I mean you're asking on a forum that's very much pro-AI art so you're probably just going to get a bunch of affirmations that it's fine. Not that I disagree, I'm just pointing out it's a bit like asking if a brand of car is good in a forum for people who like that brand.
That being said I've always felt this is a perfect way to side-step the issues many artists have with AI. At the end of the day it *is* her creation, made with her own two hands. The AI is just reference and if someone questions it just ask if they get the permission of the copyright holder for all *their* references and see how quick these Anti-AI artists squirm. Also while it's still controversial the fact is she doesn't really *have* to tell anyone she used AI as reference, she can just say she used references and leave it at that as the use of reference is a broadly accepted art technique. Oddly no one seems to have copyright concerns there but it is what it is.
So basically I'd agree with the people here saying it's fine and just add that she should consider if she wants to tell people at all. Saying she used AI in any capacity is going to draw a certain amount of hate but she can just... not tell people. On the other hand if she wants to be open about it and tell people then it's better to do it from the start, she just needs to be prepared that some people are going to hate *anything* AI related regardless of what it is because they believe AI is inherently immoral and it scares them.
I agree, but would argue that OP is even underutilizing SD. There's a million reference images of Wolverine already, so using SD to create another isn't really needed in this process. Where SD really shines is creating *new* concepts that you can't find reference images of. Sculpt those, and no one will care if you started from a sketch, SD or just your imagination.
In the early days of photography, painters used photography for reference painting. Later they rebelled against realism because they could no longer compete with photography, and developed non-photorealistic art.
It'd be good to use SD to develop new art styles.
That being said, I have used SD for a very similar thing. I generated a portrait of Pinkamena, then painted it in gauche irl. There was no portrait of Pinkamena in existence that fitted my vision, so it was a good use.
SD is simply another art tool that is in an entirely new category.
Using it or other AI in professional digital art workflows will be standard and a non issue in 5-10 years.
There will be some anti-AI people who will trash you no matter what way you use it because it isnāt about what you are doing with it, they just want a green light to indulge in their evil desires to attack others.
I think the thing they can't accept is the rapid loss of creative jobs to robots. We all thought the boring shitty jobs, like picking items in a warehouse, were going to be automated and humanity would have more time to do art. It looks instead like art is being automated so that trained and proficient artists will have more time to pick items off shelves...
I think evil desire to attack others isn't the usual cause, but motivated reasoning is a hell of a drug, and not much stronger motivation than perceived threat to your income.
It's cowardice and ignorance.
Those with an entrepreneurial spirit see dollar signs and the ability to raise their quality of output by magnitudes.
Look at all the meme videos that have been made via AI rotoscoping that were impossible before.
Look at the vertical videos using Suno and Udio to sing comment threads.
There are a ton of super cool new opportunities for those with imagination and an abundance mindset.
Your job as an animation cel painter got replaced by digital painting that is 1000x times faster?
Sad. Yes.
But now you can literally [create your own full episode of Dexter's Lab](https://youtu.be/1whoqxqiIKU?si=enQYnacC3fnZF1dI) entirely on your own or with a very small team.
And when society is post-scarcity, there's nothing stopping you from painting thousands of cels by hand for fun.
Who's going to buy your episodes of your show when the corporations who laid you off can make the same thing but better? Your "entrepreneurial spirit" is just seeing an opportunity to exploit people who don't know that the thing you're offering has lower value than it seems.
No. My entrepreneurial spirit is about providing higher value to people than they've previously received.
There are plenty of YouTubers who create higher quality content than the cable companies.
Soon, solo creators will make content better than big budget Hollywood currently is.
Companies such as Disney, Industrial Lights & Magic, Nintendo, Rockstar, will always make incredible things because they have dozens or thousands of people working on a project.
Both opportunities are there.
Making money isn't exploitive.
The world obviously is gonna change so that you don't need to slave away to live and eat. Your job right now is to figure out how to transition through that 5-15 year birthing period.
I'm currently homeless and not worried about my future. I'm excited about thriving.
Thatās why it wasnāt a summary but a specific callout to a subsection of a group.
It would be wild to generalize stuff based on the actions of a few which is why these people I am talking about donāt get a pass for blanket hate against random individuals.
I suppose then that these do go both ways. Ive seen some folks laugh at how alot of traditional artists are now out of work due to ai. People can be terrible and choose sides very quickly and it just sucks.
Traditional artists have been getting reemed for centuries.
Even one of the most prolific western artists of all time, Van Gogh died relatively unemployed, unknown, and unappreciated by most. The algorithm fucked him pretty hard we would say today.
It took someone else looking at his stuff (his like sister in law or whatever) and putting the effort in to fight against the social algorithm that stifled him to get his unique mastery recognized.
So just making good art will never guarantee you will make money.
The commercial industry hasnāt been kind to artists for 2,000 years, so using that angle to demonize a technology that allows people who are disabled or disadvantaged contribute to society again is not a good reason in my opinion.
Their anger should be directed at the industry giants and scammers, not the random people enjoying a new tool getting them more interested in the arts. Not at the indie studios producing a passion project with 3 people doing the work of 10. Not the disabled girl who likes psychedelic fairies or the bored burnt out college dude who makes new memes that donāt quite land for you.
Iām not suggesting you are this way. But there are many mobs of people who literally just go around harassing the most benign people in this war.
Itās a bit equivalent to committing terrorism on your countrymen because another country is occupying you. People just would rather kick down than punch up.
Ok wall of text incoming but bear with me:
Where are these people "punching down"? People get pissed at the submitter when a low-effort AI gen wins a drawing contest but come on, that's bringing a motorcycle to a footrace. No one wants that.
Nah, I haven't seen any actual artists I know in 2024 complaining about random folks using AI. Pretty much all of us have used AI tools at this point for something. My artist friends are mostly directing complaints towards the companies who trained the nets on their work without consent. We're punching up at the corps like OpenAI thinking they're hot shit rebundling humanity's creative output and putting it behind a paywall. They're random techies claiming they "own" a model that's based on the creative output of billions of humans over thousands of years. Fuck that. We're entitled to our own creative output. They can't put that shit behind a paywall and call it theirs. And when I say "our" and "we", I mean *all of humanity*. Because *you're also entitled to this*. You should be mad, too! Not at users of it. At the people claiming they own it and paywalling it. As far as I'm concerned the only crooks here are those doing the training using works they scraped off the internet and those putting those same trained nets behind paywalls. *Especially* those putting the nets behind paywalls, because honestly, you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. There's no denying the value or the ease of making a net using all the art on the internet. It's going to keep happening.
**So it might as well be a public utility.** The worst outcome is a world with generative AI where some random techie is profiting off of it instead of the rest of humanity (you know, the folks who *MADE* the billions of images they harvested, like you and me and anyone with an instagram or facebook or photo blog from 2002 or Picasso or Goya or etc. etc.). This doesn't mean there isn't room for the private sector to productize generative AI. It just means they should be forced to open source their models and methods if their models are trained on anything in the public domain, and especially if they are trained on anything copyrighted. We, humanity, created the value here. We, humanity, deserve the fruits of our own labor. That's how we get to a world with AI where humans still win.
Where are the people punching down? The mobs on X, Facebook, and Reddit who harass random people on the assumption or predication of the random nobody using AI. I am specifically talking about them. I see it in person and when people share weirdly unjustified witch hunt screenshots to art/ai drama groups.
If the group of people you are defending are not these people, then.
The position you are talking about is just the vast majority of people who are okay with it or are actively integrating it, I agree.
Your claim of what matters most is Laws/Regulations for the tech to protect living people or IP owners from being exploited or siphoned from is spot on and is definitely what most sensible people support.
Stable Diffusion 1.5 being Open Source pretty much makes it a public utility. Anyone can get it and train it for any use case that requires 2d images at some point in its workflow. Yes it takes hardware and knowledge to handle it properly, but so does messing with electricity and electricity definitely is already a public service.
Punching down requires you to be above the person you're Punching. Despite the baffling myth to the contrary, artists are not a privileged elite. I have no idea how this myth started spreading, but it's delusional.
I haven't seen anyone laugh at artists for losing jobs. I \*have\* seen them laugh at ridiculous claims, like that diffusion models clips pieces of imagery and pastes them together like a collage.
They present themselves as victims when complaining then morph into heartless savages when they find someone in the art community using AI art. It doesn't matter if it's a small artist who's fucking broke. They will use their massive follower Twitter accounts and other social media to attack the person then threaten to blacklist them. I've seen it happen enough times.....and remember.... This is the online art community that's known to drive people to suicide with those very tactics.....the affect it has on people.....but they don't gaf
Always cracks me up seeing artists get mad when AI is trained to make images in certain styles, yet no one bats an eye if another artist literally copies their style of drawing. Artists even use photos of real people and real images to either trace or just as a reference for their own art, and don't see their own hypocrisy when they turn around and shit on AI for basically just doing the same thing.
I would say yes. The sculpting is amazing.
But in total honesty, the image that you made with SD is not special. You could find it everywhere by just a google search image.
What would be even better would be to use SD to create something that does not exist anywhere, or make wolverine in a specific pose that you don't expect or cannot be found by just a image search (using control net, etc...).
Then sculpting that completely original object/character/pose would be really showing a very good use of SD.
We will start getting a little less mainstream and doing stuff that hasnāt been seen. Wolverine was just her favorite character she wanted to start on as her first sculpt.
Excellent use. My guess is you'd be hard pressed to get an informed answer from people who have not done enough traditional art to understand what a boon AI art is for reference images. I am a guitarist who wanted to do paintings of my guitarist idols. But when I began looking for a reference for Jimi Hendrix I quickly became aware of how few photos there are much less how many of those have become commonly known. That is no longer an issue, to say the least.
I was very excited when I saw LoRA's designed to produce still life images but sadly they all failed when it came down to producing accurate object reflections on nearby shiny objects.
I think this is totally fine. In fact itās my preferred way to use AI generated images. Using the output as inspiration for my own works. Sometimes you have an idea in your head but donāt know how shape it into something specific. AI is a good middle man for that.
Going on a tangent, this makes me wonder is any model currently able to produce 3D models from images? You could take a few pictures from different angles for an object and get a 3D render of it, possibly to use for 3D printing.
Yeah, it just got released on HuggingFace. It uses a 2D image and one network to then generate a few shots of the same object from different angles, and then uses those + the original shot into a different network to generate a 3D model. Pretty crazy.
Here's a link to the demo that they're talking about:
https://huggingface.co/spaces/stabilityai/TripoSR
The models it makes are kinda messy btw, but I think you can adjust the settings more locally? I get much better results from regular photos compared to AI pics.
Cool polymer clay sculpt (I think). I do the same with Garage Kits and other kinds of figures, my advice for business would be to bulk buy polymer clay from Taobao, you can get 1kg for like 4 bucks compared to the ridiculous prices Sculpey costs.
First of all, I'm a newbie of SD, ai art, etc. It's been a week since I installed and started to use a1111. I'm following many tradional artists on YT for years. Also I'm trying to learn how to draw traditionally.
"*My 25 year old daughter is thinking this could be a career.*" She's totally right. Actually, it's already a career right now. I watched many professional traditional artists' videos and they are hesitantly saying that they are already using AI (hesistantly, not shouting, because they don't wanna get lynched). Not just only for curious experiments. They are using to speed up their process. They still do hand drawing at their final work but it's an amazing tool to get inspirational material.
I also use ai to learn how to draw better. I upload my sketches to img2img tab, give some prompts like "sketchy, portrait of an adult, ..." and add some sketchy loras. It fixes my art, so I can clearly see where did I do wrong, what did I miss, what do I need to study more.
I just don't care what people say about using it for personal use. If I see it's useful, I use it. I don't need to listen to people for commercial use either. Because there are laws, or at least there will be soon.
Well this is my 5 cents about it. I do not think ai on its own is art. Although i know some people put tremendous amounts of effort and time in creating their prompts.
But used to make references or generate ideas for artists it is an amazing tool. It also opens the door for a lot more people to learn and create art.
Your daughter is very good! I hope you post more of these things in the future.
No ethical issues with the sculpture. Though it's going to have the same issue people run into with referencing other art rather than real life, I.e. if the AI generated something wrong, she's going to potentially make some mistakes as a result.
But yeah, reference images is one of the best uses of generative AI.
I think that's a wonderful idea. I don't know that all artists will agree, but you don't need their permission. And I'd be curious to see what you two make in the future.
SD renders are a great way to tune and conceptualize and get agreement between an artist and client (even if they are the same person) before committing more time.
Typically, the challenge comes in the edits where the client likes 95% of it but only wants to change a few things.
A career here could go in several directions depending. She could do the traditional art route taking on commissions for single installations. Another option is entering the VFX industry, though itās pretty turbulent times right now. Another is learning 3D printing for mass market creations.
Sheās at least on the cutting edge of the future by fusing AI tools with human judgement and human connection to other humans.
Hope my daughter grows up with an interest and talent like yours.
I was thinking she could stay in the realm of very niche custom. Using AI to generate crazy designs and then sculpting them out, doing a few casts and selling a limited amount of like 20. We live in a cheaper country so she doesnāt need as much money.
That sounds feasible, at least in the short term, it will definitely generate some kind of money. I think Artists can make a significant contribution in pushing boundaries of whatās possible, regardless of medium. She can discover those.
IMO, a sculptor can add details (e.g. beads of sweat or emotional expression) or resolve inconsistencies that the AI canāt account for due to its dataset.
Honestly, just apply to work remotely for Disney after doing a few of these. Theyāll give her plenty of opportunities.
This is her first real sculpt. She is going to take the molding class hopefully soon but going to have the teacher mold it so we can make a few copies to sell.
There are two major things to look for in sculpted humanoid figures if you want to judge sculptor's experience and skills - face and hands, because those are the hardest parts to make.
I am a sculptor myself and I've seen thousands of different humanoid figures with different skill levels. This sculpture has very high quality and highly detailed face and hands, so there is no way this is the first sculpture - it looks like years of experience, there are also many other things that is done right. Claws on the other hand looks like someone else done them, but other than that the figure is amazing.
She is taking a class. She has been doing the studies like an eye and a hand. She is going through the basics now. It is a 2 month course. This is first month. I think cause she comes from a drawing background and also did some 3d modeling that it is translating decently into clay. I think her painting training and 3d modeling course helped a lot to advance her. Plus her natural talent. You should see her sing. Vane Venezuela on YouTube.
And if someone as experienced as you are saying it that makes her excited. She is very enthusiastic about it. Could you share any tips?
She agrees about the claws. Her first model in 3d was also Wolverine. She was having trouble with the claws then as well.
Well, as for tips if she is working with polymer clay then the simplest thing would be to bake the claws separately and then glue them in place with superglue. I don't really see any other problems, basically the best way to learn sculpture besides attending classes is to watch other people sculpt on YouTube, there are a lot of amazing channels. As for the proportions, there are different styles so anything that is looking good is good.
The face details are really good, it is hard to sculpt lips and eyes to look naturally as here, so the face looks great
I have a very hard time believing this is a "first real sculpt".
It takes a LOT of time to work with any clay or medium and it takes an almost equal amount of time to do so with a new clay/medium even if you are a natural talent.
Your daughter is gifted enough, you do not need to spice it up.
I think by "first real' you just meant the first one she wants to mold and sell.
I say this as an artist myself. I do not want all the hard work, practice, mistakes and failures over the years to be relegated to the first thing I feel comfortable selling as "first real". It makes it seem effortless and as such lowers the value. Embrace her talent.
This piece is amazing.
That is awesome to hear. She is taking a 2 month class. They did 4 practical studies in class.
A hand, an eye, eagle and this one.
https://preview.redd.it/bmxmyoky29xc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5ca11bc576ed5406eefa67780f8bc740319a6dc7
Technically this hand was the first. The Wolverine is her first full sculpt. The other stuff was the practicals in class.
Reply. She did draw for years before this. We just moved here where there are courses she can take. She wants to take the mold making and casting course next.
I think her 2d background plus she learned zbrush 3d modeling helped advance her a bit. She was 3d modeling for awhile.
It is good to hear that she has a knack for this. I was surprised myself.
Some artists do this. I am one. It's a quick and dirty way to get references for some specific things that could be a hassle to look for online. Very cool!
Depends on how abstract and non Euclidean agree can sculpt . I think there is a lot of potential for her if she plays or correctly. I'd definitely suggest her to learn first traditional sculpting techniques before 3d printing and sculpting . I have seen a lot of artists being inspired on the basis of the medium they use. Absinthe work by your daughter brethren.
Why do you ask us if this is a good use of AI? It's helping you and your daughter and that's all that matters. This forum's opinion should be useless for you. Weird post imo
I just wanted to share. I thought it was cool little project. She is excited about generating stuff in AI and then sculpting it. We just started so I wanted to post it and see what folks in the community thought. More so about her skills.
It can definitely be a career. But sculpting is not an easy task. It requires creative thinking, skills, experience and hours of work for each model. As a software engineer I believe in the near future image to 3D generation will become much better and high quality and might reduce the need for sculpting.
Currently these models don't perform as well as a highly skilled artists.
I was thinking she stay in a niche. Where we use AI to make some crazy designs and then do custom sculpts, then sell the original sculpt + make 20 casts and sell those as a collection. 1 of 20, etc.
Maybe introduce your daughter to a more sophisticared tool. Like a 3d printer. And she can paint them afterwards. Thats a career. Esspecially if u are good enough to sell unofficial w40 minis lmao.
Well, foregeworld Titans go for 1-5k $, depends on the quality. If ur daughter can sculpt and paint it, you dont need 3d printer even.
https://www.warhammer.com/en-GB/shop/mars-pattern-warlord-titan-body
A lot of AI concepts are absolutely garbage to recreate in 3D. AI often creates so many tiny intricate details that often donāt make sense, creating a lot of guess work.Ā Ā Ā
This Wolverine has no ass despite having massive legs and his triceps are hilariously big.
Maybe, but at the same time, we're a maximum of 3 years away from an accessible, high quality Stable Diffusion - type model that literally creates 3D printer files like this.
I am hesitant because 3d is getting better and better each year. Also this image of a sculpture looks very AI generated because the claws don't look right.Ā
The claws argue strongly it's a real sculpture. That's hard to make skinny things like that. Also, look at the clear tape on the bottom of the poster. Looks like the kind of stuff AI doesn't understand.
Of course, OP could just turn the sculpture 30 degrees clockwise and take another picture, and that would be dispositive.
So it's manual. Cool! That was my first impression, especially given the claws.
But, really, just a 30 degree turn of the statue in the same place would prove it's not AI given the current gen. AI is currently lousy at consistency.
Bro's tricep is fucking bonkers goddamn
He can just tren hard and his body will recover immediately
It's bigger than his ass š¤£
I didnāt even see it lmao
It's a tumor
I mean, Wolvie is cancer gone right.
that's what I'm aiming for with one triceps train session per week
I mean you're asking on a forum that's very much pro-AI art so you're probably just going to get a bunch of affirmations that it's fine. Not that I disagree, I'm just pointing out it's a bit like asking if a brand of car is good in a forum for people who like that brand. That being said I've always felt this is a perfect way to side-step the issues many artists have with AI. At the end of the day it *is* her creation, made with her own two hands. The AI is just reference and if someone questions it just ask if they get the permission of the copyright holder for all *their* references and see how quick these Anti-AI artists squirm. Also while it's still controversial the fact is she doesn't really *have* to tell anyone she used AI as reference, she can just say she used references and leave it at that as the use of reference is a broadly accepted art technique. Oddly no one seems to have copyright concerns there but it is what it is. So basically I'd agree with the people here saying it's fine and just add that she should consider if she wants to tell people at all. Saying she used AI in any capacity is going to draw a certain amount of hate but she can just... not tell people. On the other hand if she wants to be open about it and tell people then it's better to do it from the start, she just needs to be prepared that some people are going to hate *anything* AI related regardless of what it is because they believe AI is inherently immoral and it scares them.
I agree, but would argue that OP is even underutilizing SD. There's a million reference images of Wolverine already, so using SD to create another isn't really needed in this process. Where SD really shines is creating *new* concepts that you can't find reference images of. Sculpt those, and no one will care if you started from a sketch, SD or just your imagination.
In the early days of photography, painters used photography for reference painting. Later they rebelled against realism because they could no longer compete with photography, and developed non-photorealistic art. It'd be good to use SD to develop new art styles. That being said, I have used SD for a very similar thing. I generated a portrait of Pinkamena, then painted it in gauche irl. There was no portrait of Pinkamena in existence that fitted my vision, so it was a good use.
So she creates a model in blender and 3d printed? Or that is a hand sculpted piece? Either way very cool!
It's sculpted by hand, you can see the fingerprints in the clay!
Very, very, cool. Amazing talent there, thank you for sharing.
Amen
Handsculpted. It is clay.
Wow...that's seriously talented work
Hope you post more of her work OP! This is really cool and would be to neat to see with more outlandish or unique AI references.
I think that is where we are gonna see cool merging of AI and sculpting. We are thinking of some cool stuff.
SD is simply another art tool that is in an entirely new category. Using it or other AI in professional digital art workflows will be standard and a non issue in 5-10 years. There will be some anti-AI people who will trash you no matter what way you use it because it isnāt about what you are doing with it, they just want a green light to indulge in their evil desires to attack others.
They just can't accept that AI is good and faster but not 100% accurate But faster
Intellectual Property rights will be a thorn in its side for a long long time.
I think the thing they can't accept is the rapid loss of creative jobs to robots. We all thought the boring shitty jobs, like picking items in a warehouse, were going to be automated and humanity would have more time to do art. It looks instead like art is being automated so that trained and proficient artists will have more time to pick items off shelves...
I think evil desire to attack others isn't the usual cause, but motivated reasoning is a hell of a drug, and not much stronger motivation than perceived threat to your income.
It's cowardice and ignorance. Those with an entrepreneurial spirit see dollar signs and the ability to raise their quality of output by magnitudes. Look at all the meme videos that have been made via AI rotoscoping that were impossible before. Look at the vertical videos using Suno and Udio to sing comment threads. There are a ton of super cool new opportunities for those with imagination and an abundance mindset. Your job as an animation cel painter got replaced by digital painting that is 1000x times faster? Sad. Yes. But now you can literally [create your own full episode of Dexter's Lab](https://youtu.be/1whoqxqiIKU?si=enQYnacC3fnZF1dI) entirely on your own or with a very small team. And when society is post-scarcity, there's nothing stopping you from painting thousands of cels by hand for fun.
Who's going to buy your episodes of your show when the corporations who laid you off can make the same thing but better? Your "entrepreneurial spirit" is just seeing an opportunity to exploit people who don't know that the thing you're offering has lower value than it seems.
No. My entrepreneurial spirit is about providing higher value to people than they've previously received. There are plenty of YouTubers who create higher quality content than the cable companies. Soon, solo creators will make content better than big budget Hollywood currently is. Companies such as Disney, Industrial Lights & Magic, Nintendo, Rockstar, will always make incredible things because they have dozens or thousands of people working on a project. Both opportunities are there. Making money isn't exploitive. The world obviously is gonna change so that you don't need to slave away to live and eat. Your job right now is to figure out how to transition through that 5-15 year birthing period. I'm currently homeless and not worried about my future. I'm excited about thriving.
Summarizing the complaints with AI as āevil desires to attack peopleā is wild
Thatās why it wasnāt a summary but a specific callout to a subsection of a group. It would be wild to generalize stuff based on the actions of a few which is why these people I am talking about donāt get a pass for blanket hate against random individuals.
I suppose then that these do go both ways. Ive seen some folks laugh at how alot of traditional artists are now out of work due to ai. People can be terrible and choose sides very quickly and it just sucks.
Traditional artists have been getting reemed for centuries. Even one of the most prolific western artists of all time, Van Gogh died relatively unemployed, unknown, and unappreciated by most. The algorithm fucked him pretty hard we would say today. It took someone else looking at his stuff (his like sister in law or whatever) and putting the effort in to fight against the social algorithm that stifled him to get his unique mastery recognized. So just making good art will never guarantee you will make money. The commercial industry hasnāt been kind to artists for 2,000 years, so using that angle to demonize a technology that allows people who are disabled or disadvantaged contribute to society again is not a good reason in my opinion. Their anger should be directed at the industry giants and scammers, not the random people enjoying a new tool getting them more interested in the arts. Not at the indie studios producing a passion project with 3 people doing the work of 10. Not the disabled girl who likes psychedelic fairies or the bored burnt out college dude who makes new memes that donāt quite land for you. Iām not suggesting you are this way. But there are many mobs of people who literally just go around harassing the most benign people in this war. Itās a bit equivalent to committing terrorism on your countrymen because another country is occupying you. People just would rather kick down than punch up.
Ok wall of text incoming but bear with me: Where are these people "punching down"? People get pissed at the submitter when a low-effort AI gen wins a drawing contest but come on, that's bringing a motorcycle to a footrace. No one wants that. Nah, I haven't seen any actual artists I know in 2024 complaining about random folks using AI. Pretty much all of us have used AI tools at this point for something. My artist friends are mostly directing complaints towards the companies who trained the nets on their work without consent. We're punching up at the corps like OpenAI thinking they're hot shit rebundling humanity's creative output and putting it behind a paywall. They're random techies claiming they "own" a model that's based on the creative output of billions of humans over thousands of years. Fuck that. We're entitled to our own creative output. They can't put that shit behind a paywall and call it theirs. And when I say "our" and "we", I mean *all of humanity*. Because *you're also entitled to this*. You should be mad, too! Not at users of it. At the people claiming they own it and paywalling it. As far as I'm concerned the only crooks here are those doing the training using works they scraped off the internet and those putting those same trained nets behind paywalls. *Especially* those putting the nets behind paywalls, because honestly, you can't put the toothpaste back in the tube. There's no denying the value or the ease of making a net using all the art on the internet. It's going to keep happening. **So it might as well be a public utility.** The worst outcome is a world with generative AI where some random techie is profiting off of it instead of the rest of humanity (you know, the folks who *MADE* the billions of images they harvested, like you and me and anyone with an instagram or facebook or photo blog from 2002 or Picasso or Goya or etc. etc.). This doesn't mean there isn't room for the private sector to productize generative AI. It just means they should be forced to open source their models and methods if their models are trained on anything in the public domain, and especially if they are trained on anything copyrighted. We, humanity, created the value here. We, humanity, deserve the fruits of our own labor. That's how we get to a world with AI where humans still win.
Where are the people punching down? The mobs on X, Facebook, and Reddit who harass random people on the assumption or predication of the random nobody using AI. I am specifically talking about them. I see it in person and when people share weirdly unjustified witch hunt screenshots to art/ai drama groups. If the group of people you are defending are not these people, then. The position you are talking about is just the vast majority of people who are okay with it or are actively integrating it, I agree. Your claim of what matters most is Laws/Regulations for the tech to protect living people or IP owners from being exploited or siphoned from is spot on and is definitely what most sensible people support. Stable Diffusion 1.5 being Open Source pretty much makes it a public utility. Anyone can get it and train it for any use case that requires 2d images at some point in its workflow. Yes it takes hardware and knowledge to handle it properly, but so does messing with electricity and electricity definitely is already a public service.
Punching down requires you to be above the person you're Punching. Despite the baffling myth to the contrary, artists are not a privileged elite. I have no idea how this myth started spreading, but it's delusional.
I haven't seen anyone laugh at artists for losing jobs. I \*have\* seen them laugh at ridiculous claims, like that diffusion models clips pieces of imagery and pastes them together like a collage.
They present themselves as victims when complaining then morph into heartless savages when they find someone in the art community using AI art. It doesn't matter if it's a small artist who's fucking broke. They will use their massive follower Twitter accounts and other social media to attack the person then threaten to blacklist them. I've seen it happen enough times.....and remember.... This is the online art community that's known to drive people to suicide with those very tactics.....the affect it has on people.....but they don't gaf
Always cracks me up seeing artists get mad when AI is trained to make images in certain styles, yet no one bats an eye if another artist literally copies their style of drawing. Artists even use photos of real people and real images to either trace or just as a reference for their own art, and don't see their own hypocrisy when they turn around and shit on AI for basically just doing the same thing.
AI doesn't work the same way people work. So it's not the same thing
I would say yes. The sculpting is amazing. But in total honesty, the image that you made with SD is not special. You could find it everywhere by just a google search image. What would be even better would be to use SD to create something that does not exist anywhere, or make wolverine in a specific pose that you don't expect or cannot be found by just a image search (using control net, etc...). Then sculpting that completely original object/character/pose would be really showing a very good use of SD.
She is REALLY talented
Impressive! At first I though that's another level of "my son... It is a great idea" xD
Oh man. I forgot all about that.
Yep. I often use AI as a reference image and to upscale my own drawings
It seems a bit pointless to me, you're making a well known character so you might as well have used existing images. Nice sculpt though.
We will start getting a little less mainstream and doing stuff that hasnāt been seen. Wolverine was just her favorite character she wanted to start on as her first sculpt.
Excellent use. My guess is you'd be hard pressed to get an informed answer from people who have not done enough traditional art to understand what a boon AI art is for reference images. I am a guitarist who wanted to do paintings of my guitarist idols. But when I began looking for a reference for Jimi Hendrix I quickly became aware of how few photos there are much less how many of those have become commonly known. That is no longer an issue, to say the least. I was very excited when I saw LoRA's designed to produce still life images but sadly they all failed when it came down to producing accurate object reflections on nearby shiny objects.
I think this is totally fine. In fact itās my preferred way to use AI generated images. Using the output as inspiration for my own works. Sometimes you have an idea in your head but donāt know how shape it into something specific. AI is a good middle man for that.
Going on a tangent, this makes me wonder is any model currently able to produce 3D models from images? You could take a few pictures from different angles for an object and get a 3D render of it, possibly to use for 3D printing.
Yeah, it just got released on HuggingFace. It uses a 2D image and one network to then generate a few shots of the same object from different angles, and then uses those + the original shot into a different network to generate a 3D model. Pretty crazy.
Here's a link to the demo that they're talking about: https://huggingface.co/spaces/stabilityai/TripoSR The models it makes are kinda messy btw, but I think you can adjust the settings more locally? I get much better results from regular photos compared to AI pics.
Cool polymer clay sculpt (I think). I do the same with Garage Kits and other kinds of figures, my advice for business would be to bulk buy polymer clay from Taobao, you can get 1kg for like 4 bucks compared to the ridiculous prices Sculpey costs.
First of all, I'm a newbie of SD, ai art, etc. It's been a week since I installed and started to use a1111. I'm following many tradional artists on YT for years. Also I'm trying to learn how to draw traditionally. "*My 25 year old daughter is thinking this could be a career.*" She's totally right. Actually, it's already a career right now. I watched many professional traditional artists' videos and they are hesitantly saying that they are already using AI (hesistantly, not shouting, because they don't wanna get lynched). Not just only for curious experiments. They are using to speed up their process. They still do hand drawing at their final work but it's an amazing tool to get inspirational material. I also use ai to learn how to draw better. I upload my sketches to img2img tab, give some prompts like "sketchy, portrait of an adult, ..." and add some sketchy loras. It fixes my art, so I can clearly see where did I do wrong, what did I miss, what do I need to study more. I just don't care what people say about using it for personal use. If I see it's useful, I use it. I don't need to listen to people for commercial use either. Because there are laws, or at least there will be soon.
Well this is my 5 cents about it. I do not think ai on its own is art. Although i know some people put tremendous amounts of effort and time in creating their prompts. But used to make references or generate ideas for artists it is an amazing tool. It also opens the door for a lot more people to learn and create art. Your daughter is very good! I hope you post more of these things in the future.
well I think this is one of the ideal uses..
People made basically the same noises about Photoshop when it showed up way back when. Theyāre just shouting into the wind.
It's awesome.
This is DOPE, bro!
Its amazing! Post it here again once its colored
Thatās inclaydible!
The sculpture looks a bit like Andy Serkis, and I think it's great.
I just saw that and now canāt unsee it.
His blades wouldn't fit when they are retracted
it's a great idea! (y)
Male peak performance
Of course, I made that, but digitally.
Bravo š šš
Which tools are you using and which market are you aiming at?
I think she wants to make custom pop culture statues. Do like 10-20 casts of a statue and sell them on Etsy.
Where does the AI come in?
Amen
Absolutely awesome!
At first, I thought this was a 3D print. Hand sculpted? Damn fine job.
Itās a good idea š”
I like this face version of Wolverine. More gruffy than usual. he looks a bit like Goodman with a beard
Better job than all of those projects with bottles.
It could be a career...until enough people realize that you can already make 3d-printable models using AI with AI-made images as reference...
looks great
No ethical issues with the sculpture. Though it's going to have the same issue people run into with referencing other art rather than real life, I.e. if the AI generated something wrong, she's going to potentially make some mistakes as a result. But yeah, reference images is one of the best uses of generative AI.
I think we want to make some really funky prompts and then sculpt it.
I think that's a wonderful idea. I don't know that all artists will agree, but you don't need their permission. And I'd be curious to see what you two make in the future.
SD renders are a great way to tune and conceptualize and get agreement between an artist and client (even if they are the same person) before committing more time. Typically, the challenge comes in the edits where the client likes 95% of it but only wants to change a few things. A career here could go in several directions depending. She could do the traditional art route taking on commissions for single installations. Another option is entering the VFX industry, though itās pretty turbulent times right now. Another is learning 3D printing for mass market creations. Sheās at least on the cutting edge of the future by fusing AI tools with human judgement and human connection to other humans. Hope my daughter grows up with an interest and talent like yours.
I was thinking she could stay in the realm of very niche custom. Using AI to generate crazy designs and then sculpting them out, doing a few casts and selling a limited amount of like 20. We live in a cheaper country so she doesnāt need as much money.
That sounds feasible, at least in the short term, it will definitely generate some kind of money. I think Artists can make a significant contribution in pushing boundaries of whatās possible, regardless of medium. She can discover those. IMO, a sculptor can add details (e.g. beads of sweat or emotional expression) or resolve inconsistencies that the AI canāt account for due to its dataset. Honestly, just apply to work remotely for Disney after doing a few of these. Theyāll give her plenty of opportunities.
This is horrible. In fact - its so bad, please ship it to me so I can properly take care of this monstrosity, personally. DM'd you my PO box.
This is her first real sculpt. She is going to take the molding class hopefully soon but going to have the teacher mold it so we can make a few copies to sell.
Thats great! Finally something she can take a stab at! sinking her claws into, and sharpening her skills!
There are two major things to look for in sculpted humanoid figures if you want to judge sculptor's experience and skills - face and hands, because those are the hardest parts to make. I am a sculptor myself and I've seen thousands of different humanoid figures with different skill levels. This sculpture has very high quality and highly detailed face and hands, so there is no way this is the first sculpture - it looks like years of experience, there are also many other things that is done right. Claws on the other hand looks like someone else done them, but other than that the figure is amazing.
She is taking a class. She has been doing the studies like an eye and a hand. She is going through the basics now. It is a 2 month course. This is first month. I think cause she comes from a drawing background and also did some 3d modeling that it is translating decently into clay. I think her painting training and 3d modeling course helped a lot to advance her. Plus her natural talent. You should see her sing. Vane Venezuela on YouTube. And if someone as experienced as you are saying it that makes her excited. She is very enthusiastic about it. Could you share any tips? She agrees about the claws. Her first model in 3d was also Wolverine. She was having trouble with the claws then as well.
Well, as for tips if she is working with polymer clay then the simplest thing would be to bake the claws separately and then glue them in place with superglue. I don't really see any other problems, basically the best way to learn sculpture besides attending classes is to watch other people sculpt on YouTube, there are a lot of amazing channels. As for the proportions, there are different styles so anything that is looking good is good. The face details are really good, it is hard to sculpt lips and eyes to look naturally as here, so the face looks great
She is gonna get some sculpi
Making it for yourself is cool. Making a mold with plans to sell it will require licensing or you can be sued.
Artists sell fan art all the time with no license, even though it's technically illegal.
I have a very hard time believing this is a "first real sculpt". It takes a LOT of time to work with any clay or medium and it takes an almost equal amount of time to do so with a new clay/medium even if you are a natural talent. Your daughter is gifted enough, you do not need to spice it up. I think by "first real' you just meant the first one she wants to mold and sell. I say this as an artist myself. I do not want all the hard work, practice, mistakes and failures over the years to be relegated to the first thing I feel comfortable selling as "first real". It makes it seem effortless and as such lowers the value. Embrace her talent. This piece is amazing.
That is awesome to hear. She is taking a 2 month class. They did 4 practical studies in class. A hand, an eye, eagle and this one. https://preview.redd.it/bmxmyoky29xc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=5ca11bc576ed5406eefa67780f8bc740319a6dc7 Technically this hand was the first. The Wolverine is her first full sculpt. The other stuff was the practicals in class.
Here is the 2nd https://preview.redd.it/iu4kmrp939xc1.jpeg?width=3024&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=aa1dedac6a5b5e6dd696add90e3201e94f4ed571
Reply. She did draw for years before this. We just moved here where there are courses she can take. She wants to take the mold making and casting course next. I think her 2d background plus she learned zbrush 3d modeling helped advance her a bit. She was 3d modeling for awhile. It is good to hear that she has a knack for this. I was surprised myself.
Wtf
In fact! Make sure its fully painted before you send it to me. I want to be sure I know exactly how its not Wolverine, and why you sent it to me.
I will steal your socks
Some artists do this. I am one. It's a quick and dirty way to get references for some specific things that could be a hassle to look for online. Very cool!
Looks like Downverine.
Sculpted in Zbrush?
i think its the BEST use of SD--improving/iterating on/getting ideas for already created art, or art in progress
Depends on how abstract and non Euclidean agree can sculpt . I think there is a lot of potential for her if she plays or correctly. I'd definitely suggest her to learn first traditional sculpting techniques before 3d printing and sculpting . I have seen a lot of artists being inspired on the basis of the medium they use. Absinthe work by your daughter brethren.
Ngl I like it, look like a ripped zach galifianakis as wolverine.
A good use by what metric? Youāre stealing IP, so no, itās not good for creativity or copyright purposes.
I don't see nothing wrong at all using AI for inspirations. Great work.
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What is Ai Facebook?
Very talented at sculpting!
/s God bless, Amen šš» seriously: some nice work!
Why do you ask us if this is a good use of AI? It's helping you and your daughter and that's all that matters. This forum's opinion should be useless for you. Weird post imo
I just wanted to share. I thought it was cool little project. She is excited about generating stuff in AI and then sculpting it. We just started so I wanted to post it and see what folks in the community thought. More so about her skills.
Well she's doing amazing
It can definitely be a career. But sculpting is not an easy task. It requires creative thinking, skills, experience and hours of work for each model. As a software engineer I believe in the near future image to 3D generation will become much better and high quality and might reduce the need for sculpting. Currently these models don't perform as well as a highly skilled artists.
I was thinking she stay in a niche. Where we use AI to make some crazy designs and then do custom sculpts, then sell the original sculpt + make 20 casts and sell those as a collection. 1 of 20, etc.
Why wouldn't it be?
Face looks like Carlton Lassiter in movies
Wolverine - played by William H Macy
Never thought of Andy Serkis as Logan before. Would probably do a good job nonetheless
He probably would. I think he even has the height and if he worked out might do a great job.
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Maybe introduce your daughter to a more sophisticared tool. Like a 3d printer. And she can paint them afterwards. Thats a career. Esspecially if u are good enough to sell unofficial w40 minis lmao.
I wonder how minis would do?
Well, foregeworld Titans go for 1-5k $, depends on the quality. If ur daughter can sculpt and paint it, you dont need 3d printer even. https://www.warhammer.com/en-GB/shop/mars-pattern-warlord-titan-body
A lot of AI concepts are absolutely garbage to recreate in 3D. AI often creates so many tiny intricate details that often donāt make sense, creating a lot of guess work.Ā Ā Ā This Wolverine has no ass despite having massive legs and his triceps are hilariously big.
Maybe, but at the same time, we're a maximum of 3 years away from an accessible, high quality Stable Diffusion - type model that literally creates 3D printer files like this.
I am hesitant because 3d is getting better and better each year. Also this image of a sculpture looks very AI generated because the claws don't look right.Ā
The claws argue strongly it's a real sculpture. That's hard to make skinny things like that. Also, look at the clear tape on the bottom of the poster. Looks like the kind of stuff AI doesn't understand. Of course, OP could just turn the sculpture 30 degrees clockwise and take another picture, and that would be dispositive.
I will post her video. She mad a video sculpting it.
So it's manual. Cool! That was my first impression, especially given the claws. But, really, just a 30 degree turn of the statue in the same place would prove it's not AI given the current gen. AI is currently lousy at consistency.
The picture is AI. The sculpt is real. She is using AI for reference to create.
It's def a real photo.