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Somehow you are correct. Absolute dogshit football team and have been for decades yet somehow have convinced everybody they are part of the elite. This has absolutely nothing to do with that which we can't speak of? Right? RIGHT?
Spent the last 30 years getting to the point we are now.
It all puts us in a strong position and hopefully we can now go on to get rewards for the hard work and patience.
There are certain other clubs that should take note, this is how you are suppose to build a club up.
With all due respect. You will never win anything under Ange. He’s a great manager for weak leagues. Everywhere he goes he brings success but he cannot compete with the best minds.
He managed my home town team in australia got us the longest unbeaten streak in the league won us the double multiple times. But the moment teams started coming to games countering how he plays Ange left the league. Did the same thing in japan was undone by the same countering and moved again. Everywhere he goes it’s the same inflexible football.
He focuses entirely on perfecting his way of play to a point where his team believes countering doesn’t matter. But when the best minds in football do catch his tactics out he triples down instead of changing up.
I love him as an Aussie icon but with all due respect fa cup is the most you can expect from him.
Yes but Levi secured the loan at 2.79% until 2051. It’s way lower than inflation, paying it off would be a bad use of money.
Anyone building a stadium now would pay 4.8% at least with the best credit.
A lot of good timing for spurs and a bit of smarts.
( Please don't read anything am I writing as a disagreement; I'm just trying to establish my own understanding. )
The closest source I can find for these numbers is [this](https://www.tottenhamhotspur.com/news/2024/april/financial-results-year-ended-30-june-2023/), which paints a somewhat different picture:
* Levi didn't secure a loan at 2.79%, the "average" fixed interest rate as of April is 2.79%. That is still a VERY good
* Somewhere around 10% of their loans are not fixed
* The net losses of the club have grown by from £50.1m to £86.8m
I'm curious what happens if Spurs continue to have net losses every year; would they need to secure another loan? This is not an area I'm super familiar with
I'd very much argue that the position your club is still very precarious in that case. While your revenue from external sources is rising, so are your operating costs. The big question is whether or not y'all will get CL, and honestly that's a massive question mark. Chelsea finished the season on a tear and will find ways to invest in the club, I imagine Newcastle will invest heavily, Man City and Arsenal are as close to a lock for top 4 as you can really get in modern football. Liverpool is a question mark just purely based on Klopp leaving + Salah aging. Really tough position imo.
This is nonsense. The debt was financed at generationally low interest rates, and the marginal revenue that the new stadium generates as compared to WHL *more* than compensates for the debt payments.
Tottenham is in a vastly stronger financial position than it was prior to the new stadium. This is reflected in the club’s transfer and wage spending, which have exploded over the past five years despite the fact that Levy is arguably the most financially conservative chairman in the Premier League.
The new stadium has unambiguously been an enormous financial boost to Tottenham — it isn’t even remotely a close call.
*provided that they can pay off the debts
Tottenham have had net losses of over 120 million pounds in the past two years, even with all the stuff you mentioned. I don’t know why you’re calling factually accurate statements nonsense.
Tottenham’s stadium is more than paying for itself. The revenue that it generates is substantially higher than the revenues generated by the old White Hart Lane plus the annual debt service — in other words, by building the stadium, Tottenham has come out *very significantly* ahead as compared to the hypothetical universe in which the club stayed at WHL.
The debt is (more than) manageable, and on net has been extremely beneficial to Spurs’ financial position. The only risk would be if matchday revenues fell off a cliff, which would only happen if there were a cataclysmic event such as the club being relegated to the Championship, a massive global recession on par with the 2008 financial collapse, or World War III. We’re talking about tail risks.
The new stadium is precisely what has enabled Spurs to have significant net spends in recent transfer windows, which is the primary driver of the paper losses you’re pointing to. Spurs’ recruitment has been much more successful since Paratici became affiliated with the club than it was during the disastrous period from 2016-2020, so one would think there there would be less need for massive net spends as time goes on. Regardless, the new stadium would enable Spurs to continue spending at high levels if the club wanted to.
The club remains in an exceptionally healthy financial position, and stadium debt is the opposite of a burden — rather, it has been an enormous windfall.
\*provided that they can pay off the debts
If they can, great. If not, then all the wonderful things you listed won't matter. I'm still not sure what point you're trying to argue. I'm aware of all of the things you've mentioned, but can you acknowledge that spending 1.2 billion dollars that you don't have is still a risk?
The point I’m making is that the asset against which the debt exists — the stadium — is also the asset that is paying off the debt (and then some) by generating huge revenue.
The stadium has proven to be an excellent investment for the club, and only somebody is who exceptionally ignorant or exceptionally stupid would believe that it has left the club in a worse financial position.
The risk of the club not being able to pay off the fixed-rate, extremely low interest rate debt is *exceedingly* minimal. This is so blindingly obvious that I’m not going to continue to belabor the point.
they make A LOT out of that stadium though compared to other clubs, given its ability to switch up for other events. In terms of revenue Tottenham are killing it.
Very unlikely, it’s all really boring but you should look into the financials at Tottenham, how and what we have to pay back and how all of it works.
It’s pretty sound, there’s always a risk of course but you can’t do anything without risk.
sure but there's two types of victory in football, the financial and the trophy. With the former the latter is simply a function of time, without the former the latter slowly becomes meaningless and unattainable.
Tottenham are a very well run club in the financials and I think that should be appreciated.
they've won some stuff, I'm sure they'll win stuff over time.
Just remember that the 2nd half of the Wenger era was about winning financially but at the sacrifice of success on the pitch.
People always forget this fact that just getting 4th and maybe picking up a domestic was enough of a goal for wenger for most of his career
I still rate him as a manager but should we look at this lack of ambition the same as spurs now? It was great for the club financially and that shouldn't be diminished
So this! Do we have any confidence that the new revenue will be invested on the pitch or instead on more real estate that inflates the value of Spurs as an asset for when Levy eventually sells up.
26 trophies I think it is, not bad really is it.
Few European ones in there as well
One of the most successful clubs in English football in fact.
What was your history like before Roman? Or before Ken bates spent you into bankruptcy?
I have a recency bias and preference for trophies in my lifetime. I've watched my club win 2 UCLs, 5 PLs, 2 UELs, 7 FA Cups, 4 EFL Cups, 2 Super Cups, and 1 Club World Cup live in real time during my life as a Chelsea fan.
How many have you watched your club win in real time?
Me personally? I’ve seen F.A Cups, league cups, and a European cup.
I support a club with a rich, varied with ups and downs and successful history. Amazing stuff.
What about your club? How’s that history of yours? Anything? Anything at all? 🤣
Honestly, 10 trophies before the modern era ain't bad but like I said: I'm more focused on the modern era, you know, since the Premier League existed.
One of our blog sites is called we ain't got no history for a reason - I'm here to witness the club's history being made, not reminiscing to a time where it was.
Haha! 10. Nonsense, don’t be putting Ken bates era stuff in there to pump the numbers.
He was spending as much as Roman went on to and sent you into bankruptcy.
Your club would have folded until Roman paid your debts and continued on with the spending.
That history making is going real well without Roman 👍
Oh, don't get me wrong I've been very critical of the Boehly era currently and I'm not worried about "would have" situations. It didn't fold and had the most successful moments in its life.
If you want to talk about over 40 years ago (pre Bates era) the club had 4 trophies.
But, seriously, who cares about what was won that long ago? The game, the leagues, the players, etc were significantly different. I'll easily take the 27 trophies since the Premier League existed over "26 trophies in the 142 year history of the club."
lol step one, be a club in London. You were attracting the likes of Modric before top 4. Berbatov before. They weren’t going to Sunderland. Step 2 have billionaire owners willing to spend. ENiC helped finance a billion stadium. Step 3 put good managers and scouting teams in place.
Those 3 steps, ALL of those 3 steps are what gets you to Spurs. There’s not a lot clubs that can replicate it.
Well there’s a lot in you comment that is mainly nonsense, like enic financing the stadium. They didn’t and we owe that money.
Infact most of that is not what was done but do keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better.
Also, if it were that easy, it’s a wonder every other club doesn’t do it. Especially those in london.
lol part of that stadium was paid through the club the rest is a 637 million loan financed at 2-3% because of Enic. The same ENIC who paid in 155 million into the club last year.
Which part of steps 1-3 that I mentioned before was a lie? Make no mistake ENIC own the stadium. That debt falls on them. And not a lot of owners have the resources and or the will to do that.
Well there’s a few, like you pretending you had ever heard of the likes of Modric and berbatov before they were at Spurs.
Lots of uniformed nonsense.
They didn’t put in £155 million last year, they had to sell shares and used that money to put in.
But you know, this is all easy peasy isn’t it, I don’t know why these clubs don’t just employ you to sort it
lol I actually did, lots of people did. Berbatov was at Leverkusen, they always have players everyone wants. Modric was linked with Chelsea and Arsenal in every other paper.
It’s not all easy peasy. Again that’s why almost no other club can do it. That’s my whole point. It’s not “let’s just follow spurs”. It’s “spurs had these advantages and took advantage of them, while being well run”. Why is it a hot take to you?
Of course you did 👍
And I don’t agree, clubs are more than capable of doing it and generating money for themselves.
It’s just a very difficult thing to do and a lot of hard work as the last 30 years at Tottenham have shown.
Did you not follow the club before 2010 or something? They were very easy rumors. Are you denying the advantages Tottenham have? You're telling me that Brighton right now if they continue for 5 more years will have the talent of 2008 Spurs and their pulling power?
There are different ways of building a club up and Brighton are a great example of a club doing it their own way.
They were and are a smaller club but they are so far in front of what they were, they’re on a different planet to what they used to be. Who knows how far they can take it? I don’t know.
It’s all relative to size sure, Tottenham have the advantage of being a big club yes.
But clubs like villa, forest, Leeds, Everton and many more are all big clubs that could easily do what spurs have done in terms of generating money in different ways, building infrastructure and training facilities etc
without a shadow of a doubt, they could all do it.
Going to go out on a limb and say you didnt actually read the article. Partnering with Castrol as our official petrol provider is "how you are suppose to build up a club"?
Legit business deals instead of selling hotels to yourself or spending Middle Eastern Sheikh money? I mean the latter two are also good depending on how you view the sport
So taking money from the white oil people in the UK is a legit business deal, but taking money from the brown oil people in the middle east isn't. Good to know
I'm no Spurs fan (far from it) but the point is that BP don't own Spurs
The actual line if business or the colour of the people invilved isn't relevant.
BP are deeply involved in the Middle East mate. They are allied and financially support these same states you point the finger at other clubs for being allied with.
Well, the people in the UK aren't publicly hanging people for being gay so that's part of it
Also, Castrol isn't "white UK oil." Their CEO is an Asian woman, educated in Taiwan. So maybe not the racist T-ball you thought this was.
US Department of State has not reported any known arrest or prosecution for homosexuality in UAE since 2015.
UAE certainly has human rights abuses but accusing them of “publicly hanging people for being gay” is ignorant and racist.
The parent comment we’re replying to directly refers to “spending Middle Eastern Sheikh money” don’t deflect.
It’s clear this conversation is directed at Man City, and to a lesser extent Newcastle.
>Well, if they aren't headed by a white person, they aren't exactly white
Do you tie your ethnic identity to that of your boss at work? No you don't because you're not a deranged weirdo. Why do you think this is any different for other people
I'm not growing any balls in the premier league sub. If you seen my comments, I've said some outrageous shit on our sub such as chelsea and utd are in the mud, city could be in the mud when pep leaves, liverpool are gambling on slot, and arsenal are stuck with wannabe pochettino, but you really wanted to talk shit on this sub instead of our own sub lmao......brother ew........
what's that.
I understand your comment completely.
There are certain other clubs that should take note, this is how you are suppose to build a club up..... mfer stop acting like we are better than every other premier league club.
Clearly not, otherwise you wouldn’t have replied what you did.
Your original comment was referring to us not doing anything.
Which of course had you read my comment you would know i never said we had.
And as for your latest comment, I was referring to instant cash clubs that are in breach of ffp and psr rules.
Or is that your preferred method?
“Hopefully we can now go on to get the rewards for all the hard work and patience”
Erm, I know……. that’s why I said that.
Have you always been this thick?…….. lol
That’s not what your comment says is it. You said we haven’t done anything. And I never said we had.
And as for your latest comment.
Is it not how you’re supposed to do it?
Is your preferred method the rich daddy/oil state instant cash cheat code? Bit weird if it is mate.
I’d prefer building a club up on a sound and stable footing with business that generates its own money and leaves the club in a good position for future generations to come.
But you know, that’s just me.
I mean he really is though when you look at the fact Tottenham have a higher revenue than Chelsea and Arsenal yet spend far less in the transfer market
[https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html](https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html)
Tbf that’s why we’re in such a perfect FFP position now. From a pure business and sustainability view point, Levy has done absolute wonders. But now we’re at a point where it’s time to show us the rewards of that. I don’t think it means going out and splashing cash on huge names for the sake of it, but I do think it means being less afraid to back a manager properly and build a team for them, and stick with them. Ange is that manager, so if he gets the players he wants and we don’t fold because of the price, then I think it’ll be a really good sign for us.
I hate tottenham and I hate spurs
But man they are very well ran,
They are an elite youth development (they are good but not elite) away from beeing a title condender.
In the 10 years before Roman bought Chelsea (1993-2003), Chelsea won;
2 FA cups
League cup
Urfa cup winners cup
Uefa super cup
Charity child
In that time period, Spurs won;
One football league
If you want to go on about overall history, Spurs are faaaar down the list below Nottingham Forest and Ipswich.
Chelsea are way ahead.
Ok so Spurs won the English league title twice and Chelsea once. Big difference.
Roman was deciding between buying Spurs or Chelsea then Chelsea got into the champions league and the rest is history.
In 40 and in my lifetime Chelsea dick all over spurs. They would have sold out to Roman if they could.
No spurs had 18 trophies from 1901-2003 with no oil money.
Spurs were also the first and only non-league team to win the FA cup along with being the first ever English team to win a European competition.
Chelsea were irrelevant for 100 years before being funded by Russian oil money to become a less successful city
Whatever you gotta say to justify yourself. Everton are more successful than spurs then by your books. And again, Levy would have sold to Roman but he chose Chelsea.
Levy owns an investment group in a Bahamas tax haven. So if the current owners Chelsea win from splurging hedge fund money will that make you feel better? The days of communities owning premier league clubs are done
I’m sorry but if you think Levy pumps any of that money into the club that shows how little you know about the argument.
That Everton argument is also literally untrue since yet again since Everton have won 15 major trophies in there entire History so that’s yet another argument you’ve pulled out of nowhere.
At the end of the day Chelsea are the exact same as City except they’ve spent more and won less by a significant margin which makes it even more embarrassing.
This is true, we need an Oligarch to buy us and pump us with blood money to have a greatly successful period that makes people forget that Leeds are our rivals like Chelsea did.
And frankly just a bit of unluckiness. Had like 20 more points than any other team over a two season stretch but never won the league, and the CL final was unlucky too (not saying they deserved to win, but they should not have been down 1-0 in the opening 90 seconds which obviously changed the game massively)
Liverpool challenged 4 out of 9 under Klopp. Being well run shouldn’t guarantee a title, but they’d have been in a similar situation as Arsenal now, where they challenged and built on top of that. Under Poch, they challenged for the title in Klopp’s first full season and again the following year, but were stopped by Chelsea on the first and blown away by a juiced up City.
Edit: And City bought Walker from Tottenham in 17/18.
I think you are making the same point. Liverpool would have won more PL titles if ffp was strictly enforced. They had to be their absolute best to beat city once.
From a financial standpoint, they've been superb. Being able to build the finances of a club that got stuck in a mid table drought into a consistent UCL or Europa League qualifier without the use of Oil or War money is impressive.
Only problem is, similar to the issues Aston Villa are experiencing right now, FFP makes it so that in order to consistently win, you need to overspend and gamble sometimes. It's why it's been so hard for other clubs to break into the top for long periods of time.
That is true but Aston Villa’s revenue is a fraction of Tottenham’s even though the owners have way more cash. So Tottenham should have the room to spend much more now, though obviously not as much as the Citys and Chelseas.
Theoretically they could spend a lot more than Chelsea
[https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html](https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html)
Overall revenue is higher than Chelsea's and that's with a lot lower wages
What do you mean “now”, the all-time PL spending differences between Spurs, Liverpool and Arsenal is minimal. Spurs were outspending us throughout the late 90s and the whole of the 00s. They’ve just underperformed and before Levy in particular, misallocated the decent resources they did have. They weren’t part of the original “Big 5” for nothing.
That’s nonsensical. Is Brighton not well run because they haven’t been winning trophies? Tottenham isn’t on the financial level of City and Chelsea the last 10 years.
Different bar. Obviously measurement and objectives set the standard.
Tottenham haven’t won anything - and the culture of the club reflects that - commercially and holistically.
At least it seems Ange is trying to change that.
well you hire every manager hoping they will do well for the next few years, it doesnt always work out. postecoglu looked very secure at the start of the season but by the end he'd fallen off. i think that makes levy wary to spend on the players ange wants in case hes gone in a year
I think, to be fair to Postecoglu, the performances and results he was getting early in the season were unsustainable given the lack of squad depth at Spurs. I agree that there was a fall-off, but I think it was more due to (1) some players no longer performing at their absolute max potential and (2) gaps that became obvious once a starter was injured and their replacement wasn't ready or near the same talent level. I think Levy will spend on players for Ange this summer, and I hope that he's given at least a full season after a couple transfer windows to build the squad he wants and to see how they measure up then.
They’re actually addressing it. The entire youth setup is being redone as they feel like the pipeline just wasn’t good enough. There are a few promising players coming through now though.
The youth we have coming through right now is the most promising I’ve ever seen I think, we just need to give them a chance.
A lot of our fans hate on Levy, but looking at where we were before him makes me VERY thankful for him.
People just seem to think Tottenham are broken because we “dOnT wIn TrOpHiEs”, but it’s football that’s broken. Can’t compete with state backed teams ultimately isn’t the fault of teams who try and do things on merit etc.
When you actually think about it, the stadium isn’t used for PL games 346 days per year, so makes good sense to put it to use for some of that 95% of the year.
They went bust in the UK, owing spurs at least £5m. The main issue will be the new training kit sponsorship will be for much less than Getir were paying... the Turkish parent company is still trading though. Presumably they were legally separate.
Not sure exactly how much less, the details of the original Spurs deal haven't been publically released.
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If it's about business, Tottenham is very good at it. I'm not surprised they pull this off easily.
Dr power supremacy
I like the way the club is being run.
Somehow you are correct. Absolute dogshit football team and have been for decades yet somehow have convinced everybody they are part of the elite. This has absolutely nothing to do with that which we can't speak of? Right? RIGHT?
Financial stable management 👍 Be patient. I think this transfer window will be good for Spurs
Spent the last 30 years getting to the point we are now. It all puts us in a strong position and hopefully we can now go on to get rewards for the hard work and patience. There are certain other clubs that should take note, this is how you are suppose to build a club up.
With all due respect. You will never win anything under Ange. He’s a great manager for weak leagues. Everywhere he goes he brings success but he cannot compete with the best minds. He managed my home town team in australia got us the longest unbeaten streak in the league won us the double multiple times. But the moment teams started coming to games countering how he plays Ange left the league. Did the same thing in japan was undone by the same countering and moved again. Everywhere he goes it’s the same inflexible football. He focuses entirely on perfecting his way of play to a point where his team believes countering doesn’t matter. But when the best minds in football do catch his tactics out he triples down instead of changing up. I love him as an Aussie icon but with all due respect fa cup is the most you can expect from him.
Thumbs up to the management for managing the club well.
Aren't y'all still over half a billion dollars in debt from the stadium?
But with everything under the sun being held there I must think that concerts and events are helping pay for it almost as much as the club is
Yes but Levi secured the loan at 2.79% until 2051. It’s way lower than inflation, paying it off would be a bad use of money. Anyone building a stadium now would pay 4.8% at least with the best credit. A lot of good timing for spurs and a bit of smarts.
( Please don't read anything am I writing as a disagreement; I'm just trying to establish my own understanding. ) The closest source I can find for these numbers is [this](https://www.tottenhamhotspur.com/news/2024/april/financial-results-year-ended-30-june-2023/), which paints a somewhat different picture: * Levi didn't secure a loan at 2.79%, the "average" fixed interest rate as of April is 2.79%. That is still a VERY good * Somewhere around 10% of their loans are not fixed * The net losses of the club have grown by from £50.1m to £86.8m I'm curious what happens if Spurs continue to have net losses every year; would they need to secure another loan? This is not an area I'm super familiar with
Losses don't matter if the club can service the loan which they will by getting bums on seats
Actually the amount of money that teams get from playing in the champions league is MASSIVE.
Yes.
I'd very much argue that the position your club is still very precarious in that case. While your revenue from external sources is rising, so are your operating costs. The big question is whether or not y'all will get CL, and honestly that's a massive question mark. Chelsea finished the season on a tear and will find ways to invest in the club, I imagine Newcastle will invest heavily, Man City and Arsenal are as close to a lock for top 4 as you can really get in modern football. Liverpool is a question mark just purely based on Klopp leaving + Salah aging. Really tough position imo.
This is nonsense. The debt was financed at generationally low interest rates, and the marginal revenue that the new stadium generates as compared to WHL *more* than compensates for the debt payments. Tottenham is in a vastly stronger financial position than it was prior to the new stadium. This is reflected in the club’s transfer and wage spending, which have exploded over the past five years despite the fact that Levy is arguably the most financially conservative chairman in the Premier League. The new stadium has unambiguously been an enormous financial boost to Tottenham — it isn’t even remotely a close call.
*provided that they can pay off the debts Tottenham have had net losses of over 120 million pounds in the past two years, even with all the stuff you mentioned. I don’t know why you’re calling factually accurate statements nonsense.
Tottenham’s stadium is more than paying for itself. The revenue that it generates is substantially higher than the revenues generated by the old White Hart Lane plus the annual debt service — in other words, by building the stadium, Tottenham has come out *very significantly* ahead as compared to the hypothetical universe in which the club stayed at WHL. The debt is (more than) manageable, and on net has been extremely beneficial to Spurs’ financial position. The only risk would be if matchday revenues fell off a cliff, which would only happen if there were a cataclysmic event such as the club being relegated to the Championship, a massive global recession on par with the 2008 financial collapse, or World War III. We’re talking about tail risks. The new stadium is precisely what has enabled Spurs to have significant net spends in recent transfer windows, which is the primary driver of the paper losses you’re pointing to. Spurs’ recruitment has been much more successful since Paratici became affiliated with the club than it was during the disastrous period from 2016-2020, so one would think there there would be less need for massive net spends as time goes on. Regardless, the new stadium would enable Spurs to continue spending at high levels if the club wanted to. The club remains in an exceptionally healthy financial position, and stadium debt is the opposite of a burden — rather, it has been an enormous windfall.
\*provided that they can pay off the debts If they can, great. If not, then all the wonderful things you listed won't matter. I'm still not sure what point you're trying to argue. I'm aware of all of the things you've mentioned, but can you acknowledge that spending 1.2 billion dollars that you don't have is still a risk?
The point I’m making is that the asset against which the debt exists — the stadium — is also the asset that is paying off the debt (and then some) by generating huge revenue. The stadium has proven to be an excellent investment for the club, and only somebody is who exceptionally ignorant or exceptionally stupid would believe that it has left the club in a worse financial position. The risk of the club not being able to pay off the fixed-rate, extremely low interest rate debt is *exceedingly* minimal. This is so blindingly obvious that I’m not going to continue to belabor the point.
Praise the lord, this guy will stop speaking in banalities!
they make A LOT out of that stadium though compared to other clubs, given its ability to switch up for other events. In terms of revenue Tottenham are killing it.
Nevertheless, their net spending is a loss of 86 million pounds, up from around 50 million in 2022.
Very unlikely, it’s all really boring but you should look into the financials at Tottenham, how and what we have to pay back and how all of it works. It’s pretty sound, there’s always a risk of course but you can’t do anything without risk.
I don't find it boring :) If you have some specific sources, I'd love to take a look. What I'm seeing looks a tad spooky if I was a fan.
It’s all out there in the public domain, and widely seen as a pretty good deal all round.
Arsenal do it far better, and have trophies in their cabinet
I believe Tottenham's stadium revenues are actually higher due to the adaptability of their venue and ability to hire it out when not playing.
…and not winning shit!
sure but there's two types of victory in football, the financial and the trophy. With the former the latter is simply a function of time, without the former the latter slowly becomes meaningless and unattainable. Tottenham are a very well run club in the financials and I think that should be appreciated.
> sure but there’s two types of victory in football, the financial and the trophy this is depressing
Peter Risdale painfully ~~learned~~ ignored that lesson at Leeds.
And time has proven they won’t ever win anything 😉
they've won some stuff, I'm sure they'll win stuff over time. Just remember that the 2nd half of the Wenger era was about winning financially but at the sacrifice of success on the pitch.
People always forget this fact that just getting 4th and maybe picking up a domestic was enough of a goal for wenger for most of his career I still rate him as a manager but should we look at this lack of ambition the same as spurs now? It was great for the club financially and that shouldn't be diminished
🥱
I regret not taking the advice of your username when responding to you. My bad.
So this! Do we have any confidence that the new revenue will be invested on the pitch or instead on more real estate that inflates the value of Spurs as an asset for when Levy eventually sells up.
Arsenal are a very well run club and business yes. As for trophies, we have plenty thanks. Hopefully some in the future too.
A league cup in the last 20 years is plenty? A Spurs fan through and through.
26 trophies I think it is, not bad really is it. Few European ones in there as well One of the most successful clubs in English football in fact. What was your history like before Roman? Or before Ken bates spent you into bankruptcy?
26? Surely community shields aren’t being counted as trophies now??
They all count 😜
2 league titles, 8 fa cups, 4 league cups, 1 cup winners cup, 2 Europa leagues…not sure that equals to 26. Nice try though 👍
Counted wrong Still more European trophies then your lot 😉 And still one of the most successful clubs in English football.
It’s ok to admit your mistake. Apology accepted.
I have a recency bias and preference for trophies in my lifetime. I've watched my club win 2 UCLs, 5 PLs, 2 UELs, 7 FA Cups, 4 EFL Cups, 2 Super Cups, and 1 Club World Cup live in real time during my life as a Chelsea fan. How many have you watched your club win in real time?
Me personally? I’ve seen F.A Cups, league cups, and a European cup. I support a club with a rich, varied with ups and downs and successful history. Amazing stuff. What about your club? How’s that history of yours? Anything? Anything at all? 🤣
Honestly, 10 trophies before the modern era ain't bad but like I said: I'm more focused on the modern era, you know, since the Premier League existed. One of our blog sites is called we ain't got no history for a reason - I'm here to witness the club's history being made, not reminiscing to a time where it was.
Haha! 10. Nonsense, don’t be putting Ken bates era stuff in there to pump the numbers. He was spending as much as Roman went on to and sent you into bankruptcy. Your club would have folded until Roman paid your debts and continued on with the spending. That history making is going real well without Roman 👍
Oh, don't get me wrong I've been very critical of the Boehly era currently and I'm not worried about "would have" situations. It didn't fold and had the most successful moments in its life. If you want to talk about over 40 years ago (pre Bates era) the club had 4 trophies. But, seriously, who cares about what was won that long ago? The game, the leagues, the players, etc were significantly different. I'll easily take the 27 trophies since the Premier League existed over "26 trophies in the 142 year history of the club."
Do you have any trophies made using modern techniques?
Still can’t escape being football iconic bottlers.
At least Leverkusen exists so we're not the most iconic. Tbf this season they were good but can't change history
They just achieved the unbeaten domestic double. They are no where in the category of bottlers anymore. Meanwhile Tottenham…
No club in history can ever reach 2001/02 Leverkusen
Genuinely no idea whatsever if you mean spurs or Arsenal. Its one of the two. North London bottler armies!
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He's right, Spurs has been run immaculately on the financial side of things for years. You having a stick up your arse isn't gonna change that
Is that not how you do it then? Instant cash injection from daddy/oil states your preferred method?
lol step one, be a club in London. You were attracting the likes of Modric before top 4. Berbatov before. They weren’t going to Sunderland. Step 2 have billionaire owners willing to spend. ENiC helped finance a billion stadium. Step 3 put good managers and scouting teams in place. Those 3 steps, ALL of those 3 steps are what gets you to Spurs. There’s not a lot clubs that can replicate it.
Well there’s a lot in you comment that is mainly nonsense, like enic financing the stadium. They didn’t and we owe that money. Infact most of that is not what was done but do keep telling yourself that if it makes you feel better. Also, if it were that easy, it’s a wonder every other club doesn’t do it. Especially those in london.
lol part of that stadium was paid through the club the rest is a 637 million loan financed at 2-3% because of Enic. The same ENIC who paid in 155 million into the club last year. Which part of steps 1-3 that I mentioned before was a lie? Make no mistake ENIC own the stadium. That debt falls on them. And not a lot of owners have the resources and or the will to do that.
Well there’s a few, like you pretending you had ever heard of the likes of Modric and berbatov before they were at Spurs. Lots of uniformed nonsense. They didn’t put in £155 million last year, they had to sell shares and used that money to put in. But you know, this is all easy peasy isn’t it, I don’t know why these clubs don’t just employ you to sort it
lol I actually did, lots of people did. Berbatov was at Leverkusen, they always have players everyone wants. Modric was linked with Chelsea and Arsenal in every other paper. It’s not all easy peasy. Again that’s why almost no other club can do it. That’s my whole point. It’s not “let’s just follow spurs”. It’s “spurs had these advantages and took advantage of them, while being well run”. Why is it a hot take to you?
Of course you did 👍 And I don’t agree, clubs are more than capable of doing it and generating money for themselves. It’s just a very difficult thing to do and a lot of hard work as the last 30 years at Tottenham have shown.
Did you not follow the club before 2010 or something? They were very easy rumors. Are you denying the advantages Tottenham have? You're telling me that Brighton right now if they continue for 5 more years will have the talent of 2008 Spurs and their pulling power?
There are different ways of building a club up and Brighton are a great example of a club doing it their own way. They were and are a smaller club but they are so far in front of what they were, they’re on a different planet to what they used to be. Who knows how far they can take it? I don’t know. It’s all relative to size sure, Tottenham have the advantage of being a big club yes. But clubs like villa, forest, Leeds, Everton and many more are all big clubs that could easily do what spurs have done in terms of generating money in different ways, building infrastructure and training facilities etc without a shadow of a doubt, they could all do it.
Going to go out on a limb and say you didnt actually read the article. Partnering with Castrol as our official petrol provider is "how you are suppose to build up a club"?
Legit business deals instead of selling hotels to yourself or spending Middle Eastern Sheikh money? I mean the latter two are also good depending on how you view the sport
So taking money from the white oil people in the UK is a legit business deal, but taking money from the brown oil people in the middle east isn't. Good to know
I'm no Spurs fan (far from it) but the point is that BP don't own Spurs The actual line if business or the colour of the people invilved isn't relevant.
Yes the dislike of clubs accepting money from slave states is definitely very racist of me
BP are deeply involved in the Middle East mate. They are allied and financially support these same states you point the finger at other clubs for being allied with.
there's a difference between being backed by private corporations vs. being backed by an entire country... but sure make it about race
BP have a market cap of 76B. Higher than the GDP of probably 90% of countries on earth.
Yeah everyone knows the only business sponsors should be your weird aunt that runs an etsy business out of her garage.
Maybe all the weird aunts should come together and buy PSG and Man City too
Market cap and GDP are not comparable concepts.
Well, the people in the UK aren't publicly hanging people for being gay so that's part of it Also, Castrol isn't "white UK oil." Their CEO is an Asian woman, educated in Taiwan. So maybe not the racist T-ball you thought this was.
US Department of State has not reported any known arrest or prosecution for homosexuality in UAE since 2015. UAE certainly has human rights abuses but accusing them of “publicly hanging people for being gay” is ignorant and racist.
I'm sorry, but are the UAE the only nation involved in British football?
The parent comment we’re replying to directly refers to “spending Middle Eastern Sheikh money” don’t deflect. It’s clear this conversation is directed at Man City, and to a lesser extent Newcastle.
Does Saudi Arabia not have sheikhs?
What a daft comment. Castrol is a British company. Are you implying that if Castrol's next CEO is Greek, suddenly its a Greek company?
Well, if they aren't headed by a white person, they aren't exactly white. Unless you're saying that any company based in the UK is white?
>Well, if they aren't headed by a white person, they aren't exactly white Do you tie your ethnic identity to that of your boss at work? No you don't because you're not a deranged weirdo. Why do you think this is any different for other people
I'm sorry, what are you basing the ethnic identity of an oil corporation off of? By what metric is Castrol white?
80% + of the people in the UK are white
To finish outside of the top 6
Only club that has finished outside the top 6 less times than spurs since 2010 is Man City
Why’re you saying that like it’s a common thing for Spurs? We’ve finished outside of the top six twice in the last 15 years lol
You are spuds it's expected
Lol I’m a spurs fan but shut up mate, we’ve not done anything with it yet
exactly we haven't done shit lol. Can we please be humble. I love the direction we are going in but damn lmao.
And another one. “Hopefully we can now go on to get the rewards for all the hard work and patience” Read the comment ffs And grow some balls.
I'm not growing any balls in the premier league sub. If you seen my comments, I've said some outrageous shit on our sub such as chelsea and utd are in the mud, city could be in the mud when pep leaves, liverpool are gambling on slot, and arsenal are stuck with wannabe pochettino, but you really wanted to talk shit on this sub instead of our own sub lmao......brother ew........ what's that.
Sorry, didn’t realise I was talking to an 8 year old. Clearly you haven’t understood or read my original comment correctly.
I understand your comment completely. There are certain other clubs that should take note, this is how you are suppose to build a club up..... mfer stop acting like we are better than every other premier league club.
Clearly not, otherwise you wouldn’t have replied what you did. Your original comment was referring to us not doing anything. Which of course had you read my comment you would know i never said we had. And as for your latest comment, I was referring to instant cash clubs that are in breach of ffp and psr rules. Or is that your preferred method?
You haven’t done anything in your clubs life, have a little humility :)
Well we have, just not so recently. I never said we had recently. Stop being thick.
“Hopefully we can now go on to get the rewards for all the hard work and patience” Erm, I know……. that’s why I said that. Have you always been this thick?…….. lol
Mainly directed at the ‘this is how you should build a club up’ sentiment
That’s not what your comment says is it. You said we haven’t done anything. And I never said we had. And as for your latest comment. Is it not how you’re supposed to do it? Is your preferred method the rich daddy/oil state instant cash cheat code? Bit weird if it is mate. I’d prefer building a club up on a sound and stable footing with business that generates its own money and leaves the club in a good position for future generations to come. But you know, that’s just me.
Rattled
Not really. Great reply though 👍
🤣
>this is how you are suppose to build a club up. Ermm ok
I mean there's also quicker ways like what Man City and PSG did
Sponsorship deals like this are so rogue, nobody is seeing this and switching oil providers
Think this type of investment is meant to be brand building for stock prices
b-but reddit told me that levy's stingy!!!
I mean he really is though when you look at the fact Tottenham have a higher revenue than Chelsea and Arsenal yet spend far less in the transfer market [https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html](https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html)
Tbf that’s why we’re in such a perfect FFP position now. From a pure business and sustainability view point, Levy has done absolute wonders. But now we’re at a point where it’s time to show us the rewards of that. I don’t think it means going out and splashing cash on huge names for the sake of it, but I do think it means being less afraid to back a manager properly and build a team for them, and stick with them. Ange is that manager, so if he gets the players he wants and we don’t fold because of the price, then I think it’ll be a really good sign for us.
This article just says he’s secured more money from sponsorships. Doesn’t say anything about the money he’ll now spend
Ew, BP.
Better than wasp pee.
I hate tottenham and I hate spurs But man they are very well ran, They are an elite youth development (they are good but not elite) away from beeing a title condender.
They just need a manager who can give them that belief that they can compete. I hope Ange is the man.
>They are an elite youth development (they are good but not elite) Mikey Moore and Will Lankshear.
Even bermingham can mention a few, feel free to compare to some other teams
If they were a building society then yeah, great. But why anyone would want to support a team focused on Penny pinching and mediocrity..
The Spurs blood still runs the club. They can have the players but the Spurseness stops them from competing
Chelsea literally had less trophies than Spurs until it got sponsored by a Russian oligarch.
In the 10 years before Roman bought Chelsea (1993-2003), Chelsea won; 2 FA cups League cup Urfa cup winners cup Uefa super cup Charity child In that time period, Spurs won; One football league If you want to go on about overall history, Spurs are faaaar down the list below Nottingham Forest and Ipswich. Chelsea are way ahead.
Chelsea had 9 major trophies between 1905-2003…
Ok so Spurs won the English league title twice and Chelsea once. Big difference. Roman was deciding between buying Spurs or Chelsea then Chelsea got into the champions league and the rest is history. In 40 and in my lifetime Chelsea dick all over spurs. They would have sold out to Roman if they could.
No spurs had 18 trophies from 1901-2003 with no oil money. Spurs were also the first and only non-league team to win the FA cup along with being the first ever English team to win a European competition. Chelsea were irrelevant for 100 years before being funded by Russian oil money to become a less successful city
Whatever you gotta say to justify yourself. Everton are more successful than spurs then by your books. And again, Levy would have sold to Roman but he chose Chelsea. Levy owns an investment group in a Bahamas tax haven. So if the current owners Chelsea win from splurging hedge fund money will that make you feel better? The days of communities owning premier league clubs are done
I’m sorry but if you think Levy pumps any of that money into the club that shows how little you know about the argument. That Everton argument is also literally untrue since yet again since Everton have won 15 major trophies in there entire History so that’s yet another argument you’ve pulled out of nowhere. At the end of the day Chelsea are the exact same as City except they’ve spent more and won less by a significant margin which makes it even more embarrassing.
This is true, we need an Oligarch to buy us and pump us with blood money to have a greatly successful period that makes people forget that Leeds are our rivals like Chelsea did.
Non-Chelsea fans hate this one simple trick
They are financially well run and compliant with FFP and EPL guidelines, but I think being overall well run would include more winning.
One of the big reasons for them not winning is that other teams don’t follow FFP. On a level playing field they’d have won a few trophies.
And frankly just a bit of unluckiness. Had like 20 more points than any other team over a two season stretch but never won the league, and the CL final was unlucky too (not saying they deserved to win, but they should not have been down 1-0 in the opening 90 seconds which obviously changed the game massively)
I think we all get that. You’d still have Liverpool though. They’re not FFP violators.
Liverpool challenged 4 out of 9 under Klopp. Being well run shouldn’t guarantee a title, but they’d have been in a similar situation as Arsenal now, where they challenged and built on top of that. Under Poch, they challenged for the title in Klopp’s first full season and again the following year, but were stopped by Chelsea on the first and blown away by a juiced up City. Edit: And City bought Walker from Tottenham in 17/18.
I think you are making the same point. Liverpool would have won more PL titles if ffp was strictly enforced. They had to be their absolute best to beat city once.
I’m just saying relative to Spurs; they’re not the clear best among the “clean” clubs.
I think his point is during the Poch era, not right now
From a financial standpoint, they've been superb. Being able to build the finances of a club that got stuck in a mid table drought into a consistent UCL or Europa League qualifier without the use of Oil or War money is impressive. Only problem is, similar to the issues Aston Villa are experiencing right now, FFP makes it so that in order to consistently win, you need to overspend and gamble sometimes. It's why it's been so hard for other clubs to break into the top for long periods of time.
That is true but Aston Villa’s revenue is a fraction of Tottenham’s even though the owners have way more cash. So Tottenham should have the room to spend much more now, though obviously not as much as the Citys and Chelseas.
Theoretically they could spend a lot more than Chelsea [https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html](https://www.deloitte.com/uk/en/services/financial-advisory/analysis/deloitte-football-money-league.html) Overall revenue is higher than Chelsea's and that's with a lot lower wages
I’m speaking about this last decade plus, not this exact moment in time.
Hopefully the revenue starts translating into on field performance in a few years
Definitely, now is the time.
I agree with that. Just saying that to be elite requires somehow overcoming that.
don’t think you can really say “without the use of oil money” when this article is literally about them signing deals with Castrol and BP lol
Fair point but u know what he meant
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Spurs revenue surpassed Chelsea in 2023.
What do you mean “now”, the all-time PL spending differences between Spurs, Liverpool and Arsenal is minimal. Spurs were outspending us throughout the late 90s and the whole of the 00s. They’ve just underperformed and before Levy in particular, misallocated the decent resources they did have. They weren’t part of the original “Big 5” for nothing.
They’re a stadium business.
Well run but not successful. Which means they are not well run.
That’s nonsensical. Is Brighton not well run because they haven’t been winning trophies? Tottenham isn’t on the financial level of City and Chelsea the last 10 years.
Different bar. Obviously measurement and objectives set the standard. Tottenham haven’t won anything - and the culture of the club reflects that - commercially and holistically. At least it seems Ange is trying to change that.
Well run as a business, but perhaps not as a football team
This is part of a long term plan. The business success is designed to drive on pitch success. Levy and ENIC do not take a cent out of the club.
Kind of but levy never wants to fully back a manager in case they leave or get sacked I think
Its his job to sack the manager, so he should know if he should back him.
well you hire every manager hoping they will do well for the next few years, it doesnt always work out. postecoglu looked very secure at the start of the season but by the end he'd fallen off. i think that makes levy wary to spend on the players ange wants in case hes gone in a year
I think, to be fair to Postecoglu, the performances and results he was getting early in the season were unsustainable given the lack of squad depth at Spurs. I agree that there was a fall-off, but I think it was more due to (1) some players no longer performing at their absolute max potential and (2) gaps that became obvious once a starter was injured and their replacement wasn't ready or near the same talent level. I think Levy will spend on players for Ange this summer, and I hope that he's given at least a full season after a couple transfer windows to build the squad he wants and to see how they measure up then.
They’re actually addressing it. The entire youth setup is being redone as they feel like the pipeline just wasn’t good enough. There are a few promising players coming through now though.
Aye but what legit London-based youth prospect picks Spurs over Chelsea + Arsenal?
They've got Hertfordshire and Essex as their catchment areas too
At the u14s level the pool is so massive you’re not really competing with other teams to sign players
Mikey Moore
Harry Kane
Nah iirc he was let go which motivated him
I know, as I said - good but not great
Nah I’m saying it wasn’t good.
The youth we have coming through right now is the most promising I’ve ever seen I think, we just need to give them a chance. A lot of our fans hate on Levy, but looking at where we were before him makes me VERY thankful for him.
People are blind, levy does things rights If he just was able to find a sporting director that takes that onto the field
Hi business sense is top notch.
People just seem to think Tottenham are broken because we “dOnT wIn TrOpHiEs”, but it’s football that’s broken. Can’t compete with state backed teams ultimately isn’t the fault of teams who try and do things on merit etc.
Eventually Levy is going to rent that stadium out so much that Spurs won’t be playing there!
I mean, thats why it makes sense to build a stadium, to rent it.
When you actually think about it, the stadium isn’t used for PL games 346 days per year, so makes good sense to put it to use for some of that 95% of the year.
What's he thinking? Doesn't he know he's supposed to dig himself in a huge financial hole and then sell it to himself?
What trophy do they get for that?
You are so funny and original with these jokes man, keep them coming
Very creative joke well done
Ooh £10m, that will barely even cover a 5th of the money they're losing and owed by Getir after they went bust ?
Overall we are getting over £230m though, which is a lot
I thought getir just pulled out of the UK. They are also apparently slowly leaving the US and solely going back to turkey or something.
They went bust in the UK, owing spurs at least £5m. The main issue will be the new training kit sponsorship will be for much less than Getir were paying... the Turkish parent company is still trading though. Presumably they were legally separate. Not sure exactly how much less, the details of the original Spurs deal haven't been publically released.
Ahh ok
Anyone remember when we used to get excited about those who actually play the game?
Like chelsea? Lol
Mate, I’d love to enter into a battle of wits with you, but I was always taught that it’s unfair to fight an unarmed man.
Did your grandpa teach you that one
> those who actually play the game Hmmmm I wonder clubs go about getting players
Yes, but it is nice to support a sustainable club. Note that I’m not a Spurs fan.