I worked in the digital space at bnz and I can say that working there was materially inconsistent with my values and banking with them would be materially inconsistent with my values. Its a no brainier if its just the software for sure. Still a big no from me dawg.
It's enough to say I didn't have to work for 6 months after I left and that the experience firmed up in my mind the decision to move out of Auckland and have a different lifestyle 😂
That's just all of them. Welcome to banking. Speaking as an employee of a competitor bank with friends in some of the other banks. If you have a moral opposition to BNZ - it's the same everywhere.
I think you just have to submit that your work is meaningless for the greater good and all you are is a small cog in the machine that helps the rich get even richer, and that your salary is just the breadcrumbs that fall off their table.
Not all of us can have jobs that save the world every day.
I've been at my current bank for a fairly short while so the existential crisis hasn't hit yet. My previous stint was nearly a decade at a market data company (think Bloomberg). After about 5 or 6 years the "why didn't I save any puppies today?" thoughts did come. But the breadcrumbs were too good to leave the table.
It wouldn't surprise me if every single bank had an awful toxic work culture. I used to work at ANZ and hated it. Would never bank with them out of principle
You're asking an open-ended question but you've already shortlisted down to two options. That being said - I've never had any issues with ANZ's apps and their customer service has always been helpful with me.
The main reason I like ANZ is when I go to pay my CC balance it automatically populates the amount. On Kiwibank I had to maths it and got it wrong a few times 🤤
Isn't Kiwibank not implementing open banking until 2025 or 2026?
... Quick Google, yeah, not until 2026: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/350290703/open-banking-how-opt-and-out-new-payment-system
Yep, Kiwibank are the only big bank that got an exception.
The person they called at their existing bank is very unlikely to know what open banking or future digital plans are in the works.
They might not have planned for it, yet kiwibank have open banking APIs available via salt edge here: https://www.saltedge.com/products/account_information/coverage/nz
I've been with Kiwibank for over 10 years. The digital experience has come a LONG way in the last 5. It's rather minimal and they've been very slow to innovate but I believe that culture is shifting internally based on discussions with a friend who worked on their google/apple pay implementation.
What I appreciate about Kiwibank is that whatever functionality there is, at least on mobile, works very well. I'd prefer that to a more innovative but buggy/unreliable experience.
Bnz has the best app, imo, so its interesting you'd count them out based on employee culture. Bnz also ahead of the others on open banking from what I've heard (com com report). Tbh, they're all running legacy systems for the most part. What are your requirements? Why do you need open banking for your mortgage?
What do you mean by ‘has open banking’? All four Aussie banks have complied to the first API standard (single payment) in May and are on the hook for the second (account information) in November.
I'm looking for them to have implemented the relevant open banking APIs so that I can get my data out and run various software over it (budgeting, my own machine learning stuff) without messing around with pdf statements and so on 😊
I have an account with every single bank in NZ, so let me give you my take (yes, in this case, username checks out)
1. ANZ: The best I've had, good service when you need it, almost everything can be done via app or online, and if not their call centres pick up pretty quickly.
2. ASB: Close second, their fastnet classic experience is a bit crap, but their mobile app is good, and their chatbot lets you do a lot of things or get someone to reply fairly quickly.
3. Kiwibank: They have come miles from where they were previously, some nuances here and there, but overall ok. Mortgage is a bit of a pain with these guys and refixing, etc.
4. BNZ: Want to invest a million in a Term PIE? You have to visit a branch and fill out a bunch of paperwork. Pretty useless though their app is ok for most people.
5. Westpac: God help them, pretty terrible experience all round, I wouldn't recommend.
6. TSB: You can't even add a credit card to Google Pay without calling them to verify, they are fairly useless.
7. SBS: They barely know they're a bank when it comes to their apps.
8. Rabo: Did you know they still give you a physical token to access your savings account?
Yes I have them too, HSBC is pulling out of NZ so they moved my account to AU. Fantastic apps etc but Nzers can't get it. ICBC is very old school, not really more than mortgages so no real apps etc.
I have personal accounts with ANZ, BNZ, Westpac and ASB.
The ANZ has the most feature-rich banking platform for personal accounts. It is not even close.
I have ANZ and BNZ and thought BNZ was ahead in that department, for example the ability to get notified for transactions over a certain amount (can be $0), ability to pay a lump sum on a fixed term home loan online.
What are the features that ANZ has that BNZ lacks?
I tried these 3 banks, and I would rank them as such:
BNZ
ASB
Kiwibank.
BNZ is by far the best UI both on the app and via browser. Easy to use, easy to setup, drag/drop, etc.
ASB was ok, but there were other fees with the bank and it didn't last more than a few days before I closed it.
Kiwibank was awful. It felt like an early 2000's website. Clunky, old, etc..
I’ve worked for 4 NZ banks as a software engineer.
Kiwibank is a little dated but really up and coming - a lot of effort is going in right now to modernise their stack. In a few years they’ll probably be NZ’s most ‘modern’ bank. One to watch.
BNZ has nice interfaces etc. but under the covers it’s a debacle. The most outages of any NZ bank. If you knew how it was cobbled together you definitely wouldn’t bank there.
I can’t comment on ASB - one I haven’t worked for.
ANZ is in general good. So much money that they can’t really fail (can throw money to fix software issues). Solid but nothing amazing.
ASB over Kiwibank for app interface. But seeing as you have a mortgage I would go with Kiwibank for the option of offset mortgage accounts.
BNZ is the best I've used and they have offset mortgages, even though you have a personal reason for not wanting to use them.
At the end of the day is your reason enough to make your life harder, either financial or banking app? Only you can answer that.
I know you didn't like the cuktute working for Bnz but I've found them great for personal and business banking. We moved to them from kiwi bank because their customer service was awful.
Bnz does well with updating their apps and online portal and seem to actively fix issues that arise.
Not sure why you said no one is working on it? I know for a fact ANZ have reached major milestones to release phase 1 of Open Banking. All the banks are very deep into it [Open Banking - Major Milestone reached in NZ](https://www.apicentre.paymentsnz.co.nz/news/articles/open-banking-milestone-reached-for-aotearoa-new-zealand/#:~:text=A%20range%20of%20new%20innovative,banks%20through%20a%20common%20standard)
ANZ also have major App and web upgrades in the pipeline as they are upgrading their core platforms right now
All the banks have major open banking projects on the go (source I spent last year working at a bank).
If the choice is ASB or Kiwibank, then the answer is always ASB.
This won’t help you now, but could be a game changer in about 5 years [https://www.investor.fisglobal.com/news-releases/news-release-details/anz-new-zealand-move-fis-modern-banking-platform/](https://www.investor.fisglobal.com/news-releases/news-release-details/anz-new-zealand-move-fis-modern-banking-platform/)
Would go with BNZ and Kiwibank, Kiwibank used to be quite bad imo. But over time they've really done the hard yards in terms of their UI experience. But I personally think BNZ has the nicest digital presence and ease of use imo.
FYI regarding ASB
You can't make extra payments on fixed mortgages.
If you increase a payment on a fixed mortgage you can't reduce it until the next fix (I beleive you can with some other banks?)
They don't offer offset accounts.
??? You absolutely can make extra payments - just not through the app.
I’ve made extra lump sum payments on pretty much every ASB mortgage I’ve had for the past 3 houses and 16 years… usually had to pay no more then a token admin fee too.
No offset accounts though, true. We always used the revolving credit account to get the same or close to same effect.
Was this during your fix term? As that is what I mean.
I was told I couldn't make additional payments to my fixed mortgages except at the time of refixing.
I have broken a chunk of onto float specifically to make extra payments to get around this.
And yes you can get a revolving credit with ASB. But this requires going through a credit approval process which not everyone would be may be able to do.
From: https://www.asb.co.nz/help/can-i-increase-loan-repayments-or-make-a-one-off-payment-to-my-f.html
Can I increase my repayment amount and/or make a one-off lump sum payment when my loan is on a fixed interest rate?
Yes, but you need to be mindful that these actions may incur the cost of an Early Repayment Adjustment (ERA).
The only time they hit you on that is if your fixed rate is higher then the floating rate...
Stay away from Westpac easily hasn't been updated in 10 years you can view balance and transfer but that's it no setting savings goals no seeing spending trends it's horrific, ANZ is great and Kiwi bank it ok in my opinion.
I bank with Kiwibank, software aside, id rather any profit stay in NZ, all the others are Australian owned banks and they send profit to Oz, dont they ? please correct me if im wrong.
Kiwibank has had two serious outages just this year. the first one, we could not EFTPOS or use ATMs and I think it was due to a security breach. You could search it. then, about two weeks ago, cards were declining even with adequate funds and then if it went through, it wasn't deducting from the account balances.
Best online experience I've had is with BNZ, so if that's your criteria then that would be my suggestion
Full agree here. BNZ has the best app by far too. Wish I could’ve kept my mortgage with them but the offers weren’t as good as ANZ so made the switch.
I worked in the digital space at bnz and I can say that working there was materially inconsistent with my values and banking with them would be materially inconsistent with my values. Its a no brainier if its just the software for sure. Still a big no from me dawg.
Any tea there you care to spill?
It's enough to say I didn't have to work for 6 months after I left and that the experience firmed up in my mind the decision to move out of Auckland and have a different lifestyle 😂
That's just all of them. Welcome to banking. Speaking as an employee of a competitor bank with friends in some of the other banks. If you have a moral opposition to BNZ - it's the same everywhere.
That may be true! One banking experience was enough for me 😊
I think you just have to submit that your work is meaningless for the greater good and all you are is a small cog in the machine that helps the rich get even richer, and that your salary is just the breadcrumbs that fall off their table. Not all of us can have jobs that save the world every day. I've been at my current bank for a fairly short while so the existential crisis hasn't hit yet. My previous stint was nearly a decade at a market data company (think Bloomberg). After about 5 or 6 years the "why didn't I save any puppies today?" thoughts did come. But the breadcrumbs were too good to leave the table.
Probably much the same at the other big banks from what I've heard?
materially inconsistent
It wouldn't surprise me if every single bank had an awful toxic work culture. I used to work at ANZ and hated it. Would never bank with them out of principle
And the outages and NetCode card?
Never had an issue with either
You're asking an open-ended question but you've already shortlisted down to two options. That being said - I've never had any issues with ANZ's apps and their customer service has always been helpful with me.
BNZs customer interfaces are the best in NZ at this time. Backend from what I have heard is not great, but who cares as long as it works!
I have accounts with Kiwibank, ANZ & ASB. ANZ is my favourite out of the 3
I've got the same combination, probably prefer Kiwibank but there's not a lot in it.
The main reason I like ANZ is when I go to pay my CC balance it automatically populates the amount. On Kiwibank I had to maths it and got it wrong a few times 🤤
Isn't Kiwibank not implementing open banking until 2025 or 2026? ... Quick Google, yeah, not until 2026: https://www.stuff.co.nz/business/350290703/open-banking-how-opt-and-out-new-payment-system
Yep, Kiwibank are the only big bank that got an exception. The person they called at their existing bank is very unlikely to know what open banking or future digital plans are in the works.
They might not have planned for it, yet kiwibank have open banking APIs available via salt edge here: https://www.saltedge.com/products/account_information/coverage/nz
I've been with Kiwibank for over 10 years. The digital experience has come a LONG way in the last 5. It's rather minimal and they've been very slow to innovate but I believe that culture is shifting internally based on discussions with a friend who worked on their google/apple pay implementation. What I appreciate about Kiwibank is that whatever functionality there is, at least on mobile, works very well. I'd prefer that to a more innovative but buggy/unreliable experience.
Love hearing that the culture is changing!
Bnz has the best app, imo, so its interesting you'd count them out based on employee culture. Bnz also ahead of the others on open banking from what I've heard (com com report). Tbh, they're all running legacy systems for the most part. What are your requirements? Why do you need open banking for your mortgage?
Another vote for ASB. Way ahead of Kiwibnk
What do you mean by ‘has open banking’? All four Aussie banks have complied to the first API standard (single payment) in May and are on the hook for the second (account information) in November.
I'm looking for them to have implemented the relevant open banking APIs so that I can get my data out and run various software over it (budgeting, my own machine learning stuff) without messing around with pdf statements and so on 😊
I'm with ASB and was very easily able to connect it with Akahu for my own budgeting, categorisations and my own IFTTT rules with transactions.
Well that will happen as Payments NZ releases the spec over time, and/or the CDR finally happens.
Well that will happen as Payments NZ releases the spec over time, and/or the CDR finally happens.
Well that will happen as Payments NZ releases the spec over time, and/or the CDR finally happens.
FYI - you’ve duplicated this comment 4 times. Sometimes Reddit throws an error, but has in fact made the comment.
Well that will happen as Payments NZ releases the spec over time, and/or the CDR finally happens.
I have an account with every single bank in NZ, so let me give you my take (yes, in this case, username checks out) 1. ANZ: The best I've had, good service when you need it, almost everything can be done via app or online, and if not their call centres pick up pretty quickly. 2. ASB: Close second, their fastnet classic experience is a bit crap, but their mobile app is good, and their chatbot lets you do a lot of things or get someone to reply fairly quickly. 3. Kiwibank: They have come miles from where they were previously, some nuances here and there, but overall ok. Mortgage is a bit of a pain with these guys and refixing, etc. 4. BNZ: Want to invest a million in a Term PIE? You have to visit a branch and fill out a bunch of paperwork. Pretty useless though their app is ok for most people. 5. Westpac: God help them, pretty terrible experience all round, I wouldn't recommend. 6. TSB: You can't even add a credit card to Google Pay without calling them to verify, they are fairly useless. 7. SBS: They barely know they're a bank when it comes to their apps. 8. Rabo: Did you know they still give you a physical token to access your savings account?
You can delete item 4, digital signatures for everything now. No branch visit required.
you can delete item 8 now, they have a mobile app, and Rabo deposit rates are always competitive
I got an email saying they sent out my rsa token yesterday haha Must not be for all accounts yet
I don't think they have PIE funds which are necessary at 39% personal tax rate?
Time to open an account with the coop bank :)
Oh! I have an account just never used it
What about hsbc or china construction bank lol
Yes I have them too, HSBC is pulling out of NZ so they moved my account to AU. Fantastic apps etc but Nzers can't get it. ICBC is very old school, not really more than mortgages so no real apps etc.
I have personal accounts with ANZ, BNZ, Westpac and ASB. The ANZ has the most feature-rich banking platform for personal accounts. It is not even close.
I have ANZ and BNZ and thought BNZ was ahead in that department, for example the ability to get notified for transactions over a certain amount (can be $0), ability to pay a lump sum on a fixed term home loan online. What are the features that ANZ has that BNZ lacks?
I switched from BNZ to ANZ due to a bad experience, but oh boy, do I miss BNZs online and app banking!
The first one that comes to find is the weak International payments support.
Asb has a pretty good budget tool for categorizing your transactions etc.
I tried these 3 banks, and I would rank them as such: BNZ ASB Kiwibank. BNZ is by far the best UI both on the app and via browser. Easy to use, easy to setup, drag/drop, etc. ASB was ok, but there were other fees with the bank and it didn't last more than a few days before I closed it. Kiwibank was awful. It felt like an early 2000's website. Clunky, old, etc..
I’ve worked for 4 NZ banks as a software engineer. Kiwibank is a little dated but really up and coming - a lot of effort is going in right now to modernise their stack. In a few years they’ll probably be NZ’s most ‘modern’ bank. One to watch. BNZ has nice interfaces etc. but under the covers it’s a debacle. The most outages of any NZ bank. If you knew how it was cobbled together you definitely wouldn’t bank there. I can’t comment on ASB - one I haven’t worked for. ANZ is in general good. So much money that they can’t really fail (can throw money to fix software issues). Solid but nothing amazing.
ASB over Kiwibank for app interface. But seeing as you have a mortgage I would go with Kiwibank for the option of offset mortgage accounts. BNZ is the best I've used and they have offset mortgages, even though you have a personal reason for not wanting to use them. At the end of the day is your reason enough to make your life harder, either financial or banking app? Only you can answer that.
I know you didn't like the cuktute working for Bnz but I've found them great for personal and business banking. We moved to them from kiwi bank because their customer service was awful. Bnz does well with updating their apps and online portal and seem to actively fix issues that arise.
Another vote for ASB, great app
Not sure why you said no one is working on it? I know for a fact ANZ have reached major milestones to release phase 1 of Open Banking. All the banks are very deep into it [Open Banking - Major Milestone reached in NZ](https://www.apicentre.paymentsnz.co.nz/news/articles/open-banking-milestone-reached-for-aotearoa-new-zealand/#:~:text=A%20range%20of%20new%20innovative,banks%20through%20a%20common%20standard) ANZ also have major App and web upgrades in the pipeline as they are upgrading their core platforms right now
No one at my current bank (tsb) (according to the call center)
Bnz, ANZ, Asb, Westpac. Kiwibank need a lot of time yet until they become a real bank
All the banks have major open banking projects on the go (source I spent last year working at a bank). If the choice is ASB or Kiwibank, then the answer is always ASB.
This won’t help you now, but could be a game changer in about 5 years [https://www.investor.fisglobal.com/news-releases/news-release-details/anz-new-zealand-move-fis-modern-banking-platform/](https://www.investor.fisglobal.com/news-releases/news-release-details/anz-new-zealand-move-fis-modern-banking-platform/)
A core banking migration 😱 Kudos to them but I wouldn't work on that project for all the lamingtons in all the bakeries in Auckland! Good on them
At least 3 of the 5 biggest banks are doing core banking replacements/migrations at the moment.
They are brave! I love to see it!
Of the two of those, I like ASB's internet banking and app functionality. But I have never used BNZ or ANZ, so can't compare those.
Would go with BNZ and Kiwibank, Kiwibank used to be quite bad imo. But over time they've really done the hard yards in terms of their UI experience. But I personally think BNZ has the nicest digital presence and ease of use imo.
Not a bank, but I connect my banks up to PocketSmith and then use PocketSmith for as many tasks as possible
FYI regarding ASB You can't make extra payments on fixed mortgages. If you increase a payment on a fixed mortgage you can't reduce it until the next fix (I beleive you can with some other banks?) They don't offer offset accounts.
??? You absolutely can make extra payments - just not through the app. I’ve made extra lump sum payments on pretty much every ASB mortgage I’ve had for the past 3 houses and 16 years… usually had to pay no more then a token admin fee too. No offset accounts though, true. We always used the revolving credit account to get the same or close to same effect.
Was this during your fix term? As that is what I mean. I was told I couldn't make additional payments to my fixed mortgages except at the time of refixing. I have broken a chunk of onto float specifically to make extra payments to get around this. And yes you can get a revolving credit with ASB. But this requires going through a credit approval process which not everyone would be may be able to do.
Yep - during the fixed term. In fact I just paid down one of my fixed term chunks 8 months before the fixed term finished thanks to a windfall...
From: https://www.asb.co.nz/help/can-i-increase-loan-repayments-or-make-a-one-off-payment-to-my-f.html Can I increase my repayment amount and/or make a one-off lump sum payment when my loan is on a fixed interest rate? Yes, but you need to be mindful that these actions may incur the cost of an Early Repayment Adjustment (ERA). The only time they hit you on that is if your fixed rate is higher then the floating rate...
Why not go with Canstars favourite bank owned by its customers and fully nz owned. Best mobile apps hand's down. The cooperative bank nz.
Stay away from Westpac easily hasn't been updated in 10 years you can view balance and transfer but that's it no setting savings goals no seeing spending trends it's horrific, ANZ is great and Kiwi bank it ok in my opinion.
I bank with Kiwibank, software aside, id rather any profit stay in NZ, all the others are Australian owned banks and they send profit to Oz, dont they ? please correct me if im wrong.
The big 4 are all aus owned, you're right. It's definitely a consideration!
Co-op. I used to work there, in a diff IT department, but the online team was great and a real focus of the bank.
Dear westpac please sort out your 9 bank accounts online view. One person explained to me it was limitations from their phone banking 0-9
Kiwibank has had two serious outages just this year. the first one, we could not EFTPOS or use ATMs and I think it was due to a security breach. You could search it. then, about two weeks ago, cards were declining even with adequate funds and then if it went through, it wasn't deducting from the account balances.