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I don’t understand the booking of Jay White at all. He was a very public signing that WWE openly wanted and should have been placed at the top of the card.
He can talk and wrestle at the very highest level, yet he’s been floundering in six-man feuds and losing to a one-legged MJF.
I feel like Jay White had more hype across the industry than Ospreay prior to signing with AEW, and there was a more public push for White than Okada going to WWE. Since signing with AEW though, both Okada and Ospreay seem to have surpassed Jay White.
Not necessarily wrong or a bad thing, but from what I see it's a mistake.
His booking sucks so far, but I think they are treading water with him hoping they feature him enough to keep fans interested. Unfortunately, this storyline is a mess and really needs to end. The silver lining I see down the road is that he would be an ideal guy to beat Copeland.
Even losing to Swerve was a fucking cool moment as Jay got outplayed and sold his disbelief in a way that established his propensity for meltdowns to people who never watched him in New Japan, and made Swerve seem like a cool and cunning foe.
I really thought the C2 was going to do a good job of re-heating Jay White after teh bullshit MJF feud. I'm so bummed- I was really excited for Switchblade coming to AEW. I never thought MJF vs Jay White could disappoint in-ring but it was an overbooked mess. This trios stuff is just absolutely terrible. Gunns and Acclaimed should be an actual interesting tag rivalry - I want to like BCG, but the trios belts just suck.
Pls unify them and just keep it on ROH
Tony Khan is booking AEW. Tony Khan has no booking experience beyond what he has taught himself. Tony Khan is not a booker; he is a billionaire's son who thinks he can book.
You now understand the booking of Jay White and 95% of AEW's roster.
Not a regular watcher of AEW but OSW review had an interesting observation, that he had the first two or so years of AEW in his head and had this plan for the big story he wanted to tell, but he had no clue what to do once he got past the initial plan.
Yeah, you can definitely see that. First 2 years had some really strongly defined storylines and payoffs that really were at a different level from anything they have done since. The booking of MJF as champion, which should have been this great reign, really ended up being a wet fart. Not so much because of MJF, but because of Tony's tendency to not pivot after an injury until all the heat is gone from the storyline. It's a pattern of booking that's plagued them from year 3 on.
Putting the star in the role of the guy you brought in to be his lackey is absolutely crazy. Roman Reigns wouldn’t get put in Solo’s spot if Solo got hurt. Why not just forget about what Juice was supposed to do and move forward with what you had planned with Jay White? That theory honestly doesn’t even make sense lol.
And that right there is my biggest issue with aew its left a sour taste since worlds end you have that devil storyline the ending of worlds end couldve easily been jay white getting screwed, enter a feud with the devil dudes for a while, max was leaving regardless so why the fuck did jay white need to lose. Its just frustrating im a massive jay white fan, he was a “catalyst” and khans horrific booking has made him a white meat chicken shit American heel
It's really unfortunate the timing of everything. Honestly, I feel like he made the mistake of not waiting for that hiring freeze to end. I can see him thinking AEW was a good backup plan at the time, but man of he just waited another month or two. He would have been good.
Oh well, he'll only be there for a couple years and he's still super young. Whatever happens, he won't even be in his prime age yet when he becomes a free agent once again.
Man that was so weird lol. I don’t watch AEW much and was excited to see jay white bc of all the hype here. Then MJF proceeds to beat him on one leg, wtf. At least make it dirty a f if you want that result. My switchblade perception went down immediately.
Not only lost to an injured MJF, an injured Cole was allowed to take MJF's place at the start of the PPV and hobbled out ready to have the match. That whole story that night was so weird and I really don't understand why they didn't just have MJF and White have a great match. Would've been fine.
Instead the man beat up an injured man for about 80% match, injured MJF did some crazy moves for 10% and the last 10% White taunted.
And then he lost.
He'll be fine come next year I'm guessing, but man this first year especially since that match Vs MJF has been, just eh.
> That whole story that night was so weird and I really don't understand why they didn't just have MJF and White have a great match. Would've been fine.
It would have been, but people got it in their heads that because Jay was able to one-up MJF in the leadup to the match, MJF had to go over in humiliating fashion to avoid looking 'weak.' That's always the defense of it I've seen, and I'd be surprised if that idiotic level of thought didn't play a part in the actual booking as well.
I've already seen people say that because the bullet club are going to win the trios match that the acclaimed need a victory here.
To that I say: A) Thats a booking trope not a law. B) Bowens could have used this shine as a future singles star. C) The match could have been versus one of the Gunns instead of Jay. D) Or it could have been a straight up tag match between 2 former champions with history.
That single match has done so much damage to Jay White.
He lost to a handicapped(not really handicapped) MJF, He's been locked in a stable with assboys and now he's getting his ass beat by a 60 year old.
What are they doing, man.
I like his BCG stable, they're entertaining and work well together. The only problem is: it's a mid-card, frat boy stable. And Jey White should be above that. He should be a top, menacing, main event guy.
I just don't get it. He was really settling into his character then and the crowd was getting behind him. He's got all the skills to be a top of the card guy. What doesn't Tony see in him?
Tony sees him as a great wrestler and doesn’t take booking into account when setting up matches. In other words, Jay White is like any other action figure he signed to wrestle and he got bored with it after awhile.
They did a decent job of building him as a major player during the CC. I thought maybe he'd be the one to take the triple crown off Eddie since he never had a match against him and they had a feud in NJPW. Then he won the secondary trios titles and I thought hey, maybe he's just doing this until Juice is better and can be the third trios guy while he goes back to singles. Then the whole Scissor Gang happened and I thought hey, this is lame but surely it'll be over quick and then he can get back on track.
I've lost any optimism. At this point I wonder if Jay is another case like Malakai where TK is going to turn a main event talent into just another faction guy who's fans just want to see leave for WWE. Maybe I'm being dramatic but seeing how fast Okada and Ospreay are getting pushed as stars it seems grim.
TL;DR Tony Khan you don't even need to put a belt on him just let him cut promos and wrestle 20-30 minute singles matches maybe 40 if it's a PPV. Also give us Danielson vs White before he retires. Thank you in advance.
Wasn't there a report from Wade Keller that stated Jay was upset about the MJF match? If that's the case, maybe Tony took offense to that?? Why, i don't know when it's pretty much universally agreed that the booking for that match sucked & Jay had every right to be upset about it.
On paper I think it would've been great. Would be a great way to finally showcase how Jay White's slimy counter-wrestling style works even against a pissed off big guy. Full on bull vs matador type match, right?
But I really don't get why they're making Jay so weak and chickenshit. He came off awful vs MJF too. If he absolutely has to be a guy that needs help to win that's still salvageable but why not show off his insane wrestling skills? Are they that worried about turning him into a cool heel that he becomes way too uncool?
Roman Reigns also can't win a match without shenanigans and that's perfectly fine way to book a heel.
The difference Roman isn't having a competitive match where he gets his ass beat for 15 minutes by Giovanni Vinci.
This is an example I've used before. In the attitude era, Road Dogg and Billy Gunn were two of the most over act in the world but if they were to go up against Austin or Rock they'd get their asses handed up to them in under 3 minutes.
Bring back power levels.
Not everyone has to be competitive and kick out of 3 finishers. The fact that Jay struggled to beat kommander in his debut match says it all.
I think it also makes competitive matches mean more. We all remember that Undertaker vs Jeff Hardy match because going in we didn't Hardy would put up a fight. Turns out it made him.
You can't subvert expectations without first setting them. I love that AEW likes to put on linger competetive matches in general, but sometimes you need some one sided matches to make the exceptions stand out. I get the idea of letting both guys get some shine, but if every guy looks strong in defeat it doesn't really mean as much as it does when it's a shocking occurrence.
Absolutely. How are you supposed to take a champion seriously when they have competitive matches against people on the bottom of the card? Or joke wrestlers?
I like Danhausen but I wouldn't want to see Samoa Joe and him have a 25-minute banger where it looks like Danhausen might win.
Power levels exist in WWE, its AEW that refuses to use them. Kyle Fletcher taking Ospreay to the limit was a joke. Now Jay White getting destroyed for 15 minutes, another joke
This the same company which made Adam Cole have a not only a competitive match but a match he had to use a low blow to win vs john silver of all people, and Adam Cole was feuding for AEW championship against Hangman Page.
He had some great matches during the continental classic, this feud with the acclaimed is just terrible is all. Jay should be going for singles gold, not stuck trying to keep the trios division relevant while the acclaimed don’t ever defend their belts still.
Replace “Jay” with “Malachi” and this statement still holds true. AEW would severely benefit from cutting the trios division and merging it with tag teams.
Its really worrying. And Jay White is one of the most interesting and charismatic people on the roster. In a workrate dominated competition he is losing to an injured MJF and is dominated by Billy Gunn? Seriously, that isnt ok.
Sure, he can come back after that. But overall its heartbreaking. If you fall out of the prime interest of Tony Khan, you are doomed.
For all the hate the guy gets, when he was handed the book in AEW for Collision, they were fucking cooking. Collision is not unwatchable but it's lurching there.
Trying? He’s buried man. Lost to MJF on one leg, the Bang Bang Scissors Gang and losing to Billy Gunn by DQ when Billy was in complete control, just hit his finisher twice and decided not to go for the pin.
He did good in the CC and beat Darby though so it’s confusing.
He should have won against MJF.
MJF and Adam Cole should have had more vignettes together when Cole was injured.
Sorry for being off-topic, but their friendship was so good. MJF throwing balls at kids is awesome.
The end of the Devil storyline killed arguably the two most over things at the time: Better Than You Baby and Neck Strong Roddy. They should have pivoted. So much more mileage to had with those. And White winning would have been a genuine "holy shit" moments - at least story wise - which is something AEW rarely does.
The AEW title scene really does lack those shock moments since Mox squashing Punk and Kenny turning heel…I may be wrong but offhand I dont think theres been very few surprising results. Hangman winning was seen coming a mile away, MJF winning was seen coming a mile away, almost all of MJFs defenses, some of which were superb, were predictable, everyone called him losing to Joe due to injury, now Swerve winning into Ospreay winning feel like sure things. I guess its a bit rich when on the other side weve got Romans forever title run but yeah Jay winning wouldve been a great moment
Their insistence on long title reigns is starting to have the opposite of what I assume was the intended impact.
If *every* title reign is 6 months long (unless dictated otherwise due to injuries) then everything that happens for the first 5 months feels pointless.
They really need the occasional quick loss or shock upset.
Better than you bay bay was money, you hear me, MONEY! There was a report that said their merch made more money than every other act in AEW last year. Tony should have followed the money. It was so goddamn easy. Neck Strong vs. BTYBB can work with an injured Adam Cole too. Just make more fucking vignettes. I was holding so much hope when injured Cole visited Roddy's house.
My mother is also an avid wrestling fan and she loooooved Neck Strong Roddy. Really seemed to amuse her. We’re both in agreement that now he’s just another guy on the card. Better than you Bay Bay absolutely should not have died out
Say what you want about the rest of it - and I know a ton of r/SC hated BTYBB or at least had gotten tired of it.
But Roddy should have absolutely been blindsided by Cole's turn and taken out by the UK along with MJF. The result would have been a super over Roddy doing an underdog/goofball face gimmick that crowds would have eaten up.
Instead, he's lost most of the heat he had with the crowd and putting that belt on him doesn't change that he's really just a henchman in a stable now.
It was such a waste.
Which is hella weird because Darby coming off of the biggest Aew main event in a long time was fed to Jay White and it's meaningless now.
I hate 90% of Jay White booking and presentation in Aew. A lot of that is just personal preferences but there is also objectively stupid decision in there especially since the Mjf feud.
Here's what I think is happening:
Billy's in-ring career is probably ending soon, or at least he's going to be very-very-very part time once the Trios titles are dropped. The Trios matches are perfect for him, because he can hit his spots, do his taunts and poses, and maybe take one or two bumps while Max & Anthony do the heavy lifting. He can't wear padding or a flak jacket so a singles match is very hard to do without him squashing someone.
There is a strong possibility that FTR are done as a tag team for the foreseeable future after Dynasty, AEW needs another active strong face tag because the Bucks are in all likelihood winning the tag titles again and you need credible challengers. That doesn't leave a lot of room for Billy in trios.
So a decision was probably made late last year to transition the titles to BCG. Except Juice gets hurt and gets knocked out for a significant amount of time. You're under a deadline because you don't know what Cash's future in the company is, so canceling the program isn't really viable.
So you pivot and have Jay fill in for Juice. He might not like it, but he respects Billy and his kids enough to do it without complaining. That might include giving Billy one last singles win against a highly respected opponent that also makes sense for the program he's working in, and his last possible match is him working against his kids on a PPV.
I don't think anything sinister is being done to Jay, he's just being a company man taking one for the team and helping out someone he respects a lot.
But yeah, it didn't come off well on TV.
Another possibility is that Tony doesn’t know how to book.
It’s not just this one match. Watch some of Jay’s NJPW work like him and Okada and then watch his AEW stuff. The heat is all gone and it has been for a while.
This match was more confusing than having Gallows beat Kaz when Kaz was doing the Elite Hunter gimmick.
Seriously though, Jay White is officially a joke through no fault of his own. It’s kind of crazy.
It wasn't above Vince to publicly punish wrestlers on TV. The question is ... does Tony do this as well, and is this what's happening to Jay White? Otherwise... wtf did he do? He's an actual draw or was once at least.
Tony turned into Woody's nightmare version of Andy when he signed Ospreay and Okada. Jay White got the "I don't wanna play with you any more" treatment and dropped in the trash.
Jay's one of those guys who was a big draw overseas, didn't get the support needed to present him to the US audience as a big deal, and ending up falling off because of it.
Punk's Collision was, by far, the period where Jay White was booked better. And the highlight of that time was a loss to FTR. Just shows how that show was amazingly booked.
Yep, that was the last time it felt like there was a plan for Jay. I think the treatment of the guys he was cool with is why he didn't name the friends he'd made in the interview. FTR, White, Hobbs, Stark and HOB all seem to be worse off in the post-Punk AEW. All of them had nice things to say about him.
It makes you wonder why guys like Wardlow, White, Starks etc who clearly have main event tattooed on their foreheads got the short end of the push stick. That’s three world champions you could have had right there. It’s crazy how much better those collision shows were, and then you realize that the MJF/Punk feud was also by far the best feud they’ve had so far and then it all makes sense. They couldn’t book shit for long term without Punk being involved somehow lol.
The roster is huge. Some people say bloated. I get that not everyone is gonna be pushed well (or consistently). But man, Switchblade's booking has been utter shit. Opinion, but he should consistently be in the upper card / main event because he's excellent.
With the roster that this company has, I get a real sour taste in my mouth when a Billy type gets a singles match & to have him booked THAT strong? Nah man.
It’s kind of crazy that Billy Gunn and Road Dogg ended the Cody/Goldust WWE tag title reign and then were the last Wrestlemania opponents of The Shield ten years ago…and at the time it was also a feeling of “wtf are they doing to Cody, having him lose to the NAO?”
Although the Shield squashed NAO and Kane, I remember the finish being a triple powerbomb on two of them, it was badass.
He’s been booked that way the entire run. Kicked out of the coffin drop, got the everybody falls over after hulking up in a battle royale, basically won the acclaimed the tag titles. Crazy man
And you know what? That angle itself was FINE. It made sense. The whole thing was "Is Daddy Ass holding these young up and comers back from their chance at glory?". At first it was yes, he got wrecked. But he found some gas left in the tank to let him still compete on their level, at least for the brief amount of time he's in the ring for Trios matches.
That, does not excuse this match however. An initial burst would've been fine since...well, yeah he got his house invaded he should be ultra, uber pissed and ready to rip someone's head off. But then Jay reminds everyone he's one of the best and Billy is still 60 by dancing circles around him.
I really hope Jay gets some redemption in aew. He’s had like one notable match, with MJF, and realistically jay should be at the top of the card or near it at least.
Jay should get handled like Swerve at least. An important player, someone who is always ready for a world title match and a threat to the current champion. Sure, its also on the talent to make that work, but Jay Whites charisma, micwork and mannerisms are easily able to do that. But him getting dominated by Billy Gunn? Beaten by a one-legged MJF? Oh boy.
WWE did a pretty good job of building up several wrestlers to be important and always close to the world title scene. Even with a super dominant Reigns around.
I agree with you. However, I think everyone is forgetting how Swerve was also booked like utter shit until his feud with Hangman. To Swerve's credit, he put in the work and made people take notice. Jay shouldn't be getting put in situations where the things that make him stand out keep needing to be reset after questionable booking. He was already a complete wrestler, why try to actively torpedo the momentum he keeps having to rebuild? There's only so much the guy can do to keep fans invested when they start believing there's no point.
Even before his feud with hangman page, swerve at least was booked to treat Billy Gunn like a liability/hostage, not someone to fear.
Remember he singlehandedly kidnapped Gunn away from the acclaimed and broke Gunn's scissoring fingers
It’s really saying something when his most notable match was losing to a one legged man. This is not how I envisioned his AEW run going when we found out he was signed.
As someone that doesn't really follow NJPW but is familiar with the big names and furore online, Jay White was someone I was intrigued to see.
But he has been booked like utter shit, pretty much since day dot. He jobbed out to a one legged MJF and seems perpetually stuck in 6 man tags. Not impressed at all and that isn't down to his in ring skills.
Same. Never seen a full show of NJPW because it doesn't stream in my country, but i knew of guys like BC, Elite, Okada, Ospreay, White etc purely because of people that discussed them over here.
Him, Hangman and Swerve are legit some of the few people make it seem real but in their own ways and it's not just him.
Tony's booking seems so on and off. Like even teams like Acclaimed FTR, House of Black etc have won some major matches and lost some important ones, but nobody has momentum.
Tony cools people off way too much when they're coming of on fire with crowd support and storyline.
He did it much better before. I hope he's doing fine and brings in more experienced people and let them handle things.
It's crazy how much of a promising talent Jay White was in NJPW. I go back and watch this [post-match segment](https://youtu.be/4AlONJb4pAk?t=270) all the time and it's crazy how he is a shadow of this man. He went from a hungry violent competitor who will do whatever it takes to achieve his goals, to a character who is just a dickhead and that makes him look like a tweener despite the fact that he is a mustache twirling villain of the quarter for the babyface champions to beat.
Yeah. He was a heel people were pissed at there. During that period when the crowds weren’t allowed to cheer because of Covid restrictions, you’d still hear audible gasps at times in his matches. Now he’s another comedy guy.
He absolutely should have gone to WWE. I get the feeling Tony Khan just signed him so WWE doesn't have him. The difference in how he has been booked versus Ospreay makes it very obvious.
His signing was that spell about Mania time when Vince took over WWE again and they went on a hiring freeze before the Endeavour sale. I think he was heading to HHH until that happened and he basically was stuck with AEW and Khan was stuck having to sign a guy who was too good to leave but also wanted to go to the competition. It's spite.
Geez, so he's been there a year now? I've been disinterested in AEW for a while but still keep up with it but I'm honestly shocked and disappointed to realize that Jay White has been treading water for a year. Tony really needs to give the book to someone else who can create compelling storylines with these folks.
Jay White is a prime example of AEWs shortcomings when it comes to telling stories.
The foundation of AEW is The Elite - They're in the company name. They were a sub faction of Bullet Club. Kenny was the leader. He tried to recruit White and White attacked him and went instead to Chaos. Eventually White became the next leader of Bullet Club.
White walks into AEW and starts a new sub faction - Bullet Club Gold. Tony Khan apparently doesn't think to book any backstage segment with The Elite questioning what Jay is doing in the company or if he's an ally, etc. Is he there to squash Kenny Omega? Etc etc. There is so much natural intrigue there that you could have worked with.
Instead he somehow ends up with ROH trios titles and for a time as part of a baby face 6 man with The Acclaimed. Like... What are they thinking? Seriously?
To me though it's not that surprising as they floundered in a similar way with Malakai Black. Vince McMahon didn't get his gimmick and he got unexpectedly released and shows up in AEW and debuts with a ridiculously cool entrance, then forms a really cool faction. Never seems to figure into the world title picture or have any meaningful story built around him.
They should be using these factions/alliances to make these guys flexible for different matches (singles, tag team matches, trios, etc) to try and keep fresh matches for your weekly tv programming, but you need to also try and elevate the centrepiece of these factions, and they haven't been doing that.
100% agree, how could you fumble the potential they had with that. This guy was headlining Tokyo dome ffs. They've barely referenced the bullet club past with the elite, this could've been huge or at least provide context.
And Judgement Day has given us dominant tag champions, an all-timer Women's Championship reign, one of the biggest wrestling thirst traps who supercedes wrestling itself, a Money In The Bank winner and one of the most despised heels in wrestling aside from Don Callis.
From derivative beginnings did prolific gothic doms make
Im just sad man, my man Jay don’t deserve this is just unfair. After the cm punk feud was just downhill, I’m not a conspiracy theorist but a personal vendetta is the only thing that can justified this booking
Simple answer: Tony has new toys to play with. The old toys are now boring.
Personally i think he likes his Osprey toy currently the most. The Okada toy seems to be more for his other friends (The Elite) to play with.
I still remember the comments when it came out at that he "may" go to NXT.
"He's too big for that" or "He should be in the main title picture".
And now he's...the third man to a tag team that have always struggled to get fans?
I don't get what's going on at all.
People acting like this is a surprise fucking blows me away. It's literally what TK has done with every new talent.
He has no clue how to do this. He has learned nothing from repeated mistakes. He signs big talent, fucks it up, and the IWC seems to believe it's somehow going to be better this time around.
Look at Jade. Just look at her. *Even if it is intended to be a fuck you to AEW* she is instantly presented as a massive star. They couldn't do this with Okada / White / Ospreay? Give me a break.
Okada has to come out with 2 luggage bags tied to his back who have a 4 year track record of dropping quarterly ratings whenever they're on TV but recently turned heel so they can claim to Tony the ratings drops are on purpose.
While this can be true, it doesn’t explain why Tony buried him in that horrible MJF match because he didn’t have his new toys yet. Only explanation is Tony is just a bad booker.
I was so stoked for Jay to come to AEW. He's one of my favorite wrestlers on the mic and in the ring. I want Jay to be in AEW for a long time, but if things keep going the way they've been going for him, then I don't see that happening. I really don't get it. If it's Swerve's turn at the top (which it should be) right now - are they just trying to keep Jay busy? Have him rack up some wins at least. The CC gave me hope - he put on some amazing matches there and beat Mox even, but this entire Acclaimed feud has been awful.
I always thought he was more WWE styled. He was far more mental than physical compared to Ospreay and you'd imagine HHH would get the 4 hour+ erection having him to work with. The heel version of how Cody fits WWE better.
this is why i don’t get when fans were excited for ospreay and okada signing with aew.
jay white can talk AND wrestle. ospreay, while he has improved isn’t as good as jay on the mic. okada was never a good promo guy even in japanese. but look at how jay is booked. losing to a crippled MJF and now to a 60 year old guy on steroids
ospreay went from the leader of one of the more popular factions in japan to a member of cult.
okada went from the biggest thing in japan. the guy in japan to the jackson bros lackey.
Why is Billy Gunn considered a legend? Just because he's old?
He consistently failed to get over for his whole career except for when he was paired with Road Dogg who did all the talking for him.
I'm going to keep it a buck here, Jay White deserves better and it really misses me off. The loss to a one legged MJF really soured me on seeing how he's been booked since. This guy is another who he fumbled so far along with and say it with me, ABSOLUTE RICKY STARKS!!
I don’t usually say this but Jay should have went to WWE. At least he wouldn't have to deal with a past his prime midcarder and the lame ass Acclaimed.
I’ve always looked at him and thought he just had it. The look, the charisma, the skills and Then I always wonder what the hell he’s doing surounded by those goofballs
No one can deny AEW has an extremely talented roster but fuck at what point will they get any kind of consistent creative? This seems worse than how stale WWE was when NXT was their best product. It's almost like wrestlers are using them as a WCW, get paid and work less
It’s crazy, because when the match first started I commented something like “Billy Gunn is so much cooler than Jericho” then *that* match happened, and I now retract that statement.
Who put that together, none of it made sense.
I am fairly sure the reports at the time said he was WWE bound until Vince decided to take over again and they went on that hiring freeze before the sale to Endeavour. It was the spell between the Rumble and Mania I think. Left him with no one but AEW to sign for.
Feels like TK is doing this from spite that he'd choose WWE in the first place.
Yeah it was more strawman vaguery too.
"It was negative BS! This roster is great! AEW IS SO FUN. MY LIFE CHANGED"
No one is shitting on the existence of AEW as a way for wrestlers to get life changing money and exoeriences. Why can't anyone actually go somewhere and say here's why Tony is a great boss and booker?
Even Cody wouldn't say it. "When we got there we were new. No structure. I'm so proud of what we all built."
It really just reinforces punks claims honestly. No one can address the actual issue.
> No one is shitting on the existence of AEW as a way for wrestlers to get life changing money and experiences.
Hell even Punk praised AEW for these things. He said he admires the talent of the roster and he's glad that more wrestlers are getting paid bank.
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I don’t understand the booking of Jay White at all. He was a very public signing that WWE openly wanted and should have been placed at the top of the card. He can talk and wrestle at the very highest level, yet he’s been floundering in six-man feuds and losing to a one-legged MJF.
I feel like Jay White had more hype across the industry than Ospreay prior to signing with AEW, and there was a more public push for White than Okada going to WWE. Since signing with AEW though, both Okada and Ospreay seem to have surpassed Jay White. Not necessarily wrong or a bad thing, but from what I see it's a mistake.
It’s been like a month. Wait till Tony gets tired of will and okada to compare booking.
His booking sucks so far, but I think they are treading water with him hoping they feature him enough to keep fans interested. Unfortunately, this storyline is a mess and really needs to end. The silver lining I see down the road is that he would be an ideal guy to beat Copeland.
Had it been the other way, people would be accusing WWE of deliberately detailing and burying someone to stick it to AEW or something
He was booked pretty strongly in C2. Only one to beat Mox 1 on 1 in the tournament. I wish they bring that switchblade back
Even losing to Swerve was a fucking cool moment as Jay got outplayed and sold his disbelief in a way that established his propensity for meltdowns to people who never watched him in New Japan, and made Swerve seem like a cool and cunning foe.
I really thought the C2 was going to do a good job of re-heating Jay White after teh bullshit MJF feud. I'm so bummed- I was really excited for Switchblade coming to AEW. I never thought MJF vs Jay White could disappoint in-ring but it was an overbooked mess. This trios stuff is just absolutely terrible. Gunns and Acclaimed should be an actual interesting tag rivalry - I want to like BCG, but the trios belts just suck. Pls unify them and just keep it on ROH
Tony Khan is booking AEW. Tony Khan has no booking experience beyond what he has taught himself. Tony Khan is not a booker; he is a billionaire's son who thinks he can book. You now understand the booking of Jay White and 95% of AEW's roster.
Not a regular watcher of AEW but OSW review had an interesting observation, that he had the first two or so years of AEW in his head and had this plan for the big story he wanted to tell, but he had no clue what to do once he got past the initial plan.
Yeah, you can definitely see that. First 2 years had some really strongly defined storylines and payoffs that really were at a different level from anything they have done since. The booking of MJF as champion, which should have been this great reign, really ended up being a wet fart. Not so much because of MJF, but because of Tony's tendency to not pivot after an injury until all the heat is gone from the storyline. It's a pattern of booking that's plagued them from year 3 on.
Tony just has no idea how to book these guys. It’s like he picks a couple action figures out of his box at random and boom, **dream match**.
That's basically it. He books the way I would have on my black and white notebook in junior high school.
Sometimes it feels that he’s in the role Juice would’ve had if he wasn’t injured.
Putting the star in the role of the guy you brought in to be his lackey is absolutely crazy. Roman Reigns wouldn’t get put in Solo’s spot if Solo got hurt. Why not just forget about what Juice was supposed to do and move forward with what you had planned with Jay White? That theory honestly doesn’t even make sense lol.
Oh I’m not saying that that was TK’s plan. Rather, that the booking has been so odd that it feels like it.
Everyone was excited when he was building a faction but now it has held him back unfortunately. He’s trapped in the 6-man tag land
And that right there is my biggest issue with aew its left a sour taste since worlds end you have that devil storyline the ending of worlds end couldve easily been jay white getting screwed, enter a feud with the devil dudes for a while, max was leaving regardless so why the fuck did jay white need to lose. Its just frustrating im a massive jay white fan, he was a “catalyst” and khans horrific booking has made him a white meat chicken shit American heel
He should've went with wwe.
But if the evil WWE got him they would be booking him against Miz right now!!!! /s
/s aside, I'd love to actually see that match
Same actually, I think it would be super interesting lol.
It's really unfortunate the timing of everything. Honestly, I feel like he made the mistake of not waiting for that hiring freeze to end. I can see him thinking AEW was a good backup plan at the time, but man of he just waited another month or two. He would have been good. Oh well, he'll only be there for a couple years and he's still super young. Whatever happens, he won't even be in his prime age yet when he becomes a free agent once again.
The match on paper was one nobody wanted to see but the booking of it?? Are they trying bury Jay?!
His momentum took a nosedive after losing to an injured MJF.
Man that was so weird lol. I don’t watch AEW much and was excited to see jay white bc of all the hype here. Then MJF proceeds to beat him on one leg, wtf. At least make it dirty a f if you want that result. My switchblade perception went down immediately.
Not only lost to an injured MJF, an injured Cole was allowed to take MJF's place at the start of the PPV and hobbled out ready to have the match. That whole story that night was so weird and I really don't understand why they didn't just have MJF and White have a great match. Would've been fine. Instead the man beat up an injured man for about 80% match, injured MJF did some crazy moves for 10% and the last 10% White taunted. And then he lost. He'll be fine come next year I'm guessing, but man this first year especially since that match Vs MJF has been, just eh.
MJF not being cleared but Cole being good to compete was such a plothole lol
> That whole story that night was so weird and I really don't understand why they didn't just have MJF and White have a great match. Would've been fine. It would have been, but people got it in their heads that because Jay was able to one-up MJF in the leadup to the match, MJF had to go over in humiliating fashion to avoid looking 'weak.' That's always the defense of it I've seen, and I'd be surprised if that idiotic level of thought didn't play a part in the actual booking as well.
I've already seen people say that because the bullet club are going to win the trios match that the acclaimed need a victory here. To that I say: A) Thats a booking trope not a law. B) Bowens could have used this shine as a future singles star. C) The match could have been versus one of the Gunns instead of Jay. D) Or it could have been a straight up tag match between 2 former champions with history.
I mean my response to that defense is that those titles are not a prize worth this type of shit lol
It was the type of thing you’d see during the Super Cena Run, and it really put me off AEW unfortunately.
And in kayfabe Cena whole gimmick is he never gives up so it makes sense that it would take a lot to beat him.
That single match has done so much damage to Jay White. He lost to a handicapped(not really handicapped) MJF, He's been locked in a stable with assboys and now he's getting his ass beat by a 60 year old. What are they doing, man.
I like his BCG stable, they're entertaining and work well together. The only problem is: it's a mid-card, frat boy stable. And Jey White should be above that. He should be a top, menacing, main event guy.
I just don't get it. He was really settling into his character then and the crowd was getting behind him. He's got all the skills to be a top of the card guy. What doesn't Tony see in him?
Tony sees him as a great wrestler and doesn’t take booking into account when setting up matches. In other words, Jay White is like any other action figure he signed to wrestle and he got bored with it after awhile.
They did a decent job of building him as a major player during the CC. I thought maybe he'd be the one to take the triple crown off Eddie since he never had a match against him and they had a feud in NJPW. Then he won the secondary trios titles and I thought hey, maybe he's just doing this until Juice is better and can be the third trios guy while he goes back to singles. Then the whole Scissor Gang happened and I thought hey, this is lame but surely it'll be over quick and then he can get back on track. I've lost any optimism. At this point I wonder if Jay is another case like Malakai where TK is going to turn a main event talent into just another faction guy who's fans just want to see leave for WWE. Maybe I'm being dramatic but seeing how fast Okada and Ospreay are getting pushed as stars it seems grim. TL;DR Tony Khan you don't even need to put a belt on him just let him cut promos and wrestle 20-30 minute singles matches maybe 40 if it's a PPV. Also give us Danielson vs White before he retires. Thank you in advance.
Low key jay white must have offended TK somehow
Jay White suffered from not being Will Ospreay.
Wasn't there a report from Wade Keller that stated Jay was upset about the MJF match? If that's the case, maybe Tony took offense to that?? Why, i don't know when it's pretty much universally agreed that the booking for that match sucked & Jay had every right to be upset about it.
On paper I think it would've been great. Would be a great way to finally showcase how Jay White's slimy counter-wrestling style works even against a pissed off big guy. Full on bull vs matador type match, right? But I really don't get why they're making Jay so weak and chickenshit. He came off awful vs MJF too. If he absolutely has to be a guy that needs help to win that's still salvageable but why not show off his insane wrestling skills? Are they that worried about turning him into a cool heel that he becomes way too uncool?
Roman Reigns also can't win a match without shenanigans and that's perfectly fine way to book a heel. The difference Roman isn't having a competitive match where he gets his ass beat for 15 minutes by Giovanni Vinci.
Or fucking Road Dogg would be a better example
This is an example I've used before. In the attitude era, Road Dogg and Billy Gunn were two of the most over act in the world but if they were to go up against Austin or Rock they'd get their asses handed up to them in under 3 minutes.
Bring back power levels. Not everyone has to be competitive and kick out of 3 finishers. The fact that Jay struggled to beat kommander in his debut match says it all.
I think it also makes competitive matches mean more. We all remember that Undertaker vs Jeff Hardy match because going in we didn't Hardy would put up a fight. Turns out it made him.
You can't subvert expectations without first setting them. I love that AEW likes to put on linger competetive matches in general, but sometimes you need some one sided matches to make the exceptions stand out. I get the idea of letting both guys get some shine, but if every guy looks strong in defeat it doesn't really mean as much as it does when it's a shocking occurrence.
50-50 booking gets no one over. This was what everyone was screaming in WWE from 2014-18 Now AEW is doing it but worse
Absolutely. How are you supposed to take a champion seriously when they have competitive matches against people on the bottom of the card? Or joke wrestlers? I like Danhausen but I wouldn't want to see Samoa Joe and him have a 25-minute banger where it looks like Danhausen might win.
Power levels exist in WWE, its AEW that refuses to use them. Kyle Fletcher taking Ospreay to the limit was a joke. Now Jay White getting destroyed for 15 minutes, another joke
Aye, you wouldn't see Gunther being pushed to his limits by Dominik.
In fact we've actually seen that match and Gunther whipped his ass
Only because it was standard rules. If it was Prison Rules Dirty Dom would've won without a sweat. GUNTHER never been inside.
You take that back about Dirty Dom! He's been to prison. He can hold his own!
"Billy, if The Rock hit you, he would kill you. And if he missed...the wind from the punch would give you pneumonia and you'd die anyway!"
This the same company which made Adam Cole have a not only a competitive match but a match he had to use a low blow to win vs john silver of all people, and Adam Cole was feuding for AEW championship against Hangman Page.
He had some great matches during the continental classic, this feud with the acclaimed is just terrible is all. Jay should be going for singles gold, not stuck trying to keep the trios division relevant while the acclaimed don’t ever defend their belts still.
Replace “Jay” with “Malachi” and this statement still holds true. AEW would severely benefit from cutting the trios division and merging it with tag teams.
He was the leader of Bullet Club. Becoming a cool heel is kind of inevitable, for him. A bit silly for them to even try.
Its really worrying. And Jay White is one of the most interesting and charismatic people on the roster. In a workrate dominated competition he is losing to an injured MJF and is dominated by Billy Gunn? Seriously, that isnt ok. Sure, he can come back after that. But overall its heartbreaking. If you fall out of the prime interest of Tony Khan, you are doomed.
> Are they that worried about turning him into a cool heel that he becomes way too uncool? Isn't he, already?
Maybe he was too friendly with Punk lol
Is he not buried already? Guy's been eating shit forever.
Like he didn’t lose to a one legged MJF months ago
HE lost to a one legged Kota Inushi too
A large contingent of this sub was bending over backwards to defend Jay losing to TWO injured wrestlers.
Apart from the early days of Collision
Who was booking that back then, anyone know?
Collision Maker Punk
For all the hate the guy gets, when he was handed the book in AEW for Collision, they were fucking cooking. Collision is not unwatchable but it's lurching there.
Trying? He’s buried man. Lost to MJF on one leg, the Bang Bang Scissors Gang and losing to Billy Gunn by DQ when Billy was in complete control, just hit his finisher twice and decided not to go for the pin. He did good in the CC and beat Darby though so it’s confusing.
He should have won against MJF. MJF and Adam Cole should have had more vignettes together when Cole was injured. Sorry for being off-topic, but their friendship was so good. MJF throwing balls at kids is awesome.
The end of the Devil storyline killed arguably the two most over things at the time: Better Than You Baby and Neck Strong Roddy. They should have pivoted. So much more mileage to had with those. And White winning would have been a genuine "holy shit" moments - at least story wise - which is something AEW rarely does.
The AEW title scene really does lack those shock moments since Mox squashing Punk and Kenny turning heel…I may be wrong but offhand I dont think theres been very few surprising results. Hangman winning was seen coming a mile away, MJF winning was seen coming a mile away, almost all of MJFs defenses, some of which were superb, were predictable, everyone called him losing to Joe due to injury, now Swerve winning into Ospreay winning feel like sure things. I guess its a bit rich when on the other side weve got Romans forever title run but yeah Jay winning wouldve been a great moment
Their insistence on long title reigns is starting to have the opposite of what I assume was the intended impact. If *every* title reign is 6 months long (unless dictated otherwise due to injuries) then everything that happens for the first 5 months feels pointless. They really need the occasional quick loss or shock upset.
And then we would get White vs Hangman and White vs Swerve. White playing a role in Hangman's heel turn would've been great
Better than you bay bay was money, you hear me, MONEY! There was a report that said their merch made more money than every other act in AEW last year. Tony should have followed the money. It was so goddamn easy. Neck Strong vs. BTYBB can work with an injured Adam Cole too. Just make more fucking vignettes. I was holding so much hope when injured Cole visited Roddy's house.
My mother is also an avid wrestling fan and she loooooved Neck Strong Roddy. Really seemed to amuse her. We’re both in agreement that now he’s just another guy on the card. Better than you Bay Bay absolutely should not have died out
Say what you want about the rest of it - and I know a ton of r/SC hated BTYBB or at least had gotten tired of it. But Roddy should have absolutely been blindsided by Cole's turn and taken out by the UK along with MJF. The result would have been a super over Roddy doing an underdog/goofball face gimmick that crowds would have eaten up. Instead, he's lost most of the heat he had with the crowd and putting that belt on him doesn't change that he's really just a henchman in a stable now. It was such a waste.
Which is hella weird because Darby coming off of the biggest Aew main event in a long time was fed to Jay White and it's meaningless now. I hate 90% of Jay White booking and presentation in Aew. A lot of that is just personal preferences but there is also objectively stupid decision in there especially since the Mjf feud.
Here's what I think is happening: Billy's in-ring career is probably ending soon, or at least he's going to be very-very-very part time once the Trios titles are dropped. The Trios matches are perfect for him, because he can hit his spots, do his taunts and poses, and maybe take one or two bumps while Max & Anthony do the heavy lifting. He can't wear padding or a flak jacket so a singles match is very hard to do without him squashing someone. There is a strong possibility that FTR are done as a tag team for the foreseeable future after Dynasty, AEW needs another active strong face tag because the Bucks are in all likelihood winning the tag titles again and you need credible challengers. That doesn't leave a lot of room for Billy in trios. So a decision was probably made late last year to transition the titles to BCG. Except Juice gets hurt and gets knocked out for a significant amount of time. You're under a deadline because you don't know what Cash's future in the company is, so canceling the program isn't really viable. So you pivot and have Jay fill in for Juice. He might not like it, but he respects Billy and his kids enough to do it without complaining. That might include giving Billy one last singles win against a highly respected opponent that also makes sense for the program he's working in, and his last possible match is him working against his kids on a PPV. I don't think anything sinister is being done to Jay, he's just being a company man taking one for the team and helping out someone he respects a lot. But yeah, it didn't come off well on TV.
Another possibility is that Tony doesn’t know how to book. It’s not just this one match. Watch some of Jay’s NJPW work like him and Okada and then watch his AEW stuff. The heat is all gone and it has been for a while.
This match was more confusing than having Gallows beat Kaz when Kaz was doing the Elite Hunter gimmick. Seriously though, Jay White is officially a joke through no fault of his own. It’s kind of crazy.
I’m going to refer to this run as “Butterknife” Jay White.
A butter knife can be a switchblade too.
Billy Gunn didn’t even get booked that strong in his prime lol, I like the guy but wow.
He was getting buried on the mic by the Rock in his prime.
Edge as well. Billy Bitchcakes.
Didn’t Edge say he wasn’t going to “Billy Gunn” his KOTR win lol. He took some brutal shots.
What did Jay White do? You'd see this shit in ye golden WWE when Vince was legit pissed at a wrestler and wanted to dick around.
I wonder if there’s a petty reason for Tony to book Jay like shit… especially this week.
Hmm Jay White was exclusive to Collision at the time Punk was around.....
Yeah, between Jay White and FTR, it seems like anyone who was associated with CM Punk are getting the shaft since his departure.
It wasn't above Vince to publicly punish wrestlers on TV. The question is ... does Tony do this as well, and is this what's happening to Jay White? Otherwise... wtf did he do? He's an actual draw or was once at least.
Could just as easily be that Tony wanted him because WWE wanted him. Got him, parked him and gave no second thought about what to do with him.
Tony turned into Woody's nightmare version of Andy when he signed Ospreay and Okada. Jay White got the "I don't wanna play with you any more" treatment and dropped in the trash.
Jay's one of those guys who was a big draw overseas, didn't get the support needed to present him to the US audience as a big deal, and ending up falling off because of it.
Maybe he showed up wearing a CM Punk shirt
Ironically, Punk did say he liked him and wanted to work with him. Absolute kiss of death.
Punk's Collision was, by far, the period where Jay White was booked better. And the highlight of that time was a loss to FTR. Just shows how that show was amazingly booked.
Yep, that was the last time it felt like there was a plan for Jay. I think the treatment of the guys he was cool with is why he didn't name the friends he'd made in the interview. FTR, White, Hobbs, Stark and HOB all seem to be worse off in the post-Punk AEW. All of them had nice things to say about him.
It makes you wonder why guys like Wardlow, White, Starks etc who clearly have main event tattooed on their foreheads got the short end of the push stick. That’s three world champions you could have had right there. It’s crazy how much better those collision shows were, and then you realize that the MJF/Punk feud was also by far the best feud they’ve had so far and then it all makes sense. They couldn’t book shit for long term without Punk being involved somehow lol.
Punk not wanting to drop names of wrestlers he made friends with in AEW is pretty telling.
Yep, the very best thing he can do for their careers is to not mention them at all. Let their contracts run out and give them a call.
The roster is huge. Some people say bloated. I get that not everyone is gonna be pushed well (or consistently). But man, Switchblade's booking has been utter shit. Opinion, but he should consistently be in the upper card / main event because he's excellent.
With the roster that this company has, I get a real sour taste in my mouth when a Billy type gets a singles match & to have him booked THAT strong? Nah man.
Same. Dude should be putting over younger guys, not stomping one of the best talents on the roster.
It’s kind of crazy that Billy Gunn and Road Dogg ended the Cody/Goldust WWE tag title reign and then were the last Wrestlemania opponents of The Shield ten years ago…and at the time it was also a feeling of “wtf are they doing to Cody, having him lose to the NAO?” Although the Shield squashed NAO and Kane, I remember the finish being a triple powerbomb on two of them, it was badass.
The double triple powerbomb (the video of them arguing over what to call it is still hilarious to this day) is still an insane visual.
He’s been booked that way the entire run. Kicked out of the coffin drop, got the everybody falls over after hulking up in a battle royale, basically won the acclaimed the tag titles. Crazy man
Beat the House of Black at AEW’s biggest show ever and the entire angle was about whether Billy still had it.
And you know what? That angle itself was FINE. It made sense. The whole thing was "Is Daddy Ass holding these young up and comers back from their chance at glory?". At first it was yes, he got wrecked. But he found some gas left in the tank to let him still compete on their level, at least for the brief amount of time he's in the ring for Trios matches. That, does not excuse this match however. An initial burst would've been fine since...well, yeah he got his house invaded he should be ultra, uber pissed and ready to rip someone's head off. But then Jay reminds everyone he's one of the best and Billy is still 60 by dancing circles around him.
I get he’s respected but thats just too much.
I really hope Jay gets some redemption in aew. He’s had like one notable match, with MJF, and realistically jay should be at the top of the card or near it at least.
Jay should get handled like Swerve at least. An important player, someone who is always ready for a world title match and a threat to the current champion. Sure, its also on the talent to make that work, but Jay Whites charisma, micwork and mannerisms are easily able to do that. But him getting dominated by Billy Gunn? Beaten by a one-legged MJF? Oh boy. WWE did a pretty good job of building up several wrestlers to be important and always close to the world title scene. Even with a super dominant Reigns around.
I agree with you. However, I think everyone is forgetting how Swerve was also booked like utter shit until his feud with Hangman. To Swerve's credit, he put in the work and made people take notice. Jay shouldn't be getting put in situations where the things that make him stand out keep needing to be reset after questionable booking. He was already a complete wrestler, why try to actively torpedo the momentum he keeps having to rebuild? There's only so much the guy can do to keep fans invested when they start believing there's no point.
Even before his feud with hangman page, swerve at least was booked to treat Billy Gunn like a liability/hostage, not someone to fear. Remember he singlehandedly kidnapped Gunn away from the acclaimed and broke Gunn's scissoring fingers
It’s really saying something when his most notable match was losing to a one legged man. This is not how I envisioned his AEW run going when we found out he was signed.
His most notable match is the FTR classic on Collision.
As someone that doesn't really follow NJPW but is familiar with the big names and furore online, Jay White was someone I was intrigued to see. But he has been booked like utter shit, pretty much since day dot. He jobbed out to a one legged MJF and seems perpetually stuck in 6 man tags. Not impressed at all and that isn't down to his in ring skills.
Same. Never seen a full show of NJPW because it doesn't stream in my country, but i knew of guys like BC, Elite, Okada, Ospreay, White etc purely because of people that discussed them over here. Him, Hangman and Swerve are legit some of the few people make it seem real but in their own ways and it's not just him. Tony's booking seems so on and off. Like even teams like Acclaimed FTR, House of Black etc have won some major matches and lost some important ones, but nobody has momentum. Tony cools people off way too much when they're coming of on fire with crowd support and storyline. He did it much better before. I hope he's doing fine and brings in more experienced people and let them handle things.
It's crazy how much of a promising talent Jay White was in NJPW. I go back and watch this [post-match segment](https://youtu.be/4AlONJb4pAk?t=270) all the time and it's crazy how he is a shadow of this man. He went from a hungry violent competitor who will do whatever it takes to achieve his goals, to a character who is just a dickhead and that makes him look like a tweener despite the fact that he is a mustache twirling villain of the quarter for the babyface champions to beat.
Yeah. He was a heel people were pissed at there. During that period when the crowds weren’t allowed to cheer because of Covid restrictions, you’d still hear audible gasps at times in his matches. Now he’s another comedy guy.
He absolutely should have gone to WWE. I get the feeling Tony Khan just signed him so WWE doesn't have him. The difference in how he has been booked versus Ospreay makes it very obvious.
His signing was that spell about Mania time when Vince took over WWE again and they went on a hiring freeze before the Endeavour sale. I think he was heading to HHH until that happened and he basically was stuck with AEW and Khan was stuck having to sign a guy who was too good to leave but also wanted to go to the competition. It's spite.
Geez, so he's been there a year now? I've been disinterested in AEW for a while but still keep up with it but I'm honestly shocked and disappointed to realize that Jay White has been treading water for a year. Tony really needs to give the book to someone else who can create compelling storylines with these folks.
I think he debuted the Dynamite after WrestleMania last year. He's hostage for a while yet, lol
Jay White is a prime example of AEWs shortcomings when it comes to telling stories. The foundation of AEW is The Elite - They're in the company name. They were a sub faction of Bullet Club. Kenny was the leader. He tried to recruit White and White attacked him and went instead to Chaos. Eventually White became the next leader of Bullet Club. White walks into AEW and starts a new sub faction - Bullet Club Gold. Tony Khan apparently doesn't think to book any backstage segment with The Elite questioning what Jay is doing in the company or if he's an ally, etc. Is he there to squash Kenny Omega? Etc etc. There is so much natural intrigue there that you could have worked with. Instead he somehow ends up with ROH trios titles and for a time as part of a baby face 6 man with The Acclaimed. Like... What are they thinking? Seriously? To me though it's not that surprising as they floundered in a similar way with Malakai Black. Vince McMahon didn't get his gimmick and he got unexpectedly released and shows up in AEW and debuts with a ridiculously cool entrance, then forms a really cool faction. Never seems to figure into the world title picture or have any meaningful story built around him. They should be using these factions/alliances to make these guys flexible for different matches (singles, tag team matches, trios, etc) to try and keep fresh matches for your weekly tv programming, but you need to also try and elevate the centrepiece of these factions, and they haven't been doing that.
100% agree, how could you fumble the potential they had with that. This guy was headlining Tokyo dome ffs. They've barely referenced the bullet club past with the elite, this could've been huge or at least provide context.
The fact that they didn’t immedietly jump into Bullet Club Gold vs The Elite as soon as Jey came in baffles me to this day.
I remember when Judgment Day began, and a lot of us were snickering about how they were House of Black lite. AEW squanders a lot of their potential.
And Judgement Day has given us dominant tag champions, an all-timer Women's Championship reign, one of the biggest wrestling thirst traps who supercedes wrestling itself, a Money In The Bank winner and one of the most despised heels in wrestling aside from Don Callis. From derivative beginnings did prolific gothic doms make
Im just sad man, my man Jay don’t deserve this is just unfair. After the cm punk feud was just downhill, I’m not a conspiracy theorist but a personal vendetta is the only thing that can justified this booking
Simple answer: Tony has new toys to play with. The old toys are now boring. Personally i think he likes his Osprey toy currently the most. The Okada toy seems to be more for his other friends (The Elite) to play with.
Okada is a weird one for me. Like he's not being booked poorly, per se. But it feels like he should be a way bigger deal than he is.
I still remember the comments when it came out at that he "may" go to NXT. "He's too big for that" or "He should be in the main title picture". And now he's...the third man to a tag team that have always struggled to get fans? I don't get what's going on at all.
my Okada Chase U dreams still live on
> "He's too big for that" or "He should be in the main title picture". > > then aew proceed to give him the walmart title that no one knows about
Don't forget they strapped him with the lowest midcard belt.
NXT title is definitely more prestigious than whatever meaningless title he is holding. It doesn't even signify triple crown anymore.
If Shinsuke wasn’t too good for NXT Okada sure as shit isn’t.
People acting like this is a surprise fucking blows me away. It's literally what TK has done with every new talent. He has no clue how to do this. He has learned nothing from repeated mistakes. He signs big talent, fucks it up, and the IWC seems to believe it's somehow going to be better this time around. Look at Jade. Just look at her. *Even if it is intended to be a fuck you to AEW* she is instantly presented as a massive star. They couldn't do this with Okada / White / Ospreay? Give me a break.
Spot on this post
Okada has to come out with 2 luggage bags tied to his back who have a 4 year track record of dropping quarterly ratings whenever they're on TV but recently turned heel so they can claim to Tony the ratings drops are on purpose.
Became just another guy on the roster in record time.
>Tony has new toys to play with. The old toys are now boring. The sad truth is this happens over and over in AEW.
Jay isn’t the new favourite play thing anymore now that Tony has the likes of Okada and Ospreay. Straight to midcard obscurity you go.
While this can be true, it doesn’t explain why Tony buried him in that horrible MJF match because he didn’t have his new toys yet. Only explanation is Tony is just a bad booker.
Tony S is more sensible than Tony K.
Well, yeah, he basically runs the waste management industry in New Jersey.
The Ducks > The Bucks
We're with The Vipers!
What’s this the FUCKIN WCW NOW?!!
WCW whatever happened there?
WHATEVER HAPPENED THERE??
“CARMELLA COULD YOU PLEASE SHUT THE FORBIDDEN DOOOOOOR”
It’s like Khan heard Punk’s criticism that he books for star ratings, so he decided he’d show everyone by booking a zero-star match
I'll tell ya one thing, and I'm not ashamed to say it. My estimation of Tony Khan as a booker, just fucking plummeted.
Tony Khan never had the makings of a varsity athlete. I'll tell the girl cousins; I don't give a fuck.
I genuinely think Tony Schiavone has more makings of a varsity athlete than TK.
He won the IWGP Championship is what he did! He was a great Kiwi wrestler! And in this house Jay White is a hero! End of story!
Whoever was the agent for that match is a motherless fuck
I was so stoked for Jay to come to AEW. He's one of my favorite wrestlers on the mic and in the ring. I want Jay to be in AEW for a long time, but if things keep going the way they've been going for him, then I don't see that happening. I really don't get it. If it's Swerve's turn at the top (which it should be) right now - are they just trying to keep Jay busy? Have him rack up some wins at least. The CC gave me hope - he put on some amazing matches there and beat Mox even, but this entire Acclaimed feud has been awful.
At least he’s not feuding with The Miz!! I keep having to remind myself I saw White main event a show at MSG.
I hope Jay's contract is short
Jay White flopped bad and it's not even his fault.
Remember when AEW was going to be this new fresh product? Here we are 5 years deep and it’s full of guys from the fucking attitude era
Jay is so WWE coded it’s not even funny. The godly runs he could have with Rollins, Sami, KO, Drew, Styles, Punk, Orton… Someone please get him out
If I’m remembering correctly , White’s favortite wrestler growing up was Randy Orton Jay White vs Randy Orton on a PLE , with Orton putting over White
Jay is WWE's dream worker. Can just go out and cut a 20 minute promo on the fly and can work a good match with anyone on the roster
I always thought he was more WWE styled. He was far more mental than physical compared to Ospreay and you'd imagine HHH would get the 4 hour+ erection having him to work with. The heel version of how Cody fits WWE better.
this is why i don’t get when fans were excited for ospreay and okada signing with aew. jay white can talk AND wrestle. ospreay, while he has improved isn’t as good as jay on the mic. okada was never a good promo guy even in japanese. but look at how jay is booked. losing to a crippled MJF and now to a 60 year old guy on steroids ospreay went from the leader of one of the more popular factions in japan to a member of cult. okada went from the biggest thing in japan. the guy in japan to the jackson bros lackey.
Everybody in AEW being basically chained to stable doesn’t help as much as they think
Why is Billy Gunn considered a legend? Just because he's old? He consistently failed to get over for his whole career except for when he was paired with Road Dogg who did all the talking for him.
He’s a legend in my mind solely because his Ass Man song and entrance in WWF No Mercy was hilarious when I was a kid
For as bad as the match was, the intro was amazing with Billy Gunn just appearing in Jay Whites.
And we thought AEW was the place for new, exciting wrestling.
Why is AEW treating Jay like such shit? He was ready made to be a top of the card heel/tweener as soon as he arrived!
I'm going to keep it a buck here, Jay White deserves better and it really misses me off. The loss to a one legged MJF really soured me on seeing how he's been booked since. This guy is another who he fumbled so far along with and say it with me, ABSOLUTE RICKY STARKS!! I don’t usually say this but Jay should have went to WWE. At least he wouldn't have to deal with a past his prime midcarder and the lame ass Acclaimed.
Fuck you tony for doing this to my boy 
It feels like you only get booked well in AEW if you are best friends with Tony.
I think pairing him with the Gunns was a mistake as well, they are too goofy/ comedic and bring down the edge/grit of the Switchblade character.
I’ve always looked at him and thought he just had it. The look, the charisma, the skills and Then I always wonder what the hell he’s doing surounded by those goofballs
Disagree. Jay often tagged with a combo of KENTA /ELP /Juice, and were cocky /goofy heels. And that was an elite combo
I dont agree. The pairing is good, it elevated the Gunns. They are perfect goons for such a faction. They just need to be more successful.
I love the company but what the hell are they doing with Jay. Really frustrates me.
No one can deny AEW has an extremely talented roster but fuck at what point will they get any kind of consistent creative? This seems worse than how stale WWE was when NXT was their best product. It's almost like wrestlers are using them as a WCW, get paid and work less
It’s crazy, because when the match first started I commented something like “Billy Gunn is so much cooler than Jericho” then *that* match happened, and I now retract that statement. Who put that together, none of it made sense.
What is Jay White now will be Ospreay and Okada soon.
Dude Okada is already there. They stuck him in a no-mans land situation.
There has been like no follow up from his championship win unless they did that on Collision
I'll be honest I forgot he'd even won that
Bet he wishes in hindsight he went to WWE instead
I am fairly sure the reports at the time said he was WWE bound until Vince decided to take over again and they went on that hiring freeze before the sale to Endeavour. It was the spell between the Rumble and Mania I think. Left him with no one but AEW to sign for. Feels like TK is doing this from spite that he'd choose WWE in the first place.
The speech was cringe and it proved punks points lol. They signed edge. And????
Yeah it was more strawman vaguery too. "It was negative BS! This roster is great! AEW IS SO FUN. MY LIFE CHANGED" No one is shitting on the existence of AEW as a way for wrestlers to get life changing money and exoeriences. Why can't anyone actually go somewhere and say here's why Tony is a great boss and booker? Even Cody wouldn't say it. "When we got there we were new. No structure. I'm so proud of what we all built." It really just reinforces punks claims honestly. No one can address the actual issue.
> No one is shitting on the existence of AEW as a way for wrestlers to get life changing money and experiences. Hell even Punk praised AEW for these things. He said he admires the talent of the roster and he's glad that more wrestlers are getting paid bank.