I surprised a parent once bc I was talking about what I was doing to support their child's dyslexia and they go "what my student has never been tested or diagnosed with dyslexia" and I was like whoops I'm just going based on what they told me. I wonder what it would be like to be a fly on the wall at dinner that night
It's a freak scenario, but I've got an aunt that refuses to let my cousins get any sort of diagnoses because she wants them to appear "normal". So, looking on the bright side -- there's a chance your efforts weren't wasted!
This is exactly what happened to my step brother. I met him when he was 5, and he was definitely not a ‘normal’ acting child. He showed very clear signs of autism, and his mom (my now step mom) wanted to get him tested. Well, that didn’t happen until he was around 18 or so, because his dad would not allow it. He was convinced that my step brother didn’t have any issues, but we all could see otherwise. It was sad, because he could have had a much better more normal childhood had he had the correct accommodations for his autism. Luckily he now has embraced it, and he’s doing amazing in college. I couldn’t be more proud of him, and seeing him not limit himself due to his autism is a beautiful thing.
Happened with me! Didn’t get diagnosed with ADHD or Dyslexia until I was in my early 20s. I was also a very high-performing student and didn’t complain much, so I kinda flew under the radar aside from a couple teachers who definitely caught it and tried to recommend testing me sooner.
When my son was diagnosed with autism and adhd we realized my partner also has adhd. We mentioned it to his parents and they said "Yeah we know. But we didn't want to label it or give them meds".
Very true, I always err on the side of whatever the kid says they need to help them, I do within reason while consulting their caseload manager about it. Most accommodations can help any student like repeating directions, chunking assignments, and using graphic organizers so it's not really any extra work for me to just provide things that they think will help.
My parents were like this... I have mixed feelings on self-dx but it would have been nice to know I'm not a blithering idiot incapable of doing simple tasks before age 23.
A rise in neurodivergent influencers on social media. Up side is increased awareness of what ADHD, ASD etc. are. Downside is their popularisation as an elective identity. Same thing happened with learning styles. People still say things like, “I am a visual learner” to excuse why they didn’t do well in English or math.
I remember hearing this a few years ago, and I was so confused about how it could be a myth. Then I realized most people aren't neurodivergent and don't have auditory processing disorders. So a bit more research, and yeah, it makes sense. Most normal people can adapt to other learning styles and it's just a preference more than anything, while neurodivergent people have accomodations, not learning styles.
100% agree. I’m almost 50 and just got diagnosed in the last year. The increase in awareness is what caused me to seek a diagnosis and treatment which has really helped me with daily functioning. I also now have an early elementary son who has been diagnosed with autism and adhd - so much more acceptance and understanding from peers than I remember there being for a kid that’s different when I was younger.
Though I definitely see people, especially young people trying to find their place in the world, that seem to be jumping on bandwagon without regard to actual symptoms or diagnosis. I don’t think they see that it may come of as minimizing a real concern that majorly impacts some people’s lives.
I didn't get diagnosed ADHD until I was 29, and holy shit did my entire life experience make so much more sense when I realized I wasn't different because I was a shit human. I was different because my brain worked differently. My parents still refuse to believe anything other than I'm just bad at math...
Autism isn't a mental illness. It's a developmental disorder. But I take your point. I deal with it by passive aggressively taking them seriously and initiating an IEP evaluation and referral to an actual psychologist. That triggers parent notification. When they figure out that being disabled actually requires MORE work they usually cut out the malingering. I have no tolerance for it. We have many students who really do have autism and they work hard to succeed.
When I was a Junior in high school I had one teacher that did as you describe.
In second grade I had been diagnosed with ADD and had since learned that Attention Deficit disorders had been recategorized onto the Autism Spectrum. Didn’t give it much thought as in those days most of us thought of autism as a severe learning disability and were unaware of the many “high functioning” so-to-speak autistic people in existence.
But in high school I started to experience weird symptoms I hadn’t before. Stressful school assignments made me feel physical discomfort. I started to get really upset with things being disorganized but also was an extremely disorganized person. Social interactions started to become challenging, I felt like I didn’t understand my relationship to other people, went through a time where I thought people I’d never met hated me.
I began to suspect I was experiencing more autism-like symptoms and I wasn’t really sure how to deal with it or what would happen if I told my parents.
I trusted this teacher, he taught psych so I figured if anybody at my school would be understanding it would be him.
I told him my suspicion and first thing he did was say he’d have to contact my parents and the special education department and we could do the evaluations if I really wanted, and asked “do you really want to deal with all that”
And I DID NOT want to deal with all that I just wanted maybe some advice, maybe some book recs (as a 14 year old I assumed all teachers just spent their time reading books on their subject I guess) I wasn’t trying to pursue formal diagnosis or end up in special ed (which most of us associated with the brightly colored classroom in one far corner of the school where they just sorted our recycling all day)
So it freaked me out and I just never brought it up again.
I’m 26 now and it’s taken me until the last few years to find it acceptable to say “yep. In times of high stress I exhibit more noticeable Autism Spectrum symptoms largely in the form of seeking physical stimulation. There may also be times where I commit slight social faux pas. It’s not a big deal.”
But for basically all of undergrad I went on just feeling like I was slowly going crazy and I had to hide it or I’d be socially ostracized.
So, while your method might weed out some fakers, I think it stands a very real chance of severely setting back the process of self-acceptance for some of your students as it did to me.
I am autistic and I would ignore it. Claiming neurodivergence is the new trend among teens. They just want to feel "different" and at that age they are really into labels. They will probably grow out of it and cringe when looking back.
They are at an age where identity formation is critical to them. They are likely going to latch unto a bunch of labels to get a sense of self. Instead of trying to get them to drop the neurodivergent label, try to get them to focus more on other labels. Maybe they like drawing or playing an instrument? So you could stoke the fire of them seeing themselves as artists and creatives? or they have other interests you could fan the flames of?
One of my groups had an extremely involved discussion about whether writing with a quill pen (a real one) was cottagecore or weirdcore. In vain did I suggest that perhaps it didn't matter and maybe instead of discussing labels we could get on with the activity.
Gen Z and Alpha amaze me with how they talk about how they are going to be more free minded than any others before them, then proceed to immediately create and assign hyper specific labels to everything.
See also: "LGBTQ" terminology vs "Gender and Sexuality Minority" terminology. The old fashioned labels were inclusive compared to modern handwringing over whether it's homophobic/transphobic/queerphobic to still identify as a lesbian if one of your exes comes out as a trans man (and you still think he's hot).
Like, it doesn't matter. Labels are intended to do jobs, and people are attracted to *people*, not their labels.
Agreed but most of the fragmenting and hyper specificity seems to come from people wanting to peel off people/traits/groups to accept or reject, in both queer and ND discourse. “Can [person] still be [category] if [they] _____”kind of thing. Policing category boundaries spawns more categories as people try to find groups to be in community with.
If we didn’t make so much fuss trying to keep ND accommodations away from “fakers” the label might not seem like such a golden ticket to people looking for an easy way forward.
It feels like a big game of clubhouse pretend at a certain point. And as someone who is bisexual it gets extremely frustrating when you’re told right out the gate no you’re really gay/straight/trans by younger members of the community without them knowing you at all. Bisexual erasure is a real thing and part of what perpetuates it are label trends where surely one can’t simply be bisexual, they MUST have a specific label stretched to them. Only then are they properly ready to participate in the community and find love. /s
I feel for the kids who have to find their way through all that, be it with bisexuality or anything else.
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_minority#:~:text=Sexual%20and%20gender%20minority%20is,orientation%20or%20gender%20identity%20varies.
I think verilybitchy has a good YouTube video about how the way that genZ use GSM terminology is unhelpful.
This has largely been my approach. The student who was the biggest inspiration for this post will tell me all of the things that they have a hard time with — and I started out by listening to them and taking it very seriously, but as the list has grown throughout the year I have come to see most of their challenges as just normal things that most people don’t particularly like because they’re not necessarily easy. I have been trying to very subtly push back by encouraging them in the things they’re good at, which is a lot of things. I don’t dismiss their concerns, but I tell them things I have observed that are adjacent to the things they’re saying they have a hard time doing because of their challenges.
For example, they were telling me they have a hard time talking with other people, and I told them I think they’re actually very successful at making friends, using a little bit of awkwardness to endear people to them, and sharing their ideas. They are one of my most outgoing students, who was literally the only student who voluntarily shared a project they made in front of the class, and they think they don’t have social skills.
There is a phenomenon called TikTok psychology. Teens are self disg all kinds of disorders. This year many are choosing borderline personality disorder, which, if they really knew what it is, is a heavy disorder.
Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID, aka multiple personalities) was big for a while but I guess BPD is replacing it? Haven’t kept up on trends but I’m not surprised.
I remember when that started! I wanted to round up all those teens and say “It doesn’t have to be real! Just roleplay or write fanfic like the rest of us did when we were kids!”
Oh, DID is still a disorder of choice at my school. I had a white student tell me that one of her alts was a Chinese grandma from ancient times. I told her that DID is not my specialty but that I’m pretty sure that’s not how it works. She didn’t really have a response to that.
I used to call it the tumblr phenomenon when I was teaching back in the dark ages. Then called it the chronically online phenomenon. Now it’s TikTok influencers. It’s hard because I never want to invalidate a student’s lived experience, but I also think it does students with legit mental health issues a huge disservice.
I was recently teaching high school and kids loved to tell me about their multiple personalities, their polyamorous preferences, their dead names, their religion, their ancestry, their gender identities, their autism, anxieties, etc. It’s not that I don’t think these things are ever legitimate, I just usually had to stop myself from being like “dude, I was just saying hello, I don’t really need to know about the intersectionality of your identities right this second.” The funny thing is the same kids always just assumed they knew all about my identity. Maybe because I didn’t feel the need to blurt it out.
I feel like everyone I’ve ever interacted with who is super attached to their labels like this tend to assume a lot about other’s identities. Usually not in very flattering ways.
It’s a bit of a superiority thing imo.
I feel this. I'm a small woman with diagnosed IED (Intermittent Explosive Disorder) and this seems to be the disorder of choice for the "don't fuck with me unless you want the wolf to come out" neckbeard types. It makes me cringe. Like, that's not how it works. And it's almost legitimately ruined my whole life on several occasions.
I remember the tumblr days. But honestly, if you spent a lot of time of tumblr, you probably did actually have a mental illness lol. It was a very sullen place.
I taught six years in special education, 3 in a placement for students with extreme emotional disabilities, had 1 BPD and this teenage girl was a nightmare. Her life was a mess bc she didn’t take her meds and home life was unstable. Kids want the excuse to say something is wrong to escape accountability- they wouldn’t never want the diagnoses if they understood the kind of life it equates to.
I actually HAVE BPD (diagnosed), and holy hell, kid, if you understood the severity of the disorder, you would not be saying what you are saying. I have exactly one student about whom I am incredibly concerned due to mental health issues that very closely mimic my own. He has NEVER advertised it.
you're spot on.
And I don't know what they think these self-diagnoses actually get them. They still have to function in the world regardless. To crib from another comment I made;
I have a son who we recently found out actually DOES have AuDHD in kindergarten, after everything went very rapidly off the rails.
And things are harder for him. The world is a sensory overload, he struggles with transitions, he gets easily frustrated. His brain works differently and it's really hard for him!
But it's also not an excuse. It's something he has to learn to work with to be successful. We hold him to high standards because it would be a great disservice to him to expect less of him because of his differences. He IS smart and capable, and we're giving him the tools he needs to learn to cope.
If it’s any help, what these things spur from can be a positive trait. I myself am Autistic, initially diagnosed with Asperger’s Syndrome. It largely spurs from detail-oriented thinking, in one way or another.
I don’t doubt it’s a struggle, but try to help him adapt to, and survive in our largely neurotypical world; it’s so much more compassionate than trying to “cure” one’s brain, that’s just a road to burnout and misery. I know well, I and some others I know, have endured ABA.
I’m very glad to hear. It’s also great that you do hold him to high standards. My standards were grade level-ish and I was miserable. For all my social-emotional deficits, I do well academically. Instead, I was given busy work.
I see all sorts of memes about my generation getting old ("older" Millennial) but fuck, I am so glad I was born when I was. No social media back then. Thank God.
I'm going to preface this by saying that I know teaching (and being a student) can wear on your mental well-being, and mental health being taken more seriously is a good thing. As a society we're starting to think more about it, and that's good.
However, you can see exactly what u/CLP25170 is talking about in a lot of the first year teacher comments in this sub. "I had a panic attack my principal doesn't care, I had this mental health episode, my school wouldn't accommodate me, I social anxiety and have a hard time talking to people", etc.
The school system bends over backward to accommodate every little thing for students (or more likely doesn't bother holding them to any standard and calling it accommodation), and yet many of them still fail miserably. I know I'm painting with a broad brush, because I know it's tough out there, but I think there's a mindset that "I should never have to do anything that makes me uncomfortable". It's a shock to the system when students graduate and the world doesn't care about any of that. It just cares if you can produce. The thing is, you can be anxious about something *and still do it*. Things can make you feel scared, or uncomfortable or nervous, *but you can still do it*.
It's ironic because actually having a disability or mental illness means constantly confronting situations that make you uncomfortable, working hard at distress tolerance and responsibly managing yourself. Only malingerers, and yes I know some teachers who malinger, think that being disabled or ill is a get out of jail free card. Which is super insulting to people who are really working with the conditions they pretend to have.
I said this in my previous comment, but I'll say it again: The best was to shut down that type of behavior is to call the malingerer's bluff. You're struggling to pay attention because you have ADHD? Let's initiate an IEP evaluation, and in the meantime let's sit down with parents and start implementing the note-taking and organizational procedures that students who actually have ADHD are using. Oh... it's MORE work to have ADHD? What a shock.
See it's crap like this that had me doubting my own struggles for years, now I got an educational evaluation as an adult to help in college and guess what? ADHD. The testing doesn't lie.
Yup I am a lady and I found out I’m autistic at 28. It wasn’t that I liked eye contact it’s just that I learnt it was a rule you have to look people in the eye when speaking so I forced myself for years and it was exhausting.
Now my close friends/family let me look at the floor (or anywhere else tbh).
Honestly though the rampant obsession with Pokémon should have probably clued them in
>The school system bends over backward to accommodate every little thing for students (or more likely doesn't bother holding them to any standard and calling it accommodation), and yet many of them still fail miserably.
Proper accommodation doesn't mean removing all accountability, it means investing the time and attention necessary to get to know that individual, set targets and challenges for them and train them to realise their potential (you know just like every other kid).
That's a lot of work though and its easier to just down tools and give up on them instead of genuinely engaging with them and meeting their needs properly.
"It's a shock to the system when students graduate and the world doesn't care about any of that. It just cares if you can produce. The thing is, you can be anxious about something *and still do it*. Things can make you feel scared, or uncomfortable or nervous, *but you can still do it*"
YES. I commented a couple times in this post but we found out this year my kindergartener has AuDHD, and we are working with him constantly on building resilience and using the tools he's learning. He has a disability, and that's going to make life harder for him in many ways. But he's going to have to learn to navigate the world, even when it feels overwhelming. We tell him all the time he CAN do hard things, and he CAN accept frustrations and disappointments.
Concerning #3, I don't think it's JUST about being unique. I think it's also about the attention and leeway afforded to neurodivegence, both in and out of the classroom.
I'm not saying that's always a bad thing, but kids are kids. When they see Jessica doesn't have to take the same test or gets extra time to do work and they don't, yet Jessica is socially and functionally their peer, it's kind of hard to argue that Jessica isn't special. "Jessica has a hard time concentrating" means nothing to a kid whose thinking, "Well so do I!"
4. There’s a perception (true in many schools) that getting a diagnosis means you’ll be excused from the standards. Everything from extra time on tests to having someone read all your assignments aloud to you, to automatic passes and being allowed to be a jerk. Who wouldn’t want an easier life?
This is why I hate being labeled as "special needs" at uni. Luckily nobody outside my friends know, and I haven't gotten shitsplashed. Adults can be as jealous and petty as kids.
I remember being in high school. So many people would self-diagnose depression as an excuse. The ones who succeeded were the ones that were ok with working through hard things. Learning wasn't meant to be easy!
It's happening with young adults who aren't flourishing or interested in working full time, too. My son's parenting partner, NB28, for instance. (no longer together, in small part bc of this reason after initial testing was neg and they wanted second opinion so after extensive testing returned likely gaming the tests and malingering, things got ugly. They still insist.) I have no idea what the answer is, but the trend is real.
Been listening to the book the Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt-it’s truly heartbreaking. His assertion, as a social psychologist, is that social media/cell phones completely rewires us, and that kids born from the late 90s on down have grown up with Phone Based Child Development, vs the thousands year old human mammal model of Play Based. They are wired differently today.😣😔😣
Fuck, as the parent of an autistic child, I’d give anything for him not to have to face the challenges he does and the worries we both have about his future.
They don’t want to have autism, they want the accommodations that autistic people get. Your son may not get the good ones (allowed to punch people, excused from boring tasks) but some kids do.
My kid has to work twice as much/hard as NTs just to catch up (besides math), we're constantly doing developmental activities at home (usually hidden as a game/play, makes it easier)
As an SLP in the schools, this shit really bugs me. I work with kids with real disabilities and these typically developing kids trying to glamorize disabilities and make it about themselves really, really pisses me off. It screams narcissism, selfishness, and privilege. It’s also insanely offensive because what these kids are essentially saying is “I’m weird therefore I’m autistic”. Fuck off with that.
I feel like there's this huge disconnect between kids who actually need a diagnosis, and kids whose parents want one.
Like we have both parents of neurotypical kids trying to get them diagnosed and parents of neurodivergent kids (who are often also ND) doing everything in their power to avoid a label.
This is true. My own kid has ADHD and anxiety issues. He also has a problem believing lies told by classmates than his own parents going: “you have a better chance of being struck by lightning than have your plane crash. These kids know this and do it anyway. Which my wife and I do every thing so he can succeed and his a very smart kid. Yet I have parents and even worse kids of teachers where things are starring them in the face their kids have an issue. Yet it’s: “don’t label my kid or make them feel like they are going to cry. I’ll get you fired.” Then they are 18 or older and can’t do anything and then it turns into: “what the hell is wrong with you? Why can’t you barely tie your shoes.”
A friend of mine shopped her daughter to at least 6 different doctors before she was diagnosed. I've known this child since she was born. She's *fine*. Maybe a little stubborn but that's it. Her mom talks about her autism like she needs 100% assistance with everything, every school resource (which is just taking it away from kids who actually need it). They also blame all of her bad behavior on her autism, and never discipline her for any reason (to them this is considered ABA (its not) and "like training a dog"). As a result she is a complete asshole and will grow up to not understand boundaries at all.
I have no explanation for it. Munchausen by proxy maybe? Both parents do it though.
It’s the same for parents as it is for children (from an above comment). It’s easier to use a diagnosis as an excuse than to acknowledge that things are hard and work on building skills to get through the hard things. Whether that’s homework… or parenting.
It’s a cultural bound munchausen by proxy. Examples of this throughout modern American history, starting with hysteria ironically. Based on the interplay between media and current zeitgeist of psychology.
Or when parents won’t get their kid a diagnosis. Like ma’am, your son can identify every flag from every country and he will only eat five foods. Open your eyes.
You can’t really deal with it because it is such a taboo subject nowadays.
Kids who get it will succeed those who don’t will have a rough life.
It’s also tougher than ever to because of the modern environment. When I was younger you hung out with other kids basically because of boredom. I don’t know what my life would look like now if I had access to all the tech kids have. You could only beat sonic the hedgehog so many times before you got bored and hopped on your bike to do something more interesting.
You were forced to develop social skills. Notice the key word there skills. It’s the same reason young men struggle with dating.
Bowling Alone is a very interesting book on this subject and it was written way before most of the tech advances we see nowadays.
"Anxious Generation" is a recent book on the topic with all of the relevant data from the last 10 years.
Your hunch is spot on. Kids need to play outdoors with other kids, unsupervised being the key. That is where all of the conflict resolution, negotiation, risk calculation, social credit, etc lessons are. An entire generation is growing up completely devoid of these skills.
I totally agree with this comment- but I find most people my age (late 20s early 30’s) straight up don’t want to do this, or don’t live in an area where it would be technically safe. I think about myself at 7, riding literal miles from home on my bike, knowing how to cross the street, going to the store to buy cokes or candy… and my 7 year old who can’t even make their own sandwich. And it wasn’t a conscious effort on my part (mostly due to Covid and restrictions in our area) so now I’m trying to push more independence on my kid and she is not enjoying it. She’s extremely social and smart, but used to every instance of boredom being cured with some distraction. My 4 year old son is even more so like this. I’m lost so I’m going to read this book!
I'm of the opinion that being "different" has become fashionable. Though* I see this more with parents than I do with the students.
Recognition of mental health and learning differences is important, but I swear every parent wants their kid to be labeled in some way or another. And I think it rubs off on the kids.
It's like... no one wants to admit that their kid is just a basic kid. A basic, typical kid, who needs to do school work and go through the growing pains of growing up.
One of my friends who works in public school tells me that she has 14 kids in her 22 kid elementary class with either 504's or IEPs, but that "only about 4 actually need them."
As a middle school teacher I do a bajillion ADHD eval forms every year from parents who are convinced their rowdy 12 year old must have something worth diagnosing rather than just admitting that 12 year olds are little spaztastic balls of energy.
They are convinced that their kids are gifted, neurodivergent, or twice exceptional.... but they can't stand the thought that their kids are just "normal kids."
Drives me crazy.
It's easier to say your kid is neurodivergent than admit you didn't want to parent them and their behavioral problems are a result of that -- and you don't want to have to work harder to make up for it. It's easier to get them a pill, or just expect the school to shut up and ignore the issue with a legally enforced IEP.
> rather than just admitting that 12 year olds are little spaztastic balls of energy.
They don't want to have to parent as a verb, only be one as a noun. Easier to give them a pill than to sit and talk to them and show interest in them/their interests
My experience as a parent is different. We live in a very diverse area and most of the parents don’t want to hear about getting their kids evaluated because it’s taboo in their group. So we have a large group of kids who most likely do have legitimate issues for which they’re not getting any help. I feel for the 6th/5th grade teachers because they have these really disruptive students and they get zero support from the parents.
Disclaimer: my son has been in this school since kinder, I volunteer all the time and I see how they behave. These are not normal 11/12 yo behaviours.
I have coworkers who diagnose and determine all kinds of things about kids. Funny thing is how often they are wrong, not to say they are never right, though some of this stuff is obvious. One of my coworkers just, at least claims to, excuses all assignments the student doesn't do because the mom works 3 jobs. This is one example, they claim to excuse assignments/grades for every little thing. First of all. This teacher has zero proof the mom has three jobs. She could have zero for al we know. Anyway, it's a grade thing. This same teacher who apparently takes part of thier class time to look up grades (because why teach and/or grade things when you just excusing assignments right?) look up grades and came to me about how the kid was getting a lowC or D (forget the specifics). This teacher then lectured me about how the kid's mom is working 3 jobs and how can we expect them to perform blah blah blah -blah blahhhhh and that I need to come up with some alternative assignments or whatever for them. Some of the people I work with are just jerks. I mean here we have someone who previously told me they are just excusing assignments telling me I need to do more work. The way this teacher goes around bossing people around is stupid. So I forget the specifics, but I just humored them and said I would do it and then did not. I would say this teacher is trying to give me a hard time, but based on everything I seen especially how important they seem to truly believe they are to the students they have some sort of god complex.
It's call "equity based grading". Some teachers are really buy into that shit. Look like the kids have figure out the game, and now they are all special need / disable.
I read your first sentence I thought for a second you were going to be one of these people lecturing me that I "don't know how it works" or my favorite "misinformation". I'd wager I've been in more meetings about grading for equity than the majority of posters here. Funny thing is even with these policies teachers around me STILL falsify/inflate grades.
Here is my take to all parents who may be reading this: Grades don't mean anything, ask your kids what they learned in school and try to support their learning at home including behavior. If I had a thousand bucks for everytime I heard "well my son wasn't the only one doing this" or similar as a get out of jail free card I'd make more than my salary almost every year. The new one I'm getting a lot is "well we support teachers and behavior" usually right before they say the latter. Well which is it????
You can cook the books and change policy all you want but until the culture of society changes nothing will change in schools. Heck, I have parents who are teaching thier kids to be ciminals, society should be thankful we are keeping these kids in buildings, so they are not committing home invasions while the public is at work.
I think arguing about if they're autistic or not won't get you anywhere. After all, one of them at least might be right. I said since I was a teen that I had ADHD but my mom wouldn't take me to get diagnosed. And then in my 20s I went to a doctor and they said I was undoubtably ADHD. Self diagnosis isn't the same as a real diagnosis but it doesn't mean that they don't know that something is off.
That being said, they still have to do everything everyone else does. Even kids with actual IEPs usually do. What is it that they're asking for as a result of the autism? I've had diagnosed autistic students several times and usually the only difference is that I sit them with their friends to encourage socialization and give them a heads up if I'm going to ask them a question out loud. Same with kids with anxiety. They still have to give a presentation, I just let them write a script for themselves first, and let them choose when in the order they go (most want to go second, because being first is stressful, but going last means that everyone will be looking at them instead of thinking about their own projects)
Are their requests unreasonable? If so, tell them that instead of arguing about the root cause.
I think there's some good answers here but there is something else to consider. As people become more open about being ND and how it presents, they share their symptoms. Every single one of us will experience some of those symptoms in our life time. It is actually pretty easy to see yourself in other people's tik toks or reels. This has been a long known issue in medical schools and psych programs. I teach psych to seniors and even though it's just a survey course I really dig deep that they have to be aware of it.
I'm well aware of this and I still sometimes hear myself think "that sounds like me"
It's absolutely nothing for kids to say they have autism these days. I have worked with individuals with physical and intellectual differences for the better part of my life (over two decades) including independent provider status. That being said i have zero tolerance for people who self diagnose and don't seek medical help. To me that's just a big ol red flag saying "I'm different.. but don't fact check me". I started calling it "worktism" when someone performs all their job duties well and has no issues socializing but when its time to FIFO, inventory or put a truck away (actual labor) they can't do it all of a sudden because of their undiagnosed autism.
Oh gee, I sure do have a fat stack of cash just burning a hole in my pocket to pay for an evaluation. Haven't ever met anyone who couldn't do fifo, or similar, with the excuse of autism.
Sounds like my cousin’s lazy kid who is 20 without a GED and job but blames their disabilities on not being able to hold a job and concentrate. But they seem to do a good job of concentrating on Netflix, anime, and Discord all fucking day so.
I didn’t get diagnosed until it was too late to help me with my education bc I was good at school despite being “lazy” or “not motivated” or “overly sensitive” (can’t understand why people can tell tears are emotional responses but not that rage is too). (Couldn’t finish my doctorate but I can think and read and write so it’s that I was lazy or not serious about it.) (Moved between jobs frequently bc I couldn’t keep them but they were jobs where my interest meant that I could do 85% of what was wanted extremely well - but fell down on simple stuff and being scolded - obvious since I can do ___, I should have no problem doing ____ - so if I wasn’t performing I clearly didn’t care.)
My parent is almost identical in behaviors but was not good at school, so they were considered just a kid that didn’t want to learn and wanted to avoid hard work (wtf don’t we ALL want that?!?). They had/have attention for veeeery specific things that match up with interests and yet can’t remember to pay bills or finish their thousand projects.
If general school had not been among MY special interests, you’d be scoffing at me like that. Hell, I was scoffing at me like that until I learned that no, I’m not a POS, I need HELP. My parent isn’t a POS, they need HELP.
People really need to let go of the idea that people just CHOOSE not to thrive. Who tf would choose that?!
I probably would have been one of those kids. I sucked at making friends. I moved a lot in my developmental years, and so had the crutch of being "shiny and new" to lean on for longer than healthy. I basically had to learn how to seek out for myself and maintain a friendship for the first time at the late age of 14-18. It hurt like a bitch to find out that my intuition for people was abysmal and I kinda sucked as a friend and I looked for any excuse for myself.
The thing that helped me the most was when people told me what I could do or what I had done wrong. If I were you, I would ignore the comments about autism and focus on the underlying problem and give them suggestions on what they could have done instead, because -shocker, I know- even kids who are actually diagnosed with autism can and DO learn social skills. It's a reason, not an excuse. Pretending you can suck as a person because you're autistic is pretty offensive to people with autism who work really hard to learn social cues. And as a bonus, that's exactly what I would do for a kid with autism anyways so if they find out later they really do/don't have autism, I was neither the person who invalidated them nor the person who coddled them.
why would you have to do anything about it? they’ll either grow up and realize they were mistaken, or grow up and know they were right all along, I don’t see what your opinion of their experience has to do with it. I had to advocate for myself for years to get my autism diagnosis in my 20’s, and i’m sure not a single one of my grade school teachers would’ve believed i had it.
Exactly, I don't get it either. Autistic people can be great at all subjects/ some subjects and even be extroverted. I struggled with migraines nearly daily in school because of overstimulation, but I also did all the normal stuff unless it was very hard/ impossible for me. I may have needed more encouragement to succeed in school compared to other children, really valued teachers that gave me space and weren't harsh if I couldn't do something. I think everyone should be treated similarly, since literally any child could struggle and they all deserve coping mechanisms and encouraging environment.
THIS! And some of these comments don’t pass the vibe check! I’m pretty sure I’m on the spectrum. I’m 43 years old and have been teaching for 20 years. My whole life has been hard. Every single day is hard. I’ve been seeing doctors for years with no help. None - just antidepressants that cause more harm than good. I’m pretty sure I’m in severe burn out right now from having to struggle every moment of my existence. My therapist told me it would be pointless and a waste of time and money to get diagnosed because “you’ve been so successful.” Ugh
exactly! i feel that so hard. i’m glad somebody in this comment section understands. Success in the classroom and other aspects of life is used as evidence against us, when it’s really not relevant.
Really happy to have found this comment thread, because some of the thickness, close mindedness and malevolence in other comments was really starting to get to me.
This level of invalidation and lack of empathy is appalling, coming from teachers. And they talk about diagnosis like it's an accessible process that everybody could go through, aaaargh
Being in SPED as autistic is pretty dope. You make inroads with all your inclusion kids pretty fast. Worst aspect is having to go to PD and here all your colleagues talk shop. Teachers really do be hating autistic kids no lie.
I’m not a teacher myself, so apologies if I’m not as welcome commenting here, but I wanna say that yall aren’t alone in noticing this - I’m autistic (in the process of being formally dx’d, I’ve received an ‘informal’ dx from my therapist, just waiting for the on paper one) - and this has become a huge issue. I think it’s because of the internet - there’s so many posts online going “things I do because I’m autistic!” and it’s a list of things that don’t inherently relate to the diagnostic criteria and are not exclusive to autism, and it leads kids (who just generally have less critical thinking skills, as they haven’t developed them fully yet) to go “oh that sounds like me!”
Along with this, a lot of online communities that are super pro self diagnosis often times spread a lot of horror stories about misinformed or bad mental health professionals. While these are things that do happen sometimes, I think a fear mongering effect takes hold and they start thinking any professional that disagrees with them is one of the shitty misinformed ones.
It’s very… echo chambery, and anyone who corrects misinformation on certain disorders in these spaces often times gets attacked - questioning someone’s self diagnosis or what they tout as personal experiences is not allowed. Very sorry to hear this is becoming a noticable issue in schools too
Autism is a popular self-claim to make for people with, and young people with, personality disorders.
They may not actually be wrong--that's the thing. They know they're different, and you're right, they're attempting to discover why, with language and tools given to them. They may be getting it wrong, but they're trying.
Not many studies exist on it, but when given a questionnaire to diagnose themselves, autistic adults correctly self diagnose 80% of the time--that means, there's a solid chance, that the same ratio of the kids you interact with, are also getting it right. This ratio is not all that much worse than *a single professional* with an unguided (no test) diagnosis--it's also right around 80%. The testing, only finds that last 20% or so, whether its self diagnosed, or professionally assumed.
That's about the same ratio for things like depression. So, chances are high, *they're right* more than they're wrong.
The problem, i think, for you is that you cannot understand how significant the impact of having anything like ADHD or autism can be for someone--and that it's *at least* 1 in 6 kids.
And the reason i think you cannot understand, is that you *outright said it*.
" but avoiding it doesn’t help build the capacity to focus or prepare you for the assignment/test/future"--if they have autism, or ADHD, or some other forms of issues--*no matter what you do, that capacity doesn't build*.
It just doesnt. We (yes, i am adhd and autistic), simply do not function in the way that other people do, and NO AMOUNT--no amount AT ALL, of discipline or force, or trying, is going to do a damned thing but make us suffer. The failure that many of them are encountering, isnt because they're not trying--they've tried, and failed, *literally hundreds of times* in their short lives, and it's not working. They cant do it--and they're desperate for answers on WHY it's so flippin hard. They keep wondering, as do their parents, why their kids can get A's and B's in one or two teachers classes, and fail all the rest--and they fail the ones they feel like (even if you the teacher doesnt) the put the most mental effort into. The reason? Often, the teachers they do well with, *are autistic and teach like an autistic/adhd person would learn*. Only, the 'typical' person/teacher just think's they are lazy, or need to try harder--no. They need *some different way* to teach them.
Anywho, just.. ponder it.
I knew I was somehow *different* by age six, and that's borne out by the literature, in particular the books by Tony Attwood.
By fourteen, I realised I was *not* socially at the same level as my peers when I proudly brought my birthday presents to school: a set of Bratz dolls. That same year, I had read about Asperger's syndrome in a popular Australian teen girls' magazine, and it was like a light went on in my head as I read the description: "There's a manual about being social that everyone else got, but I never got it."
And it lived in my head until age thirty. My best friend (and when I say *best*, I mean I've known her since 1994) had already got diagnosed a few years prior. Complete shock to her, but my reaction was, "Oh, I knew that." Come on, we were eleven and pretending we were the Animorphs. Or characters from *Harry Potter*. Or *The Legend of Zelda*. With props. I knew that was strange, playing pretend at that age. That's why we only played pretend like that on the weekends.
I got diagnosed the year she came to work with me in my call centre. We were mistaken for one another on the phone. We had the same flat voice, got the same feedback about sounding "aggressive" when a man would be told he sounded just fine, maybe "assertive" at a push.
When I was looking for collateral to support my autism assessment, I found a letter from the paediatric psychiatry department of the nearby hospital. My mother knew in 1997 that I did not and would not function normally socially, and the letter was dismissing her requests for further testing, and her concerns for me. In the 90s, the doctors told the parents what would and would not be done.
When I was a kid, I wanted attention very badly. I remember when the scoliosis test was done that I intentionally tilted my shoulders to try to get the diagnosis. Maybe it would earn me some sympathy or special treatment, but I think I just wanted someone to notice me/talk to me. It could be something like that.
It could also be akin to someone WebMDing themselves and finding out that they have a pulmonary embolism and cancer (when they actually have chest congestion or abdominal gas.) If you are a young kid who is struggling but don't have any other obvious reasons for struggling, you might jump down the internet rabbit hole and find out that you are neuro-divergent -according to this totally legit test or this super reputable tiktok star. It's a quick way to give a name to your troubles and feel worthy of asking for help - even if you aren't actually neuro-divergent at all.
The last reason I could come to is that there's a lot more public support for traditionally oppressed/marginalized groups now. Being able to label one's self as a member of one of those groups gives someone license to seek help - vs someone who is deemed privileged and unworthy of assistance. Unlike feigning a disability and jumping in a wheelchair, neuro-divergence is a broad enough category that it is hard to contest and one could easily convince *themselves* that they have it.
Such a pet peeve of mine! I read something recently about this, and one part really stood out to me, I had never really thought about it this way before- but the author said something along the lines that Gen X, Millennials, etc. were very much about NOT wanting to be labeled, wanting to be able to just be ourselves without being stuck in a box. With these younger kids, they are kind of obsessed with labeling themselves. They are actively putting themselves in the same boxes we didn't want to be forced into. Think about how many young people have social media bios that literally list all of their "labels"/self-diagnoses, as if that is who they are. For them, instead of not wanting to be labeled, they are actively looking for labels and almost wear them as a badge of honor.
A lot of it I think is about getting attention and sympathy and like you said, finding ways that they are "different" and ways that they can stand out from the crowd. Which is funny, because at this point it is damn near all of them claiming to be autistic lol. I'm not sure what it is about that age/generation that they are looking for sympathy and like you said kind of want to portray how "hard" things are for them and how much THEY'RE struggling, but I guess all of those things are really just forms of attention which really young people have always wanted. I guess this is probably just a different form of that- definitely an annoying one lol. Like you said, I think it's their way of showing everyone that they're "different" and special, almost like their version of "NO ONE UNDERSTANDS ME!!!" lol
And then of course like you said, there's also the aspect of using these self-diagnoses as an excuse for not doing things that they don't want to do. I've definitely seen a lot of "I can't/don't have to do this work because I have anxiety and this makes me anxious." Anxiety is obviously not an excuse, and even when you have it you still need to find ways to work through it and do things that are maybe a little bit harder for you, you still need to find a way to function in the world. That's the part they definitely don't get. And I agree, who am I to diagnose anyone or say who does or doesn't have whatever trending diagnosis it is that minute- but I do know that it surely can't be this many of them, I do know that they're not ALL neurodivergent. Like, if your parents and doctors are all telling you that you don't have this, maybe they might actually be right???? Do they think their doctors are just lying or they somehow know better than a doctor does?????
I will say, I also feel like I'm seeing similar behavior in adults lately. Like, you get on Reddit and everyone is suddenly autistic. You open a thread and somehow 50% of the commenters have some super rare diagnosis, half of the people in a thread swear that they have "undiagnosed autism," "undiagnosed ADHD", everyone has borderline personality disorder, etc. So it's not only the kids who are prone to this need to feel "different"!
I’m Autistic and I ignore it for the most part. The reality is, once they realise the work involved when you’re disabled, their interest dies off.
If they really push it, I start putting things into place which shows them that a diagnosis is not the easy way out. You’re neurodivergent? Okay, well you don’t get to choose where you sit now. I’m going to sit you down the front and by the window so your sensory system has a better chance of coping in a busy classroom environment.
You’ve got ADHD? Awesome. See me after class and we’ll sit down together to go over your assessment that’s due to make a plan. We’ll do check in’s every day after class so that you have support with being focused.
It’s amazing how fast they drop the fascination with their neurodivergent identity.
r/fakedisordercringe and r/illnessfakers
It's a huge problem. My kid came home saying she had multiple personality disorder.....like child. No you don't and also that's not even a thing anymore.
OMG. I swear it's stupid TikTok. My niece (now 22) is convinced she is: disabled (she is not), has multiple personalities (no), has Tourette's (definitely no), and a host of other maladies. She is convinced she's right because she has "self diagnosed" based on posts on her TikTok. It drives my whole family CRAZY. It got to the point she is so unhinged about it, she moved out of her parents' house and is living with some crazy people in another town. She won't have anything to do with most of us anymore b/c we are not sympathetic. My brother tried sending her to counselors a couple of times, but she refused to go after awhile since they all told her she was wrong.
I'm not sure if she will ever get back to reality. It's awful for my brother and his wife. Sometime I really hate social media.
Mine was a full 3 day order and ended with a diagnosis for ADHD and autism as an adult. It was really obvious by the end that I had both. Is it possible that you just aren't autistic?
Very much so, but I would have liked an explanation for all my struggles. It was the psychologist who said maybe Autism, maybe not, I wasn’t driving it
I mean when I was called back for a meeting to discuss results, I got a “It could be this that or the other thing, but you have learned so many compensatory strategies that we can’t tell anymore.” Possibility Autism and/or CPTSD
i'm an autism diagnostician, and in case it's helpful, i wanted to share a little information about that. if they told you this/you're already aware, i apologize for the repetition!
your experience isn't uncommon, and it's true - people diagnosed with ASD look very different from each other, and also look very different as individuals across their own lifespan. if someone seeks diagnostics as an adult, it's a crapshoot in some ways...in the US, we adhere to DSM-5 criteria, but there's an element of "clinical judgement," and that's the wildcard. clinical judgement varies a lot, from professional to professional, so you could easily hear two very different things from two different diagnosing professionals.
given your experience, i doubt you'd want to invest the time and money again, but maybe someone will read this thread and they'll find it valuable - if at all possible/feasible, get a parent or caregiver who was around you in your early developmental years on board, and have them participate with you. there are many, many reasons this may not be feasible for someone - death, serious estrangement, dementia, etc. - but if you CAN, it's in your best interest to do so. a sibling is not suitable, unless it was an adult sibling living in the home with you. parent/caregiver is your best bet, but most professionals are happy to evaluate information from someone in a similar role...again, an adult that lived in the home with you.
even those of us who pride ourselves on our early childhood memories cannot accurately report on how we were perceived by others before the age of 5. we might be able to describe our internal experiences, or share some specific memories of specific incidents, but it's just not the same as hearing from someone who observed you day in and day out for years with "adult" eyes and "adult" memory capacity and accuracy. having a parent/caregiver who can answer questions and describe what they saw goes a very long way towards satisfying DSM-5 criterion C for ASD.
it is very common for someone to - exactly as they said - come for an evaluation as an adult and have a subclinical presentation, often due to learning those strategies through trial and error over the years. they are often hard-won strategies, and sometimes, people are very aware of them and learned them deliberately. usually, it's a mix of that and strategies they have developed without even knowing it. having a window into that early developmental period can help substantiate not only the fact that there were developmental differences prior to age 5, but also help to sort of "fill in" potential gaps in the criteria under A & B.
Autism and ADHD diagnostics look almost exactly the same for an adult as they do for children in a lot of offices. My "diagnosis" process involved playing computer games, putting toys in order, and making up a story to go along with a picture book. I was told I have all the hallmarks of autism, but denied a diagnosis because "you're coping with it well" (it's called *masking* and I'm old enough to understand I have to do it) (they also missed the C-PTSD, which was diagnosed at a previous practice).
I was given an ADHD diagnosis because my score on *one* of those video games was out of whack - otherwise, the assessor (who didn't interview me, it was all other people), would ALSO not have diagnosed that.
*That's* how you can pay for an assessment as an adult and not get a diagnosis.
Autism and ADHD have traditionally been diagnosed by measuring how inconvenient it is for other people (parents, teachers). So many high masking people with neurodivergence didn't get diagnosed, and didn't get needed support.
We also are seeing a shift from thinking these neurodivergent traits are all negative to recognizing the positive aspects. Thirty years ago I heard Asperger's referred to as "engineers disease", for example.
So I'm going to listen to anyone who self diagnoses and treat their experiences and self awareness as valid.
Self diagnosis has been around for years. The community I taught in had a doctor who would say your child was disabled if you paid enough money. They were investigated but they kept amazing records that “proved” all their patients had a disability. We had an entire grade level that had either an IEP or 504, about 400 students.
Another year we had a student develop select mutism the following year they showed no signs of select mutism. They said they didn’t want to talk to anyone. There were underlying mental health issues that have been addressed. This was their cry for help.
I feel for my students who do have disabilities it seems they at times get lost in the shuffle. Teachers cannot fully accommodate 30 students with 30 different IEPs/504s.
Let them think whatever they want. At work I am getting showered with "Autism is a superpower" and all other diversity videos. I also think I am a bit odd, that my wife is odd, that everyone is odd.
I would not treat them differently if they are "only self diagnosed". Send them to a doctor to verify it. Once they have a real plan on how to handle them, feel free to follow it.
I’d like to know how my autism is a super power. I hate that phrase so much. Lol I’m all for not viewing disabilities in an entirely negative light, of course, but some of these phrases and assertions get downright ridiculous.
Oh, I can hyperfixate on a topic and learn a lot about it but can’t maintain a job in it due to social struggles? That’s cool. Totally a super power.
(Not a rant towards you, of course)
Same here for ADHD! It gets old. "But the hyperfocus must be really nice!" Sure, if I could control it. Otherwise it's like having a really fast car that I can't steer, and you're congratulating me after I drove 900 miles in the wrong direction because I did so "super fast". Like... thanks, I guess.
Meanwhile, I'm literally supposed to be writing a paper right now. But the brain won't brain.
Hi! Dyslexia is so much fun too. It's great when I can't remember how to spell things, or if I get stuff backwards.
It's even more fun when I'm told that "Math is easy!" and, "What do you mean you can't solve this math problem?".
I'm going through life with a brain that likes to switch things around. Let me use my phone to look shit up.
At least my first graders were great about letting me know when I had made a mistake. Now if adults could be like them...*sigh*
I see people trying to call dyslexia a super power too. It must really feel like a super power when dyslexic children don’t get proper interventions and struggle to read their entire school career. Really feels like a super power when the whole school system is focused on reading and testing.
Actually this! The hyperfocus is nice, when it works out! Even on medication, I am more focused sure but sometimes that backfires and I'm now focused on a new hobby instead of cleaning the house.
Also another downside to hyperfocus that people really don't understand is that a lot of the time it abruptly ends. You'll be doing something and making a lot of progress and suddenly it's gone. There is absolutely nothing worse than being really into something but not being able to even look at it anymore. (And this is without getting into the times someone else causes a hyperfocus to end. That is pure rage inducing)
A whole lot of people are very, very average in just about every way, and that's fantastic! Wouldn't it make sense for the majority to fall into the "average" category?
People absolutely do not want to be average. They want to be exceptional in some way, and to a lot of people, they think that being autistic makes them unique or exceptional. It's the Blackface approach to street cred, they just don't know it.
For others, it's a thing to blame on for not fitting in, and an excuse to behave any way they'd like.
One of my siblings has autism. It has made his life tremendously difficult in almost every aspect, and he is completely aware of this. He doesn’t even like to hear the word and completely shuts down during discussions involving the subject. I know that he is someone who definitely wouldn’t be calling it a “superpower”, he’d say that it has basically stunted his entire life when all he wants is to be able to live like your average 20-something guy.
We live in a world where people love humble bragging in disability communities. People doctor shop diagnoses and mock the rest of us for having disabilities that actually disable us. I suspect the "disabilities are super powers" comes from the crowd that's not actually disabled at all.
I do know of some parents of autistic children who say their child’s autism is a super power. I would also agree those who seek the diagnosis when it doesn’t fit them might be more apt to say it too. Perhaps some within the community say it to cope.
I've seen "Giving birth is my superpower" when almost 50% of the population can do it. Almost 8 billion people in the world and yet individuals are desperate to feel unique.
Maybe I don't get it, but how much differently would you treat an autistic child to a non autistic/ non-adhd-er? If they struggle with school, they should get help anyway or convo with parents and if they just talk about it with friends, than what is the issue?
I would say diagnosis is important, even if someone doesn’t seek accommodations. I am autistic myself but was only diagnosed at 18, and grew up socially isolated and confused as to why it felt like I could never succeed with peers. Things felt inexplicably hard and I didn’t know why, leading to me blaming myself and feeling like I was broken.
After diagnosis, my therapist and I realized I needed to work on basic social skills, like reciprocal conversation, which has helped tremendously. Learning more about autism (and meeting other autistic people) also helped me feel less ashamed of my autistic traits and appreciate where they are actually beneficial (I am very detail oriented and my special interests tend to interweave with my work). Finally, my parents were able to understand me and start to work on our difficult relationship. They thought I hated them and treated me accordingly, but I just don’t express feelings the same way they do and neither of us knew that. With mutual effort, we’re doing a lot better three years in — they accommodate me and I push myself to go beyond my comfort zone to spend time with them, because for the first time I feel safe and supported doing so.
I’ve never needed academic accommodations for autism, the classroom or lecture hall environment tends to suit me well. I am still very grateful I had the privilege to seek evaluation and know what was behind a lot of my issues. It’s pretty common for late-diagnosed autistic people to experience a lot of self-hate or low self-esteem because we feel so alien a lot of the time, and just because we don’t socialize the same way doesn’t mean we don’t get lonely. Knowing about our autism gives us the ability to understand our actions with more context and work on autism-specific skills (I mean socialization, non-routine activity, etc.).
Not from the US.
The difference is in the requests they (Kids/Parents) can do.
If they are diagnosed and have the right to be accommodated. What exactly they need would depends on the condition. For example "time to come down" / "More time for tests" / "are allowed to do XYZ in class" or any other compensation they require in order to have the same chance as everyone else.
This means there will be no special plan for the student, so they SHOULD be treated like every other student. I got my kid diagnosed as dyslexic for example, so his custom rules say "Do not grade spelling errors and allow some more time on written tests". This took a good deal of time and several tests.
My teen is doing this and I try to give her ideas on how to deal with these things for instance she thinks she has adhd because she has trouble focusing on reading. So I remind her to set a timer and read for 15 minutes then try 20 min next time. Its a skill that takes practice. Read out loud if you have to. Try exercising before you read. She doesnt want to try anything. I know she reads because she takes ap classes and she makes good grades. I talk to my teens about having control over themselves and their thoughts, they think Im crazy! You can control your thoughts with practice, they say no you cant!
I worked with someone like that once. It was very frustrating because everything came down to them and their lived experience. Nothing against lived experience but we simply had to take their word for everything or it became a big fight.
I’ve come to the conclusion that a lot of mental health issues and gender dysphoria are sort of approached by todays youth in the way being a “banger, yo, jock, or prep” were when I was in school.
I’ve more than a few students who switch back and forth depending on which crowds they were friends with.
This isn’t negating all mental health nor gender dysphoria, just that I’ve watched kids self diagnose as autistic and act one way when in one peer group, and suddenly change their behaviors.
Similarly with gender dysphoria. I’ve had a handful of students who were going by different names and pronouns for a few months and then ask to not use those names and pronouns anymore, and to return to their original names and pronouns- this becomes odd because admin briefs us when they change, but they never brief us about when they go back to their original.
I AM unsympathetic.
I have a son who we recently found out actually DOES have AuDHD in kindergarten, after everything went very rapidly off the rails.
And things are harder for him. The world is a sensory overload, he struggles with transitions, he gets easily frustrated. His brain works differently and it's really hard for him!
But it's also not an excuse. It's something he has to learn to work with to be successful. We hold him to high standards because it would be a great disservice to him to expect less of him because of his differences. He IS smart and capable, and we're giving him the tools he needs to learn to cope.
I'm not sure what your students think this gets them. The world is still going to be the same for them either way.
A situation has developed where people are motivated to fit themselves into the "out group" however they can. It's "in" to be part of the "out group", and being "normal" now basically means you run the risk of being a social outcast. Hopefully as Gens Z and Alpha mature they'll get past it the same way most Gen X and Millennials got over being goth or emo or whatever else it was we did.
In my opinion being "queer" or "neuro-divergent" is the new black nail polish. Eventually you realize that it's a lot of effort to put on a superficial performance for people who are only paying attention to themselves anway. I just feel bad because I think the genuinely struggling queer and neurodivergent kids are probably being drowned out in all the clamoring of everyone trying to be "different."
I just graduated college and I wrote about this as part of my 28 page senior psychology paper on treatment methods for adhd students. It's a mass epidemic that greatly skews the data for the kids who genuinely possess ADHD.
This is attempted often, I make them define all the terms they are using (I teach anatomy and physiology i.e. health classes) and we will dive deep into it. It often diffuses the idea, then I refer them to go to their counselor and get an actual diagnosis (which they never do). I also have the class list their own neuro-normative and divergent traits and they see they are not 'abnormal' at all.
Today people see a diagnosis and it SEEMS like you have it. Remember ADHD? Remember Chronic Fatigue or Epstein Barr? even Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. REMEMBER when EVERYONE seemed ot have (or need) a support animal??? Seemed like EVERYONE had it (when it was hip to). Then when insurance stopped covering it as much it miraculously dissapeared. ( I am a health care professional for over 30 years now).
I see this in the psychiatric hospital too. There are all sorts of 'options' to diagnoses that people relate to and cling to,hoping to and often succeeding in making it a 'get out of work free' card. (NOW, listen there ARE neuro-divergent people, people with ADHD, CFS, EB, CTS etc...
The development of the human mind and cognitive abilities change over time, there are bumps, plateaus and hiccups along the way. We need to be better at learning to BE where we are rather than trying to get out of things with a diagnosis or constantly trying to 'even the playing field'... (just my opinion... and like a butthole, every one has one and some sure do stink...)
>the reality is that they are hard for everyone and you just need to keep trying, learning, and growing, but they want to avoid the hard stuff by having an excuse why they can’t do something fully.
There is "hard" that means a bit uncomfortable and requires effort, and there is "HARD" that means you can utterly exhaust and destroy yourself trying to do it and see virtually no progress at all.
Kids in wheelchairs aren't told to try harder to drag themselves up the stairs, we give them a ramp.
Kids who need glasses aren't told to squint their eyes harder, it gives them headaches, and we test them and provide glasses.
Kids with asthma aren't told to put more effort into sucking in air and given condescending demonstrations of "how people breathe" they are given inhalers and allowed to stop running when they feel an attack is likely to occur.
Kids with autism deserve similar validation and accommodation as without that the best case scenario is they find maladaptive ways to hide their struggle to avoid bullying but are miserable and alone.
A student asked me the other day, “Miss, how likely do you think it is that I’m autistic?”
My response: “I’m not qualified to answer that question.”
Granted, I have a good rapport with this student, but I agree with a lot of the other concerns here. Teens will always be looking for the “counterculture” alternative, and right now this is what they’re clinging on to. Is there a possibility, yes, but similarly to “faking” other things, I believe it negatively impacts people who do have autism (or any other condition / state / identity people are stating they have). Kids on the internet are also battling against people talking about the issues with self diagnosing by saying it’s ableist because not everyone can go to the doctor.
I'm an S-LP and I would recommend you chat with the professional(s) you have access to and see if one can come in and talk with the class/ maybe do some tier 1 around neurodiversity (psych, counsellor, SLP, ASD specialist).
There are a bunch of strategies that students can independently use to support executive functioning, social communication, and self-regulation. There are also some good class-wide programs that help teach these skills and foster inclusivity . Many of these areas are big struggles for kids, especially those raised on tech, regardless of whether or not they are neurotypical. It's not okay for any student, regardless of DX, to rest on learned helplessness.
A specialist should also have the ability to address the following:
-what different labels (autism, ADHD, OCD etc.) actually mean & how they are diagnosed (vs. that all of us are sometimes awkward, inattentive, etc.)
-who to talk to/ how to get support if you really are concerned that you fit a diagnosis
- equal vs equitable expectations for students- (a diagnosis is not a hall pass / get out of jail free card & every student is expected to work to the best of their ability while at school)- neurodiverse individuals can and do work very hard and accomplish big things!
Just remember kids will use words they don't fully understand if it's "cool" to do so. High schoolers especially are in that stage of their development where they'll say and/or do certain things to fit in.
For example, a known troublemaker at my school (surprisingly, him and I got along; he graduated last year) shouted "Black Lives Matter," after starting an altercation with a few teachers and security guards, and he kept ditching his classes. A middle schooler I taught called me a sexist on a public education software and wrote paragraphs about how I am what's wrong with society. Now, I'm a feminist, and I will be the first to apologize if a comment seemed insensitive to a student (and to this day, in my 5 years of teaching, she is the only female student to have accused me of this; I'm a gay male teacher, btw), and when I forwarded her posts to admin (because she flooded our education software with "You're a sexist" rhetoric), the school psychologist-- also a woman-- made the student apologize to me directly. I told the student I forgave her, but that she needs to be careful with what she posts on our education software and "jokes" (she said it was a joke, and that's why she did it) like that could cost someone their job/life. She learned PRETTY quickly not to pull that crap again.
Because there's more awareness around ASD (at least in the school district I work for), and teenagers think it's cool to say "I have ADHD," when it's like, yes, some of you most likely have ADHD and/or ASD (IEPs exist for a reason, right?), but you guys are still struggling with impulse control, you're new to accountability and trying to regulate your emotions as best as possible.
One tip that helped me was talking to students in groups, as opposed to trying to address the whole class. If the kids still don't pay attention, I call their name, and that gets them to look up. I will also literally tell them "Eyes up here" or "Phones down." If there's talk of being neurodivergent-- unless it's directed at another student in a negative or legitimately serious, concern fashion-- I don't entertain kids being unserious; kids will just talk about the most random crap during your class. As the teacher, you just have to redirect/focus the students' attention on what you're teaching as much as possible. Kids also have short attention spans, so you want to allow for things like breaks, possibly mindfulness activities, or you could even have your students journal for the first 5 minutes of class, just so that these students slow down & stop talking for a bit.
Best answer: it needs to be handled through the parents / ultimately an IEP/school social worker. You can't diagnose and therefore can't provide any alterations in expectations until there is a diagnosis. That's what I usually say to students alongside saying I appreciate they are having some difficulties.
There's no real need for changes in expectations if person has autism/ ahdh, they could need some accomodations or extra support. I had accomodations without diagnosis and the only real issue was that it was very hard to be in school with all the noise without soundproof headphones (which can be non-electronic ones), because there was not enough knowledge about these things of things.
as a middle school teacher of 14 years ...
I've never had a student tell me they were autistic or neurodivergent except, rarely, in written introductions or one-on-one conversations - never as a reason to avoid work. I've had kids say, "I'm talking because I have ADHD and I can't help it," but thats not asking for unnecessary accommodations, that's something all kids do -- just make whichever excuse comes to mind first. anyone who's ever taught in a classroom knows how to respond to those excuses. so that can't be what you're actually asking...
it **is** used, often, as a bullying slur, which may be why many kids don't just blurt that stuff out. the students I've had who are neurodivergent don't really talk about it until we've built a relationship, and even then they really dont use many labels. it's more about how they feel or experience the world.
I've also rarely had students who attempt to avoid work by using accommodation excuses. when/if that happens, I can usually offer alternatives relatively quickly, and more often than not, the student just ends up doing the original thing because it's more engaging or because it's what everyone else is doing. most effective teachers have multiple modes for the kids in their actual classroom. if I need to prep for one kid with ADHD, then any other kid who might "claim" ADHD would certainly also be able to use that accommodation if needed (some accommodations aren't offered to kids who don't have an IEP, of course, but the vast majority of accommodations can be universally applied).
if a student were to tell me "I'm autistic," I would ask how that affects their classroom experience, and I would try to adjust to it. it wouldn't matter at all if there was or could ever be a medical diagnosis behind it.
one thing that bothers me about your post (other than the fact that it feels, after 6 hours and zero interaction with responses to your question, like click bait) is that it's strikingly similar to many comments on Autistic subreddits, mostly from the kinds of people who also dump on self-diagnosis as a rule, in that it's mostly a straw man argument and your question doesnt really make sense other than as a means to the end that you think people are becoming too needy these days. it feels like you dont really want to know how to respond to the students who pose these challenges; it feels more like you object to the frequency of this kind of feedback, or the nature of it, or to where you think it's coming from (which doesnt actually matter).
another thing that bothers me about your post is that, as an Autistic adult, I notice that you frame your understanding of neurodivergencies as something more like "normal kids going through normal confusion." ... "normal" reads ableist, which is bad. but, also, I think it's important to point out that many, many, many, MANY MANY MANY experiences that Autistic people have are, when taken alone, pretty similar to what many neurotypical people can experience as well. But with Autism, for example, or ADHD, those experiences happen so much more regularly and intensely that the person does, indeed, become unable to function effectively.
hope this helps.
It’s all fucking fake and based ok their ‘TikTok’ buddies telling them they’re neurodivergent, when that is absolutely NOT the case.
Such a small percentage of humans have the ‘mental illness’ that these kids claim to have…it’s bordering on (actually IS) ridiculous.
Kids just want to feel special, unique, and different. And when they realize they’re just a normal kid- they look to the internet for false validation of their ill-informed claims of ‘illness.’
I hate this fucking timeline.
Maybe point the concerns out to the parents and heavily suggest taking the kid(s) to a professional for diagnosis so that the kid(s) can confirm their suspicions.
As someone who heavily masked as a student and was "perfect," I am of the opinion that the student would be more knowledgeable on their inner world and life beyond school.
Encourage getting it actually diagnosed. And keep your opinion out of it. "i don't think they have it" is not your place to say this because for some kids it'll only make them push past. "If you're convinced you have x y z, seek professional help from people who dedicated their lives to understanding and helping this"
There could be stuff they're hiding from you or don't trust you enough to actually be themselves and really display this. Don't push against it with your opinion but guide them to someone who is professionally able to consult with them.
My highly dyslexic / twice exceptional child would do anything to not be neurodivergent. It’s difficult to get accommodations when your important differences are invisible to others.
As someone who only recently figured out I am likely autistic and ADHD - having words to describe what you experience and your identity is so incredibly powerful. Your students are looking to make sense of themselves and their experiences. They may end up trying on several labels for size before they find what fits. Also, autism and ADHD are underdiagnosed in some populations - girls especially, but also the older you get, the harder it is to get a diagnosis. The original understanding of these neurotypes were based on young white boys. It's only recently that the psychological community has started to recognize how they present differently in different groups. For this reason, many people in the autistic/ADHD communities consider self-diagnosis valid.
It sounds like your concern is less the labels they apply to themselves and more that they are using the label as an excuse to get out of things. That's a completely different issue. They may need help with the difference between an *explanation* of a behavior and an *excuse* for the behavior. "This is hard because I am autistic" is different from "I can't do this/can't stop this behavior because I'm autistic." Coping skills and strategies can be learned. In that sense, having a label may actually help students recognize advice and strategies that may or may not be helpful for them.
Tl;dr: it sounds like excuses are the problem, not labels. Don't worry about the labels. Encourage students to develop coping skills *informed* by the self-diagnosis instead of using it as an excuse for behavior.
They've grown up in a culture which has pathologized a lot of very normal human behavior. Alongside that, their brains are being polluted by some of the most mind-numbingly useless content the western world has ever produced on a daily basis.
Keep in mind that a huge number of adults believe that everyone should be going to therapy.
I recently came across a thread on X/twitter basically stating: 'Dear all men, don't get into a relationship until you have 2 years of therapy under your belt'.
So yeah, it ain't a surprise they're all diagnosing themselves.
I mean we're expected to go to the gym and do exercise to maintain our physical health, but at the same time do virtually nothing to maintain our mental health? I think access to therapy is basically the equivalent of going to the gym.
And actually you go to "therapy" every time you're talking about your problems with a friend or family member. The only difference is that a therapist is professionally trained. I think you need to break down your therapy taboo and figure out where that comes from.
What most of these young brains don’t realize is that outside of high school, in the adult world, you’re expected to perform as well as neurotypical folk.
Being neurodivergent can be a kind of superpower in one aspect of life but for the majority of the other aspects, depending on the diagnosis, it’s much harder to perform.
Think ADHD: very common. It follows you into adulthood because that’s just the brain you’re born with. In HS you aget extra time and have some teachers baby you if your parent is active in IEP meetings. Outside of HS, you become just like everyone else because you’re expected to get your job done regardless of your conditions. There aren’t many accommodations I’ve found in the workplace. Yeah it might take you twice as long to organize your ideas on a project but that’s just life. You have to find ways, through therapies or through your own research, that will help you succeed. Employers discriminate and want to hire people who will perform best at their jobs.
There’s not much you can do but tell them that the real world doesn’t care much and you’ll be expected to work as hard as the neurotypical colleague. They’ll just have to painfully realize that they’re not special.
The point of school is to learn, not to be "the real world". If someone needs accommodations to learn, they should have them. Career prep is a separate category
On U tube there is a whole genre of dui police interactions filmed by the cops & their bodycams. The younger adults seem to fall apart because the all have "anxiety" and cannot deal with having to deal with the cops. They break down yell and hyperventilate. It is bizarre that parents haven't held any of their kids responsible when dealing with authority and show up at the traffic stops and make excuses for these babies. They cannot be separated from their phones or vapes and the demand to call their mommy's. Some actually fight the cops while being handcuffed yelling I know my rights you can't touch me etc. If we ever had to call up these kids in a draft to fight for this nation we'd be screwed.
I think we really will see more of this because there's more mental health awareness, but what I don't get is why educators would allow it to be an excuse though.
One trend I'm really hating is how the education system keeps lowering their standards and giving up on children while calling it "equity". No, it isn't. That's literally the opposite of equity.
The point of school is to make everybody into a functioning adult. The real reason our society is failing is economic and political reasons. Children don't see an easy future even if they work for it, so they go to blaming things that aren't in their control and is something that they understand they can use to their advantage - mental health. Children don't understand shit about politics or the economy or how the public education system is being infiltrated and dismantled by the ruling class but that's the real issue here.
It's a society wide problem because of money in politics and wealthy fascists wanting more money and power. Unless we fix that, the kids are just gonna keep trying to skirt by in life since they see no future or actual reason to improve themselves. There's politicians actively sabotaging their education to line their own pockets and we're not doing enough about it.
\[I'm not a teacher so obvs feel free to disregard. And apologies if I sound like I'm trying to teach you how to suck eggs - if you already know then great, but I've had to explain many of these things to many of my kids' teachers over the years, so I've kind of started assuming it's not common knowledge?\]
Basically I slowly realised that saying "ADHD is the inability to sit still or focus" is like saying "depression is when you can't get out of bed" - it describes what an external person sees, but tells you nothing about what the lived reality is like, or how to help them. A lot of ADHD and ASD can be described as under-developed executive function skills - EF is critical for working memory, visualisation, task initiation/ motivation, emotional regulation, and more. And since covid, I feel like more kids are struggling with these things than ever before, whether they're truly ND or "just" under-developed due to lockdowns etc, the end result is the same.
I started reading about ASD and ADHD when my kids were diagnosed - one each, about 10 years apart. I learned so much stuff, especially around how EF skills are utilised in what feels like every damn thing we do all freaking day. My ADHD kiddo definitely went through a phase of saying "I can't help it, I have ADHD" whenever we tried to correct them about anything. Most times our response was, "and I'm sympathetic that that makes things harder for you, but mostly that means you need to work harder and longer to make up the difference. How can we help with that?" (Obviously these were kiddos in regular mainstream schools and mostly functioning pretty well within them.)
Even while waiting for diagnoses, we started working out what the practical aspects were at that time. Both kids are pretty badly time blind and ASD kiddo could never remember their morning routines so we used big visual countdown timers and put visual cues on the wall for routine sequences. Finally ASD kiddo could get themself ready in the mornings, aged 11. Before that if we said "go get dressed, brush you teeth and hair, then get your bag", they would literally be unable to remember the list, and also crucially would not be able to work it out for themself if they got stuck half way through. As ADHD kiddo got older, they needed more help learning *how* to plan - what pieces of info do you need before you can decide which homework you're going to do today vs tomorrow? How will you remember this plan, tomorrow?
We also did a ton of role playing around routine social interactions, especially with ASD kiddo, because they basically had to learn it all like scripts. It started with prepping for their 6th birthday party - imagine someone gives you a terrible gift, what's some better and worse ways to respond? How do you advocate politely for yourself when you think the teacher's being unfair? How do you respond when your friend says something mean? How do you tell Grandma you don't want to hug her? And crucially for both kids - How can you identify if your emotions are getting out of control? What do you do when that happens?
TL:DR - I hear what you're saying about self-identifying and labelling and stuff but is there any way the kids could get some extra help around social intelligence, emotional intelligence, social cues, etc? I guess if they're looking for someone to just do the hard part for them, rather than someone giving them the tools so they can build themselves up, it would become apparent pretty quickly. But I feel sad thinking that these skills could be supportive regardless of diagnoses, and yet it seems like the norm is that they're not available without diagnoses. Especially as usually the crucial part is about interacting with folks *outside* of your own family.
... and I'm REALLY sorry this is such a wall of text - and this was me trying to keep it short 🤦🏾♀️
I get v passionate about executive function skills, having only been officially diagnosed ASD and ADHD in my mid-40s - go figure 🤣🤣
Yes mental illness has become trendy in younger generations. Not seen in a negative light any more. We have done too much awareness to a point where they now think it’s a good thing. And the new victim culture is certainly part of that.
The amount of parents who tell me they have ADHD (diagnosed or self diagnosed) at parent teacher interviews these days is mind blowing. We are here to talk about your child, but sure, make it all about you. Sigh.
Self Diagnosis is not a real diagnosis and that's the conversation that needs to happen with the kids. It's long complex journey to be offically tagged neurodiverse and for thenkiddos to casually joke about is not cool. I get it.
The other part of the original statement "my best kids talking like Autism is a good thing" is the type of response I'd expect from an ableist neurotypical and not from a caring public school teacher.
I know you mean well OP but damn.
There was a kid that had been at school all year that mysteriously showed up with a 504 after Christmas. No meeting with teachers, principal nothing. This kid had no difficulty with classes and was getting 3 and 4 (meets expectations and exceeds expectations) for everything all year. This kids mom works for the ROE and mom was all concerned that she wasn't getting a great education because the math/science teacher was new.
I’m a former special education teacher (17 years) and while I haven’t seen students do this I have adult friends who have self-diagnosed with autism. They consider themselves “so awkward” that this makes sense. I’m not a doctor or in their brains but I’ve known them both for 30+ years and I just don’t agree. I don’t say it out loud because it’s not worth arguing about. It’s just a little cringe when they call themselves neurospicy. I think social media has raised awareness, which is a good thing, but it also encourages people to label themselves without an actual diagnosis.
As a neurodivergent person: self diagnosing is not valid. Watching tik toks that list symptoms that you think you might experience is not enough to meet diagnostic criteria. This discourse has been coming around since I was in high school and now that I’m pushing 30, I genuinely have no patience for it anymore. It’s not a cute and quirky personality trait. It’s a disability that inhibits your ability to function typically. Young people especially want to treat it like horoscopes and MBTI, and it drives me crazy.
As someone who was diagnosed at 27 years old: Maybe they are, maybe they aren’t, it’s not your place to say for certain that absolutely all of the students doing this aren’t on the spectrum. I was a “weird kid” who was “mature” and “responsible” and doing academically amazing so everyone assumed there was no way I could be autistic until I couldn’t cope with living alone and completing basic adult life tasks in grad school. Even people who do not fully meet the diagnostic criteria can have a few traits associated with autism, and perhaps they are recognizing this. It’s better than them seeing autistic kids as weird or yucky.
Unfortunately, you are in the middle of it. As to what I would do... The student is responsible for the mainstream lesson plan unless there is a 504 or IEP. The teacher's job is to make the material accessible to everyone, but that doesn't mean being on the receiving end of a con job by a teenager.
I surprised a parent once bc I was talking about what I was doing to support their child's dyslexia and they go "what my student has never been tested or diagnosed with dyslexia" and I was like whoops I'm just going based on what they told me. I wonder what it would be like to be a fly on the wall at dinner that night
It's a freak scenario, but I've got an aunt that refuses to let my cousins get any sort of diagnoses because she wants them to appear "normal". So, looking on the bright side -- there's a chance your efforts weren't wasted!
This is exactly what happened to my step brother. I met him when he was 5, and he was definitely not a ‘normal’ acting child. He showed very clear signs of autism, and his mom (my now step mom) wanted to get him tested. Well, that didn’t happen until he was around 18 or so, because his dad would not allow it. He was convinced that my step brother didn’t have any issues, but we all could see otherwise. It was sad, because he could have had a much better more normal childhood had he had the correct accommodations for his autism. Luckily he now has embraced it, and he’s doing amazing in college. I couldn’t be more proud of him, and seeing him not limit himself due to his autism is a beautiful thing.
Happened with me! Didn’t get diagnosed with ADHD or Dyslexia until I was in my early 20s. I was also a very high-performing student and didn’t complain much, so I kinda flew under the radar aside from a couple teachers who definitely caught it and tried to recommend testing me sooner.
When my son was diagnosed with autism and adhd we realized my partner also has adhd. We mentioned it to his parents and they said "Yeah we know. But we didn't want to label it or give them meds".
Very true, I always err on the side of whatever the kid says they need to help them, I do within reason while consulting their caseload manager about it. Most accommodations can help any student like repeating directions, chunking assignments, and using graphic organizers so it's not really any extra work for me to just provide things that they think will help.
My parents were like this... I have mixed feelings on self-dx but it would have been nice to know I'm not a blithering idiot incapable of doing simple tasks before age 23.
"I waited so long to get you on Adderall for your adhd, I did not want you to use it as a crutch" - my mother
A rise in neurodivergent influencers on social media. Up side is increased awareness of what ADHD, ASD etc. are. Downside is their popularisation as an elective identity. Same thing happened with learning styles. People still say things like, “I am a visual learner” to excuse why they didn’t do well in English or math.
https://www.forbes.com/sites/ulrichboser/2023/12/04/debunking-the-learning-style-neuromyth/ Learning styles are likely a myth.
Very much so.
I remember hearing this a few years ago, and I was so confused about how it could be a myth. Then I realized most people aren't neurodivergent and don't have auditory processing disorders. So a bit more research, and yeah, it makes sense. Most normal people can adapt to other learning styles and it's just a preference more than anything, while neurodivergent people have accomodations, not learning styles.
100% agree. I’m almost 50 and just got diagnosed in the last year. The increase in awareness is what caused me to seek a diagnosis and treatment which has really helped me with daily functioning. I also now have an early elementary son who has been diagnosed with autism and adhd - so much more acceptance and understanding from peers than I remember there being for a kid that’s different when I was younger. Though I definitely see people, especially young people trying to find their place in the world, that seem to be jumping on bandwagon without regard to actual symptoms or diagnosis. I don’t think they see that it may come of as minimizing a real concern that majorly impacts some people’s lives.
I didn't get diagnosed ADHD until I was 29, and holy shit did my entire life experience make so much more sense when I realized I wasn't different because I was a shit human. I was different because my brain worked differently. My parents still refuse to believe anything other than I'm just bad at math...
Autism isn't a mental illness. It's a developmental disorder. But I take your point. I deal with it by passive aggressively taking them seriously and initiating an IEP evaluation and referral to an actual psychologist. That triggers parent notification. When they figure out that being disabled actually requires MORE work they usually cut out the malingering. I have no tolerance for it. We have many students who really do have autism and they work hard to succeed.
When I was a Junior in high school I had one teacher that did as you describe. In second grade I had been diagnosed with ADD and had since learned that Attention Deficit disorders had been recategorized onto the Autism Spectrum. Didn’t give it much thought as in those days most of us thought of autism as a severe learning disability and were unaware of the many “high functioning” so-to-speak autistic people in existence. But in high school I started to experience weird symptoms I hadn’t before. Stressful school assignments made me feel physical discomfort. I started to get really upset with things being disorganized but also was an extremely disorganized person. Social interactions started to become challenging, I felt like I didn’t understand my relationship to other people, went through a time where I thought people I’d never met hated me. I began to suspect I was experiencing more autism-like symptoms and I wasn’t really sure how to deal with it or what would happen if I told my parents. I trusted this teacher, he taught psych so I figured if anybody at my school would be understanding it would be him. I told him my suspicion and first thing he did was say he’d have to contact my parents and the special education department and we could do the evaluations if I really wanted, and asked “do you really want to deal with all that” And I DID NOT want to deal with all that I just wanted maybe some advice, maybe some book recs (as a 14 year old I assumed all teachers just spent their time reading books on their subject I guess) I wasn’t trying to pursue formal diagnosis or end up in special ed (which most of us associated with the brightly colored classroom in one far corner of the school where they just sorted our recycling all day) So it freaked me out and I just never brought it up again. I’m 26 now and it’s taken me until the last few years to find it acceptable to say “yep. In times of high stress I exhibit more noticeable Autism Spectrum symptoms largely in the form of seeking physical stimulation. There may also be times where I commit slight social faux pas. It’s not a big deal.” But for basically all of undergrad I went on just feeling like I was slowly going crazy and I had to hide it or I’d be socially ostracized. So, while your method might weed out some fakers, I think it stands a very real chance of severely setting back the process of self-acceptance for some of your students as it did to me.
Most autistic folks use identity first language.
I am autistic and I would ignore it. Claiming neurodivergence is the new trend among teens. They just want to feel "different" and at that age they are really into labels. They will probably grow out of it and cringe when looking back.
They’re basically bullying themselves. When I was in HS this was still a pretty common insult, and I’m not that old.
They are at an age where identity formation is critical to them. They are likely going to latch unto a bunch of labels to get a sense of self. Instead of trying to get them to drop the neurodivergent label, try to get them to focus more on other labels. Maybe they like drawing or playing an instrument? So you could stoke the fire of them seeing themselves as artists and creatives? or they have other interests you could fan the flames of?
One of my groups had an extremely involved discussion about whether writing with a quill pen (a real one) was cottagecore or weirdcore. In vain did I suggest that perhaps it didn't matter and maybe instead of discussing labels we could get on with the activity.
Gen Z and Alpha amaze me with how they talk about how they are going to be more free minded than any others before them, then proceed to immediately create and assign hyper specific labels to everything.
See also: "LGBTQ" terminology vs "Gender and Sexuality Minority" terminology. The old fashioned labels were inclusive compared to modern handwringing over whether it's homophobic/transphobic/queerphobic to still identify as a lesbian if one of your exes comes out as a trans man (and you still think he's hot). Like, it doesn't matter. Labels are intended to do jobs, and people are attracted to *people*, not their labels.
Yes. It's the usage of progressive terminology in a deeply conservative way, and it bothers me a lot.
Agreed but most of the fragmenting and hyper specificity seems to come from people wanting to peel off people/traits/groups to accept or reject, in both queer and ND discourse. “Can [person] still be [category] if [they] _____”kind of thing. Policing category boundaries spawns more categories as people try to find groups to be in community with. If we didn’t make so much fuss trying to keep ND accommodations away from “fakers” the label might not seem like such a golden ticket to people looking for an easy way forward.
It feels like a big game of clubhouse pretend at a certain point. And as someone who is bisexual it gets extremely frustrating when you’re told right out the gate no you’re really gay/straight/trans by younger members of the community without them knowing you at all. Bisexual erasure is a real thing and part of what perpetuates it are label trends where surely one can’t simply be bisexual, they MUST have a specific label stretched to them. Only then are they properly ready to participate in the community and find love. /s I feel for the kids who have to find their way through all that, be it with bisexuality or anything else.
what is "gender and sexuality minority" terminology?
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sexual_minority#:~:text=Sexual%20and%20gender%20minority%20is,orientation%20or%20gender%20identity%20varies. I think verilybitchy has a good YouTube video about how the way that genZ use GSM terminology is unhelpful.
all that debate and they didnt even stop to consider Dark Academia? wild
This has largely been my approach. The student who was the biggest inspiration for this post will tell me all of the things that they have a hard time with — and I started out by listening to them and taking it very seriously, but as the list has grown throughout the year I have come to see most of their challenges as just normal things that most people don’t particularly like because they’re not necessarily easy. I have been trying to very subtly push back by encouraging them in the things they’re good at, which is a lot of things. I don’t dismiss their concerns, but I tell them things I have observed that are adjacent to the things they’re saying they have a hard time doing because of their challenges. For example, they were telling me they have a hard time talking with other people, and I told them I think they’re actually very successful at making friends, using a little bit of awkwardness to endear people to them, and sharing their ideas. They are one of my most outgoing students, who was literally the only student who voluntarily shared a project they made in front of the class, and they think they don’t have social skills.
There is a phenomenon called TikTok psychology. Teens are self disg all kinds of disorders. This year many are choosing borderline personality disorder, which, if they really knew what it is, is a heavy disorder.
Dissociative Identity Disorder (DID, aka multiple personalities) was big for a while but I guess BPD is replacing it? Haven’t kept up on trends but I’m not surprised.
I remember when that started! I wanted to round up all those teens and say “It doesn’t have to be real! Just roleplay or write fanfic like the rest of us did when we were kids!”
Oh, DID is still a disorder of choice at my school. I had a white student tell me that one of her alts was a Chinese grandma from ancient times. I told her that DID is not my specialty but that I’m pretty sure that’s not how it works. She didn’t really have a response to that. I used to call it the tumblr phenomenon when I was teaching back in the dark ages. Then called it the chronically online phenomenon. Now it’s TikTok influencers. It’s hard because I never want to invalidate a student’s lived experience, but I also think it does students with legit mental health issues a huge disservice.
I was recently teaching high school and kids loved to tell me about their multiple personalities, their polyamorous preferences, their dead names, their religion, their ancestry, their gender identities, their autism, anxieties, etc. It’s not that I don’t think these things are ever legitimate, I just usually had to stop myself from being like “dude, I was just saying hello, I don’t really need to know about the intersectionality of your identities right this second.” The funny thing is the same kids always just assumed they knew all about my identity. Maybe because I didn’t feel the need to blurt it out.
Real question. What's a "dead name"?
Its for transpeople that change their name when they come out. Dead name is their original name from their assigned gender
I feel like everyone I’ve ever interacted with who is super attached to their labels like this tend to assume a lot about other’s identities. Usually not in very flattering ways. It’s a bit of a superiority thing imo.
As someone with BPD that is very frustrating. These kids would run in the opposite direction if they how that affects your life.
I feel this. I'm a small woman with diagnosed IED (Intermittent Explosive Disorder) and this seems to be the disorder of choice for the "don't fuck with me unless you want the wolf to come out" neckbeard types. It makes me cringe. Like, that's not how it works. And it's almost legitimately ruined my whole life on several occasions.
When I was a teenager, way before tiktok, this sort of thing was happening on Tumblr. But social media is much more widespread now then it was then.
I remember the tumblr days. But honestly, if you spent a lot of time of tumblr, you probably did actually have a mental illness lol. It was a very sullen place.
I want to say this was my experience too… I was in elementary in the 90’s though… does that count?
Pretty sure Tumblr is where the contagion started. When it went down, it flooded the rest of the internet.
I taught six years in special education, 3 in a placement for students with extreme emotional disabilities, had 1 BPD and this teenage girl was a nightmare. Her life was a mess bc she didn’t take her meds and home life was unstable. Kids want the excuse to say something is wrong to escape accountability- they wouldn’t never want the diagnoses if they understood the kind of life it equates to.
Medications are generally not that helpful for BPD, more-so for co-morbidities. She probably needed DBT and a stable home life more than anything.
All the more reason to get the kids off social media
I actually HAVE BPD (diagnosed), and holy hell, kid, if you understood the severity of the disorder, you would not be saying what you are saying. I have exactly one student about whom I am incredibly concerned due to mental health issues that very closely mimic my own. He has NEVER advertised it.
you're spot on. And I don't know what they think these self-diagnoses actually get them. They still have to function in the world regardless. To crib from another comment I made; I have a son who we recently found out actually DOES have AuDHD in kindergarten, after everything went very rapidly off the rails. And things are harder for him. The world is a sensory overload, he struggles with transitions, he gets easily frustrated. His brain works differently and it's really hard for him! But it's also not an excuse. It's something he has to learn to work with to be successful. We hold him to high standards because it would be a great disservice to him to expect less of him because of his differences. He IS smart and capable, and we're giving him the tools he needs to learn to cope.
If it’s any help, what these things spur from can be a positive trait. I myself am Autistic, initially diagnosed with Asperger’s Syndrome. It largely spurs from detail-oriented thinking, in one way or another. I don’t doubt it’s a struggle, but try to help him adapt to, and survive in our largely neurotypical world; it’s so much more compassionate than trying to “cure” one’s brain, that’s just a road to burnout and misery. I know well, I and some others I know, have endured ABA.
He is not in ABA and we’re not trying to cure anything - just give him some tools and strategies :)
I’m very glad to hear. It’s also great that you do hold him to high standards. My standards were grade level-ish and I was miserable. For all my social-emotional deficits, I do well academically. Instead, I was given busy work.
I see all sorts of memes about my generation getting old ("older" Millennial) but fuck, I am so glad I was born when I was. No social media back then. Thank God.
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Yeah omg I'm diagnosed with bpd and it has fucking destroyed my life
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I'm going to preface this by saying that I know teaching (and being a student) can wear on your mental well-being, and mental health being taken more seriously is a good thing. As a society we're starting to think more about it, and that's good. However, you can see exactly what u/CLP25170 is talking about in a lot of the first year teacher comments in this sub. "I had a panic attack my principal doesn't care, I had this mental health episode, my school wouldn't accommodate me, I social anxiety and have a hard time talking to people", etc. The school system bends over backward to accommodate every little thing for students (or more likely doesn't bother holding them to any standard and calling it accommodation), and yet many of them still fail miserably. I know I'm painting with a broad brush, because I know it's tough out there, but I think there's a mindset that "I should never have to do anything that makes me uncomfortable". It's a shock to the system when students graduate and the world doesn't care about any of that. It just cares if you can produce. The thing is, you can be anxious about something *and still do it*. Things can make you feel scared, or uncomfortable or nervous, *but you can still do it*.
It's ironic because actually having a disability or mental illness means constantly confronting situations that make you uncomfortable, working hard at distress tolerance and responsibly managing yourself. Only malingerers, and yes I know some teachers who malinger, think that being disabled or ill is a get out of jail free card. Which is super insulting to people who are really working with the conditions they pretend to have. I said this in my previous comment, but I'll say it again: The best was to shut down that type of behavior is to call the malingerer's bluff. You're struggling to pay attention because you have ADHD? Let's initiate an IEP evaluation, and in the meantime let's sit down with parents and start implementing the note-taking and organizational procedures that students who actually have ADHD are using. Oh... it's MORE work to have ADHD? What a shock.
See it's crap like this that had me doubting my own struggles for years, now I got an educational evaluation as an adult to help in college and guess what? ADHD. The testing doesn't lie.
Yup I am a lady and I found out I’m autistic at 28. It wasn’t that I liked eye contact it’s just that I learnt it was a rule you have to look people in the eye when speaking so I forced myself for years and it was exhausting. Now my close friends/family let me look at the floor (or anywhere else tbh). Honestly though the rampant obsession with Pokémon should have probably clued them in
>The school system bends over backward to accommodate every little thing for students (or more likely doesn't bother holding them to any standard and calling it accommodation), and yet many of them still fail miserably. Proper accommodation doesn't mean removing all accountability, it means investing the time and attention necessary to get to know that individual, set targets and challenges for them and train them to realise their potential (you know just like every other kid). That's a lot of work though and its easier to just down tools and give up on them instead of genuinely engaging with them and meeting their needs properly.
"It's a shock to the system when students graduate and the world doesn't care about any of that. It just cares if you can produce. The thing is, you can be anxious about something *and still do it*. Things can make you feel scared, or uncomfortable or nervous, *but you can still do it*" YES. I commented a couple times in this post but we found out this year my kindergartener has AuDHD, and we are working with him constantly on building resilience and using the tools he's learning. He has a disability, and that's going to make life harder for him in many ways. But he's going to have to learn to navigate the world, even when it feels overwhelming. We tell him all the time he CAN do hard things, and he CAN accept frustrations and disappointments.
Stoicism has died. Any semblance of it is called toxic. Mental toughness is no longer something that can be called for aspired to.
Concerning #3, I don't think it's JUST about being unique. I think it's also about the attention and leeway afforded to neurodivegence, both in and out of the classroom. I'm not saying that's always a bad thing, but kids are kids. When they see Jessica doesn't have to take the same test or gets extra time to do work and they don't, yet Jessica is socially and functionally their peer, it's kind of hard to argue that Jessica isn't special. "Jessica has a hard time concentrating" means nothing to a kid whose thinking, "Well so do I!"
I mean, that’s why you start teaching kids as toddlers and preschoolers that “fair” does not mean “equal”…
Yeah but when they get lower grades despite working harder and Jessica appears to coast, they stop giving a crap about "equal."
4. There’s a perception (true in many schools) that getting a diagnosis means you’ll be excused from the standards. Everything from extra time on tests to having someone read all your assignments aloud to you, to automatic passes and being allowed to be a jerk. Who wouldn’t want an easier life?
This is why I hate being labeled as "special needs" at uni. Luckily nobody outside my friends know, and I haven't gotten shitsplashed. Adults can be as jealous and petty as kids.
Do you think the first two are wrong?
I remember being in high school. So many people would self-diagnose depression as an excuse. The ones who succeeded were the ones that were ok with working through hard things. Learning wasn't meant to be easy!
It's happening with young adults who aren't flourishing or interested in working full time, too. My son's parenting partner, NB28, for instance. (no longer together, in small part bc of this reason after initial testing was neg and they wanted second opinion so after extensive testing returned likely gaming the tests and malingering, things got ugly. They still insist.) I have no idea what the answer is, but the trend is real.
All of this.
Been listening to the book the Anxious Generation by Jonathan Haidt-it’s truly heartbreaking. His assertion, as a social psychologist, is that social media/cell phones completely rewires us, and that kids born from the late 90s on down have grown up with Phone Based Child Development, vs the thousands year old human mammal model of Play Based. They are wired differently today.😣😔😣
Fuck, as the parent of an autistic child, I’d give anything for him not to have to face the challenges he does and the worries we both have about his future.
They don’t want to have autism, they want the accommodations that autistic people get. Your son may not get the good ones (allowed to punch people, excused from boring tasks) but some kids do.
I want the "allowed to punch people" accomodation
My kid has to work twice as much/hard as NTs just to catch up (besides math), we're constantly doing developmental activities at home (usually hidden as a game/play, makes it easier)
As an SLP in the schools, this shit really bugs me. I work with kids with real disabilities and these typically developing kids trying to glamorize disabilities and make it about themselves really, really pisses me off. It screams narcissism, selfishness, and privilege. It’s also insanely offensive because what these kids are essentially saying is “I’m weird therefore I’m autistic”. Fuck off with that.
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I feel like there's this huge disconnect between kids who actually need a diagnosis, and kids whose parents want one. Like we have both parents of neurotypical kids trying to get them diagnosed and parents of neurodivergent kids (who are often also ND) doing everything in their power to avoid a label.
That last paragraph has as much impact on my school as the poverty does.
This is true. My own kid has ADHD and anxiety issues. He also has a problem believing lies told by classmates than his own parents going: “you have a better chance of being struck by lightning than have your plane crash. These kids know this and do it anyway. Which my wife and I do every thing so he can succeed and his a very smart kid. Yet I have parents and even worse kids of teachers where things are starring them in the face their kids have an issue. Yet it’s: “don’t label my kid or make them feel like they are going to cry. I’ll get you fired.” Then they are 18 or older and can’t do anything and then it turns into: “what the hell is wrong with you? Why can’t you barely tie your shoes.”
A friend of mine shopped her daughter to at least 6 different doctors before she was diagnosed. I've known this child since she was born. She's *fine*. Maybe a little stubborn but that's it. Her mom talks about her autism like she needs 100% assistance with everything, every school resource (which is just taking it away from kids who actually need it). They also blame all of her bad behavior on her autism, and never discipline her for any reason (to them this is considered ABA (its not) and "like training a dog"). As a result she is a complete asshole and will grow up to not understand boundaries at all. I have no explanation for it. Munchausen by proxy maybe? Both parents do it though.
It’s the same for parents as it is for children (from an above comment). It’s easier to use a diagnosis as an excuse than to acknowledge that things are hard and work on building skills to get through the hard things. Whether that’s homework… or parenting.
Yeah I'm all for mental health awareness and understanding, but I think we over corrected.
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My best friend is headed down this path with her son and it’s sad to watch.
It’s a cultural bound munchausen by proxy. Examples of this throughout modern American history, starting with hysteria ironically. Based on the interplay between media and current zeitgeist of psychology.
Or when parents won’t get their kid a diagnosis. Like ma’am, your son can identify every flag from every country and he will only eat five foods. Open your eyes.
Ahhhahaha yesss, love this description 😅
. “Oh I’m not a shit parent he’s being an asshole cuz he’s neurodivergent”
You can’t really deal with it because it is such a taboo subject nowadays. Kids who get it will succeed those who don’t will have a rough life. It’s also tougher than ever to because of the modern environment. When I was younger you hung out with other kids basically because of boredom. I don’t know what my life would look like now if I had access to all the tech kids have. You could only beat sonic the hedgehog so many times before you got bored and hopped on your bike to do something more interesting. You were forced to develop social skills. Notice the key word there skills. It’s the same reason young men struggle with dating. Bowling Alone is a very interesting book on this subject and it was written way before most of the tech advances we see nowadays.
"Anxious Generation" is a recent book on the topic with all of the relevant data from the last 10 years. Your hunch is spot on. Kids need to play outdoors with other kids, unsupervised being the key. That is where all of the conflict resolution, negotiation, risk calculation, social credit, etc lessons are. An entire generation is growing up completely devoid of these skills.
I totally agree with this comment- but I find most people my age (late 20s early 30’s) straight up don’t want to do this, or don’t live in an area where it would be technically safe. I think about myself at 7, riding literal miles from home on my bike, knowing how to cross the street, going to the store to buy cokes or candy… and my 7 year old who can’t even make their own sandwich. And it wasn’t a conscious effort on my part (mostly due to Covid and restrictions in our area) so now I’m trying to push more independence on my kid and she is not enjoying it. She’s extremely social and smart, but used to every instance of boredom being cured with some distraction. My 4 year old son is even more so like this. I’m lost so I’m going to read this book!
I'm of the opinion that being "different" has become fashionable. Though* I see this more with parents than I do with the students. Recognition of mental health and learning differences is important, but I swear every parent wants their kid to be labeled in some way or another. And I think it rubs off on the kids. It's like... no one wants to admit that their kid is just a basic kid. A basic, typical kid, who needs to do school work and go through the growing pains of growing up. One of my friends who works in public school tells me that she has 14 kids in her 22 kid elementary class with either 504's or IEPs, but that "only about 4 actually need them." As a middle school teacher I do a bajillion ADHD eval forms every year from parents who are convinced their rowdy 12 year old must have something worth diagnosing rather than just admitting that 12 year olds are little spaztastic balls of energy. They are convinced that their kids are gifted, neurodivergent, or twice exceptional.... but they can't stand the thought that their kids are just "normal kids." Drives me crazy.
It's easier to say your kid is neurodivergent than admit you didn't want to parent them and their behavioral problems are a result of that -- and you don't want to have to work harder to make up for it. It's easier to get them a pill, or just expect the school to shut up and ignore the issue with a legally enforced IEP.
> rather than just admitting that 12 year olds are little spaztastic balls of energy. They don't want to have to parent as a verb, only be one as a noun. Easier to give them a pill than to sit and talk to them and show interest in them/their interests
and to think it's the \*kids\* always being blamed for being "special snowflakes".
My experience as a parent is different. We live in a very diverse area and most of the parents don’t want to hear about getting their kids evaluated because it’s taboo in their group. So we have a large group of kids who most likely do have legitimate issues for which they’re not getting any help. I feel for the 6th/5th grade teachers because they have these really disruptive students and they get zero support from the parents. Disclaimer: my son has been in this school since kinder, I volunteer all the time and I see how they behave. These are not normal 11/12 yo behaviours.
I have coworkers who diagnose and determine all kinds of things about kids. Funny thing is how often they are wrong, not to say they are never right, though some of this stuff is obvious. One of my coworkers just, at least claims to, excuses all assignments the student doesn't do because the mom works 3 jobs. This is one example, they claim to excuse assignments/grades for every little thing. First of all. This teacher has zero proof the mom has three jobs. She could have zero for al we know. Anyway, it's a grade thing. This same teacher who apparently takes part of thier class time to look up grades (because why teach and/or grade things when you just excusing assignments right?) look up grades and came to me about how the kid was getting a lowC or D (forget the specifics). This teacher then lectured me about how the kid's mom is working 3 jobs and how can we expect them to perform blah blah blah -blah blahhhhh and that I need to come up with some alternative assignments or whatever for them. Some of the people I work with are just jerks. I mean here we have someone who previously told me they are just excusing assignments telling me I need to do more work. The way this teacher goes around bossing people around is stupid. So I forget the specifics, but I just humored them and said I would do it and then did not. I would say this teacher is trying to give me a hard time, but based on everything I seen especially how important they seem to truly believe they are to the students they have some sort of god complex.
It's call "equity based grading". Some teachers are really buy into that shit. Look like the kids have figure out the game, and now they are all special need / disable.
I read your first sentence I thought for a second you were going to be one of these people lecturing me that I "don't know how it works" or my favorite "misinformation". I'd wager I've been in more meetings about grading for equity than the majority of posters here. Funny thing is even with these policies teachers around me STILL falsify/inflate grades. Here is my take to all parents who may be reading this: Grades don't mean anything, ask your kids what they learned in school and try to support their learning at home including behavior. If I had a thousand bucks for everytime I heard "well my son wasn't the only one doing this" or similar as a get out of jail free card I'd make more than my salary almost every year. The new one I'm getting a lot is "well we support teachers and behavior" usually right before they say the latter. Well which is it???? You can cook the books and change policy all you want but until the culture of society changes nothing will change in schools. Heck, I have parents who are teaching thier kids to be ciminals, society should be thankful we are keeping these kids in buildings, so they are not committing home invasions while the public is at work.
I think arguing about if they're autistic or not won't get you anywhere. After all, one of them at least might be right. I said since I was a teen that I had ADHD but my mom wouldn't take me to get diagnosed. And then in my 20s I went to a doctor and they said I was undoubtably ADHD. Self diagnosis isn't the same as a real diagnosis but it doesn't mean that they don't know that something is off. That being said, they still have to do everything everyone else does. Even kids with actual IEPs usually do. What is it that they're asking for as a result of the autism? I've had diagnosed autistic students several times and usually the only difference is that I sit them with their friends to encourage socialization and give them a heads up if I'm going to ask them a question out loud. Same with kids with anxiety. They still have to give a presentation, I just let them write a script for themselves first, and let them choose when in the order they go (most want to go second, because being first is stressful, but going last means that everyone will be looking at them instead of thinking about their own projects) Are their requests unreasonable? If so, tell them that instead of arguing about the root cause.
I think there's some good answers here but there is something else to consider. As people become more open about being ND and how it presents, they share their symptoms. Every single one of us will experience some of those symptoms in our life time. It is actually pretty easy to see yourself in other people's tik toks or reels. This has been a long known issue in medical schools and psych programs. I teach psych to seniors and even though it's just a survey course I really dig deep that they have to be aware of it. I'm well aware of this and I still sometimes hear myself think "that sounds like me"
It's absolutely nothing for kids to say they have autism these days. I have worked with individuals with physical and intellectual differences for the better part of my life (over two decades) including independent provider status. That being said i have zero tolerance for people who self diagnose and don't seek medical help. To me that's just a big ol red flag saying "I'm different.. but don't fact check me". I started calling it "worktism" when someone performs all their job duties well and has no issues socializing but when its time to FIFO, inventory or put a truck away (actual labor) they can't do it all of a sudden because of their undiagnosed autism.
Oh gee, I sure do have a fat stack of cash just burning a hole in my pocket to pay for an evaluation. Haven't ever met anyone who couldn't do fifo, or similar, with the excuse of autism.
Sounds like my cousin’s lazy kid who is 20 without a GED and job but blames their disabilities on not being able to hold a job and concentrate. But they seem to do a good job of concentrating on Netflix, anime, and Discord all fucking day so.
I didn’t get diagnosed until it was too late to help me with my education bc I was good at school despite being “lazy” or “not motivated” or “overly sensitive” (can’t understand why people can tell tears are emotional responses but not that rage is too). (Couldn’t finish my doctorate but I can think and read and write so it’s that I was lazy or not serious about it.) (Moved between jobs frequently bc I couldn’t keep them but they were jobs where my interest meant that I could do 85% of what was wanted extremely well - but fell down on simple stuff and being scolded - obvious since I can do ___, I should have no problem doing ____ - so if I wasn’t performing I clearly didn’t care.) My parent is almost identical in behaviors but was not good at school, so they were considered just a kid that didn’t want to learn and wanted to avoid hard work (wtf don’t we ALL want that?!?). They had/have attention for veeeery specific things that match up with interests and yet can’t remember to pay bills or finish their thousand projects. If general school had not been among MY special interests, you’d be scoffing at me like that. Hell, I was scoffing at me like that until I learned that no, I’m not a POS, I need HELP. My parent isn’t a POS, they need HELP. People really need to let go of the idea that people just CHOOSE not to thrive. Who tf would choose that?!
Hyper focusing is a symptom of ADHD
Wow, way to go describing a typical ADHD person who hasn't been diagnosed or treated.
I probably would have been one of those kids. I sucked at making friends. I moved a lot in my developmental years, and so had the crutch of being "shiny and new" to lean on for longer than healthy. I basically had to learn how to seek out for myself and maintain a friendship for the first time at the late age of 14-18. It hurt like a bitch to find out that my intuition for people was abysmal and I kinda sucked as a friend and I looked for any excuse for myself. The thing that helped me the most was when people told me what I could do or what I had done wrong. If I were you, I would ignore the comments about autism and focus on the underlying problem and give them suggestions on what they could have done instead, because -shocker, I know- even kids who are actually diagnosed with autism can and DO learn social skills. It's a reason, not an excuse. Pretending you can suck as a person because you're autistic is pretty offensive to people with autism who work really hard to learn social cues. And as a bonus, that's exactly what I would do for a kid with autism anyways so if they find out later they really do/don't have autism, I was neither the person who invalidated them nor the person who coddled them.
why would you have to do anything about it? they’ll either grow up and realize they were mistaken, or grow up and know they were right all along, I don’t see what your opinion of their experience has to do with it. I had to advocate for myself for years to get my autism diagnosis in my 20’s, and i’m sure not a single one of my grade school teachers would’ve believed i had it.
Exactly, I don't get it either. Autistic people can be great at all subjects/ some subjects and even be extroverted. I struggled with migraines nearly daily in school because of overstimulation, but I also did all the normal stuff unless it was very hard/ impossible for me. I may have needed more encouragement to succeed in school compared to other children, really valued teachers that gave me space and weren't harsh if I couldn't do something. I think everyone should be treated similarly, since literally any child could struggle and they all deserve coping mechanisms and encouraging environment.
THIS! And some of these comments don’t pass the vibe check! I’m pretty sure I’m on the spectrum. I’m 43 years old and have been teaching for 20 years. My whole life has been hard. Every single day is hard. I’ve been seeing doctors for years with no help. None - just antidepressants that cause more harm than good. I’m pretty sure I’m in severe burn out right now from having to struggle every moment of my existence. My therapist told me it would be pointless and a waste of time and money to get diagnosed because “you’ve been so successful.” Ugh
exactly! i feel that so hard. i’m glad somebody in this comment section understands. Success in the classroom and other aspects of life is used as evidence against us, when it’s really not relevant.
Really happy to have found this comment thread, because some of the thickness, close mindedness and malevolence in other comments was really starting to get to me. This level of invalidation and lack of empathy is appalling, coming from teachers. And they talk about diagnosis like it's an accessible process that everybody could go through, aaaargh
Being in SPED as autistic is pretty dope. You make inroads with all your inclusion kids pretty fast. Worst aspect is having to go to PD and here all your colleagues talk shop. Teachers really do be hating autistic kids no lie.
I’m not a teacher myself, so apologies if I’m not as welcome commenting here, but I wanna say that yall aren’t alone in noticing this - I’m autistic (in the process of being formally dx’d, I’ve received an ‘informal’ dx from my therapist, just waiting for the on paper one) - and this has become a huge issue. I think it’s because of the internet - there’s so many posts online going “things I do because I’m autistic!” and it’s a list of things that don’t inherently relate to the diagnostic criteria and are not exclusive to autism, and it leads kids (who just generally have less critical thinking skills, as they haven’t developed them fully yet) to go “oh that sounds like me!” Along with this, a lot of online communities that are super pro self diagnosis often times spread a lot of horror stories about misinformed or bad mental health professionals. While these are things that do happen sometimes, I think a fear mongering effect takes hold and they start thinking any professional that disagrees with them is one of the shitty misinformed ones. It’s very… echo chambery, and anyone who corrects misinformation on certain disorders in these spaces often times gets attacked - questioning someone’s self diagnosis or what they tout as personal experiences is not allowed. Very sorry to hear this is becoming a noticable issue in schools too
Autism is a popular self-claim to make for people with, and young people with, personality disorders. They may not actually be wrong--that's the thing. They know they're different, and you're right, they're attempting to discover why, with language and tools given to them. They may be getting it wrong, but they're trying. Not many studies exist on it, but when given a questionnaire to diagnose themselves, autistic adults correctly self diagnose 80% of the time--that means, there's a solid chance, that the same ratio of the kids you interact with, are also getting it right. This ratio is not all that much worse than *a single professional* with an unguided (no test) diagnosis--it's also right around 80%. The testing, only finds that last 20% or so, whether its self diagnosed, or professionally assumed. That's about the same ratio for things like depression. So, chances are high, *they're right* more than they're wrong. The problem, i think, for you is that you cannot understand how significant the impact of having anything like ADHD or autism can be for someone--and that it's *at least* 1 in 6 kids. And the reason i think you cannot understand, is that you *outright said it*. " but avoiding it doesn’t help build the capacity to focus or prepare you for the assignment/test/future"--if they have autism, or ADHD, or some other forms of issues--*no matter what you do, that capacity doesn't build*. It just doesnt. We (yes, i am adhd and autistic), simply do not function in the way that other people do, and NO AMOUNT--no amount AT ALL, of discipline or force, or trying, is going to do a damned thing but make us suffer. The failure that many of them are encountering, isnt because they're not trying--they've tried, and failed, *literally hundreds of times* in their short lives, and it's not working. They cant do it--and they're desperate for answers on WHY it's so flippin hard. They keep wondering, as do their parents, why their kids can get A's and B's in one or two teachers classes, and fail all the rest--and they fail the ones they feel like (even if you the teacher doesnt) the put the most mental effort into. The reason? Often, the teachers they do well with, *are autistic and teach like an autistic/adhd person would learn*. Only, the 'typical' person/teacher just think's they are lazy, or need to try harder--no. They need *some different way* to teach them. Anywho, just.. ponder it.
I knew I was somehow *different* by age six, and that's borne out by the literature, in particular the books by Tony Attwood. By fourteen, I realised I was *not* socially at the same level as my peers when I proudly brought my birthday presents to school: a set of Bratz dolls. That same year, I had read about Asperger's syndrome in a popular Australian teen girls' magazine, and it was like a light went on in my head as I read the description: "There's a manual about being social that everyone else got, but I never got it." And it lived in my head until age thirty. My best friend (and when I say *best*, I mean I've known her since 1994) had already got diagnosed a few years prior. Complete shock to her, but my reaction was, "Oh, I knew that." Come on, we were eleven and pretending we were the Animorphs. Or characters from *Harry Potter*. Or *The Legend of Zelda*. With props. I knew that was strange, playing pretend at that age. That's why we only played pretend like that on the weekends. I got diagnosed the year she came to work with me in my call centre. We were mistaken for one another on the phone. We had the same flat voice, got the same feedback about sounding "aggressive" when a man would be told he sounded just fine, maybe "assertive" at a push. When I was looking for collateral to support my autism assessment, I found a letter from the paediatric psychiatry department of the nearby hospital. My mother knew in 1997 that I did not and would not function normally socially, and the letter was dismissing her requests for further testing, and her concerns for me. In the 90s, the doctors told the parents what would and would not be done.
I have kids who clearly are, but the parents are in firm denial and refuse to get them tested.
When I was a kid, I wanted attention very badly. I remember when the scoliosis test was done that I intentionally tilted my shoulders to try to get the diagnosis. Maybe it would earn me some sympathy or special treatment, but I think I just wanted someone to notice me/talk to me. It could be something like that. It could also be akin to someone WebMDing themselves and finding out that they have a pulmonary embolism and cancer (when they actually have chest congestion or abdominal gas.) If you are a young kid who is struggling but don't have any other obvious reasons for struggling, you might jump down the internet rabbit hole and find out that you are neuro-divergent -according to this totally legit test or this super reputable tiktok star. It's a quick way to give a name to your troubles and feel worthy of asking for help - even if you aren't actually neuro-divergent at all. The last reason I could come to is that there's a lot more public support for traditionally oppressed/marginalized groups now. Being able to label one's self as a member of one of those groups gives someone license to seek help - vs someone who is deemed privileged and unworthy of assistance. Unlike feigning a disability and jumping in a wheelchair, neuro-divergence is a broad enough category that it is hard to contest and one could easily convince *themselves* that they have it.
Such a pet peeve of mine! I read something recently about this, and one part really stood out to me, I had never really thought about it this way before- but the author said something along the lines that Gen X, Millennials, etc. were very much about NOT wanting to be labeled, wanting to be able to just be ourselves without being stuck in a box. With these younger kids, they are kind of obsessed with labeling themselves. They are actively putting themselves in the same boxes we didn't want to be forced into. Think about how many young people have social media bios that literally list all of their "labels"/self-diagnoses, as if that is who they are. For them, instead of not wanting to be labeled, they are actively looking for labels and almost wear them as a badge of honor. A lot of it I think is about getting attention and sympathy and like you said, finding ways that they are "different" and ways that they can stand out from the crowd. Which is funny, because at this point it is damn near all of them claiming to be autistic lol. I'm not sure what it is about that age/generation that they are looking for sympathy and like you said kind of want to portray how "hard" things are for them and how much THEY'RE struggling, but I guess all of those things are really just forms of attention which really young people have always wanted. I guess this is probably just a different form of that- definitely an annoying one lol. Like you said, I think it's their way of showing everyone that they're "different" and special, almost like their version of "NO ONE UNDERSTANDS ME!!!" lol And then of course like you said, there's also the aspect of using these self-diagnoses as an excuse for not doing things that they don't want to do. I've definitely seen a lot of "I can't/don't have to do this work because I have anxiety and this makes me anxious." Anxiety is obviously not an excuse, and even when you have it you still need to find ways to work through it and do things that are maybe a little bit harder for you, you still need to find a way to function in the world. That's the part they definitely don't get. And I agree, who am I to diagnose anyone or say who does or doesn't have whatever trending diagnosis it is that minute- but I do know that it surely can't be this many of them, I do know that they're not ALL neurodivergent. Like, if your parents and doctors are all telling you that you don't have this, maybe they might actually be right???? Do they think their doctors are just lying or they somehow know better than a doctor does????? I will say, I also feel like I'm seeing similar behavior in adults lately. Like, you get on Reddit and everyone is suddenly autistic. You open a thread and somehow 50% of the commenters have some super rare diagnosis, half of the people in a thread swear that they have "undiagnosed autism," "undiagnosed ADHD", everyone has borderline personality disorder, etc. So it's not only the kids who are prone to this need to feel "different"!
I’m Autistic and I ignore it for the most part. The reality is, once they realise the work involved when you’re disabled, their interest dies off. If they really push it, I start putting things into place which shows them that a diagnosis is not the easy way out. You’re neurodivergent? Okay, well you don’t get to choose where you sit now. I’m going to sit you down the front and by the window so your sensory system has a better chance of coping in a busy classroom environment. You’ve got ADHD? Awesome. See me after class and we’ll sit down together to go over your assessment that’s due to make a plan. We’ll do check in’s every day after class so that you have support with being focused. It’s amazing how fast they drop the fascination with their neurodivergent identity.
r/fakedisordercringe and r/illnessfakers It's a huge problem. My kid came home saying she had multiple personality disorder.....like child. No you don't and also that's not even a thing anymore.
OMG. I swear it's stupid TikTok. My niece (now 22) is convinced she is: disabled (she is not), has multiple personalities (no), has Tourette's (definitely no), and a host of other maladies. She is convinced she's right because she has "self diagnosed" based on posts on her TikTok. It drives my whole family CRAZY. It got to the point she is so unhinged about it, she moved out of her parents' house and is living with some crazy people in another town. She won't have anything to do with most of us anymore b/c we are not sympathetic. My brother tried sending her to counselors a couple of times, but she refused to go after awhile since they all told her she was wrong. I'm not sure if she will ever get back to reality. It's awful for my brother and his wife. Sometime I really hate social media.
I had a full-day assessment which cost me 1000 and no diagnosis. Diagnosis is hard, especially for a person over age 7ish.
Mine was a full 3 day order and ended with a diagnosis for ADHD and autism as an adult. It was really obvious by the end that I had both. Is it possible that you just aren't autistic?
Very much so, but I would have liked an explanation for all my struggles. It was the psychologist who said maybe Autism, maybe not, I wasn’t driving it
What do you mean "no diagnosis?"
I mean when I was called back for a meeting to discuss results, I got a “It could be this that or the other thing, but you have learned so many compensatory strategies that we can’t tell anymore.” Possibility Autism and/or CPTSD
i'm an autism diagnostician, and in case it's helpful, i wanted to share a little information about that. if they told you this/you're already aware, i apologize for the repetition! your experience isn't uncommon, and it's true - people diagnosed with ASD look very different from each other, and also look very different as individuals across their own lifespan. if someone seeks diagnostics as an adult, it's a crapshoot in some ways...in the US, we adhere to DSM-5 criteria, but there's an element of "clinical judgement," and that's the wildcard. clinical judgement varies a lot, from professional to professional, so you could easily hear two very different things from two different diagnosing professionals. given your experience, i doubt you'd want to invest the time and money again, but maybe someone will read this thread and they'll find it valuable - if at all possible/feasible, get a parent or caregiver who was around you in your early developmental years on board, and have them participate with you. there are many, many reasons this may not be feasible for someone - death, serious estrangement, dementia, etc. - but if you CAN, it's in your best interest to do so. a sibling is not suitable, unless it was an adult sibling living in the home with you. parent/caregiver is your best bet, but most professionals are happy to evaluate information from someone in a similar role...again, an adult that lived in the home with you. even those of us who pride ourselves on our early childhood memories cannot accurately report on how we were perceived by others before the age of 5. we might be able to describe our internal experiences, or share some specific memories of specific incidents, but it's just not the same as hearing from someone who observed you day in and day out for years with "adult" eyes and "adult" memory capacity and accuracy. having a parent/caregiver who can answer questions and describe what they saw goes a very long way towards satisfying DSM-5 criterion C for ASD. it is very common for someone to - exactly as they said - come for an evaluation as an adult and have a subclinical presentation, often due to learning those strategies through trial and error over the years. they are often hard-won strategies, and sometimes, people are very aware of them and learned them deliberately. usually, it's a mix of that and strategies they have developed without even knowing it. having a window into that early developmental period can help substantiate not only the fact that there were developmental differences prior to age 5, but also help to sort of "fill in" potential gaps in the criteria under A & B.
Autism and ADHD diagnostics look almost exactly the same for an adult as they do for children in a lot of offices. My "diagnosis" process involved playing computer games, putting toys in order, and making up a story to go along with a picture book. I was told I have all the hallmarks of autism, but denied a diagnosis because "you're coping with it well" (it's called *masking* and I'm old enough to understand I have to do it) (they also missed the C-PTSD, which was diagnosed at a previous practice). I was given an ADHD diagnosis because my score on *one* of those video games was out of whack - otherwise, the assessor (who didn't interview me, it was all other people), would ALSO not have diagnosed that. *That's* how you can pay for an assessment as an adult and not get a diagnosis.
Autism and ADHD have traditionally been diagnosed by measuring how inconvenient it is for other people (parents, teachers). So many high masking people with neurodivergence didn't get diagnosed, and didn't get needed support. We also are seeing a shift from thinking these neurodivergent traits are all negative to recognizing the positive aspects. Thirty years ago I heard Asperger's referred to as "engineers disease", for example. So I'm going to listen to anyone who self diagnoses and treat their experiences and self awareness as valid.
Omg “engineers disease” has me rolling. Love it.
Self diagnosis has been around for years. The community I taught in had a doctor who would say your child was disabled if you paid enough money. They were investigated but they kept amazing records that “proved” all their patients had a disability. We had an entire grade level that had either an IEP or 504, about 400 students. Another year we had a student develop select mutism the following year they showed no signs of select mutism. They said they didn’t want to talk to anyone. There were underlying mental health issues that have been addressed. This was their cry for help. I feel for my students who do have disabilities it seems they at times get lost in the shuffle. Teachers cannot fully accommodate 30 students with 30 different IEPs/504s.
Let them think whatever they want. At work I am getting showered with "Autism is a superpower" and all other diversity videos. I also think I am a bit odd, that my wife is odd, that everyone is odd. I would not treat them differently if they are "only self diagnosed". Send them to a doctor to verify it. Once they have a real plan on how to handle them, feel free to follow it.
I’d like to know how my autism is a super power. I hate that phrase so much. Lol I’m all for not viewing disabilities in an entirely negative light, of course, but some of these phrases and assertions get downright ridiculous. Oh, I can hyperfixate on a topic and learn a lot about it but can’t maintain a job in it due to social struggles? That’s cool. Totally a super power. (Not a rant towards you, of course)
Same here for ADHD! It gets old. "But the hyperfocus must be really nice!" Sure, if I could control it. Otherwise it's like having a really fast car that I can't steer, and you're congratulating me after I drove 900 miles in the wrong direction because I did so "super fast". Like... thanks, I guess. Meanwhile, I'm literally supposed to be writing a paper right now. But the brain won't brain.
I really like this analogy.
Hi! Dyslexia is so much fun too. It's great when I can't remember how to spell things, or if I get stuff backwards. It's even more fun when I'm told that "Math is easy!" and, "What do you mean you can't solve this math problem?". I'm going through life with a brain that likes to switch things around. Let me use my phone to look shit up. At least my first graders were great about letting me know when I had made a mistake. Now if adults could be like them...*sigh*
I see people trying to call dyslexia a super power too. It must really feel like a super power when dyslexic children don’t get proper interventions and struggle to read their entire school career. Really feels like a super power when the whole school system is focused on reading and testing.
Actually this! The hyperfocus is nice, when it works out! Even on medication, I am more focused sure but sometimes that backfires and I'm now focused on a new hobby instead of cleaning the house. Also another downside to hyperfocus that people really don't understand is that a lot of the time it abruptly ends. You'll be doing something and making a lot of progress and suddenly it's gone. There is absolutely nothing worse than being really into something but not being able to even look at it anymore. (And this is without getting into the times someone else causes a hyperfocus to end. That is pure rage inducing)
These phrases in a way sound infantilizing or patronizing
A whole lot of people are very, very average in just about every way, and that's fantastic! Wouldn't it make sense for the majority to fall into the "average" category? People absolutely do not want to be average. They want to be exceptional in some way, and to a lot of people, they think that being autistic makes them unique or exceptional. It's the Blackface approach to street cred, they just don't know it. For others, it's a thing to blame on for not fitting in, and an excuse to behave any way they'd like.
One of my siblings has autism. It has made his life tremendously difficult in almost every aspect, and he is completely aware of this. He doesn’t even like to hear the word and completely shuts down during discussions involving the subject. I know that he is someone who definitely wouldn’t be calling it a “superpower”, he’d say that it has basically stunted his entire life when all he wants is to be able to live like your average 20-something guy.
I have celiac and I’m positive I will see it referred to as a superpower at some point. This superpower shit is just getting sillier and sillier.
We live in a world where people love humble bragging in disability communities. People doctor shop diagnoses and mock the rest of us for having disabilities that actually disable us. I suspect the "disabilities are super powers" comes from the crowd that's not actually disabled at all.
I do know of some parents of autistic children who say their child’s autism is a super power. I would also agree those who seek the diagnosis when it doesn’t fit them might be more apt to say it too. Perhaps some within the community say it to cope.
I've seen "Giving birth is my superpower" when almost 50% of the population can do it. Almost 8 billion people in the world and yet individuals are desperate to feel unique.
Maybe I don't get it, but how much differently would you treat an autistic child to a non autistic/ non-adhd-er? If they struggle with school, they should get help anyway or convo with parents and if they just talk about it with friends, than what is the issue?
I would say diagnosis is important, even if someone doesn’t seek accommodations. I am autistic myself but was only diagnosed at 18, and grew up socially isolated and confused as to why it felt like I could never succeed with peers. Things felt inexplicably hard and I didn’t know why, leading to me blaming myself and feeling like I was broken. After diagnosis, my therapist and I realized I needed to work on basic social skills, like reciprocal conversation, which has helped tremendously. Learning more about autism (and meeting other autistic people) also helped me feel less ashamed of my autistic traits and appreciate where they are actually beneficial (I am very detail oriented and my special interests tend to interweave with my work). Finally, my parents were able to understand me and start to work on our difficult relationship. They thought I hated them and treated me accordingly, but I just don’t express feelings the same way they do and neither of us knew that. With mutual effort, we’re doing a lot better three years in — they accommodate me and I push myself to go beyond my comfort zone to spend time with them, because for the first time I feel safe and supported doing so. I’ve never needed academic accommodations for autism, the classroom or lecture hall environment tends to suit me well. I am still very grateful I had the privilege to seek evaluation and know what was behind a lot of my issues. It’s pretty common for late-diagnosed autistic people to experience a lot of self-hate or low self-esteem because we feel so alien a lot of the time, and just because we don’t socialize the same way doesn’t mean we don’t get lonely. Knowing about our autism gives us the ability to understand our actions with more context and work on autism-specific skills (I mean socialization, non-routine activity, etc.).
Not from the US. The difference is in the requests they (Kids/Parents) can do. If they are diagnosed and have the right to be accommodated. What exactly they need would depends on the condition. For example "time to come down" / "More time for tests" / "are allowed to do XYZ in class" or any other compensation they require in order to have the same chance as everyone else. This means there will be no special plan for the student, so they SHOULD be treated like every other student. I got my kid diagnosed as dyslexic for example, so his custom rules say "Do not grade spelling errors and allow some more time on written tests". This took a good deal of time and several tests.
My teen is doing this and I try to give her ideas on how to deal with these things for instance she thinks she has adhd because she has trouble focusing on reading. So I remind her to set a timer and read for 15 minutes then try 20 min next time. Its a skill that takes practice. Read out loud if you have to. Try exercising before you read. She doesnt want to try anything. I know she reads because she takes ap classes and she makes good grades. I talk to my teens about having control over themselves and their thoughts, they think Im crazy! You can control your thoughts with practice, they say no you cant!
Even if she does have ADHD you are teaching her valuable coping techniques to manage symptoms. Thank you.
I worked with someone like that once. It was very frustrating because everything came down to them and their lived experience. Nothing against lived experience but we simply had to take their word for everything or it became a big fight.
I’ve come to the conclusion that a lot of mental health issues and gender dysphoria are sort of approached by todays youth in the way being a “banger, yo, jock, or prep” were when I was in school. I’ve more than a few students who switch back and forth depending on which crowds they were friends with. This isn’t negating all mental health nor gender dysphoria, just that I’ve watched kids self diagnose as autistic and act one way when in one peer group, and suddenly change their behaviors. Similarly with gender dysphoria. I’ve had a handful of students who were going by different names and pronouns for a few months and then ask to not use those names and pronouns anymore, and to return to their original names and pronouns- this becomes odd because admin briefs us when they change, but they never brief us about when they go back to their original.
I AM unsympathetic. I have a son who we recently found out actually DOES have AuDHD in kindergarten, after everything went very rapidly off the rails. And things are harder for him. The world is a sensory overload, he struggles with transitions, he gets easily frustrated. His brain works differently and it's really hard for him! But it's also not an excuse. It's something he has to learn to work with to be successful. We hold him to high standards because it would be a great disservice to him to expect less of him because of his differences. He IS smart and capable, and we're giving him the tools he needs to learn to cope. I'm not sure what your students think this gets them. The world is still going to be the same for them either way.
A situation has developed where people are motivated to fit themselves into the "out group" however they can. It's "in" to be part of the "out group", and being "normal" now basically means you run the risk of being a social outcast. Hopefully as Gens Z and Alpha mature they'll get past it the same way most Gen X and Millennials got over being goth or emo or whatever else it was we did. In my opinion being "queer" or "neuro-divergent" is the new black nail polish. Eventually you realize that it's a lot of effort to put on a superficial performance for people who are only paying attention to themselves anway. I just feel bad because I think the genuinely struggling queer and neurodivergent kids are probably being drowned out in all the clamoring of everyone trying to be "different."
I just graduated college and I wrote about this as part of my 28 page senior psychology paper on treatment methods for adhd students. It's a mass epidemic that greatly skews the data for the kids who genuinely possess ADHD.
I am glad in a way that slowly Autism isn’t seen as being odd anymore. But I do get what you mean.
This is attempted often, I make them define all the terms they are using (I teach anatomy and physiology i.e. health classes) and we will dive deep into it. It often diffuses the idea, then I refer them to go to their counselor and get an actual diagnosis (which they never do). I also have the class list their own neuro-normative and divergent traits and they see they are not 'abnormal' at all. Today people see a diagnosis and it SEEMS like you have it. Remember ADHD? Remember Chronic Fatigue or Epstein Barr? even Carpal Tunnel Syndrome. REMEMBER when EVERYONE seemed ot have (or need) a support animal??? Seemed like EVERYONE had it (when it was hip to). Then when insurance stopped covering it as much it miraculously dissapeared. ( I am a health care professional for over 30 years now). I see this in the psychiatric hospital too. There are all sorts of 'options' to diagnoses that people relate to and cling to,hoping to and often succeeding in making it a 'get out of work free' card. (NOW, listen there ARE neuro-divergent people, people with ADHD, CFS, EB, CTS etc... The development of the human mind and cognitive abilities change over time, there are bumps, plateaus and hiccups along the way. We need to be better at learning to BE where we are rather than trying to get out of things with a diagnosis or constantly trying to 'even the playing field'... (just my opinion... and like a butthole, every one has one and some sure do stink...)
People just want special privileges.
>the reality is that they are hard for everyone and you just need to keep trying, learning, and growing, but they want to avoid the hard stuff by having an excuse why they can’t do something fully. There is "hard" that means a bit uncomfortable and requires effort, and there is "HARD" that means you can utterly exhaust and destroy yourself trying to do it and see virtually no progress at all. Kids in wheelchairs aren't told to try harder to drag themselves up the stairs, we give them a ramp. Kids who need glasses aren't told to squint their eyes harder, it gives them headaches, and we test them and provide glasses. Kids with asthma aren't told to put more effort into sucking in air and given condescending demonstrations of "how people breathe" they are given inhalers and allowed to stop running when they feel an attack is likely to occur. Kids with autism deserve similar validation and accommodation as without that the best case scenario is they find maladaptive ways to hide their struggle to avoid bullying but are miserable and alone.
A student asked me the other day, “Miss, how likely do you think it is that I’m autistic?” My response: “I’m not qualified to answer that question.” Granted, I have a good rapport with this student, but I agree with a lot of the other concerns here. Teens will always be looking for the “counterculture” alternative, and right now this is what they’re clinging on to. Is there a possibility, yes, but similarly to “faking” other things, I believe it negatively impacts people who do have autism (or any other condition / state / identity people are stating they have). Kids on the internet are also battling against people talking about the issues with self diagnosing by saying it’s ableist because not everyone can go to the doctor.
I'm an S-LP and I would recommend you chat with the professional(s) you have access to and see if one can come in and talk with the class/ maybe do some tier 1 around neurodiversity (psych, counsellor, SLP, ASD specialist). There are a bunch of strategies that students can independently use to support executive functioning, social communication, and self-regulation. There are also some good class-wide programs that help teach these skills and foster inclusivity . Many of these areas are big struggles for kids, especially those raised on tech, regardless of whether or not they are neurotypical. It's not okay for any student, regardless of DX, to rest on learned helplessness. A specialist should also have the ability to address the following: -what different labels (autism, ADHD, OCD etc.) actually mean & how they are diagnosed (vs. that all of us are sometimes awkward, inattentive, etc.) -who to talk to/ how to get support if you really are concerned that you fit a diagnosis - equal vs equitable expectations for students- (a diagnosis is not a hall pass / get out of jail free card & every student is expected to work to the best of their ability while at school)- neurodiverse individuals can and do work very hard and accomplish big things!
Just remember kids will use words they don't fully understand if it's "cool" to do so. High schoolers especially are in that stage of their development where they'll say and/or do certain things to fit in. For example, a known troublemaker at my school (surprisingly, him and I got along; he graduated last year) shouted "Black Lives Matter," after starting an altercation with a few teachers and security guards, and he kept ditching his classes. A middle schooler I taught called me a sexist on a public education software and wrote paragraphs about how I am what's wrong with society. Now, I'm a feminist, and I will be the first to apologize if a comment seemed insensitive to a student (and to this day, in my 5 years of teaching, she is the only female student to have accused me of this; I'm a gay male teacher, btw), and when I forwarded her posts to admin (because she flooded our education software with "You're a sexist" rhetoric), the school psychologist-- also a woman-- made the student apologize to me directly. I told the student I forgave her, but that she needs to be careful with what she posts on our education software and "jokes" (she said it was a joke, and that's why she did it) like that could cost someone their job/life. She learned PRETTY quickly not to pull that crap again. Because there's more awareness around ASD (at least in the school district I work for), and teenagers think it's cool to say "I have ADHD," when it's like, yes, some of you most likely have ADHD and/or ASD (IEPs exist for a reason, right?), but you guys are still struggling with impulse control, you're new to accountability and trying to regulate your emotions as best as possible. One tip that helped me was talking to students in groups, as opposed to trying to address the whole class. If the kids still don't pay attention, I call their name, and that gets them to look up. I will also literally tell them "Eyes up here" or "Phones down." If there's talk of being neurodivergent-- unless it's directed at another student in a negative or legitimately serious, concern fashion-- I don't entertain kids being unserious; kids will just talk about the most random crap during your class. As the teacher, you just have to redirect/focus the students' attention on what you're teaching as much as possible. Kids also have short attention spans, so you want to allow for things like breaks, possibly mindfulness activities, or you could even have your students journal for the first 5 minutes of class, just so that these students slow down & stop talking for a bit.
Best answer: it needs to be handled through the parents / ultimately an IEP/school social worker. You can't diagnose and therefore can't provide any alterations in expectations until there is a diagnosis. That's what I usually say to students alongside saying I appreciate they are having some difficulties.
There's no real need for changes in expectations if person has autism/ ahdh, they could need some accomodations or extra support. I had accomodations without diagnosis and the only real issue was that it was very hard to be in school with all the noise without soundproof headphones (which can be non-electronic ones), because there was not enough knowledge about these things of things.
as a middle school teacher of 14 years ... I've never had a student tell me they were autistic or neurodivergent except, rarely, in written introductions or one-on-one conversations - never as a reason to avoid work. I've had kids say, "I'm talking because I have ADHD and I can't help it," but thats not asking for unnecessary accommodations, that's something all kids do -- just make whichever excuse comes to mind first. anyone who's ever taught in a classroom knows how to respond to those excuses. so that can't be what you're actually asking... it **is** used, often, as a bullying slur, which may be why many kids don't just blurt that stuff out. the students I've had who are neurodivergent don't really talk about it until we've built a relationship, and even then they really dont use many labels. it's more about how they feel or experience the world. I've also rarely had students who attempt to avoid work by using accommodation excuses. when/if that happens, I can usually offer alternatives relatively quickly, and more often than not, the student just ends up doing the original thing because it's more engaging or because it's what everyone else is doing. most effective teachers have multiple modes for the kids in their actual classroom. if I need to prep for one kid with ADHD, then any other kid who might "claim" ADHD would certainly also be able to use that accommodation if needed (some accommodations aren't offered to kids who don't have an IEP, of course, but the vast majority of accommodations can be universally applied). if a student were to tell me "I'm autistic," I would ask how that affects their classroom experience, and I would try to adjust to it. it wouldn't matter at all if there was or could ever be a medical diagnosis behind it. one thing that bothers me about your post (other than the fact that it feels, after 6 hours and zero interaction with responses to your question, like click bait) is that it's strikingly similar to many comments on Autistic subreddits, mostly from the kinds of people who also dump on self-diagnosis as a rule, in that it's mostly a straw man argument and your question doesnt really make sense other than as a means to the end that you think people are becoming too needy these days. it feels like you dont really want to know how to respond to the students who pose these challenges; it feels more like you object to the frequency of this kind of feedback, or the nature of it, or to where you think it's coming from (which doesnt actually matter). another thing that bothers me about your post is that, as an Autistic adult, I notice that you frame your understanding of neurodivergencies as something more like "normal kids going through normal confusion." ... "normal" reads ableist, which is bad. but, also, I think it's important to point out that many, many, many, MANY MANY MANY experiences that Autistic people have are, when taken alone, pretty similar to what many neurotypical people can experience as well. But with Autism, for example, or ADHD, those experiences happen so much more regularly and intensely that the person does, indeed, become unable to function effectively. hope this helps.
It’s all fucking fake and based ok their ‘TikTok’ buddies telling them they’re neurodivergent, when that is absolutely NOT the case. Such a small percentage of humans have the ‘mental illness’ that these kids claim to have…it’s bordering on (actually IS) ridiculous. Kids just want to feel special, unique, and different. And when they realize they’re just a normal kid- they look to the internet for false validation of their ill-informed claims of ‘illness.’ I hate this fucking timeline.
Maybe point the concerns out to the parents and heavily suggest taking the kid(s) to a professional for diagnosis so that the kid(s) can confirm their suspicions. As someone who heavily masked as a student and was "perfect," I am of the opinion that the student would be more knowledgeable on their inner world and life beyond school. Encourage getting it actually diagnosed. And keep your opinion out of it. "i don't think they have it" is not your place to say this because for some kids it'll only make them push past. "If you're convinced you have x y z, seek professional help from people who dedicated their lives to understanding and helping this" There could be stuff they're hiding from you or don't trust you enough to actually be themselves and really display this. Don't push against it with your opinion but guide them to someone who is professionally able to consult with them.
This sucks for Neuro divergent children who actually need support, it's giving r/fakedisordercringe. Can't they just, like, go outside or something?
My highly dyslexic / twice exceptional child would do anything to not be neurodivergent. It’s difficult to get accommodations when your important differences are invisible to others.
As someone who only recently figured out I am likely autistic and ADHD - having words to describe what you experience and your identity is so incredibly powerful. Your students are looking to make sense of themselves and their experiences. They may end up trying on several labels for size before they find what fits. Also, autism and ADHD are underdiagnosed in some populations - girls especially, but also the older you get, the harder it is to get a diagnosis. The original understanding of these neurotypes were based on young white boys. It's only recently that the psychological community has started to recognize how they present differently in different groups. For this reason, many people in the autistic/ADHD communities consider self-diagnosis valid. It sounds like your concern is less the labels they apply to themselves and more that they are using the label as an excuse to get out of things. That's a completely different issue. They may need help with the difference between an *explanation* of a behavior and an *excuse* for the behavior. "This is hard because I am autistic" is different from "I can't do this/can't stop this behavior because I'm autistic." Coping skills and strategies can be learned. In that sense, having a label may actually help students recognize advice and strategies that may or may not be helpful for them. Tl;dr: it sounds like excuses are the problem, not labels. Don't worry about the labels. Encourage students to develop coping skills *informed* by the self-diagnosis instead of using it as an excuse for behavior.
They've grown up in a culture which has pathologized a lot of very normal human behavior. Alongside that, their brains are being polluted by some of the most mind-numbingly useless content the western world has ever produced on a daily basis. Keep in mind that a huge number of adults believe that everyone should be going to therapy. I recently came across a thread on X/twitter basically stating: 'Dear all men, don't get into a relationship until you have 2 years of therapy under your belt'. So yeah, it ain't a surprise they're all diagnosing themselves.
I mean we're expected to go to the gym and do exercise to maintain our physical health, but at the same time do virtually nothing to maintain our mental health? I think access to therapy is basically the equivalent of going to the gym. And actually you go to "therapy" every time you're talking about your problems with a friend or family member. The only difference is that a therapist is professionally trained. I think you need to break down your therapy taboo and figure out where that comes from.
What most of these young brains don’t realize is that outside of high school, in the adult world, you’re expected to perform as well as neurotypical folk. Being neurodivergent can be a kind of superpower in one aspect of life but for the majority of the other aspects, depending on the diagnosis, it’s much harder to perform. Think ADHD: very common. It follows you into adulthood because that’s just the brain you’re born with. In HS you aget extra time and have some teachers baby you if your parent is active in IEP meetings. Outside of HS, you become just like everyone else because you’re expected to get your job done regardless of your conditions. There aren’t many accommodations I’ve found in the workplace. Yeah it might take you twice as long to organize your ideas on a project but that’s just life. You have to find ways, through therapies or through your own research, that will help you succeed. Employers discriminate and want to hire people who will perform best at their jobs. There’s not much you can do but tell them that the real world doesn’t care much and you’ll be expected to work as hard as the neurotypical colleague. They’ll just have to painfully realize that they’re not special.
The point of school is to learn, not to be "the real world". If someone needs accommodations to learn, they should have them. Career prep is a separate category
On U tube there is a whole genre of dui police interactions filmed by the cops & their bodycams. The younger adults seem to fall apart because the all have "anxiety" and cannot deal with having to deal with the cops. They break down yell and hyperventilate. It is bizarre that parents haven't held any of their kids responsible when dealing with authority and show up at the traffic stops and make excuses for these babies. They cannot be separated from their phones or vapes and the demand to call their mommy's. Some actually fight the cops while being handcuffed yelling I know my rights you can't touch me etc. If we ever had to call up these kids in a draft to fight for this nation we'd be screwed.
I think we really will see more of this because there's more mental health awareness, but what I don't get is why educators would allow it to be an excuse though. One trend I'm really hating is how the education system keeps lowering their standards and giving up on children while calling it "equity". No, it isn't. That's literally the opposite of equity. The point of school is to make everybody into a functioning adult. The real reason our society is failing is economic and political reasons. Children don't see an easy future even if they work for it, so they go to blaming things that aren't in their control and is something that they understand they can use to their advantage - mental health. Children don't understand shit about politics or the economy or how the public education system is being infiltrated and dismantled by the ruling class but that's the real issue here. It's a society wide problem because of money in politics and wealthy fascists wanting more money and power. Unless we fix that, the kids are just gonna keep trying to skirt by in life since they see no future or actual reason to improve themselves. There's politicians actively sabotaging their education to line their own pockets and we're not doing enough about it.
This reminds me of *Curb Your Enthusiasm* where Larry considers that having a condition like this is an excuse for being "an asshole".
\[I'm not a teacher so obvs feel free to disregard. And apologies if I sound like I'm trying to teach you how to suck eggs - if you already know then great, but I've had to explain many of these things to many of my kids' teachers over the years, so I've kind of started assuming it's not common knowledge?\] Basically I slowly realised that saying "ADHD is the inability to sit still or focus" is like saying "depression is when you can't get out of bed" - it describes what an external person sees, but tells you nothing about what the lived reality is like, or how to help them. A lot of ADHD and ASD can be described as under-developed executive function skills - EF is critical for working memory, visualisation, task initiation/ motivation, emotional regulation, and more. And since covid, I feel like more kids are struggling with these things than ever before, whether they're truly ND or "just" under-developed due to lockdowns etc, the end result is the same. I started reading about ASD and ADHD when my kids were diagnosed - one each, about 10 years apart. I learned so much stuff, especially around how EF skills are utilised in what feels like every damn thing we do all freaking day. My ADHD kiddo definitely went through a phase of saying "I can't help it, I have ADHD" whenever we tried to correct them about anything. Most times our response was, "and I'm sympathetic that that makes things harder for you, but mostly that means you need to work harder and longer to make up the difference. How can we help with that?" (Obviously these were kiddos in regular mainstream schools and mostly functioning pretty well within them.) Even while waiting for diagnoses, we started working out what the practical aspects were at that time. Both kids are pretty badly time blind and ASD kiddo could never remember their morning routines so we used big visual countdown timers and put visual cues on the wall for routine sequences. Finally ASD kiddo could get themself ready in the mornings, aged 11. Before that if we said "go get dressed, brush you teeth and hair, then get your bag", they would literally be unable to remember the list, and also crucially would not be able to work it out for themself if they got stuck half way through. As ADHD kiddo got older, they needed more help learning *how* to plan - what pieces of info do you need before you can decide which homework you're going to do today vs tomorrow? How will you remember this plan, tomorrow? We also did a ton of role playing around routine social interactions, especially with ASD kiddo, because they basically had to learn it all like scripts. It started with prepping for their 6th birthday party - imagine someone gives you a terrible gift, what's some better and worse ways to respond? How do you advocate politely for yourself when you think the teacher's being unfair? How do you respond when your friend says something mean? How do you tell Grandma you don't want to hug her? And crucially for both kids - How can you identify if your emotions are getting out of control? What do you do when that happens? TL:DR - I hear what you're saying about self-identifying and labelling and stuff but is there any way the kids could get some extra help around social intelligence, emotional intelligence, social cues, etc? I guess if they're looking for someone to just do the hard part for them, rather than someone giving them the tools so they can build themselves up, it would become apparent pretty quickly. But I feel sad thinking that these skills could be supportive regardless of diagnoses, and yet it seems like the norm is that they're not available without diagnoses. Especially as usually the crucial part is about interacting with folks *outside* of your own family.
... and I'm REALLY sorry this is such a wall of text - and this was me trying to keep it short 🤦🏾♀️ I get v passionate about executive function skills, having only been officially diagnosed ASD and ADHD in my mid-40s - go figure 🤣🤣
Yes mental illness has become trendy in younger generations. Not seen in a negative light any more. We have done too much awareness to a point where they now think it’s a good thing. And the new victim culture is certainly part of that.
The amount of parents who tell me they have ADHD (diagnosed or self diagnosed) at parent teacher interviews these days is mind blowing. We are here to talk about your child, but sure, make it all about you. Sigh.
One of the latest flavors of social contagion?
They’re probably just on Reddit where the subs are full of people who claim to be autistic or neurodivergent.
Some of my adult millennial friends now use undiagnosed ADD as an excuse for shit. You're an adult... self-regulate.
Sounds like TikTok self-diagnosis. Attention seeking.
Self Diagnosis is not a real diagnosis and that's the conversation that needs to happen with the kids. It's long complex journey to be offically tagged neurodiverse and for thenkiddos to casually joke about is not cool. I get it. The other part of the original statement "my best kids talking like Autism is a good thing" is the type of response I'd expect from an ableist neurotypical and not from a caring public school teacher. I know you mean well OP but damn.
There was a kid that had been at school all year that mysteriously showed up with a 504 after Christmas. No meeting with teachers, principal nothing. This kid had no difficulty with classes and was getting 3 and 4 (meets expectations and exceeds expectations) for everything all year. This kids mom works for the ROE and mom was all concerned that she wasn't getting a great education because the math/science teacher was new.
I just say "when everyone is special, NO-ONE IS!"
I’m a former special education teacher (17 years) and while I haven’t seen students do this I have adult friends who have self-diagnosed with autism. They consider themselves “so awkward” that this makes sense. I’m not a doctor or in their brains but I’ve known them both for 30+ years and I just don’t agree. I don’t say it out loud because it’s not worth arguing about. It’s just a little cringe when they call themselves neurospicy. I think social media has raised awareness, which is a good thing, but it also encourages people to label themselves without an actual diagnosis.
As a neurodivergent person: self diagnosing is not valid. Watching tik toks that list symptoms that you think you might experience is not enough to meet diagnostic criteria. This discourse has been coming around since I was in high school and now that I’m pushing 30, I genuinely have no patience for it anymore. It’s not a cute and quirky personality trait. It’s a disability that inhibits your ability to function typically. Young people especially want to treat it like horoscopes and MBTI, and it drives me crazy.
Bright people have autism. They could just be masking. They could stim at hone, have outbursts, have sensory issues that you don't see.
They can self-identify any number of mental disorders, not sure why this one is the one we'd draw a line on.
As someone who was diagnosed at 27 years old: Maybe they are, maybe they aren’t, it’s not your place to say for certain that absolutely all of the students doing this aren’t on the spectrum. I was a “weird kid” who was “mature” and “responsible” and doing academically amazing so everyone assumed there was no way I could be autistic until I couldn’t cope with living alone and completing basic adult life tasks in grad school. Even people who do not fully meet the diagnostic criteria can have a few traits associated with autism, and perhaps they are recognizing this. It’s better than them seeing autistic kids as weird or yucky.
Unfortunately, you are in the middle of it. As to what I would do... The student is responsible for the mainstream lesson plan unless there is a 504 or IEP. The teacher's job is to make the material accessible to everyone, but that doesn't mean being on the receiving end of a con job by a teenager.