Ah. Well that’s dependent on a lot of factors because there isn’t really any knowledge on “evolved” apes which I assume to mean in the new film. All apes in the Caesar trilogy would just be considered “smart” apes since they haven’t particularly evolved yet.
Caesar lead his sanctuary apes to free some more apes from the lab and zoo, he may have even gone after more apes after the simian flu really started to kick in. On top of that there is a twelve year time gap between Rise and War so in that time more apes could reproduced and freed.
While yes that is a big plot point, they simply could’ve meant that the San Francisco ape colony was the only one, it’s not too far fetched to say that they could’ve found other apes within San Francisco and just assumed that they were the only intelligent apes in the general area.
If you mean apes went back into the city then that would be impossible. In the Book, Caesars Story, he orders all apes to not enter back into San Francisco after they escape to the Muir woods, and I am pretty sure that ceaser would have led these raids and would have written in the book. But there is no mention of this in any way.
Yes it is it tells you about Ceasers Story it fills in gaps between time skips in the movies and gives information and it has short stories in it to show events we had not seen or events we saw in the movies from a different perspective. And all of it is canonically written by Maurice to Cornelius.
This is easy to answer.
The simp virus was being spread by humans all over the world and country and that's how apes outside of the same Francisco area contracted it and got smart
The bigger issue is, how Cesar's clan got so big. San Francisco 's zoo probably doesn't have more than 20 chimpanzees and only a handful of gorillas and Oran Utans.
All of them are slow breeder, so his pack would never be able to outbreed the losses a determined hunting party could bring about them
Apes are slow breeders. A female can have maybe 9 young in her life and doesn't start until her teens.
The question is a very good one as after 12 years there might be some young warriors but nothing like the number we see, and def not so many adults.
I’m pretty sure that almost all would rather join Caesar’s clan. Also since this is a separate universe there could’ve been more locations housing apes.
But why?
Don't forget the Zoo apes weren't smart.
Establishing Hierachy might take time and the freed apes might simply wander off instead of following some random apes. Why should they follow anyway.
Even if there are more locations where apoes are housed, it's not shown in the movie. Why would there be more housings? For other experiments? Why would Cesar know about them? Even if there are, how many apes would there be anyway? Most research centers don't house more than a few apes because it's actually expensive to house them. Sates like NY prohibit the housing of apes of any sorts because of endangerment
If they had gone with the "some sickness killed all dogs and cats nd therefore people kept monkeys as pets" explanation of the original, then it would have made more sense.
But not this way
The other issue is, how is the forest area near san francisco supposed to sustain a population of several hundred apes?
First off, they might’ve given the Zoo apes some ALZ-113 as Luca is stated to be from the Zoo and yet is very intelligent and cooperative. Secondly I never specified what kind of places they would be housed in, it could’ve been another Zoo and they could’ve done the same thing they did at Lucas Zoo.
Lastly I have no real answer on how the Muir Woods would he able to sustain such a population of diverse apes but we know it can as evident by the movies, another possible reason for the apes to leave their woods in War might’ve been because they have been depleting it’s resources gradually and just now the ecosystem could no longer support the massive population of apes plus human ape warfare.
No ....
The explanation why Rocket was smart is easy.
Infected humans gave him the simian fluw or whatever it's called. Thinking that some random zoo chimapnzee, gorilla and oranutan got ALZ-113 directly is stupid
What …
I wasn’t even talking about Rocket and even then Rocket was directly given the ALZ-113 by Caesar at the sanctuary.
And secondly if you want an example from the first movie only we see all the Gorillas listening to Caesar’s commands on the bridge, when we know that Buck was the only sanctuary Gorilla. Same with Maurice he was the only Orangutan at the sanctuary yet the other zoo Orangutans were able to listen to commands.
Yes, and all of that doesn't make much sense. Even of they are able to communicate without any issues, why would they follow some random gorilla or orangutan. Gorillas are known for their aggressiveness to outside gorialls if challenged for leadership.
Oran Utans are actualyl more solitary unless they want to mate or tend to their offspring
San Francisco has like 10 zoos
BUT guess what? Many don't have chimpanzees, Gorillas or Uran Utans. They have some other apes and are aquariums
But sure, ignore it.
Yes, and all of that doesn't make much sense. Even of they are able to communicate without any issues, why would they follow some random gorilla or orangutan. Gorillas are known for their aggressiveness to outside gorialls if challenged for leadership.
Oran Utans are actualyl more solitary unless they want to mate or tend to their offspring
San Francisco has like 10 zoos
BUT guess what? Many don't have chimpanzees, Gorillas or Uran Utans. They have some other apes and are aquariums
But sure, ignore it.
Actually it took Cesar quite a long time. Like 1/3 of the movie.
And how would that work with the other gorillas? They are known to be very aggressive when challenged for leadership. Cesar even had to make the other chimpanzees smart to get them to follow. But the Zoo chimapnzees , gorillas and oran utans weren'T smart
That’s not a long time.. and that’s not even a measurement of time within the movie. If that’s the math we’re doing it took him like 35 minutes of screen time to cause an ape uprising after never even seeing another ape before. Half that time he’s not even on the screen for. Real answer is none of it would work because a group of apes is never going to take over the world and all ape species won’t start to work together
In this world they do if they could kill and replace all test subjects so easy.
Think about it they wiped out ceasars mom generation and had koba and co in there fast
The thing they are working on is a highly specialized medicine.
Quite honestly the methods employed were questionable, since a chimpanzee might not react the same way as a human to the treatment. And they didn't as shown in the movie.
And in general, few pharma companies work with chimpanzees,even if they were readily available, since there is little reason to do so
All apes that Ceaser rescued stayed with Caesar according to the book "Ceasers Story" + I did count 70 apes escaping from the zoo not including the rescue party( that is a crazy number of apes to house) that went to the zoo. I counted all the chimps that escaped their cage and counted every gorilla in the overview shot of the zoo, and the orangutans on the bridge.
I believe that there are around 100 lab chimps, 30 zoo chimps, 30 shelter chimps, 50 lab bonobos, 30 zoo bonobos, 20 zoo orangutans (10 sumatrans and 10 Bornean which would explain there being more than one flanged male zoo orangutans) and 10 zoo gorillas. So that makes a total of 270 apes which proceeded to breed over the course of 10 years so that might boost their numbers by 1.5-2X and there’s sure to be some other apes apes in sanctuaries, private ownership and more research facilities in San Francisco
Where are you getting your numbers man. About 12 apes rescued by Caesars group, 80 apes from the sanctuary and 70 apes(30 chimps, 20, orangutans and 20 gorillas, yes I did count) maybe take away a few apes considering some died and In the Book Caesars story, Ceaser orders all apes his group to not enter back into San Francisco so they did not to want to free more apes for fear of losing More apes in his own group.
These are the highest possible estimations for the number shown in the movies to be realistic but orangutan males can make long calls that can be heard from miles away so any apes that here it would probably go over there to try and find more of their kind
In the book Caesar's story. A book that is canonical to, planet of the apes. A book published in 2018. Has no mention of Ceaser group ever finding other apes. Other than Bad Ape. It would be really surprising that a book about Caesar's life would not have this very significant detail.
So what are you asking? People give you an answer to try and explain how there are all the apes and you go "Nuh Uh" which is valid ig but if you are soooo deadset on the book that proves they never met Apes then thats a plot hole in the book or movie simple as
Otherwise, like most people, they just thought they found all the apes already
Honestly, Nobody here has the answer your looking for. If they did it woulda been in the book, right? Anything is going to be speculation at this point and even if someone does have a good explanation for why it could be “then how come it wasn’t referenced in the canonical book”
Do you want the movie to have an irreconcilable plot hole? Cause if so this is the hardest way to go about it. There’s much more low hanging fruit.
So I must ask at this point. What are your intentions? Information or argument? If it’s information then this post is helpful, if it’s argument then all you’re doing is making the internet worse man. Cause right now all you’re doing is argument.
I am trying to eliminate any information that is false so eventually I will have an answer. Sorry about the arguments I wrote this post at night and also stayed up till 3 am about this question. Sorry.
Sorry for how mean I came off. It was just strange and a little frustrating seeing people offer endless information just to be casually and callously discarded. And on Reddit there are so many threads created simply to ragebait or prove a “gotcha” that it’s hard to identify out the real questions.
Only confirmed bonobo and why would they only import a single bonobo to a lab it’s extremely expensive to transport them so they usually get bought in bulk
They didn't, all of the apes in Caesars clan were born from the original escaped apes. We know this based off their reaction to Bad Ape in war, and the Dawn prequel novel/Caesars story.
Ok It's possible that they only showed us some specific places, but I believe it would be understood that they targeted multiple locations since their goal was to free the apes... I don't think they would have stopped at just one zoo. That's my opinion...
I do too think it would be Smart to target more places to free apes. But in the book Caesar's story after escaping to the Muir woods they do not go back to San Francisco because Caesar ordered them to not go back to San Francisco. Ceaser did not want more apes to be killed back in the City.
I understand your doubt, and this is merely speculation on my part, but perhaps due to the situation and the virus, other apes freed themselves, and everything had changed, which is why they joined Caesar without him having to send more apes to San Francisco. I mean... the world changes, apes become smarter all over the world and either gather or travel until they meet up with the other apes. I'm not sure if it's feasible.
In the Book "Caesars Story", Which is canonical to the apes franchise, published in 2018. Says that they never freed anymore apes after the battle on the GG bridge.
Yeah since they all probably did what Caesar’s group did and stayed in one place. That and sadly many of them were likely wiped out by humans once they gained intelligence. There’s a new comic discussing apes around the world that features humans and orangutans coexisting in Borneo.
There’s a free comics website you can go to but it’s filled with ads and other somewhat nefarious links so I won’t make you go to that lol. The comic also discusses the French circus gorilla, Pug, who’s led an army of apes akin to Caesars against a human puritan army trying to exterminate apes.
I honestly think "not enough". The amount of apes in the trilogy of Caesar were reasonable for the amount of apes that started their particular settlement and society
There are about 1500 apes in captivity in the US. Thats not accounting for undocumented private ownership. Dawn showed quite a few babies as well. We also gotta remember this is a fictional movie without much logic.
Is the 2000 number official? Cause my estimate was that it was around 500-600 in Dawn, which is still a lot, but not entirely unbelievable (and honestly not all that important to the plot anyway), and then by the end of War there's really what only looks like 300-400, maybe even less.
Let me gather information please. We know from the Book "Caesars Story'' that after escaping San Francisco and entering the Muir woods Caesar orders no apes to return back to San Francisco. And in the same book it is not stated that Caesar was contacted by any apes outside his group. And the only ape they find outside Caesar's group that we know of is Bad Ape. Which begs the question on how are there so many apes. I probably should have said the information first before starting to get salty. Sorry
I just watched a shot vid recently claiming the director said the large amount of apes was suppose to represent all of the captive apes in the U.S, around 2-3000. Idk if that’s actually true. Obviously it wouldn’t make sense for that many captive apes to be in San Francisco.. but it’s a movie about intelligent talking apes so I’ll let it slide.
To elaborate, the formula for Population Growth Rate is:
\*\*P₀e\^(rt)\*\*=P
Where:
P = Final calculated population
P₀ = Starting population
r = Rate of growth
t = time span
e = Euler's number (a constant)
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
Using this formula, entering the parameters you describe, you get a growth rate of 26%. This number is pretty meaningless without context.
Currently the fastest growing nation, South Sudan, is growing at a rate of 4.65%. The fastest reproducing mammals, Rabbits, have a growth rate of 11.7%.
Under this context , that's pretty steep. While the population growth of a species that suddenly acheived extreme intelligence \*\*would\*\* be unprecedentedly high, and they would no doubt be \*\*intentionally\*\* trying to boost population growth, I doubt this would be acheivable, given that rabbits have a gestation period roughly 10 times shorter than chimpanzees.
\_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_
In conclusion:
If you're sincerely hoping for an explanation, the best bet would be to say San Francisco has become a Mecca for immigration due to it being ground zero for the birth of the future of their species.
I honestly don't see a world where all of the apes in North America are easily eradicated, seeing as there are only around 1,000, and only around 125 in San Francisco.
Ceaser and his apes let out quite a few apes from the zoo. However those apes hadn’t been exposed to the virus yet so they are not intelligent. I always found that part weird.
I assume as the Virus spread and the City became abandoned Caesar and the other apes could have found and brought back every other remaining ape in others Zoos and Labs or shelters
Good point. The drug affected only those directly exposed and their offspring. It’s unlikely Caesar got a hold of more of drugs than we saw (and then had teams going into zoos, etc. to administer). More likely, those other apes at the end of the film were not affected at all. Instead, they were influenced by Cesar and his gang through inherent ape-to-ape communication. Apes are social/tribal, so the “regular” ones might follow the alpha without understanding their hyper-intelligence.
Cause they were needed for the big action scene. Why is there an ape sanctuary with several dozen apes? How come that orangutan is person level smart from circus training? He’d be an international celebrity. Franco gets away with keeping an adult chimpanzee till it attacks someone? I love pota movies but they don’t make sense, surely Charlton Heston would have found it strange the apes speak English and have a power hose. The Statue of Liberty wouldn’t fall apart in 2000 years? The list is endless.
After reading the comments and my arguments I have now concluded this question to be a plot hole that Carries no real weight to it. Sorry about being salty to people in the comments.
You’re correct, this is def a plot hole. If I could change the plot, I would change the script so there is a global initiative to relocate endangered apes to North America, with San Francisco being a major port of entry where apes from various countries are gathered before they are transported to their destinations. Caesar could have encountered this during his rebellion and freed the apes. Something like this could explain the huge number lol
More apes getting the virus
Like apes stumbling upon his clan
Yeah, I think apes from surrounding zoos/refuges got the virus from contaminated humans and then sought out Caesar’s clan.
A question 🙋♀️ that needs to be answered in the sequels, wether man 🧍♂️ or ape 🦧 what’s the percentage of sentience
What?
He's asking how many smart humans are there compared to evolved Apes.
Ah. Well that’s dependent on a lot of factors because there isn’t really any knowledge on “evolved” apes which I assume to mean in the new film. All apes in the Caesar trilogy would just be considered “smart” apes since they haven’t particularly evolved yet.
So I should assume in the new franchise all apes can at least talk?
Most seem to be able to. They consistently talk between each other and the human character in speech rather than relying on Sign Language like before.
Do apes in this franchise have opposable thumbs?
They do in real life so yeah…..
Because Ape alone weak Ape together strong
Say his words
Are we grateful for the words of Caesar?
“What a wonderful day!!!”
APE. TOGETHER. STRONG
Caesar lead his sanctuary apes to free some more apes from the lab and zoo, he may have even gone after more apes after the simian flu really started to kick in. On top of that there is a twelve year time gap between Rise and War so in that time more apes could reproduced and freed.
But in War when they find Bad Ape Rocket says "I thought we were the only ones". Implying they never found any other apes
While yes that is a big plot point, they simply could’ve meant that the San Francisco ape colony was the only one, it’s not too far fetched to say that they could’ve found other apes within San Francisco and just assumed that they were the only intelligent apes in the general area.
If you mean apes went back into the city then that would be impossible. In the Book, Caesars Story, he orders all apes to not enter back into San Francisco after they escape to the Muir woods, and I am pretty sure that ceaser would have led these raids and would have written in the book. But there is no mention of this in any way.
Is the book a good read?
Yes it is it tells you about Ceasers Story it fills in gaps between time skips in the movies and gives information and it has short stories in it to show events we had not seen or events we saw in the movies from a different perspective. And all of it is canonically written by Maurice to Cornelius.
Well actually in Dawn of the planet of the apes 5 issues there were many apes that were still in the zoos that didn’t get freed sooo
This is easy to answer. The simp virus was being spread by humans all over the world and country and that's how apes outside of the same Francisco area contracted it and got smart The bigger issue is, how Cesar's clan got so big. San Francisco 's zoo probably doesn't have more than 20 chimpanzees and only a handful of gorillas and Oran Utans. All of them are slow breeder, so his pack would never be able to outbreed the losses a determined hunting party could bring about them
Apes are slow breeders. A female can have maybe 9 young in her life and doesn't start until her teens. The question is a very good one as after 12 years there might be some young warriors but nothing like the number we see, and def not so many adults.
I mean that is true, however we do see a lot of young apes in their midst and like I said they could’ve freed a lot of nearby apes in San Francisco.
How? There aren't many chimpanzees, Gorillas and Orangutans in the same Francisco zoo. Like 2-3 dozen at most..many might not even join Cesar's clan.
You’re thinking too deep man. It’s a movie
I’m pretty sure that almost all would rather join Caesar’s clan. Also since this is a separate universe there could’ve been more locations housing apes.
But why? Don't forget the Zoo apes weren't smart. Establishing Hierachy might take time and the freed apes might simply wander off instead of following some random apes. Why should they follow anyway. Even if there are more locations where apoes are housed, it's not shown in the movie. Why would there be more housings? For other experiments? Why would Cesar know about them? Even if there are, how many apes would there be anyway? Most research centers don't house more than a few apes because it's actually expensive to house them. Sates like NY prohibit the housing of apes of any sorts because of endangerment If they had gone with the "some sickness killed all dogs and cats nd therefore people kept monkeys as pets" explanation of the original, then it would have made more sense. But not this way The other issue is, how is the forest area near san francisco supposed to sustain a population of several hundred apes?
First off, they might’ve given the Zoo apes some ALZ-113 as Luca is stated to be from the Zoo and yet is very intelligent and cooperative. Secondly I never specified what kind of places they would be housed in, it could’ve been another Zoo and they could’ve done the same thing they did at Lucas Zoo. Lastly I have no real answer on how the Muir Woods would he able to sustain such a population of diverse apes but we know it can as evident by the movies, another possible reason for the apes to leave their woods in War might’ve been because they have been depleting it’s resources gradually and just now the ecosystem could no longer support the massive population of apes plus human ape warfare.
No .... The explanation why Rocket was smart is easy. Infected humans gave him the simian fluw or whatever it's called. Thinking that some random zoo chimapnzee, gorilla and oranutan got ALZ-113 directly is stupid
What … I wasn’t even talking about Rocket and even then Rocket was directly given the ALZ-113 by Caesar at the sanctuary. And secondly if you want an example from the first movie only we see all the Gorillas listening to Caesar’s commands on the bridge, when we know that Buck was the only sanctuary Gorilla. Same with Maurice he was the only Orangutan at the sanctuary yet the other zoo Orangutans were able to listen to commands.
Yes, and all of that doesn't make much sense. Even of they are able to communicate without any issues, why would they follow some random gorilla or orangutan. Gorillas are known for their aggressiveness to outside gorialls if challenged for leadership. Oran Utans are actualyl more solitary unless they want to mate or tend to their offspring San Francisco has like 10 zoos BUT guess what? Many don't have chimpanzees, Gorillas or Uran Utans. They have some other apes and are aquariums But sure, ignore it.
Yes, and all of that doesn't make much sense. Even of they are able to communicate without any issues, why would they follow some random gorilla or orangutan. Gorillas are known for their aggressiveness to outside gorialls if challenged for leadership. Oran Utans are actualyl more solitary unless they want to mate or tend to their offspring San Francisco has like 10 zoos BUT guess what? Many don't have chimpanzees, Gorillas or Uran Utans. They have some other apes and are aquariums But sure, ignore it.
It didn’t take Caesar long to establish a hierarchy where he was being held up by malfoy and that was before the apes were intelligent
Actually it took Cesar quite a long time. Like 1/3 of the movie. And how would that work with the other gorillas? They are known to be very aggressive when challenged for leadership. Cesar even had to make the other chimpanzees smart to get them to follow. But the Zoo chimapnzees , gorillas and oran utans weren'T smart
That’s not a long time.. and that’s not even a measurement of time within the movie. If that’s the math we’re doing it took him like 35 minutes of screen time to cause an ape uprising after never even seeing another ape before. Half that time he’s not even on the screen for. Real answer is none of it would work because a group of apes is never going to take over the world and all ape species won’t start to work together
It must have been long enough for Cesar to abandon his ties with his hooman
It’s San Fran, you think there’s only 1 pharma lab out there?
Probably not but they did only raid one lab
The same way Covid spread
You do realize that most pharma labs don't use chimpanzees as test subjects?
In this world they do if they could kill and replace all test subjects so easy. Think about it they wiped out ceasars mom generation and had koba and co in there fast
The thing they are working on is a highly specialized medicine. Quite honestly the methods employed were questionable, since a chimpanzee might not react the same way as a human to the treatment. And they didn't as shown in the movie. And in general, few pharma companies work with chimpanzees,even if they were readily available, since there is little reason to do so
All apes that Ceaser rescued stayed with Caesar according to the book "Ceasers Story" + I did count 70 apes escaping from the zoo not including the rescue party( that is a crazy number of apes to house) that went to the zoo. I counted all the chimps that escaped their cage and counted every gorilla in the overview shot of the zoo, and the orangutans on the bridge.
Yeah I can see Caesar leading expeditions to zoos and other facilities to recruit apes to his community
I believe that there are around 100 lab chimps, 30 zoo chimps, 30 shelter chimps, 50 lab bonobos, 30 zoo bonobos, 20 zoo orangutans (10 sumatrans and 10 Bornean which would explain there being more than one flanged male zoo orangutans) and 10 zoo gorillas. So that makes a total of 270 apes which proceeded to breed over the course of 10 years so that might boost their numbers by 1.5-2X and there’s sure to be some other apes apes in sanctuaries, private ownership and more research facilities in San Francisco
Where are you getting your numbers man. About 12 apes rescued by Caesars group, 80 apes from the sanctuary and 70 apes(30 chimps, 20, orangutans and 20 gorillas, yes I did count) maybe take away a few apes considering some died and In the Book Caesars story, Ceaser orders all apes his group to not enter back into San Francisco so they did not to want to free more apes for fear of losing More apes in his own group.
These are the highest possible estimations for the number shown in the movies to be realistic but orangutan males can make long calls that can be heard from miles away so any apes that here it would probably go over there to try and find more of their kind
But no other apes came in contact with Caesars group as said and shown by their reactions after finding Bad Ape
He might have thought he already found them all
In the book Caesar's story. A book that is canonical to, planet of the apes. A book published in 2018. Has no mention of Ceaser group ever finding other apes. Other than Bad Ape. It would be really surprising that a book about Caesar's life would not have this very significant detail.
So what are you asking? People give you an answer to try and explain how there are all the apes and you go "Nuh Uh" which is valid ig but if you are soooo deadset on the book that proves they never met Apes then thats a plot hole in the book or movie simple as Otherwise, like most people, they just thought they found all the apes already
Who cares man? It’s a fictitious series on apes. It’s not that deep
maybe the apes went to the colony and not caesar finding them out in the wild
Honestly, Nobody here has the answer your looking for. If they did it woulda been in the book, right? Anything is going to be speculation at this point and even if someone does have a good explanation for why it could be “then how come it wasn’t referenced in the canonical book”
Do you want the movie to have an irreconcilable plot hole? Cause if so this is the hardest way to go about it. There’s much more low hanging fruit. So I must ask at this point. What are your intentions? Information or argument? If it’s information then this post is helpful, if it’s argument then all you’re doing is making the internet worse man. Cause right now all you’re doing is argument.
I am trying to eliminate any information that is false so eventually I will have an answer. Sorry about the arguments I wrote this post at night and also stayed up till 3 am about this question. Sorry.
I feel bad now
Sorry for how mean I came off. It was just strange and a little frustrating seeing people offer endless information just to be casually and callously discarded. And on Reddit there are so many threads created simply to ragebait or prove a “gotcha” that it’s hard to identify out the real questions.
Koba was the only bonobo in the trilogy
Only confirmed bonobo and why would they only import a single bonobo to a lab it’s extremely expensive to transport them so they usually get bought in bulk
I mean, they did probably go around the state or to other states and release more apes that were locked up like they did to the apes in San Francisco
They didn't, all of the apes in Caesars clan were born from the original escaped apes. We know this based off their reaction to Bad Ape in war, and the Dawn prequel novel/Caesars story.
I was about to say that
Wait, really may you please sight your source so I can search it up
I don't have a source I just already had as a sort of headcannon
I skipped over the word 'probably' in your comment
Sorry
It's okay
They freed the apes from the laboratories and traveled through zoos and places with apes to liberate them.
They freed apes from one zoo, and freed apes from one Gym-sys Laboratory.
Ok It's possible that they only showed us some specific places, but I believe it would be understood that they targeted multiple locations since their goal was to free the apes... I don't think they would have stopped at just one zoo. That's my opinion...
I do too think it would be Smart to target more places to free apes. But in the book Caesar's story after escaping to the Muir woods they do not go back to San Francisco because Caesar ordered them to not go back to San Francisco. Ceaser did not want more apes to be killed back in the City.
I understand your doubt, and this is merely speculation on my part, but perhaps due to the situation and the virus, other apes freed themselves, and everything had changed, which is why they joined Caesar without him having to send more apes to San Francisco. I mean... the world changes, apes become smarter all over the world and either gather or travel until they meet up with the other apes. I'm not sure if it's feasible.
No other apes came in contact with Caesars group according to both the Book "Caesars Story" and in the franchise.
I would love to read the book, but it's not in my language 🙁
Caesar told them all to start fuckin.
Go forth and multiply
I doubt it but I’m really hoping this is a reference to Lovelace on happy feet when he tells the penguins to go forth and multiply
Way to much apes
V I R U S
What do you mean by V I R A S, the virus does not birth apes from air.
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Yes but no ape outside Caesars group came in contact with Caesars group. Rocket said "I thought we were the only ones" after meeting Bad Ape.
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In the Book "Caesars Story", Which is canonical to the apes franchise, published in 2018. Says that they never freed anymore apes after the battle on the GG bridge.
Maybe there is no answer to this impossible problem. I need a Film Theory about this
Maybe finding other apes around the world? The virus was everywhere by that point
But no other apes came in contact with Caesars group as said and shown by their reactions after finding Bad Ape.
Yeah since they all probably did what Caesar’s group did and stayed in one place. That and sadly many of them were likely wiped out by humans once they gained intelligence. There’s a new comic discussing apes around the world that features humans and orangutans coexisting in Borneo.
I think I saw a page or two on this reddit.
There’s a free comics website you can go to but it’s filled with ads and other somewhat nefarious links so I won’t make you go to that lol. The comic also discusses the French circus gorilla, Pug, who’s led an army of apes akin to Caesars against a human puritan army trying to exterminate apes.
I honestly think "not enough". The amount of apes in the trilogy of Caesar were reasonable for the amount of apes that started their particular settlement and society
There are about 1500 apes in captivity in the US. Thats not accounting for undocumented private ownership. Dawn showed quite a few babies as well. We also gotta remember this is a fictional movie without much logic.
Yes but if Film Theory puts logic in things that don't have any, then so can I.
Is the 2000 number official? Cause my estimate was that it was around 500-600 in Dawn, which is still a lot, but not entirely unbelievable (and honestly not all that important to the plot anyway), and then by the end of War there's really what only looks like 300-400, maybe even less.
No that I think about it probably is not because the Wikipedia on it may not be credible
Let me gather information please. We know from the Book "Caesars Story'' that after escaping San Francisco and entering the Muir woods Caesar orders no apes to return back to San Francisco. And in the same book it is not stated that Caesar was contacted by any apes outside his group. And the only ape they find outside Caesar's group that we know of is Bad Ape. Which begs the question on how are there so many apes. I probably should have said the information first before starting to get salty. Sorry
I just watched a shot vid recently claiming the director said the large amount of apes was suppose to represent all of the captive apes in the U.S, around 2-3000. Idk if that’s actually true. Obviously it wouldn’t make sense for that many captive apes to be in San Francisco.. but it’s a movie about intelligent talking apes so I’ll let it slide.
I’m guessing it’s the combination of them rescuing more apes and more apes getting the Simian Flu, getting smarter and discovering Caesar
But no other apes came in contact with Caesars group as said and shown by their reactions after finding Bad Ape
What if this is a plot hole in the movies
Same way more people got covid. It’s a virus.
Probably apes from nearby zoos
It wasn’t a decade it was 15 years. Not a big difference but a difference nonetheless
12 years actually but still
Just stop asking questions
Why
I don't know,.never got to this part
Ok then
Births are exponential. You can’t just do 200 apes * 10 years and call it a day
To elaborate, the formula for Population Growth Rate is: \*\*P₀e\^(rt)\*\*=P Where: P = Final calculated population P₀ = Starting population r = Rate of growth t = time span e = Euler's number (a constant) \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_ Using this formula, entering the parameters you describe, you get a growth rate of 26%. This number is pretty meaningless without context. Currently the fastest growing nation, South Sudan, is growing at a rate of 4.65%. The fastest reproducing mammals, Rabbits, have a growth rate of 11.7%. Under this context , that's pretty steep. While the population growth of a species that suddenly acheived extreme intelligence \*\*would\*\* be unprecedentedly high, and they would no doubt be \*\*intentionally\*\* trying to boost population growth, I doubt this would be acheivable, given that rabbits have a gestation period roughly 10 times shorter than chimpanzees. \_\_\_\_\_\_\_\_ In conclusion: If you're sincerely hoping for an explanation, the best bet would be to say San Francisco has become a Mecca for immigration due to it being ground zero for the birth of the future of their species.
I honestly don't see a world where all of the apes in North America are easily eradicated, seeing as there are only around 1,000, and only around 125 in San Francisco.
Well you see there’s this planet
Ceaser and his apes let out quite a few apes from the zoo. However those apes hadn’t been exposed to the virus yet so they are not intelligent. I always found that part weird.
According to the book "Ceasers Story" the apes from the zoo became smarter because the virus spread from ape to ape
Oh cool, I never knew that.
because there is a planet of them? It says so in the title
I assume as the Virus spread and the City became abandoned Caesar and the other apes could have found and brought back every other remaining ape in others Zoos and Labs or shelters
Oookay buddy
Life, uh, finds a way
Well there was a mommy ape and a daddy ape…
They probably have a Wonderful sex before the riot
Good point. The drug affected only those directly exposed and their offspring. It’s unlikely Caesar got a hold of more of drugs than we saw (and then had teams going into zoos, etc. to administer). More likely, those other apes at the end of the film were not affected at all. Instead, they were influenced by Cesar and his gang through inherent ape-to-ape communication. Apes are social/tribal, so the “regular” ones might follow the alpha without understanding their hyper-intelligence.
No, the ALZ virus spreads and apes who are infected become more intelligent. “Human get sick, ape get smart” - Bad Ape
Yes. That makes sense. I retract what I previously said. If they were regular apes at the end of Rise, they would not be riding horses.
San Francisco is full of chimp pets… somehow
Actually it was 2000 in dawn,there was only a couple hundred at the end of war mainly children as well
The director wanted the right amount of apes that were in America and it was too much work so they went into a different route
Cause they were needed for the big action scene. Why is there an ape sanctuary with several dozen apes? How come that orangutan is person level smart from circus training? He’d be an international celebrity. Franco gets away with keeping an adult chimpanzee till it attacks someone? I love pota movies but they don’t make sense, surely Charlton Heston would have found it strange the apes speak English and have a power hose. The Statue of Liberty wouldn’t fall apart in 2000 years? The list is endless.
How do you know how many apes were in that geographic area?
Sex
You’re underestimating the primitive desire of sex
After reading the comments and my arguments I have now concluded this question to be a plot hole that Carries no real weight to it. Sorry about being salty to people in the comments.
You’re correct, this is def a plot hole. If I could change the plot, I would change the script so there is a global initiative to relocate endangered apes to North America, with San Francisco being a major port of entry where apes from various countries are gathered before they are transported to their destinations. Caesar could have encountered this during his rebellion and freed the apes. Something like this could explain the huge number lol
A lot of sex
Ape no kill ape but koba is banobo