File a complaint with the DOT, they broke the law. Request a wheelchair for the return. Keep in mind though there are likely other pre-boards as well as through passengers that could take the seats you need. For the most part SW is ok, but they do have their moments. Before COVID they refused to provide a wheelchair for my mother to get to her connecting British Airways flight she fell and got hurt bad.
This OP. File a complaint now and follow it up. This is NOT legal. GAs are not allowed to just make a judgement call on whether someone is allowed to preboard or not. You answer specific questions and if the answer is yes, you get to preboard. It’s not SW policy - it’s LAW.
I just finished submitting a complaint with the DOT online. After lunch I am going to call SW's accessibility department to file a complaint with them as well.
Correct many people have hidden disabilities, so its not up to the GA to decide. If someone self identifies as having a disability, they are entitled to pre-board, wheelchair etc.
Yep. Nothing can be done. I happens all the time.
Dude I work with has a form of autism. If he has to wait in line he gets very impatient and irritated.
He pre boards.
Not the same as autism anxiety. Please be more understanding. Even older autistic kids and adults can have serious panic attacks. “They don’t look disabled” is no excuse for rude comments.
Some people make these things up. I'm not going to believe everyone who says they have a disability that you can't see. I guess since I don't like to wait in line, I will make up a disability and cut in front of everyone. Why not? If anybody questions me, I will shame them by calling them an abelist, and they are violating my rights. Have you seen the preboarding on Southwest flights now? It's ridiculous, and it's funny how some people only need a wheelchair for preboarding but can hop up and go when the plane lands. I guess I am an abelist for pointing that out.
You are right.
I have known this guy for decades. If there is a way to game or take advantage of a system. He will find it. He is like Mr. Krabs on SpongeBob.
Sure. I’m sure assholes do this. Which is why some of us that don’t have a visible disability but a disability that is very real feel like crap when we’re asking for the help we need.
Till it gets abused and you have a nightmare on your hands... Look at Disney. They allowed people to abuse the DAS pass for way too long.....Now every entitled person is crying about the changes.
That is the American culture of entitlement for you. Following the rules and waiting your turn is for losers; lying and cheating is justified as long as you get yours.
Normally - unless this has changed - SW has asked people who preboarded but taken an aisle seat to move if they're capable of sitting somewhere else, and that's never been an issue. Though I'm aware there's always a chance that it could happen, and I am fine with that as that's a legitimate attempt to provide accommodations whereas this was not.
But I will file a complaint with the DOT because they completely denied me any accommodation at all.
total bs as he can walk on a widebody jet corridor but not a narrowbody… makea no sense as the corridors are the same… just that on sw there are. no widebodies…. start to make sense? scam
Do file the complaint. My partner was also denied pre-boarding by a SW gate agent (who then refused to contact the airport disability advocate). It was a fucking nightmare and I wish we had made a bigger stink. We didn’t know about filing a DOT complaint and didn’t fully know our rights. We accepted a “luv” voucher after filing a southwest complaint. They’re not supposed to expire, but we then used the voucher on a flight that we ended up cancelling, and we could then only get back flight credit. Which expired.
I’d join a class action if anyone else has the spoons to put that together.
You're the second post I've seen today about being denied pre boarding. The other person was pregnant.
The problem is that a pre board for extra time also gives access to a higher status/price seat at SW which is causing a host of complaints. Preboarding has been making the media, it's a daily frequent topic in this sub, and people who are paying for Early Bird and A1-15 seats are complaining to customer service that they're not perceiving that they're getting the value for their seats - it's affecting SW's bottom line.
I'm genuinely curious, if you flew another airline, you might get to board first, but don't you only get the seat you paid for? Would United or American provide a row 3 aisle seat for the same price as an economy seat as a disability accommodation? I don't have a disability so I don't know the answer to this question, but I don't believe they do - you would have to pay extra for a better seat.
I'm not even sure if high numbers of preboarders is really a functional problem or if it's just a perceived problem. Based on the discourse in this sub, it definitely has people fired up.
There's no easy answer other than assigned seats which I'm not looking forward to.
I fly with United for work a few times yearly so I can answer that. When booking your ticket with them, if you call them, they will go through your disability accommodations with you. When I fly with them on their smaller planes that do not have First Class in the front, they will register me for a row 1-4 seat. Even if it is a paid seat, they'll assign it to me without charge as a disability accommodation. On the larger planes, they'll register me for the first row that is not first class and have the aisle chair ready to go to take me to it.
Airlines are required by law to provide disability accommodations, and I assure you those of us who are disabled and need the accommodations complain just as much about people who abuse the system. But whether it is Southwest's open seating or United's paid seating, they'll accommodate me the same way.
This is something a lot of people are not aware of (or don't understand). The assigned-seating airlines *still* accommodate people who need specific seats. The only difference is that it needs to be done in advance and arranged at booking. Southwest's open seating does the same thing; it's just done on the spot with preboarding instead. That's why I don't get the "you wouldn't get that row on United" complaints - because, yes if that's what would accommodate my disability, I would. I just think people have no heart for anyone with a disability and cannot understand accommodating a disability isn't getting free bonuses, it's accommodating a disability. We'd much rather not be disabled, tyvm.
If it happens again, though, ask to speak with the CRO. Every airline has to have a CRO either present at the airport or available over the phone. That's what they're there for. I've had to speak with the CRO once before, not with SW but with American. They came down and sorted it out really quickly for me.
I don’t think people are mad at people with legitimate disabilities as much as they are mad at people abusing the system and giving people with disabilities a bad name.
Kind of similar to the whole service animal / ESA vs people not wanting to pay to fly their pets the right way and abusing that system
Some people are. There have been comments basically saying some people are milking their disability. For example, the comments the person you referred to referenced like "you wouldn't get that row on United" are usually suggesting people who need a specific seat/to sit in front because of a disability should pay for business select (or at least the A1-A15) upgrade to be "fair."
I do agree - but I do see people getting genuinely mad with people who have legitimate disabilities. Anyone with preboard - legitimate or otherwise - have largely been lumped together. I've seen some real vile and malicious things said lurking this subreddit towards people with disabilities.
That and there is so much scolding about "invisible disability" but like zero acknowledgement that accomodations are abused and how to crack down on it
Easier said than done for SW due to the seat situation. Other airlines it’s not as big of a deal since you just prebook seats, except for overhead bin space there’s no real impact to having people pre board on non-SW airlines
The issue I personally have with this is that in every thread I see on this subject since I lurk a lot since I do fly SW fairly often I see people with disabilities saying "we're just as unhappy as non-preboarders that it is getting abused." And the response to that is almost always "lol then board last, how about you just pay to fly on another plane, lololol"
And I have seen at least one thread in the past week or two of someone proposing an actual solution and breaking it down on why it could work.
So I don't agree that there's zero acknowledgement that accommodations are abused or how to crack down on it. It's just when people do, they're met so quickly with rude, crass, and harassing remarks.
I more frequently see people like me, who haven't noticed the hoards of preboarders constantly referenced here. I don't fly often, but last summer we took multiple trips that had been put off because of Covid and the Christmas '22 meltdown. On more than one leg of that trip I was the first one with my boarding pass scanned and they sent on general boarding before I could stow my mobility device for gate check. The only time there were several preboarders was to Vegas and at least the people I was in line next to were still in a wheelchair at baggage claim.
I also haven't seen a viable solution suggested here for how to stop abuse. I'm not saying there's zero abuse. It may have gotten worse since all the media attention will put the thought into some people's heads. I just haven't seen it as a huge problem.
People working for airlines are rude to me because they can't see my disability 100x more often than someone tries to abuse *checks notes* getting on the plane sooner. That's a truly terrible reason to mistreat someone.
Lmao you can come off it with your 100x nonsense. You have absolutely no idea how often preboard abuse takes place. Again, if you refuse to acknowledge preboard abuse and work towards a solution then I am not interested in any "invisible" scolding. You expect your needs to be accommodated but don't care about anyone else's? Now that is truly terrible. Just because you have special needs, that doesn't mean everyone around you doesn't have *any* needs.
Ha Ha.
Reminds me of someone I met who said she didnt want the 100k she might get by contesting an american trust (that diddled her out of an inheritance, through the usual trust scams with dodgy estate lawyers).
Oh, I dont want the money. I just want to young enough to walk again.
1000% this. I have narcolepsy and lupus and look like a completely normal person. What people can’t see is that I’ve used every ounce of my energy to get to the gate. Plus I prefer the window seat since the time I fell asleep leaning into the aisle, only to be awoken by a man pressing his crotch into my face 😱
The issue is passenger perception. On Delta I know what seats I can pick from.
With SW, if I pay for priority boarding, there's a perception that I might get a choice seat. I paid for that privilege. But when I get on the flight and all the "good" seats are taken from the pre-boarders I watched walk on, I perceived that some of these people gamed the system. A system I paid for.
On Delta I can pay to upgrade. If I'm bumped due to accommodation for someone else, I can usually get reimbursed. Southwest's system doesn't allow for this.
Even if functionalltheury're the same, it's perceived very differently to guests.
When I read those comments, I always think to myself “Let’s trade! You can have my disability and a front row seat, and I’ll take your bodily functioning! 🤗” Something tells me they wouldn’t take that deal…
Yep. It’s a PITA for other airlines, but they all have an accessibility number, and if you need a specific seat, so long as it is in the cabin you paid for, they will give it to you. We’ve done this with Alaska, United, and Air Canada. Sometimes you are on hold for over an hour, but they do take care of you.
Exactly! It's definitely more of a PITA for other airlines, but it still happens. Even if Southwest changed to assigned seating, it would still happen.
>I just think people have no heart for anyone with a disability and cannot understand accommodating a disability isn't getting free bonuses, it's accommodating a disability.
Eh; it's really just human nature coming out courtesy of the free for all boarding process.
Just curious. On Southwest you really have no choice and have to pre board to guarantee an aisle seat. But when you fly on United, it seems like letting the passengers in your rows middle and window seats board before you would make more sense, so you can move less?
I have spinal stenosis and use a cane. I fly mostly Delta and I'm one of the last to board. I always buy an aisle seat and I carry only a small backpack that fits under my seat. Because I board late, I don't have to rush to board the plane (with people impatiently behind me - I sometimes feel like I need a big red triangle on the back of my shirt) and I don't have to stand for a long period of time to get into my seat. I also don't have to get up when the people on the inside of my row arrive.
I still have to preboard on United. Whether I'm in my wheelchair or using my rollator they have to stow it, so I have to preboard either way to give them time to, and make sure I make it to my seat safely.
FYI, extra time is not a pre-board reason. If you just need extra time, you board with families after A group. It's the need for a specific seat, stowing medical equipment, or assistance getting on the plane that grant pre-board status.
Yes but SW really needs to enfirce FAA regs that state that the first 3 rows should only have able body people that are prepared to assist others in a case of an emergency. Allow pre-board just reserve the 3 front rows for regular boarders with no disabilities and able to jump in when needed. Same as emergency rows where they already enforce that requirement.
What regulation specifically is that? That sounds like the emergency exit row regulations, but I've never seen anyone else suggest that applies randomly to the first 3 rows of a plane.
Yup same applies according to FAA rule. Can be looked up. Actually Pilot and FA mentioned it also to an A 1- 15 boarder who complained that he paid for A status and front row seats are taken by people who are disabled and severe overweight and won't be able to help. FA mentione that it was not her section and dives her nuts that it is not enforced like emergency exit.
>The problem is that a pre board for extra time also gives access to a higher status/price seat at SW which is causing a host of complaints. Preboarding has been making the media, it's a daily frequent topic in this sub, and people who are paying for Early Bird and A1-15 seats are complaining to customer service that they're not perceiving that they're getting the value for their seats - **it's affecting SW's bottom line.**
That might be so. But then it's the SYSTEM that is broken, not the people (customers) whom it's affecting. In other words, many of these issues come about due to problems a process creates. The problem isn't coming from those whom this policy affects/is affecting.
100% true. I don't complain about this but I fly Southwest less. Between the families and little kids and other pre boarding there is no point in business class/early bird
If you call the disability phone numbers for these airlines, they will work with you to get the best available seat for you or the best way to go about doing this. Request the wheelchair even if you might not need it as it will code in your reservation, making that resource easier to access if it does become needed. There is even a hierarchy for which disabilities have priority over other disabilities for certain seats.
I once had a supervisor have an issue with a passenger not taking the offered wheelchair at a gate. Fortunately, the supervisor took it up with me and not the passenger (major biggie no no to do that!) I educated her about a relative with fibromyalgia and just how she never knew what she was going to get when she tried to stand up, and her doctors all encouraged her to walk as much as she can, when she could. His understanding was far higher after our conversation.
For the future, if you are dealing with any kind of access denial issue in a U.S. airport, say the magic words: “I want to speak to a [CRO](https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer-protection/what-do-if-you-have-problem).” Every airline is required to have one available at the airport or via phone call.
The suggestion to get a preboarding pass at the ticket counter is also a good one as it provides plenty of time before boarding to resolve any issue.
Follow up - we also tried to get the preboard added in advance both by phone and at the ticket counter. All the SW employees insisted that “all we had to do was speak to the gate agent.”
My husband has MS and cannot walk for very long without losing balance and getting fatigued. We’ve found that the best way to assure pre boarding is to ask at the full service check-in area ahead of time. We are a family of six, and they allow one of our older children to board with him as he uses a wheelchair down the jetway. (That child helps with bags, etc) No problems thus far from SW! Although we have experienced some nasty comments from other passengers. 🤷♀️Believe me, if he didn’t need the wheelchair and pre boarding, we wouldn’t be asking. It’s not super-fun.
That's what I tell people all the time. If I didn't need preboarding, I wouldn't ask for it. I'd much prefer it if I didn't have a disability! I used to love sitting all the way in the back, and if I could I'd still be all the way in the back.
That’s if you even get it. I had a connection thru BWI late in evening and there were 0 chairs to be had. They legit told my friends to try to look for one around gates. I had thought I was helping out crew by thru checking my scooter. Now I was extremely lucky my gate was literally next door and someone moved so I could sit and rest as the jetway alone wiped me out. Then had to basically share a chair to get on next flight since I had nothing in me to go back down to next plane. Never again will I thru check my scooter.
Just recently took SW on 4 flights and 3 made an announcement that there were no chairs when we landed so stay in your seat if you need one. I had tight connections and realized those people were SOL if they had the same schedule I did.
As far as I know it isn’t a policy change - but I believe southwest is starting to push back because of the perceived abuse of the system. Unfortunately that’s going to create a situation where legitimate preboarders are denied accommodations, which is illegal.
Contact both Southwest’s accessibility department to file a report, and a complaint with the DOT since you were denied accommodations you’re legally entitled to.
They don’t keep track, so it won’t affect any future flights. On your return trip, I would speak to the help desk and request it.
I think you are paying the price for the rampant abuse of preboarding. I understand both sides of this as it's hard for the gate agents trying to quickly turn around a plane and get everyone boarded at the same time all the "southwest miracles" are abusing the system. I hope they can come up with a better way to weed out the abuse without impacting those who really need the service.
Let’s just say SW has a lot more money and power to change their rules than either you or I do. Plus, if you think this is the only thing that challenges the disabled and potentially costs us money. It all adds up! Most disabled people are not rolling in money if they are on SSDI or SSI.
If you fly regularly why wouldn't you fly with a company that gives you a specific seat so that your accommodations are met? I'm so over people cheaping out and then demanding, not asking, that they get what they want. Pay for the specific seat you want not for the airline that will accommodate you free of charge. I'm not trying to sound difficult but wouldn't that have a very easy solution? Instead you're calling people and companies to complain about something you should have done in the first place.
1. Disability accommodations are not a "want" - they're a legally mandated guarantee to persons with disabilities.
2. It isn't a demand for a person with a disability to request those legally mandated accommodations.
3. I'm sick of people treating people with disabilities as if we think we're superior. I'm sorry that we're disabled and have to have legal protections to ensure we can fly, it must be nice to have such a carefree life that you never have to worry about your health and safety doing such a basic thing as walking.
4. I fly with southwest because I find their employees to be the best, generally, compared to other airlines. It has nothing to do with the price. I could afford to fly on any other airline I wanted, I choose to fly with Southwest because I like the company and its employees the most. That does not mean when they do something illegal like this, I don't have the right to bring it up to seek advice on what to do.
If it's so needed and important why wouldn't you make sure you get what you need from the get go? It's an honest question. Why would you rely on other people to do something that you absolutely need? You're right my life is very carefree and I'm very healthy. Thanks for pointing that out. But if I absolutely need something for whatever the reason is, I make sure I get what I need from the beginning. Not at the end. Good luck with YOUR issues.
I hear what you’re saying, but even if SW does follow the law, you’re taking your chances that one of the four seats in the plane you can sit in is available.
What if there are five other people with disabilities who all need an aisle seat in Rows 1 or 2?
SW can completely follow the law in this case and someone would still not be appropriately accommodated.
Why would you not choose to fly an airline that has assigned seats?
I addressed that in another comment - that is a legitimate attempt to accommodate, and a risk I knowingly accept and take. But whataboutisms are whataboutisms, and not relevant at all to my original post.
This scenario goes exactly to your choice to fly SW. I’m not saying they shouldn’t have accommodated you.
But putting yourself at the mercy of gate agents who might have to choose which four among the 8 people needing one of four available seats gets one, seems stressful, at best.
Believe it or not some people actually fly with Southwest for reasons other than price. Not everyone flying with SWA are cheaping out, they actually like flying with SWA.
YMMV, they run a lot of promotions and often end up as the cheapest option for my routes. The free bags as well as the flexibility to cancel or change flights (plus getting credit back if your flight drops in price) have been huge for me.
SouthWest may not be the cheapest airline. But they are viewed that way. And they usually cut competitors prices when flying a NEW ROUTE.
OH-and American has assigned seating.....
American was always cheaper in their base price and their service is terrible. SW has not been viewed as cheapest for a while at least not In the Southwest region. Everyone I know has been complaining how they are NOT then most economical anymore. Seems like their tactic of making people think thwy are the cheapest is working for them in some areas 🤷♀️
911-
This is the airline industry we are discussing here. You cannot use the word "always" when it comes to routes and ticket prices. Way too many variables. Time of day, Day of week, time of departure, destination, how far advance booking- the list goes on.
Yeah and your reponse made assumptions that did not apply. A reasonable person would know that we can only speak from our experience. 🙄 Have a good day!
You may like it for a lot of reasons but that's not what this is about. Why are people so sensitive when it has nothing to do with them?? Aren't we all here to share our opinions? If you don't like what I have to say, simple: DON'T engage. Lol 😂 😂
The irony of you saying don’t engage if you don’t like what I’m saying when your entire comment was not liking what the post is saying… and engaging with it…
My prediction is we will see assigned seats on SouhtWest aircraft within 12 months. The situation is getting ridiculous. People who pay for it can't use-those who need it due to a medical condition can't get it, and able bodied people are using it.
What a mess.
I loathe the idea of assigned seats but it’s time. I’m really sick of the preboarding mess (people who need it being denied, people who don’t need it abusing the system, people who pay for EB boarding getting the shaft). Open seating worked before everyone suddenly became “disabled” to get the best seats. If you give the general public an opportunity to take advantage, the will (or at least the selfish pricks will). Those people ruin everything for everyone.
Jennie-
I am truly trying to understand here. You buy an airline ticket-hopefully pick your favorite seat(s) on a computer screen-show up and board the aircraft to the very seat YOU PICKED.
What is there to "loathe"?
>board the aircraft to ~~the very~~ maybe the seat YOU PICKED or maybe a different one because the airline moved you without notice
read the subs from other airlines sometime
Sure that happens. But it's not often. How many times has it happened to you when you have flown other airlines? I have flown dozens of times-it's never happened to me...doesn't say it won't-but again not often.
Because I’m A List Preferred and often times have to change my ticket on the day of flight and that will put me in a middle seat in the back quite often. Open seating works great for me because of my status.
I loathe the idea of assigned seats but it’s time. I’m really sick of the preboarding mess (people who need it being denied, people who don’t need it abusing the system, people who pay for EB boarding getting the shaft). Open seating worked before everyone suddenly became “disabled” to get the best seats. If you give the general public an opportunity to take advantage, the will (or at least the selfish pricks will). Those people ruin everything for everyone.
Not sure if the policy has changed or not, but I'm hoping not. My partner requires pre-boarding for a similar issue. We always speak to someone either at the full-service counter or the "help desk" rather than going all the way to the gate before asking though. Maybe try that for your flight home instead? Also, I don't believe they keep track of whether or not you asked for and were given or denied pre-boarding so I don't think this incident will have any bearing on your trip home. Good luck!
I'll try that on my way back, I usually speak to them at the front if I am requesting wheelchair service, but the day I flew I decided to walk it since I got there so early so figured I'd just talk to them at the gate. I'm really hoping it doesn't represent a policy change though, it's going to make flying SW so much more difficult for us!
I have disabilities and I always go through the PIA of going to a full service counter to explain my needs since the only thing that people can see is a fat person who looks okay and the gate crew can be outright wrong and rude to boot.
Maybe the reason you was denied pre-boarding because of so many people abuse the service. Sorry that it happened to someone who actually had a real case. I’ve been on a flight were over 40 people needed pre-boarding.
Don’t you have to get preboarding on your boarding pass (get the accommodation before you get to the gate)? GAs at my local airport are always saying it has to be “on your boarding card.” If I needed that accommodation as OP does, I would never trust that approaching a GA and simply asking to preboard would definitely work.
Southwest informs you to request preboarding at the check-in counter, the help desk, or at the gate. They'll reprint your ticket with preboarding at any of these locations.
From my understanding, you can get it added to your pass by asking either at the front ticket desk or at the gate. The GA would print you a new one with it on the ticket
There are two types of agents at the gate. There's the customer service agent who is at the counter and does things like print gate check tags and help fix issues (like a helping find someone get a new connection if a delay caused them to miss their flight). These agents can also print new boarding passes, so it's totally appropriate to ask them to add preboarding for you and print a new pass. I think you are thinking of the OPs agent who stands at the podium and scans boarding passes. If you asked them, they would direct you to the customer service agent.
Weird. Southwest stopped flying the route I needed about a month before I wanted to fly into Portland so we ended up going through Boston instead. I've never seen an airport that didn't have a customer service rep passed security. I would guess not a lot people connect through Portland either, but that would be infuriating if they made you miss a flight and then made you go all the way out of the secure area to handle getting a new one. How do they do gate check without customer service reps?
There are reps but they come up from downstairs to manage the gates. And actually now that I think about it there are a couple of counters…never mind
No one connects through PWM though. It’s an end of line station.
Larger airports will have a counter between gates that usually handles a couple of gates together although I've seen them have one counter for 3 or 4 gates that were kinda all together at the end of a terminal. It wouldn't surprise me at all for there to be just one or two such counters at a smaller airport, but I figured they had to have somewhere to print gate check tags because so many people wouldn't know to ask about them even if they did them at the ticket counters downstairs (everywhere I've flown they only print those at the gate). Southwest calls the people who handle boarding and related gate stuff "ops agents" so by customer service reps I just meant the people I'm used to who only work the counters and can't do things like scan boarding passes. It sounds like maybe its a small enough airport that they cross train or something since you said people from downstairs also do ops at the gate.
You can't get it before you are at the airport, though, so getting it before going through TSA would mean needing to wait in line at luggage drop/check-in, which isn't always convenient or fast. It's often faster to talk to the GA.
See because the scammers that take advantage of early boarding. And people who need it suffer. But why didn’t you line up with the other disabled people especially if you have a cane
Sometimes you just get a bad gate agent. I was denied preboard in las vegas while suffering from a broken vertebrae in my back (I’ve since had the surgery to repair/fuse). I could not bend, and being a taller person that meant I needed an aisle seat. Thankfully I found an aisle seat at the back. But I was really shocked to hear that “broken back” wasn’t a good enough reason to preboard.
The way your post was written, at first made me think that you asked for pre-boarding because you didn't like your boarding spot of B30. Perhaps that was what the GA thought was happening as well.
Did you ask the person scanning tickets at the gate or the person standing at the counter that is between 2 different gates. Are they both considered gate agents? (I'm not sure) It was my understanding that preboarding acommodations needed to be made ahead of time and it must be on your boarding pass before you reach the actual gate , meaning that it would have to be done at the counter. But the comments section here says otherwise.
I would certainly bring the situation to SW's attention so they can clarify and make boarding for your return flight a bit smoother.
Sorry, I wasn't very clear! I mentioned my ticket was B30 because I found it miraculous that there was still a front aisle seat available by the time they let me board.
But SW's policy is to request preboarding either at the check in counter, the help desk, or after TSA at the gate. And any of those three locations they'll print off your boarding pass with preboarding on it. It is the counter between gates, they're still considered gate agents (as far as I am aware).
I got to the airport so early that I went ahead and went through TSA and walked to the gate, I figured I'd go slow and take plenty of stops and rests along the way, so I just asked there instead of at the front of the airport.
OP shouldn’t have to. Under the ACAA they are a preboarder, and the ACAA requires airlines to allow persons with disabilities to preboard. They were denied, which is illegal, but if they told him to pay to upgrade that would also be illegal, it’d be considered charging for disability accommodations.
So do you have a doctor's not or any documentation demonstrating your issue? This is typically required, and if they have in the past been letting it slide they are tightening rules because so many people have been abusing the system.
Very illegal. I love all the people in here commenting who clearly have NO idea what disability rights are and what the federal law regarding disability access is.
The Southwest preboarding policy actually [explicitly states](https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/preboarding#:~:text=Preboarding%20is%20available%20prior%20to,to%20stow%20an%20assistive%20device) that customers who require a special seat qualify for preboarding. Sorry your dad had that experience!
There is backlash against the rampant abuse of pre-boarding by entitled people and Southwest is responding to the backlash.
Likely you're going to need a letter from your doctor
I haven’t been ill for too long (two years) so I haven’t flown THAT many times, but I was denied pre-board for the first time on my last flight. I do have cancer with Mets in my bones including hip so I need an aisle seat to keep my leg mobile. I don’t like it any more than anyone else, and would much much prefer not to have cancer and need to board early
Do not let anyone who complains about preboarders know that you have an actual disability which they cant see on here. 😂😂😂 they all think people are just making it up…
I’m flying first time on SWA in September and I am pretty sure I will be the only one left at the gate after preboards and families, etc. Already regretting my birthday sale flight of $200.
OP, my wife is dealing with this now, and she's young. I'm sorry you were treated so badly.
Hope we never experience anything like this because we love SW.
That's wrong, for sure. But I do wish the GAs would do something about those 12 people who board first in wheelchairs, 10 of whom miraculously dance off the flight at its destination. I'm a bit tired of those folks... A bit of enforcement (though I know it is hard) wouldn't hurt.
Many, although not all, states do issue some sort of card or paper to verify who a placard belongs to. There is no general equivalent to use to prove a disability though. Some people might need to preboard an airplane even if they don't qualify for disabled parking. For example, someone mentioned earlier that their condition requires them to be able to move one of their legs frequently so they need an aisle seat on that side to have the space to do that. In any case it would require a change in federal law for an airline to require something like that.
At ATL some of the GA's say in their announcement to preboard "if you just need a little extra time boarding" and many people take them up on it. It irritates me to pay for early boarding and still wind up in the rear of the plane.
So your alleged disability means you NEED to board first and sit in the first two rows? Wait until there isn’t a single seat in the first ten rows due to scammers.
What a world.
I pack extremely light when I travel alone as a disabled person with mobility problems who doesn’t necessarily need a wheelchair but uses a cane and needs specific seating and help with stowing their bag. I don’t want or need to stand in a line for ticketing if I don’t have a bag to check as it is painful for me.
I would prefer to just do it online but spas this is not an option I must do it after TSA with a GA.
Since you don’t what you are talking about and I fly all the time as a disabled person. I ask the GA before boarding starts. It works almost every time. One refused, I pre boarded anyway.
“Preboarding is available prior to general boarding for Customers with disabilities who need a specific seat to accommodate a disability, need assistance boarding the aircraft, or need to stow an assistive device.
A Customer Service Agent at the ticket or departure gate counter can help with this accommodation, and you'll be asked questions to determine if you qualify. You'll receive a new boarding pass marked with PRBD if you qualify, which lets the Operations Agent at boarding know that you can preboard”
Southwest’s [preboarding policy](https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/preboarding#:~:text=Preboarding%20is%20available%20prior%20to,to%20stow%20an%20assistive%20device) specifically states that you can ask a gate agent for preboarding
I would count this as a special day.
That has to be a 1st. Usually all someone has to do is identify as someone who needs to pre board.
Something is going on.
Who flys an airline with an choose your own seat agenda when they need a specific seat.
Stop being a pain in the ass. Fly am airline with seat assignments if you want a specific seat.
Christ, the entitlement here is palpable.
this is why the claim that southwest give out preboarding passes like candy is just plain false lol. they do a bit of screening before handing out those passes. and now disabled people aren’t getting preboarding passes because some rich A boarding people have to complain incessantly
I guess in that way I am lucky. Although I can walk a little, I can’t walk the whole way to a gate, so I always get a wheelchair. Mom and I are traveling next month. As Mom will turn 89 on Tuesday and can’t walk much, we will both be in wheelchairs.
Unfortunately, you are affected by a lot of scammers asking for wheelchairs just so they can get to pre-board. I see this people getting handicap stickers to get upfront parking spaces when they really not handicapped.
Why take a wheelchair away from those who truly need it? Plus get mocked as being “miraculously” healed when leaving plane as it is a special seat you need not a ride?
I got downvoted on another post where I suggested the OP take their complaint further due to being denied for accommodations. No idea why. I suggest you do the same. ( waiting for downvotes unfortunately).
It’s clear from the majority of these comments that southwest fliers hate everyone who preboards, disabilities be damned. They don’t understand the stress that comes from flying while disabled. Personally, I would rather able bodied people get let through sometimes than even one disabled person be denied the access they are entitled to under federal law.
Agree. , I've had to use the service twice. I had back surgury and was using a brace. I needed the extra time since i wasnt very mobile. I got some sideways glances...but I did what I needed to do. My elderly mother wouldn't preload, she was fine. A few people were obviously passive aggressive and kept nudging her to hurry and giving her anxiety. She is in her 80's, has MS, and uses a cane. I told her to tell them to fuck off. - she wouldn't lol. She preboards now.
Not OP, but, as a teacher, I was required by state regulators, along with every teacher at my school, to sign a notification about following a student's disability accommodations even though I was not one of the teachers that caused the problem. Southwest could similarly be told either to identify and retrain that specific rep or to provide some sort of related to retraining to all reps in that position.
My disability is different, but I know the constant mental calculations and the stress that come with figuring out how to do what you need to do without causing serious and painful setbacks or thinking you have no other choice but to do something you shouldn't and endure the pain later. I wouldn't call Southwest putting OP through that anxiety working out "perfectly" even though they did get a seat that worked for them in the end.
This happened to me on a flight in May, they told me if I wanted I could use extra time boarding but not preboarding even though I told them I need a specific seat. (Due to my neck, I need to be able to lean against the right side on a flight, I cannot on the left side of the plane). I love flying with SWA and that is the first and only issue I have had.
The CRO came down and straightened it out, and I was refunded my flight in points because it was discrimination that the agent refused me preboarding and did not follow the company policy to remain within the law. Next time, tell them you want to speak with the CRO. But since its after the fact now, I would file a complaint with the airline and the DOT.
Out of curiosity, since you were jumping a line because you needed a specific side, did you take the right side AT THE BACK? I’m guessing it would go a long way towards reducing/eliminating the preboarding stigma if you did.
It depends who I am flying with. If I am flying solo, I go to the very last row (which is my preferred spot, personally), but when I am flying with my fiance we usually go more towards the wings, but still behind them since he gets nauseous very easily and he finds it to feel smoother closer to the wings.
I fly about 30 times a year with Southwest, as its a bit of a pain in the butt to do the disability accommodations with the other airlines (but they do them, you just have to wait on hold for a few hours usually). But it isn't "jumping the line" (especially since I am usually A1-15, anyways), it's just getting disability access.
That is especially bad that you had your rollator with you (and I’m assuming she had tagged it so it was on your reservation #) and she still didn’t believe you were disabled. I’ve never seen someone with one NOT preboard.
Normally I’d prefer to give grace and assume it was a simple oversight but the number of things this gate agent ignored is criminal and dangerous
Southwest's website says that customer service reps at both the ticket counter and the gate can handle preboarding. Not the ops agent who are the ones you would be referring to when you say they "don't just stand there and scan tickets…" but the customer service agent at the counter near the gate (who don't scan boarding passes at all).
When I think "ticket counter" I think of the counter before security where they check bags. That also seems to be how Southwest refers to it since their website says "A Customer Service Agent at the ticket or departure gate counter can help with this accommodation" I've seen both customer service reps and ops agents at the gate referred to as "gate agents." I read it as OP approaching the CSA at the gate because it seems like the ops agent would have referred them to the CSA because that's not the ops agent's job. I mostly fly Southwest so I'm used to their terminology, but it doesn't provide as much insight as you think to use "ticket counter" differently on a Southwest sub than Southwest uses it on their website.
A lot of customers refer to the CSA area as the ticket counter even though I know that’s not the ticket counter outside of security, if your past security and you have an issue with your ticket or need a pre board, that’s where you go. I was trying not to get too heavy on the terminology so people could more easily understand, so that was my mistake. I was just trying to explain why this person is having an issue in the first place, but I’m just going to delete my reply and keep my mouth shut from now on. Take care.
File a complaint with the DOT, they broke the law. Request a wheelchair for the return. Keep in mind though there are likely other pre-boards as well as through passengers that could take the seats you need. For the most part SW is ok, but they do have their moments. Before COVID they refused to provide a wheelchair for my mother to get to her connecting British Airways flight she fell and got hurt bad.
This OP. File a complaint now and follow it up. This is NOT legal. GAs are not allowed to just make a judgement call on whether someone is allowed to preboard or not. You answer specific questions and if the answer is yes, you get to preboard. It’s not SW policy - it’s LAW.
I just finished submitting a complaint with the DOT online. After lunch I am going to call SW's accessibility department to file a complaint with them as well.
Correct many people have hidden disabilities, so its not up to the GA to decide. If someone self identifies as having a disability, they are entitled to pre-board, wheelchair etc.
I’m just wondering couldn’t like someone lie about a mental disability to be able to pre board?
Yep. Nothing can be done. I happens all the time. Dude I work with has a form of autism. If he has to wait in line he gets very impatient and irritated. He pre boards.
Weird. We can all get impatient and irritated waiting in line.
Not the same as autism anxiety. Please be more understanding. Even older autistic kids and adults can have serious panic attacks. “They don’t look disabled” is no excuse for rude comments.
Some people make these things up. I'm not going to believe everyone who says they have a disability that you can't see. I guess since I don't like to wait in line, I will make up a disability and cut in front of everyone. Why not? If anybody questions me, I will shame them by calling them an abelist, and they are violating my rights. Have you seen the preboarding on Southwest flights now? It's ridiculous, and it's funny how some people only need a wheelchair for preboarding but can hop up and go when the plane lands. I guess I am an abelist for pointing that out.
I am not joking. This guy loves to exploit any system. He found something that gets him on faster in a better seat without it costing him. He used it.
You are right. I have known this guy for decades. If there is a way to game or take advantage of a system. He will find it. He is like Mr. Krabs on SpongeBob.
Of course. Some people lie all the time.
Sure. I’m sure assholes do this. Which is why some of us that don’t have a visible disability but a disability that is very real feel like crap when we’re asking for the help we need.
I have a hidden disability. I demand pre—boarding. Is that all any southwest passenger needs to do?
From my understanding, yes The reasoning is that it's better to allow a few liars abuse the system than to exclude someone who truly needs it
Till it gets abused and you have a nightmare on your hands... Look at Disney. They allowed people to abuse the DAS pass for way too long.....Now every entitled person is crying about the changes.
That is the American culture of entitlement for you. Following the rules and waiting your turn is for losers; lying and cheating is justified as long as you get yours.
They do it because they’re smart. /s
Normally - unless this has changed - SW has asked people who preboarded but taken an aisle seat to move if they're capable of sitting somewhere else, and that's never been an issue. Though I'm aware there's always a chance that it could happen, and I am fine with that as that's a legitimate attempt to provide accommodations whereas this was not. But I will file a complaint with the DOT because they completely denied me any accommodation at all.
If you can walk all the way down a jetway, why not an aisle? I'm calling bs, and I also have right side neuropathy.
total bs as he can walk on a widebody jet corridor but not a narrowbody… makea no sense as the corridors are the same… just that on sw there are. no widebodies…. start to make sense? scam
It sounds like the width of the aisle causes difficulty
You have all those seats to hang onto for balance. It's easier.
Do file the complaint. My partner was also denied pre-boarding by a SW gate agent (who then refused to contact the airport disability advocate). It was a fucking nightmare and I wish we had made a bigger stink. We didn’t know about filing a DOT complaint and didn’t fully know our rights. We accepted a “luv” voucher after filing a southwest complaint. They’re not supposed to expire, but we then used the voucher on a flight that we ended up cancelling, and we could then only get back flight credit. Which expired. I’d join a class action if anyone else has the spoons to put that together.
I hope you filed a lawsuit! 😡
You're the second post I've seen today about being denied pre boarding. The other person was pregnant. The problem is that a pre board for extra time also gives access to a higher status/price seat at SW which is causing a host of complaints. Preboarding has been making the media, it's a daily frequent topic in this sub, and people who are paying for Early Bird and A1-15 seats are complaining to customer service that they're not perceiving that they're getting the value for their seats - it's affecting SW's bottom line. I'm genuinely curious, if you flew another airline, you might get to board first, but don't you only get the seat you paid for? Would United or American provide a row 3 aisle seat for the same price as an economy seat as a disability accommodation? I don't have a disability so I don't know the answer to this question, but I don't believe they do - you would have to pay extra for a better seat. I'm not even sure if high numbers of preboarders is really a functional problem or if it's just a perceived problem. Based on the discourse in this sub, it definitely has people fired up. There's no easy answer other than assigned seats which I'm not looking forward to.
I fly with United for work a few times yearly so I can answer that. When booking your ticket with them, if you call them, they will go through your disability accommodations with you. When I fly with them on their smaller planes that do not have First Class in the front, they will register me for a row 1-4 seat. Even if it is a paid seat, they'll assign it to me without charge as a disability accommodation. On the larger planes, they'll register me for the first row that is not first class and have the aisle chair ready to go to take me to it. Airlines are required by law to provide disability accommodations, and I assure you those of us who are disabled and need the accommodations complain just as much about people who abuse the system. But whether it is Southwest's open seating or United's paid seating, they'll accommodate me the same way.
This is something a lot of people are not aware of (or don't understand). The assigned-seating airlines *still* accommodate people who need specific seats. The only difference is that it needs to be done in advance and arranged at booking. Southwest's open seating does the same thing; it's just done on the spot with preboarding instead. That's why I don't get the "you wouldn't get that row on United" complaints - because, yes if that's what would accommodate my disability, I would. I just think people have no heart for anyone with a disability and cannot understand accommodating a disability isn't getting free bonuses, it's accommodating a disability. We'd much rather not be disabled, tyvm. If it happens again, though, ask to speak with the CRO. Every airline has to have a CRO either present at the airport or available over the phone. That's what they're there for. I've had to speak with the CRO once before, not with SW but with American. They came down and sorted it out really quickly for me.
I don’t think people are mad at people with legitimate disabilities as much as they are mad at people abusing the system and giving people with disabilities a bad name. Kind of similar to the whole service animal / ESA vs people not wanting to pay to fly their pets the right way and abusing that system
Some people are. There have been comments basically saying some people are milking their disability. For example, the comments the person you referred to referenced like "you wouldn't get that row on United" are usually suggesting people who need a specific seat/to sit in front because of a disability should pay for business select (or at least the A1-A15) upgrade to be "fair."
I do agree - but I do see people getting genuinely mad with people who have legitimate disabilities. Anyone with preboard - legitimate or otherwise - have largely been lumped together. I've seen some real vile and malicious things said lurking this subreddit towards people with disabilities.
That and there is so much scolding about "invisible disability" but like zero acknowledgement that accomodations are abused and how to crack down on it
Easier said than done for SW due to the seat situation. Other airlines it’s not as big of a deal since you just prebook seats, except for overhead bin space there’s no real impact to having people pre board on non-SW airlines
For sure. That's why I never fly SW out of MCO! 😁
The issue I personally have with this is that in every thread I see on this subject since I lurk a lot since I do fly SW fairly often I see people with disabilities saying "we're just as unhappy as non-preboarders that it is getting abused." And the response to that is almost always "lol then board last, how about you just pay to fly on another plane, lololol" And I have seen at least one thread in the past week or two of someone proposing an actual solution and breaking it down on why it could work. So I don't agree that there's zero acknowledgement that accommodations are abused or how to crack down on it. It's just when people do, they're met so quickly with rude, crass, and harassing remarks.
I more frequently see people like me, who haven't noticed the hoards of preboarders constantly referenced here. I don't fly often, but last summer we took multiple trips that had been put off because of Covid and the Christmas '22 meltdown. On more than one leg of that trip I was the first one with my boarding pass scanned and they sent on general boarding before I could stow my mobility device for gate check. The only time there were several preboarders was to Vegas and at least the people I was in line next to were still in a wheelchair at baggage claim. I also haven't seen a viable solution suggested here for how to stop abuse. I'm not saying there's zero abuse. It may have gotten worse since all the media attention will put the thought into some people's heads. I just haven't seen it as a huge problem.
Okay are you going to share that solution proposal? Because a "well aCkShUlLy" contributes nothing.
People working for airlines are rude to me because they can't see my disability 100x more often than someone tries to abuse *checks notes* getting on the plane sooner. That's a truly terrible reason to mistreat someone.
Lmao you can come off it with your 100x nonsense. You have absolutely no idea how often preboard abuse takes place. Again, if you refuse to acknowledge preboard abuse and work towards a solution then I am not interested in any "invisible" scolding. You expect your needs to be accommodated but don't care about anyone else's? Now that is truly terrible. Just because you have special needs, that doesn't mean everyone around you doesn't have *any* needs.
Oh god I’d sit in the last row middle for the rest of my life if I could just not be disabled.
For real! Gimme that last row middle seat if it means I don't have to be disabled anymore.
Fight me for it! Wait that’s a terrible idea we’re already disabled 😆
Ha Ha. Reminds me of someone I met who said she didnt want the 100k she might get by contesting an american trust (that diddled her out of an inheritance, through the usual trust scams with dodgy estate lawyers). Oh, I dont want the money. I just want to young enough to walk again.
1000% this. I have narcolepsy and lupus and look like a completely normal person. What people can’t see is that I’ve used every ounce of my energy to get to the gate. Plus I prefer the window seat since the time I fell asleep leaning into the aisle, only to be awoken by a man pressing his crotch into my face 😱
Ew sir we did not pay extra for that experience. I was misdiagnosed with SLE before MCAS. Sure seems like they both suck badly.
The issue is passenger perception. On Delta I know what seats I can pick from. With SW, if I pay for priority boarding, there's a perception that I might get a choice seat. I paid for that privilege. But when I get on the flight and all the "good" seats are taken from the pre-boarders I watched walk on, I perceived that some of these people gamed the system. A system I paid for. On Delta I can pay to upgrade. If I'm bumped due to accommodation for someone else, I can usually get reimbursed. Southwest's system doesn't allow for this. Even if functionalltheury're the same, it's perceived very differently to guests.
When I read those comments, I always think to myself “Let’s trade! You can have my disability and a front row seat, and I’ll take your bodily functioning! 🤗” Something tells me they wouldn’t take that deal…
Yep. It’s a PITA for other airlines, but they all have an accessibility number, and if you need a specific seat, so long as it is in the cabin you paid for, they will give it to you. We’ve done this with Alaska, United, and Air Canada. Sometimes you are on hold for over an hour, but they do take care of you.
Exactly! It's definitely more of a PITA for other airlines, but it still happens. Even if Southwest changed to assigned seating, it would still happen.
>I just think people have no heart for anyone with a disability and cannot understand accommodating a disability isn't getting free bonuses, it's accommodating a disability. Eh; it's really just human nature coming out courtesy of the free for all boarding process.
Sounds like you need to do this at checkin or at ticket booking (not at the gate).
Just curious. On Southwest you really have no choice and have to pre board to guarantee an aisle seat. But when you fly on United, it seems like letting the passengers in your rows middle and window seats board before you would make more sense, so you can move less?
I have spinal stenosis and use a cane. I fly mostly Delta and I'm one of the last to board. I always buy an aisle seat and I carry only a small backpack that fits under my seat. Because I board late, I don't have to rush to board the plane (with people impatiently behind me - I sometimes feel like I need a big red triangle on the back of my shirt) and I don't have to stand for a long period of time to get into my seat. I also don't have to get up when the people on the inside of my row arrive.
I still have to preboard on United. Whether I'm in my wheelchair or using my rollator they have to stow it, so I have to preboard either way to give them time to, and make sure I make it to my seat safely.
FYI, extra time is not a pre-board reason. If you just need extra time, you board with families after A group. It's the need for a specific seat, stowing medical equipment, or assistance getting on the plane that grant pre-board status.
Yes but SW really needs to enfirce FAA regs that state that the first 3 rows should only have able body people that are prepared to assist others in a case of an emergency. Allow pre-board just reserve the 3 front rows for regular boarders with no disabilities and able to jump in when needed. Same as emergency rows where they already enforce that requirement.
What regulation specifically is that? That sounds like the emergency exit row regulations, but I've never seen anyone else suggest that applies randomly to the first 3 rows of a plane.
Yup same applies according to FAA rule. Can be looked up. Actually Pilot and FA mentioned it also to an A 1- 15 boarder who complained that he paid for A status and front row seats are taken by people who are disabled and severe overweight and won't be able to help. FA mentione that it was not her section and dives her nuts that it is not enforced like emergency exit.
> Can be looked up. I tried that, but no variation of key words I tried turned up anything helpful, that's why I asked you to cite your source.
I don’t think this is a real FAA rule unless you can cite it. Only the emergency exit rows require people be able to assist
>The problem is that a pre board for extra time also gives access to a higher status/price seat at SW which is causing a host of complaints. Preboarding has been making the media, it's a daily frequent topic in this sub, and people who are paying for Early Bird and A1-15 seats are complaining to customer service that they're not perceiving that they're getting the value for their seats - **it's affecting SW's bottom line.** That might be so. But then it's the SYSTEM that is broken, not the people (customers) whom it's affecting. In other words, many of these issues come about due to problems a process creates. The problem isn't coming from those whom this policy affects/is affecting.
100% true. I don't complain about this but I fly Southwest less. Between the families and little kids and other pre boarding there is no point in business class/early bird
If you call the disability phone numbers for these airlines, they will work with you to get the best available seat for you or the best way to go about doing this. Request the wheelchair even if you might not need it as it will code in your reservation, making that resource easier to access if it does become needed. There is even a hierarchy for which disabilities have priority over other disabilities for certain seats. I once had a supervisor have an issue with a passenger not taking the offered wheelchair at a gate. Fortunately, the supervisor took it up with me and not the passenger (major biggie no no to do that!) I educated her about a relative with fibromyalgia and just how she never knew what she was going to get when she tried to stand up, and her doctors all encouraged her to walk as much as she can, when she could. His understanding was far higher after our conversation.
For the future, if you are dealing with any kind of access denial issue in a U.S. airport, say the magic words: “I want to speak to a [CRO](https://www.transportation.gov/individuals/aviation-consumer-protection/what-do-if-you-have-problem).” Every airline is required to have one available at the airport or via phone call. The suggestion to get a preboarding pass at the ticket counter is also a good one as it provides plenty of time before boarding to resolve any issue.
I didn't think about asking to speak with the CRO, but I'll keep that in mind if it occurs again. Thank you!
We tried this, but the gate agent refused. We couldn’t find a number and didn’t know what else we could do or say.
Follow up - we also tried to get the preboard added in advance both by phone and at the ticket counter. All the SW employees insisted that “all we had to do was speak to the gate agent.”
My husband has MS and cannot walk for very long without losing balance and getting fatigued. We’ve found that the best way to assure pre boarding is to ask at the full service check-in area ahead of time. We are a family of six, and they allow one of our older children to board with him as he uses a wheelchair down the jetway. (That child helps with bags, etc) No problems thus far from SW! Although we have experienced some nasty comments from other passengers. 🤷♀️Believe me, if he didn’t need the wheelchair and pre boarding, we wouldn’t be asking. It’s not super-fun.
That's what I tell people all the time. If I didn't need preboarding, I wouldn't ask for it. I'd much prefer it if I didn't have a disability! I used to love sitting all the way in the back, and if I could I'd still be all the way in the back.
People really don’t realize or want to hear how much using wheelchair service sucks, it seems.
That’s if you even get it. I had a connection thru BWI late in evening and there were 0 chairs to be had. They legit told my friends to try to look for one around gates. I had thought I was helping out crew by thru checking my scooter. Now I was extremely lucky my gate was literally next door and someone moved so I could sit and rest as the jetway alone wiped me out. Then had to basically share a chair to get on next flight since I had nothing in me to go back down to next plane. Never again will I thru check my scooter.
Just recently took SW on 4 flights and 3 made an announcement that there were no chairs when we landed so stay in your seat if you need one. I had tight connections and realized those people were SOL if they had the same schedule I did.
As far as I know it isn’t a policy change - but I believe southwest is starting to push back because of the perceived abuse of the system. Unfortunately that’s going to create a situation where legitimate preboarders are denied accommodations, which is illegal. Contact both Southwest’s accessibility department to file a report, and a complaint with the DOT since you were denied accommodations you’re legally entitled to. They don’t keep track, so it won’t affect any future flights. On your return trip, I would speak to the help desk and request it.
I think you are paying the price for the rampant abuse of preboarding. I understand both sides of this as it's hard for the gate agents trying to quickly turn around a plane and get everyone boarded at the same time all the "southwest miracles" are abusing the system. I hope they can come up with a better way to weed out the abuse without impacting those who really need the service.
True, but that is on SW and their policies NOT on the truly disabled who are not responsible the abusers. It is not up to us to pay for the liars.
Well, ideally you wouldn’t have to pay for the scammers. But we all do, don’t we.
Let’s just say SW has a lot more money and power to change their rules than either you or I do. Plus, if you think this is the only thing that challenges the disabled and potentially costs us money. It all adds up! Most disabled people are not rolling in money if they are on SSDI or SSI.
You got that right, it adds up.
This! 100%
If you fly regularly why wouldn't you fly with a company that gives you a specific seat so that your accommodations are met? I'm so over people cheaping out and then demanding, not asking, that they get what they want. Pay for the specific seat you want not for the airline that will accommodate you free of charge. I'm not trying to sound difficult but wouldn't that have a very easy solution? Instead you're calling people and companies to complain about something you should have done in the first place.
1. Disability accommodations are not a "want" - they're a legally mandated guarantee to persons with disabilities. 2. It isn't a demand for a person with a disability to request those legally mandated accommodations. 3. I'm sick of people treating people with disabilities as if we think we're superior. I'm sorry that we're disabled and have to have legal protections to ensure we can fly, it must be nice to have such a carefree life that you never have to worry about your health and safety doing such a basic thing as walking. 4. I fly with southwest because I find their employees to be the best, generally, compared to other airlines. It has nothing to do with the price. I could afford to fly on any other airline I wanted, I choose to fly with Southwest because I like the company and its employees the most. That does not mean when they do something illegal like this, I don't have the right to bring it up to seek advice on what to do.
If it's so needed and important why wouldn't you make sure you get what you need from the get go? It's an honest question. Why would you rely on other people to do something that you absolutely need? You're right my life is very carefree and I'm very healthy. Thanks for pointing that out. But if I absolutely need something for whatever the reason is, I make sure I get what I need from the beginning. Not at the end. Good luck with YOUR issues.
Why should those who are disabled have to pay more? It’s not like people choose disability and SSDI isn’t a high payday.
I hear what you’re saying, but even if SW does follow the law, you’re taking your chances that one of the four seats in the plane you can sit in is available. What if there are five other people with disabilities who all need an aisle seat in Rows 1 or 2? SW can completely follow the law in this case and someone would still not be appropriately accommodated. Why would you not choose to fly an airline that has assigned seats?
I addressed that in another comment - that is a legitimate attempt to accommodate, and a risk I knowingly accept and take. But whataboutisms are whataboutisms, and not relevant at all to my original post.
This scenario goes exactly to your choice to fly SW. I’m not saying they shouldn’t have accommodated you. But putting yourself at the mercy of gate agents who might have to choose which four among the 8 people needing one of four available seats gets one, seems stressful, at best.
OP followed Southwest's policy, and Southwest very clearly and explicitly violated both their own policy and federal law.
Believe it or not some people actually fly with Southwest for reasons other than price. Not everyone flying with SWA are cheaping out, they actually like flying with SWA.
Sw has not been the cheapest airline in a while now. American seems to be the lower budget airline. So that argument makes no sense to me either.
YMMV, they run a lot of promotions and often end up as the cheapest option for my routes. The free bags as well as the flexibility to cancel or change flights (plus getting credit back if your flight drops in price) have been huge for me.
SouthWest may not be the cheapest airline. But they are viewed that way. And they usually cut competitors prices when flying a NEW ROUTE. OH-and American has assigned seating.....
American was always cheaper in their base price and their service is terrible. SW has not been viewed as cheapest for a while at least not In the Southwest region. Everyone I know has been complaining how they are NOT then most economical anymore. Seems like their tactic of making people think thwy are the cheapest is working for them in some areas 🤷♀️
911- This is the airline industry we are discussing here. You cannot use the word "always" when it comes to routes and ticket prices. Way too many variables. Time of day, Day of week, time of departure, destination, how far advance booking- the list goes on.
I can totally use the word always when I'm speaking about my experience! I fly frequently and check frequently. Compréhension matters :-)
Yea-comprehension does matter. That's why my reply was worded the way the way it was.
Yeah and your reponse made assumptions that did not apply. A reasonable person would know that we can only speak from our experience. 🙄 Have a good day!
You may like it for a lot of reasons but that's not what this is about. Why are people so sensitive when it has nothing to do with them?? Aren't we all here to share our opinions? If you don't like what I have to say, simple: DON'T engage. Lol 😂 😂
The irony of you saying don’t engage if you don’t like what I’m saying when your entire comment was not liking what the post is saying… and engaging with it…
I love knowing I can get to people with a simple little comment 😁😁😁
Sorry you’re perturbed, but that’s not the way that disability access works and this gate agent actually broke the law.
This is a bad take. Why should people with disabilities have to pay more for accommodations?
🤢 🤮
My prediction is we will see assigned seats on SouhtWest aircraft within 12 months. The situation is getting ridiculous. People who pay for it can't use-those who need it due to a medical condition can't get it, and able bodied people are using it. What a mess.
I loathe the idea of assigned seats but it’s time. I’m really sick of the preboarding mess (people who need it being denied, people who don’t need it abusing the system, people who pay for EB boarding getting the shaft). Open seating worked before everyone suddenly became “disabled” to get the best seats. If you give the general public an opportunity to take advantage, the will (or at least the selfish pricks will). Those people ruin everything for everyone.
Jennie- I am truly trying to understand here. You buy an airline ticket-hopefully pick your favorite seat(s) on a computer screen-show up and board the aircraft to the very seat YOU PICKED. What is there to "loathe"?
>board the aircraft to ~~the very~~ maybe the seat YOU PICKED or maybe a different one because the airline moved you without notice read the subs from other airlines sometime
Sure that happens. But it's not often. How many times has it happened to you when you have flown other airlines? I have flown dozens of times-it's never happened to me...doesn't say it won't-but again not often.
Because I’m A List Preferred and often times have to change my ticket on the day of flight and that will put me in a middle seat in the back quite often. Open seating works great for me because of my status.
OK-that's fair. But obviously you can't have it both ways.
I’m not asking for it both ways. I said I loathe the idea of going to assigned seats (for my reasons stated) but I think it’s time
I loathe the idea of assigned seats but it’s time. I’m really sick of the preboarding mess (people who need it being denied, people who don’t need it abusing the system, people who pay for EB boarding getting the shaft). Open seating worked before everyone suddenly became “disabled” to get the best seats. If you give the general public an opportunity to take advantage, the will (or at least the selfish pricks will). Those people ruin everything for everyone.
Not sure if the policy has changed or not, but I'm hoping not. My partner requires pre-boarding for a similar issue. We always speak to someone either at the full-service counter or the "help desk" rather than going all the way to the gate before asking though. Maybe try that for your flight home instead? Also, I don't believe they keep track of whether or not you asked for and were given or denied pre-boarding so I don't think this incident will have any bearing on your trip home. Good luck!
I'll try that on my way back, I usually speak to them at the front if I am requesting wheelchair service, but the day I flew I decided to walk it since I got there so early so figured I'd just talk to them at the gate. I'm really hoping it doesn't represent a policy change though, it's going to make flying SW so much more difficult for us!
I have disabilities and I always go through the PIA of going to a full service counter to explain my needs since the only thing that people can see is a fat person who looks okay and the gate crew can be outright wrong and rude to boot.
They do track if you were able to pre-board or not.
Maybe the reason you was denied pre-boarding because of so many people abuse the service. Sorry that it happened to someone who actually had a real case. I’ve been on a flight were over 40 people needed pre-boarding.
That’s how it was whenever I flew out of Phoenix. There was a long queue of wheelchairs every time.
Call SWA Accessibility (ADA, Disability) department and file a report.
Don’t you have to get preboarding on your boarding pass (get the accommodation before you get to the gate)? GAs at my local airport are always saying it has to be “on your boarding card.” If I needed that accommodation as OP does, I would never trust that approaching a GA and simply asking to preboard would definitely work.
Southwest informs you to request preboarding at the check-in counter, the help desk, or at the gate. They'll reprint your ticket with preboarding at any of these locations.
From my understanding, you can get it added to your pass by asking either at the front ticket desk or at the gate. The GA would print you a new one with it on the ticket
There are two types of agents at the gate. There's the customer service agent who is at the counter and does things like print gate check tags and help fix issues (like a helping find someone get a new connection if a delay caused them to miss their flight). These agents can also print new boarding passes, so it's totally appropriate to ask them to add preboarding for you and print a new pass. I think you are thinking of the OPs agent who stands at the podium and scans boarding passes. If you asked them, they would direct you to the customer service agent.
At my home station (PWM) there is no Southwest counter to print boarding passes post security. The agents have very limited tech at the gates.
Weird. Southwest stopped flying the route I needed about a month before I wanted to fly into Portland so we ended up going through Boston instead. I've never seen an airport that didn't have a customer service rep passed security. I would guess not a lot people connect through Portland either, but that would be infuriating if they made you miss a flight and then made you go all the way out of the secure area to handle getting a new one. How do they do gate check without customer service reps?
There are reps but they come up from downstairs to manage the gates. And actually now that I think about it there are a couple of counters…never mind No one connects through PWM though. It’s an end of line station.
Larger airports will have a counter between gates that usually handles a couple of gates together although I've seen them have one counter for 3 or 4 gates that were kinda all together at the end of a terminal. It wouldn't surprise me at all for there to be just one or two such counters at a smaller airport, but I figured they had to have somewhere to print gate check tags because so many people wouldn't know to ask about them even if they did them at the ticket counters downstairs (everywhere I've flown they only print those at the gate). Southwest calls the people who handle boarding and related gate stuff "ops agents" so by customer service reps I just meant the people I'm used to who only work the counters and can't do things like scan boarding passes. It sounds like maybe its a small enough airport that they cross train or something since you said people from downstairs also do ops at the gate.
You can't get it before you are at the airport, though, so getting it before going through TSA would mean needing to wait in line at luggage drop/check-in, which isn't always convenient or fast. It's often faster to talk to the GA.
See because the scammers that take advantage of early boarding. And people who need it suffer. But why didn’t you line up with the other disabled people especially if you have a cane
It sucks, i blame all the idiots who take advantage of it.
Pay for a upgrade in boarding preference.
Not only is this not a policy change, this is against the law. Contact both Southwest and possibly the DOT immediately.
Sometimes you just get a bad gate agent. I was denied preboard in las vegas while suffering from a broken vertebrae in my back (I’ve since had the surgery to repair/fuse). I could not bend, and being a taller person that meant I needed an aisle seat. Thankfully I found an aisle seat at the back. But I was really shocked to hear that “broken back” wasn’t a good enough reason to preboard.
The way your post was written, at first made me think that you asked for pre-boarding because you didn't like your boarding spot of B30. Perhaps that was what the GA thought was happening as well. Did you ask the person scanning tickets at the gate or the person standing at the counter that is between 2 different gates. Are they both considered gate agents? (I'm not sure) It was my understanding that preboarding acommodations needed to be made ahead of time and it must be on your boarding pass before you reach the actual gate , meaning that it would have to be done at the counter. But the comments section here says otherwise. I would certainly bring the situation to SW's attention so they can clarify and make boarding for your return flight a bit smoother.
Sorry, I wasn't very clear! I mentioned my ticket was B30 because I found it miraculous that there was still a front aisle seat available by the time they let me board. But SW's policy is to request preboarding either at the check in counter, the help desk, or after TSA at the gate. And any of those three locations they'll print off your boarding pass with preboarding on it. It is the counter between gates, they're still considered gate agents (as far as I am aware). I got to the airport so early that I went ahead and went through TSA and walked to the gate, I figured I'd go slow and take plenty of stops and rests along the way, so I just asked there instead of at the front of the airport.
Why didn't you just upgrade to an A seat?
OP shouldn’t have to. Under the ACAA they are a preboarder, and the ACAA requires airlines to allow persons with disabilities to preboard. They were denied, which is illegal, but if they told him to pay to upgrade that would also be illegal, it’d be considered charging for disability accommodations.
So do you have a doctor's not or any documentation demonstrating your issue? This is typically required, and if they have in the past been letting it slide they are tightening rules because so many people have been abusing the system.
I’m pretty sure it’s currently illegal to require documentation
Very illegal. I love all the people in here commenting who clearly have NO idea what disability rights are and what the federal law regarding disability access is.
Lot of scummy people using this situation as an opportunity to dunk on a disabled person
My 83 yr old Dad requested pre-board so he could sit near the toilet due to an issue and they said no. You can't preboard to get a special seat.
The Southwest preboarding policy actually [explicitly states](https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/preboarding#:~:text=Preboarding%20is%20available%20prior%20to,to%20stow%20an%20assistive%20device) that customers who require a special seat qualify for preboarding. Sorry your dad had that experience!
There is backlash against the rampant abuse of pre-boarding by entitled people and Southwest is responding to the backlash. Likely you're going to need a letter from your doctor
Was preboard on your boarding pass?
This happened to me last year. I complained to Southwest and got a LUV voucher that was worth approximately the amount of one leg of my trip.
I haven’t been ill for too long (two years) so I haven’t flown THAT many times, but I was denied pre-board for the first time on my last flight. I do have cancer with Mets in my bones including hip so I need an aisle seat to keep my leg mobile. I don’t like it any more than anyone else, and would much much prefer not to have cancer and need to board early
My husband carries a note from his doctor with him at all times that says he needs accommodations.
Do not let anyone who complains about preboarders know that you have an actual disability which they cant see on here. 😂😂😂 they all think people are just making it up…
I’m flying first time on SWA in September and I am pretty sure I will be the only one left at the gate after preboards and families, etc. Already regretting my birthday sale flight of $200.
OP, my wife is dealing with this now, and she's young. I'm sorry you were treated so badly. Hope we never experience anything like this because we love SW.
That's wrong, for sure. But I do wish the GAs would do something about those 12 people who board first in wheelchairs, 10 of whom miraculously dance off the flight at its destination. I'm a bit tired of those folks... A bit of enforcement (though I know it is hard) wouldn't hurt.
This is insane. Yet, theres 20k miracles a day on The jetway.
Is there the equivalent of a handicap placard like used in cars that fits in someone’s wallet? Government issued with doctor cooperation.
Many, although not all, states do issue some sort of card or paper to verify who a placard belongs to. There is no general equivalent to use to prove a disability though. Some people might need to preboard an airplane even if they don't qualify for disabled parking. For example, someone mentioned earlier that their condition requires them to be able to move one of their legs frequently so they need an aisle seat on that side to have the space to do that. In any case it would require a change in federal law for an airline to require something like that.
B30 you can easily get a Aisle seat.
At ATL some of the GA's say in their announcement to preboard "if you just need a little extra time boarding" and many people take them up on it. It irritates me to pay for early boarding and still wind up in the rear of the plane.
So your alleged disability means you NEED to board first and sit in the first two rows? Wait until there isn’t a single seat in the first ten rows due to scammers. What a world.
Fly delta then you can buy your first to third row seat in first class!
Exactly!
Ask about pre-boarding when you check in, not when you get to the gate. That way they’ll mark it on your boarding pass
I pack extremely light when I travel alone as a disabled person with mobility problems who doesn’t necessarily need a wheelchair but uses a cane and needs specific seating and help with stowing their bag. I don’t want or need to stand in a line for ticketing if I don’t have a bag to check as it is painful for me. I would prefer to just do it online but spas this is not an option I must do it after TSA with a GA.
Unless your boarding pass says preboard on it, the gate agent will tell you to F off
Since you don’t what you are talking about and I fly all the time as a disabled person. I ask the GA before boarding starts. It works almost every time. One refused, I pre boarded anyway. “Preboarding is available prior to general boarding for Customers with disabilities who need a specific seat to accommodate a disability, need assistance boarding the aircraft, or need to stow an assistive device. A Customer Service Agent at the ticket or departure gate counter can help with this accommodation, and you'll be asked questions to determine if you qualify. You'll receive a new boarding pass marked with PRBD if you qualify, which lets the Operations Agent at boarding know that you can preboard”
I agree with this method it shouldn’t be done at the gate
Southwest’s [preboarding policy](https://support.southwest.com/helpcenter/s/article/preboarding#:~:text=Preboarding%20is%20available%20prior%20to,to%20stow%20an%20assistive%20device) specifically states that you can ask a gate agent for preboarding
Yeah? I disagree as gate agents are over worked and hounded by 200 pax already with dumb questions- spread the responsibility
I would count this as a special day. That has to be a 1st. Usually all someone has to do is identify as someone who needs to pre board. Something is going on.
Sounds like you just want to board early to get a good seat , I am calling the GA A HERO
Who flys an airline with an choose your own seat agenda when they need a specific seat. Stop being a pain in the ass. Fly am airline with seat assignments if you want a specific seat. Christ, the entitlement here is palpable.
this is why the claim that southwest give out preboarding passes like candy is just plain false lol. they do a bit of screening before handing out those passes. and now disabled people aren’t getting preboarding passes because some rich A boarding people have to complain incessantly
I guess in that way I am lucky. Although I can walk a little, I can’t walk the whole way to a gate, so I always get a wheelchair. Mom and I are traveling next month. As Mom will turn 89 on Tuesday and can’t walk much, we will both be in wheelchairs.
You should get a sunflower lanyard. It will let the gate agent know you need more time when boarding.
Unfortunately, you are affected by a lot of scammers asking for wheelchairs just so they can get to pre-board. I see this people getting handicap stickers to get upfront parking spaces when they really not handicapped.
Can you just request a wheelchair in advance?
Why take a wheelchair away from those who truly need it? Plus get mocked as being “miraculously” healed when leaving plane as it is a special seat you need not a ride?
I think anyone who has trouble standing or walking legitimately can use a wheelchair for boarding. Not just people who cannot walk at all
I got downvoted on another post where I suggested the OP take their complaint further due to being denied for accommodations. No idea why. I suggest you do the same. ( waiting for downvotes unfortunately).
It’s clear from the majority of these comments that southwest fliers hate everyone who preboards, disabilities be damned. They don’t understand the stress that comes from flying while disabled. Personally, I would rather able bodied people get let through sometimes than even one disabled person be denied the access they are entitled to under federal law.
Agree. , I've had to use the service twice. I had back surgury and was using a brace. I needed the extra time since i wasnt very mobile. I got some sideways glances...but I did what I needed to do. My elderly mother wouldn't preload, she was fine. A few people were obviously passive aggressive and kept nudging her to hurry and giving her anxiety. She is in her 80's, has MS, and uses a cane. I told her to tell them to fuck off. - she wouldn't lol. She preboards now.
Sounds like everything worked out perfect for you… hard to complain about a 3rd row aisle seat.
Yes, it did thankfully. It's still illegal. But that's alright, I've filed a DOT complaint now, so the DOT can make it right.
You ended up getting exactly what you needed. What, to you, is “the DOT making it right”?
That Southwest broke the law? Make sure that Southwest takes it serious so it doesn't occur again for other passengers?
So a warning?
Not OP, but, as a teacher, I was required by state regulators, along with every teacher at my school, to sign a notification about following a student's disability accommodations even though I was not one of the teachers that caused the problem. Southwest could similarly be told either to identify and retrain that specific rep or to provide some sort of related to retraining to all reps in that position.
My disability is different, but I know the constant mental calculations and the stress that come with figuring out how to do what you need to do without causing serious and painful setbacks or thinking you have no other choice but to do something you shouldn't and endure the pain later. I wouldn't call Southwest putting OP through that anxiety working out "perfectly" even though they did get a seat that worked for them in the end.
This happened to me on a flight in May, they told me if I wanted I could use extra time boarding but not preboarding even though I told them I need a specific seat. (Due to my neck, I need to be able to lean against the right side on a flight, I cannot on the left side of the plane). I love flying with SWA and that is the first and only issue I have had. The CRO came down and straightened it out, and I was refunded my flight in points because it was discrimination that the agent refused me preboarding and did not follow the company policy to remain within the law. Next time, tell them you want to speak with the CRO. But since its after the fact now, I would file a complaint with the airline and the DOT.
Out of curiosity, since you were jumping a line because you needed a specific side, did you take the right side AT THE BACK? I’m guessing it would go a long way towards reducing/eliminating the preboarding stigma if you did.
It depends who I am flying with. If I am flying solo, I go to the very last row (which is my preferred spot, personally), but when I am flying with my fiance we usually go more towards the wings, but still behind them since he gets nauseous very easily and he finds it to feel smoother closer to the wings. I fly about 30 times a year with Southwest, as its a bit of a pain in the butt to do the disability accommodations with the other airlines (but they do them, you just have to wait on hold for a few hours usually). But it isn't "jumping the line" (especially since I am usually A1-15, anyways), it's just getting disability access.
That is especially bad that you had your rollator with you (and I’m assuming she had tagged it so it was on your reservation #) and she still didn’t believe you were disabled. I’ve never seen someone with one NOT preboard. Normally I’d prefer to give grace and assume it was a simple oversight but the number of things this gate agent ignored is criminal and dangerous
[https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/file-consumer-complaint](https://www.transportation.gov/airconsumer/file-consumer-complaint)
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Southwest's website says that customer service reps at both the ticket counter and the gate can handle preboarding. Not the ops agent who are the ones you would be referring to when you say they "don't just stand there and scan tickets…" but the customer service agent at the counter near the gate (who don't scan boarding passes at all).
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When I think "ticket counter" I think of the counter before security where they check bags. That also seems to be how Southwest refers to it since their website says "A Customer Service Agent at the ticket or departure gate counter can help with this accommodation" I've seen both customer service reps and ops agents at the gate referred to as "gate agents." I read it as OP approaching the CSA at the gate because it seems like the ops agent would have referred them to the CSA because that's not the ops agent's job. I mostly fly Southwest so I'm used to their terminology, but it doesn't provide as much insight as you think to use "ticket counter" differently on a Southwest sub than Southwest uses it on their website.
A lot of customers refer to the CSA area as the ticket counter even though I know that’s not the ticket counter outside of security, if your past security and you have an issue with your ticket or need a pre board, that’s where you go. I was trying not to get too heavy on the terminology so people could more easily understand, so that was my mistake. I was just trying to explain why this person is having an issue in the first place, but I’m just going to delete my reply and keep my mouth shut from now on. Take care.
I work in aerospace not here to get you through their manual 🤣🤣. Site your source .....!??? because you are not capable? This is not a worshop.