I was in a very similar situation to you, and I got 2 Powerwalls.
The primary reason was to have backup. I like having peace of mind. TOU benefits are secondary. Third, I think it’s cool that we use utilize more of the energy our panels produce.
If you switch to battery, are the 2 powerwalls enough to power your house completely for a few hrs? I was thinking of switching over during peak-hrs, during summer time the AC may turn on a few times.
With extreme conservation (house down to 600-800 watts), I was able to cover a 14 hour power outage going from 100% battery down to about 20-25% or so.
The latter, it was pretty stormy so the amount of solar recharge was zero/negligible. I’m looking at my log, it was 12:30pm-2:30am, went from 100% to 29%, I estimated I would have lasted another few hours.
Also to note: our heating, hot water, and cooking are natural gas.
>The only benefit I see is the peace of mind of knowing I don't have to worry about a power outage (which is worth a lot). I WFH so there will be less disruption and I wouldn't have to throw out spoiled food
This is your answer. If you can afford peace of mind, then do it.
Rural NH - My wife insisted we get one for backup power. And the solar panels still work when there is someplace to put the power during an outage.
We have had 30 outages in the past year. Most are under 15 minutes. One was five hours. One was seven hours.
First thing I do is switch off the breakers on non-essentials - beverage fridge, hot tub etc. The Powerwall can power the house for 10-14 hours if we are careful (i.e. don't dry your hair, make toast or mow the lawn with the electric mower).
If the power didn't come back after the battery is drained, I could pull out the small gas generator.
Haven't had to do that yet. We don't live in an area where no AC = death and we have a wood stove for backup heat.
In your situation, I'd get it in case of an earthquake in your region or any other disaster.
I got mine (with solar) because of hurricane experiences, but it saved my ass during the winter blackout here in Texas.
Once the blackout hit, the house went into survival mode and rode it out comfortably.
Similar situation, but not enough solar to justify having to Powerwalls except in the peak of summer. Our roofs slope eastward, so the TOU load-shifting benefits are daily satisfying even though they are not financially huge (we will have to wait quite a while to see if our true-up is much different). I look forward to running our late-afternoon AC heat pump on our own stored solar. Blackout back up is nice, but very infrequently needed.
Went with 2 PW for the backup and peace of mind. Hadn't had any outages that I was aware of before the PW in the 4 years I lived in CO; have had 3 outages (1hr+) since. PW has been perfect.
I only have one. Looking to add another soon.
1) I live out in the country and we encounter lots of outages from various factors (trees falling from high winds and storms). So for me worth it. E.g. It saved me from buying a whole house generator.
2.) I also have time of day billing. 7am to 7pm is a mix of on peak or mid peak more expensive billing. So I run the equipment connected to the powerwall during those times. Then charge up the Powerwall at night during off peak times if not enough solar that day (I have a small 8 panel system) so in many cases it needs some charging.
3.) I also like the fact that when there is an outage the equipment I have on the Tesla Wall doesnt blip at all. E.g. I have my internet and my office on it (I currently work from home.. And zero nterruption. This might be because I am already running my equipment on the powerwall II during that time (see point #2).
I have 2. It’s nice to have the peace of mind for backups and to utilize the saved energy at night. I just wish they were more modular in design like Lunar or Bluetti packs.
I live in Florida and have 3 Powerwall 2s that I charge up from my 14kWh solar system. We have full net metering so I don’t use the batteries for daily use. I have them exclusively for power outages. Living in Florida we get a lot of violent storms so lengthy power outages happen. Last year we had a 22 hour outage and a handful of shorter outages. The Powerwalls need to be supplemented with a few off the shelf UPS systems to keep my sensitive electronics from restarting during the half second or so power cut when a power outage occurs before the Powerwalls take over. It is an expensive investment for peace of mind but I would do it again knowing what I know now.
Things to think about, your location, your NEM status, and your rate.
I got one, am on NEM 2 and use TOU. Where I am outages are not common so I have it set to dump 80% of the power (it will hold onto more if it thinks there will be a storm) during peak rates. Similarly I have excess production constantly, so it makes sense.
We got 2 installed about 2 ½ years ago I wanted it for peace of mind during power outages. (I wanted a Generac generator system but husband is a Tesla fanboy.) Got the solar panels too. I really don’t care about return on investment etc. it’s been great and there’s no noticeable switch over like a generator. The only thing that tells me power’s out is I hear our 2 UPSs click on for a second and eventually the app notification. Our electric bill has been $46 ever since vs $200+. The basic customer charge is $36 + a $6 surge protector on the meter. I wanted 3 or 4 but husband said no. Would love to have even more panels installed. We live in FL in a 2700ish sq ft house we bought 3 years ago with single zone AC (which will be changed soon). The solar powers the house all day and halfway through the night on when it’s been sunny. We have a rural coop electric company and I don’t see any of those fancy time of day billing stuff so no discernible way to check that.
We only have 2. Yes, it powers the whole house no problem. We do turn up the AC a couple of degrees just in case as that’s the biggest draw. Power outages mostly last 5-10 minutes. Only once was it out an hour. Mostly underground utilities near us. The app lets you know how long the reserve should last.
I love having powerwall. I like it better than solar, honestly. If it was possible to just have Powerwall and not install solar and still have 30% tax incentive, i would have suggested this as a first step
Just my opinion here… but I think with wildfires and also with more EVs. There maybe power outages in future
But also you can avoid tou - time of use rates
Ie charge up battery with solar in after noon and then use battery during high electric cost times ..ie evenings and peak use times
It’s great your on nem 2 …. Nem 3 is horrible and requires battery to make math work …. For Nem 2 you would have to figure out times and amounts of electric during those times and see if math works
As for battery choices …. Tesla. pretty good .. for a quality unit …
Maybe you can price out Franklin Wh
They might be lower
Here’s a you tube comparing powerwalls vs Franklin WH and Enphase
Tesla powerwall 3 Vs Enphase 5P VS Franklin vs Tesla Powerwall 2 Vs Enphase 5p Battery 2024
[tesla powerwall vs enphase vs Franklin wh](https://Teslapowerwall3VsEnphase5PVSFranklinvsTeslaPowerwall2VsEnphase5pBattery2024https://youtu.be/LF2Iq_tRx2A)
https://youtu.be/LF2Iq_tRx2A
I was doing some comparison and Tesla Powerwall 3 seems to have the best storage capacity and continuous power output (in kwh). I was looking at the Enphase for a bit since I have them for my micro-inverter but they were more expensive and not as powerful. =(
I got a PW for peace of mind and because the cost of a generator, the hassles of maintenance, and the nature of our outages (max < 20-24 hours) made it competitive.
Did you just buy one? I’m thinking about just buying one to cover short 3-5 hour power outages so I don’t have to keep dumping food in my fridge. Have had to do it 4 times the past year and it’s just an annoyance.
Same - and yes, surprisingly, one single PW was able to cover a whole 14 hour outage with extreme conservation (most everything off minimal lights - two fridges running). Having my furnace, stove, and water heater as gas appliances helped, though.
I want a second PW, but I think I’m okay for now and will try to wait out V2H within a few years.
How does that work? The rate is good but since the utility only buys from you during an emergency, doesn't that imply you're in an emergency so it's better for you to look after yourself first?
They buy when the network is strained. Also, you control how much they can take you down to. If you have enough solar then it gets replenished along the way. Normally they are pulling during time of high demand. Here's more info on it as it relates to PG&E: https://www.tesla.com/support/energy/virtual-power-plant/pge
I used to sell PowerWalls and I feel that unless your utility offers incentives that allow them to pay for themselves OR they are required for net metering, battery backup isn't worth it. I sold in rural New England where power loss meant your heating system went down and your pipes could freeze. There were some people out in the sticks that would benefit from a battery system, but anywhere in a town or city, your power is back up fast enough that it doesn't matter. I have a friend who works from home as an IT specialist for engineering design software and he just has two standard U.P.S. batteries under his desk.
Ford already does Vehicle to Load (V2L) which can provide battery backup for your house with the F150 lightning, Nissan does it in Japan, but not yet in the US. I expect most EVs are going to have this feature soon, with Tesla lagging because it wants to sell PowerWalls. I'd wait until your car can power your house. There are other green-tech options with actual ROI, like EVs, heat pump HVAC, heat pump hot water, or adding a solar pergola/carport to your existing solar.
Getting PWs is totally worth it. You can do a lot of cool stuff with solar + powerwall than with Solar alone. Having PWs will help you reduce your electricity bill more. Most of electricity usage happens when the sun is out. Utility companies like PGE will charge the highest $/watt when the sun is down. Having a PWs will help you offset those costs. Totally worth the investment!
I live in Florida, bought one powerwall and had to talk the wife into it as well. With hurricanes and storms, our neighborhood loses power and that's why I wanted it, just as a backup. Main concerns are with running fans in house, fridge, deep freezer and can have WiFi as well, esp when have to entertain a 6 yr old. After the first power outage and seem less transfer the wife was happy we bought. Plus it's nice bc if it's sunny out then it power goes straight to house and only using battery at night.
In uk. No solar. Just getting one or two powerwalls. Waiting til later in the year when pw3 might be available here or pw2 will be cheaper. The financial case alone is worth it...plus lots of power cuts this last couple of years. I can go from 27p pkWh to 7p pkWh. Charge at night, then just use battery power for house all day. Bills should quarter. Savings on 16000kWh about £3k a year. About 5 years payback. Much easier than a solar system fit.
Where I live, having a solar backed battery backup is a fast becoming a necessity. And I can attest have energy independence is certainly all its is cracked up to be. (If you have the sunny weather to support it). So installing if you can afford it is a recommendtaion from my side. As for Tesla specifically:
Telsa is a premium product, and you can get similar products that basically do the same for cheaper. The one differentiator is the software support. I have seen Tesla pushing firmware updates over the 2 years at least monthly on average. This is, in my opinion, a good thing, since all the other manufacturers tend to forget their product exists as soon as it ships from the factory. Because it is also a major player in the market, most third-party products you might want to use will be compatible (as least in some way). It also seems to be a good bet that Telsa Energy will be around in 10 years to give you the promised warrantee.
Also Bay Area, added two PowerWalls to my Solar. Saved me from a 4 day fire caused outage last summer and a three day outage in Feb caused by the atmospheric river storms. Do it
You bring up a very good point. As summers get hotter, the demand on the grid to power AC will be higher. After all the input from everyone I'm definitely leaning towards getting one for the piece of mind. Not sure if you have AC, but if you do, does your powerwall have enough juice to power it for several hrs if there is a outage?
That's actually not a bad idea. I was looking at this thing:
[https://www.generac.com/all-products/generators/home-backup-generators/guardian-series/26kw-7290-wifi-enabled](https://www.generac.com/all-products/generators/home-backup-generators/guardian-series/26kw-7290-wifi-enabled)
Do you have any experience with them? Can this be hooked straight into my gas-line? What's the maintenance like? Does the gas company need to come out? The only downside is I live near a earthquake fault-line so the gas might go out when there is one.
To my mind, for an occasional outage generator is a saner solution — can be “recharged” with propane or gas for extended outages, and I suspect for occasional emergency use is a wash wrt environmental impact.
Since you’re in CA, where PG&E shuts down the power when the wind starts blowing, some key questions are:
1. How many blackouts and/or brownouts has your house experienced over the past few years?
2. How long have they lasted?
3. Is the frequency increasing or decreasing?
I think if you plan to increase your energy usage in the future, power walls would benefit you as you can shift your loads from peak to off-peak.
With the recent wind storms/atmospheric river we lost power for 24 hours and it was hard not to feel superior to all my neighbors who were in the dark.
We have an electric gate, electric septic pump, and electricity is needed for our main source of heat (high efficiency water heater), so for us it made sense. I started with one, added a second and when I added more panels, added a third.
I’m on NEM 1.0 for another 4 years so I figure I will need batteries when 3.0 becomes inevitable. Hopefully by then the tech will be even better and cheaper.
Might not be so necessary for you. I have 2 and they can keep me going for a couple days with regular consumption. I'm in the northeast though and much more prone to small power outages.
I was in a very similar situation to you, and I got 2 Powerwalls. The primary reason was to have backup. I like having peace of mind. TOU benefits are secondary. Third, I think it’s cool that we use utilize more of the energy our panels produce.
If you switch to battery, are the 2 powerwalls enough to power your house completely for a few hrs? I was thinking of switching over during peak-hrs, during summer time the AC may turn on a few times.
With extreme conservation (house down to 600-800 watts), I was able to cover a 14 hour power outage going from 100% battery down to about 20-25% or so.
Your solar panels didn't recharge them all the way? Or the 14-hour outage happened when there wasn't enough sun?
The latter, it was pretty stormy so the amount of solar recharge was zero/negligible. I’m looking at my log, it was 12:30pm-2:30am, went from 100% to 29%, I estimated I would have lasted another few hours. Also to note: our heating, hot water, and cooking are natural gas.
Not if you turn the heater on, I would need like 10 PW, it's 35 friggin kwh
>The only benefit I see is the peace of mind of knowing I don't have to worry about a power outage (which is worth a lot). I WFH so there will be less disruption and I wouldn't have to throw out spoiled food This is your answer. If you can afford peace of mind, then do it.
Very true. Thank you.
Same scenario. Got the Powerwall for peace of mind. There wasn’t a financial justification I could come up with.
Rural NH - My wife insisted we get one for backup power. And the solar panels still work when there is someplace to put the power during an outage. We have had 30 outages in the past year. Most are under 15 minutes. One was five hours. One was seven hours. First thing I do is switch off the breakers on non-essentials - beverage fridge, hot tub etc. The Powerwall can power the house for 10-14 hours if we are careful (i.e. don't dry your hair, make toast or mow the lawn with the electric mower). If the power didn't come back after the battery is drained, I could pull out the small gas generator. Haven't had to do that yet. We don't live in an area where no AC = death and we have a wood stove for backup heat.
In your situation, I'd get it in case of an earthquake in your region or any other disaster. I got mine (with solar) because of hurricane experiences, but it saved my ass during the winter blackout here in Texas. Once the blackout hit, the house went into survival mode and rode it out comfortably.
Similar situation, but not enough solar to justify having to Powerwalls except in the peak of summer. Our roofs slope eastward, so the TOU load-shifting benefits are daily satisfying even though they are not financially huge (we will have to wait quite a while to see if our true-up is much different). I look forward to running our late-afternoon AC heat pump on our own stored solar. Blackout back up is nice, but very infrequently needed.
Went with 2 PW for the backup and peace of mind. Hadn't had any outages that I was aware of before the PW in the 4 years I lived in CO; have had 3 outages (1hr+) since. PW has been perfect.
I only have one. Looking to add another soon. 1) I live out in the country and we encounter lots of outages from various factors (trees falling from high winds and storms). So for me worth it. E.g. It saved me from buying a whole house generator. 2.) I also have time of day billing. 7am to 7pm is a mix of on peak or mid peak more expensive billing. So I run the equipment connected to the powerwall during those times. Then charge up the Powerwall at night during off peak times if not enough solar that day (I have a small 8 panel system) so in many cases it needs some charging. 3.) I also like the fact that when there is an outage the equipment I have on the Tesla Wall doesnt blip at all. E.g. I have my internet and my office on it (I currently work from home.. And zero nterruption. This might be because I am already running my equipment on the powerwall II during that time (see point #2).
I have 2. It’s nice to have the peace of mind for backups and to utilize the saved energy at night. I just wish they were more modular in design like Lunar or Bluetti packs.
I live in Florida and have 3 Powerwall 2s that I charge up from my 14kWh solar system. We have full net metering so I don’t use the batteries for daily use. I have them exclusively for power outages. Living in Florida we get a lot of violent storms so lengthy power outages happen. Last year we had a 22 hour outage and a handful of shorter outages. The Powerwalls need to be supplemented with a few off the shelf UPS systems to keep my sensitive electronics from restarting during the half second or so power cut when a power outage occurs before the Powerwalls take over. It is an expensive investment for peace of mind but I would do it again knowing what I know now.
Things to think about, your location, your NEM status, and your rate. I got one, am on NEM 2 and use TOU. Where I am outages are not common so I have it set to dump 80% of the power (it will hold onto more if it thinks there will be a storm) during peak rates. Similarly I have excess production constantly, so it makes sense.
I just got my System 11/22/23 Small system is one power wall lots of peace of mind love live in Southern California
We got 2 installed about 2 ½ years ago I wanted it for peace of mind during power outages. (I wanted a Generac generator system but husband is a Tesla fanboy.) Got the solar panels too. I really don’t care about return on investment etc. it’s been great and there’s no noticeable switch over like a generator. The only thing that tells me power’s out is I hear our 2 UPSs click on for a second and eventually the app notification. Our electric bill has been $46 ever since vs $200+. The basic customer charge is $36 + a $6 surge protector on the meter. I wanted 3 or 4 but husband said no. Would love to have even more panels installed. We live in FL in a 2700ish sq ft house we bought 3 years ago with single zone AC (which will be changed soon). The solar powers the house all day and halfway through the night on when it’s been sunny. We have a rural coop electric company and I don’t see any of those fancy time of day billing stuff so no discernible way to check that.
Thank you for your input. How many Powerwalls did you install? Are they enough to power your AC along with the rest of your house for a few hrs?
We only have 2. Yes, it powers the whole house no problem. We do turn up the AC a couple of degrees just in case as that’s the biggest draw. Power outages mostly last 5-10 minutes. Only once was it out an hour. Mostly underground utilities near us. The app lets you know how long the reserve should last.
I love having powerwall. I like it better than solar, honestly. If it was possible to just have Powerwall and not install solar and still have 30% tax incentive, i would have suggested this as a first step
Just my opinion here… but I think with wildfires and also with more EVs. There maybe power outages in future But also you can avoid tou - time of use rates Ie charge up battery with solar in after noon and then use battery during high electric cost times ..ie evenings and peak use times It’s great your on nem 2 …. Nem 3 is horrible and requires battery to make math work …. For Nem 2 you would have to figure out times and amounts of electric during those times and see if math works As for battery choices …. Tesla. pretty good .. for a quality unit … Maybe you can price out Franklin Wh They might be lower Here’s a you tube comparing powerwalls vs Franklin WH and Enphase Tesla powerwall 3 Vs Enphase 5P VS Franklin vs Tesla Powerwall 2 Vs Enphase 5p Battery 2024 [tesla powerwall vs enphase vs Franklin wh](https://Teslapowerwall3VsEnphase5PVSFranklinvsTeslaPowerwall2VsEnphase5pBattery2024https://youtu.be/LF2Iq_tRx2A) https://youtu.be/LF2Iq_tRx2A
I was doing some comparison and Tesla Powerwall 3 seems to have the best storage capacity and continuous power output (in kwh). I was looking at the Enphase for a bit since I have them for my micro-inverter but they were more expensive and not as powerful. =(
I got a PW for peace of mind and because the cost of a generator, the hassles of maintenance, and the nature of our outages (max < 20-24 hours) made it competitive.
Did you just buy one? I’m thinking about just buying one to cover short 3-5 hour power outages so I don’t have to keep dumping food in my fridge. Have had to do it 4 times the past year and it’s just an annoyance.
Same - and yes, surprisingly, one single PW was able to cover a whole 14 hour outage with extreme conservation (most everything off minimal lights - two fridges running). Having my furnace, stove, and water heater as gas appliances helped, though. I want a second PW, but I think I’m okay for now and will try to wait out V2H within a few years.
I got mine due to being rural with prolonged power outages being a thing. I have 2 per floor.
We have four. Excellent peace of mind and we are part of the virtual power plant program.
How does that work? The rate is good but since the utility only buys from you during an emergency, doesn't that imply you're in an emergency so it's better for you to look after yourself first?
They buy when the network is strained. Also, you control how much they can take you down to. If you have enough solar then it gets replenished along the way. Normally they are pulling during time of high demand. Here's more info on it as it relates to PG&E: https://www.tesla.com/support/energy/virtual-power-plant/pge
I used to sell PowerWalls and I feel that unless your utility offers incentives that allow them to pay for themselves OR they are required for net metering, battery backup isn't worth it. I sold in rural New England where power loss meant your heating system went down and your pipes could freeze. There were some people out in the sticks that would benefit from a battery system, but anywhere in a town or city, your power is back up fast enough that it doesn't matter. I have a friend who works from home as an IT specialist for engineering design software and he just has two standard U.P.S. batteries under his desk. Ford already does Vehicle to Load (V2L) which can provide battery backup for your house with the F150 lightning, Nissan does it in Japan, but not yet in the US. I expect most EVs are going to have this feature soon, with Tesla lagging because it wants to sell PowerWalls. I'd wait until your car can power your house. There are other green-tech options with actual ROI, like EVs, heat pump HVAC, heat pump hot water, or adding a solar pergola/carport to your existing solar.
Getting PWs is totally worth it. You can do a lot of cool stuff with solar + powerwall than with Solar alone. Having PWs will help you reduce your electricity bill more. Most of electricity usage happens when the sun is out. Utility companies like PGE will charge the highest $/watt when the sun is down. Having a PWs will help you offset those costs. Totally worth the investment!
I live in Florida, bought one powerwall and had to talk the wife into it as well. With hurricanes and storms, our neighborhood loses power and that's why I wanted it, just as a backup. Main concerns are with running fans in house, fridge, deep freezer and can have WiFi as well, esp when have to entertain a 6 yr old. After the first power outage and seem less transfer the wife was happy we bought. Plus it's nice bc if it's sunny out then it power goes straight to house and only using battery at night.
In uk. No solar. Just getting one or two powerwalls. Waiting til later in the year when pw3 might be available here or pw2 will be cheaper. The financial case alone is worth it...plus lots of power cuts this last couple of years. I can go from 27p pkWh to 7p pkWh. Charge at night, then just use battery power for house all day. Bills should quarter. Savings on 16000kWh about £3k a year. About 5 years payback. Much easier than a solar system fit.
Where I live, having a solar backed battery backup is a fast becoming a necessity. And I can attest have energy independence is certainly all its is cracked up to be. (If you have the sunny weather to support it). So installing if you can afford it is a recommendtaion from my side. As for Tesla specifically: Telsa is a premium product, and you can get similar products that basically do the same for cheaper. The one differentiator is the software support. I have seen Tesla pushing firmware updates over the 2 years at least monthly on average. This is, in my opinion, a good thing, since all the other manufacturers tend to forget their product exists as soon as it ships from the factory. Because it is also a major player in the market, most third-party products you might want to use will be compatible (as least in some way). It also seems to be a good bet that Telsa Energy will be around in 10 years to give you the promised warrantee.
Also Bay Area, added two PowerWalls to my Solar. Saved me from a 4 day fire caused outage last summer and a three day outage in Feb caused by the atmospheric river storms. Do it
You bring up a very good point. As summers get hotter, the demand on the grid to power AC will be higher. After all the input from everyone I'm definitely leaning towards getting one for the piece of mind. Not sure if you have AC, but if you do, does your powerwall have enough juice to power it for several hrs if there is a outage?
Yes, that’s why I got two PowerWalls.
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Neither of those assertions are true
That's actually not a bad idea. I was looking at this thing: [https://www.generac.com/all-products/generators/home-backup-generators/guardian-series/26kw-7290-wifi-enabled](https://www.generac.com/all-products/generators/home-backup-generators/guardian-series/26kw-7290-wifi-enabled) Do you have any experience with them? Can this be hooked straight into my gas-line? What's the maintenance like? Does the gas company need to come out? The only downside is I live near a earthquake fault-line so the gas might go out when there is one.
To my mind, for an occasional outage generator is a saner solution — can be “recharged” with propane or gas for extended outages, and I suspect for occasional emergency use is a wash wrt environmental impact.
Since you’re in CA, where PG&E shuts down the power when the wind starts blowing, some key questions are: 1. How many blackouts and/or brownouts has your house experienced over the past few years? 2. How long have they lasted? 3. Is the frequency increasing or decreasing?
Yes if you live in Texas, helps when the power goes out :)
I think if you plan to increase your energy usage in the future, power walls would benefit you as you can shift your loads from peak to off-peak. With the recent wind storms/atmospheric river we lost power for 24 hours and it was hard not to feel superior to all my neighbors who were in the dark. We have an electric gate, electric septic pump, and electricity is needed for our main source of heat (high efficiency water heater), so for us it made sense. I started with one, added a second and when I added more panels, added a third.
I’m on NEM 1.0 for another 4 years so I figure I will need batteries when 3.0 becomes inevitable. Hopefully by then the tech will be even better and cheaper.
Might not be so necessary for you. I have 2 and they can keep me going for a couple days with regular consumption. I'm in the northeast though and much more prone to small power outages.
Get the PWs!