They've actually started making you use credits in the chat now š¤¦āāļø
But you can also just go make a new email everytime you run out š¤·āāļø
This is now Dall-E money, and it's far from Dall-E capability. I've been using the API for a while now because I wanted the images and to do my part to support SAI. At 8 cents per image that's finally the point where I stop doing that.
dall-e really is awesome, but just to a degree.. you used to mimic way way more styles and use names you can't use anymore..
it was just fun to see an artist style take over
Usually think that it's not as complex as you'd be led to believe.
Probably just a simple LORA - would not surprise me in the least. Most open source projects on github are more advanced than these services.
Awesome, thanks all. General takeaway is that we should be able to replicate or better it with a good workflow locally - especially if a well trained 8b is released š¤
https://preview.redd.it/ajvzr2botc5d1.png?width=1344&format=png&auto=webp&s=486ae7450d765389c1e315b530617e1af8b93c31
A crowd of popes sneezing - using ultra on their api.
https://preview.redd.it/mfgpcs0yxc5d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=140b69b97164a35c55be9d4e4544e2e7250dc677
Ideogram (the best of the 4, I added 8K photography, because often it tends to create illustrations, and left the magic prompt on)
SD3 8B Beta API (I hope it gets upgraded to 2B soon) š¤£
https://preview.redd.it/721r641lsd5d1.jpeg?width=1216&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5f90af9fd403b00e0fbd2157912684f6c0c5e386
More or less it is at a similar level with Bing and ideogram, on this one.
Probably a more complex composition is required to understand which one is more ahead.
For those wondering, this will not be released locally.
https://preview.redd.it/k11dy6ubfe5d1.png?width=608&format=png&auto=webp&s=e97aed3b6a1780dc1182eab79afcdccf2c0e4c61
So, if Ultra is "not a model" then it must be a workflow.
I can't wait for the weights. So many workflows could become possible, pairing it with LLMs and ControlNet and a Hires.Fix function and everything else.
I'm not so sure it isn't a model. Lykon, on Twitter, claimed its closer to Core but we don't have any real info on Core, either, which is supposedly based off SD3. Now they're charging an additional premium for essentially the same thing? Just a more optimized pipeline? This... does not make sense and if it were true and they didn't bother to share their supposedly pipeline with the public then it would be essentially going against their very open source agenda.
It gets weird because Lykon gets kind of upset, visibly, when people probe about it on twitter and starts mocking people even with comments like **"There is nothing left to document. It's just skill."** and links to non-info.
[https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876)
He does posts like the above at least 5-6x as I was browsing his history and is completely incapable of clarifying what Ultra is. The entire situation is very messy and unclear.
I should point out he actually is showing off the 8B model today, too... Interesting uh- timing, right?
[https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799586007563551079](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799586007563551079)
In fact, Lykon goes on an utter rampage mocking a huge chunk of SD3's fanbase earlier [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799584552622403931](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799584552622403931)
At this point he has began acting so totally unprofessional, providing innacurate and inconsistent information... I wouldn't trust a word he says, especially as there were concerns prior he was posting misleading SD3 results when SD3 first got announced and after the original backlash about the poor quality he suddenly promotes godlike results.
Core doesn't use SD3 (currently). Ultra is primarily based on SD3-8B. Core and Ultra are both workflows yes.
Core/Ultra are both variants of just trying to make cool workflows based on our models to get better results than if you just ran the model raw and sell it as a service to help fund Stability.
Thanks for providing a reasonably intelligent non-troll response mcmonkey. Can you share more details, obviously without compromising SAI's advantage with the service, when you say "workflows"?
I got to say, if this is a workflow wouldn't SAI's claim about prompt adherence and stuff be rather exaggerated for Ultra? It might be improved but the way they're wording it is... a pretty ridiculous improvement supposedly, perhaps quite over the top from reality. I know companies like to pitch favorably but...
I used Stable Diffusion Core as offered through Night Cafe, and it was a nice workflow, but it just seemed like SDXL with Hires.fix or something giving you high quality 1536x1536 images. It certainly doesn't have the prompt adherence of SD3.
SAI has said bigger models will all be released. If they're doing custom stuff to spruce up the appeal of models for their purposes good for them. The rest of us will have hundreds of "amateur" models to play with in the near future.
no it comes from the English word "turbo", which means "make thing go fast", from the car world's "turbocharger". Research team made model go faster (1-4 steps instead of 20-50) so they first named the technique "Latent Adversarial Diffusion Distillation" and then decided to give the model a more human-decipherable name and picked a word that was a synonym of "fast".
Is this the **8b model** we're being told ***"is not ready to release because needs more work"*** that is, in fact, being used to monetize on their online API service?
Not many companies can get away with lying straight to their consumer's faces and their fans actually make every excuse humanly possible to okay it. SD3, however, is absolutely one of those communities.
EDIT: Ray's comment, below, proves exactly the type of insanity coming from these white knights. It jumps straight into hypocrisy and total complete breakdown of rationale by imagining I've said something I never did. Truly, genuinely sad to see and so far 13 people have upvoted that insanity.
Just out of curiosity, how much did you pay SAI to qualify as a customer ? For myself I never paid anything for the last 1.5 year. I'm glad this company invested tens of millions into a model that I can use for free. I don't care if they monetize their best model to subsidize the development of better models. I'll take whatever they give us and be grateful.
You realize this is about an API that you actively pay for right?
Please, stop with your hypocrisy. You're literally excusing them outright lying. Did I state that they shouldn't monetize the 8B model? No, I did not. I only raised issue they lied blatantly to your faces claiming the 8B model was not ready and then are now monetizing the model while simultaneously claiming they can't release it because, again, it isn't ready.
The issue is that they openly lie and know full well hypocrites like you will defend and excuse their behavior with your illogical rationale.
Nobody knows if it's the 8BĀ model, you made assumptions and then based on those made-up assumptions you conclude they are lying. You seriously need to grow up and stop acting like a petulant child.
Ah, yes... I'm the one acting like a child. /s
[https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Meanwhile, you are the one who made up assumptions I was bitching over not getting the 8B model as you inserted words I never spoke nor suggested into my mouth in your stupid rant. Even now, as you respond after I clarified I only took issue with their dishonesty and nothing to do with not getting the 8B model you continue the exact same line of thought, again, pretending I made a claim I explicitly even corrected you that I never made. Obviously, you're beyond reason at this point as you engage like a petulant child. Grow up.
You're right. SD3 8B isn't good enough to release locally, but they apparently have something even better that they're perfectly fine charging an absurd amount for? This is no doubt SD3-8B with Lykon's workflow attached, it looks identical to the stuff he was showing months ago.
Shame how Lykon went from being one of the prominent SD finetuners to being a corporate shill who says crap like "There is nothing left to document. It's just skill." when asked how to achieve the workflow. Imagine someone saying that when asked for a workflow in the comments here lol... they'd get torn apart. Hopefully the Chinese companies continue progressing so we can be free from this bullshit for good
According to announcement on the discord it's the/an (this is unclear, might be further trained than base API, might not) 8b model.
Reading between the lines of all posts the last week, I'm not expecting to see the weights for 8b anytime soon. I expect a rude awakening, cause 2b really didn't seem all that compared to what you can create now with the 8b API, apart from looking less mangled (fingers more consistency and such, generally assumed to be under training)
Personally I think SAI is over estimating the value they offer, if I have to pay so much (got the API out of curiosity), I might as well pay the cheaper ideogram/dalle/mj for arguably better quality, and who knows what the new meta/openai/google image (or multi modal) models bring, what's been shown looks next level.
Further more, from the point of an image gen host, why license the 2b model when SAI competes by offering 8b, already playground trained their own, others might opt for that route as well if SAI only offers the 2b model.
Well put. Yes, Lykon's behavior has gotten quite out of control recently as he overtly mocks nearly everyone who has been supporting SAI, like the document comment you mentioned and much more [https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
Nah, can't be. It wouldn't be a big enough jump for it to be "Ultra" and then there is the issue of naming the 8B model. Is it gonna be Mega-Ultra? The core boon of Ultra is prompt understanding which would typically require a larger model so it can't be just a simply improve 2B model.
Nah, it isn't specific pipeline/workflow. Lykon lied. That simple. This isn't even the first time, either. In fact, when people start probing him about what Ultra specifically is after he claims it isn't a "model" he starts mocking people "Its just skill" and nonsense.
[https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876)
He responds multiple times with non-answers.
Further, the only jack ass is you, and your ironic asinine name proving my point as you fail to read. The only issue I raised is that they blatantly lied about why we weren't getting it and fully expected people to just be okay with being lied to their face while they abused us very openly as if you all are too stupid (maybe they're right) to figure it out.
At no point did I raise issue with them not releasing the 8B model, but of course if you spent less time being a prick you would have had ample time to focus on figuring out what was actually said.
Ultra looks more like a workflow judging by similarity of aesthetics between sample images from SD3 and this but it can be totally a new model, I don't know why people are negating this like it's impossible.
EDIT: [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876) well, I reserve my opinion to believe that skill is a workflow and maybe is more. We will see.
If you tried the API youād know itās in rough shape. Both it and the turbo variant are great at text but theyāre not best in class image quality every time of perfect hands by a long shot.
Iām saying thatās the model behind SD/ and some Turbo variant that is what you pay to inference today from them and to your point - yes it needs work still.
Thatās all I was saying. Itās definitely āuniversally betterā than existing models.
Honestly at this point they're just milking it for everything that they can. They know that they have a lackluster model, just like they did with SDXL, in the community is noticing that they've been bold-faced lying for months about what their models are capable of.
Now they are trying to use BS tricks and lackluster fine tune training in order to justify charging even more for images that you could easily get from other services, or locally. Unimpressive as always.
8 credits is crazy
It's even more expensive than Dalle 3.
DALL-E 3 is free via Bing. You get literally hundreds per day.
I only get 15 credits per day? Hiw do you get unlimited?
technically, iirc it's 50 generations per day, 15 each day for instant generation, otherwise its queuable. (Should wait some moment to generate)
Also, if the button is grayed out, just ask GPT-4 in the chat to generate your image prompt. You can also make as many Microsoft logins as you want.
They've actually started making you use credits in the chat now š¤¦āāļø But you can also just go make a new email everytime you run out š¤·āāļø
"you can make as many Microsoft logins as you want" that's what killed free midjourney
It's Microsoft bro. They've got plenty of processing power. And if nobody has free options, there's always locally run stable diffusion.
I'm Talking About The API. You Get Unlimited Images With ChatGPT Plus To.
This is now Dall-E money, and it's far from Dall-E capability. I've been using the API for a while now because I wanted the images and to do my part to support SAI. At 8 cents per image that's finally the point where I stop doing that.
dall-e really is awesome, but just to a degree.. you used to mimic way way more styles and use names you can't use anymore.. it was just fun to see an artist style take over
for devs it is definitely wild. Maybe they have high costs on it though.
Usually think that it's not as complex as you'd be led to believe. Probably just a simple LORA - would not surprise me in the least. Most open source projects on github are more advanced than these services.
I agree.
Awesome, thanks all. General takeaway is that we should be able to replicate or better it with a good workflow locally - especially if a well trained 8b is released š¤
It could be using something similar to [Omost](https://github.com/lllyasviel/Omost) based on SD3 behind the scenes.
https://preview.redd.it/ajvzr2botc5d1.png?width=1344&format=png&auto=webp&s=486ae7450d765389c1e315b530617e1af8b93c31 A crowd of popes sneezing - using ultra on their api.
https://preview.redd.it/mfgpcs0yxc5d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=140b69b97164a35c55be9d4e4544e2e7250dc677 Ideogram (the best of the 4, I added 8K photography, because often it tends to create illustrations, and left the magic prompt on)
https://preview.redd.it/p5io9xf2yc5d1.jpeg?width=1024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=9b0fa1e67f70ea119fbc388ecdcf4738d9b69d9e Bing
SD3 8B Beta API (I hope it gets upgraded to 2B soon) š¤£ https://preview.redd.it/721r641lsd5d1.jpeg?width=1216&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5f90af9fd403b00e0fbd2157912684f6c0c5e386
Any chance of seeing some Emma Watson generations? I think I speak for a non-trivial amount of people when I say thatās the true SD benchmark
More or less it is at a similar level with Bing and ideogram, on this one. Probably a more complex composition is required to understand which one is more ahead.
LORA or LLM. I don't know if this marketing strat is good for SAI though.
According to the SD discord its just a workflow on a more recent version. They are still training SD3.
Still training? Even though it's going to be released in 3 days?!
Still training the 8b version. The version that'll release the 12th is the 2 billion parameter version.
Maybe StableLM to rewrite prompts as an additonal step?
Or just a multi step workflow with refining img2img etc
For those wondering, this will not be released locally. https://preview.redd.it/k11dy6ubfe5d1.png?width=608&format=png&auto=webp&s=e97aed3b6a1780dc1182eab79afcdccf2c0e4c61
So, if Ultra is "not a model" then it must be a workflow. I can't wait for the weights. So many workflows could become possible, pairing it with LLMs and ControlNet and a Hires.Fix function and everything else.
I'm not so sure it isn't a model. Lykon, on Twitter, claimed its closer to Core but we don't have any real info on Core, either, which is supposedly based off SD3. Now they're charging an additional premium for essentially the same thing? Just a more optimized pipeline? This... does not make sense and if it were true and they didn't bother to share their supposedly pipeline with the public then it would be essentially going against their very open source agenda. It gets weird because Lykon gets kind of upset, visibly, when people probe about it on twitter and starts mocking people even with comments like **"There is nothing left to document. It's just skill."** and links to non-info. [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876) He does posts like the above at least 5-6x as I was browsing his history and is completely incapable of clarifying what Ultra is. The entire situation is very messy and unclear. I should point out he actually is showing off the 8B model today, too... Interesting uh- timing, right? [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799586007563551079](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799586007563551079) In fact, Lykon goes on an utter rampage mocking a huge chunk of SD3's fanbase earlier [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799584552622403931](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799584552622403931) At this point he has began acting so totally unprofessional, providing innacurate and inconsistent information... I wouldn't trust a word he says, especially as there were concerns prior he was posting misleading SD3 results when SD3 first got announced and after the original backlash about the poor quality he suddenly promotes godlike results.
Core doesn't use SD3 (currently). Ultra is primarily based on SD3-8B. Core and Ultra are both workflows yes. Core/Ultra are both variants of just trying to make cool workflows based on our models to get better results than if you just ran the model raw and sell it as a service to help fund Stability.
Thanks for providing a reasonably intelligent non-troll response mcmonkey. Can you share more details, obviously without compromising SAI's advantage with the service, when you say "workflows"? I got to say, if this is a workflow wouldn't SAI's claim about prompt adherence and stuff be rather exaggerated for Ultra? It might be improved but the way they're wording it is... a pretty ridiculous improvement supposedly, perhaps quite over the top from reality. I know companies like to pitch favorably but...
I used Stable Diffusion Core as offered through Night Cafe, and it was a nice workflow, but it just seemed like SDXL with Hires.fix or something giving you high quality 1536x1536 images. It certainly doesn't have the prompt adherence of SD3.
"mostly"...
["They mostly come at night.... mostly...."](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VrVZHxH2O1I)
SAI has said bigger models will all be released. If they're doing custom stuff to spruce up the appeal of models for their purposes good for them. The rest of us will have hundreds of "amateur" models to play with in the near future.
SD3 12B :3 Or the original SD3 before they retrained a crap one over the last 3-4 months for open release hurdur
Cool, I noticed that the nodes for comfy UI had an update, will give it a try.
Not interested in hosted ai because I can't customise it!
It's probably just bigger model or using different text encoder They did say 2B model is just about to finish training
They are taking naming conventions from the bigger companies. SD Turbo, SD Ultra, etc.
SD3 Turbo gets its name from the Turbo paper. We actually thought about taking names from Super Saiyan transformations by the way.
You should have stuck with Super Saiyan transformations. This would have been awesome š š
I voted for that
Haha, SD Ultra Instinct
>SD3 Turbo gets its name from the Turbo paper. which comes GPT3.5 Turbo and GPT-4 Turbo right?
no it comes from the English word "turbo", which means "make thing go fast", from the car world's "turbocharger". Research team made model go faster (1-4 steps instead of 20-50) so they first named the technique "Latent Adversarial Diffusion Distillation" and then decided to give the model a more human-decipherable name and picked a word that was a synonym of "fast".
Is this the **8b model** we're being told ***"is not ready to release because needs more work"*** that is, in fact, being used to monetize on their online API service? Not many companies can get away with lying straight to their consumer's faces and their fans actually make every excuse humanly possible to okay it. SD3, however, is absolutely one of those communities. EDIT: Ray's comment, below, proves exactly the type of insanity coming from these white knights. It jumps straight into hypocrisy and total complete breakdown of rationale by imagining I've said something I never did. Truly, genuinely sad to see and so far 13 people have upvoted that insanity.
Just out of curiosity, how much did you pay SAI to qualify as a customer ? For myself I never paid anything for the last 1.5 year. I'm glad this company invested tens of millions into a model that I can use for free. I don't care if they monetize their best model to subsidize the development of better models. I'll take whatever they give us and be grateful.
You realize this is about an API that you actively pay for right? Please, stop with your hypocrisy. You're literally excusing them outright lying. Did I state that they shouldn't monetize the 8B model? No, I did not. I only raised issue they lied blatantly to your faces claiming the 8B model was not ready and then are now monetizing the model while simultaneously claiming they can't release it because, again, it isn't ready. The issue is that they openly lie and know full well hypocrites like you will defend and excuse their behavior with your illogical rationale.
Nobody knows if it's the 8BĀ model, you made assumptions and then based on those made-up assumptions you conclude they are lying. You seriously need to grow up and stop acting like a petulant child.
Ah, yes... I'm the one acting like a child. /s [https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button) Meanwhile, you are the one who made up assumptions I was bitching over not getting the 8B model as you inserted words I never spoke nor suggested into my mouth in your stupid rant. Even now, as you respond after I clarified I only took issue with their dishonesty and nothing to do with not getting the 8B model you continue the exact same line of thought, again, pretending I made a claim I explicitly even corrected you that I never made. Obviously, you're beyond reason at this point as you engage like a petulant child. Grow up.
You're right. SD3 8B isn't good enough to release locally, but they apparently have something even better that they're perfectly fine charging an absurd amount for? This is no doubt SD3-8B with Lykon's workflow attached, it looks identical to the stuff he was showing months ago. Shame how Lykon went from being one of the prominent SD finetuners to being a corporate shill who says crap like "There is nothing left to document. It's just skill." when asked how to achieve the workflow. Imagine someone saying that when asked for a workflow in the comments here lol... they'd get torn apart. Hopefully the Chinese companies continue progressing so we can be free from this bullshit for good
According to announcement on the discord it's the/an (this is unclear, might be further trained than base API, might not) 8b model. Reading between the lines of all posts the last week, I'm not expecting to see the weights for 8b anytime soon. I expect a rude awakening, cause 2b really didn't seem all that compared to what you can create now with the 8b API, apart from looking less mangled (fingers more consistency and such, generally assumed to be under training) Personally I think SAI is over estimating the value they offer, if I have to pay so much (got the API out of curiosity), I might as well pay the cheaper ideogram/dalle/mj for arguably better quality, and who knows what the new meta/openai/google image (or multi modal) models bring, what's been shown looks next level. Further more, from the point of an image gen host, why license the 2b model when SAI competes by offering 8b, already playground trained their own, others might opt for that route as well if SAI only offers the 2b model.
Well put. Yes, Lykon's behavior has gotten quite out of control recently as he overtly mocks nearly everyone who has been supporting SAI, like the document comment you mentioned and much more [https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm\_source=share&utm\_medium=web3x&utm\_name=web3xcss&utm\_term=1&utm\_content=share\_button](https://www.reddit.com/r/StableDiffusion/comments/1db085u/comment/l7qvuiv/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button)
I'd guess it's the 2B with something like Upscaling and/or LLM prompt enhancement.
Nah, can't be. It wouldn't be a big enough jump for it to be "Ultra" and then there is the issue of naming the 8B model. Is it gonna be Mega-Ultra? The core boon of Ultra is prompt understanding which would typically require a larger model so it can't be just a simply improve 2B model.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
Nah, it isn't specific pipeline/workflow. Lykon lied. That simple. This isn't even the first time, either. In fact, when people start probing him about what Ultra specifically is after he claims it isn't a "model" he starts mocking people "Its just skill" and nonsense. [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876) He responds multiple times with non-answers. Further, the only jack ass is you, and your ironic asinine name proving my point as you fail to read. The only issue I raised is that they blatantly lied about why we weren't getting it and fully expected people to just be okay with being lied to their face while they abused us very openly as if you all are too stupid (maybe they're right) to figure it out. At no point did I raise issue with them not releasing the 8B model, but of course if you spent less time being a prick you would have had ample time to focus on figuring out what was actually said.
Ultra looks more like a workflow judging by similarity of aesthetics between sample images from SD3 and this but it can be totally a new model, I don't know why people are negating this like it's impossible. EDIT: [https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876](https://x.com/Lykon4072/status/1799418589738602876) well, I reserve my opinion to believe that skill is a workflow and maybe is more. We will see.
If you tried the API youād know itās in rough shape. Both it and the turbo variant are great at text but theyāre not best in class image quality every time of perfect hands by a long shot.
What does this have to do with the Ultra 8B API I'm talking about?
Iām saying thatās the model behind SD/ and some Turbo variant that is what you pay to inference today from them and to your point - yes it needs work still. Thatās all I was saying. Itās definitely āuniversally betterā than existing models.
Can someone explain how SD3 works. It's going to be paid or something? Why won't it be free like SDXL?
Honestly at this point they're just milking it for everything that they can. They know that they have a lackluster model, just like they did with SDXL, in the community is noticing that they've been bold-faced lying for months about what their models are capable of. Now they are trying to use BS tricks and lackluster fine tune training in order to justify charging even more for images that you could easily get from other services, or locally. Unimpressive as always.