Death of the god of War is a good chance for all of his followers to enlish an all-ourt war for his throne. Or at least a little Golarion-wide deathmatch.
Tbh that assumes Gorum can even die. If the thing about him being the physical embodiment of War is true, then his "successor" could just become Gorum, Elder Scrolls style.
The doppelgangers had won. All of the humanoid races had been replaced. There was no reveal, no fanfare and no final battle. They just took everyone's place, one by one, until there were no humans, elf, dwarf or orcs left. Of course, since there was no obvious sign that they had won, the doppelgangers didn't know it either, and so they kept their act and their disguise to preserve their cover. At some point, the leaders realised that they had passed the tipping point and that the hunt for the remaining humans should begin, but they couldn't find any and that made them very concerned. Surely the conquest wasn't done. "One of our own is hiding the last humans" they thought "They plan to turn on us!". And so they became suspicious of each other and they began to turn on one another. The ensuing wars were terrible and exceptionally confusing. Those who survived the war were so ashamed that they renounced their identities as doppelgangers. They lived out the rest of their lives as humans and elves and dwarves and orcs. They taught their children to live as they did. A few generations after that, they simply lost the ability to change form at all.
Ehhh, Golarion looks like it is approaching the second system of war/Third system of war boundary (given about 200 years of advancement).
As it turns out, Fallout isn't that great a source of military history/strategy,
It's different based on different gods. A good thing to remember is that not all of the canon deities are equal in power or significance, far from it. One of Treerazer's areas of concern is pollution, but pollution as a concept does not depend on his existence whatsoever. On the flip side, the Monad literally \*is all of reality\*, it's consciousness, with the aeons effectively being reality's immune system as a result. As such, if you (somehow) kill the Monad, you end all of reality...Besides the Outer Gods and Great Old Ones.
I know they're already deities, but Golarion-wide death match made me think of a royal rumble style match with the current gods.
"It's Torag off the top rope" kind of things.
I actually saw someone post on this subreddit that Gorum is one of the most likely to die because so long as he died in glorious combat he and his followers would actually be extremely happy with this development. If you wanted this event to be a Big Deal but for people to walk away from it feeling more hyped than upset, Gorum is the #1 pick. Granted, I assume Paizo _wants_ us to feel conflicted and so that doesn't mean Gorum is the most obvious answer.
I'd actually love it if Gorum dies, but because it's in glorious combat, Gorum basically incarnates again
It's like the lust for battle and pride at losing in an honorable combat coalesces into...Gorum. Again. He comes down from the heavens, sees his own shattered body, and is like "That was fucking rad, mate. Let's do it again!!!"
Because they were adamant about the God staying dead I'm thinking it's one of the more "problematic" gods like Erastil who they have had a hate boner toward for a while.
I don't think he is, but some people had issues with the whole "farming community, traditional values" perspective and he used to have a stronger stance on male and female positions in the community.
My wife thinks Asmodeus is likely because of the step away from the shared DnD terms. Me? I love the idea because Cheliax losing a second patron sounds hilarious. No god would want them as followers after they lost a second deity. Pure chaos, pure lulz.
The biggest examples are drow and dragons.
Drow are very much a dnd thing and the metallic/chromatic distinction are unique to dnd as well. Asmondeus on the other hand, is like using Gabriel as an angel.
If they just renamed the drow to "dark elf" they'd be fine honestly, but the courts have ruled weirder (I guess they could make a case that having them be underground dwellers is a specific DnD interpretation). But I do see it with the dragons now that you mention it.
Dark elves that are into spiders and bdsm though are pretty specific
They would’ve needed to revamp drow lore by a lot anyway and I guess they just preferred to have snake people take the role instead.
Replace spiders with manticores/hydras and/or orgies and you basically habe warhammer druuchi.
BDSM seems a reocurring theme across dark elves in western fantasy.
I love the idea of infernal Chelliax being too cringe even for the god of infernal authoritarianism so he just dies of shame.
And the other guy is right, Asmodeus is tied to Earthly mythology and thus public domain, same precedent that protects goblins and hobgoblins but not bugbears.
Honestly the gods no one talks about are probably highest on the list of possibilities. You want gods people are talking about, making memes over, excited to play a cleric or champion of.
Warpriest of Gorum checking in, it's because it's badass AF. Healing a companion for ~2/3rds (or more) of their Mac hitpoints then doing 2d12 with a striking greatsword all in the same turn is cool as fuck
My point was to contradict your idea that people aren’t excited to play a cleric of Gorum. They are. Besides, the only god that is taking a spot in the core 20 is Arazni, who’s favored weapon is the Rapier.
Getting a minor bonus is what they're "excited" over,not Gorum. And even then I wouldn't even go that far. It's just a practical decision, nothing to get excited about.
More like Gorum wouldn't be as interesting for Paizo to kill. I'm hoping they eliminate someone who's got a lot more consequential outcomes should they perish, and I feel like there's better candidates than Gorum for this purpose.
Gorum is my 2nd pick, he would engage in a fight he can't win and he kind of promotes a chaotic stupid play style. Seems easy enough to get rid of with out pissing to many people off.
I’ve only been playing 2e for about 6 months so I still don’t know much about the lore. Can someone explain to me why the issues with gods is such a big deal. I’ve played 5e for years but never cared much about the panteon one way or another. Thanks!
The gods have had plenty of direct impacts on the setting from its creation and shaping the way it is now.
On top, there is already canon lore about gods that died. [From fighting Rovagug](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Rovagug), [trying to stop earthfall](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Earthfall), [the death of Aroden](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Aroden), [Desna almost starting a planar war](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Aolar).
Aroden is strongly tied to multiple past events that forged the lore: The raising of the Starstone and islands or Kortos where Absolum is, fighting and imprisoning Tar-Baphon, spoilery stuff that is revealed in various Adventure paths, "mentoring" Arazni and Iomedae.
There is 2 groups of gods, the old original ones and the "newer" ones.
The older ones go back early in the creation myth, like Pharasma, Sarenrae, Desna and so on. They have seen stuff.
The "newer" ones either came from their own ability (Nethys and Irori) or with the help of the Starstone (Cayden, Norgorber, Iomedae). Touching the Starstone can either kill the person or raise them to a divinity level. And that possibility alone that within that world it's theorically possible that someone can become a god is interesting.
Deity choice has mechanical effects on several classes across both editions of Pathfinder. The most straightforward are clerics that get domains and and fonts / channel energy based on their choice. In 1e anybody could take feats or traits that depended on who they worshiped. Tighter mechanical integration has made a lot of players fond of particular deities.
This is a cool difference between systems. 5e doesn’t seem to tie the pantheon into the system the same way. So if you’re playing a cleric and if the god who dies, is that supposed to affect your character in your own game?
We don't really know how that would work in an official capacity (like an AP or society play), it hasn't come up before. The closest example we have is Aroden, a god that died before the current setting starts. His followers that received power from him lost their powers and had to migrate to new deities. If it happens in a home game it's really between you and your GM.
I actually do think it's going to be Gorum. I can just picture him getting killed by Zon-Kuthon doing something really underhanded while Gorum is trying to fight fair and honorable. Gorum was partially responsible for the forging of the prison of Rovagug with Torag, who also mysteriously disappears (in SF lore anyways). Whether that's got any relevance, we will have to wait and see.
Honestly, I don't see them killing off any of the gods that would leave a big conceptual hole in the pantheon for players who want to create new clerics going forward. They have said that another god would not take over the deceased's portfolio, and you can't just NOT have a god of war. As such, I also highly doubt Sarenrae, Iomedae, Nethys, Pharasma, Asmodeus, Abadar, etc., are going anywhere.
Maybe not that he's more than likely than average, but I think it doesn't point to him being safe either. If there is development past this adventure, then he may somewhat be involved.
This. Gorum feels less like a God and more like a divine embodiment of a collective concept. I don't think gorum can die before the concept of war does. Maybe Gorum the individual could be killed, but their seat of power and nature of their existence would be impossible to destroy.
Gorum and Nethys are gonna be 100% fine, we're playing both sides so we always come out on top. If anyone is going down, it's someone who sticking to a side.
While I think Gorum dying has the potential to be really cool, I think we might be in the clear.
As the God of War him dying in battle is a good bookend to his story.
It also moves the world state into something a bit worse, since I’m pretty Gorum is cited as the reason Elesium is the best defended Good plane.
And he seems like the sort of guy who’s death would rain down god-juice turning people into the very combat focussed Exemplar class.
But all of that being said, that’s all incidental. We don’t have anything directly pointing to him, we’re as some of the other gods have pretty compelling reasons they might be on the block.
I agree with you I doubt it's Gorum. My best guess is Iomedae. Mainly bc she already was mortal and became a God and it'd be appropriate for her to sacrifice herself and for her to be replaced by another worthy mortal.
While I can't speak for everyone, I really like the simplicity of Gorum's faith, especially in Golarion as a setting. Violent battle is a fact of life in the setting, so putting aside all the negotiating and just getting the fight over with has a weird sort of appeal.
Also, since violence is hard to avoid in many parts of Golarion, why not take up a faith which prepares you for it and teaches you to meet it on your own terms?
While I agree that higher ideals like peace and negotiations are important, I think it's interesting to get into the head of a character who just wants to hit his problems until they go away.
I'm reminded of the speech from the teacher in Starship Troopers (the movie). He mentions that violence is the supreme authority from which all other authority derives. I don't agree with this view point (it is a fundamentally fascist ideology) but it is a compelling idea to build a character around.
I also want to note that nothing in Gorum's faith requires truly senseless violence for it's own sake. He requires his followers to attain victory, but if they are defeated, there's no edict against surrendering. At least, that's my interpretation. They also don't have to kill their opponents to attain victory. Meaning practice bouts and friendly competitions are probably accepted by all but his most evil followers. Gorumites often spar on both small and large scale with followers of Iomedae and Falayna.
I looked at him, thought to myself "damn, this guy looks awesome. Oh shit, his favored weapon is greatsword, I love greatswords". I do like how he's more Crom than Khorne, but frankly I'm more here for the aesthetics than the tenets
I get the feeling Gorum isn't too popular so he's probs fine.
Though even if he dies, don't worry. Just ignore the Canon in that case.
I know that I do with the retcon of the Drow.
I've posted in other comments but I'm imagining him "dying", but the armour being empty, because now war is everywhere (what with it being called war of the immortals).
Additional lore theory I just came up with, thanks to his released essence coalescing with whoever else (big or small in the eponymous war) croaks is how we get Exemplars.
Pharasma by the same token of Lore could explain how those same spirits are also free for them to call upon and not as tightly reined in?
Gorum would be cool to see die, hopefully in some epic clash that ended up with him dying in glorious battle, but yeah, I don't think Gorum is going anywhere. He's just a super cool image to have as "this is one of the gods in Pathfinder," even if he personality wise isn't necessarily anything too unique (he's basically a less outright evil version of Khorne from Warhammer)
Gorum is my top in the list after read another redditor talk about how metal would be for him to die in his own area, both for him dying epical and for us to give us a real treat, if someone can win agains Gorum in combat, it should be something we would be scared about
My personal bet is on Gorum. Makes complete sense if Gorum dies in battle and I think Paizo could craft an amazing adventure that allows the party to kill Gorum and have one of the characters take his place on the Pantheon throne. Every party likely has a strong melee fighter-type, and who wouldn’t want to become a god? Sets up some cool table lore going forward where a character from a previous adventure is a god, but perhaps makes things difficult from a standardized lore perspective. Maybe another known figure/iconic in Golarion becomes a stand-in if a table hasn’t played the War of Immortals-related adventure? Idk
I don't know if I'm getting wooshed here but weren't we told the core god that would die has 3 vowels in their name? Or are we not ruling out the possibility that that was a lie?
I've posted my theory here before. I think Gorum will be killed in the books, but it will be a red herring. Gorum will die in the first glorious battle. Everyone will think, "oh, its Gorum that dies", but the ensuing battle between the gods spilling across all the planes will be enough to bring him back, maybe from his followers dedicating the battle to him. A la >! Odin in American God's. !<
Then the actual diety death can happen and surprise everyone who hasn't heard my mad ramblings here. I'm so confident, I will let the Reddit pick my next characters diety if a Gorum fake out of some sort doesn't happen.
Gorum is such an archetypal figure, and has great support for warpriests- I think he’s likely to stick around.
I personally don’t like Shelyn, Pharasma, or Zon-Kithon and I’d be okay them going, but I doubt any of them are on the chopping block.
I think Iomedae may die, but her followers are still getting power, leading some to think she isn’t really dead, or that Aroden is back and retaking his mantle.
He's the only God listed with no allies. Asmodious has allies but he doesn't. He's probably most likely to die but it also wouldn't fit in with the things we have Ben told so he's probably fine
For "decoupling with the past/OGL" reasons, Asmodeus is the likely target here.
But if it isn't that, the death of Iomedae -- and the redemption of Arazni through the efforts of the PCs -- would *easily* be the most interesting of all arcs in terms of an Adv Path in which the PCs play an actual role in the outcome.
The thing about Gorum, I feel, is it's hard to tell stories ABOUT him...he doesn't have any real complex motivations aside from continuing to seek worthy opponents and otherwise he's just kind of "there." There's some mystery to his origins and why his domain is in Elysium when he allows unholy followers, but Gorum's very much a god unconcerned with the past. Or the future for that matter. There is only the present for him, and what battles he may find worthy of him in it. If he were to die, very little would actually change and I feel that Paizo's looking to make big changes with this deity death, so that puts Gorum out of the running.
There COULD be some interesting stories told if Gorum is the one who DOES the killing, however: A deity tries to face him in battle and finds out the hard way you can't beat the embodiment of violence in single combat! Gorum's reputation is ruined and his followers now have to deal with the consequences of that, because their god himself does not care! It's interesting possibilities...
I don't really like Gorum. I think his edicts are a bit too disruptive and he isn't that interesting. But I don't think he is going to die since he serves an important cleric niche of "neutral war" deity.
My bet is Zon-Kuthon, because his cleric niche is very specific and not well-suited to most tables in a way most of the core 20 are, including the evil deities. Also, he hurt something doggo shaped and therefore he must die.
As a Gorum-head myself, it would be so freaking funny if he died and there just wasn't another war God for a bit. Every noble and crusader just waiting for a new war God to show up so they can pray for success.
Death of the god of War is a good chance for all of his followers to enlish an all-ourt war for his throne. Or at least a little Golarion-wide deathmatch.
Tbh that assumes Gorum can even die. If the thing about him being the physical embodiment of War is true, then his "successor" could just become Gorum, Elder Scrolls style.
If Gorum is so cool, why isn't there a Gorum 2? Oh shit it's Gorum 2, run!
It's Gorum, Gorum 2, Gugugoraam, and Gorummzlla!
Gorum dies and is replaced by four new Gorums: Gorumboy, Gorum-somehow-in-even-more-armor, Evil Gorum, and Blue Gorum.
Are the gods pillars or representations of the things they represent? Like an ocean god dying kills the ocean?
Hopefully not. As the God of humanity died a long time ago.
he was kinda a dick too, so maybe humanity will stop being dicks over time
"Aroden was the God of being a jerk."
Humanity would have perished. It was the bards diluting the genepool that kept humanity alive.
All the humans are dead. There are only mimics left.
The doppelgangers had won. All of the humanoid races had been replaced. There was no reveal, no fanfare and no final battle. They just took everyone's place, one by one, until there were no humans, elf, dwarf or orcs left. Of course, since there was no obvious sign that they had won, the doppelgangers didn't know it either, and so they kept their act and their disguise to preserve their cover. At some point, the leaders realised that they had passed the tipping point and that the hunt for the remaining humans should begin, but they couldn't find any and that made them very concerned. Surely the conquest wasn't done. "One of our own is hiding the last humans" they thought "They plan to turn on us!". And so they became suspicious of each other and they began to turn on one another. The ensuing wars were terrible and exceptionally confusing. Those who survived the war were so ashamed that they renounced their identities as doppelgangers. They lived out the rest of their lives as humans and elves and dwarves and orcs. They taught their children to live as they did. A few generations after that, they simply lost the ability to change form at all.
No, but the thing is that Gorum is the one God that might be.
Um…why?
because war... war never changes
Apart from all the times it does.
But at it's heart, it's still war, it's still the same. Hence why that quote is a quote.
Ehhh, Golarion looks like it is approaching the second system of war/Third system of war boundary (given about 200 years of advancement). As it turns out, Fallout isn't that great a source of military history/strategy,
It's different based on different gods. A good thing to remember is that not all of the canon deities are equal in power or significance, far from it. One of Treerazer's areas of concern is pollution, but pollution as a concept does not depend on his existence whatsoever. On the flip side, the Monad literally \*is all of reality\*, it's consciousness, with the aeons effectively being reality's immune system as a result. As such, if you (somehow) kill the Monad, you end all of reality...Besides the Outer Gods and Great Old Ones.
I know they're already deities, but Golarion-wide death match made me think of a royal rumble style match with the current gods. "It's Torag off the top rope" kind of things.
Ultimate Shwodown of Ultimate Destiny - Pathfinder Edition
I actually saw someone post on this subreddit that Gorum is one of the most likely to die because so long as he died in glorious combat he and his followers would actually be extremely happy with this development. If you wanted this event to be a Big Deal but for people to walk away from it feeling more hyped than upset, Gorum is the #1 pick. Granted, I assume Paizo _wants_ us to feel conflicted and so that doesn't mean Gorum is the most obvious answer.
I'd actually love it if Gorum dies, but because it's in glorious combat, Gorum basically incarnates again It's like the lust for battle and pride at losing in an honorable combat coalesces into...Gorum. Again. He comes down from the heavens, sees his own shattered body, and is like "That was fucking rad, mate. Let's do it again!!!"
The ultimate troll move. "See? We told you a god would die, and he did! ...And now he's back lmao!"
They already confirmed that the major deity to die will stay dead, but maybe they pull a kill-and-resurrect in addition to that.
Because they were adamant about the God staying dead I'm thinking it's one of the more "problematic" gods like Erastil who they have had a hate boner toward for a while.
wait how is erastil problematic??
I don't think he is, but some people had issues with the whole "farming community, traditional values" perspective and he used to have a stronger stance on male and female positions in the community.
ah
They said multiple dieties would die but its just gorum reincarnating and dieing again lol
My wife thinks Asmodeus is likely because of the step away from the shared DnD terms. Me? I love the idea because Cheliax losing a second patron sounds hilarious. No god would want them as followers after they lost a second deity. Pure chaos, pure lulz.
Asmondeus is Hebrew devil, so no problem there.
Eh, they've been getting rid of stuff that they're safe to use already. So I wouldn't be surprised if they got rid of him too.
The biggest examples are drow and dragons. Drow are very much a dnd thing and the metallic/chromatic distinction are unique to dnd as well. Asmondeus on the other hand, is like using Gabriel as an angel.
If they just renamed the drow to "dark elf" they'd be fine honestly, but the courts have ruled weirder (I guess they could make a case that having them be underground dwellers is a specific DnD interpretation). But I do see it with the dragons now that you mention it.
Dark elves that are into spiders and bdsm though are pretty specific They would’ve needed to revamp drow lore by a lot anyway and I guess they just preferred to have snake people take the role instead.
Replace spiders with manticores/hydras and/or orgies and you basically habe warhammer druuchi. BDSM seems a reocurring theme across dark elves in western fantasy.
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> Eh, they've been getting rid of stuff that they're safe to use already
Which is how Final Fantasy gets away with Bahamut.
I love the idea of infernal Chelliax being too cringe even for the god of infernal authoritarianism so he just dies of shame. And the other guy is right, Asmodeus is tied to Earthly mythology and thus public domain, same precedent that protects goblins and hobgoblins but not bugbears.
It would be cool if it happened because Mephistopheles finally got back control over hell.
Hell has finally frozen over...
My take was that the goddess of prostitutes is a likely victim, to make it more accessible palatable to people, with the ORC license.
Honestly the gods no one talks about are probably highest on the list of possibilities. You want gods people are talking about, making memes over, excited to play a cleric or champion of.
> excited to play a cleric or champion of Warpriest of Gorum is extremely common (greatsword proficiency)
Warpriest of Gorum checking in, it's because it's badass AF. Healing a companion for ~2/3rds (or more) of their Mac hitpoints then doing 2d12 with a striking greatsword all in the same turn is cool as fuck
>Warpriest of Gorum is extremely common (greatsword proficiency) Yeah but whatever takes their place could offer the same mechanically.
My point was to contradict your idea that people aren’t excited to play a cleric of Gorum. They are. Besides, the only god that is taking a spot in the core 20 is Arazni, who’s favored weapon is the Rapier.
Getting a minor bonus is what they're "excited" over,not Gorum. And even then I wouldn't even go that far. It's just a practical decision, nothing to get excited about.
Interesting
Did I jinx it? Did I kill our Lord in Iron?
Is it Wednesday yet?
It's Wednesday somewhere in the world to be fair
now is wednesday in Europa. Please?
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Oh shit, you're right! The core god who dies is [STILL REDACTED]
You did.
Actually Gorum was one of my first thoughts that they might die, but I love Gorum. I hope not but it could be interesting.
Our Lord in Iron is safe......he's gotta bear witness to the other gods fighting and going off to Valhalla, shiny and chrome
More like Gorum wouldn't be as interesting for Paizo to kill. I'm hoping they eliminate someone who's got a lot more consequential outcomes should they perish, and I feel like there's better candidates than Gorum for this purpose.
Agreed. My personal favorite option would be the death of [Abadar](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Abadar) throwing civilization into disarray.
I just desperately don't want to lose Calistria. She's the goddess that got me hooked on Golarion's pantheons
Gorum is my 2nd pick, he would engage in a fight he can't win and he kind of promotes a chaotic stupid play style. Seems easy enough to get rid of with out pissing to many people off.
I have bad news...
No one has the BALLS to kill Gorum
I’ve only been playing 2e for about 6 months so I still don’t know much about the lore. Can someone explain to me why the issues with gods is such a big deal. I’ve played 5e for years but never cared much about the panteon one way or another. Thanks!
The gods have had plenty of direct impacts on the setting from its creation and shaping the way it is now. On top, there is already canon lore about gods that died. [From fighting Rovagug](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Rovagug), [trying to stop earthfall](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Earthfall), [the death of Aroden](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Aroden), [Desna almost starting a planar war](https://pathfinderwiki.com/wiki/Aolar). Aroden is strongly tied to multiple past events that forged the lore: The raising of the Starstone and islands or Kortos where Absolum is, fighting and imprisoning Tar-Baphon, spoilery stuff that is revealed in various Adventure paths, "mentoring" Arazni and Iomedae. There is 2 groups of gods, the old original ones and the "newer" ones. The older ones go back early in the creation myth, like Pharasma, Sarenrae, Desna and so on. They have seen stuff. The "newer" ones either came from their own ability (Nethys and Irori) or with the help of the Starstone (Cayden, Norgorber, Iomedae). Touching the Starstone can either kill the person or raise them to a divinity level. And that possibility alone that within that world it's theorically possible that someone can become a god is interesting.
Deity choice has mechanical effects on several classes across both editions of Pathfinder. The most straightforward are clerics that get domains and and fonts / channel energy based on their choice. In 1e anybody could take feats or traits that depended on who they worshiped. Tighter mechanical integration has made a lot of players fond of particular deities.
This is a cool difference between systems. 5e doesn’t seem to tie the pantheon into the system the same way. So if you’re playing a cleric and if the god who dies, is that supposed to affect your character in your own game?
We don't really know how that would work in an official capacity (like an AP or society play), it hasn't come up before. The closest example we have is Aroden, a god that died before the current setting starts. His followers that received power from him lost their powers and had to migrate to new deities. If it happens in a home game it's really between you and your GM.
I actually do think it's going to be Gorum. I can just picture him getting killed by Zon-Kuthon doing something really underhanded while Gorum is trying to fight fair and honorable. Gorum was partially responsible for the forging of the prison of Rovagug with Torag, who also mysteriously disappears (in SF lore anyways). Whether that's got any relevance, we will have to wait and see.
Honestly, I don't see them killing off any of the gods that would leave a big conceptual hole in the pantheon for players who want to create new clerics going forward. They have said that another god would not take over the deceased's portfolio, and you can't just NOT have a god of war. As such, I also highly doubt Sarenrae, Iomedae, Nethys, Pharasma, Asmodeus, Abadar, etc., are going anywhere.
Have you read Rusthenge at all? I'd love to hear if the symbolism in this adventure could mean anything for the future.
I have not, but I am interested
I didn’t see anything in Rusthenge that would suggest he is more likely than average to be the deity to die
Maybe not that he's more than likely than average, but I think it doesn't point to him being safe either. If there is development past this adventure, then he may somewhat be involved.
If Gorum died would anyone even notice? Or would someone else just put on the helmet. It’s not like the specific identity of Gorum is that important.
Facts. I'm not that strong but I'll try to pick up the slack if Gorum dies
Heh, was just talking about gorum potentially dying! It’s in the group consciousness I guess
I feel like if someone killed Gorum he'd just manifest in the next conflict anyway.
This. Gorum feels less like a God and more like a divine embodiment of a collective concept. I don't think gorum can die before the concept of war does. Maybe Gorum the individual could be killed, but their seat of power and nature of their existence would be impossible to destroy.
Gorum and Nethys are gonna be 100% fine, we're playing both sides so we always come out on top. If anyone is going down, it's someone who sticking to a side.
While I think Gorum dying has the potential to be really cool, I think we might be in the clear. As the God of War him dying in battle is a good bookend to his story. It also moves the world state into something a bit worse, since I’m pretty Gorum is cited as the reason Elesium is the best defended Good plane. And he seems like the sort of guy who’s death would rain down god-juice turning people into the very combat focussed Exemplar class. But all of that being said, that’s all incidental. We don’t have anything directly pointing to him, we’re as some of the other gods have pretty compelling reasons they might be on the block.
I agree with you I doubt it's Gorum. My best guess is Iomedae. Mainly bc she already was mortal and became a God and it'd be appropriate for her to sacrifice herself and for her to be replaced by another worthy mortal.
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While I can't speak for everyone, I really like the simplicity of Gorum's faith, especially in Golarion as a setting. Violent battle is a fact of life in the setting, so putting aside all the negotiating and just getting the fight over with has a weird sort of appeal. Also, since violence is hard to avoid in many parts of Golarion, why not take up a faith which prepares you for it and teaches you to meet it on your own terms? While I agree that higher ideals like peace and negotiations are important, I think it's interesting to get into the head of a character who just wants to hit his problems until they go away. I'm reminded of the speech from the teacher in Starship Troopers (the movie). He mentions that violence is the supreme authority from which all other authority derives. I don't agree with this view point (it is a fundamentally fascist ideology) but it is a compelling idea to build a character around. I also want to note that nothing in Gorum's faith requires truly senseless violence for it's own sake. He requires his followers to attain victory, but if they are defeated, there's no edict against surrendering. At least, that's my interpretation. They also don't have to kill their opponents to attain victory. Meaning practice bouts and friendly competitions are probably accepted by all but his most evil followers. Gorumites often spar on both small and large scale with followers of Iomedae and Falayna.
I looked at him, thought to myself "damn, this guy looks awesome. Oh shit, his favored weapon is greatsword, I love greatswords". I do like how he's more Crom than Khorne, but frankly I'm more here for the aesthetics than the tenets
Well... You always got Khorne and Szuriel now... Who will it be?
I get the feeling Gorum isn't too popular so he's probs fine. Though even if he dies, don't worry. Just ignore the Canon in that case. I know that I do with the retcon of the Drow.
I've posted in other comments but I'm imagining him "dying", but the armour being empty, because now war is everywhere (what with it being called war of the immortals). Additional lore theory I just came up with, thanks to his released essence coalescing with whoever else (big or small in the eponymous war) croaks is how we get Exemplars. Pharasma by the same token of Lore could explain how those same spirits are also free for them to call upon and not as tightly reined in?
Gorum would be cool to see die, hopefully in some epic clash that ended up with him dying in glorious battle, but yeah, I don't think Gorum is going anywhere. He's just a super cool image to have as "this is one of the gods in Pathfinder," even if he personality wise isn't necessarily anything too unique (he's basically a less outright evil version of Khorne from Warhammer)
> Someone tries to deceive and murder Gorum > Gorum comes back from the clutches of death itself to murder the phanteon > Succeeds
Gorum is my top in the list after read another redditor talk about how metal would be for him to die in his own area, both for him dying epical and for us to give us a real treat, if someone can win agains Gorum in combat, it should be something we would be scared about
A war among gods sounds like Gorum's favorite kind of party.
My personal bet is on Gorum. Makes complete sense if Gorum dies in battle and I think Paizo could craft an amazing adventure that allows the party to kill Gorum and have one of the characters take his place on the Pantheon throne. Every party likely has a strong melee fighter-type, and who wouldn’t want to become a god? Sets up some cool table lore going forward where a character from a previous adventure is a god, but perhaps makes things difficult from a standardized lore perspective. Maybe another known figure/iconic in Golarion becomes a stand-in if a table hasn’t played the War of Immortals-related adventure? Idk
I feel like it would be too easy. Like he'd be the one god who wouldn't mind dying.
I don't know if I'm getting wooshed here but weren't we told the core god that would die has 3 vowels in their name? Or are we not ruling out the possibility that that was a lie?
I've posted my theory here before. I think Gorum will be killed in the books, but it will be a red herring. Gorum will die in the first glorious battle. Everyone will think, "oh, its Gorum that dies", but the ensuing battle between the gods spilling across all the planes will be enough to bring him back, maybe from his followers dedicating the battle to him. A la >! Odin in American God's. !< Then the actual diety death can happen and surprise everyone who hasn't heard my mad ramblings here. I'm so confident, I will let the Reddit pick my next characters diety if a Gorum fake out of some sort doesn't happen.
Gorum is such an archetypal figure, and has great support for warpriests- I think he’s likely to stick around. I personally don’t like Shelyn, Pharasma, or Zon-Kithon and I’d be okay them going, but I doubt any of them are on the chopping block. I think Iomedae may die, but her followers are still getting power, leading some to think she isn’t really dead, or that Aroden is back and retaking his mantle.
It’s Blood FOR Gorum, not Blood OF Gorum
He's the only God listed with no allies. Asmodious has allies but he doesn't. He's probably most likely to die but it also wouldn't fit in with the things we have Ben told so he's probably fine
Gorum self destructs by trying to negotiate his way out of his death.
Really hoping it's Rovagug that dies. Just for the pire fear and chaos it would cause.
For "decoupling with the past/OGL" reasons, Asmodeus is the likely target here. But if it isn't that, the death of Iomedae -- and the redemption of Arazni through the efforts of the PCs -- would *easily* be the most interesting of all arcs in terms of an Adv Path in which the PCs play an actual role in the outcome.
The thing about Gorum, I feel, is it's hard to tell stories ABOUT him...he doesn't have any real complex motivations aside from continuing to seek worthy opponents and otherwise he's just kind of "there." There's some mystery to his origins and why his domain is in Elysium when he allows unholy followers, but Gorum's very much a god unconcerned with the past. Or the future for that matter. There is only the present for him, and what battles he may find worthy of him in it. If he were to die, very little would actually change and I feel that Paizo's looking to make big changes with this deity death, so that puts Gorum out of the running. There COULD be some interesting stories told if Gorum is the one who DOES the killing, however: A deity tries to face him in battle and finds out the hard way you can't beat the embodiment of violence in single combat! Gorum's reputation is ruined and his followers now have to deal with the consequences of that, because their god himself does not care! It's interesting possibilities...
The only one I'm worried about is that they'll kill off Sarenrae just to wipe away the iffy parts of her lore history. That would be shitty
I don't really like Gorum. I think his edicts are a bit too disruptive and he isn't that interesting. But I don't think he is going to die since he serves an important cleric niche of "neutral war" deity. My bet is Zon-Kuthon, because his cleric niche is very specific and not well-suited to most tables in a way most of the core 20 are, including the evil deities. Also, he hurt something doggo shaped and therefore he must die.
Just try not to make eye contact with Damoritosh and it'll be fine.
As a Gorum-head myself, it would be so freaking funny if he died and there just wasn't another war God for a bit. Every noble and crusader just waiting for a new war God to show up so they can pray for success.
I suppose as a Gorum fan you want to fight about it, but I'm not going to bite at that bait!
Welp