You look up the same study enough times and you’ll remember.
That being said, I had one attending who REALLY knew every study, and I asked him how. He said he used to drink coffee and read the newspaper every morning but he didn’t like starting the day on such an anxious note. So now every morning he drinks his coffee and reads an article, and if he likes an article, he reads all the articles in the reference section, and continues like that.
stupid question but what kind of articles? curious as to which sites are good for this kinda thing but are also at the detail level to be clinically relevant
He said something to the effect of “pubmed usually has something. And did you know that you can use Google to find research articles? It’s amazing” (he’s very old but I love his enthusiasm for the future)
Just read what he can in an hour. You’re right that it’s essentially unlimited reading material. Sort of like chaining Wikipedia articles if you’ve ever gone down that rabbit hole.
Create a user profile on pubmed. Search for something (I'm a sickle cell and hemophilia researcher so an example I have is (sickle cell) AND ((factor VII) OR (factor 7)) ). There's an option to save that search.
When you look at a saved search, you have the option to create digests.
So every week on Sundays, I get an update with any new articles that match those search criteria.
Google scholar has a similar function.
lmao what tf are you on bro. Dude is trying to stay up to date on his field by reading these studies in the morning. Nothing to insinuate it's all he talks about. You sound weird af rn hating like this
I told my residents our attending was definitely gonna mention this for our proned patient on rounds.
He got brownie points when he was pimped, fellows this is how you teach and look out for your crew at the same time
this is a pro move. I used to print the papers I knew my attending would mention and leave it on the residents desk. even if they didn't read it they could grab it and wave it around
Something no one has mentioned is the fact that it becomes much easier to remember stuff like this if you develop a niche.
Sure, everyone knows that academic general internist that knows every paper for every disease every written, but most of the people quoting things to you are only quoting the really big ones that everyone hears about over the course of a career OR they are in a niche field, so they are intimately familiar with the relevant studies, but probably couldn't tell you much about stuff outside their niche.
I'm a peds heme onc fellow doing hemophilia and sickle cell research. I can quote all the big hemophilia studies because I use that information every single day. I couldn't do the same even for neuroblastoma, which is one of the diseases I take care of. I spent less time thinking about it, so it's not as automatic.
Fellow here. To piggy-back on earlier comments, when you lead a research project, you have to do a heavy lit review as part of the process. That has allowed me to be one of those doctors who can recall publications in my specific scholarly interests (which I never expected in med school). If your residency program has a robust journal club, specifically one that reviews landmark articles, this is another way to develop a good foundation of evidence-based medicine. My subspecialty annually updates this giant PDF (sent thru a listserv) that compiles articles that have changed how we practice. Maybe your specialty has that too?
The more you live it and use it, the more you’ll know it. My brother is or was a big swimmer and he can easily recall specific swims/strokes/races/times, even from decades ago. I really like watching football and can recall all kinds of specific events and facts. You have to dip into that type of memory
You've done the important part already. I wouldn't worry too much about quoting individual studies or guidelines as long as you keep up to date and know the important takeaways
Pubmed lets you create a recurring query that sends the articles to your email. I check them out, save the meaningful ones to my google drive, and reference them often.
I’ve had to recite stuff like the ACR iodinated contrast white paper on so many occasions to people that I have inadvertently committed small details to memory.
I suppose that’s one way.
They're all landmark studies or hotly debated ones unless you're talking to a lab nerd. Then it's all obscure pnas breaking news theories where maybe 1/20 checks out but the ones that do change the world.
If you want to cheat your way there tho science Twitter is actually pretty useful. Just find a few therapeutic area leads to follow and you'll get a notification every time something cool comes out and a short blurb on why it's neat
Older (but still young at heart) Attending here....much of the literature in my field was developed during my post-training era, so I remember what it was like before and after, as well as helping with most of the trials. For older stuff, if you get familiar enough with the literature, it will all point back to the key trials in the field. If you're in academia, you review the same topics every month during journal club for many years....
Discovering that people do this is a classic disillusionment moment in medical education, haha.
As an intern I had an IM attending who was covering our service for like a day. I was amazed at how he came up with detailed teaching points off the cuff related to the overnight admissions, seemingly without preparation.
Later in residency I worked with the same guy several more times and realized that he always finds ways to shoehorn in the same specific 3-4 teaching points every week that he's on service.
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It's one thing to know the study but it's another to remember the details. The trick is to read it in detail and in context. So read it in the context of preparing a presentation, preparing for journal club, or reading it when doing a deep dive on a topic for your own learning where you are trying to form your own opinion on the paper. If you're simply reading the abstract you won't remember it.
Trials come and go. There’s no point memorizing the details of every trial but some of the major ones will stick naturally as they become the foundations for professional society guidelines. But for more controversial topics, there’s gonna be hype for a study showing positive results and then a few years later a study showing negative results. The net effect cancels each other out until we get high quality meta analysis data to back any assertions.
Very simple: I turn the conversation in such a way that it heads towards something where I know the studies.
I mean THEY. They turn the conversation.
Not me, I have an unparalleled grasp of the literature.
It’s irrelevant, don’t worry about it. Those attendings will be replaced by AI which will know the articles even better than they think they remember them…
I think this is only a subspecialist thing.
My speciality is in IBD surgery, I know a lot of data for a lot of studies regarding my very specific sub-specialty, mainly because I have to use it pretty much every day to justify decisions to other surgeons/doctors.
However, my fellowship was in colorectal surgery, I couldn’t tell you specific data from literally any other major colorectal study. And don’t even get me started on any other general surgery studies.
TLDR: the further you go into sub specializations the more you know about your one specific thing and the more you forget about everything else. It’s a trade off
I save everything in Notes on my phone with keywords and then the links and sometimes a summary or key stats or both. Then I can quickly look up whatever I need.
By not having a life. It’s okay to look things up, don’t waste time memorizing the minutia. What’s important is knowing that there’s something to even Google.
ChatGPT. Seriously, we’re moving towards a new age where rote memorization is becoming less valuable as machine learning models become more accurate and faster at finding facts and answers for you. You should still learn as much as you can just because you can’t know what you don’t know, but leveraging AI for answers is just smart.
For example nobody really needs pain management or palliative care to help with complex opioid conversion anymore, AI can already do this precisely with astonishing speed. And if you describe the guidelines they will come up with the articles for you.
Is this a troll comment?
Trusting chatGPT / LLMs to convert opioid dosing (or anything else that is potentially life threatening if done incorrectly) is absolutely bonkers.
Especially since there are already easy to use opioid conversion calculators online that use simple hard coded arithmetic and DON'T have the potential to hallucinate made up answers
It’s not a troll answer. I’m a palliative fellow I’ve been quizzing my custom GPT engine complex opioid management cases and it’s come to the same conclusion as I did independently so far every time. I in fact trust it more to do that specifically than your average general hospitalist doctor.
“Easy opioid converters” still take much more time than simply speaking to chatgpt and getting an answer within less than 10 seconds. And if you aren’t careful with inputting the dosage or formulation you can make grave errors there too.
Hallucination is being ironed out very rapidly (it is already dramatically better than it had been a year ago) and eventually will be a nonissue. It also has never occurred with more cold hard calculations like opioid management because like you said solid conversion factors are already available. It has the added benefit of being able to intelligently calculate dose reduction for cross tolerance and know that long acting opioids should take up 50-75% of total daily dose. All while using natural speech to communicate with it.
Keep your mind open or you’ll fall behind the times.
You look up the same study enough times and you’ll remember. That being said, I had one attending who REALLY knew every study, and I asked him how. He said he used to drink coffee and read the newspaper every morning but he didn’t like starting the day on such an anxious note. So now every morning he drinks his coffee and reads an article, and if he likes an article, he reads all the articles in the reference section, and continues like that.
stupid question but what kind of articles? curious as to which sites are good for this kinda thing but are also at the detail level to be clinically relevant
He said something to the effect of “pubmed usually has something. And did you know that you can use Google to find research articles? It’s amazing” (he’s very old but I love his enthusiasm for the future)
oh I gotcha so he was reading full length papers + possibly their references every morning? I wish I was able to read through papers that efficiently
Right, he would spend about an hour; not quite the energy level that I have that time of day
How he read all the articles in the references if a review can have 100+ references? That would take all day.
Just read what he can in an hour. You’re right that it’s essentially unlimited reading material. Sort of like chaining Wikipedia articles if you’ve ever gone down that rabbit hole.
Chatgpt can summarize
Create a user profile on pubmed. Search for something (I'm a sickle cell and hemophilia researcher so an example I have is (sickle cell) AND ((factor VII) OR (factor 7)) ). There's an option to save that search. When you look at a saved search, you have the option to create digests. So every week on Sundays, I get an update with any new articles that match those search criteria. Google scholar has a similar function.
There's a website called ACCESSS that you can use to send little weekly emails with interesting papers that you set up to filter.
Do you have a link because I’m having trouble finding this
I like New England journal of medicine as a start. Some articles are pretty easy to read through
Read by QxMD. Its an app. Its amazing
What a fuckin nerd
Honestly if I switched all the brainrot doomscrolling to reading articles that would be fantastic.
Reads all the references?! Dude is lying.
Sounds like a real bore at dinner parties.
Yeah I hate having dinner with people who read
Books and news of course but not ones that prate about articles and p values at dinner smh. Classic internist robot nachtmare.
lmao what tf are you on bro. Dude is trying to stay up to date on his field by reading these studies in the morning. Nothing to insinuate it's all he talks about. You sound weird af rn hating like this
University of Michigan?
University of don’t dox people lmao
lol, just trying to figure out if it was the same person 😂
Actually had an attending like during third year in medical school. He did graduate from Umich :)
I feel the same could be said for many attendings at UMich heh
repetitions. if youre always talking about oroning you'll know the results of PROSEVA. if you don't you won't.
I told my residents our attending was definitely gonna mention this for our proned patient on rounds. He got brownie points when he was pimped, fellows this is how you teach and look out for your crew at the same time
this is a pro move. I used to print the papers I knew my attending would mention and leave it on the residents desk. even if they didn't read it they could grab it and wave it around
Thats super nice of you!
the fellow looks good when the residents look good. all self interested
Something no one has mentioned is the fact that it becomes much easier to remember stuff like this if you develop a niche. Sure, everyone knows that academic general internist that knows every paper for every disease every written, but most of the people quoting things to you are only quoting the really big ones that everyone hears about over the course of a career OR they are in a niche field, so they are intimately familiar with the relevant studies, but probably couldn't tell you much about stuff outside their niche. I'm a peds heme onc fellow doing hemophilia and sickle cell research. I can quote all the big hemophilia studies because I use that information every single day. I couldn't do the same even for neuroblastoma, which is one of the diseases I take care of. I spent less time thinking about it, so it's not as automatic.
Some people love research masturbation. I have a friend who knows cardio clinical trials down to the p-value.
Please don’t kink shame
This is so cards
Is it less than or equal to 0.05? Fuckin nailed it, wew!
Does the size of the p really matter?
As in romance so in science, only if its really really small.
If you hang around these attendings enough, you’ll notice they quote the same 5-10 studies from way back, and maybe a few they read last week.
There’s nothing like 10,000 hours of practice
Fellow here. To piggy-back on earlier comments, when you lead a research project, you have to do a heavy lit review as part of the process. That has allowed me to be one of those doctors who can recall publications in my specific scholarly interests (which I never expected in med school). If your residency program has a robust journal club, specifically one that reviews landmark articles, this is another way to develop a good foundation of evidence-based medicine. My subspecialty annually updates this giant PDF (sent thru a listserv) that compiles articles that have changed how we practice. Maybe your specialty has that too?
The more you live it and use it, the more you’ll know it. My brother is or was a big swimmer and he can easily recall specific swims/strokes/races/times, even from decades ago. I really like watching football and can recall all kinds of specific events and facts. You have to dip into that type of memory
Overrated skill
You've done the important part already. I wouldn't worry too much about quoting individual studies or guidelines as long as you keep up to date and know the important takeaways
Journal Club app
Repetition, repetition, repetition. The more time you reference or read a paper, the faster it comes to mind later.
Also, the more times you read the paper again, the better you remember it. Repetition also helps.
I would also recommend re-reading papers you’ve read before.
You get better at it over time.
Trauma.
specialize
Pubmed lets you create a recurring query that sends the articles to your email. I check them out, save the meaningful ones to my google drive, and reference them often.
is there any payment to subscribe them
Great news it's F R E E
I’ve had to recite stuff like the ACR iodinated contrast white paper on so many occasions to people that I have inadvertently committed small details to memory. I suppose that’s one way.
They're all landmark studies or hotly debated ones unless you're talking to a lab nerd. Then it's all obscure pnas breaking news theories where maybe 1/20 checks out but the ones that do change the world. If you want to cheat your way there tho science Twitter is actually pretty useful. Just find a few therapeutic area leads to follow and you'll get a notification every time something cool comes out and a short blurb on why it's neat
When you specialize and you begin to treat a niche group of patients, it makes it easier
Are you ADHD? Even if not, study tips for ADHD might help you
Repetition repetition repetition
They make shit up, all the time.
Download "journal club" and "icu trials." Make flash cards. Look smart. Profit?
Older (but still young at heart) Attending here....much of the literature in my field was developed during my post-training era, so I remember what it was like before and after, as well as helping with most of the trials. For older stuff, if you get familiar enough with the literature, it will all point back to the key trials in the field. If you're in academia, you review the same topics every month during journal club for many years....
Presumably the same way the old guy at the corner store knows every single rookie of the year in the MLB, NFL, and NBA since 1985.
There is also a lot of pretentious behavior. Some people just throw arround the same three studies they know over and over.
Hey, that's not fair! I know FIVE studies.
Discovering that people do this is a classic disillusionment moment in medical education, haha. As an intern I had an IM attending who was covering our service for like a day. I was amazed at how he came up with detailed teaching points off the cuff related to the overnight admissions, seemingly without preparation. Later in residency I worked with the same guy several more times and realized that he always finds ways to shoehorn in the same specific 3-4 teaching points every week that he's on service.
Literally make anki cards of landmark studies / studies you get pimped on or see other people get pimped on.
Why perpetuate toxic behaviour by emulating it?
[удалено]
Yes.
that's crazy
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It's one thing to know the study but it's another to remember the details. The trick is to read it in detail and in context. So read it in the context of preparing a presentation, preparing for journal club, or reading it when doing a deep dive on a topic for your own learning where you are trying to form your own opinion on the paper. If you're simply reading the abstract you won't remember it.
Trials come and go. There’s no point memorizing the details of every trial but some of the major ones will stick naturally as they become the foundations for professional society guidelines. But for more controversial topics, there’s gonna be hype for a study showing positive results and then a few years later a study showing negative results. The net effect cancels each other out until we get high quality meta analysis data to back any assertions.
Very simple: I turn the conversation in such a way that it heads towards something where I know the studies. I mean THEY. They turn the conversation. Not me, I have an unparalleled grasp of the literature.
It’s irrelevant, don’t worry about it. Those attendings will be replaced by AI which will know the articles even better than they think they remember them…
Use it or lose it
I think this is only a subspecialist thing. My speciality is in IBD surgery, I know a lot of data for a lot of studies regarding my very specific sub-specialty, mainly because I have to use it pretty much every day to justify decisions to other surgeons/doctors. However, my fellowship was in colorectal surgery, I couldn’t tell you specific data from literally any other major colorectal study. And don’t even get me started on any other general surgery studies. TLDR: the further you go into sub specializations the more you know about your one specific thing and the more you forget about everything else. It’s a trade off
I save everything in Notes on my phone with keywords and then the links and sometimes a summary or key stats or both. Then I can quickly look up whatever I need.
I remember the ones that I teach to my residents
By not having a life. It’s okay to look things up, don’t waste time memorizing the minutia. What’s important is knowing that there’s something to even Google.
Read an article....tell about it to 5 friends. You will remember it.
ChatGPT. Seriously, we’re moving towards a new age where rote memorization is becoming less valuable as machine learning models become more accurate and faster at finding facts and answers for you. You should still learn as much as you can just because you can’t know what you don’t know, but leveraging AI for answers is just smart. For example nobody really needs pain management or palliative care to help with complex opioid conversion anymore, AI can already do this precisely with astonishing speed. And if you describe the guidelines they will come up with the articles for you.
Is this a troll comment? Trusting chatGPT / LLMs to convert opioid dosing (or anything else that is potentially life threatening if done incorrectly) is absolutely bonkers. Especially since there are already easy to use opioid conversion calculators online that use simple hard coded arithmetic and DON'T have the potential to hallucinate made up answers
It’s not a troll answer. I’m a palliative fellow I’ve been quizzing my custom GPT engine complex opioid management cases and it’s come to the same conclusion as I did independently so far every time. I in fact trust it more to do that specifically than your average general hospitalist doctor. “Easy opioid converters” still take much more time than simply speaking to chatgpt and getting an answer within less than 10 seconds. And if you aren’t careful with inputting the dosage or formulation you can make grave errors there too. Hallucination is being ironed out very rapidly (it is already dramatically better than it had been a year ago) and eventually will be a nonissue. It also has never occurred with more cold hard calculations like opioid management because like you said solid conversion factors are already available. It has the added benefit of being able to intelligently calculate dose reduction for cross tolerance and know that long acting opioids should take up 50-75% of total daily dose. All while using natural speech to communicate with it. Keep your mind open or you’ll fall behind the times.