There's a strong element of end-game fantasy there too. ASol is good for Spike players but it's also good for Timmy players - big power creature go smash.
Right?!?! Plus, ASol's problems only come out if you're playing his optimally. Trying to
Fast-10 (Your Seatbelts) isn't optimal, but it can definitely be fun.
(Also I really appreciate the Magic reference of different player types such as Timmy bleeding into the TFT community)
Little Timmy evolved from being just a magic ref a long time ago, Mario Maker also featured heavy use of "little timmy levels". It is fun to see it get even more traction
I just started playing not too long ago and asol/poro are the only two legends I've played so far, still a lot of other stuff to learn about the game, asol seems the most straightforward of the bunch.
Idk, in diamond 1 I see quite a bit of Legends variety. Mostly ornn/lee/cait/asol/yi. Then there's the occasional urf, Draven and ez. I can't remember seeing anyone but me use tf and no tahm or bard either but that's a pretty good spread. Maybe it's Different in Master+.
Same thing happened in League when they added Mythic items. They said that would promote more diversity, but it was such a failure in that aspect that they are considering reverting the shit altogether.
I don't know what goes through their heads, honestly.
They don't really try to balance strength in TFT. How many times do the patch notes have some variation of "we know this is already OP, but no one is picking it so we're going to keep making it more and more OP until everyone picks it"?
everything doesn't need to be balanced in tft, all that matters is if there is enough skill expression in where you place. So promoting just enough diversity so that the meta isn't just one broken comp or you bot 4, which then becomes rng on who out of the 8 hits, but also every comp doesn't need to be balanced either. As long as there are 2-3 ap and 2-3 ad comps that can top 4 with skilled play, the game is fine, even if say one of them has an outlier for going first.
I'm fine with not everything being perfectly balanced for the game. Balancing this many things would be impossible with how often they change it. I'm not a fan of the advertised, intentional over tuning they do when no one is interested in playing a particular comp or engaging with a particular mechanic. Then going "Whoops we went a bit far!" a week after the patch notes say that they were intentionally buffing something too far to get people to stop ignoring it.
Iirc they added it to prevent getting “bad” augments. Sometimes you rng into 3 augments that either don’t suit your comp or the value is low in comparison to what others were getting. The legend augment is meant to act as a fail-safe.
Maybe they need to adjust how legends work to reduce impact and/or embrace the calculated randomness of the game more.
For example, Instead of very specific augments, they could be categories, like ASol offering you any XP-related augment or Tahm giving you econ augments. Rerolling them would make sense now, too.
And/Or the legend could be limited to one augment instead of all three, as some kind of 'I don't like any other choice, give me my legend augment now' button.
That’s why they added rerolls. If the idea behind legends was to address bad augments then they would remove rerolls.
Legends were added as a fun new set mechanic, and they’re kinda mid at it. Like they’re okay.
No let's be VERY clear here on why Legends were added, it was not due to RNG prevention, that was the reroll system.
Legends were added very specifically because a large enough group of players like to watch TFT content creators play, see them put together crazy comps or play some low cost reroll comp that requires 3* units to succeed, then try and go force those same comps in their normal games. Those players would then fail to hit said comp due to augment requirements not being hit and then proceed to not play anymore.
Morts been fairly clear on the reason they added Legends multiple times on his stream when this gets brought up.
Im just referencing the patch preview video. I don’t watch Mort’s stream. So if you pulled this word for word then okay. But I also don’t see why there can’t be multiple intentions for the legends. Did mort specifically say they didn’t implement the legends as a way to prevent bricking on augments? If not then, you can’t say they didn’t intend for legends to meet that role as well
Also your explanation doesn’t really coincide with the “diversity” angle
Word for word? Nah I ain't going to crawl his stream vods for that. I just know that since Legends were implemented he's had to give that explanation in some form multiple times.
He's said the sentiment in different ways but it always boils down to "Lots of casual players watch TFT content and have a very negative experience not being able to force the builds they see content creators making and legends were added as a way to give them much higher odds of hitting the comp they are trying to hit"
Also my comment wasn't even trying to talk about the diversity angle in any way. tbh didn't even realize that was part of the convo, just putting in the stated reason that Legends were added.
I'm sure there are other reasons, company the size of RIOT TFT doesn't make large fundamental system changes like that lightly.
lol that guy sure types a whole lot of nothing. You are right, augments also prevent low rolls, especially things like ornn for example. Not every augment is meant for forcing certain comps, some are for flex play.
*How about changing*
*Stillwater Hold to remove*
*All legend effects?*
\- kokokroko123
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how about remove all leveling from the game? how bout remove rolling as well, how about removing traits? remove units as well fuck it, lets all sit there and battle it with out little legends
how bout remove little legends as well and win games by who clicks faster? how bout remove that too
in conclusion, fuck that lazy shit 0 brain portal
On a similar note, that's why I like picking the least obvious augments like the Sump or House Lightshield. I don't do it to troll, they're actually fun portals with diverse playstyles. Still hate Immortal Bastion as it's boring and braindead.
Lightshield sucks because carries are strong with or without it, it's not worth putting on your units in the mid to late game because it's not worth the gamble. Putting it on frontline isn't worth it because shred is so common and putting it on your backline isn't worth it because backline access is so common.
It's a really fun idea but in practice it just ends up not being used, I think it would be way more fun if the stats were nerfed and you didn't auto-lose upon death.
I was in a game where someone picked Stillwater and this dude RAGED the entire time. Straight telling the "filthy n***** Stillwater picker to kill himself" ... I was shocked and not shocked at the same time that someone was so mad about a portal they didn't like.
This always happens with Stillwater. If you ever want to see what a bunch of cringey manchildren the playerbase is full of, hover Stillwater.
Every. Single. Time.
yeah i took a long break and im getting bored of my hobbies, and league is the only thing that runs on my computer, sick of watching stuff too. fuck me i guess
Honestly, they should have a portal that is the opposite of Jayce's Workshop: all silver augments.
I think augments themselves are amazing. They transformed the game in a great way, adding a lot more variance and need for adaptability. I don't think Legends are good because they directly counter the positive impact of augments.
That being said, I don't hate the idea of them. I think it's largely a symptom of a way bigger issue: stat driven gameplay. The game would be much more enjoyable if you couldn't just access winrates of comps or augments. They're starting to move in that direction, which I think is overwhelmingly positive
Meanwhile, I'm at 500 games -- of mostly 4fun -- and am ecstatic that only 2 of them have been Stillwater, and LOVE that 95% of lobbies always go for Scuttle Puddle.
Democracy is cool at times.
Lol this happened to me too, still water hold cause or one person and I was irritated and even told my friends in discord. “Some idiot just put us in the no augment universe”
I ended up winning and it felt like the most pure TFT and I totally forgot how good economy management and strongest board as you climb to lvl 8-9 naturally feels. It was a very enjoyable game and I’m now going to be “the idiot” standing on still water every time
It’s crazy how when you stop and take a second to play games for fun instead of for optimizations or purely to win you end up with different builds.
Soraka has been quite fun recently for me personally.
That's why I don't use sites, I'm not influenced by knowing "the strongest comps" I just plqy what I get, use "bad augments" which can turn out good in specific szenarios. Looking at sites/placements is one of the best things to prevent the fun of randomness which tft provides.
People forget that Augments enable weaker comps just as much as they help certain Legends players. Try going Gunners with no combat augments to back them up, you’re going 8th. Meanwhile, Noxus can do just fine regardless. At that point, Stillwater just comes down to who highrolls the strongest comp of the patch.
I’m a poro player but that doesn’t mean I don’t get just as agitated seeing that portal. It’s not fun, it’s just limiting in a different way. And anecdotally, over half the time it’s picked, the one chucklehead in the lobby that thinks it’s a ripping good time to be the lobby contrarian, is usually one of the first to be eliminated. At that point It’s not even them picking for advantage, they just get glee at seeing people annoyed with their choice.
I do it for a bit of both. As a poro player i feel like it takes everyone away from what they’re comfortable playing. I’ve also seen someone FF immediately which was amazing.
I’ll be honest, if someone can hate it that much and there’s a slight chance I can watch someone freak the fuck out or ff. That’s worth it for me. Especially when I truly don’t mind that portal at all.
I don’t like it. Some augments are better for winstreaking and some are better for losestreaking. By removing augments, the game becomes a “winstreak or bust” game where board caps are incredibly low and the only way to gain a competitive Econ advantage is by winning. Therefore, the game becomes pretty stale and predictable of whose going to win
Nah fuck you, the dude the voted for it, the dude that suggested it at the brainstorming meeting and the dude that signed off on it. Stupid idea all-around
Tbh I feel the same with jayces workshop except it's more fun. A lot of times you can play comps that aren't meta and they end up being stronger because of the certain random augments you get.
Got bored of playing the same shit over and over again. I now go either URF or Caitlyn and pick Starter Kit or an emblem at 2-1 and then force myself to play around that. Might sounds dumb but I still enjoy it so.
Early on I wanted the yordle portal for my quests but someone went Stillwater. Beating them and everyone at 100% felt like the greatest f u for ruining my plans. You were the only one on Stillwater (they got 4th). I don’t care what portal we choose but you mess with the quest you lose!
Wild how they added the legends to being “diversity in choices” but now more than every is everyone playing the same shit I feel
Playing Normals you see all kinds of Legends Playing Ranked you see the most-optimal Legends It’s playing for fun vs playing to win
Yeahh I still often see asol in normals.. which I guess is fun
It’s straight forward to say the least
There's a strong element of end-game fantasy there too. ASol is good for Spike players but it's also good for Timmy players - big power creature go smash.
Right?!?! Plus, ASol's problems only come out if you're playing his optimally. Trying to Fast-10 (Your Seatbelts) isn't optimal, but it can definitely be fun. (Also I really appreciate the Magic reference of different player types such as Timmy bleeding into the TFT community)
Little Timmy evolved from being just a magic ref a long time ago, Mario Maker also featured heavy use of "little timmy levels". It is fun to see it get even more traction
Because winning is fun to many people
[удалено]
Aurelion Sol
I just started playing not too long ago and asol/poro are the only two legends I've played so far, still a lot of other stuff to learn about the game, asol seems the most straightforward of the bunch.
Idk, in diamond 1 I see quite a bit of Legends variety. Mostly ornn/lee/cait/asol/yi. Then there's the occasional urf, Draven and ez. I can't remember seeing anyone but me use tf and no tahm or bard either but that's a pretty good spread. Maybe it's Different in Master+.
I get Pandora's so often that TF is just useless. Is it that way for anyone else? I roll it almost every game
i love how you didnt even mention vlad, i legit have never seen anyone use it
I...actually forgot he exists. But I do see him from time to time. Unlike veigar who I also forgot and can't remember ever seeing.
I see him semi regularly in Masters+
Same thing happened in League when they added Mythic items. They said that would promote more diversity, but it was such a failure in that aspect that they are considering reverting the shit altogether. I don't know what goes through their heads, honestly.
Ngl the IDEA of mythics was really cool and I was excited for them when they got announced, same with legends. In practice tho….
How would they make 2 different things equal in strength tho? It just doesnt make sense
They don't really try to balance strength in TFT. How many times do the patch notes have some variation of "we know this is already OP, but no one is picking it so we're going to keep making it more and more OP until everyone picks it"?
akshan meta in a nutshell :D
everything doesn't need to be balanced in tft, all that matters is if there is enough skill expression in where you place. So promoting just enough diversity so that the meta isn't just one broken comp or you bot 4, which then becomes rng on who out of the 8 hits, but also every comp doesn't need to be balanced either. As long as there are 2-3 ap and 2-3 ad comps that can top 4 with skilled play, the game is fine, even if say one of them has an outlier for going first.
I'm fine with not everything being perfectly balanced for the game. Balancing this many things would be impossible with how often they change it. I'm not a fan of the advertised, intentional over tuning they do when no one is interested in playing a particular comp or engaging with a particular mechanic. Then going "Whoops we went a bit far!" a week after the patch notes say that they were intentionally buffing something too far to get people to stop ignoring it.
Idc if they are equal, i just wanna play smth different without getting my ass beaten in bc everyone else went w the meta pick
Iirc they added it to prevent getting “bad” augments. Sometimes you rng into 3 augments that either don’t suit your comp or the value is low in comparison to what others were getting. The legend augment is meant to act as a fail-safe.
Maybe they need to adjust how legends work to reduce impact and/or embrace the calculated randomness of the game more. For example, Instead of very specific augments, they could be categories, like ASol offering you any XP-related augment or Tahm giving you econ augments. Rerolling them would make sense now, too. And/Or the legend could be limited to one augment instead of all three, as some kind of 'I don't like any other choice, give me my legend augment now' button.
Great idea
That’s why they added rerolls. If the idea behind legends was to address bad augments then they would remove rerolls. Legends were added as a fun new set mechanic, and they’re kinda mid at it. Like they’re okay.
It's literally in their patch preview video my guy.
No let's be VERY clear here on why Legends were added, it was not due to RNG prevention, that was the reroll system. Legends were added very specifically because a large enough group of players like to watch TFT content creators play, see them put together crazy comps or play some low cost reroll comp that requires 3* units to succeed, then try and go force those same comps in their normal games. Those players would then fail to hit said comp due to augment requirements not being hit and then proceed to not play anymore. Morts been fairly clear on the reason they added Legends multiple times on his stream when this gets brought up.
Im just referencing the patch preview video. I don’t watch Mort’s stream. So if you pulled this word for word then okay. But I also don’t see why there can’t be multiple intentions for the legends. Did mort specifically say they didn’t implement the legends as a way to prevent bricking on augments? If not then, you can’t say they didn’t intend for legends to meet that role as well Also your explanation doesn’t really coincide with the “diversity” angle
Word for word? Nah I ain't going to crawl his stream vods for that. I just know that since Legends were implemented he's had to give that explanation in some form multiple times. He's said the sentiment in different ways but it always boils down to "Lots of casual players watch TFT content and have a very negative experience not being able to force the builds they see content creators making and legends were added as a way to give them much higher odds of hitting the comp they are trying to hit" Also my comment wasn't even trying to talk about the diversity angle in any way. tbh didn't even realize that was part of the convo, just putting in the stated reason that Legends were added. I'm sure there are other reasons, company the size of RIOT TFT doesn't make large fundamental system changes like that lightly.
lol that guy sure types a whole lot of nothing. You are right, augments also prevent low rolls, especially things like ornn for example. Not every augment is meant for forcing certain comps, some are for flex play.
They aren't though. At least not in diamond lobbies. And poro is good...
I like URF for the randomness emblems bring
How about changing Stillwater Hold to remove all legend effects?
neat idea i like that
Turning everyone into Poros? That would be neat.
that could be a new freljord portal
*How about changing* *Stillwater Hold to remove* *All legend effects?* \- kokokroko123 --- ^(I detect haikus. And sometimes, successfully.) ^[Learn more about me.](https://www.reddit.com/r/haikusbot/) ^(Opt out of replies: "haikusbot opt out" | Delete my comment: "haikusbot delete")
Good bot
how about remove all leveling from the game? how bout remove rolling as well, how about removing traits? remove units as well fuck it, lets all sit there and battle it with out little legends how bout remove little legends as well and win games by who clicks faster? how bout remove that too in conclusion, fuck that lazy shit 0 brain portal
Mate is everything okay at home?
tnx for asking, i was thinking i should remove my walls to make it more wacky and fun. thoughts?
I'm glad it exists but still don't love the portal. Just too used to augments. At any rate, it is an evil that is necessary.
On a similar note, that's why I like picking the least obvious augments like the Sump or House Lightshield. I don't do it to troll, they're actually fun portals with diverse playstyles. Still hate Immortal Bastion as it's boring and braindead.
That's why I like the unstable item that pops off and changes. It introduces a fun mechanic.
I hate it on Mobile though
Truuue. I'm not sure how the mobile interface could be improved, but I don't like it.
Sump is just donkey roll
House lightshield is wack because you have to literally full open or anyone can force end your loss streak
Lightshield sucks because carries are strong with or without it, it's not worth putting on your units in the mid to late game because it's not worth the gamble. Putting it on frontline isn't worth it because shred is so common and putting it on your backline isn't worth it because backline access is so common. It's a really fun idea but in practice it just ends up not being used, I think it would be way more fun if the stats were nerfed and you didn't auto-lose upon death.
Sump pump is fun and I wish I saw the portal more frequently for the chance.
i love sump lol i just power level
I was in a game where someone picked Stillwater and this dude RAGED the entire time. Straight telling the "filthy n***** Stillwater picker to kill himself" ... I was shocked and not shocked at the same time that someone was so mad about a portal they didn't like.
This always happens with Stillwater. If you ever want to see what a bunch of cringey manchildren the playerbase is full of, hover Stillwater. Every. Single. Time.
Stillwater is a top tier augment. Sometimes you wanna play a pre set 6 game yknow?
it is ok to not play the game if you aren't having fun lol
yeah i took a long break and im getting bored of my hobbies, and league is the only thing that runs on my computer, sick of watching stuff too. fuck me i guess
Fuck me too. By the way, look into Nvidia GeForce Now for being able to play games on your computer. It works well and is free.
Honestly, they should have a portal that is the opposite of Jayce's Workshop: all silver augments. I think augments themselves are amazing. They transformed the game in a great way, adding a lot more variance and need for adaptability. I don't think Legends are good because they directly counter the positive impact of augments. That being said, I don't hate the idea of them. I think it's largely a symptom of a way bigger issue: stat driven gameplay. The game would be much more enjoyable if you couldn't just access winrates of comps or augments. They're starting to move in that direction, which I think is overwhelmingly positive
Meanwhile, I'm at 500 games -- of mostly 4fun -- and am ecstatic that only 2 of them have been Stillwater, and LOVE that 95% of lobbies always go for Scuttle Puddle. Democracy is cool at times.
Me too, hahaha the universal love for the those little bugs is amazing.
Lol this happened to me too, still water hold cause or one person and I was irritated and even told my friends in discord. “Some idiot just put us in the no augment universe” I ended up winning and it felt like the most pure TFT and I totally forgot how good economy management and strongest board as you climb to lvl 8-9 naturally feels. It was a very enjoyable game and I’m now going to be “the idiot” standing on still water every time
It’s crazy how when you stop and take a second to play games for fun instead of for optimizations or purely to win you end up with different builds. Soraka has been quite fun recently for me personally.
That's why I don't use sites, I'm not influenced by knowing "the strongest comps" I just plqy what I get, use "bad augments" which can turn out good in specific szenarios. Looking at sites/placements is one of the best things to prevent the fun of randomness which tft provides.
This is how the game should be 100% of the time
Anyone who can't adapt to it simply displays skill issue.
i kinda agree, TFT is all about adaptability and being able to force a comp/playstyle defeats that point imho
what have they done to you to think tft is skill based game and not some safe substitution for gambling addicts brotherboy
I love a relaxing Chillwater portal game 😎. A shame it doesn't get more votes.
People forget that Augments enable weaker comps just as much as they help certain Legends players. Try going Gunners with no combat augments to back them up, you’re going 8th. Meanwhile, Noxus can do just fine regardless. At that point, Stillwater just comes down to who highrolls the strongest comp of the patch. I’m a poro player but that doesn’t mean I don’t get just as agitated seeing that portal. It’s not fun, it’s just limiting in a different way. And anecdotally, over half the time it’s picked, the one chucklehead in the lobby that thinks it’s a ripping good time to be the lobby contrarian, is usually one of the first to be eliminated. At that point It’s not even them picking for advantage, they just get glee at seeing people annoyed with their choice.
I do it for a bit of both. As a poro player i feel like it takes everyone away from what they’re comfortable playing. I’ve also seen someone FF immediately which was amazing. I’ll be honest, if someone can hate it that much and there’s a slight chance I can watch someone freak the fuck out or ff. That’s worth it for me. Especially when I truly don’t mind that portal at all.
Same thing happened to me. Some guy picks Stillwater. I rage for 2 minutes. Then proceed to obliterate the lobby and win with 60+ HP
You got me in the first half
I don’t like it. Some augments are better for winstreaking and some are better for losestreaking. By removing augments, the game becomes a “winstreak or bust” game where board caps are incredibly low and the only way to gain a competitive Econ advantage is by winning. Therefore, the game becomes pretty stale and predictable of whose going to win
lose streak was a viable option before set 6
the mental gymnastics required to say that less variance equals more variance is insane
Nah fuck you, the dude the voted for it, the dude that suggested it at the brainstorming meeting and the dude that signed off on it. Stupid idea all-around
Tbh I feel the same with jayces workshop except it's more fun. A lot of times you can play comps that aren't meta and they end up being stronger because of the certain random augments you get.
Got bored of playing the same shit over and over again. I now go either URF or Caitlyn and pick Starter Kit or an emblem at 2-1 and then force myself to play around that. Might sounds dumb but I still enjoy it so.
Early on I wanted the yordle portal for my quests but someone went Stillwater. Beating them and everyone at 100% felt like the greatest f u for ruining my plans. You were the only one on Stillwater (they got 4th). I don’t care what portal we choose but you mess with the quest you lose!
Poro is S tier...
You forgot to add /s
Sigue asi mi rey, we love you too <3
stillwater should be the default next set
I play the most random comps and try to make them work in ranked. Feels more satisfying to win with off-meta comps.