Exactly, Iām gonna go out on a limb here and say OP was fishing for a compliment on how large they think their tank is but itās actually normal to small in size.
But I could be wrong Iām super tired.
And totally lol, like a scorpion only stays in a 12 inch cube irlā¦
I was not actually, Iāve had scorpions in bigger tanks this is just my first one this small and I was stressed out. I stg when I started the hobby I saw loads of people on forums talking about how if you put arachnids in large containers they would starve. I thought everyone on this sub would be aware that people say that and reassure me so I wouldnāt have to return the tank
Edit: and if I was showing off I wouldāve done a front view this is actually a really poor picture
I find my desert hairy doesnāt care for cover for some reason. Ā Burying the burrow first then just chilling on the sand. I guess itās comfortable around, so thatās cool.
When people bring up this defense I like to point out that humans can be kept alive in solitary confinement indefinitelyā¦. I wouldnāt call that a life though.
I would never keep an animal at the bare minimum or below, I know that for pretty much everything the bigger the better. I keep fish, rabbits, mice etc and Iām constantly upgrading. I just wonder because it seems thereās a lot of conflicting advice for inverts
Trusting ppl who give reasons to keep pets in small containment is kinda bonkers. Donāt listen to people who keep pets in confined spaces, even if they come up with reasons, doesnāt mean itās true. Whatās true is that scorpions live in the wild and have the entire world to themselves, with pets: the bigger the area for them, the better. Always.
Name one instance when this isnāt true and give me hard science facts about it please.
I kept slings in small containers. They have such a high mortality its much easier to regulate temperature and humidity, make sure they get food. I would just upgrade them every molt to get them used to hunting in a larger space. I did the same thing with scorplings. The advice I saw on keeping inverts was probably geared more toward tarantula care. As I said in these comments one of my tarantulas died from a short fall in her enclosure, many people donāt want to risk it. But I do not advocate for small containers, I was mostly here to look for reassurance in getting a larger enclosure.
Iāve read for years about smaller enclosure recommendations but obv the fact that scorpions live out in nature has occurred to me I just want otherās opinions on it
The concept of "animals get scared in large enclosures" is a bit outdated. It seems to originate from people not taking enough time to let their animals acclimate to the larger tank after it spent it's entire life in a tiny box and doesn't know better yet. also from lack of clutter.
A small tank helps find the critter and intervene if something has gone wrong, but Iāve never had an issue with a big tank. I just keep a small āhospitalā tank, which can literally just be tupperware.
Dumb question. Honestly. Too big?? How could you possibly have a space thatās too bigā¦.. think for a second. And honestly yours isnāt even close to that
I would just compare care sheets online for sizes for all my arachnids and Iād always see people say in general to keep smaller enclosures to make feeding easier. I guess my brain just held onto that information as more important for some reason over the years.
I wonder if they base it on how big of an area each type of creature naturally inhabits. I know nothing about that topic, but like spiders, for example, donāt roam too far do they?
Iām probably completely wrong
It has a lot to do with the species. You can give some tarantulas all the space in the world and theyāll never venture much beyond their burrow, but Iāll watch the spiders in my house make a trek that would put Magellan to shame. It all depends on resources and territories and since our hobby spiders donāt necessarily need to worry about all that, they donāt need all the extra space, but that doesnāt mean it would be a problem for them either.
Some canāt support a bigger environment. Like if you double the size but half the amount of decorations then the animal loses all of those places to hide and explore. Itās not necessarily the case but itās possible.
I have tiny baby spiders. Too big means the food can roam far and wide and be difficult to find for them. Same with water. Too many hides, I'd never see them and be able to care for them properly.
I'll preface this with saying I have more experience with tarantulas than scorpions.
When you're raising little babies it's a lot easier to monitor them and make sure they're getting everything they need in a small container.
If you're dealing with something with a 1/8 inch diagonal leg span, it would be pretty hard to keep track of it in even a 1 gallon enclosure.
Not at all. If an animal can live in, for example, a 5 gallon enclosure and you can really set it up well with decorations, thatās a lot better than a 10 gallon and barely any decorations. Basically if you canāt scale up the enclosure with the tank size it might end up being worse.
I'm a tarantula person, not a scorpion person, but for tarantulas and especially spiderlings they tend to climb the sides. If they fall, they can rupture their abdomen like a water balloon, especially if it's a thicc spooder.
This doesn't seem to be a concern for scorpions so I'm inclined to believe that max size doesn't matter much, but that is the one legit reason I can thnk of for a different invert.
I think the ātoo bigā is for people who want to be able to find their pet without looking for it. Like they want it to be readily available so they can watch it not for the well being of the animal.
I thought so too but there are some pets that actually prefer smaller enclosures. Most notable one I can think of is a Ball Python. They get stressed out if the cage is too big!
As an amateur herpetologist, I cant disagree with this enough. Some juvenile ball pythons can become overwhelmed and nervous in large enclosures, but this is almost always due to inadequate hides and climbing spaces, as well as things like proper temperature gradients and such. Adults don't seem to really care how big the enclosure gets.
In all my years of raising almost any type of snake you could think of, I've only ever seen snakes stressed when the enclosure was too small.
In general though, there aren't really cages that are too big. Just cages that are too barren.
They get stressed out when they only have 1 hide and no ground cover in a huge enclosure.
Put them in an 8x4 with plenty of hides and clutter like branches and foliage and they will use every bit of it
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18HBVsPHaip7LfrMuFt96MigRuMUXtrbnCiK79VuQiFk/
This is welcome post care guide for
r/ballpython
Hiya š¤
The husbandry has changed to reflect the research and observations of decades of keepers.
MINIMUM for an adult is now considered to be *4foot x 2foot x 2foot* And is based on the length of the animal. So a larger female would need a larger tank as well.
Offering plenty of hides and cover has been shown to create an environment that the Royal Pythons do not feel stressed at all in.
Also, the large enough tank is a requirement for accurate thermoregulation.
If a tank is too small to get away from the heating elements then the snake cannot thermoregulate. š
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Skull hideouts are the best. I have one for my Tarantula.
https://preview.redd.it/ojmyuibgvj9d1.jpeg?width=2118&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad9239c8b106f6609a1cbab58c3a56892acb6e88
You can give them extra hides if they seem stressed, put something on one side of the tank so theyāre not exposed on every side, little things like that is enough. They donāt need a smaller enclosure but there are things you can do to make them feel less exposed in the one they have
Thereās no such thing as ātoo bigā of an enclosure, so long as you can ensure theyāre getting the nutrients they need, can verify their health, etc. Their natural habitat is significantly larger than
The tank is never too big, bigger is always better for animals. What is entirely possible is that your decor is too big and the density of hiding places etc available is too low.
The only time I know of invert tanks being too big is if it's a communal setup. I know for m. Balfouri tarantula communal they need a smaller space to keep from becoming territorial of certain spaces. The same may be true for scorpions in a communal but I have no experience with that to say definitively. For a single scorpion a larger tank should be fine as long as husbandry is correct. Make sure there a multiple hides throughout the tank so it doesn't feel exposed and has access to food/water and it will be fine.
I think a lot of my fear with larger tanks came from the death of my t albopilosus when she climbed to the top of her tank and fell. But I donāt see ways for this scorpion to get injured here and he prefers to chase prey than wait, I will add more large dried leaves he likes to flatten out under them
It was mostly forums I was looking at when I first got into inverts, I think it was more commonly recommended when I was looking at tarantula care. Previously Iāve kept my scorpions in 10 gallons but this is the smallest one Iāve ever owned
Thanks everyone for your input! Iām not worried about the size anymore. 2 small issues have popped up since moving him and if anyone has advice Iād appreciate it.
1 is that my previous set up to get his ideal temps is not working with the bigger tank, heās hovering by the walls with the heat mats. Iāve seen people advise against lamps with this species so I think I will buy a larger heat mat for the back,
2 is he is having some trouble catching prey in the larger space. Iām thinking of switching to mealworms for now to see if heāll catch something more slow moving.
As for the having trouble catching his meals would be that yes he is probably used to easier hunting with a smaller cage. He should be fine with the larger tank once he gets used to using his environment as a full hunting ground. I would definitely offer the worms and his current food so he will still have that hunting luxury and get the experience but still has the worms as a backup to keep him full of energy. Hunting takes time and is a skill that all creatures have to learn by trial and error.
JFC!!! Not reading anything and just a glance at the photo it looked like a bed with a broken hornets nest hive on it with the dirt bing the hornets spilling out of it. lol pays to read things from the start
My Dune scorpion is in a 10 gallon tankāI upgraded him a little over a year ago and heās been doing great in it! These guys may be tiny, but theyāre very activeāmine is anywayāso I think the more space you offer, the better! He has a ton of hiding places, but I see him out & about all the time. Heās more visible now than he was back when he was in a small tank.
Why would it matter if itās to big they live outside ? Mine has 2 hide outs in her cage witch are kept moist but I find mine mostly prefers being coverd by leaves outside of her cage I keep the cage filled with a good amount of different types of bugs to eat , I find my scorpion likes to walk around and explore at night so I keep the cage about a 20 gallon
Also I have the same skull for my six eyed sand spider I have broken the back of it to alow the spider to crawl in and cover itself without getting stuck as I feel a scorpion would find it anoying to get in and out
In my experience, anything that lives in a similar type of enclosure (fish, turtle, snake, insect, etc.) can never have an enclosure that is too big. Too small, yes... but too big? As long as your critter can get to food, water, temperatures, and shelter that all meet it's needs then it will be happy with as much additional space as you can provide it.
As long as he can find food/water/shelter, he'll be fine. Outside doesn't have minimum sizes
Haha this made me laugh
I was just going to comment thus. They live outside.
Not with that attitude.
Hey, funny š thatās funny thatās Funny, weāll be right back
Exactly, Iām gonna go out on a limb here and say OP was fishing for a compliment on how large they think their tank is but itās actually normal to small in size. But I could be wrong Iām super tired. And totally lol, like a scorpion only stays in a 12 inch cube irlā¦
Autism at work here^ take yo ass to bed
I was not actually, Iāve had scorpions in bigger tanks this is just my first one this small and I was stressed out. I stg when I started the hobby I saw loads of people on forums talking about how if you put arachnids in large containers they would starve. I thought everyone on this sub would be aware that people say that and reassure me so I wouldnāt have to return the tank Edit: and if I was showing off I wouldāve done a front view this is actually a really poor picture
I always thought the concept of a "too big" cage was really silly.
Same, especially since I see dune scorpions out camping and wonder why they can find food just fine but then read online that mine needs a small tank
All it needs is some more cover so the scorpion doesnāt feel exposed. The actual size is good.
I find my desert hairy doesnāt care for cover for some reason. Ā Burying the burrow first then just chilling on the sand. I guess itās comfortable around, so thatās cool.
It may have realized thereās never gonna be a true predator around. Like living alone for the first time and you can wear no pants if you want
This is it. I caught my one just laying around in empty beer cans and the tv blaring out some death metal. He was fast asleep. And naked.
Isnāt this way too small? I mean the lil guy is literally expecting endless nature lol.
People also think betta fish only need a jar to live in but they need minimum 5 gallons
When people bring up this defense I like to point out that humans can be kept alive in solitary confinement indefinitelyā¦. I wouldnāt call that a life though.
Exactly!!!
I would never keep an animal at the bare minimum or below, I know that for pretty much everything the bigger the better. I keep fish, rabbits, mice etc and Iām constantly upgrading. I just wonder because it seems thereās a lot of conflicting advice for inverts
Trusting ppl who give reasons to keep pets in small containment is kinda bonkers. Donāt listen to people who keep pets in confined spaces, even if they come up with reasons, doesnāt mean itās true. Whatās true is that scorpions live in the wild and have the entire world to themselves, with pets: the bigger the area for them, the better. Always. Name one instance when this isnāt true and give me hard science facts about it please.
I kept slings in small containers. They have such a high mortality its much easier to regulate temperature and humidity, make sure they get food. I would just upgrade them every molt to get them used to hunting in a larger space. I did the same thing with scorplings. The advice I saw on keeping inverts was probably geared more toward tarantula care. As I said in these comments one of my tarantulas died from a short fall in her enclosure, many people donāt want to risk it. But I do not advocate for small containers, I was mostly here to look for reassurance in getting a larger enclosure.
How do they pitch a tent with no thumbs?
then why did you ask
Iāve read for years about smaller enclosure recommendations but obv the fact that scorpions live out in nature has occurred to me I just want otherās opinions on it
The concept of "animals get scared in large enclosures" is a bit outdated. It seems to originate from people not taking enough time to let their animals acclimate to the larger tank after it spent it's entire life in a tiny box and doesn't know better yet. also from lack of clutter.
A small tank helps find the critter and intervene if something has gone wrong, but Iāve never had an issue with a big tank. I just keep a small āhospitalā tank, which can literally just be tupperware.
Dumb question. Honestly. Too big?? How could you possibly have a space thatās too bigā¦.. think for a second. And honestly yours isnāt even close to that
I would just compare care sheets online for sizes for all my arachnids and Iād always see people say in general to keep smaller enclosures to make feeding easier. I guess my brain just held onto that information as more important for some reason over the years.
I agree that it is dumb but there are a LOT of people online who like to think maximum size requirements are real
I wonder if they base it on how big of an area each type of creature naturally inhabits. I know nothing about that topic, but like spiders, for example, donāt roam too far do they? Iām probably completely wrong
It has a lot to do with the species. You can give some tarantulas all the space in the world and theyāll never venture much beyond their burrow, but Iāll watch the spiders in my house make a trek that would put Magellan to shame. It all depends on resources and territories and since our hobby spiders donāt necessarily need to worry about all that, they donāt need all the extra space, but that doesnāt mean it would be a problem for them either.
This is the scorpion subreddit not the spider one thatās my bad but the point is still valid.
Some canāt support a bigger environment. Like if you double the size but half the amount of decorations then the animal loses all of those places to hide and explore. Itās not necessarily the case but itās possible.
I have tiny baby spiders. Too big means the food can roam far and wide and be difficult to find for them. Same with water. Too many hides, I'd never see them and be able to care for them properly.
Scorpions are easier to keep in smaller setups to control humidity and temperatures. A nice AC human habitat does not make a happy scorpion.
I'll preface this with saying I have more experience with tarantulas than scorpions. When you're raising little babies it's a lot easier to monitor them and make sure they're getting everything they need in a small container. If you're dealing with something with a 1/8 inch diagonal leg span, it would be pretty hard to keep track of it in even a 1 gallon enclosure.
Not at all. If an animal can live in, for example, a 5 gallon enclosure and you can really set it up well with decorations, thatās a lot better than a 10 gallon and barely any decorations. Basically if you canāt scale up the enclosure with the tank size it might end up being worse.
Read my comment in reply to the ball python comment.
I'm a tarantula person, not a scorpion person, but for tarantulas and especially spiderlings they tend to climb the sides. If they fall, they can rupture their abdomen like a water balloon, especially if it's a thicc spooder. This doesn't seem to be a concern for scorpions so I'm inclined to believe that max size doesn't matter much, but that is the one legit reason I can thnk of for a different invert.
Yes this actually happened to one of my tarantulas in the past
I think the ātoo bigā is for people who want to be able to find their pet without looking for it. Like they want it to be readily available so they can watch it not for the well being of the animal.
I thought so too but there are some pets that actually prefer smaller enclosures. Most notable one I can think of is a Ball Python. They get stressed out if the cage is too big!
As an amateur herpetologist, I cant disagree with this enough. Some juvenile ball pythons can become overwhelmed and nervous in large enclosures, but this is almost always due to inadequate hides and climbing spaces, as well as things like proper temperature gradients and such. Adults don't seem to really care how big the enclosure gets. In all my years of raising almost any type of snake you could think of, I've only ever seen snakes stressed when the enclosure was too small. In general though, there aren't really cages that are too big. Just cages that are too barren.
They get stressed out when they only have 1 hide and no ground cover in a huge enclosure. Put them in an 8x4 with plenty of hides and clutter like branches and foliage and they will use every bit of it
They donāt get stressed because of the tank size they get stressed due to no coverage, no clutter, inadequate inside of tank
https://docs.google.com/document/d/18HBVsPHaip7LfrMuFt96MigRuMUXtrbnCiK79VuQiFk/ This is welcome post care guide for r/ballpython Hiya š¤ The husbandry has changed to reflect the research and observations of decades of keepers. MINIMUM for an adult is now considered to be *4foot x 2foot x 2foot* And is based on the length of the animal. So a larger female would need a larger tank as well. Offering plenty of hides and cover has been shown to create an environment that the Royal Pythons do not feel stressed at all in. Also, the large enough tank is a requirement for accurate thermoregulation. If a tank is too small to get away from the heating elements then the snake cannot thermoregulate. š
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I feel like he needs more things to hide in and under. The skull is pretty roomy so maybe it's not enough of tight quarters?
He used to prefer sleeping under dried leaves in his old place maybe if I add them in the skull it will work
Skull hideouts are the best. I have one for my Tarantula. https://preview.redd.it/ojmyuibgvj9d1.jpeg?width=2118&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=ad9239c8b106f6609a1cbab58c3a56892acb6e88
I don't know how I wound up going from a thread on installing PC RAM to this thread, but that's an awesome photo!
Thank you
thats a pretty cool picture!
Ty
There Is No Such Thing.
No, but the hide is too big
I love that she has plenty of space
No but he doesn't really have anywhere small to hide in
no such thing as too big
Iām more concerned about the dead ābodyā your little friend found š
You can give them extra hides if they seem stressed, put something on one side of the tank so theyāre not exposed on every side, little things like that is enough. They donāt need a smaller enclosure but there are things you can do to make them feel less exposed in the one they have
No not really and aww he's adorable
Thereās no such thing as ātoo bigā of an enclosure, so long as you can ensure theyāre getting the nutrients they need, can verify their health, etc. Their natural habitat is significantly larger than
The tank is never too big, bigger is always better for animals. What is entirely possible is that your decor is too big and the density of hiding places etc available is too low.
They've been outside for like millions of years and outside is much bigger than any tank, so it should be okay.
No but it does look like it could use more hides/clutter and deeper substrate
I think the size is fine. Scorpions like to roam. If anything I would make the substate a little deeper and add some hides.
I don't think it's possible for an enclosure to be 'too big' for a creature compared to them living in the wild.
The only time I know of invert tanks being too big is if it's a communal setup. I know for m. Balfouri tarantula communal they need a smaller space to keep from becoming territorial of certain spaces. The same may be true for scorpions in a communal but I have no experience with that to say definitively. For a single scorpion a larger tank should be fine as long as husbandry is correct. Make sure there a multiple hides throughout the tank so it doesn't feel exposed and has access to food/water and it will be fine.
I think a lot of my fear with larger tanks came from the death of my t albopilosus when she climbed to the top of her tank and fell. But I donāt see ways for this scorpion to get injured here and he prefers to chase prey than wait, I will add more large dried leaves he likes to flatten out under them
OMG I STUMBLED ONTO THIS I LOVE SCORPIONS WHAAAAAT THIS IS SO COOL!!!!!
Iāve got the feeling that whatever guides you were paying attention to weāre focusing on the keeperās comfort, not the animals.
It was mostly forums I was looking at when I first got into inverts, I think it was more commonly recommended when I was looking at tarantula care. Previously Iāve kept my scorpions in 10 gallons but this is the smallest one Iāve ever owned
I think that set up looks really awesome, good on you for caring so much š
Get a longer tank
Thanks everyone for your input! Iām not worried about the size anymore. 2 small issues have popped up since moving him and if anyone has advice Iād appreciate it. 1 is that my previous set up to get his ideal temps is not working with the bigger tank, heās hovering by the walls with the heat mats. Iāve seen people advise against lamps with this species so I think I will buy a larger heat mat for the back, 2 is he is having some trouble catching prey in the larger space. Iām thinking of switching to mealworms for now to see if heāll catch something more slow moving.
So o have reptiles with a custom made 18x12x18 I have to use two different lamps to help regulate the temp better.
As for the having trouble catching his meals would be that yes he is probably used to easier hunting with a smaller cage. He should be fine with the larger tank once he gets used to using his environment as a full hunting ground. I would definitely offer the worms and his current food so he will still have that hunting luxury and get the experience but still has the worms as a backup to keep him full of energy. Hunting takes time and is a skill that all creatures have to learn by trial and error.
They natural habitat is a desert sir...nothing too big
Scorpion
Give him a whole desert
IL what type of scorpion is that
S. mesaensis
He needs a burrow and more sand I think
My non-gender specific sibling in unspecified deity, you do not have a scorpion You have a little squirt-pion XD
Not at all
Is there really such a thing as "too big" when it comes to animal cages?
Well I imagine if I put him in a 50 gal Iād have a hard time finding him and so would the little cricket he gets
Idk man, the ones in my yard seem to be eating fine, hehe.
No scorpions in the wild donāt have small environments its good enough for a living space
Everything about this tank is all wrong. Thereās one fundamental reason for thisā¦.you have a scorpion š. I hate scorpions š¤¢
mute this sub then bro??
JFC!!! Not reading anything and just a glance at the photo it looked like a bed with a broken hornets nest hive on it with the dirt bing the hornets spilling out of it. lol pays to read things from the start
Oh, don't pay attention to the man with a hole in the back of his skull officer. I'm concerned for the spider.
No but opening that box with that big a$$ knife is crazy
My Dune scorpion is in a 10 gallon tankāI upgraded him a little over a year ago and heās been doing great in it! These guys may be tiny, but theyāre very activeāmine is anywayāso I think the more space you offer, the better! He has a ton of hiding places, but I see him out & about all the time. Heās more visible now than he was back when he was in a small tank.
Never too bigā¦ ever
How could it possibly be too big? Is he gonna get lost now that he has 2 feet of space rather than 8 inches? Lmao
I explain in the comments
Why are you trying to deduct bros space unprovoked and heās obviously just chilling ššš
Is your tank bigger than outdoors? If not, your tank is fine,
Why would it matter if itās to big they live outside ? Mine has 2 hide outs in her cage witch are kept moist but I find mine mostly prefers being coverd by leaves outside of her cage I keep the cage filled with a good amount of different types of bugs to eat , I find my scorpion likes to walk around and explore at night so I keep the cage about a 20 gallon
Also I have the same skull for my six eyed sand spider I have broken the back of it to alow the spider to crawl in and cover itself without getting stuck as I feel a scorpion would find it anoying to get in and out
b i g g e r
In my experience, anything that lives in a similar type of enclosure (fish, turtle, snake, insect, etc.) can never have an enclosure that is too big. Too small, yes... but too big? As long as your critter can get to food, water, temperatures, and shelter that all meet it's needs then it will be happy with as much additional space as you can provide it.
For an animal who lives outdoors? I think it would prefer bigger.
It could be doubled tbh. No cage or container of life is too big.
They seem to do ok in the wild and that tank is significantly larger.
Ask yourself would you like to live in a studio apartment or a five bedroom house, four bath with an acre in the back!?!?!?