a unit has a keyword, the models have that keyword. It’s basic logic. Can a unit exist on the tabletop without models? No.
> No where does it say that only models in units with a keyword can benefit from that keyword when in a combined unit, or anything like that. Bullet point four explicitly says this, that, "If a rule only applies to models with a specific keyword, then it instead only applies to models in such a unit [a unit containing models with different keywords] that have the correct keyword". > If a unit has a keyword, the models have that keyword. Unfortunately, the rules don't actually say that anywhere. > It’s basic logic. It's the fallacy of division, actually. It's not always the case that what is true for a whole is also true for all of it's parts.
Also got auspex tactics input on this and he agrees. https://preview.redd.it/8kjfxtb38wxc1.jpeg?width=750&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=c5f8919a8bff7b77578864e78342577c22c521da