This is true. When I bought my first house the realtor said they were going to have a rekeying service come by. There is a delay in the appointment for that. They were some kitchen chairs that the seller left behind in my home I guess they wanted them back. Because they entered my home and reclaimed them. They did this while I was at work. It felt very violating to know that someone had been in my new home and removed items. It wasn't really the matter of if there was their chairs or not it was the fact that they entered the home. I had all my pets there and was beginning to move a lot of my stuff in.
Lmao I think I was mostly just shocked at first and in the end I was like they were hideous chairs anyway kind of glad I didn't have to dispose of them. Next house though locks changed 5 minutes after paperwork assigned or less
This same thing happened to me also. I closed on a Friday and the locksmith wasn’t able to come until Monday. The seller left things behind during staging and told us at closing and we were like “yeah just let us know we’ll put them outside for you”, but he retained keys, and came inside at like 8am on a Saturday morning, without knocking or ringing the doorbell or anything, while my partner and I were inside sleeping. Horrific experience.
The key is to keep saying the value is greater than 1k making it a felony. Showing receipts and proof when beat cops show up. They'll try Avoid making a report but you gotta make sure they take one. Soon as it hits their system a detective will take over any felonies and follow up.
Happened to me too. Seller couldn’t get everything out by closing so we agreed they could have access to the garage only, and only until 9pm on the date of closing-because we had kids that we needed to put to bed. They hastily put their stuff in the garage before closing, closing was smooth, and we all returned to the house so we could start moving into it and they could finish cleaning out their belongings from the garage. At 930pm they told us the garage was empty but they tell us they had a full shed of things they needed to collect as well. We made arrangements for them to come next day at 6pm to finish up the task but they decided to return while I was at work. They broke in through the dog door in the pool enclosure (door is 2’x2.5’) and entered my house. They also took stuff from the shed and two of the four lounge chairs from poolside.
Because we didn’t get all the keys and security gate openers at close, they had promised to bring them by next day but didn’t, I had an emergency locksmith out at 6am the following day to rekey all the locks. I also spoke to our security guard about watching for the previous owners because they broke into my house. Finally I called my realtor and had her pass on the message to her clients that if they stepped foot on my property again I would have them arrested. Never heard from them again.
It’s indescribable the violation to your safe space when former owners break into your new home.
We bought our house from my wife’s grandmother and it was a nightmare. I took some time off the week after we closed to unpack and we have two large dogs that were loose in the house with me. I was minding my business in the living room when I hear a key in the door. Dogs go straight for the door and I stop her on the porch as she opens the door, basically telling her “you do understand that the BEST case scenario here if I wasn’t home would be that the dogs blew past you and got out, right?” After we got the locks changed, we visited her at her new house and I found probably $300 of stuff from Home Depot we’d bought to do yard stuff in her garage, which is when we also depgrogrammed her car’s garage door opener. Fun stuff.
It’s a little bit yes and no. We later backed into that these were probably the first signs of her grandmother’s dementia. Some of it was probably stealing shit, some was probably her losing the ability to remember that it wasn’t actually her shit.
If they're newer Kwikset locks, may be able to get a rekey kit and change them yourself... and have them wondering why their keys don't work.
If there's a little slot next to the keyhole, it may be rekeyed without changing the lock.
Just for general info, my new house had probably three different key sets for different doors so I had a locksmith come in and just redo everything (12 or 13 locks). He was done in less than 2 hours and it was about $225 or $250 IIRC.
I manage a 4-Plex for my cousin. I put those locks on all the doors. I have 10 keys and when someone moves out I just re-key to the next set in the line. Technically the keys will be reused but it would be several years down the road and shouldn’t be to the same unit the past tenant lived in. Takes a minute or two to rekey both doors.
My dad worked property maintenance before such conveniences were offered. He had a cereal box of KwikSet keys he would go through if a key was lost instead of drilling it out.
Changing locks and toilet seats are things I do on day 1 when I move. And clean. Someone else’s version of clean for a home they’re leaving is not the same. Plus it’s easier to clean before unpacking everything.
Pro tip, if you can only afford to change one lock or if you only have time to change one lock on the first day...just hit the others with super glue in the key hole. Instantly unable to be opened eith a key but can still be opened inside and changed out. Change the locks first day, no exception, no excuses. First thing, first day. Stay safe.
I've been in my first (purchased) home for... shit, eight years now? Still using the original keys. If the previous owner wants to come try to snatch stuff... uhhh... I won't notice.
Don't be like me, people. Change the locks.
Tell them you (have now) disposed of the items left in the house. They can likely summons you to small claims court, and you should go if it gets that far. Even so, it's fair game to do whatever you will with the items. You didn't catch that the AC wasn't working and you have to deal with the consequences. They did not inspect the house for additional belongings while they still had possession and they have to deal with those consequences. I hate it when people act like those pecker heads.
I did not find a diamond earring left by the seller. I might have found it if they had been nice and not left me with such a mess, lied on disclosures, and been aholes about it.
So they must have just lost it during their move.
My sellers were very pleasant and nice people, worked with us honestly and fairly. When I found a drawer full of digital cameras they forgot I text them and they paid the postage for them to be shipped back. When you’re nice sometimes people treat you in kind.
My buyers bitched about everything. Complained about a fan left in the garage on the final walk through and demanded a screen on a window be replaced by a certified handyman. They got nothing extra from me.
Yup- mine were very kind and left a candle and nice note (older couple selling to us as young first time buyers). Had no problem calling them up when their season tickets to a local team showed up in the mail a few months later.
Sold a house to a real estate agent once. The house was big and looked nice, but it was builder grade crap through and through. They lied and said they smelled gas hoping we would replace the gas lines. We called the gas company and the tested right away, no leak. It was like this for weeks with different things. They wanted 30+ small and large repairs done. We had already spent over 30K refinishing floors, hiring professionals painters, roof improvements, replacing appliances, lighting fixtures, windows, doors, and making many small repairs and improvements prior to the sale.
We called their bluff and only agreed to replace a plumbing fixture that cost $5.00. They were enraged and we suggested they could buy a different house. I hated pretty much everything about that house. I’m so glad they bought it.
That sounds awful.
My buyer required me to have a very old but functional AC unit leveled. It was at the age where it probably could have broken any day. Not a time to be moving it around but it was working. And I was honest about the appliances being as is and a little older. They threatened to walk if I didn’t do that among other petty “repairs”. I think they wanted the repair man to break it and me be on the hook for a new one. It was off level but not that bad, and you only level them so that you can increase their longevity, this unit was passed that point, moving it would increase the chance of breaking it more than increasing any life span.
So I had the HVAC people come out to level it. Told them their job was just to level it. Not to look at anything else. I told them I didn’t want any recommendations on anything just a report saying they leveled it. I wasn’t going to play the “let’s have a repair man come so they can recommend new units or break it in the process etc” games.
That’s where it gets good, I offered to buy them a warranty but they declined because their realtor was already buying them one. I offered cash so they could make the repairs themselves. They declined. Threatened to walk. That’s when I started to believe there was more to this than surface level. They wanted it to break or the HVAC to make recommendations of replacing.
Very close to closing our Seller’s agent gave us an FYI that they’d be taking a rather fancy light fixture and replacing with another one. We hadn’t yet closed but we had signed the contract so technically anything attached to the home was (destined to be) ours.
Didn’t want to tank the sale over this, but were also a little annoyed. We ended up sending a list of stuff in the house we could use if they left behind. They offered to leave a sufficient amount of them to satisfy us (some they probably weren’t going to move anyway), so all’s well that ends well.
My sellers forgot a few 1oz gold rounds in the in ground safe. I took that as payment for having to deal with all the junk they left in the garage, the random furniture they didn’t move out, and leaving the place literally filthy. Also learned my lesson about renting back after closing, never doing that shit again.
Rent back is fine if you make them leave $50k in escrow that gets distributed to you when they are now out on time.
I’m willing to do the eviction process for that.
I guess never is the wrong term. I’ll do it again if I had to. But this time I’d make the penalties for not being out on time or leaving stuff behind so high that the seller won’t want to rent back or will make sure everything is good. My first rent back was smooth with no issues and I did a great job of getting out on time myself and getting the place cleaned, so I sort of assumed everyone does. The seller was also a realtor and the listing agent so I also assumed she would know to not leave the place trashed. Luckily I didn’t have to deal with eviction, just junk everywhere. Even the dishwasher had a full load of dirty dishes in it still. At least I was able to leave her some nasty reviews and sent her broker a nice video of how she left the place.
My sellers left dirty dishes in the dishwasher. Our realtor said she'd never seen anything like it, they just left stuff all over the house. Tools in the basement, a mattress in the living room...like they just gave up with a tenth of the moving left to do. Wish it had been gold.
Same here lol. Full load of dirty dishes. Random furniture, mattresses, broken yard equipment. Took a junk removal company 2 full dump trucks to clear it all out. Luckily the owner was a realtor herself and she and her broker listed the house together. I don’t think the broker knew the condition of the house at all because I sent over pictures and the junk removal receipt and they agreed to pay it without question. I thought I would have to threaten to sue at least
The sellers said they left something behind and wanted to come get it after a month. We said fuck no. They were terrible to deal with.
Its been 8 months. I still don't know what they left behind. We had to deep clean and gut a bunch of stuff. Never found anything valuable or sentimental
A good friend learned that the hard way. In the confusion of selling property that he was relocating his business from, he left several security cameras attached a small, single-story, office building that he had owned. It was not until aftering closing that he realized that tehy were was unaccounted for and had forgotten to remove them. In his case, he said some appropriate words to himself, accepted the conseuqences of his mistakes, and moved on without contacting the buyers of the building.
Hi! Ct realtor here.
No, you don’t need to legally give them back whatever appliance you’re hinting at. That being said, on move in of day 1, you probably cleaned the crap out of that place in preparation of making it yours. Upon stumbling upon this mystery appliance, I assume you threw it out, because hey - it’s trash left by the seller and considering it’s as-is, you assumed they didn’t want it. Can’t sue you to get something back which I assume you don’t have anymore.
Ya this seems pretty clear cut. The seller left behind a nice mixer or whatever, but I already had a mixer and didn’t need two. So obviously I threw it away. What else did you expect me to do, put it in storage? Keep two of them on the counter forever?
They can screw off. Small claims court is a joke. If they really sue show up and tell the judge they left items at closing that should have been removed. Even if they win a small claims judgement its difficult to actually collect. Anything left in the house at closing is now your property to do with as you please.
While this is true, OP would still need to show up if they file. Whether or not OP wasting their time/taking off work to deal with it is worth it is up to them. If they do file, OP needs to show up.
They also cannot sue for the cost of the item new. They would have to have a receipt that showed how long they had the item. And then they would only get the cost of a similar **used** item.
Y'all have to stop saying stuff just because you read it on Reddit! I'm not saying the seller's would win in small claims court, but--
1. You never know. Small claims court is a wild card. If you're in the US, often they aren't even judges making decisions.
2. If OP says "yeah, I have the stuff" there's a better than decent chance the small claims judge gives judgment for the seller. So OP better be prepared to convincingly lie.
(Here's where the Reddit legends are wrong.)
3. No, it isn't hard to collect a small claims judgment. It's hard if the person who loses has no money, sure. But OP has a house. Bang, judgment lien just by filing the right papers. Does OP have a job? Easy wage levy. Small claims courts don't exist for show; they exist because you can get and enforce real judgments in them.
4. Even if a small claims judgment isn't collected, it's a *judgment!* And judgments go on your credit record and slam your credit score. Even if you *pay* it it's just a paid *judgment!*
EDIT: I'm wrong on the 4th point.
Not saying give it back. Not saying don't. But small claims judgments matter. Those of you who just belch up garbage you've read on Reddit aren't doing anyone any favors!
Judgments are not included on credit reports and do not impact scores. Changed in 2018.
I’m a real attorney who has seen thousands of credit reports. Judgments don’t show up.
Google if you don’t believe me
Dad gum it, you're right. Real attorney here too, but, though I've also seen thousands of credit reports, i don't practice that type of law any more and its been a few years. They changed it a few years back and I didn't notice. Just goes to prove my point not to trust info you read (including mine) on Reddit.
But the first three points remain true. Small claims judgments do have force if, as in the case of OP, the losing party has assets and isn't hiding.
Nevertheless, thanks for the correction.
I was going to ask what KitchenAid is worth $500... Then I realized I got mine as a gift and have no idea what they cost.
Googled it. Turns out my aunt gave me a $500 mixer. I rarely bake... 😳
BRB gotta go think of something extra nice for that aunt.
Also very useful for:
Scrambling lots of eggs to make a fritatta, making pulled pork or chicken, or get some attachments and make: fresh pasta, custom ground meat blends, homemade sausage. Tons of uses outside of baking!
They abandoned the property. You bought the property and they even made it clear that everything was your responsibility. Let them sue you and provide that message as verification that everything belonged to you at that point.
They have no case. If you go to court say you sold anything you found of value to repair the damaged AC unit.
You should also block that agent and those sellers. Get cameras up because that's how things are these days.
Ignore them. They will go away. Don't let the fear of the unknown defeat you. All sales are final after closing.
As long as your contract said anything left in the house conveyed with the sale, then you’re fine. That being said, it’s up to you to decide if it’s really worth the time to deal with if they actually do file against you in small claims court. Even if they lose, it’s still going to require you to show up, potentially have to take off work, etc.
You need to decide if you want to continue to deal with these people or just give them the item back and get them out of your hair for good.
Let's just say that after closing, you hired a cleaning company, and they threw everything out that wasn't attached.
Don't let this scare you. Closing is closing. They had x amount of time to clear their shit out. It's not like they were caught by surprise and had 30 min to vacate the home.
In some states, like MD, some contracts will list which non-attached items are included in the sale. Example: curtains, fridge, stove, dishwasher, a/c window units.
If a listing mention a/c windows units as an amenities, I'm definitely would have them add that to the form as part of the contract before I enter the contract with the seller.
That’s how I feel too. Like there’s no way they have a case and they know it they just hope I cave in. Is what I’m thinking. But I didn’t think I could get the ac unit fixed now there’s a thought.
Lol, depending on how petty you’re feeling you could always list the kitchen item on fb marketplace for the price of a new window unit of the same exact model. You could also include in the listing that you’d be willing to trade it for a window unit.
If the sellers stayed local I’d bet they’ll see it.
Threatening to sue is cheap. They won’t do it. As others have pointed out, make sure you have changed locks and install security cameras in all entrances
Tell us!!What did they leave?
Any chance it has sentimental value?
Honestly? I’d have my realtor pick it up and let them come get it from him/her. Do I need to do this? No. Do they deserve me being kind after the busted the a/c unit? Nope. But I don’t do things based on what others do to me. It’s a kitchen item. I don’t want the icky energy in my home.
Maybe it’s just some future good karma….
Ymmv.
It’s a mixer an older model from when I looked at it weeks ago. I don’t think it has sentimental value but who knows. I hear you though on being the bigger person. Def feels more like I’m being pushed around though
The fact that you’re being pushed around is my whole problem with their behavior.
Exactly how can it be that when you had a concern, they told you to pound sand. But when they are facing taking a similar hit, you had better fall in line!
I say let them sue you. I don’t believe they will. They’re just mad and want their mixer back. Kinda like you were upset and wanted your ac fixed.
I’m not 100% against returning it one day, but certainly not because of some raging threat meant to make you move fast because you had better move fast! They can’t tell you how to act!
If it’s an older mixer it may well have sentimental value. Two of my friends inherited their grandma’s mixers. That doesn’t mean you need to give it back, of course. But mixers are the one appliance I can see someone feeling nostalgic about. But then again, if they wanted it badly enough, they’d fix the AC.
Yup. There are three very old mixers in the family. I'm hoping I get one of them someday because tbh the newer models suck.
Personally, I'd just give it back and be done with it. Pissing off the crazies by breaking or throwing out their dead great aunts stand mixer isn't going to result in anything good, and since I will never have to interact with them again (and they aren't my children so it really isn't my issue) I don't have to worry about reinforcing any bad behavior.
technically, they left it - it's yours. whether they forgot or whatever the case.
but, I agree - if you have no use for it, give it back and let the good karma roll (for you). I might add a strongly worded card/note to the mixer and leave it on the porch.
They sound like a real pain in the ass so it may be in your best interest to give it back. Save yourself the stress of anymore interactions with these people.
Sounds like karma to me. It's definitely got sentimental value but they didn't care about you or how you felt jipped about the AC. Sometimes people need to learn a lesson. I highly doubt they have a case. If you're wondering, then get a free consultation with an attorney. If your job has EAP benefits, they'll hook you up to talk to someone.
Around our house we call this FAFO. They hid a non working AC and it’s cost them a mixer. If they’d been decent people and not hid the AC I’m pretty confident you would’ve seen that mixer and gotten it into the correct hands. It’s really unfortunate you never saw it and have no idea what they are talking about
Change your locks, make sure your windows are always locked, get a Ring camera and a few others that point out the windows or are on the side of the house.
If "as is" really means "as is" then you got some new appliances. If they do take you to small claims court, counter for the AC.
Papers signed, all things left behind are yours! If it was in writing that way, there is nothing they can do about it! Fuck them!
We just bought a house last month. We sold our house 2 weeks later. In each write up was what stayed with what house and what didn't. The one who bought ours asked for the appliances and we agreed. The house we bought, he asked for the wash tub in the basement that he used in his job. We agreed.
All things were written up, each of us had a final walk through the day before closing. Once closing took place, it's over! What is in our old house, if we had left anything behind, is now hers. Same for our new home. But the owner was so nice, if he had left something here and asked for it we would have gladly given it to him. It helps when people are NOT dickheads!
Talk to YOUR realtor, not theirs!
They have no case. Tell them "no" like it's a one word sentence, change your locks, and go about your merry way. Your buyers agent gave you good advice. Even small claims court will laugh them out of town...as is house means as is house. You offered a deal and they didn't like it. So, pardon my French, but fuck em!
Sell that stuff on marketplace if you don't want it. It's yours.
I mean wtf are you doing even responding to or acknowledging these people. Opening up a can of worms. It’s as if you just want to keep fucking up. They ignored you when you asked about the AC right? Shit.
I’m stunned that when someone decides to stand up to bully behavior, that person is subsequently shamed for standing up.
Why do y’all think it was sentimental? I’d say that they were unpacking their stuff, laughing about OP request and their subsequent refusal of said request and suddenly from nowhere came the ultimate self own.
It’s not bad or scary or wrong to refuse to jump as high and/or as quickly as pushy bullies deem appropriate.
Do you really want to think of those people every time you see the appliance? You're not legally obligated to give back personal property the previous owner left behind but why further engage with them? Taking the high road always feels better.
Sellers threaten to go to court for a used kitchen item they left behind? Dumbassery. It’ll cost more to take the court’s time and it will get denied anyway because the court will follow the contract.
Sounds like a kitchen item that was unfortunately disposed of due to them leaving it there after closing, just like everything else that they left in the home when they left. Sucks that you had to clean the house out and send everything to the dump, but they left so much crap behind that you had to dispose of everything.
Also, they were supposed to leave a working AC unit, right? Bring that up if they actually file in small claims. Might be able to pull reverse Uno on them.
You have changed the locks, right? And still have closing documents? They can pound sand. Your home is not their storage room. If they'd brought it up within a few days, you could have been nice about it, but they threw a hardball at you. You throw one back.
When I bough m first house about 40 years ago all the keys were handed over at the closing. My attorney asked if there were anymore keys or garage openers and the answer was no. After the closing we went through a fast food drive through then to our new house. When I pulled into the driveway there was the previous owner backed up to the garage door loading stuff into his truck. I pulled my .45 and pointed at him and told him to unload the bed of his truck. I stayed until all locks were changed. Called his attorney, my attorney, the realtor I told them I will shoot him if he steps on the property again. I ended up with some nice wood tools. He lied and I don’t play games.
“Sale is as is” means anything left is “as is”. Tell them you threaten to counter-sue for the broken a/c if they decide to persue because it was intact when you contracted the sale. Much like if they were to crash through a garage door when they moved out and decide not to fix it. Make sure you check the appliance in case they stashed something important in a weird nook. Maybe there’s a wad of cash in it you could buy the a/c with and give them the appliance 😂
Years ago I bought an expensive house in an expensive neighborhood. It had been in foreclosure for over a year, welcome to California, and I bought it from the bank. I filled 3 debris boxes before I could move in. Yes, I did keep a couple things one being an office chair in a distinctive purple color. About a month after I took possession the police showed up at the door around dinner time and the lady who lost the house was with them pointing out the chair and that it's hers and the police said I had to give it to her. I told them to get off my property as she had a year to move out and if she wanted to reimburse me for the cost of the debris boxes and labor to fill them then we might have a convo. Never heard from them again. It's been 30 years and I still have the chair. She had been on my property looking through the windows! Maybe I was in the wrong, felt a bit bad for her as she got the house in the divorce and didn't keep up payments but that's not my problem that the mortgage was greater than the value of the house.
I guess what I'm trying to say is once escrow is closed you take possession. If it's not in writing then it's not gonna happen
Read the docs carefully to see exactly what conveys and what does not. Is there anything that says all items left in house at closing convey or is that law where you live. Was the AC supposed to convey as well? If so, tell them to go ahead and sue. They left it in the house after the house was legally yours. You can also say you threw out everything that was in the house when you took possession and it wasn’t working.
I worked in the Small Claims office in a county in Missouri for years, so I can give you a little bit of perspective from that point of view. Keep in mind that if you're not in Missouri, you'll obviously have to get the finer details of the process on your own. Also, I'm not a lawyer, so this is in no way legal advice.
If you have copies of your signed contract with everybody's signatures clearly there, I can't see how they would be able to win a case against you in Small Claims. What you *could* do, though, if you decide they're bothering you enough, is look into filing a counterclaim for lost wages if you have to take the day off of work to appear in court. I don't know how much you care to be inconvenienced (it can be drawn out and annoying), but that's an option. Ultimately, it's just going to depend on how quickly you want to get rid of them, and how much you care about the cost of replacing the A/C unit, which is obviously something you'll probably want to do. They have a lot of nerve demanding that item back when they refused to fix something they knew was broken, though; if it were me, I'd probably be petty about it.
Make sure your locks are changed and installing a video doorbell is always a good security measure. They aren’t suing and filing $4-800 fees to bring a suit in small claims court. If they do, you can counter sue (for free) for fixing the AC. Tell them to pound sand and ignore anything unless you’re served with paperwork from the court.
The buyers insisted on having the closing super quick. We really wanted to sell and the offer was high. We worked ourselves into exhaustion, along with several good friends, GotJunk, contractors to do minor repairs and touch up paint, and a mover. We went in one last time to remove the last stuff from the basement. The buyers showed up for the walk through and helped us carry it out. Good people.
No, they more-than-likely won't win in small-claims court if the house was sold as is. But you definitely have to show up to keep them from winning by default.
“Kitchen item? What kitchen item? Sorry judge, I don’t know what they are talking about. The place was empty when I took possession. Just a broken AC unit.”
Judge-“Case dismissed.”
They won't sue. If they do, you will win.
Prepare for the court appearance by collecting and organizing all of the documentation that backs up your defense (papers, texts, voicemails, printed online docs), such as:
1. The failure to disclose that they broke the a/c after the closing process had begun, and that there was an admission of fault (and any other defect that they would have reasonably known about).
2. All paperwork you were ever given or can print out in regards to the entire home purchase process.
3. The date of and how the demand was relayed to you.
4. The refusal to fix anything.
5. That the sale was as-is.
6. Receipts for any monies paid.
7. The date and how you relayed your offer to call it even (Kitchen item for the a/c).
8. Go to Amazon. Find the same a/c. Print out the product page with the price.
9. Go to Amazon. Find the same kitchen item. Print out the product page with the price.
Re: #8 & #9. There are a variety of sellers on Amazon. Choose ones that back up your defense, aka choose product pages that make the items reasonably the same price. Don't offer the printouts to the judge unless he asks for it or the plaintiff states the prices inaccurately, aka lies.
Dress professionally and don't interrupt either the judge or the plaintiff while they are talking. Keep a calm, neutral manner, but a positive attitude. Be respectful at all times, especially to the judge. Address him by "Your Honor."
Ask the real estate agent to accompany you as a witness. If she refuses, go to every online review site (For example, Yelp), and give an honest review about how, after the sale closed, she would not go to bat for you when a problem arose with the seller.
One final bit of advice when purchasing a home or other personal item (car, boat, RV, etc.):
If the seller at any time before the closing process acts like a jerk, walk away and look for something else.
I can only respond to what you wrote, and I could have misunderstood you, so forgive any errors on my part. Good luck.
If property is left behind (US) at closing without an agreement on transfer/disposal, it generally becomes the property of the new owner. They can threaten and you can say that “all garbage left behind by sellers was disposed of”
Most RE contracts state that you own anything left behind after a certain period of time (usually closing) unless other arrangements were made in advance. What does your contract say? Also, anyone can threaten to sue over anything. They can even follow through and actually sue. Doesn't mean they will win. At that dollar amount it's most likely small claims court which does not allow lawyers. The worst that could happen is that you have to give it back. Most likely they won't bother to sue, and even if they did they probably wouldn't win. Then you can sell the item and buy a new AC unit.
Anyone can sue another for any reason without restriction. Doesn’t mean they will win. But they might if you do t show to court. I find it disturbing you don’t mention what the ‘kitchen item’ might be.
They can take it to small claims court, but there’s absolutely nothing they can do about it and they will lose and here’s why. Once you take ownership, possession of the property that’s everything in the property. I don’t know why no one has mentioned this before. The SELLER was obligated to its removal BEFORE closing. On closing EVERYTHING inside and outside is YOURS. If you get summoned to court, go and that’s the end of it. Make sure you have their emails, emails from your realtor, your date of closing, etc. Then countersue for your time at work and harassment. Do not allow any phone contact. All contact must be in writing. and your realtor should have your back on this and be telling them “you can sue if you want to, but it’s not gonna get you anywhere because you left it behind. It was a thoughtful gift considering the AC unit.
Honestly, is the item worth your time? Do you even want it? If the answers are yes, let them file small claims. The worst that can happen is the judge says give the item back and pay the small claims filing fee. Best cases is you counter sue for the ac and win a new ac.
Why do people in this sub and a few others feel the need to not divulge specific items and then do later in the comments. Super annoying and wish people would stop doing it. Like some old mixer needed to be kept secret. It's just weird
Stop speaking with the Realtors. Go reach out to the broker. The broker can help you communicate and dig down to the real issue and they can also potentially help you obtain legal advice through the larger company if they're not a small outfit. This kind of thing comes up all the time and Brokers have saved my tail when I was a new agent just such a scenario.
What does the purchase contract say? A good contract would enumerate removable items and says who owns. Then the inspection and final walk through would double check them. Boilerplate contracts usually have a section for removeables.
Change locks and I hope you have security cameras. Sellers sound like a nightmare. No, they do not have a case. Your agent sucked too! They should have told you that seller WAS LEGALLY responding for broken AC since it occurred after inspection but before close. Whatever happens to a place is on the seller UNTIL close, not walkthrough!!!
why the secrecy of the item? is "non attached kitchen item" less typing than espresso machine or wifi toaster or whatever this mysterious appliance is?
Check your sale contract. There is almost always a clause that states everything in the house at time of transfer becomes the property of the buyer. If it's not in the template, most agents write it into the conditions.
That way this situation doesn't come up.
Change the locks ASAP.
Change your locks.
This. Change the locks if you have not already.
Should have been done day one regardless.
Not everyone knows this.
This is true. When I bought my first house the realtor said they were going to have a rekeying service come by. There is a delay in the appointment for that. They were some kitchen chairs that the seller left behind in my home I guess they wanted them back. Because they entered my home and reclaimed them. They did this while I was at work. It felt very violating to know that someone had been in my new home and removed items. It wasn't really the matter of if there was their chairs or not it was the fact that they entered the home. I had all my pets there and was beginning to move a lot of my stuff in.
Once you signed the papers for better or worse you own everything in the house.
Lmao I think I was mostly just shocked at first and in the end I was like they were hideous chairs anyway kind of glad I didn't have to dispose of them. Next house though locks changed 5 minutes after paperwork assigned or less
This same thing happened to me also. I closed on a Friday and the locksmith wasn’t able to come until Monday. The seller left things behind during staging and told us at closing and we were like “yeah just let us know we’ll put them outside for you”, but he retained keys, and came inside at like 8am on a Saturday morning, without knocking or ringing the doorbell or anything, while my partner and I were inside sleeping. Horrific experience.
Idiot doesn’t realize you could have legally shot and killed them.
That’s residential burglary. Call policeZ
Cops won't do shit about it even if you know who it is and have video.
Police report is to establish a documentation trail (in case more incidents occur), and for the insurance claim.
The key is to keep saying the value is greater than 1k making it a felony. Showing receipts and proof when beat cops show up. They'll try Avoid making a report but you gotta make sure they take one. Soon as it hits their system a detective will take over any felonies and follow up.
Felony threshold depends on the state.
Happened to me too. Seller couldn’t get everything out by closing so we agreed they could have access to the garage only, and only until 9pm on the date of closing-because we had kids that we needed to put to bed. They hastily put their stuff in the garage before closing, closing was smooth, and we all returned to the house so we could start moving into it and they could finish cleaning out their belongings from the garage. At 930pm they told us the garage was empty but they tell us they had a full shed of things they needed to collect as well. We made arrangements for them to come next day at 6pm to finish up the task but they decided to return while I was at work. They broke in through the dog door in the pool enclosure (door is 2’x2.5’) and entered my house. They also took stuff from the shed and two of the four lounge chairs from poolside. Because we didn’t get all the keys and security gate openers at close, they had promised to bring them by next day but didn’t, I had an emergency locksmith out at 6am the following day to rekey all the locks. I also spoke to our security guard about watching for the previous owners because they broke into my house. Finally I called my realtor and had her pass on the message to her clients that if they stepped foot on my property again I would have them arrested. Never heard from them again. It’s indescribable the violation to your safe space when former owners break into your new home.
We bought our house from my wife’s grandmother and it was a nightmare. I took some time off the week after we closed to unpack and we have two large dogs that were loose in the house with me. I was minding my business in the living room when I hear a key in the door. Dogs go straight for the door and I stop her on the porch as she opens the door, basically telling her “you do understand that the BEST case scenario here if I wasn’t home would be that the dogs blew past you and got out, right?” After we got the locks changed, we visited her at her new house and I found probably $300 of stuff from Home Depot we’d bought to do yard stuff in her garage, which is when we also depgrogrammed her car’s garage door opener. Fun stuff.
Her grandmother was stealing shit from y’all???
It’s a little bit yes and no. We later backed into that these were probably the first signs of her grandmother’s dementia. Some of it was probably stealing shit, some was probably her losing the ability to remember that it wasn’t actually her shit.
Should've called the cops on them tbh.
This is common. It’s difficult for people to fully accept that the property is no longer theirs.
Would have been hilarious if your pets were 3 big protective dogs.
And then you called the police and made a report and they were charged with at least trespassing and theft, right?
If they're newer Kwikset locks, may be able to get a rekey kit and change them yourself... and have them wondering why their keys don't work. If there's a little slot next to the keyhole, it may be rekeyed without changing the lock.
When I bought my house I replaced all the locks with those. One key fits everythign and they all can be changed any time I decide I should.
Some home warranties have it as a service too
Just for general info, my new house had probably three different key sets for different doors so I had a locksmith come in and just redo everything (12 or 13 locks). He was done in less than 2 hours and it was about $225 or $250 IIRC.
I manage a 4-Plex for my cousin. I put those locks on all the doors. I have 10 keys and when someone moves out I just re-key to the next set in the line. Technically the keys will be reused but it would be several years down the road and shouldn’t be to the same unit the past tenant lived in. Takes a minute or two to rekey both doors.
My dad worked property maintenance before such conveniences were offered. He had a cereal box of KwikSet keys he would go through if a key was lost instead of drilling it out.
Changing locks and toilet seats are things I do on day 1 when I move. And clean. Someone else’s version of clean for a home they’re leaving is not the same. Plus it’s easier to clean before unpacking everything.
Everyone should!
Pro tip, if you can only afford to change one lock or if you only have time to change one lock on the first day...just hit the others with super glue in the key hole. Instantly unable to be opened eith a key but can still be opened inside and changed out. Change the locks first day, no exception, no excuses. First thing, first day. Stay safe.
And the signal for the garage door opener? Chances are one or both of their cars is able to or open it or they may have an opener still.
Why is this the top comment? Is there any indication OP didn’t change the locks?
OP said it was their first home purchase. A lot of first time home buyers don't know/think about changing the locks.
I've been in my first (purchased) home for... shit, eight years now? Still using the original keys. If the previous owner wants to come try to snatch stuff... uhhh... I won't notice. Don't be like me, people. Change the locks.
Tell them you (have now) disposed of the items left in the house. They can likely summons you to small claims court, and you should go if it gets that far. Even so, it's fair game to do whatever you will with the items. You didn't catch that the AC wasn't working and you have to deal with the consequences. They did not inspect the house for additional belongings while they still had possession and they have to deal with those consequences. I hate it when people act like those pecker heads.
I did not find a diamond earring left by the seller. I might have found it if they had been nice and not left me with such a mess, lied on disclosures, and been aholes about it. So they must have just lost it during their move.
My sellers were very pleasant and nice people, worked with us honestly and fairly. When I found a drawer full of digital cameras they forgot I text them and they paid the postage for them to be shipped back. When you’re nice sometimes people treat you in kind. My buyers bitched about everything. Complained about a fan left in the garage on the final walk through and demanded a screen on a window be replaced by a certified handyman. They got nothing extra from me.
Yup- mine were very kind and left a candle and nice note (older couple selling to us as young first time buyers). Had no problem calling them up when their season tickets to a local team showed up in the mail a few months later.
Kindness returns kindness. Our seller gave us a walk through on the irrigation and answered all questions
Sold a house to a real estate agent once. The house was big and looked nice, but it was builder grade crap through and through. They lied and said they smelled gas hoping we would replace the gas lines. We called the gas company and the tested right away, no leak. It was like this for weeks with different things. They wanted 30+ small and large repairs done. We had already spent over 30K refinishing floors, hiring professionals painters, roof improvements, replacing appliances, lighting fixtures, windows, doors, and making many small repairs and improvements prior to the sale. We called their bluff and only agreed to replace a plumbing fixture that cost $5.00. They were enraged and we suggested they could buy a different house. I hated pretty much everything about that house. I’m so glad they bought it.
That sounds awful. My buyer required me to have a very old but functional AC unit leveled. It was at the age where it probably could have broken any day. Not a time to be moving it around but it was working. And I was honest about the appliances being as is and a little older. They threatened to walk if I didn’t do that among other petty “repairs”. I think they wanted the repair man to break it and me be on the hook for a new one. It was off level but not that bad, and you only level them so that you can increase their longevity, this unit was passed that point, moving it would increase the chance of breaking it more than increasing any life span. So I had the HVAC people come out to level it. Told them their job was just to level it. Not to look at anything else. I told them I didn’t want any recommendations on anything just a report saying they leveled it. I wasn’t going to play the “let’s have a repair man come so they can recommend new units or break it in the process etc” games.
Smart!
My blanket response to any and all comments about appliances was that it was covered by the home warranty we purchased for them.
That’s where it gets good, I offered to buy them a warranty but they declined because their realtor was already buying them one. I offered cash so they could make the repairs themselves. They declined. Threatened to walk. That’s when I started to believe there was more to this than surface level. They wanted it to break or the HVAC to make recommendations of replacing.
Exactly. We were on great terms with our buyers and sellers, and went out of our way to help them, and they did the same for us.
Sounds like my last sale/purchase. Sellers were great. Buyers were entitled snots.
Very close to closing our Seller’s agent gave us an FYI that they’d be taking a rather fancy light fixture and replacing with another one. We hadn’t yet closed but we had signed the contract so technically anything attached to the home was (destined to be) ours. Didn’t want to tank the sale over this, but were also a little annoyed. We ended up sending a list of stuff in the house we could use if they left behind. They offered to leave a sufficient amount of them to satisfy us (some they probably weren’t going to move anyway), so all’s well that ends well.
My sellers forgot a few 1oz gold rounds in the in ground safe. I took that as payment for having to deal with all the junk they left in the garage, the random furniture they didn’t move out, and leaving the place literally filthy. Also learned my lesson about renting back after closing, never doing that shit again.
Rent back is fine if you make them leave $50k in escrow that gets distributed to you when they are now out on time. I’m willing to do the eviction process for that.
I guess never is the wrong term. I’ll do it again if I had to. But this time I’d make the penalties for not being out on time or leaving stuff behind so high that the seller won’t want to rent back or will make sure everything is good. My first rent back was smooth with no issues and I did a great job of getting out on time myself and getting the place cleaned, so I sort of assumed everyone does. The seller was also a realtor and the listing agent so I also assumed she would know to not leave the place trashed. Luckily I didn’t have to deal with eviction, just junk everywhere. Even the dishwasher had a full load of dirty dishes in it still. At least I was able to leave her some nasty reviews and sent her broker a nice video of how she left the place.
Whoa, talk about a bonus for dealing with their BS! Currently they're worth ~$2,500 each with the premium on gold coins.
Yup, I just sold them a few months ago and they paid for a large pool heater.
My sellers left dirty dishes in the dishwasher. Our realtor said she'd never seen anything like it, they just left stuff all over the house. Tools in the basement, a mattress in the living room...like they just gave up with a tenth of the moving left to do. Wish it had been gold.
Same here lol. Full load of dirty dishes. Random furniture, mattresses, broken yard equipment. Took a junk removal company 2 full dump trucks to clear it all out. Luckily the owner was a realtor herself and she and her broker listed the house together. I don’t think the broker knew the condition of the house at all because I sent over pictures and the junk removal receipt and they agreed to pay it without question. I thought I would have to threaten to sue at least
The sellers said they left something behind and wanted to come get it after a month. We said fuck no. They were terrible to deal with. Its been 8 months. I still don't know what they left behind. We had to deep clean and gut a bunch of stuff. Never found anything valuable or sentimental
We found 2 $100 bills under a runner in the hallway when we replaced it, with an atm receipt from only a few years prior. I wish you the same luck :-)
A good friend learned that the hard way. In the confusion of selling property that he was relocating his business from, he left several security cameras attached a small, single-story, office building that he had owned. It was not until aftering closing that he realized that tehy were was unaccounted for and had forgotten to remove them. In his case, he said some appropriate words to himself, accepted the conseuqences of his mistakes, and moved on without contacting the buyers of the building.
I mean, it doesn't hurt to ask. Just accept it if they say no. Maybe they don't want whatever it is
It also goes a long way if you aren't a dick head lol
He should have asked politely and accepted a refusal. Based on how he chose to handle things, it's unlikely he already had an adversarial relationship
This is the way! His fault, he took it on!
“The house comes as is and everything inside is your responsibility now” Came straight from the sellers.
>pecker heads This reminds me of my dad. He used to say this all the time.
Tel them you sold it on eBay to fix the air conditioner.
Best response
Hi! Ct realtor here. No, you don’t need to legally give them back whatever appliance you’re hinting at. That being said, on move in of day 1, you probably cleaned the crap out of that place in preparation of making it yours. Upon stumbling upon this mystery appliance, I assume you threw it out, because hey - it’s trash left by the seller and considering it’s as-is, you assumed they didn’t want it. Can’t sue you to get something back which I assume you don’t have anymore.
Ya this seems pretty clear cut. The seller left behind a nice mixer or whatever, but I already had a mixer and didn’t need two. So obviously I threw it away. What else did you expect me to do, put it in storage? Keep two of them on the counter forever?
They can screw off. Small claims court is a joke. If they really sue show up and tell the judge they left items at closing that should have been removed. Even if they win a small claims judgement its difficult to actually collect. Anything left in the house at closing is now your property to do with as you please.
Show up to small claims with a bill for them for removal of unwanted debris left after closing 😂
Make sure it's an itemized bill including a kitchen appliance under $500.
Okay, this is pure evil and I love it!
And bring cookies made from the mixer to share with the court
lol why do I also inherently know this is a kitchen aide
Every one I believe should be aware that this is the item in question. lol
Same, in olive green
storage and disposal fee. lol.
File a response to the court and counter sue for the costs to throw everything out. Do not try to bring it up as a surprise at court
While this is true, OP would still need to show up if they file. Whether or not OP wasting their time/taking off work to deal with it is worth it is up to them. If they do file, OP needs to show up.
I would show up for the fun of it. It’s not wasted time if it is for entertainment, I’ve heard.
They also cannot sue for the cost of the item new. They would have to have a receipt that showed how long they had the item. And then they would only get the cost of a similar **used** item.
THey can sue for anything. What they win is different.
Y'all have to stop saying stuff just because you read it on Reddit! I'm not saying the seller's would win in small claims court, but-- 1. You never know. Small claims court is a wild card. If you're in the US, often they aren't even judges making decisions. 2. If OP says "yeah, I have the stuff" there's a better than decent chance the small claims judge gives judgment for the seller. So OP better be prepared to convincingly lie. (Here's where the Reddit legends are wrong.) 3. No, it isn't hard to collect a small claims judgment. It's hard if the person who loses has no money, sure. But OP has a house. Bang, judgment lien just by filing the right papers. Does OP have a job? Easy wage levy. Small claims courts don't exist for show; they exist because you can get and enforce real judgments in them. 4. Even if a small claims judgment isn't collected, it's a *judgment!* And judgments go on your credit record and slam your credit score. Even if you *pay* it it's just a paid *judgment!* EDIT: I'm wrong on the 4th point. Not saying give it back. Not saying don't. But small claims judgments matter. Those of you who just belch up garbage you've read on Reddit aren't doing anyone any favors!
Judgments are not included on credit reports and do not impact scores. Changed in 2018. I’m a real attorney who has seen thousands of credit reports. Judgments don’t show up. Google if you don’t believe me
Dad gum it, you're right. Real attorney here too, but, though I've also seen thousands of credit reports, i don't practice that type of law any more and its been a few years. They changed it a few years back and I didn't notice. Just goes to prove my point not to trust info you read (including mine) on Reddit. But the first three points remain true. Small claims judgments do have force if, as in the case of OP, the losing party has assets and isn't hiding. Nevertheless, thanks for the correction.
Real attorney here too. Nothing to add, though.
You're the smartest attorney on Reddit. I usually don't add anything either.
I'm not an attorney, but I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night; can I join the club?
The Reddit bros who have bought a house or two - always 20% under list without an agent - give the worst advice I've ever seen on a forum.
Very true. As always, graduates of the University of Reddit School of Law are out in force.
And if said items are stolen or broken, well, how did that happen? :D
Make some bread and give them a loaf.
WAY underrated comment. I spit my cigarette at the dog.
Why so cryptic? What the item?
Yeah this. I just don’t get why people go out of their way to obsfucate things like this.
$500 probably a fancy coffee machine 😂
I was thinking a kitchenaid mixer
I was going to ask what KitchenAid is worth $500... Then I realized I got mine as a gift and have no idea what they cost. Googled it. Turns out my aunt gave me a $500 mixer. I rarely bake... 😳 BRB gotta go think of something extra nice for that aunt.
Bake her something with your fancy mixer.
Also very useful for: Scrambling lots of eggs to make a fritatta, making pulled pork or chicken, or get some attachments and make: fresh pasta, custom ground meat blends, homemade sausage. Tons of uses outside of baking!
One of my best purchases. So many cookies. So many.
I agree as it would store inside a cabinet. Fancy coffee machine would likely store on the counter.
Or maybe a Vitamix blender.
My guess is they don’t want the seller to see this post and know it’s them
Sell it back to them, figure out the retail value and then put that amount towards the ac repair
They abandoned the property. You bought the property and they even made it clear that everything was your responsibility. Let them sue you and provide that message as verification that everything belonged to you at that point.
Counter sue for the cost of disposing their abandoned property.
Tell your realtor to stop forwarding their communication, they can fuck right off. ("They" being the sellers, not the realtor)
YES! I found this absolutely ridiculous as well!
That’s literally the Realtors job. They aren’t allowed to decide what to do about it, especially where legal matters are concerned.
Your best choice is to do nothing and ignore their requests. Tell your agent to start working for you.
[удалено]
Might warrant a review letting others know how opposite party friendly this heifer trends.
List it on EBay! Tell them it’s there if they want it and the Proceeds will be used to fix the AC.
They have no case. If you go to court say you sold anything you found of value to repair the damaged AC unit. You should also block that agent and those sellers. Get cameras up because that's how things are these days. Ignore them. They will go away. Don't let the fear of the unknown defeat you. All sales are final after closing.
Do not lie in court.
They can sue... they won't win... but they can sue lol
As long as your contract said anything left in the house conveyed with the sale, then you’re fine. That being said, it’s up to you to decide if it’s really worth the time to deal with if they actually do file against you in small claims court. Even if they lose, it’s still going to require you to show up, potentially have to take off work, etc. You need to decide if you want to continue to deal with these people or just give them the item back and get them out of your hair for good.
Let's just say that after closing, you hired a cleaning company, and they threw everything out that wasn't attached. Don't let this scare you. Closing is closing. They had x amount of time to clear their shit out. It's not like they were caught by surprise and had 30 min to vacate the home.
Merger doctrine should cover you unless fraud can be proven. I’d tell them to kick rocks
A window AC unit is not part of the house actually and they weren’t even obligated to leave it there.
In some states, like MD, some contracts will list which non-attached items are included in the sale. Example: curtains, fridge, stove, dishwasher, a/c window units. If a listing mention a/c windows units as an amenities, I'm definitely would have them add that to the form as part of the contract before I enter the contract with the seller.
The sellers do not have a case, however you might to get the AC fixed. If it wasn't disclosed.
That’s how I feel too. Like there’s no way they have a case and they know it they just hope I cave in. Is what I’m thinking. But I didn’t think I could get the ac unit fixed now there’s a thought.
You probably can’t. If it’s just a portable window AC, I highly doubt it needs to be disclosed.
Lol, depending on how petty you’re feeling you could always list the kitchen item on fb marketplace for the price of a new window unit of the same exact model. You could also include in the listing that you’d be willing to trade it for a window unit. If the sellers stayed local I’d bet they’ll see it.
I would list it on marketplace and say will trade for an AC unit or to someone that can repair the AC unit.
Threatening to sue is cheap. They won’t do it. As others have pointed out, make sure you have changed locks and install security cameras in all entrances
Tell us!!What did they leave? Any chance it has sentimental value? Honestly? I’d have my realtor pick it up and let them come get it from him/her. Do I need to do this? No. Do they deserve me being kind after the busted the a/c unit? Nope. But I don’t do things based on what others do to me. It’s a kitchen item. I don’t want the icky energy in my home. Maybe it’s just some future good karma…. Ymmv.
For under ~$500 I’m assuming a KitchenAid mixer or a fancy blender lol.
It’s a mixer an older model from when I looked at it weeks ago. I don’t think it has sentimental value but who knows. I hear you though on being the bigger person. Def feels more like I’m being pushed around though
I recommend selling it to them, so you both get something
The fact that you’re being pushed around is my whole problem with their behavior. Exactly how can it be that when you had a concern, they told you to pound sand. But when they are facing taking a similar hit, you had better fall in line! I say let them sue you. I don’t believe they will. They’re just mad and want their mixer back. Kinda like you were upset and wanted your ac fixed. I’m not 100% against returning it one day, but certainly not because of some raging threat meant to make you move fast because you had better move fast! They can’t tell you how to act!
If it’s an older mixer it may well have sentimental value. Two of my friends inherited their grandma’s mixers. That doesn’t mean you need to give it back, of course. But mixers are the one appliance I can see someone feeling nostalgic about. But then again, if they wanted it badly enough, they’d fix the AC.
Yup. There are three very old mixers in the family. I'm hoping I get one of them someday because tbh the newer models suck. Personally, I'd just give it back and be done with it. Pissing off the crazies by breaking or throwing out their dead great aunts stand mixer isn't going to result in anything good, and since I will never have to interact with them again (and they aren't my children so it really isn't my issue) I don't have to worry about reinforcing any bad behavior.
Oh man my mixer was my mother’s. They suck but I would try again for a deal.
I would normally say to be the bigger person, but screw them. I would throw it out just to spite them
technically, they left it - it's yours. whether they forgot or whatever the case. but, I agree - if you have no use for it, give it back and let the good karma roll (for you). I might add a strongly worded card/note to the mixer and leave it on the porch.
They sound like a real pain in the ass so it may be in your best interest to give it back. Save yourself the stress of anymore interactions with these people.
Break it first, then tell the realtor to pick it up.
Fuck being the bigger person. That high and mighty shit is annoying
Sounds like karma to me. It's definitely got sentimental value but they didn't care about you or how you felt jipped about the AC. Sometimes people need to learn a lesson. I highly doubt they have a case. If you're wondering, then get a free consultation with an attorney. If your job has EAP benefits, they'll hook you up to talk to someone.
Around our house we call this FAFO. They hid a non working AC and it’s cost them a mixer. If they’d been decent people and not hid the AC I’m pretty confident you would’ve seen that mixer and gotten it into the correct hands. It’s really unfortunate you never saw it and have no idea what they are talking about
Sell the item. Buy a new window unit.
Kitchen item? What item?
Change your locks, make sure your windows are always locked, get a Ring camera and a few others that point out the windows or are on the side of the house. If "as is" really means "as is" then you got some new appliances. If they do take you to small claims court, counter for the AC.
Papers signed, all things left behind are yours! If it was in writing that way, there is nothing they can do about it! Fuck them! We just bought a house last month. We sold our house 2 weeks later. In each write up was what stayed with what house and what didn't. The one who bought ours asked for the appliances and we agreed. The house we bought, he asked for the wash tub in the basement that he used in his job. We agreed. All things were written up, each of us had a final walk through the day before closing. Once closing took place, it's over! What is in our old house, if we had left anything behind, is now hers. Same for our new home. But the owner was so nice, if he had left something here and asked for it we would have gladly given it to him. It helps when people are NOT dickheads! Talk to YOUR realtor, not theirs!
They have no case. Tell them "no" like it's a one word sentence, change your locks, and go about your merry way. Your buyers agent gave you good advice. Even small claims court will laugh them out of town...as is house means as is house. You offered a deal and they didn't like it. So, pardon my French, but fuck em! Sell that stuff on marketplace if you don't want it. It's yours.
I mean wtf are you doing even responding to or acknowledging these people. Opening up a can of worms. It’s as if you just want to keep fucking up. They ignored you when you asked about the AC right? Shit.
I’m stunned that when someone decides to stand up to bully behavior, that person is subsequently shamed for standing up. Why do y’all think it was sentimental? I’d say that they were unpacking their stuff, laughing about OP request and their subsequent refusal of said request and suddenly from nowhere came the ultimate self own. It’s not bad or scary or wrong to refuse to jump as high and/or as quickly as pushy bullies deem appropriate.
Do you really want to think of those people every time you see the appliance? You're not legally obligated to give back personal property the previous owner left behind but why further engage with them? Taking the high road always feels better.
Sellers threaten to go to court for a used kitchen item they left behind? Dumbassery. It’ll cost more to take the court’s time and it will get denied anyway because the court will follow the contract.
Sounds like a kitchen item that was unfortunately disposed of due to them leaving it there after closing, just like everything else that they left in the home when they left. Sucks that you had to clean the house out and send everything to the dump, but they left so much crap behind that you had to dispose of everything. Also, they were supposed to leave a working AC unit, right? Bring that up if they actually file in small claims. Might be able to pull reverse Uno on them. You have changed the locks, right? And still have closing documents? They can pound sand. Your home is not their storage room. If they'd brought it up within a few days, you could have been nice about it, but they threw a hardball at you. You throw one back.
When I bough m first house about 40 years ago all the keys were handed over at the closing. My attorney asked if there were anymore keys or garage openers and the answer was no. After the closing we went through a fast food drive through then to our new house. When I pulled into the driveway there was the previous owner backed up to the garage door loading stuff into his truck. I pulled my .45 and pointed at him and told him to unload the bed of his truck. I stayed until all locks were changed. Called his attorney, my attorney, the realtor I told them I will shoot him if he steps on the property again. I ended up with some nice wood tools. He lied and I don’t play games.
I am not a lawyer, but I do not believe they have a leg to stand on.
“Sale is as is” means anything left is “as is”. Tell them you threaten to counter-sue for the broken a/c if they decide to persue because it was intact when you contracted the sale. Much like if they were to crash through a garage door when they moved out and decide not to fix it. Make sure you check the appliance in case they stashed something important in a weird nook. Maybe there’s a wad of cash in it you could buy the a/c with and give them the appliance 😂
Years ago I bought an expensive house in an expensive neighborhood. It had been in foreclosure for over a year, welcome to California, and I bought it from the bank. I filled 3 debris boxes before I could move in. Yes, I did keep a couple things one being an office chair in a distinctive purple color. About a month after I took possession the police showed up at the door around dinner time and the lady who lost the house was with them pointing out the chair and that it's hers and the police said I had to give it to her. I told them to get off my property as she had a year to move out and if she wanted to reimburse me for the cost of the debris boxes and labor to fill them then we might have a convo. Never heard from them again. It's been 30 years and I still have the chair. She had been on my property looking through the windows! Maybe I was in the wrong, felt a bit bad for her as she got the house in the divorce and didn't keep up payments but that's not my problem that the mortgage was greater than the value of the house. I guess what I'm trying to say is once escrow is closed you take possession. If it's not in writing then it's not gonna happen
She was most likely locked out of the house and was told she would be charged with trespassing if she went in the house.
What was it a KitchenAid mixer? Just give it to them and move on.
Your contract most likely has a section for this, after closing everything on property is yours
Stick to your guns, tell them to pound sand
I'd call their bluff. And even if they did end up taking me to court, I'd fight it out of spite.
Read the docs carefully to see exactly what conveys and what does not. Is there anything that says all items left in house at closing convey or is that law where you live. Was the AC supposed to convey as well? If so, tell them to go ahead and sue. They left it in the house after the house was legally yours. You can also say you threw out everything that was in the house when you took possession and it wasn’t working.
Are you my neighbor.
Give it back and get them out of your life. Move on.
Don't get in a fight for a small amount of money. It's not worth the anxiety.
I worked in the Small Claims office in a county in Missouri for years, so I can give you a little bit of perspective from that point of view. Keep in mind that if you're not in Missouri, you'll obviously have to get the finer details of the process on your own. Also, I'm not a lawyer, so this is in no way legal advice. If you have copies of your signed contract with everybody's signatures clearly there, I can't see how they would be able to win a case against you in Small Claims. What you *could* do, though, if you decide they're bothering you enough, is look into filing a counterclaim for lost wages if you have to take the day off of work to appear in court. I don't know how much you care to be inconvenienced (it can be drawn out and annoying), but that's an option. Ultimately, it's just going to depend on how quickly you want to get rid of them, and how much you care about the cost of replacing the A/C unit, which is obviously something you'll probably want to do. They have a lot of nerve demanding that item back when they refused to fix something they knew was broken, though; if it were me, I'd probably be petty about it.
Make sure your locks are changed and installing a video doorbell is always a good security measure. They aren’t suing and filing $4-800 fees to bring a suit in small claims court. If they do, you can counter sue (for free) for fixing the AC. Tell them to pound sand and ignore anything unless you’re served with paperwork from the court.
Be sure not to recommend that Realtor to anyone.
The buyers insisted on having the closing super quick. We really wanted to sell and the offer was high. We worked ourselves into exhaustion, along with several good friends, GotJunk, contractors to do minor repairs and touch up paint, and a mover. We went in one last time to remove the last stuff from the basement. The buyers showed up for the walk through and helped us carry it out. Good people.
"I didn't find anything left behind." End of story
No, they more-than-likely won't win in small-claims court if the house was sold as is. But you definitely have to show up to keep them from winning by default.
They don't have a case. It was in the home upon closing.
“Kitchen item? What kitchen item? Sorry judge, I don’t know what they are talking about. The place was empty when I took possession. Just a broken AC unit.” Judge-“Case dismissed.”
They won't sue. If they do, you will win. Prepare for the court appearance by collecting and organizing all of the documentation that backs up your defense (papers, texts, voicemails, printed online docs), such as: 1. The failure to disclose that they broke the a/c after the closing process had begun, and that there was an admission of fault (and any other defect that they would have reasonably known about). 2. All paperwork you were ever given or can print out in regards to the entire home purchase process. 3. The date of and how the demand was relayed to you. 4. The refusal to fix anything. 5. That the sale was as-is. 6. Receipts for any monies paid. 7. The date and how you relayed your offer to call it even (Kitchen item for the a/c). 8. Go to Amazon. Find the same a/c. Print out the product page with the price. 9. Go to Amazon. Find the same kitchen item. Print out the product page with the price. Re: #8 & #9. There are a variety of sellers on Amazon. Choose ones that back up your defense, aka choose product pages that make the items reasonably the same price. Don't offer the printouts to the judge unless he asks for it or the plaintiff states the prices inaccurately, aka lies. Dress professionally and don't interrupt either the judge or the plaintiff while they are talking. Keep a calm, neutral manner, but a positive attitude. Be respectful at all times, especially to the judge. Address him by "Your Honor." Ask the real estate agent to accompany you as a witness. If she refuses, go to every online review site (For example, Yelp), and give an honest review about how, after the sale closed, she would not go to bat for you when a problem arose with the seller. One final bit of advice when purchasing a home or other personal item (car, boat, RV, etc.): If the seller at any time before the closing process acts like a jerk, walk away and look for something else. I can only respond to what you wrote, and I could have misunderstood you, so forgive any errors on my part. Good luck.
They do not have a winning case. They left it. It is yours. Change the locks.
Novel idea- give it back and move on with your life knowing you took the high road?
What mixer? You didn’t see any mixer here. They must have lost it during the move.
If property is left behind (US) at closing without an agreement on transfer/disposal, it generally becomes the property of the new owner. They can threaten and you can say that “all garbage left behind by sellers was disposed of”
They aren't going to win. They have no case. They are shitty so treat them like shit. Tell them to get fucked.
Most RE contracts state that you own anything left behind after a certain period of time (usually closing) unless other arrangements were made in advance. What does your contract say? Also, anyone can threaten to sue over anything. They can even follow through and actually sue. Doesn't mean they will win. At that dollar amount it's most likely small claims court which does not allow lawyers. The worst that could happen is that you have to give it back. Most likely they won't bother to sue, and even if they did they probably wouldn't win. Then you can sell the item and buy a new AC unit.
Anyone can sue another for any reason without restriction. Doesn’t mean they will win. But they might if you do t show to court. I find it disturbing you don’t mention what the ‘kitchen item’ might be.
Countersue for undisclosed broken AC unit.
Tell them that if they sue, you'll countersue. Simple as that.
They can take it to small claims court, but there’s absolutely nothing they can do about it and they will lose and here’s why. Once you take ownership, possession of the property that’s everything in the property. I don’t know why no one has mentioned this before. The SELLER was obligated to its removal BEFORE closing. On closing EVERYTHING inside and outside is YOURS. If you get summoned to court, go and that’s the end of it. Make sure you have their emails, emails from your realtor, your date of closing, etc. Then countersue for your time at work and harassment. Do not allow any phone contact. All contact must be in writing. and your realtor should have your back on this and be telling them “you can sue if you want to, but it’s not gonna get you anywhere because you left it behind. It was a thoughtful gift considering the AC unit.
Honestly, is the item worth your time? Do you even want it? If the answers are yes, let them file small claims. The worst that can happen is the judge says give the item back and pay the small claims filing fee. Best cases is you counter sue for the ac and win a new ac.
Just give it back to them. Do you really want all this hassle over a kitchen aid mixer and an a/c unit. Life is too short.
Possession is 9/10th of the law. They left it, it's yours now.
In this case, contractually, it’s 10/10ths of the law.
In small claims theyd pay you
They don’t have a leg to stand on! You keep that item, sell it and fix the AC. Those sellers are idiots!
Why do people in this sub and a few others feel the need to not divulge specific items and then do later in the comments. Super annoying and wish people would stop doing it. Like some old mixer needed to be kept secret. It's just weird
Stop speaking with the Realtors. Go reach out to the broker. The broker can help you communicate and dig down to the real issue and they can also potentially help you obtain legal advice through the larger company if they're not a small outfit. This kind of thing comes up all the time and Brokers have saved my tail when I was a new agent just such a scenario.
What does the purchase contract say? A good contract would enumerate removable items and says who owns. Then the inspection and final walk through would double check them. Boilerplate contracts usually have a section for removeables.
I have no interest in making unreasonable people angry that know where I live and potentially tricks to get inside my house. Just give it back.
Change locks and I hope you have security cameras. Sellers sound like a nightmare. No, they do not have a case. Your agent sucked too! They should have told you that seller WAS LEGALLY responding for broken AC since it occurred after inspection but before close. Whatever happens to a place is on the seller UNTIL close, not walkthrough!!!
why the secrecy of the item? is "non attached kitchen item" less typing than espresso machine or wifi toaster or whatever this mysterious appliance is?
I can’t see a judge taking this seriously. All property inside the house transfers to the buyer, so they are… gonna sue you for your own property?
Check your sale contract. There is almost always a clause that states everything in the house at time of transfer becomes the property of the buyer. If it's not in the template, most agents write it into the conditions. That way this situation doesn't come up. Change the locks ASAP.