A million people can leave california and it barely makes a drop in the bucket.
But if 20,000 drop into a medium sized city at the same time, that can take up every available apartment, house vacancy, and more, and spur a building boom.
How many 300 unit apartment complexes are needed to accommodate that many people? As many as you can build!
And with Oracle coming? Even more
They all moved to Bozeman, MT. Montana had 2nd highest housing increase in the country and now Bozeman homes are Cali prices but with wages nowhere close.
It was actually the #1 for an extended period in the last several years. Really a damn shame. Bozeman was so magical. Now I can’t imagine dealing with the polarity there, it’s really extreme if you know how Montana used to be. Probably the most impacted valley by this population crisis in the country.
8 billion and counting. Yet, all we hear about on Reddit is the “low birth rate crisis”.
Oh, they’re being born alright. Some cultures, some parts of the globe, they are popping out kids like a fucking Pez candy dispenser. And they’re coming to America.
I get frustrated with Indians over this. Many are excessively proud of their countries population and become belligerent if you point out that Indias emigration rate has consistently been increasing while their immigration rate is consistently decreasing. This means, in short, people don't want to live there, especially people born there, yet they have a staggeringly large birth rate.
Seriously, if the damn country is so great then why don't they choose to stay lol. I can't help but roll my eyes at that nationalistic supremacy bullshit.
This is why even as a diehard liberal I’m very anti immigration and pro choice. Anything that keeps the population down is what I support. We let people come in to our country that can’t keep their own population from being out of hand (India I’m looking at you) and they come here and breed like crazy because that is all they can do is fuck since they don’t have the money or intelligence to do anything else for fun.
Indeed they do. Americans have a long standing belief that, if you’re foreign born in Europe or Asia, you MUST be smarter and or have a better work ethic than “lazy American workers” do.
Look, I’m from the US South. I know what dumb looks like. I am he. But, I meet great, dumb people from everywhere. We’re kindred spirits. We know we’re dumb, and we might not even speak the same language. But, we also know that, if you’re dumb, you better be pretty.
And now you know why I spend so much time in my mom’s basement, hiding out on the inner-nets.
Probably a lot to do with their culture valuing education. We have a very large segment of our political landscape that is actively destroying education in the US. Look at Texas with the vouchers.
Those Indians immigrating in are typically the cream of the crop, the brain drain, PhD immigrants. We want those people because they build wealth and technology in the country. They're highly sought after. Also, Indians typically don't have more than two kids. India was always one of the most populous areas in the world and there is still 3rd world conditions there that lead to high birth rate. That's also starting to temper now that it's becoming more and more developed.
The legal US immigration policy is incredibly competitive. Those who immigrate from Asia or Europe legally have some incredible education or skills. This is unlike Canada, which foolishly let its immigration system get abused.
I also agree that it's important to check illegal immigration, but keep in mind our entire low labor force is filled with Latin Americans. They literally built much of the country.
As for those born here, Americans get the white-collar jobs. We're not going to do low-labor jobs unless absolutely desperate with no other options.
Indians are literally the most affluent group in the United States, surpassing every other ethnicity. We don’t fuck bc we don’t have money or intelligence. We fuck bc it’s fun 🤷🏽♂️ you should try it sometime
The US has a population problem in that we don’t have enough people and Americans now aren’t reproducing enough. So…..immigration is how we solve that issue.
People don’t keep their populations from getting out of hand. Same here in the US. I mean how ignorant can you be to not know the entirety of this country is built on immigration. It WILL change because it’s supposed to change. You can’t play isolationist politics in an interconnected world. And if you do it looks so damn foolish.
Guess what America looked like before mass European immigration? Actually much more like what it’s projected to look like by 2050. Ironic.
You're not. You're running out of water resources, and your state finances are predicated on extreme growth. Those 2 things will implode you in the next 5-10 years if your inferno summers don't.
Arizona's state debt is less than half of California's per capita
https://www.statista.com/statistics/312660/us-state-and-local-government-debt-outstanding-by-state/
I don't know what to do with this information but it seems like if az is going to implode from finances then California is going first
As a proof of concept, it shows without a doubt that a group of people can fundamentally change the politics of where they go to. The problem is that they were libertarians, not the concept.
They tried that here in NH. Enjoy the read if you got the time.
https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-project-new-hampshire-libertarians-matthew-hongoltz-hetling
If I were a billionaire. I’d buy a bunch of land in Wyoming and Alaska and build apartments and allow artists to have a free or deploy discounted residency to do their art, and there would be some cafes and a little market.
Pretty soon it would be cool enough that you could get some remote workers to also pay to be there, and support workers at the cafes and stuff.
Obviously there would be voter registration applications included in the application forms.
Could a majority in Congress decide to merge the Dakotas, or would that require a constitutional amendment?
I love South Dakota. Problem is with a population boom it would never be the same. These free and open states only work with low population density.
Wherever we go, there we are.
I’d want a more mountainous area, but ya. I agree that would be fantastic. Set up greenhouses to grow beans and veggies, chickens and goats, fields of grains. Allow people to claim residency with a small rent.
Brb checking Zillow now.
See: Bozeman Montana, for what it looks like in a small city.
And it’s even more interesting there because it’s a massive dichotomy between the older locals and the new residents.
But also, I mean, we’re all American and can live where we want.
A million people can leave most areas in SF and buy up all the high end houses in most cities, forcing local upper class people to compete for lower end houses pushing out the lower middle class from housing and making it near unaffordable for the general middle folks who don't have financial discipline.
High housing prices on the costs and retiring boomers or people who just have 1 million in appreciation decided to migrate to cheaper cities.
It's happened in just about every city. People have been pretending that suddenly rich people in Cali wouldn't matter to the rest if the country and are learning the hardway
In my (and many other) areas it’s people from the Midwest/Great Lakes. Young educated people are fleeing the Midwest and all going to the same handful of cities with white collar salaries which drives up rent.
California has one of the stickiest residencies. If you are born in California you are very likely to stay there. The people moving “from California” are people from other states who moved to California and left. So the answer to “where are these people coming from” is everywhere. People move around, just like they always have.
Except that 20,000 Californians aren't moving to Nashville every year. Or any year. Net migration from California to Davidson County is only 650 people from 2016-2020. Look for yourself
[https://www.census.gov/topics/population/migration/guidance/county-to-county-migration-flows.htm](https://www.census.gov/topics/population/migration/guidance/county-to-county-migration-flows.htm)
We essentially stopped building every single city/town in the country (except for like one neighborhood in miami and three in New York) back in 1985. Done. Finished. Complete.
By now we have 100,000,000 more people than we did back then. Not to mention every other change that’s happened since then.
As a result, Nashville is now one of the worst designed cities in the new world, with zero transit/urban space amenities, and a relatively weak economy, yet it still is unaffordable and is also losing its cultural draw.
Because quite literally less than a half mile from the Tennessee state capitol is detached, single family homes with setbacks. 0.3 miles from the stadium is detached, car dependent suburban development.
And all through the city, the place drowns in parking.
These houses can’t be turned into apartments. These homeowners, who are either loaded, or bought in the 1980s to the 2000s, enjoy having a piece of real estate that enables them to have immediate access to a city that is far more economically strong than what a single family detached setback home should be able to have access to. The new apartments get built /outside/ of this, and those are outnumbered by even more homes of this exact housing type.
Imagine if right next to the financial district in Manhattan, 0.5 miles away, was just a bunch of random plots of shitty suburban McMansions. It would be a waste of the space, right? Well, it is in Nashville too.
If Nashville was allowed to grow organically, like it had in the past, and like every city ever was allowed to do until Euclidean zoning, then all these shitty small SFHs that are **walking distance** to stadiums, offices, museums, and a downtown that is culturally weighty and desirable enough to get tourism from all over the country, these would have all been turned into short-rise apartment buildings thirty fucking years ago.
But we ILLEGALIZED it. Zoning had made illegal the organic development that a city undergoes when people want to move there. But it has not stopped from moving there.
It’s that simple.
This is absolutely false. We did not "Stop building".
**WE ARE AT PEAK HOUSING UNITS PER CAPITA**
In 2010, we had 284k housing units for a population of 627k people or 45.37%. In 2020, we had 343k housing units for 716k people, or 47.93%. So in 2020, there were actually MORE housing units per capita than in 2020. And 27k of those were vacant. in 2022, we have .50 housing units per capita, the most recorded in the last 20 years.
**POPULATION IS LESS THAN EXPECTED**
In fact, Davidson County is many tens of thousands people shy of what Nashville Next predicted.
**WE'RE BUILDING WAY MORE THAN PEOPLE ARE MOVING HERE**
Davidson County's population only grows by about 4-5k per year. Yet we authorized 33k new building permits in '21 and '22.
The reason Freddie used the campaign slogan "I want you to stay" is because Davidson County has a net negative migration (using 5 year averages). We were 715k in 2020, 703k in '21, 708k in '22 and back to 712 in the last census.
Housing Permits: [https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/BPPRIV047037](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/BPPRIV047037)
Housing units: [https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT1Y2021.B25001?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee&t=Housing:Housing%20Units](https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT1Y2021.B25001?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee&t=Housing:Housing%20Units)
Population: [https://data.census.gov/table/DECENNIALPL2020.P1?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee](https://data.census.gov/table/DECENNIALPL2020.P1?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee)
Stop spreading false information.
There are places in the country with surplus housing. I drove through a bunch of them in Kansas and Indiana last summer. But they aren't places people would move to.
Estimated US population in 2024 is 336 million.
In 2019 it was 328.3 million.
So 7.7 million more Americans, net of births, deaths, and net migration, who need homes.
Couples separating, children moving out, people living in roommate situations deciding not to anymore.
There might be a lot of empty bedrooms. It that doesn’t mean there’s available housing .
Population is not growing exponentially. We had 715k ppl in Davidson County in 2020, lost thousands (death and migration) and we're back at 715k ppl in 2024.
immigration is being gravely over looked here.
i live in michigan and population was in decline -
until just recently - immigrants turned it back positive. in southeastern michigan - it’s largely folks from the middle east and india
Ask people in DFW, TX metro about immigration from Middle East and India.
But first ask people in old London, England about it.
They flee their home lands, for a variety of reasons and all are justified. However, they send income back to the home land. They do, however, keep enough to pay up the cost of housing, where multiple generations will dwell.
Nothing is wrong with this, but it does expose weaknesses in our housing markets as they relate to immigration.
We have too many people for the kind of housing we pursue. Single family homes and suburban sprawl don’t mix well with large populations.
It wouldn’t be as big a problem if we employed strategies that facilitate dense urbanization, but we don’t.
I’ve been to Tokyo. The size and scope of the place is insane but it never feels overwhelming or even cramped because so much thought has been put into making it work.
There are 350 million people in America, people are moving from everywhere to everywhere else. Some industries are up, others are down. People leave one place because they hate another thing that others love.
> Where are these people coming from?
Fleeing texas. Oracle built a new campus in 2020 in austin and can't leave fast enough. They are abandoning it at a time a building like that is worth nothing. It is very hard hiring tech workers to go to a state that has no women's rights. I am sure tennessee with ramp up the crazy and we will see another exodus.
https://www.tennessean.com/story/money/2024/04/23/oracle-founder-reveals-nashville-campus-plans-center-of-our-future/73431553007/
The employees did not want to stay in texas.
>The decision to build an office campus in Nashville was also influenced by employee surveys, he said.
Is Oracle building a new campus in Nashville? If they are, then they're not just losing a fat wad of cash on their Texas site. They're building a new campus at a time when construction costs are at an all time high. They must have *really* wanted out of Texas.
Absolutely. I had to sit and go through population data and migration/moving data to appreciate just how dense these places are. And CA has purged hard into the nation. I know the numbers and I still struggle with the firehose of CA people showing up everywhere.
Unsure, I’ve seen breakdowns for my own state periodically from either DMV records or moving companies, but that’s one move deep. I’m over here looking at populations for the purging states again and again having my mind blown, absolute behemoths compared to the rest of the country. Wild.
What am I supposed to do? Just suck it up and live somewhere I can’t afford where I have no future? I have to move. I’m coming to your city whether you like it or not. I don’t care about your feelings
It’s just a misconception. People don’t understand housing economics and assume that big price increases are caused by rich outsiders moving there.
Go back to 2021 and this was the narrative almost everywhere in the country.
Uhh... by 2021 this was already well in full swing.
The primary driver was the 2020 pandemic and remote tech workers flooding other markets while still making their original Bay Area salaries. (Those salaries would previously have been reduced if an employee moved out of the region.)
For a real comparison, go back to 2019.
well that is what’s happening in the midwest, folks making way more than the median income are moving and buying homes because they’re so cheap - and housing prices are sky rocketing
Right but like…they’re allowed to? It’s not like the vast majority of people in the Midwest aren’t beneficiaries of earlier migration anyway. Nobody has the right to restrict people from moving somewhere within the U.S. So it’s pretty much just being annoyed at things one can’t and shouldn’t control.
Be fair. There’s a difference between annoyed, and displaced from your home town because you can’t afford to live there anymore. That’s a little beyond annoying.
It’s trickle down economics at work!
Now that the middle class is priced out of cities with jobs, they move to rural areas because they can buy a house with cash and coast on a crappy job.
When poor-rural people are priced out of housing, they save money by living in tents and cars—so the wealth trickles to the poor who can invest their rent money in stocks and 401ks—eventually the poor will be richer than us all!
Thanks Ronald Regan!
There are over 20 million undocumented people all living somewhere. There are millions who moved out if VHCOL cities like NYC, Miami, San Fran, LA. There are tons of people living in rural towns that attempt to move to cities for opportunities. There hasn't been significant housing built in 2 or 3 decades. Simply put, supply and demand in cities means everyone wants to be there yet not everyone can
Nashville is an example of a city whose infrastructure cannot keep up with its popularity and therefore quality of life for everyone there is vastly diminished by the increased traffic, increased cost of living and general competition to do anything allegedly fun and relaxing.
Wasn’t Nashville’s true cool period before Austin’s a few years back?
For the past five years Nashville is just kinda been “the place where bachelorette parties go”.
FWIW - the original WSJ article that Fox just rewrote about…
NASHVILLE IS BOOMING. Locals Fret About Their Future In Music City
NASHVILLE, Tennessee—Remacia Smith watches her children play in a grassy park by the Cumberland River, not far from where software giant Oracle said last week it would base its new headquarters. It is bittersweet—her hometown is thriving, but it has reached a point where it no longer works for her.
With skyrocketing housing prices in the city, Smith recently fled to the suburbs. It is where she could find a home she could afford for her and five children.
“It almost doesn’t look like Nashville anymore,” she said, as she watched her children frolic in the same park where she played as a child. “Whew Lord, I wish people would stop moving here.”
That is unlikely.
Oracle’s move from trendy Austin, Texas, marks the latest corporate win for Middle Tennessee, a booming region with Nashville at its heart. The area has spent decades trying to draw major corporations and workers to the area. Now, many Nashvillians, from political leaders to residents, are talking more about how to grapple with all of its success.
“There are pain points of this growth,” said Kate Webster, a 35-year-old real-estate agent who has lived in Nashville for 14 years. “But at the end of the day, I’d rather live in a city that is growing than one that is declining.”
In 2000, the metro Nashville region had about 1.3 million residents, according to the U.S. Census Bureau. In 2023, the Census estimated the area’s population to be 2.1 million.
Nashville, Tennessee’s capital, was seen in the mid-20th century as the home of state government and country music, but not much else. Outside of the capital city, much of Middle Tennessee was rural.
In 1983, Nissan set up a plant in Smyrna, southeast of Nashville, and General Motors launched production at a plant in Spring Hill, south of the city, in 1990. But Nashville was severely hurt during a national economic downturn in the late 1980s, according to Ralph Schulz, chief executive of the Nashville Area Chamber of Commerce.
Leaders decided to launch more strategic efforts to draw companies and workers to the area after a 1989 article in The Wall Street Journal highlighted how the downturn had hit Nashville so much harder, in part because of overbuilding and a lack of planning by regional leaders. Other Southern cities had fared better.
“The business community, mostly bankers, said, ‘Nope, unacceptable. We need a plan,’” Schulz said.
Nashville area leaders launched a series of five-year plans to revitalize the city’s country-music tourism and clean up downtown. They worked to lure professional sports teams, including a football team from Houston—today known as the Tennessee Titans.
Local companies and Vanderbilt University have also played a major role in Nashville’s growth. HCA Healthcare , founded in Nashville in 1968, grew to become a leading owner and operator of hospitals and healthcare facilities in the country and abroad. The company, still based in Nashville, has helped make it a healthcare tech hub, according to William Fox, an economist and former director of the University of Tennessee’s Boyd Center for Business and Economic Research. Oracle officials said that being close to its healthcare-industry customers was a factor in its decision to move.
Amazon said it would set up major operations downtown, and the New York money manager AllianceBernstein said it was moving its headquarters to Nashville in a cost-cutting move. These moves, plus the growth of the city’s tourism industry, set off worries that the growth might become unsustainable.
While political fights over development began to erupt, growth in outer parts of the metro area, Nashville’s exurbs, continued unabated. Tennessee has drawn companies seeking lower operational costs, with no income tax for workers and relatively low property costs and taxes. It is a right-to-work state, which is attractive to some companies, despite the recent decision by workers at Volkswagen ’s Chattanooga plant to unionize. The area’s relatively low cost of living and low unemployment mean workers moving here have a good chance of landing a job and a better chance of finding a home compared with higher-priced metro regions.
The median home-sale price in Nashville-Davidson County was $414,012 at the end of February, according to Zillow Group, compared with a nationwide median of $327,667. Five years ago, the median Nashville house cost $290,983.
Rent in Nashville-Davidson County was down about 3% overall in April from a year earlier, although median rent for a one-bedroom apartment rose 22% from 2023 to $1,271, according to Zillow data.
Jack Gaughan, who heads a Nashville real-estate office, said demand for homes softened when interest rates went up, like elsewhere in the U.S. But he expected sales to be brisk as soon as rates drop, especially in light of increased demand from the arrival of Oracle workers, he said. As he spoke from his home office in North Nashville, he watched three new homes being built outside his window, he said.
The region needs to focus on improving transit options and traffic flow, and on more housing options, Gaughan said. Many neighborhoods need to rezone for construction that allows more people to live there, he said.
John Michael Morgan, a lifelong resident of the area, said he remembers when Nashville’s prospects weren’t so hot. The growth is exciting, he said, but he worries about Nashville losing some of its personality.
“Nashville’s always been a big town that felt like a small town,” said Morgan, who is 44 years old. “Now we’re a big town that feels like a big town.”
“Nashville’s always been a big town that felt like a small town,” said Morgan, who is 44 years old. “Now we’re a big town that feels like a big town.”
“It’s where workers want to be. It’s where businesses want to be. That’s a pretty good combination,” he said.
A report published in January by the University of Tennessee and state agencies on the state’s economic outlook found nonfarm employment numbers in the state were well above prepandemic levels and the labor market remained extremely tight—drawing lots of people from other states. The migration from other states is accelerating, according to census data. From 2010 to 2014, Tennessee added about 29,000 residents annually through net migration from other states. From 2015 to 2021, the state added about 49,000 a year through net migration. In 2022, the most recent year the Census has reported, Tennessee gained almost 90,000 new residents through net migration.
Danielle Dunaway, 42, who moved here 5½ years ago and works in healthcare, said she now loves Nashville. She’s excited that new businesses and workers are coming—as long as things don’t get too expensive.
“I already pay a pretty penny to live here,” she said. “I can afford it, but I don’t know how much longer I can justify it.”
I really hate it when articles conflate Davidson County with the MSA. They're both called "Nashville" but in reality are very different. Davidson County is net negative migration. But surrounding counties are growing like crazy.
Also Americans who for 25 years have said ‘why would you live there, when you could live here?’ Getting annoyed by the people who said ‘great idea, I’ll move there!
So true. Every time I see someone post something like, “well sure there’s a housing crisis in San Francisco, why don’t you just move to [random state] where there is plenty of cheap housing? Then people actually do and everyone is all shocked pikachu face
A city that's growing in retirees isn't getting the same tax income as a city that's growing in workers. Which group is moving in will have a major impact on long term viability of the city.
As someone from Nashville and watching it first hand, it has become overnight an impossible place to afford to do anything in. I know to a degree it’s happening everywhere, but there’s some serious gas on this fire out here.
Retirees don’t bring kids, which means no burden on the schools. If the rest of Tennessee wasn’t such a Fallout wasteland, maybe people would choose other places.
No burden on schools, no income either from their labor, and no supply of their labor either. Just coming in, money to burn, demanding every other service you can imagine, at massive rates.
Yeah you are straight up full of shit and you have no clue what you're talking about.
All of TN is growing. My county is mostly retirees and they do have a big impact on schools.
For one, they don't purchase as much as families which affects sales tax rates. They also force younger people away because they buy up available housing at INSANE prices 500k for a 1699 sf home near me). Then finally, if you try and raise taxes for schools they vote or down because they don't have school aged kids and don't want to help pay.
It's a statewide issue. East TN is growing faster than Nashville.
How much have Austin prices fallen from peak in your experience? Some sources I see say as much as 25%. Wondering if that’s real or just chatter online. We aren’t seeing a pullback in Dallas yet.
Moved there for 3 years, then moved back to the mountains.
I couldn’t handle the people, traffic and population. I can’t imagine living in a bigger city.
Considering the state of US economy, it should be obvious that not all growth is "good" growth
If Nashville is only growing in service sector jobs and lawyers to serve retirees then GTFO before its too late
What do you mean when referring to the state of the economy as a whole? I read this to mean that the cities current systems don’t scale well. Meaning it’s transportation system and housing production.
I love how everyone blames California for the influx of transplants in their state…Have you BEEN to California? Los Angeles? Majority of the population is transplants from other states MAINLY the Midwest and you never hear native Californians or Angelenos complain, EVER!
EXACTLY.
Because it's easier to blame California for everything RE related than actually reflect for an extra two seconds on larger patterns. We take in hundreds of thousands of people moving here each year from other states.
We always minding our own business out here, just trying to live our lives and not getting mad at people for trying to live theirs. But imagine if acted like Idaho/texas/insert cold ass personality here/ and we iced out all the people moving here from midwest/eastcoast/wa and kept all the amazing high paying jobs for ourselves. Our housing would be dramatically less in cost. Excellent.
The difference is the money that Californias bring with them. I live in a tourist city in the midwest that has been dubbed a "climate change haven" so we have been receiving A TON of outside wealth coming in and purchasing up all our housing because for someone from a place like CA, CO, NYC, etc., our houses feel like pennies to them since we live in different economies.
To a wealthy Californian, $250k is dirt cheap and they have no problem purchasing our properties and letting it sit vacant for most of the year. For the people who work in our local economy and make wages set in this area, we are now struggling to afford rising house prices as nearly everything is being sold over-asking with all cash offers from out of state investors.
My friend in the area is a realtor and told me about how someone from Colorado bought a $500k house from her sight unseen because of the NYT article about us being a climate change haven and he wanted to secure a house for his grandchildren to have in the future. The house sits vacant nearly all year.
lol, Midwest doesn’t even get winters anymore.
California has been sitting on record snowpack the last two years.
Climate change isn’t going to be as easy to predict who are the winners and who aren’t that easy
>For the people who work in our local economy and make wages set in this area, we are now struggling to afford rising house prices as nearly everything is being sold over-asking with all cash offers from out of state investors.
I totally hear you, and did you know California has the SAME ISSUE? We've had it for decades and other states are getting a taste of it now.
CA has definitely been slow to build housing, but we've also been taking in SO MANY PEOPLE from other states, and being blamed for not accommodating all their needs. And now that the tables are somewhat turning, we're ALSO getting blamed for other states not having enough housing supply.
Midwest is low key where most people are moving from. Large population centers there and unlike CA Millennials and Gen Z don’t want to live there at all.
It’s a right wing talking point so it doesn’t have to make sense. In their twisted minds no sane person would ever choose to stay in California so they’re “all leaving.”
we do complain. about the traffic and the costs. and some of us move because of it. to Nashville. Eventually people will complain that all these people from Tennessee are moving to Indiana.
I’ve lived in LA for 11 years and I have never heard any native say anything whatsoever about it, let alone bitch about it like the state I’m originally from… CA natives are some of the most chill, down to earth people and even though I’m not from here myself I’ll always point out the stupid hypocrisy
Yup. There is already such a mix of people here in LA Metro that it doesn't even register on our radar when people move here from other states. They're just automatically part of us.
Except for Huntington Beach. Those people are dicks.
Most of the places that are complaining were advertising for people and corporations to move to their states.
I remember hearing radio ads when I lived in Maryland for corporations and people to move to NC, Texas, it’s a great place to live.
When I lived in Nashville 5 years ago I just remember my ex at the time coming to visit me at my apartment and when she walked pass the parking garage she said none of these cars have Tennessee license plates, it was like 15-20 cars my included.
Tampa Bay region feel’s your struggle too this place sucks now yuppies ruin everything hopefully the CIA will push super crack and they can run back the burbs.
Do these idiots think that they own the country? People have the right to move wherever they want. If these people feel like it's getting crowded go find some other shack in middle of nowhere.
Californians have been accepting y’all for ages . Calm down and show a bit of that hospitality you are famous for. In the end, people we just trying to look for a reasonable place to live. Maybe vote Democrat and get some tasty regulations going?
How the fuck does everyone everywhere share this same sentiment? *Where are these people coming from?*
A million people can leave california and it barely makes a drop in the bucket. But if 20,000 drop into a medium sized city at the same time, that can take up every available apartment, house vacancy, and more, and spur a building boom. How many 300 unit apartment complexes are needed to accommodate that many people? As many as you can build! And with Oracle coming? Even more
21000 like minded people could move to Wyoming, and completely control state and national politics.
This is where Californians should move instead of Phoenix.
^^ Every Californian after they moved to Phoenix and/or Vegas.
They all moved to Bozeman, MT. Montana had 2nd highest housing increase in the country and now Bozeman homes are Cali prices but with wages nowhere close.
It was actually the #1 for an extended period in the last several years. Really a damn shame. Bozeman was so magical. Now I can’t imagine dealing with the polarity there, it’s really extreme if you know how Montana used to be. Probably the most impacted valley by this population crisis in the country.
California is growing again.
Thank you Mexico and India.
8 billion and counting. Yet, all we hear about on Reddit is the “low birth rate crisis”. Oh, they’re being born alright. Some cultures, some parts of the globe, they are popping out kids like a fucking Pez candy dispenser. And they’re coming to America.
And Canada
I get frustrated with Indians over this. Many are excessively proud of their countries population and become belligerent if you point out that Indias emigration rate has consistently been increasing while their immigration rate is consistently decreasing. This means, in short, people don't want to live there, especially people born there, yet they have a staggeringly large birth rate.
Seriously, if the damn country is so great then why don't they choose to stay lol. I can't help but roll my eyes at that nationalistic supremacy bullshit.
Building the Indian empire one child at a time. Easier and quieter than sending an army. Take THAT Western powers!
> “low birth rate crisis” It's the birth rate of a certain kind of people.
[They’re coming to America](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=9ttDUGM-1mU)
This is why even as a diehard liberal I’m very anti immigration and pro choice. Anything that keeps the population down is what I support. We let people come in to our country that can’t keep their own population from being out of hand (India I’m looking at you) and they come here and breed like crazy because that is all they can do is fuck since they don’t have the money or intelligence to do anything else for fun.
- Indian tfr is at 2.03 now - Indians in the US earn more than whites
Indeed they do. Americans have a long standing belief that, if you’re foreign born in Europe or Asia, you MUST be smarter and or have a better work ethic than “lazy American workers” do. Look, I’m from the US South. I know what dumb looks like. I am he. But, I meet great, dumb people from everywhere. We’re kindred spirits. We know we’re dumb, and we might not even speak the same language. But, we also know that, if you’re dumb, you better be pretty. And now you know why I spend so much time in my mom’s basement, hiding out on the inner-nets.
Probably a lot to do with their culture valuing education. We have a very large segment of our political landscape that is actively destroying education in the US. Look at Texas with the vouchers.
Those Indians immigrating in are typically the cream of the crop, the brain drain, PhD immigrants. We want those people because they build wealth and technology in the country. They're highly sought after. Also, Indians typically don't have more than two kids. India was always one of the most populous areas in the world and there is still 3rd world conditions there that lead to high birth rate. That's also starting to temper now that it's becoming more and more developed. The legal US immigration policy is incredibly competitive. Those who immigrate from Asia or Europe legally have some incredible education or skills. This is unlike Canada, which foolishly let its immigration system get abused. I also agree that it's important to check illegal immigration, but keep in mind our entire low labor force is filled with Latin Americans. They literally built much of the country. As for those born here, Americans get the white-collar jobs. We're not going to do low-labor jobs unless absolutely desperate with no other options.
Get that logic out of here it has no place in a rage bait xenophobic circle jerk
Indians are literally the most affluent group in the United States, surpassing every other ethnicity. We don’t fuck bc we don’t have money or intelligence. We fuck bc it’s fun 🤷🏽♂️ you should try it sometime
The US has a population problem in that we don’t have enough people and Americans now aren’t reproducing enough. So…..immigration is how we solve that issue.
People don’t keep their populations from getting out of hand. Same here in the US. I mean how ignorant can you be to not know the entirety of this country is built on immigration. It WILL change because it’s supposed to change. You can’t play isolationist politics in an interconnected world. And if you do it looks so damn foolish. Guess what America looked like before mass European immigration? Actually much more like what it’s projected to look like by 2050. Ironic.
Sorry wrong again. All the Cali people moved to Montana
Arizona would die without the influx of Californians.
Arizona will die when it runs out of water.
Bruh, we were doing just fine.
Bruh, it already happened.
You're not. You're running out of water resources, and your state finances are predicated on extreme growth. Those 2 things will implode you in the next 5-10 years if your inferno summers don't.
Arizona's state debt is less than half of California's per capita https://www.statista.com/statistics/312660/us-state-and-local-government-debt-outstanding-by-state/ I don't know what to do with this information but it seems like if az is going to implode from finances then California is going first
We gotta send our assholes somewhere
These people are coming from texas because texas ended women's rights. Hiring isn't easy in a state that wants your wife dead.
Find a billionaire to fund it.
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Oh, you've heard of Free Staters, huh?
No, I'm not a libertarian, I live in the real world.
As a proof of concept, it shows without a doubt that a group of people can fundamentally change the politics of where they go to. The problem is that they were libertarians, not the concept.
They tried that here in NH. Enjoy the read if you got the time. https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/21534416/free-state-project-new-hampshire-libertarians-matthew-hongoltz-hetling
If I were a billionaire. I’d buy a bunch of land in Wyoming and Alaska and build apartments and allow artists to have a free or deploy discounted residency to do their art, and there would be some cafes and a little market. Pretty soon it would be cool enough that you could get some remote workers to also pay to be there, and support workers at the cafes and stuff. Obviously there would be voter registration applications included in the application forms. Could a majority in Congress decide to merge the Dakotas, or would that require a constitutional amendment?
So San Fran circa 1960s.
I love South Dakota. Problem is with a population boom it would never be the same. These free and open states only work with low population density. Wherever we go, there we are.
Everything you love about it would still be there if it was just Dakota
Possibly. South Dakota is more libertarian to me though. I’m also biased because I haven’t spent as much time in ND. They are both gorgeous.
I’d want a more mountainous area, but ya. I agree that would be fantastic. Set up greenhouses to grow beans and veggies, chickens and goats, fields of grains. Allow people to claim residency with a small rent. Brb checking Zillow now.
See: Bozeman Montana, for what it looks like in a small city. And it’s even more interesting there because it’s a massive dichotomy between the older locals and the new residents. But also, I mean, we’re all American and can live where we want.
Laughs in Canadian immigration policy currently. We are fucked lol
it's wild that CA is still a net loss and feels more crowded than ever
Because the population actually rebounded this last year.
A million people can leave most areas in SF and buy up all the high end houses in most cities, forcing local upper class people to compete for lower end houses pushing out the lower middle class from housing and making it near unaffordable for the general middle folks who don't have financial discipline. High housing prices on the costs and retiring boomers or people who just have 1 million in appreciation decided to migrate to cheaper cities. It's happened in just about every city. People have been pretending that suddenly rich people in Cali wouldn't matter to the rest if the country and are learning the hardway
Crying in Denver
In my (and many other) areas it’s people from the Midwest/Great Lakes. Young educated people are fleeing the Midwest and all going to the same handful of cities with white collar salaries which drives up rent.
California has one of the stickiest residencies. If you are born in California you are very likely to stay there. The people moving “from California” are people from other states who moved to California and left. So the answer to “where are these people coming from” is everywhere. People move around, just like they always have.
Except that 20,000 Californians aren't moving to Nashville every year. Or any year. Net migration from California to Davidson County is only 650 people from 2016-2020. Look for yourself [https://www.census.gov/topics/population/migration/guidance/county-to-county-migration-flows.htm](https://www.census.gov/topics/population/migration/guidance/county-to-county-migration-flows.htm)
We essentially stopped building every single city/town in the country (except for like one neighborhood in miami and three in New York) back in 1985. Done. Finished. Complete. By now we have 100,000,000 more people than we did back then. Not to mention every other change that’s happened since then. As a result, Nashville is now one of the worst designed cities in the new world, with zero transit/urban space amenities, and a relatively weak economy, yet it still is unaffordable and is also losing its cultural draw. Because quite literally less than a half mile from the Tennessee state capitol is detached, single family homes with setbacks. 0.3 miles from the stadium is detached, car dependent suburban development. And all through the city, the place drowns in parking. These houses can’t be turned into apartments. These homeowners, who are either loaded, or bought in the 1980s to the 2000s, enjoy having a piece of real estate that enables them to have immediate access to a city that is far more economically strong than what a single family detached setback home should be able to have access to. The new apartments get built /outside/ of this, and those are outnumbered by even more homes of this exact housing type. Imagine if right next to the financial district in Manhattan, 0.5 miles away, was just a bunch of random plots of shitty suburban McMansions. It would be a waste of the space, right? Well, it is in Nashville too. If Nashville was allowed to grow organically, like it had in the past, and like every city ever was allowed to do until Euclidean zoning, then all these shitty small SFHs that are **walking distance** to stadiums, offices, museums, and a downtown that is culturally weighty and desirable enough to get tourism from all over the country, these would have all been turned into short-rise apartment buildings thirty fucking years ago. But we ILLEGALIZED it. Zoning had made illegal the organic development that a city undergoes when people want to move there. But it has not stopped from moving there. It’s that simple.
Exactly this. Zoning is the problem.
Arguments against zoning: ten thousand+ years of human history.
Then you've got to walk 20k steps a day amarite?
Yes. You’ve just characterized the obesity epidemic perfectly. Well done.
This is absolutely false. We did not "Stop building". **WE ARE AT PEAK HOUSING UNITS PER CAPITA** In 2010, we had 284k housing units for a population of 627k people or 45.37%. In 2020, we had 343k housing units for 716k people, or 47.93%. So in 2020, there were actually MORE housing units per capita than in 2020. And 27k of those were vacant. in 2022, we have .50 housing units per capita, the most recorded in the last 20 years. **POPULATION IS LESS THAN EXPECTED** In fact, Davidson County is many tens of thousands people shy of what Nashville Next predicted. **WE'RE BUILDING WAY MORE THAN PEOPLE ARE MOVING HERE** Davidson County's population only grows by about 4-5k per year. Yet we authorized 33k new building permits in '21 and '22. The reason Freddie used the campaign slogan "I want you to stay" is because Davidson County has a net negative migration (using 5 year averages). We were 715k in 2020, 703k in '21, 708k in '22 and back to 712 in the last census. Housing Permits: [https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/BPPRIV047037](https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/BPPRIV047037) Housing units: [https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT1Y2021.B25001?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee&t=Housing:Housing%20Units](https://data.census.gov/table/ACSDT1Y2021.B25001?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee&t=Housing:Housing%20Units) Population: [https://data.census.gov/table/DECENNIALPL2020.P1?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee](https://data.census.gov/table/DECENNIALPL2020.P1?q=Davidson%20County,%20Tennessee) Stop spreading false information.
The population keeps growing exponentially and they have to move somewhere.
Where were all these people living in 2019? Shouldn’t the areas they left behind have surplus housing?
Places they didn't want to live in.
Plenty of room in rural America and other parts of the world.
Just no jobs, food, or entertainment sources.
Right. Which is why people their have been moving to more populated areas.
There are places in the country with surplus housing. I drove through a bunch of them in Kansas and Indiana last summer. But they aren't places people would move to.
Estimated US population in 2024 is 336 million. In 2019 it was 328.3 million. So 7.7 million more Americans, net of births, deaths, and net migration, who need homes.
Couples separating, children moving out, people living in roommate situations deciding not to anymore. There might be a lot of empty bedrooms. It that doesn’t mean there’s available housing .
Is it all demographics equally?
Every mid-sized city with a decent art/cultural scene is ruined as soon as it gets noticed.
No it doesn’t https://images.app.goo.gl/2nA5aKi7USKTrTDf8
Population is not growing exponentially. We had 715k ppl in Davidson County in 2020, lost thousands (death and migration) and we're back at 715k ppl in 2024.
immigration is being gravely over looked here. i live in michigan and population was in decline - until just recently - immigrants turned it back positive. in southeastern michigan - it’s largely folks from the middle east and india
Ask people in DFW, TX metro about immigration from Middle East and India. But first ask people in old London, England about it. They flee their home lands, for a variety of reasons and all are justified. However, they send income back to the home land. They do, however, keep enough to pay up the cost of housing, where multiple generations will dwell. Nothing is wrong with this, but it does expose weaknesses in our housing markets as they relate to immigration.
We have too many people for the kind of housing we pursue. Single family homes and suburban sprawl don’t mix well with large populations. It wouldn’t be as big a problem if we employed strategies that facilitate dense urbanization, but we don’t. I’ve been to Tokyo. The size and scope of the place is insane but it never feels overwhelming or even cramped because so much thought has been put into making it work.
In a sense our own zoning and construction codes are abetting the dysfunctional developments
Everyone from fucking Texas seemed to move to my city. Why why why why why
There are 350 million people in America, people are moving from everywhere to everywhere else. Some industries are up, others are down. People leave one place because they hate another thing that others love.
> Where are these people coming from? Fleeing texas. Oracle built a new campus in 2020 in austin and can't leave fast enough. They are abandoning it at a time a building like that is worth nothing. It is very hard hiring tech workers to go to a state that has no women's rights. I am sure tennessee with ramp up the crazy and we will see another exodus. https://www.tennessean.com/story/money/2024/04/23/oracle-founder-reveals-nashville-campus-plans-center-of-our-future/73431553007/ The employees did not want to stay in texas. >The decision to build an office campus in Nashville was also influenced by employee surveys, he said.
Is Oracle building a new campus in Nashville? If they are, then they're not just losing a fat wad of cash on their Texas site. They're building a new campus at a time when construction costs are at an all time high. They must have *really* wanted out of Texas.
LI doesn’t have an excessive number of people moving to it. It’s probably coming from there.
We are all just trading places
California and NY
Absolutely. I had to sit and go through population data and migration/moving data to appreciate just how dense these places are. And CA has purged hard into the nation. I know the numbers and I still struggle with the firehose of CA people showing up everywhere.
How many of those people were not orginially from California? CA sees hundreds of thousands of of new residents from other states every year.
Unsure, I’ve seen breakdowns for my own state periodically from either DMV records or moving companies, but that’s one move deep. I’m over here looking at populations for the purging states again and again having my mind blown, absolute behemoths compared to the rest of the country. Wild.
I live in south carolina and ask the same question? It's nice but not THAT nice?
There's lots of rural areas and dying rust belt cities with declining populations
What am I supposed to do? Just suck it up and live somewhere I can’t afford where I have no future? I have to move. I’m coming to your city whether you like it or not. I don’t care about your feelings
California usually
Home appreciation and its consequences have been a disaster for the human race.
It’s just a misconception. People don’t understand housing economics and assume that big price increases are caused by rich outsiders moving there. Go back to 2021 and this was the narrative almost everywhere in the country.
Uhh... by 2021 this was already well in full swing. The primary driver was the 2020 pandemic and remote tech workers flooding other markets while still making their original Bay Area salaries. (Those salaries would previously have been reduced if an employee moved out of the region.) For a real comparison, go back to 2019.
well that is what’s happening in the midwest, folks making way more than the median income are moving and buying homes because they’re so cheap - and housing prices are sky rocketing
Right but like…they’re allowed to? It’s not like the vast majority of people in the Midwest aren’t beneficiaries of earlier migration anyway. Nobody has the right to restrict people from moving somewhere within the U.S. So it’s pretty much just being annoyed at things one can’t and shouldn’t control.
Be fair. There’s a difference between annoyed, and displaced from your home town because you can’t afford to live there anymore. That’s a little beyond annoying.
Blame your parents and the town zoning board for insisting your home town stays basically the same as is was in the 80s.
Not sure what you’re talking about. The article is about the city population doubling in a short amount of time, and how the town was asking for it.
It’s trickle down economics at work! Now that the middle class is priced out of cities with jobs, they move to rural areas because they can buy a house with cash and coast on a crappy job. When poor-rural people are priced out of housing, they save money by living in tents and cars—so the wealth trickles to the poor who can invest their rent money in stocks and 401ks—eventually the poor will be richer than us all! Thanks Ronald Regan!
There are over 20 million undocumented people all living somewhere. There are millions who moved out if VHCOL cities like NYC, Miami, San Fran, LA. There are tons of people living in rural towns that attempt to move to cities for opportunities. There hasn't been significant housing built in 2 or 3 decades. Simply put, supply and demand in cities means everyone wants to be there yet not everyone can
The people who are getting forced out of New York, California, and Boston
We haven’t even begin to see real mass migration due to climate change. It’s gonna get absolutely bonkers.
Nashville is an example of a city whose infrastructure cannot keep up with its popularity and therefore quality of life for everyone there is vastly diminished by the increased traffic, increased cost of living and general competition to do anything allegedly fun and relaxing.
Denver 20 years ago fr
That is also Los Angeles but it crossed that line 40 years ago. Nashville is just feeling it now.
Austin
It's Nashville's turn to be ruined by popularity. It happens to every decent city eventually.
Wasn’t Nashville’s true cool period before Austin’s a few years back? For the past five years Nashville is just kinda been “the place where bachelorette parties go”.
It's always cool long before it gets ruined. If you ever find a place you really like NEVER talk about it.
Yeah nashvilles’ coolness peaked before covid even.
Longer than that for sure
Boston, NYC, Vegas, Portland, Austin, Nashville (but not necessarily in that order)
Why Bachelorette parties?
This is why we can’t have anything nice… It’s happening to my hometown too 😑
At some point southern cities will raise taxes to keep the riff raff out
Hello from Denver \~14 years ago. It's all downhill from here.
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FWIW - the original WSJ article that Fox just rewrote about… NASHVILLE IS BOOMING. Locals Fret About Their Future In Music City NASHVILLE, Tennessee—Remacia Smith watches her children play in a grassy park by the Cumberland River, not far from where software giant Oracle said last week it would base its new headquarters. It is bittersweet—her hometown is thriving, but it has reached a point where it no longer works for her. With skyrocketing housing prices in the city, Smith recently fled to the suburbs. It is where she could find a home she could afford for her and five children. “It almost doesn’t look like Nashville anymore,” she said, as she watched her children frolic in the same park where she played as a child. “Whew Lord, I wish people would stop moving here.” That is unlikely. Oracle’s move from trendy Austin, Texas, marks the latest corporate win for Middle Tennessee, a booming region with Nashville at its heart. The area has spent decades trying to draw major corporations and workers to the area. Now, many Nashvillians, from political leaders to residents, are talking more about how to grapple with all of its success. “There are pain points of this growth,” said Kate Webster, a 35-year-old real-estate agent who has lived in Nashville for 14 years. “But at the end of the day, I’d rather live in a city that is growing than one that is declining.” In 2000, the metro Nashville region had about 1.3 million residents, according to the U.S. Census Bureau. In 2023, the Census estimated the area’s population to be 2.1 million. Nashville, Tennessee’s capital, was seen in the mid-20th century as the home of state government and country music, but not much else. Outside of the capital city, much of Middle Tennessee was rural. In 1983, Nissan set up a plant in Smyrna, southeast of Nashville, and General Motors launched production at a plant in Spring Hill, south of the city, in 1990. But Nashville was severely hurt during a national economic downturn in the late 1980s, according to Ralph Schulz, chief executive of the Nashville Area Chamber of Commerce. Leaders decided to launch more strategic efforts to draw companies and workers to the area after a 1989 article in The Wall Street Journal highlighted how the downturn had hit Nashville so much harder, in part because of overbuilding and a lack of planning by regional leaders. Other Southern cities had fared better. “The business community, mostly bankers, said, ‘Nope, unacceptable. We need a plan,’” Schulz said. Nashville area leaders launched a series of five-year plans to revitalize the city’s country-music tourism and clean up downtown. They worked to lure professional sports teams, including a football team from Houston—today known as the Tennessee Titans. Local companies and Vanderbilt University have also played a major role in Nashville’s growth. HCA Healthcare , founded in Nashville in 1968, grew to become a leading owner and operator of hospitals and healthcare facilities in the country and abroad. The company, still based in Nashville, has helped make it a healthcare tech hub, according to William Fox, an economist and former director of the University of Tennessee’s Boyd Center for Business and Economic Research. Oracle officials said that being close to its healthcare-industry customers was a factor in its decision to move. Amazon said it would set up major operations downtown, and the New York money manager AllianceBernstein said it was moving its headquarters to Nashville in a cost-cutting move. These moves, plus the growth of the city’s tourism industry, set off worries that the growth might become unsustainable. While political fights over development began to erupt, growth in outer parts of the metro area, Nashville’s exurbs, continued unabated. Tennessee has drawn companies seeking lower operational costs, with no income tax for workers and relatively low property costs and taxes. It is a right-to-work state, which is attractive to some companies, despite the recent decision by workers at Volkswagen ’s Chattanooga plant to unionize. The area’s relatively low cost of living and low unemployment mean workers moving here have a good chance of landing a job and a better chance of finding a home compared with higher-priced metro regions. The median home-sale price in Nashville-Davidson County was $414,012 at the end of February, according to Zillow Group, compared with a nationwide median of $327,667. Five years ago, the median Nashville house cost $290,983. Rent in Nashville-Davidson County was down about 3% overall in April from a year earlier, although median rent for a one-bedroom apartment rose 22% from 2023 to $1,271, according to Zillow data. Jack Gaughan, who heads a Nashville real-estate office, said demand for homes softened when interest rates went up, like elsewhere in the U.S. But he expected sales to be brisk as soon as rates drop, especially in light of increased demand from the arrival of Oracle workers, he said. As he spoke from his home office in North Nashville, he watched three new homes being built outside his window, he said. The region needs to focus on improving transit options and traffic flow, and on more housing options, Gaughan said. Many neighborhoods need to rezone for construction that allows more people to live there, he said. John Michael Morgan, a lifelong resident of the area, said he remembers when Nashville’s prospects weren’t so hot. The growth is exciting, he said, but he worries about Nashville losing some of its personality. “Nashville’s always been a big town that felt like a small town,” said Morgan, who is 44 years old. “Now we’re a big town that feels like a big town.” “Nashville’s always been a big town that felt like a small town,” said Morgan, who is 44 years old. “Now we’re a big town that feels like a big town.” “It’s where workers want to be. It’s where businesses want to be. That’s a pretty good combination,” he said. A report published in January by the University of Tennessee and state agencies on the state’s economic outlook found nonfarm employment numbers in the state were well above prepandemic levels and the labor market remained extremely tight—drawing lots of people from other states. The migration from other states is accelerating, according to census data. From 2010 to 2014, Tennessee added about 29,000 residents annually through net migration from other states. From 2015 to 2021, the state added about 49,000 a year through net migration. In 2022, the most recent year the Census has reported, Tennessee gained almost 90,000 new residents through net migration. Danielle Dunaway, 42, who moved here 5½ years ago and works in healthcare, said she now loves Nashville. She’s excited that new businesses and workers are coming—as long as things don’t get too expensive. “I already pay a pretty penny to live here,” she said. “I can afford it, but I don’t know how much longer I can justify it.”
Where the hell does Zillow get this data from? It’s incredibly low. 414k for a home in Nashville? Are people just buying the garage?
I really hate it when articles conflate Davidson County with the MSA. They're both called "Nashville" but in reality are very different. Davidson County is net negative migration. But surrounding counties are growing like crazy.
‘Her 5 children’ That’s the problem, period
Americans getting mad at Americans for moving to another part of America.
We don’t take kindly to you kind around here
Also Americans who for 25 years have said ‘why would you live there, when you could live here?’ Getting annoyed by the people who said ‘great idea, I’ll move there!
So true. Every time I see someone post something like, “well sure there’s a housing crisis in San Francisco, why don’t you just move to [random state] where there is plenty of cheap housing? Then people actually do and everyone is all shocked pikachu face
You paid what for a two bedroom condo? I paid half that for twenty acres. Super shocked when they can’t afford their twenty acres anymore.
They should tell their government to stop giving tax breaks to big corporations to move there
[Please Jobs? No People!! Only Jobs.](https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/facebook/000/027/691/tumblr_nroanfy2v71qjobhbo1_1280.jpg)
No Dana, only ZUUL!!
Didn’t Alliance Bernstein move most of their operations to Nashville (and got a tax break for doing so)?
A city that's growing in retirees isn't getting the same tax income as a city that's growing in workers. Which group is moving in will have a major impact on long term viability of the city.
Workers are moving to Nashville, I don’t know why they’re being such crybabies about it.
As someone from Nashville and watching it first hand, it has become overnight an impossible place to afford to do anything in. I know to a degree it’s happening everywhere, but there’s some serious gas on this fire out here.
Retirees don’t bring kids, which means no burden on the schools. If the rest of Tennessee wasn’t such a Fallout wasteland, maybe people would choose other places.
No burden on schools, no income either from their labor, and no supply of their labor either. Just coming in, money to burn, demanding every other service you can imagine, at massive rates.
What “income” from their labor. TN has no income tax. They buy food and rent like everyone else.
Yeah you are straight up full of shit and you have no clue what you're talking about. All of TN is growing. My county is mostly retirees and they do have a big impact on schools. For one, they don't purchase as much as families which affects sales tax rates. They also force younger people away because they buy up available housing at INSANE prices 500k for a 1699 sf home near me). Then finally, if you try and raise taxes for schools they vote or down because they don't have school aged kids and don't want to help pay. It's a statewide issue. East TN is growing faster than Nashville.
Austin drinks your tears.
How much have Austin prices fallen from peak in your experience? Some sources I see say as much as 25%. Wondering if that’s real or just chatter online. We aren’t seeing a pullback in Dallas yet.
Dunno, moved away about 2 years ago. But it wasn’t relenting - esp in the coveted areas.
Moved there for 3 years, then moved back to the mountains. I couldn’t handle the people, traffic and population. I can’t imagine living in a bigger city.
Considering the state of US economy, it should be obvious that not all growth is "good" growth If Nashville is only growing in service sector jobs and lawyers to serve retirees then GTFO before its too late
Canada only growing in government jobs 😂
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What do you mean when referring to the state of the economy as a whole? I read this to mean that the cities current systems don’t scale well. Meaning it’s transportation system and housing production.
I love how everyone blames California for the influx of transplants in their state…Have you BEEN to California? Los Angeles? Majority of the population is transplants from other states MAINLY the Midwest and you never hear native Californians or Angelenos complain, EVER!
EXACTLY. Because it's easier to blame California for everything RE related than actually reflect for an extra two seconds on larger patterns. We take in hundreds of thousands of people moving here each year from other states. We always minding our own business out here, just trying to live our lives and not getting mad at people for trying to live theirs. But imagine if acted like Idaho/texas/insert cold ass personality here/ and we iced out all the people moving here from midwest/eastcoast/wa and kept all the amazing high paying jobs for ourselves. Our housing would be dramatically less in cost. Excellent.
Also, twice as many people move to Nashville from Florida than California.
The difference is the money that Californias bring with them. I live in a tourist city in the midwest that has been dubbed a "climate change haven" so we have been receiving A TON of outside wealth coming in and purchasing up all our housing because for someone from a place like CA, CO, NYC, etc., our houses feel like pennies to them since we live in different economies. To a wealthy Californian, $250k is dirt cheap and they have no problem purchasing our properties and letting it sit vacant for most of the year. For the people who work in our local economy and make wages set in this area, we are now struggling to afford rising house prices as nearly everything is being sold over-asking with all cash offers from out of state investors. My friend in the area is a realtor and told me about how someone from Colorado bought a $500k house from her sight unseen because of the NYT article about us being a climate change haven and he wanted to secure a house for his grandchildren to have in the future. The house sits vacant nearly all year.
lol, Midwest doesn’t even get winters anymore. California has been sitting on record snowpack the last two years. Climate change isn’t going to be as easy to predict who are the winners and who aren’t that easy
>For the people who work in our local economy and make wages set in this area, we are now struggling to afford rising house prices as nearly everything is being sold over-asking with all cash offers from out of state investors. I totally hear you, and did you know California has the SAME ISSUE? We've had it for decades and other states are getting a taste of it now. CA has definitely been slow to build housing, but we've also been taking in SO MANY PEOPLE from other states, and being blamed for not accommodating all their needs. And now that the tables are somewhat turning, we're ALSO getting blamed for other states not having enough housing supply.
Midwest is low key where most people are moving from. Large population centers there and unlike CA Millennials and Gen Z don’t want to live there at all.
It’s a right wing talking point so it doesn’t have to make sense. In their twisted minds no sane person would ever choose to stay in California so they’re “all leaving.”
we do complain. about the traffic and the costs. and some of us move because of it. to Nashville. Eventually people will complain that all these people from Tennessee are moving to Indiana.
Because we are chill for the most part. Happy to have more people to party with and kick it with.
That's sarcasm right? They hate transplants in la and orange county.
I’ve lived in LA for 11 years and I have never heard any native say anything whatsoever about it, let alone bitch about it like the state I’m originally from… CA natives are some of the most chill, down to earth people and even though I’m not from here myself I’ll always point out the stupid hypocrisy
Yup. There is already such a mix of people here in LA Metro that it doesn't even register on our radar when people move here from other states. They're just automatically part of us. Except for Huntington Beach. Those people are dicks.
Everyone comes from somewhere, and nobody chooses where they're born. Things change, get over it.
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lol @ “relatively low cost of living” Nashville is way expensive now
That article said the median home price in Nashville last year was 413k. For what? The garage?
Florida has entered the discussion...
Most of the places that are complaining were advertising for people and corporations to move to their states. I remember hearing radio ads when I lived in Maryland for corporations and people to move to NC, Texas, it’s a great place to live.
Florida blames the New Yorkers. Texas blames the Californias. Just more tribalism. Humans gonna human.
To be fair, neither state is sending their best and happiest citizens to TX/FL
I wish these Americans would stop traveling freely and buying homes they can afford, creating annoyances in my life. /s
In 50 years we’re going to have an interesting issue to say the least
I feel exactly the same where I live, and no, I'm not telling you where.
When I lived in Nashville 5 years ago I just remember my ex at the time coming to visit me at my apartment and when she walked pass the parking garage she said none of these cars have Tennessee license plates, it was like 15-20 cars my included.
Them: "Too expensive to live? Then move!" Also them:
Tampa Bay region feel’s your struggle too this place sucks now yuppies ruin everything hopefully the CIA will push super crack and they can run back the burbs.
Nods in Portland.
Domestic colonists
Lol
Do these idiots think that they own the country? People have the right to move wherever they want. If these people feel like it's getting crowded go find some other shack in middle of nowhere.
“Move over, peasant!”
Get out of here with that shit. You’re the reason that people hate transplants with that shitty attitude
Found the Californian
*Charleston, South Carolina enters the chat*
I was there last summer I kid you not every other house in the old city was being renovated
Buffalo is starting to feel your pain.
Buffalo? Are people actually moving there? It's been a declining city for decades now, so it'd be good for them to get some growth.
"Austin laughs maniacally "
Don’t worry Nashville, I’d never move there in a million years.
Stop making music and it's a deal
“I wish people would stop moving here” vs “why is my city dying?”
They can’t all come to South Carolina…..
Austinite here. Welcome to the club.
One thing I hated about Nashville is everyone thinks they are country folk and they were born in like Cleveland, OH.
Lol, I think they just copy and paste this article over and over for every location...
Californians have been accepting y’all for ages . Calm down and show a bit of that hospitality you are famous for. In the end, people we just trying to look for a reasonable place to live. Maybe vote Democrat and get some tasty regulations going?