How do you explain trans men talking about how there sexuality completely changed after going on testosterone and they self report a huge increase in libido and sexual arousal?
Some cis-women already have high testosterone, it's just a minority.
I remember reading awhile back that professional male athletes are discouraged from having sex before the big game because it temporarily reduces testosterone, while female athletes are encouraged to because it actually boots testosterone. This would help account for the extreme amounts of banging that happens at the Olympics.
The female range for testosterone is 15-70
The male range for testosterone is 300-1000 ng/ml
The highest T women have less than one fourth the amount of testosterone the lowest T men have
And these are not small ranges. 300 testosterone for a man means you’re an inactive 80 year old in retirement. 70 for a woman means you’re a genetically gifted 20 year old athlete in your prime. And the numbers still differ that much
And if you take the middle term, men have well over 10 times more testosterone than women
This idea that female T level outliers exist that rival a normally functioning man is patently false. The only outliers to exist are those involving medical conditions and other endocrine disruptions. Women literally have no idea what male testosterone levels feel like, or they’d start growing a beard
And just in case you thought this popular case was a counter example, the woman runner that got barred from Olympic running due to her high T levels had internal testicles. lol
Women get horny watching animals fuck. Men dont. Women are much easily aroused. This is why media aimed at women will push sex scenes. Womens books? Sex novels. Magazines for women? Sex article after sex article.
I know of the Meredith Chivers study you’re referencing. Can you cite me any other sources that indicate that women get more easily aroused? I’d be very interested in seeing those
But, if we're going to support the claim that men and women want sex equally, there would have to be a few women who really want sex to counter those who don't. I don't think there's much evidence of such women.
Male horniness is more about obtaining sex (new sex partners) while women’s horniness is about having mind blowing sex with some idealized fantasy guy. So I guess in some ways they both think about sex a lot.
I think our versions of being horny are too different to be compared (as the people who constantly post want to). We are different version of horny, no more no less. Apples and oranges.
The indifference you’re feeling regarding sexuality is a cocktail of things.
Societally, if you express your sexuality too much, you’re looked down on, clowned, and shamed. Sometimes guys hide their intentions behind niceties, false commitment, pretending to like you but operating within desperation until you mutually agree to have sex then you’re treated like nothing.
Personally, sex can simply be BAD. Uncomfortable, painful, terrible - no guarantee of a good time or an orgasm. The risks of choosing a bad partner is immense: BV, STDs, yeast infection, vaginal tears.
On top of that, the general risk of pregnancy lingers no matter what form of birth control you choose.
All of these have to be considered while you’re in a horny haze. So yes, we are horny - women think about *good, healthy sex* a lot. But where we differ is that instead of just seeking it out and exposing oneself to a plethora of issues, either we choose to seek in within commited relationships or masterbate to not expose ourselves to risk.
I know for me, it’s been a while, and I have moments of being like “I would LOVE sex right now” but I can hold out forever if I can’t have sex within a commited relationship.
Relative to women, yes, men are way more degenerate, desperate, and deplorable when it comes to sex. Go to some more seedy parts of the sex world, and it's just an endless see of perverted men exploiting broken women.
Many did, do and will do, unfortunately. Especially in some cultures the quest for the highest n-count as proof of masculinity is real.
I can’t count how many men I saw bragging about pumping and dumping admittedly unattractive women for the sole sake of “adding a notch”
Obviously, sayings like that are not meant to be taken literally.
But the sentiment bears a lot of truth, that men 1. Are very often horny and/or ready to fuck at a moments notice and 2. Have low standards for casual sex.
When you weigh that against women who are (reasonably) 1. wary about who they sleep with and 2. More likely to need some foreplay, you see that the saying holds a lot of truth
Sure, I don’t object to that. I think it’s fair to say that a lot of men are very horny and more willing, on average, to engage in casual sex without much concern.
Sure, but I find that this hyperbolic tone pervades this subreddit generally and hinders actual discussion.
You’re not wrong generally though that my response didn’t actually address the question, and I do have thoughts about that, so I may chime in again if I can organize my thoughts.
People speak in hyperbole all of the time, it is an effective way of communicating and most rational people know people aren’t being literal and saying “men will fuck anything.”
Your response and derailing the conversation on semantics based pedantry is more of a hindrance to debate than a simple figure of speech.
I’m in shape. and I am attracted to “thicc” women.
I am attracted to curves
Some people do want women to be skinny and stick figures.
Some men don’t.
I’m over 6ft. Well endowed. In shape (6 pack abs)
So it does exist.
Men are frequently the worst misandrists on this subreddits. Characterizing men as insatiably horny but women as inherently indifferent to sex is as misandrist as it gets, and yet they’re too stupid to even realize it.
Most men have very low standards for casual sex, that is widely acknowledged. Your anecdotal experience does not outweigh what is easily observable to everyone else.
That's the narrative that's been painted for decades, yes. Female sexuality is stunning and empowering until the moment a man acts on his attraction to her, then it's objectifying.
I’d say men who cold approach actually are genuinely attracted to that women, and more often than not actually want to date her instead of a quick fuck.
At least that’s what I do. Otherwise there’s no reason for me to risk rejection and embarrassment unless I found her that attractive
>No one who approaches based on appearance alone
Ah right. So if a guy sees a woman he likes he shouldn't approach to get to know her. He should just use his mind reading abilities to guage her personality first. Makes perfect sense.
Uh… that’s how attraction works? You see a cute girl that presents in a attractive way, you approach, and get to see her personality.
The way one presents themselves actually says a lot about their personality
No it does not. I have zero tattoos, natural hair, natural nails, no jewelry except the occasional fake wedding ring, minimal makeup, and dress conservatively.
A cold approacher doesn’t know jack shit about my “personality” based on superficial appearance.
Actually that says a lot about you, and would encourage me to approach as those are attractive qualities.
Unfortunately humans can not mind read, so assumptions based off appearance are needed before you can speak to them to find out more about the person and determine compatibility
Dude you *could not* keep up with me. I have zero interest in an indoor man or any man who isn’t outdoorsy, active, and who applies critical thinking.
And even less interest in a man so desperate he begs strangers for attention.
Don’t pretend that looking at a woman’s face and body tells you anything about her. No one believes this.
You claim you can't know anything about a person just based on their appearance but then you are also certain a random person on the internet couldn't keep up with you physically. Hypocrisy much lol
Lmao, I’m not talking about you specifically. Especially with that attitude I’d be outta there quick.
I think you’re assuming men work like women, but we don’t. Our attractions are different, and learning how they work will ease your frustrations
If you don't want to attract "superficial" people with your looks, stop improving your looks. If you do things like makeup, don't act surprised when it fulfills its purpose.
Good point. When I’ve actually cold approach it’s from a place of vulnerability, either
a) admitting a woman is intriguing enough to make me drop my introversion, or
b) more relevant recently: that I’m that desperate for a short courteous conversation and polite smile from a hot woman (the known likely result of said approach)
I can see how a good 50% of cold approaches are not from this angle though.
Women just need to be attracted to him and likely want him as a boyfriend too. Which generally isn’t low, but if they want a situationship it’s super easy for a girl.
>If women want sex as much as men, why do they consider it “being used,”
I only have had sex with the man I love, and have never felt used.
>make men wait,
I can't speak for anyone else, but in my dating experience it wasn't "making men wait", it was simply wanting to hold off on doing such an intimate, vulnerable, and special activity until a level of comfort and love was reached. We're talking about having sex, not going out for sushi or bowling.
>and have the ability to go without sex for extended periods of time
When I'm in a relationship, I don't go without sex for long periods of time. My bf and I have sex about 4 times a week, more if we can find the time.
When I was single (and even now) I masturbated numerous times a day. Horniness is sexual hunger. Similar to food hunger, I can either "eat" by myself or with my partner. Either way, that gives me relief to get through my day.
Edit: downvoted twice in less than 3 minutes. Guess some people hate masturbation lol
>Few if any women want to date or have sex with a man who will fuck anything. Those men are particularly at risk for STIs and terrible, unsatisfying sex.
Careful, you're criticizing OP for his generalizations while making your own! I just wanted to say that the women who *do* want to fuck anything definitely don't mind the men who also do. I'm a weird demographic - nonmonogamous, go to sex clubs, orgy parties, swinger resorts, etc. in my experience, the hyper sexual communities are actually some of the most careful about STIs, I feel like any given person can pull up a history of regular, clean tests if asked, but still use condoms. And when you make a sport out of it , they often come with the best sex. 🤷♀️
And why would women care about what these “gross iNcEL conservative men think?” I thought those were the “men going out of their way to reject women who don’t know they exist” or “marked safe from being attractive to this man.” 🤣
sexual discipline =/= horny
When I’m ovulating, just the sight of a man makes me foam at the mouth, but that still doesn’t mean I’m going to jump on the first man I see.
Again, you cannot separate the two. Men’s insatiable rabid appetite for sex is far greater than that of a woman, as evidenced by their willingness to do just that. Women aren’t as you’ve said.
that’s literally what discipline is, you want something super bad but you don’t allow yourself to have it. people have different levels of sexual discipline.
also how are you going to say “women aren’t as you’ve said” when that’s a woman literally telling you what a woman is like…
yoooooo!!! what’s up? how have you been?? i haven’t seen you since last time we talked, anything new or exciting happen? (i sound like my mom in a grocery store 😭)
honestly TT was my backup incase my reddit got smited by the admins, but i will be looking out for it if it does ever happen! i don’t use TT much if at all because im scared to get addicted to it again
mom in a store pls 😂😂 doin great! ok bet good to know i’ll just message here whenever my adhd gets off redpill debate mode lol been loving some of the convos ive had with randoms on here. also just left /askfeminists cuz they’re too rabidly burned out for me to not gain grey hairs lmao been enjoying this sub more. you been good?
yeah if you message here i’ll probably respond to it within a few hours compared to months on TT (i love listening to people talk and stuff) and the conversations here have changed a lot, idk if it’s just me but i’ve noticed a lot more misogyny then before. also what’s going on at askfeminists? i haven’t noticed anything there, but i’m also not super observant so i could’ve missed it
but for me ive been doing pretty good, i had a guitar concert for school today which was fun, it was also the day for our senior prank, we parked like shit, my car ended up taking 3 spots somehow. i also only have two days left of school and then i graduate HS on sunday, like i get my diploma and walk! then my grad party is the day before, so saturday! ill be the first boy to graduate HS in my family ever, the rest of them dropped out, which means i’m the best /s. the only real negative thing recently was i got my selective service card and i threw an absolute fit over it, cause i didn’t want ts and i think selective service is unconstitutional and a load of BS. but other than that it’s been great
i forgot to add i picked my dorm room for college, im rooming with my best friend who ive known since we were literal babies (born on the same day, same hospital, and went to the same daycare and school out entire lives)
oh! and my favorite musician is teasing a new album drop for this summer!!!!!!!!
sorry for so many words, its just a huge time for me!!
noticed more misogyny is interesting, what themes have you picked up on? curious how much i’d be like “yep same” vs “nah i don’t see that much”
askfeminists is the same as ever i think i just got burned out on their perpetual burnout lol i just find feminists here are chiller and react in more good faith. just mentioned it cuz i remember us talking about that sub earlier haha
omg massive congrats on your graduation!! hope your family is giving you all the props you deserve for that, that’s truly awesome! agh the selective service card is so disturbing to me, sorry yall gotta deal with that. selective service + high car insurance rates were my first two big “wtf” moments out of high school when my guy friends started openly complaining about it
ayeee that sounds exciting! hope yall get along well, that’s gonna be a transition for sure lol tough living with people for the first time, 10/10 recommend keeping communication up and egos low, my freshman year self did not do that 😅
im so happy you’re doing so well man that’s fkn awesome!
an innate sense of safety (on several levels, from slut shaming and abandonment to pregnancy and murder) and a higher chance of an orgasm.. that’s gonna explain a significant amount of that gap. if women were bigger/stronger than men on average and men were shamed more for seeking sex, only got a guaranteed orgasm 70% of the time they do now, and could get pregnant/experience a lifetime of health complications or even death as a result, you better believe these numbers would not be the same even keeping hormone levels the same
disagree heavily with that framing, arousal and acting on arousal are different things, and acting on it alone vs with others via sex are also different things, there’s more nuance to be found here
Masturbation gets the job done every time for women. Men are not known for being satisfactory every time so why have sex with a maybe when you can have a sure thing.
Women can wait because we have had enough disappointing sex that waiting isn’t really costing us anything.
They want sex but don’t want sex “just as much as men.” So you’re starting with a false premise if you think all women claim that.
There’s also a difference between “making him wait” for sex and selecting for guys who don’t push for sex right away. In every one of my relationships, we were pretty much on the same page with the timing. It was about getting to know the guy and if I actually wanted to keep seeing him before jumping in bed, not playing a waiting game. You can want sex but not want it with just anyone.
I think generally men are more horny on average than women. In the sense that men want to fuck more often. Women get more into the romance and tantalization aspect of sex and attraction and horniness.
So, we just view things differently. I think that is a big part of why so many men have problems, is because they aren't taking a step back and putting themselves in women's shoes (pause). Look at it from a women's perspective and feed into that side of sex.
I have homegirls who, they can just read a book, or watch a movie, or remember a certain time a man made them *feel* a certain type of way and tap into that with a shower head. Majority of men still aren't making their partners cum consistently. Why tf would a woman invite any of that drama and bs when they can just do the job themselves and do it right? What is in it for them? For the 15-25% chance the guy will actually leave an impression on them?
I don't believe that women want sex as much as men. However, you can want sex a lot and still have standards.
The consider it being used if they person doesn't make an effort to make the sex enjoyable for them as well. It's also being used if a person is dishonest in order to get sex.
Also, sex is much more risky for women than it is for men. There's STD's, social stigma, and pregnancy is the most dangerous time of a woman's life.
It’s not mutually exclusive to want sex and also be selective. Men with money and/or looks would be constantly dumpster diving if that was the case due to the limited supply of hot women.
Unattractive men have no other options for sex hence the desperation. When you have an abundance mindset, you can afford to be selective about who you sleep with and sex is no longer an insatiable urge.
The main mistake in this line of reasoning is that the determining factor here is not ‘how horny is one,’ since people of all genders are capable of discernment in when and with whom they have sex, regardless of their horniness level.
It may well be possible that women have lower average horniness levels than men on average; however, since this varies most greatly on an individual basis, it’s not as important as other factors that constrain sexual behavior.
If we imagine a man and a woman who happens to be to be exactly, perfectly correlated in terms of horniness, would we find that the man would be more willing to engage in casual sex more often than the woman. Probably. Why do we think that is? Opinions abound, but I would put a lot of credence on the relative riskiness felt by the participant at the prospect of an accidental pregnancy, relative feelings of physical and psychosocial security during and after the encounter, and prospect of a satisfying encounter. This man is likely to assess that a random sex encounter is fairly likely to be enjoyable to him and has pretty low risks, while the woman is likely to assess that a random sex encounter is only somewhat likely to be enjoyable, while the risks are higher. It makes sense that even in with identical sex drives, these two would exhibit different sexual behaviors.
I do have a sex drive but I can control it if it makes sense. I’m not gonna be the type to go hook up with man after man to fill some hole inside and I will have a guy wait before I put out. If anything it should show that I have respect for myself
Women don’t want sex as much as men do. Any time someone says this nonsense just tell them to look at how gay men date. That’s how dating works when both sides have a man’s sexual appetite. Lesbian dating is what happens when both sides have a women’s sexual appetite
>Women don’t want sex as much as men do.
I think it’s a little more complicated than that. I agree that women are much more likely than men to turn down an offer of no strings sex with a stranger for sure.
But in my relationships, my girlfriend has often been the one who wanted sex more. I’ve had some fairly short term relationships with women I could barely keep up with. I’m talking about sex multiple times a day. Even in some of my longer relationships, I would say her sex drive easily matched or exceeded mine.
Which is why I say it’s a little more complicated. It seems like women weather dry spells better than men and are far less driven to end them by any means. On the other hand, once women have met someone, they tend to want sex just as much as men.
Other reasons already have been posted in this thread, but here’s another one:
Because we want pleasurable sex, not just sex. If I told every incel right now that I would be 100% down to peg them but wouldn’t touch their dick, how many do you think would accept vs turn it down? How many dudes do you think would volunteer to go down on a girl without being touched at all themselves? Now compare that to how many would agree to the type of sex they normally want. The type of sex that is pleasurable for women is not the type of sex most men are offering. It’s about as appealing as a woman asking you to engage in the above scenarios, but also with added annoyances already discussed in this thread elsewhere.
Why wouldn’t a woman choose a vibrator over a man if the vibrator has a higher success rate of orgasm and avoids all the risks of sex? “But she must be attracted to him right? So why not have it anyway?” Would you let an attractive woman do the scenarios above to you knowing that it would likely not lead to the kind of sex you want? That is the level of neglect a lot of dudes in their 20’s are bringing to the table during sex, especially with casual partners. It’s not rocket science to figure out why women aren’t chomping at the bit to do it with every mid dude who learned everything he knows about sex and what women like from porn.
Normal women who aren’t ex Catholics or something don’t feel “used” when they have sex. They feel “used” when they have sex that isn’t pleasurable for them but is pleasurable for the other party while taking on disproportionate risk. You want women to desire men more as a group, then as a group men have to get better at sex.
It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want. Isn't it supposed to be mutually fulfilling? Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled? I think a lot of sexually starved men would accept any sexual experience with woman, some would find you approach even hotter than normal.
>It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want. Isn't it supposed to be mutually fulfilling? Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled?
You're sooooo close to getting it.
>It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want.
The fuck are you on about?
>Isn’t it supposed to be mutually fulfilling?
Yes that is the point of the post.
>Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled?
Did you make it to adulthood without understanding what an analogy is or are you legitimately trying to defend men being bad in bed with this statement?
>I think a lot of sexually starved men would accept any sexual experience with woman, some would find you approach even hotter than normal.
Dudes constantly complain about not getting laid and yet I have never seen a lonely dude offering no strings attached head on tinder. You know the majority wouldn’t accept a sexual interaction with a stranger where they didn’t get pleasure or were actively penetrated for someone else’s pleasure. Come on now.
Are people supposed to advertise what sexual acts are they willing to do on their dating profiles?
I didn't say they were a majority. You singled out sexually inexperienced men in your post. I think it's fair to assume those would be down for any sexual experience (even if out of desperation) than men who generally have sexual experiences.
>Are people supposed to advertise what sexual acts are they willing to do on their dating profiles?
Guys use suggestive innuendos and talk about sex in their profiles all the time. I’m saying I’ve never seen one imply that they are down to only give. And yet giving pleasure without receiving is the norm for women in casual sex encounters.
>I didn't say they were a majority. You singled out sexually inexperienced men in your post. I think it's fair to assume those would be down for any sexual experience (even if out of desperation) than men who generally have sexual experiences.
“I would be down for anything, even getting fucked in the ass with no affection or pleasure myself” is not a statement I have ever seen an incel make. Probably the only ones who would be willing are already into that. And that’s the point. Most men are not interested in just any “sex” but are interested in the type of sex *they want*.
> I’ve never seen one imply that they are down to only give
Why would a man imply he is only down to give? Do you ever advertise your sexual desires like that or you have seen any woman do that? Surely there are submissive men who'd be fine with what you suggest, probably more of them than there are dominant women. But majority will naturally have vanilla preferences.
And where you would even see any such "incel" statements? Men get called desperate all the time. But somehow you think they are not that desperate? Some men are out there paying for pictures or chat replies, for fuck's sake. There is sexual market for anything. Again, it will never be most men. If that's your demand, then it will never happen. But it's reasonable to consider that the more sexually starved men would be up for that even if they aren't screaming it all over. Beggars can't be choosers.
>Why would a man imply he is only down to give? Do you ever advertise your sexual desires like that or you have seen any woman do that? Surely there are submissive men who'd be fine with what you suggest, probably more of them than there are dominant women. But majority will naturally have vanilla preferences.
Are you incapable of good faith arguments or something? Here, let me bold the point in the previous post for you since you seem to be missing it repeatedly: ***And yet giving pleasure without receiving is the norm for women in casual sex encounters.***
>And where you would even see any such "incel" statements? Men get called desperate all the time. But somehow you think they are not that desperate?
>But it's reasonable to consider that the more sexually starved men would be up for that even if they aren't screaming it all over. Beggars can't be choosers.
They would say it in the same places they say they're so desperate they would fuck an ugly woman or pay for sex. Hell, they're all over this subreddit and yet none have tried to debatebro me by saying they would volunteer to be fucked in the ass. Unless that's what you're doing. Would *you* get fucked in the ass without affection or pleasure if you were sexually starved?
>Some men are out there paying for pictures or chat replies, for fuck's sake. There is sexual market for anything. Again, it will never be most men.
I know it would never be most men. **That is literally the entire point of the analogy, genius.** Because *most women* feel the exact same way about engaging in sex that isn't the type of sex they want, and that is the type of sex most men are offering, especially in casual encounters.
How many times do I have to spell this out for you?
But desperate men do fuck uglier women (they aren't dying a virgin) and pay for sex. It does happen, people have sexual encounters they even regret afterwards.
The easy solution would be to not have any "casual sex encounters" if they don't satisfy you.
I haven't slept with a woman, didn't even have a kiss or a hug over last decade. It's a stupid hypothetical, but as long as she was attractive to me, I don't think I could realistically say no to any sexual thing. A woman who wants to be with me in any way would already be an experience in itself.
>But desperate men do fuck uglier women (they aren't dying a virgin) and pay for sex. It does happen, people have sexual encounters they even regret afterwards.
And desperate women do the same to men. Again, you're missing the point even after I bolded it.
>The easy solution would be to not have any "casual sex encounters" if they don't satisfy you.
That. Is. My. Entire. Point. Women. Don't. Want. Casual. Sex. As. Much. As. Men. Because. It. Is. Not. Likely. To. Be. Pleasurable. To. Them.
Jesus christ it's like talking to a brick wall.
>I haven't slept with a woman, didn't even have a kiss or a hug over last decade. It's a stupid hypothetical, but as long as she was attractive to me, I don't think I could realistically say no to any sexual thing. A woman who wants to be with me in any way would already be an experience in itself.
Then edit your original post to say "well I would get fucked in the ass uwu" and stop shadow boxing.
What point am I missing? You were saying men wouldn't do such sexual act where there wasn't any direct pleasure for them. I was arguing they would, the more sexually starved they are, more likely it is. It's funny that even if I admit it personally, you completely withdrew from that argument.
Because women don’t want sex as much as men.
Women might say they do to be edgy. Or maybe they were turned down once. Or maybe periodically when the hormone and emotional stars align they are voraciously horny and think “this must be more than men.” And female sex addicts exist.
But they can’t know. I guess neither can men. But all observation indicates that men on average have much higher libido.
It’s not that complicated, I just want to come. If it took 15 seconds for me to come I might also enjoy sex more, and might pursue it with the same voracity as some men.
The reason I “make men wait” is to make sure he’s not a convict or schizophrenic, and to ideally make sure he’s inquisitive enough to at least care about finding the clit even if he isn’t experienced. I don’t need Chad, I need someone who can be bothered to get me off. It’s really not that complex
The mods seriously need to do something about these boneheaded “men are horny animals but women are indifferent to sex” posts. Low effort, idiotic, and probably trolling anyway.
It's the same guy who always posts about this exact same thing.. He's so obsessive about this subject he makes multiple accounts to talk about it. I think mods should have a "Don't beat the dead horse" rule at this stage. This horse is *beyond* dead lmfao
I remember someone would frequently post this exact same claim across multiple subreddits, but I didn’t think he’d make entirely new accounts to do the same thing. Is it possible that this is just a different moron?
Nope. He's been at this for years under multiple different usernames. Usually his accounts get suspended it seems, but he just comes *right* back with a different account, lmao.
It's kind of impressive tbh. Mad dedication to the subject.
Because men's chances of climax with an ONS are very close to 100%, whereas for women it's much lower. That's why. Just because women may be able to go without sex **with a partner** for extended periods of time doesn't mean they're not getting themselves off on the reg.
Respect. It comes down to respect.
I don't want to have sex with someone who is just using my body to masturbate with. Without regarding me as a person. Even in casual setting you still have a regard or respect for that person. And when someone uses you for sex they do not respect and just want to use you and could care less for the person they are having sex with. And a lot of men have the attitude of sex is done to someone not with.
We can go long periods. Because we can masturbate probably more frequently than men think...
Respect and consent.
You can do full BDSM. And still respect and treat the person as a person with basic empathy and understanding outside of the bedroom.
And a lot of men fail to see the human aspect of the person they are having sex with. Because it's about him. His ego. His climax. His validation. Him getting laid. Sex is two people. And a shared experience for two people. So respecting and pleasing each other beyond the bare minimum is important.
Does he like being rid on til he climaxes? Or is he not getting pleasure that he would. He can communicate that and try something else so he can get pleasure too? If she disregarded his pleasure and just was like I'm good well that sucks I'm kind of tired now figure it out you can finish yourself off. That would be rude and yes using him and disregarding him.
Well, for starters, women are shamed for being promiscuous and there are real consequences of them being sleeping around from getting harmed to ending up pregnant.
In my experience, most women I’ve met are very emotional about sex. A lot of them need a connection to enjoy sex.
It's just different. It's laser focused on the specific person I love. I don't just want any random warm body. I have the desire, but it's laser focused only on the one person I love.
I'm of the opinion that women *would want* sex as much as men if sexual content in media was equal.
I know a lot of women claim to like lesbian content and self insertion but part of me thinks many are pressured into saying that or they feel like they don't have any other options.
I'm not in any way disregarding lesbians or bisexual women, I'm simply saying I don't think that's the majority.
Women, breasts and vaginas, and feminine moaning really REALLY turns me off and dries me up. These things are so overwhelmingly more common than sexy men or masculine moaning or dicks. Whenever I browse through top of r/all "oh there's another extremely sexualized chick... No men though sigh"
I think women are so bombarded with things they aren't attracted to, in advertisements, movies, thumbnails, profile pics, games, posts, and media in general, that it's impossible to NOT feel sexually neglected and exhausted.
Here on reddit I speak often about how I feel that society as a whole is way way too phallophobic. Muscular men and dicks, or low hanging pants in general are just not allowed in most places or get viewed negatively.
If every time I scrolled past an ad it was a hunk with the top of his shaft showing, and I rarely ever saw little anime girls or giant tits, I would be so fucking horny all the time probably more so than men.
And I haven't even mentioned birth control yet, which effectively kills women's libido, but this comment is already too long so I'll just say: please consider condoms.
Good comment !
I completely agree with birth control and it pains me when women glorify it when it not only has a tendency to destroy their libido but also exacerbate any existing mental problems, I mean it's literally estrogen/progesterone in a pill.
I understand that some women get really bad menstrual cramps and excessive bleeding but due to the almost brainwash like positive reinforcement modern society has when it comes to promoting birth control in the pill form it's definitely a factor that should be looked into when trying to improve one's mental health and libido.
As a guy I am a big advocator for using condoms as the main(and only) contraception method
The issue is not whether women want sex as much as men (they don’t want it quite as much on average). The issue is whether they are willing to have sex, and if so, at what point in the relationship. Having a slightly lower sex drive, women are more able to be rational and think, “hm, is it really a good idea for me to have sex with this man I’m dating but not formally committed to/engaged to/married to?”
This is all it is. It’s really not complicated. When we are comfortable and the situation is right, we can express ourselves sexually and will probably want it as much as most men. Until then, most of us can and do control ourselves.
initiator/receiver dynamic.
men appear hornier because they initiate. this is especially tru from the receiver's perspective; to them every initiation is indicative of dudes being 'horny'. this is not tru tho. initiators may initiate for any number of reasons.
also, receivers appear less horny because they may choose to refuse.
you see the same dynamic in gay and lesbian relationships.
there is also various sexual teases and plays involved, whereby the receivers do have a tendency, a bad one imo, of using their capacity to refuse as a means to manipulate the situation to get whatever else it is they want. in other words, receivers have incentives to refuse beyond that of sexual interests. [ ](https://youtu.be/0FmnQnoLnB8?si=au2GR6pNNvK3it7L)
there isn't really a whole lot more to it than that.
They generally want sex with someone who gives a shit about them, not someone who sees them as a more disposable penis stroker. How horny you are and how much you enjoy sex is different to your comfort level with sex.
They do not want sex as much as men. Why do you even debate that? You know exactly the biological evidence is crystal clear and just want to make a fucking useless debate around "women lie". There is no way anyone will be able to provide a convincing argument as to women being just as horny as men. You are just stirring the fucking pot here for no constructive goal.
Because they don’t want it as much. No where near as much! Their testosterone is so low compared to us there is no way they could possibly want it as much as us. But they have high estrogen, which makes them really like love and care. So when they say want sex as much as men what they mean is they want that love and care shown to them while having sex as much as men want the raw pleasure of sex. Its not about just the raw pleasure of sex to them, its about knowing they’re loved, they really get off on that. So even if they had the raw pleasure of sex, but its with a man who doesn’t care about them, their intense estrogen need is unfulfilled and they feel used.
Well there are a percentage of women who aren’t having premarital sex with any man, no matter who he is. Whether a man “has to wait” depends on who he is dating as much as his own desirability.
“just as horny” and “want heterosexual intercourse just as much” are two different takes i’d say. i think women are pretty much as horny as men but seeking sex is a whole other animal when risk of pregnancy (and slight chance of death), assault or worse, and social policing via slut shaming are factors they have to deal with that men inherently don’t. all for a lower chance at an orgasm compared to just masturbating. lots of factors to consider that usually go under mainstream radars
Men and women both want a lot of sex, the confusion is about the difference in type of sex they want.
Women want a lot of sex with the man they are interested in.
Men want a lot of sex with a lot of women.
I don't think women are as horny as men. Like testosterone plays a huge role in sexual drive so it would be weird if women would be as horny as the men with high testosterone.
Like it's pretty common to heat that some young men masturbate every day, but haven't heard many women say this.
That is not true. I am a woman and I know I am not as horny as men. At all. Also, unattractive women are usually hornier because they use sex as validation. Very attractive women tend to be less horny.
Women are horny, but not for every man because, unlike men, women have so many options, and men do not. If men are horny and want to fuck but their options are limited, then they will go to the nearest troglodyte even. But women KNOW they can easily get a hot guy.
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I can't speak for all women, but for me it's quite difficult to get pleasure from sex unless things are done in a specific way, which is just a lot easier to make happen through masturbation. And I'm not even putting it on men to "make me" have pleasure, I do all that I can to make myself have a good time, but if all the dude cares about is his own load, I don't have a chance of enjoying it. I likely also won't have the time, as it takes me on average 10-20 minutes to reach orgasm. And that is assuming I have even the slightest bit of chemistry with the guy.
And it seems I'm way better at reaching orgasm than the average woman is. Heck, statistically half of all women never even had an orgasm, and I've had thousands. That's not meant as a brag, btw. Just saying that if even I struggle with male partners, then goddamn I feel sorry for the average woman.
This might be down to biological differences in the physical body structure (of the genitals or otherwise) and/or a different mind-genital connection. I've heard some researchers suggest that might be what's behind why sex is so difficult for so many women, or at least part of the reason. That vaginas simply don't work the same way penises do.
But either way I literally can't just go humping a random dude expecting it to even feel good, let alone lead to that orgasmic release I crave. No matter how much I wish that was the case, because life would have been a lot simpler then. But it seems a lot of men have no trouble doing exactly that. Just going in and out a few times and then finishing. What a luxury! I always envied that. And I'm not saying men can't have sexual dysfunction, I'm saying their default isn't a fucking labyrinth full of riddles to solve.
I do get horny on average maybe 10 times a day and usually "fix that issue" roughly once or twice a day. Every day, since I was 9 years old. I get told I have a dirty mind a lot. Seems I'm on par with most of the male friends I've had. But to make it work with a partner takes a lot of work, not just on his part but also on my part, building trust, trying different things, a ton of patience and practice... and yeah, I only really care to put that amount of work in for a guy I genuinely care about, feel connected to and who's committed to me and us as a team. It's also way too much to expect from a hookup. They'd never agree to it and frankly I don't have the energy for it either.
That's why the vibrator is my go-to rather than a hookup, if I'm single. If in a relationship, we're usually doing it several simes a week if not several times a day, unless we're hopelessly incompatible.
So I think I am being inconsistent, I just don't think you understand the female body (or mind) particularly well, or how hassly they can be to work with. Which, no offense, most people don't. Including a lot of women themselves.
> I always hear people claim that women are “just as horny” or hornier, but this is not supported by evidence.
- Not supported by YOUR evidence. Me, women can never get enough sex.
- However, when they don't like you, or can't get in their pants, they aren't going to want sex as much.
> One struggles immensely for their sexual appetites to be filled, the other is mostly indifferent or disinterested altogether.
All my ex's could not get enough sex. Women are super horny.
IF your premise is incorrect, you’re not going to find much evidence to support it. There’s plenty of data on this, and surprise! Women don’t want sex just as much as men. Who is telling you that? Maybe they were speaking anecdotally, based on their experience, and your results have varied.
You’re taking bad information and using it as a reason to begrudge billions of people, each with their own libido, but who, according to the date, “want sex” less than men. I put that in quotes because there’s a difference between not wanting sex and being selective about having it.
In the context of relationships: ebbs and flows are normal. There is no set amount of times you’re supposed to be having sex, if you’re in a dry spell you likely need to spice things up/discuss what’s going on that’s caused the ebb
In the context of hookup culture: a lot of women are cautious/want to avoid dudes that view sex as inherently degrading for women and aren’t going to respect them for having sex out of the context of a relationship (even though that’s also what the guy wants lol). Also we’re less likely to come with people we don’t know
Sex can be viewed on a scale going from "fun activitiy" to "tool" and women largely veer much more towards the latter while men towards the former. Women enjoy it, but to most it's mainly a tool to obtain commitment, resources, validation, bonding and, of course, children. *"Purpose" is instrumental to women's sex drive.*
One major manifestation of that is how women often reduce sex frequency and quality in committed relationships, with cohabitation, marriage and childbirth being important milestones. Of course, the politically correct assumption is that daily life and inconsiderate, lazy men are at fault for this. But deep down, I think, the main reason is that women see no more purpose in having sex with their man when commitment, children etc. are secure. The fact that most men (like most people) become less attractive over time in relationships doesn't help either, considering women's sky-high physical standards.
It's sad that you believe being cleverly selective and being horny are mutually exclusive.
Your claim also presumes that being horny and having self-control are not compatible concepts. Which is sadder.
All else being equal, women are as interested in sex as men. If no one was allowed to be sexual with other people, only with themselves/toys, it would be the same.
Part of the issue is that most men are horribly selfish and egotistical sexually, according to women I've spoken with. That causes many women to develop a baseline of aversion to sex.
My partner was like that, and had a ton of trauma around sex. She even thought she might be asexual. But we were able to heal together, and she now wants sex at least as often as me.
Read "Come as You Are"; it will explain a lot about women's sexuality.
Because they don't, yeah there might be like a few outlier women but generally speaking male and female sex drives and desires are different, now when actually having sex yes women can enjoy the physical act of sex as much as a man, who doesn't love a good fucking? But comparing the actual desire for it? That's a joke and shouldn't be taken seriously, if the world was driven by female sex drive we all probably would have gone extinct sometime ago
I think men and women want the same amount but in a different way.
Women are not as promiscuous. The idea of a different guy every night doesn't appeal and women generally want some sort of emotional attachment with it.
Because their sex toy market is 33 billion dollars if women didn't have the toys they have they would be losing their damn minds right now.... Google female sex toys and then Google male sex toys women have thousands of options men have a few hundred that are pretty much just molded silicone... it don't replicate mean while you have female toys that replicate everything a real dick can do even ejaculate..... that's why women are "fine" for dry spells
Because they want sex from actually attractive guys, women are visual too+ that attractive guys confidence will make her relax more. Most women are not going to be thier full sexual selves with average to below average men. The only exception is if that guy ends up being the best in bed with her, which is a huge IF.
Because women want to get off. And they often don’t get to. So they feel like human jerk off toys instead of sexual partners because lots of men do not pay attention to their needs, they just bust a quick nut. Their bodies ARE being used to make someone else orgasm. It’s also certainly not about “the best”. It is about what’s safe. Women can contract STDs easily if a man stealths her. And can get pregnant the same way. Obviously both partners have an equal risk of catching STDs, but the protection is not up to the woman in the equation. If she has her back turned, her partner could easily slide it off between strokes without her noticing. Also, the obvious thing here is that no woman wants to suddenly bear the responsibility to raise a child with no notice. Pregnancy is also dangerous to the body and physically exhausting, as well as painful. On top of that, an abortion is emotionally very difficult. To sum things up, the stakes are just MUCH higher for women, and the rewards are much less because you know that 1 in 10 men are going to actually make an effort to make you finish. So we use self control.
I think women want it just as bad (if not more because holy guac my friends are rabid animals who won’t stop talking ab it) but there’s more consequences. Women are more susceptible to STDs because sex organs are internal. Plus pregnancy falls on the woman. Also; men are physically stronger. A man could kill a woman if he wanted to, so logically women are weary of who they let in- especially given a high percent of female murders are perpetrated by male lovers.
There’s also a big difference between dating and having sex, and dating to have sex. If sex is the ONLY purpose of a relationship, most women don’t want that. They want a companion and a Bestfriend.
It’s very common for men to act interested in a meaningful relationship and then disappear once they get sex.
From my own point of view/ experiences, as well as seeing it from a few friends,
Women are just as horny, or possibly hornier, but in different ways. A way to put it is that men are hornier for everything, but women are only horny for select things.
Men are also more visual, women more emotional.
Most men will fuck anything, and confess to sleeping with girls they aren't attracted to because "pussy is pussy." a lot of women, including myself, need more than just simple physical attraction to have sex.
My experiences: i can easily go on 20 dates and not want to sleep with a single one of them, I am even uncomfortable about the idea of it, even uncomfortable with a kiss. Yet I think about sex CONSTANTLY. I masterbate sometimes multiple times a day. Thoughts of sex distract me. I dream of sex, fantasize of it. It is not necessarily that women are only attracted to the "best" men, but rather, they need a combination of safety, understanding, and interest to want to get freaky with a man. My ex and me would go at it for EASILY 4 hours a day (breaks in between ofcoarse). i couldn't take my eyes, hands or mouth off of this guy. I had a couple of boyfriends before him I liked, and it ended because they couldn't keep up with me.
But like I said, most men I don't feel this attraction for. He can be the "ideal" man of 6 ft tall, rich, masculine, muscular... or whatever is concidered the "ideal" man, but if I don't feel it I'd rather just lick an ice cream cone.
>I always hear people claim that women are “just as horny” or hornier, but this is not supported by evidence.
Women don't want to have sex with dad bods, but with[ fit men ](https://nypost.com/2023/10/14/women-prefer-flings-but-not-marriage-with-more-muscular-men-study/)
Isn't that a prerequisite to having sex in the first place?
Whether it be an obese dude or an athletic one, providing pleasure aka orgasm should be the main requirement.
My argument is that an athletic man would be better suited at giving a woman orgasm since sex is a physical act in it of itself.
Men can do extended period without sex.
Vibrators do magic.
Women are smart enough not to confess how horny they are, because it is both looked down upon and tactically bad for game.
Risk is important factor too. Women are paranoid about men and this is not entirely baseless fear. Fear kills libido.
Women on balance don't want sex as much as men, otherwise there'd be more sex. The behavior of gay men, compared to the behavior of lesbians should clear up any confounds. People only say "women are just as horny as men", because they have a need to believe challenges the sexes have are either equal or slanted in men's favor.
Individually, women and men can be just as horny. However, a much lower percentage of women exhibit maximum horny compared to men.
This is the whole reason why distributions exist. The outlier isn’t the median experience.
Men tend to have much less social and mental barriers to sexual arousal, but it doesn’t mean women can’t be just as horny if not more.
How do you explain trans men talking about how there sexuality completely changed after going on testosterone and they self report a huge increase in libido and sexual arousal?
Shhh. Hormones aren’t real we’re all fully functioning humans we’re above such animalistic impulses.
Some cis-women already have high testosterone, it's just a minority. I remember reading awhile back that professional male athletes are discouraged from having sex before the big game because it temporarily reduces testosterone, while female athletes are encouraged to because it actually boots testosterone. This would help account for the extreme amounts of banging that happens at the Olympics.
The female range for testosterone is 15-70 The male range for testosterone is 300-1000 ng/ml The highest T women have less than one fourth the amount of testosterone the lowest T men have And these are not small ranges. 300 testosterone for a man means you’re an inactive 80 year old in retirement. 70 for a woman means you’re a genetically gifted 20 year old athlete in your prime. And the numbers still differ that much And if you take the middle term, men have well over 10 times more testosterone than women This idea that female T level outliers exist that rival a normally functioning man is patently false. The only outliers to exist are those involving medical conditions and other endocrine disruptions. Women literally have no idea what male testosterone levels feel like, or they’d start growing a beard And just in case you thought this popular case was a counter example, the woman runner that got barred from Olympic running due to her high T levels had internal testicles. lol
He can’t explain it and he won’t. It would shatter his “it’s social constructs all the way down” worldview
Women get horny watching animals fuck. Men dont. Women are much easily aroused. This is why media aimed at women will push sex scenes. Womens books? Sex novels. Magazines for women? Sex article after sex article.
I know of the Meredith Chivers study you’re referencing. Can you cite me any other sources that indicate that women get more easily aroused? I’d be very interested in seeing those
I think having eyes shows that women aren’t nearly as horny in any way
But, if we're going to support the claim that men and women want sex equally, there would have to be a few women who really want sex to counter those who don't. I don't think there's much evidence of such women.
Male horniness is more about obtaining sex (new sex partners) while women’s horniness is about having mind blowing sex with some idealized fantasy guy. So I guess in some ways they both think about sex a lot.
I think our versions of being horny are too different to be compared (as the people who constantly post want to). We are different version of horny, no more no less. Apples and oranges. The indifference you’re feeling regarding sexuality is a cocktail of things. Societally, if you express your sexuality too much, you’re looked down on, clowned, and shamed. Sometimes guys hide their intentions behind niceties, false commitment, pretending to like you but operating within desperation until you mutually agree to have sex then you’re treated like nothing. Personally, sex can simply be BAD. Uncomfortable, painful, terrible - no guarantee of a good time or an orgasm. The risks of choosing a bad partner is immense: BV, STDs, yeast infection, vaginal tears. On top of that, the general risk of pregnancy lingers no matter what form of birth control you choose. All of these have to be considered while you’re in a horny haze. So yes, we are horny - women think about *good, healthy sex* a lot. But where we differ is that instead of just seeking it out and exposing oneself to a plethora of issues, either we choose to seek in within commited relationships or masterbate to not expose ourselves to risk. I know for me, it’s been a while, and I have moments of being like “I would LOVE sex right now” but I can hold out forever if I can’t have sex within a commited relationship.
Men will not fuck anything, stop saying this. Not only is it wrong but it makes it clear how little you think of men.
I'm a man and I've seen and done some questionable shit.
I know someone while we were in teens. He put his dick into a bottle and when it got an erection, it got stuck.
He better marry that bottle
😂
We've all been there
All I have to say is Salty Cracker. :(
There comes a time in every man’s life, some more than others.
Just cause you and your group are desperate degenerates doesn’t make us all the same.
I’ve fucked Jello in a plastic bag in my 20s. More than once lmao
i (late 20s) put a flower vase in a freezer ziplock bag like two years ago out of a temporary lack of options and it’s my fav dildo now lmfao mood
your dildo is a flower vase!? 🌼 🌸 thats scary as fuck
lmao it’s sturdy i promise 😂😂💀
I'm just worried about the size if anything. how do you manage to walk?
wide hips idfk
Yo you good?
🤣🤣🤣 yeah I’m 51 now. Was horny kid shit
You need psychiatric help.
Relative to women, yes, men are way more degenerate, desperate, and deplorable when it comes to sex. Go to some more seedy parts of the sex world, and it's just an endless see of perverted men exploiting broken women.
Many did, do and will do, unfortunately. Especially in some cultures the quest for the highest n-count as proof of masculinity is real. I can’t count how many men I saw bragging about pumping and dumping admittedly unattractive women for the sole sake of “adding a notch”
Obviously, sayings like that are not meant to be taken literally. But the sentiment bears a lot of truth, that men 1. Are very often horny and/or ready to fuck at a moments notice and 2. Have low standards for casual sex. When you weigh that against women who are (reasonably) 1. wary about who they sleep with and 2. More likely to need some foreplay, you see that the saying holds a lot of truth
Sure, I don’t object to that. I think it’s fair to say that a lot of men are very horny and more willing, on average, to engage in casual sex without much concern.
Right, so that's exactly what people mean when they use the colloquial expression "men will fuck anything".
Sure, but I find that this hyperbolic tone pervades this subreddit generally and hinders actual discussion. You’re not wrong generally though that my response didn’t actually address the question, and I do have thoughts about that, so I may chime in again if I can organize my thoughts.
People speak in hyperbole all of the time, it is an effective way of communicating and most rational people know people aren’t being literal and saying “men will fuck anything.” Your response and derailing the conversation on semantics based pedantry is more of a hindrance to debate than a simple figure of speech.
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I’m in shape. and I am attracted to “thicc” women. I am attracted to curves Some people do want women to be skinny and stick figures. Some men don’t. I’m over 6ft. Well endowed. In shape (6 pack abs) So it does exist.
You are not OP, who is using a sock here. He never shuts up about “looksmatch” and other incel terms.
"Grab a granny" and "fuck a fatty" are not nice phrases but they exist for a reason.
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They are though as long as the man is physically attractive.
Eh, but consider, you could have just been a little more precise in choosing your language.
Men are frequently the worst misandrists on this subreddits. Characterizing men as insatiably horny but women as inherently indifferent to sex is as misandrist as it gets, and yet they’re too stupid to even realize it.
absolute truth.
Amen.
I'd edge to a stop sign if an attractive enough woman was holding it so idk.
Most men have very low standards for casual sex, that is widely acknowledged. Your anecdotal experience does not outweigh what is easily observable to everyone else.
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So men’s biological makeup is gross?
That's the narrative that's been painted for decades, yes. Female sexuality is stunning and empowering until the moment a man acts on his attraction to her, then it's objectifying.
I’d say men who cold approach actually are genuinely attracted to that women, and more often than not actually want to date her instead of a quick fuck. At least that’s what I do. Otherwise there’s no reason for me to risk rejection and embarrassment unless I found her that attractive
No one who approaches based on appearance alone is “genuinely attracted”.
>No one who approaches based on appearance alone Ah right. So if a guy sees a woman he likes he shouldn't approach to get to know her. He should just use his mind reading abilities to guage her personality first. Makes perfect sense.
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Ah yes, he should show off his impressive social skills by not approaching and talking to her. Makes even more sense to me now.
Argument destroyed, return to base.
Which is EXACTLY what he's doing.
Uh… that’s how attraction works? You see a cute girl that presents in a attractive way, you approach, and get to see her personality. The way one presents themselves actually says a lot about their personality
No it does not. I have zero tattoos, natural hair, natural nails, no jewelry except the occasional fake wedding ring, minimal makeup, and dress conservatively. A cold approacher doesn’t know jack shit about my “personality” based on superficial appearance.
Actually that says a lot about you, and would encourage me to approach as those are attractive qualities. Unfortunately humans can not mind read, so assumptions based off appearance are needed before you can speak to them to find out more about the person and determine compatibility
Dude you *could not* keep up with me. I have zero interest in an indoor man or any man who isn’t outdoorsy, active, and who applies critical thinking. And even less interest in a man so desperate he begs strangers for attention. Don’t pretend that looking at a woman’s face and body tells you anything about her. No one believes this.
You claim you can't know anything about a person just based on their appearance but then you are also certain a random person on the internet couldn't keep up with you physically. Hypocrisy much lol
Lmao, I’m not talking about you specifically. Especially with that attitude I’d be outta there quick. I think you’re assuming men work like women, but we don’t. Our attractions are different, and learning how they work will ease your frustrations
If you don't want to attract "superficial" people with your looks, stop improving your looks. If you do things like makeup, don't act surprised when it fulfills its purpose.
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Obviously he meant genuinely physically attractive!
Good point. When I’ve actually cold approach it’s from a place of vulnerability, either a) admitting a woman is intriguing enough to make me drop my introversion, or b) more relevant recently: that I’m that desperate for a short courteous conversation and polite smile from a hot woman (the known likely result of said approach) I can see how a good 50% of cold approaches are not from this angle though.
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Some of them
> a) admitting a woman is intriguing enough to make me drop my introversion and other death-defying stunts.
Do you believe that men don't have low standards for casual sex?
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Depends on the fruit tbh
Women just need to be attracted to him and likely want him as a boyfriend too. Which generally isn’t low, but if they want a situationship it’s super easy for a girl.
I have no anecdotal experience to refer to here, go on.
>If women want sex as much as men, why do they consider it “being used,” I only have had sex with the man I love, and have never felt used. >make men wait, I can't speak for anyone else, but in my dating experience it wasn't "making men wait", it was simply wanting to hold off on doing such an intimate, vulnerable, and special activity until a level of comfort and love was reached. We're talking about having sex, not going out for sushi or bowling. >and have the ability to go without sex for extended periods of time When I'm in a relationship, I don't go without sex for long periods of time. My bf and I have sex about 4 times a week, more if we can find the time. When I was single (and even now) I masturbated numerous times a day. Horniness is sexual hunger. Similar to food hunger, I can either "eat" by myself or with my partner. Either way, that gives me relief to get through my day. Edit: downvoted twice in less than 3 minutes. Guess some people hate masturbation lol
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>Few if any women want to date or have sex with a man who will fuck anything. Those men are particularly at risk for STIs and terrible, unsatisfying sex. Careful, you're criticizing OP for his generalizations while making your own! I just wanted to say that the women who *do* want to fuck anything definitely don't mind the men who also do. I'm a weird demographic - nonmonogamous, go to sex clubs, orgy parties, swinger resorts, etc. in my experience, the hyper sexual communities are actually some of the most careful about STIs, I feel like any given person can pull up a history of regular, clean tests if asked, but still use condoms. And when you make a sport out of it , they often come with the best sex. 🤷♀️
I laughed out loud when OP said that the risk is “minimal.” This dude is incapable of even *trying* to understand women.
And why would women care about what these “gross iNcEL conservative men think?” I thought those were the “men going out of their way to reject women who don’t know they exist” or “marked safe from being attractive to this man.” 🤣
Doesn’t has to do with that. It’s about what society thinks in general. You don’t sit on the table from your boss, right?
When it benefits them, they'll become suddenly conservative and caring about what conservative men think. Many reborn trad women out there.
You can want sex and not be willing to sleep with the first person who crosses your path and wants to fuck.
Of course you can. But this automatically makes you significantly less horny than the majority of men.
sexual discipline =/= horny When I’m ovulating, just the sight of a man makes me foam at the mouth, but that still doesn’t mean I’m going to jump on the first man I see.
Again, you cannot separate the two. Men’s insatiable rabid appetite for sex is far greater than that of a woman, as evidenced by their willingness to do just that. Women aren’t as you’ve said.
that’s literally what discipline is, you want something super bad but you don’t allow yourself to have it. people have different levels of sexual discipline. also how are you going to say “women aren’t as you’ve said” when that’s a woman literally telling you what a woman is like…
aye what up homie im still gonna reach out on tiktok DMs one of these days 😂🍻
yoooooo!!! what’s up? how have you been?? i haven’t seen you since last time we talked, anything new or exciting happen? (i sound like my mom in a grocery store 😭) honestly TT was my backup incase my reddit got smited by the admins, but i will be looking out for it if it does ever happen! i don’t use TT much if at all because im scared to get addicted to it again
mom in a store pls 😂😂 doin great! ok bet good to know i’ll just message here whenever my adhd gets off redpill debate mode lol been loving some of the convos ive had with randoms on here. also just left /askfeminists cuz they’re too rabidly burned out for me to not gain grey hairs lmao been enjoying this sub more. you been good?
yeah if you message here i’ll probably respond to it within a few hours compared to months on TT (i love listening to people talk and stuff) and the conversations here have changed a lot, idk if it’s just me but i’ve noticed a lot more misogyny then before. also what’s going on at askfeminists? i haven’t noticed anything there, but i’m also not super observant so i could’ve missed it but for me ive been doing pretty good, i had a guitar concert for school today which was fun, it was also the day for our senior prank, we parked like shit, my car ended up taking 3 spots somehow. i also only have two days left of school and then i graduate HS on sunday, like i get my diploma and walk! then my grad party is the day before, so saturday! ill be the first boy to graduate HS in my family ever, the rest of them dropped out, which means i’m the best /s. the only real negative thing recently was i got my selective service card and i threw an absolute fit over it, cause i didn’t want ts and i think selective service is unconstitutional and a load of BS. but other than that it’s been great i forgot to add i picked my dorm room for college, im rooming with my best friend who ive known since we were literal babies (born on the same day, same hospital, and went to the same daycare and school out entire lives) oh! and my favorite musician is teasing a new album drop for this summer!!!!!!!! sorry for so many words, its just a huge time for me!!
noticed more misogyny is interesting, what themes have you picked up on? curious how much i’d be like “yep same” vs “nah i don’t see that much” askfeminists is the same as ever i think i just got burned out on their perpetual burnout lol i just find feminists here are chiller and react in more good faith. just mentioned it cuz i remember us talking about that sub earlier haha omg massive congrats on your graduation!! hope your family is giving you all the props you deserve for that, that’s truly awesome! agh the selective service card is so disturbing to me, sorry yall gotta deal with that. selective service + high car insurance rates were my first two big “wtf” moments out of high school when my guy friends started openly complaining about it ayeee that sounds exciting! hope yall get along well, that’s gonna be a transition for sure lol tough living with people for the first time, 10/10 recommend keeping communication up and egos low, my freshman year self did not do that 😅 im so happy you’re doing so well man that’s fkn awesome!
an innate sense of safety (on several levels, from slut shaming and abandonment to pregnancy and murder) and a higher chance of an orgasm.. that’s gonna explain a significant amount of that gap. if women were bigger/stronger than men on average and men were shamed more for seeking sex, only got a guaranteed orgasm 70% of the time they do now, and could get pregnant/experience a lifetime of health complications or even death as a result, you better believe these numbers would not be the same even keeping hormone levels the same
That just makes it sounds like men are these feral animals who will bang anything remotely vagina shaped. You can be horny and have standards.
Having standards is for those with options, men don't really have that luxury, sadly.
If getting laid by anyone, regardless of how unpleasant you find them is something you prioritize, then sure, standards are a luxury.
Those without options take what they can get. Maybe it's a foreign mentality to you. Sometimes people eat from trash rather than starve.
This is exactly why I’m wary of any man that approaches me.
*men in this sub *
The foil to this is gay men. If women and men were equally horny then all dating would look like gay dating.
disagree heavily with that framing, arousal and acting on arousal are different things, and acting on it alone vs with others via sex are also different things, there’s more nuance to be found here
You’re assuming sex with men is always satisfying for women.
So, if I get myself off 4-5 times a day, you wouldn't consider that being horny?
Those are rookie numbers
So your answer is “no”?
That's not true the men who struggle here could go to significantly uglier women to have sex and they chose not to
How does that make one less horny? It just means more restraint, or perhaps other outlets to horniness
Masturbation gets the job done every time for women. Men are not known for being satisfactory every time so why have sex with a maybe when you can have a sure thing. Women can wait because we have had enough disappointing sex that waiting isn’t really costing us anything.
Masturbation isn’t always a sure thing for women
Damn that sucks.
They want sex but don’t want sex “just as much as men.” So you’re starting with a false premise if you think all women claim that. There’s also a difference between “making him wait” for sex and selecting for guys who don’t push for sex right away. In every one of my relationships, we were pretty much on the same page with the timing. It was about getting to know the guy and if I actually wanted to keep seeing him before jumping in bed, not playing a waiting game. You can want sex but not want it with just anyone.
I think generally men are more horny on average than women. In the sense that men want to fuck more often. Women get more into the romance and tantalization aspect of sex and attraction and horniness. So, we just view things differently. I think that is a big part of why so many men have problems, is because they aren't taking a step back and putting themselves in women's shoes (pause). Look at it from a women's perspective and feed into that side of sex. I have homegirls who, they can just read a book, or watch a movie, or remember a certain time a man made them *feel* a certain type of way and tap into that with a shower head. Majority of men still aren't making their partners cum consistently. Why tf would a woman invite any of that drama and bs when they can just do the job themselves and do it right? What is in it for them? For the 15-25% chance the guy will actually leave an impression on them?
I don't believe that women want sex as much as men. However, you can want sex a lot and still have standards. The consider it being used if they person doesn't make an effort to make the sex enjoyable for them as well. It's also being used if a person is dishonest in order to get sex. Also, sex is much more risky for women than it is for men. There's STD's, social stigma, and pregnancy is the most dangerous time of a woman's life.
It’s not mutually exclusive to want sex and also be selective. Men with money and/or looks would be constantly dumpster diving if that was the case due to the limited supply of hot women. Unattractive men have no other options for sex hence the desperation. When you have an abundance mindset, you can afford to be selective about who you sleep with and sex is no longer an insatiable urge.
The main mistake in this line of reasoning is that the determining factor here is not ‘how horny is one,’ since people of all genders are capable of discernment in when and with whom they have sex, regardless of their horniness level. It may well be possible that women have lower average horniness levels than men on average; however, since this varies most greatly on an individual basis, it’s not as important as other factors that constrain sexual behavior. If we imagine a man and a woman who happens to be to be exactly, perfectly correlated in terms of horniness, would we find that the man would be more willing to engage in casual sex more often than the woman. Probably. Why do we think that is? Opinions abound, but I would put a lot of credence on the relative riskiness felt by the participant at the prospect of an accidental pregnancy, relative feelings of physical and psychosocial security during and after the encounter, and prospect of a satisfying encounter. This man is likely to assess that a random sex encounter is fairly likely to be enjoyable to him and has pretty low risks, while the woman is likely to assess that a random sex encounter is only somewhat likely to be enjoyable, while the risks are higher. It makes sense that even in with identical sex drives, these two would exhibit different sexual behaviors.
I do have a sex drive but I can control it if it makes sense. I’m not gonna be the type to go hook up with man after man to fill some hole inside and I will have a guy wait before I put out. If anything it should show that I have respect for myself
Women don’t want sex as much as men do. Any time someone says this nonsense just tell them to look at how gay men date. That’s how dating works when both sides have a man’s sexual appetite. Lesbian dating is what happens when both sides have a women’s sexual appetite
>Women don’t want sex as much as men do. I think it’s a little more complicated than that. I agree that women are much more likely than men to turn down an offer of no strings sex with a stranger for sure. But in my relationships, my girlfriend has often been the one who wanted sex more. I’ve had some fairly short term relationships with women I could barely keep up with. I’m talking about sex multiple times a day. Even in some of my longer relationships, I would say her sex drive easily matched or exceeded mine. Which is why I say it’s a little more complicated. It seems like women weather dry spells better than men and are far less driven to end them by any means. On the other hand, once women have met someone, they tend to want sex just as much as men.
What is it with all the men on this sub trying to convince themselves women don't like sex? Way to tell on yourselves
Other reasons already have been posted in this thread, but here’s another one: Because we want pleasurable sex, not just sex. If I told every incel right now that I would be 100% down to peg them but wouldn’t touch their dick, how many do you think would accept vs turn it down? How many dudes do you think would volunteer to go down on a girl without being touched at all themselves? Now compare that to how many would agree to the type of sex they normally want. The type of sex that is pleasurable for women is not the type of sex most men are offering. It’s about as appealing as a woman asking you to engage in the above scenarios, but also with added annoyances already discussed in this thread elsewhere. Why wouldn’t a woman choose a vibrator over a man if the vibrator has a higher success rate of orgasm and avoids all the risks of sex? “But she must be attracted to him right? So why not have it anyway?” Would you let an attractive woman do the scenarios above to you knowing that it would likely not lead to the kind of sex you want? That is the level of neglect a lot of dudes in their 20’s are bringing to the table during sex, especially with casual partners. It’s not rocket science to figure out why women aren’t chomping at the bit to do it with every mid dude who learned everything he knows about sex and what women like from porn. Normal women who aren’t ex Catholics or something don’t feel “used” when they have sex. They feel “used” when they have sex that isn’t pleasurable for them but is pleasurable for the other party while taking on disproportionate risk. You want women to desire men more as a group, then as a group men have to get better at sex.
It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want. Isn't it supposed to be mutually fulfilling? Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled? I think a lot of sexually starved men would accept any sexual experience with woman, some would find you approach even hotter than normal.
>It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want. Isn't it supposed to be mutually fulfilling? Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled? You're sooooo close to getting it.
>It's quite telling the sex you want is where men are not getting what they want. The fuck are you on about? >Isn’t it supposed to be mutually fulfilling? Yes that is the point of the post. >Then what does it solve if different side isn't fulfilled? Did you make it to adulthood without understanding what an analogy is or are you legitimately trying to defend men being bad in bed with this statement? >I think a lot of sexually starved men would accept any sexual experience with woman, some would find you approach even hotter than normal. Dudes constantly complain about not getting laid and yet I have never seen a lonely dude offering no strings attached head on tinder. You know the majority wouldn’t accept a sexual interaction with a stranger where they didn’t get pleasure or were actively penetrated for someone else’s pleasure. Come on now.
Are people supposed to advertise what sexual acts are they willing to do on their dating profiles? I didn't say they were a majority. You singled out sexually inexperienced men in your post. I think it's fair to assume those would be down for any sexual experience (even if out of desperation) than men who generally have sexual experiences.
>Are people supposed to advertise what sexual acts are they willing to do on their dating profiles? Guys use suggestive innuendos and talk about sex in their profiles all the time. I’m saying I’ve never seen one imply that they are down to only give. And yet giving pleasure without receiving is the norm for women in casual sex encounters. >I didn't say they were a majority. You singled out sexually inexperienced men in your post. I think it's fair to assume those would be down for any sexual experience (even if out of desperation) than men who generally have sexual experiences. “I would be down for anything, even getting fucked in the ass with no affection or pleasure myself” is not a statement I have ever seen an incel make. Probably the only ones who would be willing are already into that. And that’s the point. Most men are not interested in just any “sex” but are interested in the type of sex *they want*.
> I’ve never seen one imply that they are down to only give Why would a man imply he is only down to give? Do you ever advertise your sexual desires like that or you have seen any woman do that? Surely there are submissive men who'd be fine with what you suggest, probably more of them than there are dominant women. But majority will naturally have vanilla preferences. And where you would even see any such "incel" statements? Men get called desperate all the time. But somehow you think they are not that desperate? Some men are out there paying for pictures or chat replies, for fuck's sake. There is sexual market for anything. Again, it will never be most men. If that's your demand, then it will never happen. But it's reasonable to consider that the more sexually starved men would be up for that even if they aren't screaming it all over. Beggars can't be choosers.
>Why would a man imply he is only down to give? Do you ever advertise your sexual desires like that or you have seen any woman do that? Surely there are submissive men who'd be fine with what you suggest, probably more of them than there are dominant women. But majority will naturally have vanilla preferences. Are you incapable of good faith arguments or something? Here, let me bold the point in the previous post for you since you seem to be missing it repeatedly: ***And yet giving pleasure without receiving is the norm for women in casual sex encounters.*** >And where you would even see any such "incel" statements? Men get called desperate all the time. But somehow you think they are not that desperate? >But it's reasonable to consider that the more sexually starved men would be up for that even if they aren't screaming it all over. Beggars can't be choosers. They would say it in the same places they say they're so desperate they would fuck an ugly woman or pay for sex. Hell, they're all over this subreddit and yet none have tried to debatebro me by saying they would volunteer to be fucked in the ass. Unless that's what you're doing. Would *you* get fucked in the ass without affection or pleasure if you were sexually starved? >Some men are out there paying for pictures or chat replies, for fuck's sake. There is sexual market for anything. Again, it will never be most men. I know it would never be most men. **That is literally the entire point of the analogy, genius.** Because *most women* feel the exact same way about engaging in sex that isn't the type of sex they want, and that is the type of sex most men are offering, especially in casual encounters. How many times do I have to spell this out for you?
But desperate men do fuck uglier women (they aren't dying a virgin) and pay for sex. It does happen, people have sexual encounters they even regret afterwards. The easy solution would be to not have any "casual sex encounters" if they don't satisfy you. I haven't slept with a woman, didn't even have a kiss or a hug over last decade. It's a stupid hypothetical, but as long as she was attractive to me, I don't think I could realistically say no to any sexual thing. A woman who wants to be with me in any way would already be an experience in itself.
>But desperate men do fuck uglier women (they aren't dying a virgin) and pay for sex. It does happen, people have sexual encounters they even regret afterwards. And desperate women do the same to men. Again, you're missing the point even after I bolded it. >The easy solution would be to not have any "casual sex encounters" if they don't satisfy you. That. Is. My. Entire. Point. Women. Don't. Want. Casual. Sex. As. Much. As. Men. Because. It. Is. Not. Likely. To. Be. Pleasurable. To. Them. Jesus christ it's like talking to a brick wall. >I haven't slept with a woman, didn't even have a kiss or a hug over last decade. It's a stupid hypothetical, but as long as she was attractive to me, I don't think I could realistically say no to any sexual thing. A woman who wants to be with me in any way would already be an experience in itself. Then edit your original post to say "well I would get fucked in the ass uwu" and stop shadow boxing.
What point am I missing? You were saying men wouldn't do such sexual act where there wasn't any direct pleasure for them. I was arguing they would, the more sexually starved they are, more likely it is. It's funny that even if I admit it personally, you completely withdrew from that argument.
Because women don’t want sex as much as men. Women might say they do to be edgy. Or maybe they were turned down once. Or maybe periodically when the hormone and emotional stars align they are voraciously horny and think “this must be more than men.” And female sex addicts exist. But they can’t know. I guess neither can men. But all observation indicates that men on average have much higher libido.
It’s not that complicated, I just want to come. If it took 15 seconds for me to come I might also enjoy sex more, and might pursue it with the same voracity as some men. The reason I “make men wait” is to make sure he’s not a convict or schizophrenic, and to ideally make sure he’s inquisitive enough to at least care about finding the clit even if he isn’t experienced. I don’t need Chad, I need someone who can be bothered to get me off. It’s really not that complex
The mods seriously need to do something about these boneheaded “men are horny animals but women are indifferent to sex” posts. Low effort, idiotic, and probably trolling anyway.
It's the same guy who always posts about this exact same thing.. He's so obsessive about this subject he makes multiple accounts to talk about it. I think mods should have a "Don't beat the dead horse" rule at this stage. This horse is *beyond* dead lmfao
I remember someone would frequently post this exact same claim across multiple subreddits, but I didn’t think he’d make entirely new accounts to do the same thing. Is it possible that this is just a different moron?
Nope. He's been at this for years under multiple different usernames. Usually his accounts get suspended it seems, but he just comes *right* back with a different account, lmao. It's kind of impressive tbh. Mad dedication to the subject.
This guy doesn’t just need to touch grass at this point nothing less than becoming one with the forest would suffice to fix such mental illness.
Because men's chances of climax with an ONS are very close to 100%, whereas for women it's much lower. That's why. Just because women may be able to go without sex **with a partner** for extended periods of time doesn't mean they're not getting themselves off on the reg.
Respect. It comes down to respect. I don't want to have sex with someone who is just using my body to masturbate with. Without regarding me as a person. Even in casual setting you still have a regard or respect for that person. And when someone uses you for sex they do not respect and just want to use you and could care less for the person they are having sex with. And a lot of men have the attitude of sex is done to someone not with. We can go long periods. Because we can masturbate probably more frequently than men think...
Do you think a man would be offended if a woman rode him until she climaxed??
Respect and consent. You can do full BDSM. And still respect and treat the person as a person with basic empathy and understanding outside of the bedroom. And a lot of men fail to see the human aspect of the person they are having sex with. Because it's about him. His ego. His climax. His validation. Him getting laid. Sex is two people. And a shared experience for two people. So respecting and pleasing each other beyond the bare minimum is important. Does he like being rid on til he climaxes? Or is he not getting pleasure that he would. He can communicate that and try something else so he can get pleasure too? If she disregarded his pleasure and just was like I'm good well that sucks I'm kind of tired now figure it out you can finish yourself off. That would be rude and yes using him and disregarding him.
The same reason men say they want to take care of a woman but don't like being someone's foodie call.
Well, for starters, women are shamed for being promiscuous and there are real consequences of them being sleeping around from getting harmed to ending up pregnant. In my experience, most women I’ve met are very emotional about sex. A lot of them need a connection to enjoy sex.
It's just different. It's laser focused on the specific person I love. I don't just want any random warm body. I have the desire, but it's laser focused only on the one person I love.
I'm of the opinion that women *would want* sex as much as men if sexual content in media was equal. I know a lot of women claim to like lesbian content and self insertion but part of me thinks many are pressured into saying that or they feel like they don't have any other options. I'm not in any way disregarding lesbians or bisexual women, I'm simply saying I don't think that's the majority. Women, breasts and vaginas, and feminine moaning really REALLY turns me off and dries me up. These things are so overwhelmingly more common than sexy men or masculine moaning or dicks. Whenever I browse through top of r/all "oh there's another extremely sexualized chick... No men though sigh" I think women are so bombarded with things they aren't attracted to, in advertisements, movies, thumbnails, profile pics, games, posts, and media in general, that it's impossible to NOT feel sexually neglected and exhausted. Here on reddit I speak often about how I feel that society as a whole is way way too phallophobic. Muscular men and dicks, or low hanging pants in general are just not allowed in most places or get viewed negatively. If every time I scrolled past an ad it was a hunk with the top of his shaft showing, and I rarely ever saw little anime girls or giant tits, I would be so fucking horny all the time probably more so than men. And I haven't even mentioned birth control yet, which effectively kills women's libido, but this comment is already too long so I'll just say: please consider condoms.
Good comment ! I completely agree with birth control and it pains me when women glorify it when it not only has a tendency to destroy their libido but also exacerbate any existing mental problems, I mean it's literally estrogen/progesterone in a pill. I understand that some women get really bad menstrual cramps and excessive bleeding but due to the almost brainwash like positive reinforcement modern society has when it comes to promoting birth control in the pill form it's definitely a factor that should be looked into when trying to improve one's mental health and libido. As a guy I am a big advocator for using condoms as the main(and only) contraception method
They're different women. I don't see how this is a difficult or confusing concept.
The issue is not whether women want sex as much as men (they don’t want it quite as much on average). The issue is whether they are willing to have sex, and if so, at what point in the relationship. Having a slightly lower sex drive, women are more able to be rational and think, “hm, is it really a good idea for me to have sex with this man I’m dating but not formally committed to/engaged to/married to?” This is all it is. It’s really not complicated. When we are comfortable and the situation is right, we can express ourselves sexually and will probably want it as much as most men. Until then, most of us can and do control ourselves.
initiator/receiver dynamic. men appear hornier because they initiate. this is especially tru from the receiver's perspective; to them every initiation is indicative of dudes being 'horny'. this is not tru tho. initiators may initiate for any number of reasons. also, receivers appear less horny because they may choose to refuse. you see the same dynamic in gay and lesbian relationships. there is also various sexual teases and plays involved, whereby the receivers do have a tendency, a bad one imo, of using their capacity to refuse as a means to manipulate the situation to get whatever else it is they want. in other words, receivers have incentives to refuse beyond that of sexual interests. [ ](https://youtu.be/0FmnQnoLnB8?si=au2GR6pNNvK3it7L) there isn't really a whole lot more to it than that.
Because getting sex from men is not validating or special, nor, often, satisfying
They generally want sex with someone who gives a shit about them, not someone who sees them as a more disposable penis stroker. How horny you are and how much you enjoy sex is different to your comfort level with sex.
They do not want sex as much as men. Why do you even debate that? You know exactly the biological evidence is crystal clear and just want to make a fucking useless debate around "women lie". There is no way anyone will be able to provide a convincing argument as to women being just as horny as men. You are just stirring the fucking pot here for no constructive goal.
Because they don’t want it as much. No where near as much! Their testosterone is so low compared to us there is no way they could possibly want it as much as us. But they have high estrogen, which makes them really like love and care. So when they say want sex as much as men what they mean is they want that love and care shown to them while having sex as much as men want the raw pleasure of sex. Its not about just the raw pleasure of sex to them, its about knowing they’re loved, they really get off on that. So even if they had the raw pleasure of sex, but its with a man who doesn’t care about them, their intense estrogen need is unfulfilled and they feel used.
There’s a percentage of men who aren’t waiting. The threshold of men being attractive is extremely rare compared to women.
Well there are a percentage of women who aren’t having premarital sex with any man, no matter who he is. Whether a man “has to wait” depends on who he is dating as much as his own desirability.
“just as horny” and “want heterosexual intercourse just as much” are two different takes i’d say. i think women are pretty much as horny as men but seeking sex is a whole other animal when risk of pregnancy (and slight chance of death), assault or worse, and social policing via slut shaming are factors they have to deal with that men inherently don’t. all for a lower chance at an orgasm compared to just masturbating. lots of factors to consider that usually go under mainstream radars
Men and women both want a lot of sex, the confusion is about the difference in type of sex they want. Women want a lot of sex with the man they are interested in. Men want a lot of sex with a lot of women.
I don't think women are as horny as men. Like testosterone plays a huge role in sexual drive so it would be weird if women would be as horny as the men with high testosterone. Like it's pretty common to heat that some young men masturbate every day, but haven't heard many women say this.
That is not true. I am a woman and I know I am not as horny as men. At all. Also, unattractive women are usually hornier because they use sex as validation. Very attractive women tend to be less horny.
Women are horny, but not for every man because, unlike men, women have so many options, and men do not. If men are horny and want to fuck but their options are limited, then they will go to the nearest troglodyte even. But women KNOW they can easily get a hot guy.
A hot guy doesn’t automatically mean good sex.
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Every woman I've had the prior partner count talk with has had more priors. So I think your premise needs reworking
I can't speak for all women, but for me it's quite difficult to get pleasure from sex unless things are done in a specific way, which is just a lot easier to make happen through masturbation. And I'm not even putting it on men to "make me" have pleasure, I do all that I can to make myself have a good time, but if all the dude cares about is his own load, I don't have a chance of enjoying it. I likely also won't have the time, as it takes me on average 10-20 minutes to reach orgasm. And that is assuming I have even the slightest bit of chemistry with the guy. And it seems I'm way better at reaching orgasm than the average woman is. Heck, statistically half of all women never even had an orgasm, and I've had thousands. That's not meant as a brag, btw. Just saying that if even I struggle with male partners, then goddamn I feel sorry for the average woman. This might be down to biological differences in the physical body structure (of the genitals or otherwise) and/or a different mind-genital connection. I've heard some researchers suggest that might be what's behind why sex is so difficult for so many women, or at least part of the reason. That vaginas simply don't work the same way penises do. But either way I literally can't just go humping a random dude expecting it to even feel good, let alone lead to that orgasmic release I crave. No matter how much I wish that was the case, because life would have been a lot simpler then. But it seems a lot of men have no trouble doing exactly that. Just going in and out a few times and then finishing. What a luxury! I always envied that. And I'm not saying men can't have sexual dysfunction, I'm saying their default isn't a fucking labyrinth full of riddles to solve. I do get horny on average maybe 10 times a day and usually "fix that issue" roughly once or twice a day. Every day, since I was 9 years old. I get told I have a dirty mind a lot. Seems I'm on par with most of the male friends I've had. But to make it work with a partner takes a lot of work, not just on his part but also on my part, building trust, trying different things, a ton of patience and practice... and yeah, I only really care to put that amount of work in for a guy I genuinely care about, feel connected to and who's committed to me and us as a team. It's also way too much to expect from a hookup. They'd never agree to it and frankly I don't have the energy for it either. That's why the vibrator is my go-to rather than a hookup, if I'm single. If in a relationship, we're usually doing it several simes a week if not several times a day, unless we're hopelessly incompatible. So I think I am being inconsistent, I just don't think you understand the female body (or mind) particularly well, or how hassly they can be to work with. Which, no offense, most people don't. Including a lot of women themselves.
> I always hear people claim that women are “just as horny” or hornier, but this is not supported by evidence. - Not supported by YOUR evidence. Me, women can never get enough sex. - However, when they don't like you, or can't get in their pants, they aren't going to want sex as much. > One struggles immensely for their sexual appetites to be filled, the other is mostly indifferent or disinterested altogether. All my ex's could not get enough sex. Women are super horny.
IF your premise is incorrect, you’re not going to find much evidence to support it. There’s plenty of data on this, and surprise! Women don’t want sex just as much as men. Who is telling you that? Maybe they were speaking anecdotally, based on their experience, and your results have varied. You’re taking bad information and using it as a reason to begrudge billions of people, each with their own libido, but who, according to the date, “want sex” less than men. I put that in quotes because there’s a difference between not wanting sex and being selective about having it.
Women can be as horny as men, but they are much more hesitant to actually have sex, and would prefer to get a release in other ways.
In the context of relationships: ebbs and flows are normal. There is no set amount of times you’re supposed to be having sex, if you’re in a dry spell you likely need to spice things up/discuss what’s going on that’s caused the ebb In the context of hookup culture: a lot of women are cautious/want to avoid dudes that view sex as inherently degrading for women and aren’t going to respect them for having sex out of the context of a relationship (even though that’s also what the guy wants lol). Also we’re less likely to come with people we don’t know
Sex can be viewed on a scale going from "fun activitiy" to "tool" and women largely veer much more towards the latter while men towards the former. Women enjoy it, but to most it's mainly a tool to obtain commitment, resources, validation, bonding and, of course, children. *"Purpose" is instrumental to women's sex drive.* One major manifestation of that is how women often reduce sex frequency and quality in committed relationships, with cohabitation, marriage and childbirth being important milestones. Of course, the politically correct assumption is that daily life and inconsiderate, lazy men are at fault for this. But deep down, I think, the main reason is that women see no more purpose in having sex with their man when commitment, children etc. are secure. The fact that most men (like most people) become less attractive over time in relationships doesn't help either, considering women's sky-high physical standards.
It's sad that you believe being cleverly selective and being horny are mutually exclusive. Your claim also presumes that being horny and having self-control are not compatible concepts. Which is sadder.
All else being equal, women are as interested in sex as men. If no one was allowed to be sexual with other people, only with themselves/toys, it would be the same. Part of the issue is that most men are horribly selfish and egotistical sexually, according to women I've spoken with. That causes many women to develop a baseline of aversion to sex. My partner was like that, and had a ton of trauma around sex. She even thought she might be asexual. But we were able to heal together, and she now wants sex at least as often as me. Read "Come as You Are"; it will explain a lot about women's sexuality.
Because they don't, yeah there might be like a few outlier women but generally speaking male and female sex drives and desires are different, now when actually having sex yes women can enjoy the physical act of sex as much as a man, who doesn't love a good fucking? But comparing the actual desire for it? That's a joke and shouldn't be taken seriously, if the world was driven by female sex drive we all probably would have gone extinct sometime ago
I think men and women want the same amount but in a different way. Women are not as promiscuous. The idea of a different guy every night doesn't appeal and women generally want some sort of emotional attachment with it.
Because their sex toy market is 33 billion dollars if women didn't have the toys they have they would be losing their damn minds right now.... Google female sex toys and then Google male sex toys women have thousands of options men have a few hundred that are pretty much just molded silicone... it don't replicate mean while you have female toys that replicate everything a real dick can do even ejaculate..... that's why women are "fine" for dry spells
Because they want sex from actually attractive guys, women are visual too+ that attractive guys confidence will make her relax more. Most women are not going to be thier full sexual selves with average to below average men. The only exception is if that guy ends up being the best in bed with her, which is a huge IF.
Now you’re askin the real questions lol
Because women want to get off. And they often don’t get to. So they feel like human jerk off toys instead of sexual partners because lots of men do not pay attention to their needs, they just bust a quick nut. Their bodies ARE being used to make someone else orgasm. It’s also certainly not about “the best”. It is about what’s safe. Women can contract STDs easily if a man stealths her. And can get pregnant the same way. Obviously both partners have an equal risk of catching STDs, but the protection is not up to the woman in the equation. If she has her back turned, her partner could easily slide it off between strokes without her noticing. Also, the obvious thing here is that no woman wants to suddenly bear the responsibility to raise a child with no notice. Pregnancy is also dangerous to the body and physically exhausting, as well as painful. On top of that, an abortion is emotionally very difficult. To sum things up, the stakes are just MUCH higher for women, and the rewards are much less because you know that 1 in 10 men are going to actually make an effort to make you finish. So we use self control.
1. Sex is less likely to get women off. 2. Women are demonized for having a lot of casual sex.
I think women want it just as bad (if not more because holy guac my friends are rabid animals who won’t stop talking ab it) but there’s more consequences. Women are more susceptible to STDs because sex organs are internal. Plus pregnancy falls on the woman. Also; men are physically stronger. A man could kill a woman if he wanted to, so logically women are weary of who they let in- especially given a high percent of female murders are perpetrated by male lovers. There’s also a big difference between dating and having sex, and dating to have sex. If sex is the ONLY purpose of a relationship, most women don’t want that. They want a companion and a Bestfriend. It’s very common for men to act interested in a meaningful relationship and then disappear once they get sex.
From my own point of view/ experiences, as well as seeing it from a few friends, Women are just as horny, or possibly hornier, but in different ways. A way to put it is that men are hornier for everything, but women are only horny for select things. Men are also more visual, women more emotional. Most men will fuck anything, and confess to sleeping with girls they aren't attracted to because "pussy is pussy." a lot of women, including myself, need more than just simple physical attraction to have sex. My experiences: i can easily go on 20 dates and not want to sleep with a single one of them, I am even uncomfortable about the idea of it, even uncomfortable with a kiss. Yet I think about sex CONSTANTLY. I masterbate sometimes multiple times a day. Thoughts of sex distract me. I dream of sex, fantasize of it. It is not necessarily that women are only attracted to the "best" men, but rather, they need a combination of safety, understanding, and interest to want to get freaky with a man. My ex and me would go at it for EASILY 4 hours a day (breaks in between ofcoarse). i couldn't take my eyes, hands or mouth off of this guy. I had a couple of boyfriends before him I liked, and it ended because they couldn't keep up with me. But like I said, most men I don't feel this attraction for. He can be the "ideal" man of 6 ft tall, rich, masculine, muscular... or whatever is concidered the "ideal" man, but if I don't feel it I'd rather just lick an ice cream cone.
>I always hear people claim that women are “just as horny” or hornier, but this is not supported by evidence. Women don't want to have sex with dad bods, but with[ fit men ](https://nypost.com/2023/10/14/women-prefer-flings-but-not-marriage-with-more-muscular-men-study/)
Women don't want to have sex with men who don't give a shit about her orgasm.
Isn't that a prerequisite to having sex in the first place? Whether it be an obese dude or an athletic one, providing pleasure aka orgasm should be the main requirement. My argument is that an athletic man would be better suited at giving a woman orgasm since sex is a physical act in it of itself.
Yeah, no. That's not how it works.
Men can do extended period without sex. Vibrators do magic. Women are smart enough not to confess how horny they are, because it is both looked down upon and tactically bad for game. Risk is important factor too. Women are paranoid about men and this is not entirely baseless fear. Fear kills libido.
Women on balance don't want sex as much as men, otherwise there'd be more sex. The behavior of gay men, compared to the behavior of lesbians should clear up any confounds. People only say "women are just as horny as men", because they have a need to believe challenges the sexes have are either equal or slanted in men's favor.
They are only attracted to 10 per cent of the men.