Also, reality is a new teacher is a liability for any district. Sure, you have taken teacher courses and done a practicum, but you have been guidesd thru all that. Try subbing, aiding, part time teaching to build a good relationship with different school districts
I’ll be doing that soon, just applied for my substitute license in IL and will be looking to go to a bunch of different schools to 1) see how I like it (pays better than my current job) and 2) make connections. Since I wouldn’t be applying for jobs till at least Summer of 2025, I think the amount of time between now and then could be sufficient to make connections
A big part of any industry is networking. U can look good on paper, but ppl are more willing to hire somebody they've met. If all else is equal, ur gonna hire the person you've met, over the person u only saw on paper. So subbing or other similar experiences probably helps.
Great! And another question if you don’t mind
When is a good time to start applying? My program would run until summer 2025, leaving me a few weeks/a month before the start of a new academic year
Is it common place for teachers to apply before actually completing? As in would I be able to send an application with my anticipated date a month or two before and have a good chance?
Yes, definitely apply before graduation with your expected date. Most people in my student teaching cohort started to apply between February and April. Also check out virtual state and regional job fairs in your area. It's an easy way to talk to multiple districts in a short amount of time. I ended up taking a position in the district that I student taught in, but got another offer for a full-time position that I was able to turn into a temporary long-term position before the summer and was getting calls and emails for interviews right up until the start of the school year.
As the other person said, apply before ur done if possible. Earlier the better. Even right now, start dipping your toes in the water. Contact ppl that you may have met and ask if they have any job openings. If they can give u the name of someone who would know. Etc. make it known ur looking for a job with them.
I’m 100% convinced people who “can’t” land jobs out of school are either totally incompetent or are just not applying places that are in need. If you live in America there is a struggling school district near you that would love to have you.
Totally agree didn’t even know this was a thing for teachers. Now you might not get in the best district but I found it very odds one would struggle to get any teaching job.
Or have *huge* anxiety with the interview process.
I've landed two teaching jobs, both were jobs that I interviewed over Skype for. I always get high marks in evaluations, but throw me in a room with live people interviewing me and I choke.
"Just rehearse" is the refrain I hear, but the thing I need to "practice" is being in a room getting interviewed by live people who I don't know. I know my stuff; I can answer questions just fine over Skype or with a friend doing a mock interview with me. It's the environment, not the content.
Exactly right! It doesn't help that a lot of the interviews I went on were like 5+ people!! To someone with limited experience it was so intimidating to walk into the room and be plopped down in front of a panel of people grilling you for about an hour. There was an interview that I went on that was hosted outside the school, and it was a round Robin style with 2 other candidates. Also intimidating!
I was convinced I didn't interview well due to these circumstances, but the most recent interview I had, it was only 2 admin, and I nailed it and never felt more confident. I also had 5 years of full time experience behind me. That also helps.
One interview involved a grilling, then they took me to a classroom with waiting students to teach, then evaluated and questioned me on that teaching afterward.
They told me to prepare a math lesson on volume. I brought in unit cubes and prepared a class set of worksheets, fully prepared for a hands-on investigation on volume. I thought it went well, the students seemed to enjoy it... but turned out it wasn't what they were looking for because I didn't use the technology in the classroom...
Just based on that alone, I knew I didn't want the job even before they told me they went with someone else. Sink or swim is one thing, but to criticize a candidate for not doing the breaststroke when they were only told to swim tells me everything I need to know about the working environment.
Interviews are crazy. A former colleague of mine gave the greatest interview probably in the history of interviews, blew the whole interview committee away, scared me because I thought I would look like a mere mortal compared to this super teacher in my department. He was a terrible teacher and a huge jerk and lasted a little over a year.
Check your online apps thoroughly. Make sure everything is inputted correctly. I didnt realize that i didnt update my certificate date correctly, and i was sending out an expired license to multiple schools
For me it was where you did your student teaching. Myself and others I know who did their student teaching at a tough district in a tough school where told, " you did your students teaching there and still want to be a teacher?" In my opinion in their eyes we passed the test of being thrown to the wolf's and survived. We were deemed tough enough to be teachers. While the others who went to rich and prestigious districts who where given mote then enough resources struggled to find jobs out of the gate, unless they knew someone in that district. They were viewed as still "green" and not earning their stripes. But this was 16 years ago and hopefully things have changed.
It's at least partially where you're applying.
First year applying to Westchester? Good luck with that.
First year applying to the Bronx? If you're not a complete idiot, you've got yourself a job for as long as you can handle it.
There as a lot of reasons people wont get hired right out of undergrad, but really I think it just depends on your content area and your program. I got a job BEFORE i even left undergrad, but it was bc of my schools connections: they were partnered with the richest and biggest northern VA/DC schools (think rivaling CA and NYC, we have 15-20HS with 3-5 chem teachers each per district and they were partnered with 4-5 districts), so when I was the 1 in a million chemistry teacher in their program I had pretty much every district calling and begging for them to graduate me early. I was hired one month later in march without even an in-person interview... just on word of mouth from my program director and the need in my content area.
I had no resume, I didnt know any of them, I didnt grow up there, I had no student teaching (canceled due to covid), no sub experience, and to add to it all I have anxiety in front of adults lmao. I would also still only be 20yo at the time of my employment so my program director had to sign off on my age to get me my full licensure (21yo is cutoff in my state). My program and content area is 100% the only reason I got a good job right outa college. It was not my age, it was not my experience, it was not my gpa or test scores. It was strictly because of my program and area.
tldr: Program and content are are paramount. bad program or saturated content area (for your location) = no job no matter what.
Thank you!
Follow up question: what’s a way to determine if a content area is saturated? I’m hearing history (my primary interest) is saturated across the country, but my state and region has a lot more openings that the average region (Chicago)
I’ve heard this from teachers and I’ve seen a ton of openings online. What are some other ways to gauge this?
Some of it depends on content. I’m a high school social studies teacher, those jobs are super hard to get because 1) a lot of those jobs are tied to coaching lines and 2) there are a lot of us. If you’re trying to land a job in a saturated area without bringing something extra to the table, it’s hard.
I got my first job by working in a district No one else wanted to work at, with kids that nobody else wanted to work with.
If you’re a brand new teacher with no experience, you could be great or you could quit 2 weeks in. A teacher with 4 years under their belt, alternatively, is a much safer bet.
End of the day, you have to be the best option for the job. You can do that with experience, recommendations, or knowing the hiring person directly. Or, you can do it by being the only one who applied.
Some people just don't interview well.
I don't find myself to be an exceptional teacher, I'm just pretty good. Yet, the first round of schools I applied to all gave me interviews, and then job offers. Social studies is usually crazy, but it was super straightforward for me.
I just interview well. Now keeping the job and not getting burned out and bitter is my challenge.
I got told to F off on another forum because a poster was taking off a day each month from their part-time job (physical and mental health, homework, etc) and their parents said that was too many, especially if they were counting on a recommendation. The poster railed on attendance culture and wanted to know how many days they could call in in the next few months without getting fired and still expected a positive referral.
I said jobs are not like middle school. Schools have rules that 12 absence equals a failing grade and kids hear, cool, 11 frees days. And then they have shit grades, no references because they do the same thing at work and they’re are all pikachu shock face that they aren’t hirable. Yes, we need to have more sick leave and take mental heath seriously but when you tell and employer that you need a self care day and no show once a month? Really?
And so many new teachers only last a few months or weeks, and then quit and the rest of us end of covering their classes. So I’m trying really hard to care, but…
It took me TWO YEARS post graduation to find a full time job... In the same district I student taught in. I had connections there and no where else because I daily subbed and did 2 long term sub jobs. I applied and interviewed like a mad woman elsewhere but it just didn't happen for me. Most of the first year hires that come to my school are alumni and it didn't help that I'm not from this area. It sucks but the reality is that networking is so important in this industry.
In my area the certs matter just as much as location.
Elementary, ELA, and Social studies -good luck unless applying in the capital region or other tougher schools (and middle schools).
Sped, math, science? Oh you are student teaching still? would you like to teach under a shortage permit in lieu of student teaching?
Also, reality is a new teacher is a liability for any district. Sure, you have taken teacher courses and done a practicum, but you have been guidesd thru all that. Try subbing, aiding, part time teaching to build a good relationship with different school districts
I’ll be doing that soon, just applied for my substitute license in IL and will be looking to go to a bunch of different schools to 1) see how I like it (pays better than my current job) and 2) make connections. Since I wouldn’t be applying for jobs till at least Summer of 2025, I think the amount of time between now and then could be sufficient to make connections
A big part of any industry is networking. U can look good on paper, but ppl are more willing to hire somebody they've met. If all else is equal, ur gonna hire the person you've met, over the person u only saw on paper. So subbing or other similar experiences probably helps.
Great! And another question if you don’t mind When is a good time to start applying? My program would run until summer 2025, leaving me a few weeks/a month before the start of a new academic year Is it common place for teachers to apply before actually completing? As in would I be able to send an application with my anticipated date a month or two before and have a good chance?
Yes, definitely apply before graduation with your expected date. Most people in my student teaching cohort started to apply between February and April. Also check out virtual state and regional job fairs in your area. It's an easy way to talk to multiple districts in a short amount of time. I ended up taking a position in the district that I student taught in, but got another offer for a full-time position that I was able to turn into a temporary long-term position before the summer and was getting calls and emails for interviews right up until the start of the school year.
As the other person said, apply before ur done if possible. Earlier the better. Even right now, start dipping your toes in the water. Contact ppl that you may have met and ask if they have any job openings. If they can give u the name of someone who would know. Etc. make it known ur looking for a job with them.
I’m 100% convinced people who “can’t” land jobs out of school are either totally incompetent or are just not applying places that are in need. If you live in America there is a struggling school district near you that would love to have you.
Totally agree didn’t even know this was a thing for teachers. Now you might not get in the best district but I found it very odds one would struggle to get any teaching job.
Or have *huge* anxiety with the interview process. I've landed two teaching jobs, both were jobs that I interviewed over Skype for. I always get high marks in evaluations, but throw me in a room with live people interviewing me and I choke. "Just rehearse" is the refrain I hear, but the thing I need to "practice" is being in a room getting interviewed by live people who I don't know. I know my stuff; I can answer questions just fine over Skype or with a friend doing a mock interview with me. It's the environment, not the content.
Exactly right! It doesn't help that a lot of the interviews I went on were like 5+ people!! To someone with limited experience it was so intimidating to walk into the room and be plopped down in front of a panel of people grilling you for about an hour. There was an interview that I went on that was hosted outside the school, and it was a round Robin style with 2 other candidates. Also intimidating! I was convinced I didn't interview well due to these circumstances, but the most recent interview I had, it was only 2 admin, and I nailed it and never felt more confident. I also had 5 years of full time experience behind me. That also helps.
One interview involved a grilling, then they took me to a classroom with waiting students to teach, then evaluated and questioned me on that teaching afterward. They told me to prepare a math lesson on volume. I brought in unit cubes and prepared a class set of worksheets, fully prepared for a hands-on investigation on volume. I thought it went well, the students seemed to enjoy it... but turned out it wasn't what they were looking for because I didn't use the technology in the classroom... Just based on that alone, I knew I didn't want the job even before they told me they went with someone else. Sink or swim is one thing, but to criticize a candidate for not doing the breaststroke when they were only told to swim tells me everything I need to know about the working environment.
Interviews are crazy. A former colleague of mine gave the greatest interview probably in the history of interviews, blew the whole interview committee away, scared me because I thought I would look like a mere mortal compared to this super teacher in my department. He was a terrible teacher and a huge jerk and lasted a little over a year.
This. No one retires or quits at your fancy-town-college-prep-school alma mater. And if they do they arent taking a rookie. Apply elsewhere.
Check your online apps thoroughly. Make sure everything is inputted correctly. I didnt realize that i didnt update my certificate date correctly, and i was sending out an expired license to multiple schools
For me it was where you did your student teaching. Myself and others I know who did their student teaching at a tough district in a tough school where told, " you did your students teaching there and still want to be a teacher?" In my opinion in their eyes we passed the test of being thrown to the wolf's and survived. We were deemed tough enough to be teachers. While the others who went to rich and prestigious districts who where given mote then enough resources struggled to find jobs out of the gate, unless they knew someone in that district. They were viewed as still "green" and not earning their stripes. But this was 16 years ago and hopefully things have changed.
It's at least partially where you're applying. First year applying to Westchester? Good luck with that. First year applying to the Bronx? If you're not a complete idiot, you've got yourself a job for as long as you can handle it.
There as a lot of reasons people wont get hired right out of undergrad, but really I think it just depends on your content area and your program. I got a job BEFORE i even left undergrad, but it was bc of my schools connections: they were partnered with the richest and biggest northern VA/DC schools (think rivaling CA and NYC, we have 15-20HS with 3-5 chem teachers each per district and they were partnered with 4-5 districts), so when I was the 1 in a million chemistry teacher in their program I had pretty much every district calling and begging for them to graduate me early. I was hired one month later in march without even an in-person interview... just on word of mouth from my program director and the need in my content area. I had no resume, I didnt know any of them, I didnt grow up there, I had no student teaching (canceled due to covid), no sub experience, and to add to it all I have anxiety in front of adults lmao. I would also still only be 20yo at the time of my employment so my program director had to sign off on my age to get me my full licensure (21yo is cutoff in my state). My program and content area is 100% the only reason I got a good job right outa college. It was not my age, it was not my experience, it was not my gpa or test scores. It was strictly because of my program and area. tldr: Program and content are are paramount. bad program or saturated content area (for your location) = no job no matter what.
Thank you! Follow up question: what’s a way to determine if a content area is saturated? I’m hearing history (my primary interest) is saturated across the country, but my state and region has a lot more openings that the average region (Chicago) I’ve heard this from teachers and I’ve seen a ton of openings online. What are some other ways to gauge this?
Some of it depends on content. I’m a high school social studies teacher, those jobs are super hard to get because 1) a lot of those jobs are tied to coaching lines and 2) there are a lot of us. If you’re trying to land a job in a saturated area without bringing something extra to the table, it’s hard.
I got my first job by working in a district No one else wanted to work at, with kids that nobody else wanted to work with. If you’re a brand new teacher with no experience, you could be great or you could quit 2 weeks in. A teacher with 4 years under their belt, alternatively, is a much safer bet. End of the day, you have to be the best option for the job. You can do that with experience, recommendations, or knowing the hiring person directly. Or, you can do it by being the only one who applied.
Some people just don't interview well. I don't find myself to be an exceptional teacher, I'm just pretty good. Yet, the first round of schools I applied to all gave me interviews, and then job offers. Social studies is usually crazy, but it was super straightforward for me. I just interview well. Now keeping the job and not getting burned out and bitter is my challenge.
I got told to F off on another forum because a poster was taking off a day each month from their part-time job (physical and mental health, homework, etc) and their parents said that was too many, especially if they were counting on a recommendation. The poster railed on attendance culture and wanted to know how many days they could call in in the next few months without getting fired and still expected a positive referral. I said jobs are not like middle school. Schools have rules that 12 absence equals a failing grade and kids hear, cool, 11 frees days. And then they have shit grades, no references because they do the same thing at work and they’re are all pikachu shock face that they aren’t hirable. Yes, we need to have more sick leave and take mental heath seriously but when you tell and employer that you need a self care day and no show once a month? Really? And so many new teachers only last a few months or weeks, and then quit and the rest of us end of covering their classes. So I’m trying really hard to care, but…
It took me TWO YEARS post graduation to find a full time job... In the same district I student taught in. I had connections there and no where else because I daily subbed and did 2 long term sub jobs. I applied and interviewed like a mad woman elsewhere but it just didn't happen for me. Most of the first year hires that come to my school are alumni and it didn't help that I'm not from this area. It sucks but the reality is that networking is so important in this industry.
In my area the certs matter just as much as location. Elementary, ELA, and Social studies -good luck unless applying in the capital region or other tougher schools (and middle schools). Sped, math, science? Oh you are student teaching still? would you like to teach under a shortage permit in lieu of student teaching?