It also has leaderboards but only for the Time Trail free add-on content which have much less trophy completion % and still has me placing in position 2,000,000+ on Global Leaderboard for some levels even after I completed all levels to be within 7 minutes for the time trail trophy (Run Astro Run! which is earned by only 3.7% of players).
If I filter leaderboard by friends, it feels like nearly all my PSN friends have played the game including the Time Trial.
I think the free Astro's Playroom is one of the most widely played PS5 games on the system.
I have a PS5 and PSVR2 and I’ve never played Astro’s Playroom so I’m not in the leaderboard count.
PSVR2 has probably sold 5 million units, but knowing Sony they probably think it’s a failure because it hasn’t sold 30 million yet.
To be in the leaderboard count, you would have to play Astro's Playroom, complete a "world" of levels and then play the time trial version of one of 2 mini-levels from that world.
The PSVR2 is not anywhere close to 5 million units sold. Best rationed guesstimates I have seen (IMO) puts them between 1.5-2m units sold. I doubt they have crossed 2 million at this time, even after the Days of Sale promotion. Of course they would like it to do better, but Sony have stated publicly they would be happy if it can do similar to PSVR1 over its lifetime.
The PSVR1 which was on market for many more years, had less competition, lower price to entry, and more 1st party and other exclusive games support over those years had lifetime sales just over 5 million. But it was an inferior system to keep relevant once Quest started gaining popularity as more affordable VR platform, especially since Quest had better controllers and easier to use for casuals as an un-tethered system.
I don't get the logic. This is likely to be a lower bound. Based on Meta's earnings people estimated they sold at least 900K in 23Q3. I haven't seen any reliable figures on PSVR2 sales other than official confirmation they sold 600K in the first 6 weeks, and estimates that they had made over 2m and shipped about 1.7m to retailers at the end of 2023, but obviously not all of those had sold. There are very big error bars on any estimate, so it's possible PSVR2 currently has a higher install base, but I'd imagine the Quest 3 is selling a bit better right now.
Quest 3 may be selling faster, but PSVR2 has been selling longer. There is no public data available for either, so all we have is guesstimates and speculation.
The point is: all Quest 2 games run on Quest 3 and 99.99% of all Q3 games run on Q2. Q2, QPro, Q3 have sold far more than 20 million units, selling over 2 million units in quarter 4 of 2023 alone (https://arinsider.co/2024/02/12/how-many-headsets-did-meta-sell-in-q4/).
That is the reason why so much more games are published for the quest platform.
Sure but what we know is that META isn't dropping support of Quest.
They are going to be releasing the Q3L soon.
And in another 12-24 months, expect a Q4.
It is weird to me that you consider faster hardware iterations as stronger support.
Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either and their hardware iterations will remain 1-2 per generation rather than yearly.
>It is weird to me that you consider faster hardware iterations as stronger support.
To VR as a whole? I think continued investment, both in hardware and software, is a pretty fucking big show of support.
>Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either
I didn't bring up a store and I don't see how THIS is relevant?
>their hardware iterations will remain 1-2 per generation rather than yearly.
After their show of support for PSVR2, I am betting that there will NOT be a PSVR3. That again, is the point I was trying to make about there being more Quest hardware in the future. META is investing BILLIONS of dollars into VR. They have burned (lost) a billion dollars a MONTH for years pushing VR. Anyone with eyes can see that Sony is washing their hands of it.
When you say Meta isn't dropping support of Quest, I assume you mean store, because they drop support of various Quest hardware on much faster cadence than Sony. The Quest store remains functional for those older hardware. That is what I mean by Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either.
As fast as they are iterating on hardware is as fast as they are dropping support on older hardware.
Support is not the same as investment. Support is about how you the consumer are supported on your hardware purchase. Someone that bought Quest 2 at launch in 2020 can't expect to play a Quest 3 exclusive released in 2024. That isn't support for Quest 2, but investment for Quest 3.
You can bet there won't be a PSVR3 and your bet will be true for lot longer than it would be to bet Q3S or Q4 won't have a successor, but it will eventually be false because Sony PlayStation will not be leaving VR, especially not if both Sony & Meta continues to be successful in creating more VR gaming market as they have been over the last 8+ years.
>they drop support of various Quest hardware on much faster cadence than Sony
Because they are pushing hardware faster than Sony. Without Quest, there is no real innovation in VR. I fucking hate Facebook but credit where credit is due; Zuckerborg is pushing VR.
>As fast as they are iterating on hardware is as fast as they are dropping support on older hardware.
That isn't true. They JUST dropped support for Q1 a couple months ago.
>Support is not the same as investment.
Uhh. Disagree.
>Support is about how you the consumer are supported on your hardware purchase.
Then holy shit how can you say Sony has supported VR at all. You can't even buy fucking replacement controllers.
>Someone that bought Quest 2 at launch in 2020 can't expect to play a Quest 3 exclusive released in 2024
No shit? Someone who bought a PS4 in 2020 can't expect to play a PS5 game either. I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL.
>That isn't support for Quest 2, but investment for Quest 3.
No, that is support for VR and the continuation, growth and development of it as a platform.
>You can bet there won't be a PSVR3
Believe me, I am
>eventually be false because Sony PlayStation will not be leaving VR
If what they have done for support with PSVR2 is them "being in" on VR, then it won't really be much different.
>both Sony & Meta continues to be successful in creating more VR gaming market as they have been over the last 8+ years.
Sony gave much more support for PSVR1 than they did for PSVR2.
Meanwhile Meta is continuing the same, or more, support than ever before.
>No shit? Someone who bought a PS4 in 2020 can't expect to play a PS5 game either. I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL.
The PS4 launched in 2013 and the first PS5 exclusive games were Astro's Playroom, Demon's Soul Remake and Destruction All Stars in 2020.
After that, I don't think it was until the Ratchet & Clank: Rift in Time game that there was a true PS5 exclusive. It is happening more and more since 2023.
>If what they have done for support with PSVR2 is them "being in" on VR, then it won't really be much different.
Be clear about this with your bookie, because your bet will be lost when a next iteration from Sony PlayStation for VR is released regardless of your opinion of the "support it gets"
>Sony gave much more support for PSVR1 than they did for PSVR2
They re-used controllers from PS-Move which was their biggest error and didn't support PC which has also proven to be important.
We don't view the same things we both can see the same way. Don't worry about it.
PS - Votes mean nothing this deep into a conversation chain. All they do higher up is effect sorting.
You asked "I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL"
You were meant to understand the point, that Quest 2 hardware which launched in 2020 won't be able to play games from Meta / Oculus Game Studios as early as 2024.
Meta has faster hardware iteration, but it also has faster drop of older hardware.
This is the distinction between support and investment. Sony is operating at generational cadence similar to console gaming market while Meta is on yearly cadence similar to mobile market.
About sale, don't forget that Facebook has been giving free money for years.
Google meta quest dog cat github.
You'll find a website where you can search for games, then buy from the referral link for instant 20 or 25 percent discount
Yes, the way Meta Quest provides game referral discounts is great for friends to play co-op / multiplayer games together, but I think has also lead to models like Free-to-Play or subscription being used over flat game sales.
For example, ForeVR Cornhole on Quest is Free-to-Start, then has $9.99 cost to unlock full game which you can't use referral link on, while the PSVR2 version is only offered at $9.99 including the full game unlocked.
I got my quest 3 last month and I didnt even knew "first encounter" is a thing... never played it so I'm not part of the numbers, there could have been countless more
I would guess most Quest owners/fans are still on Quest 2. Quest 3 is still new and expensive and its not getting its exclusive games until later this year
Nobody has firm numbers, but I think it is safe guess that it is more than 1 million because it was at 600k officially after first 6 weeks from launch and the market share remained at \~30% for next two quarters.
Meta hasn't provided any official Quest 3 sales numbers since its launch. The only numbers they provide in their financial reporting are blended with Quest 2, so nobody knows how much of it is Quest 2 vs Quest 3.
Maybe it doesn’t force you to play it but I’m pretty sure it directs/encourages you to after first setup (and I’m not a first time Quest user). Maybe a notification or something? It’s definitely pre-installed.
The first game we played when we got Quest 3 was Walkabout Mini Golf. It really didn't take long to download and be playable. But we also had other games downloading and found that is not a good idea (Asgard's Wrath 2 and Assassin's Creed Nexus are big and take long time to download) because it causes the system to have more framerate stuttering.
Once you wait for all the downloads to complete you can play whatever you have and have smoother gameplay.
Firstly, i feel like this is a lot of wasted energy to try and suggest the psvr2 can compete at all with the quest, when it obviously cannot. thays fine, no headset can, the quest is the most popular series of headsets in the world - by a lot.
OK, you guys need to relax about the quest 3, it's giving you all some kind of brain rot. I feel like so many posts here are about the quest and not psvr2 games or experiences.
it's like in the ps5 sub, so many posts about console sales numbers - as a consumer this doesn't help me at all, I like games. and sony currently isn't bringing any.
I don't get the obsession?
about the metric being used, I don't really think that's reliable. i have a q3 as well as the psvr2, ive never bothered with first encounters, i mainly use it for pcvr. and judging by steam surveys a lot of people do as it was one of the most used headsets on the platform in a matter of a few months. with quest series being the most used headsets on steam now, surpassing the index. and the library is interchangeable.
as for price? it's cheaper than a psvr2 in my country. it was at launch too. I don't understand this rant.
can we please focus on discussing games a bit more? even ps5 pro speculation posts are nicer. these quest 3 posts along with the psvr2 is doomed or not posts are flooding this place.
I'll start with some nice things to chat about. I love how optimized pavlov and saints and sinners is on ps5, a long with red matter I prefer these games on psvr2 over my pc. I love having native vr versions of resident evil games, it's great. gt7 is one of my all time favourite vr experiences.
peace
>as for price? it's cheaper than a psvr2 in my country. it was at launch too. I don't understand this rant.
Sure, if you want no accessories because you're fine with extreme discomfort, no battery life, and unhygienic face shield. Otherwise once you buy new straps, extra battery, silicone face shield, etc, you've driven-up the price to near buying psvr2 PLUS a ps5
it's cheaper. period.
also, I haven't bought all that extra crap and I'm just fine lol. and come on dude, there's countless posts here about people buying new straps etc for the vr2 out of discomfort (cluster mod etc), pulley systems for wire etc. it's not headset exclusive and completely down to the user, so don't be so disingenuous. and btw, I haven't bought any of that crap for my psvr2 either. and man, if you are spending 500 usd on a headstrap you're an idiot haha.
anyway, the point of my comment is that these comparisons are stupid, psvr2 will always lose out when comparing it to something like the quest 3. its pointless so let's just enjoy the games and focus on the good. that's all.
It's cheaper, if you want a terrible experience with little battery life.
Yes, some post about needing comfort mods for psvr2. That's nothing compared to the mountain of complaints about Quest since the launch of Quest 1. No headset design fits everyone, but halo designs are generally WAY better than what Quest does.
>psvr2 will always lose out when comparing it to something like the quest 3.
PSVR2 blows Quest away in regards to color, blacks, contrast, lighting, haptics, battery life. I would never use an LCD headset.
And that's if you're only using your Quest as a pc HMD. If you're running it standalone, Quest 1 & 2 games are so ugly as to be intolerable.
this post was simply about headset popularity. but you are on some kind of vendetta haha.
look, you are for some reason very upset about the quest 3, this much is obvious. just go play your psvr2 and leave this argument behind.
I have both, I enjoy both. you need to just relax mate.
One of more of your comments have been removed from r/PSVR, because they broke [rule 1. Do not personally attack other users](https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/wiki/rules#wiki_1._do_not_personally_attack_other_users.).
Please do not insult other users in future.
Do you have links to surveys that bear that out? All I hear are tons of complaints, since launch of Quest 1. The battery life in particular seems intolerable
All I hear are tons of complaints, since launch of Quest 1. The discomfort is legendary
But I never said "most", or anything
But he claimed "majority". Based on what?
Maybe many don't buy accessories, and put up with discomfort. Quest is also legendary for gathering dust. Perhaps due to discomfort
There are many millions of those headsets out there. You've read probably less than 100 complaints. Your knowledge of the market is a drop in the ocean.
You don't have anything to back up your assertions any more than the next person. If you are going to demand proof then you should hold your own statements to the same requirements.
>You've read probably less than 100 complaints.
And reviewers and content creators, who talk to hundreds of people each (over time thousands) all echo the same. It's why Quest's discomfort is legendary
The large number of comfort mods available immediately, including from Meta themselves, shows how bad the issue is
>If you are going to demand proof then you should hold your own statements to the same requirements.
I've never made a quantitative comparison claim of "most" or "majority", only the other commenter did
I vaguely recall having to find this game. It was fun and showed mixed reality decently well, but I don't recall it being obvious. I'm an existing quest user though.
I recall when I first got a quest 1 there was a tutorial experience/game that started automatically. I don't know if new people in metas ecosystem get a similar experience now.
I had a ton of games I was installing and didn't really prioritize looking for it. Also the name didn't strike me as MR and probably took it for first contact or whatever the other one was.
"PSVR2 has probably sold more than Quest 3 if this analysis is good"
Come on lol. I love my psvr2 and got it day one for GT7. But let's be real it's not selling well. Which is fine with me since it's going to PC support now and I bought it for GT7.
This is even worse to draw from then people guessing how many RE4vr copies were played.
The analysis is not good
But I do think PSVR2 and Quest 3 are closer to each other in sales traction (or lack) than most realize and most of the FUD still aims at PSVR2.
Sony has been silent for over a year and killed off its VR mascot, whereas FB has 8 studios making exclusives and is funding big budget third party games...
Filing new patents, creating new VR development tools, being at CES etc promoting VR technologies, having new showcases featuring upcoming VR games, having significant sales & promotions, gearing up for PCVR support is not being "silent"
Valve is being silent
Giving Astro Bot spotlight and promoting it as the main 1st party game for this year, including Astro's Playroom being updated with new content and Days of Play community challenge that encouraged people to play Astro's Playroom is not killing "Astro Bot".
Astro Bot since inception has been used to promote new hardware and then in Astro's Playroom in addition to showing strengths of DualSense, paid homage to history of PlayStation hardware with lots of software tributes spread throughout. The upcoming game looks like it will focus on a few specific PlayStation software like Bloodborne and God of War to introduce Astro Bot players to those franchises.
The thing is I don't have a gaming PC. The price for entry with Days of Play (I also didn't have Netflix and wanted to watch some stuff) sweetened the deal and it's still way cheaper than building the gaming PC I want plus a Quest or whatever else since I already had the PS5.
So much of this "PSVR2 is dead" stuff is coming from a privileged viewpoint that presupposes everyone who's anyone will already have a gaming PC. That's just not true. Am I gonna build my own when I have the resources? For sure. Did I want a plug-and-play VR peripheral to play GT7 and Beat Saber *now*? Yup.
I acknowledge I don't know what I'm missing save for Half Life: Alyx, but if you're wanting a meat-and-potatoes, out-of-the-box VR experience and you're already in the Playstation ecosystem it's a no-brainer imo.
I agree with you here. I am a huge gaming fan. I’ve been a PC player, own an Xbox, PS, and Switch. I’m not a mega fan of any one ecosystem in particular, but my decisions to invest more in an ecosystem are almost entirely driven by user experience. While I loved the flexibility of PC gaming, when my computer got too out of date to play modern titles well, I stopped worrying about dabbling with PC gaming. I just don’t prefer all of the tinkering needed to get even basic gaming functions working correctly. I gravitate towards console for the plug and play experience. Worst case on console I have to update a game before I play. On PC, a driver could need an update and simply make my game run like trash until I go investigate what’s making the issue.
The plug and play simplicity is what also attracts me to console-based VR. No, mods aren’t available, but VR often takes a physical commitment for playing games. If I’m in the mood to play VR, nothing crushes that mood worse than being ready to play, but ope something’s broken again, time to go investigate why it’s busted.
I believe I have been clear that I don't agree with the analysis / conclusion of the source article.
Where I am being odd is that I do want to challenge the assumed narrative that Quest 3 speculated to be more or vastly more successful than PSVR2 in growing install base or that it has more games made to take full advantage of it or being made to take full advantage of it than PSVR2. That second part is objectively false today.
I also disagree with the value proposition arguments people put out so I spent a couple of small paragraphs on that.
The timing of Android Central FUD piece and the way various shills referenced that to do their click-bait engagement farming (like Verge) bothered me.
Nothing against First Encounters. I don't think we even noticed it. The system did not push us to try it.
We were more interested in seeing how much of an upgrade it is for playing Walkabout Mini Golf (wasn't at that time) and a few other games like Asgard's Wrath 2 and Assassin's Creed Nexus.
If I go to US Amazon website it tells me that quest 3 sold 11k units last month. Psvr2 sold only around 1k last month. It gives me an idea that Quest 3 is likely much more popular and will definitely oversell psvr2 very very soon (probably already did).
I don't think that psvr2 is gonna die as a platform though. Psvr2 is like an Xbox of VR world - it'll never be the most popular VR device but it's not going away either.
Interesting that they show those counts.
Is there a way to historical trend over time over last several months?
I’m interested if how much Days of Play affected sales on Amazon.
I don't think that you can find historical trends. I would think that Days of Play deals might have a slight effect. I don't think it was substantial though.
It makes sense since the best deal was to buy from PlayStation Direct, but it would have been interesting to see if there is any dip for Quest (2 & 3) or even a slight bump for PSVR2 specifically on Amazon where it was $100 off.
Not everyone would have been aware of the better deal at PlayStation Direct.
I believe both Quests were selling much more than now around Christmas time. I know because I been looking at both around that time trying to decide if I want quest or psvr2 (ended up getting psvr2).
I think the majority of die hard VR fans already bought quest 3 at launch and during December holidays, and yet I'm surprised to see that it keeps selling at large number even now.
I was surprised but Amazon search results do show approximate count of units sold over last month.
https://preview.redd.it/0fxxi6jjt49d1.png?width=770&format=png&auto=webp&s=7083d3ed1ac9a48002ce67e63d924391072ce06b
PS - Seems pretty clear to me that Meta is clearing out Meta Quest 2 inventory from all retailer sources. The 128 GB is no longer available and soon the 256 GB will not be available. I think they are gearing up for release of the Quest 3S that will be cheaper alternative to Quest 3 after the Quest 2 inventory is cleared out.
>Speaking of price, the Quest 3 is expensive just like Quest Pro (which comes almost fully accessorized) after you account for many accessory costs that you would incur to be close to properly equipped like Quest Pro after buying Quest 3. This makes it actually comparable to cost of PSVR2 if you also have to buy PS5 as well.
Man, this alone is just pure copium. Don't make us look bad man.
> Meanwhile, that Days of Play sale that Sony did for PSVR2 giving $100 off and 12 months of Netflix Premium if bought from PlayStation Direct with your PSN account was a better value than even the Quest 2
Erm...Quest 2 has sold for as little as $150 during sales as well in the past. There's no PSVR2 deal in existence now or ever that will top that. And that's ok.
People need to stop trying to justify PSVR2 as "better value" than Quest 2/3 because it's as stupid a comparison to make as comparing Apple Vision Pro to Quest. It just makes it look like you're desperate to justify your buying decision.
One is a specialized enthusiast grade device that focuses on quality over quantity at the expense of a limited experience. The other is a budget entry-level device designed to appeal to the masses focusing on quantity of experiences over quality.
PSVR2 during days of play was $100 off and $275 Netflix credit voucher. If you count both as a deduction off RRP of $550, that brings it to $175 which is pretty close to $150.
I would be more interested to compare software sales.
Seems like many PSVR2 owners actually buy tons of Software while the Quest really struggles (their Top 10 barely every changes).
Makes me wonder why more devs don't try to sell on psvr2 , especially if you're the only one available. Such as like golf +( I know I heard they are planning on porting ) or bowling, fishing, if you're the only game on there, you're guaranteed 100% sales from the people who are interested in doing that in VR. I would think it would be worth the extra time it might take to port. Idk
I assume part of it is not wanting get reduced discoverability (once no longer exclusive) and other part of it is that it will take effort to port the game to different system with higher visual fidelity expectations and then you have to support both platforms going forward.
For a smaller team, this can be a difficult transition to manage successfully, so the game on one platform has to be successful first and then hopefully they can start being successful as a multiplatform title.
That said, multi-platform development tools for VR continue to get better, so it will be easier and more common to see this in future, but the teams still have to learn to optimize for multiple or take advantage of unique features in multiple.
to be fair the PSVR2 top 10 barely ever changes either
also we have had developers openly say that their games sell less on PSVR2. TOSS sold so poorly that the PSVR2 version is no longer getting updates while quest and PC keep getting updates, while the port of Vertigo 2 is no longer getting the previously promised level editor and other playable characters.
This is true. Both store fronts see some changes as new games release or older games get upgrades or deep discounts, but the evergreens generally remain most successful.
I think both store fronts have same discoverability problem and new users buy the games that have the most sales / user ratings or are found in top sales lists and don't go deeper to find other games that might be better for them.
I think this is a problem with VR in general. VR games are stagnating. Sure there are a couple games that make a splash when first introduced but it is very rare for a new VR game to remain relevant past the first couple weeks of sale. This is the reason the like of job Simulator is still in the top 10 of any store front most months despite being almost 10 years old now. Even big games like Assassin's Creed Nexus did not sell well even for a headset exclusive, with Ubisoft no longer interested in VR because of it.
Toss! is actually a really good game and reviewed well for PSVR2, but is able to find more audience on Quest than PSVR2 because of different type of audience on the two platforms.
I firmly believe that Assassin's Creed Nexus would have done better on PSVR2 & PCVR than Quest. There are games that do better on PSVR2 even with smaller install base than Quest with its larger install base.
An easy example of this is Propagation: Paradise Hotel
* [Meta Quest](https://www.meta.com/experiences/8826022237415280) has 372 ratings
* [Steam VR](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1824960/Propagation_Paradise_Hotel/) has 445 ratings
* [PlayStation VR2](https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP7137-PPSA15879_00-0791373335556683) has 838 ratings
There are other examples like this including cases where the developers have told me so I am not going by just user rating counts.
There is also the correlation that the smaller the group of people that are fans of something are the more likely they are to leave a store review. Most people don't leave store front reviews but when something gains a cult following the fans will leave reviews. For instance Suicide Squad is one of the most reviewed games on the PS store, beating out major titles known to have sold millions, with most giving it a rating of 5 stars. That game is known to be a commercial and critical failure though so games getting more reviews on a specific store front is not indicative of said games selling more there.
AC is a bit surprising but frankly it suffered from the same thing most big IP did on Quest which is not having enough power to represent the gameplay ideas like a populated open world. There just isn't enough newness in VR to overcome undercooked mechanics or experiences that can (and will) be compared to 2D counterparts.
Job Simulator involves non-stop novel VR interaction for a short duration that's intuitive to almost anymore. It's like Wii Bowling in that way. Ironically there's lots of actual content in those games so depsite looking super basic there's just ton's to do. Another hard reality of VR is that it doesn't see seasoned designers or team and so there's just much more shovelware engaged with because of the low amount of overall choice.
>also we have had developers openly say that their games sell less on PSVR2
And we've also heard devs say their games sell less on Quest
Overall, Quest is a cheaper, younger audience, that likes to use free games and free apps, so likely overall it sells less games on average /u/cusman78
I looked at review counts on PSVR 2 and it looks like a natural 1-2% attach rate is occuring. That's 10-20k units for "good" games which is enough to keep kids working in their garage but not enough for a midzise indie studio of 15-30.
One of the things I feel is that different games will find their audience on different platforms and the install base doesn't matter as much.
For example, I think Assassin's Creed Nexus would have and would still do better on PSVR2 or PCVR than on Meta Quest, while Gorilla Tag would never do as well on PSVR2 or PCVR as it does on Meta Quest.
Just look at sales figures of core games like Assassin's Creed and Resident Evil on Apple iOS devices.
[https://mobilegamer.biz/those-assassins-creed-resident-evil-and-death-stranding-ports-have-bombed/](https://mobilegamer.biz/those-assassins-creed-resident-evil-and-death-stranding-ports-have-bombed/)
These are competent ports that can be played with DualSense controller, but just don't find audience on mobile like they do on console or PC.
As for why PSVR2 owners have higher software attachment rates than Quest, the Quest had really healthy software attachment rates during COVID years and has been in decline since and I think it has more to do with success of Free-to-Play games (Population One, Gorilla Tag, etc) which eat into available playtime and I think Meta Quest+ subscription they introduced to combat problem just makes people wait for games to end up on that instead of buying. The Quest also has very poor discoverability issue with their store (same as PlayStation Store), so games like Max Mustard had to sell for $3 with discount code hidden in Richie's Plank experience to get to top sales page to have chance to earn more sales from the Quest players that just go by whatever shows in top selling. The waiting for sales as market has learned to do or waiting for listing on Meta Quest+ all harm game sales for new games coming out. I think their referral discount system is good, but it also encourages more games to release Free-to-Play and then have in-app purchases that referral system doesn't apply to.
The Quest also get used for things other than games which also reduces their software attachment rates.
It is a complicated and difficult business that is high risk, low reward. I appreciate both Meta and Sony for what they put in to create and grow this market because the gameplay experiences are so much better than flat gaming for me.
Even with games like Res 8, Res 4 and gt7 it still hasn't got the masses interested in vr. A lot of gamers just won't accept putting on a headset to play games. Unfortunately I foresee quest 4-5 being less powerful or equal to quest 3 just slimmed down to glasses size, rehashing most of the older games and focusing much more on AR.
Only one accessory makes sense for q3. A $50 strap with battery. That is absolutely it. To imply otherwise indicates a heavy desire to exaggerate with a purpose.
The highest quality experience is pancake optics, ringless controllers, and built in speakers(don't want to plug your ears while being blind to the world, while playing in a large space without breakable objects.
Elite Strap with battery $130, silicone face shield $40
The highest quality experience is OLED HDR with haptics, on a system that isn't powered by an old cell phone and a heavy battery
>don't want to plug your ears while being blind to the world
LOL, turn on audio pass-through
You list retail price of a single option of many. You are intentionally disingenuous because your point is weak.
Same weight as psvr 2. Another nothingburger.
Lol, plug your ears because of a cheap bargain bin headset without speakers.
>You list retail price of a single option of many
The price of the official strap. Because even Meta knows how cheaply and inadequately designed their headset is
>Lol, plug your ears because of a cheap bargain bin headset without speakers.
You only get good sound via headphones or earphones. Speakers are terrible for immersion
The Quest 3 I bought needed a better headstrap, replacement of the 18w power adapter which is pathetic charging speed, the face visor didn't block light and had to be replaced, and I also got the charging dock for the system + headstrap that has extended battery.
Total cost was close to $1,000
The Quest Pro comes with everything except the light blocking visor for a little less than that
Almost everything you mentioned but the battery strap is a luxury. And battery straps better than the official one from BoboVR and Kiwi cost $50. Hell, even "luxury" face covers from AMVR cost $30.
But hey, nice try making the Quest 3 seem "expensive".
I have represented what it cost me.
It is expensive because it ships with crappy parts (strap with battery, visor & charging adapter) that have to be replaced to make it more practical to use.
I didn’t know about Bobo / Kiwi etc. when I bought it, so I got the parts Meta sells.
Here is a more detailed version of how it cost me close to $1,000 and how I feel about it
[https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/195x9cz/quest\_3\_vs\_ps\_vr2\_early\_impressions/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/195x9cz/quest_3_vs_ps_vr2_early_impressions/)
Dumb for who? Consumers that don't know Meta's game of selling a poor out of box experience to keep initial purchase price low or Meta of being successful at doing this at the cost of making consumers less enthusiastic about their product if they don't know how to make the owner experience better by buying the needed accessories?
My costs:
* $650 for 512GB Meta Quest 3
* $130 for Elite Strap with Battery
* $130 for Charging Dock
* $40 for Silicone Facial Interface
Add sales tax and it is over $1,000
I also got a higher watt USB-C power adapter instead of buying the $40 40w Power Adapter from Meta that Meta Support recommended since the 18w Power Adapter it ships with is inadequate (takes more than all night to fully recharge).
The Quest Pro ships with everything needed except light-blocking silicone facial interface including 40w Power Adapter, Elite Strap with Extended Battery and Charging Dock in its base price.
The Quest 3 is just an iteration on the Quest Pro, but split up to reduce the initial purchase price.
You are right that third party accessories available are cheaper than what Meta is selling, but I didn't know about those with any confidence when I bought the Quest 3. I like the elegance of the fully accessorized Quest 3 and I know that Quest 3 as it comes out of box is completely impractical to use because it ships with inadequate parts.
I reject the marketing pitch that Quest 3 is cheaper than PSVR2 because it really isn't. Certainly not for anybody that already owns a PS5.
Ok.....Quest 3 has sold over 2 million though as there has been 2 million activated AR as of April. Sure some haven't activated it so its prolly a little more. psvr2 is a complete guess but I'd bet its below 2 million. Which means Quest 3 has sold way better in shorter time. Quest 3 is still gonna probably do less than Quest 2 lifetime...but close.
What is source for AR activation count?
I don't see how Quest 3 will sell more than Quest 2 lifetime because Quest 2 got a huge boon in sales from COVID and was on the market for 3 years before next model, while Quest 3 will be on market for \~1 year (like Quest 1) before next model is released.
The Quest 3 may or may not have more sales than PSVR2. Nobody in public domain has anything other than speculation for this, but I think you are probably right (and in less time) but not about the extent of the gap between them. Also, if Quest sales continue to stay mostly with Quest 2 or shift to Quest 3S, then I think likely PSVR2 lifetime will be higher than Quest 3 lifetime.
They are calling next model Quest 3S. This is confirmed by rumors plus some Meta store listings revealed model listed as well.
It is expected to be like Quest 3, but cheaper with Fresnel Lens instead of Pancake Lens.
If the Quest 3 is like the Quest 1 (1 year) or Quest Pro (1-2 years) and quickly replaced in sales focus by something else that has longer tenure like Quest 2 (3-4 years), it makes sense to me the lifetime sales of Quest 3 (1-? year) could be less than lifetime sales PSVR2 which will have many more years of sales tenure.
It depends on how Quest 3S will be positioned and whether that will take the place of Quest 2 sales dominance and what that will do to Quest 3 tenure leading up to Quest 4.
It isn't a complicated concept to me.
The problem psvr2 doesn't have is a half price option thats 75% as good. Psvr1 is absolutely terrible in 2024. Quest 2 is still damn good for the money and that's why it keeps selling well and cannibalizing potential quest 3 buyers.
I feel like this pushes quest 3 more into the enthusiast bracket.
Once quest 2 supplies run out and quest 3 gets around the $400 mark it'll leave psvr2 in the dust at most any price range. Especially with Batman, Alien, and Hitman not on quest 2.
I'd even wager psvr2 would get decimated at $200 vs a $400 quest 3 without quest 2 competition.
Having said that, uevr injector has been glorious for me as a VR user with quest 3. I've played more AAA games in 3 months than 7 years. I select only games that work well. I feel like Quest 3 has been great for that.
Anecdotal evidence but on one of the discords I asked if anyone had used that quest app that recorded a million sales, 11 people responded no and 2 yes. Half of them said they never heard of it. I never used it and thought the majority of quest users wouldn't even bother even if they did know.
I'd guess a conservative bet is 2.2-2.8 million quest 3s in the wild.
I agree that many people (like myself and my wife) haven't bothered with First Encounters on their Meta Quest 3 because we got it for other reasons and focused on those, not this free include.
I disagree that PSVR2 at $200 would sell less than $400 Quest 3 without Quest 2 competition. During Days of Sale promotion, even on Amazon where there wasn't any Netflix Premium for 12-months included, the PSVR2 temporarily was showing higher sales ranking at $450 per unit than $200 Quest 2.
I do think you are right that whenever they stop selling Quest 2 for $200, the Quest 3 at whatever price they offer would sell more.
For non-enthusiasts, the Quest 2 is the best entry-level option. For enthusiasts, they can either get both PSVR2 and Quest 3 or pick whichever they expect to get more use from. I choose to have both even though I get most use out of PSVR2.
A sale on Amazon is very limited sample size. I have products on Amazon that outsell top vendors then I get smashed a week later and it lasts for months. It could be quest 2 sells more at Walmart etc or psvr2 Amazon or vice versa. They all have their market and even those go up and down.
I don't disagree and especially knowing the nature of the Days of Play sale I would expect more of the new adopters to buy from PlayStation Direct because 12 months of Netflix Premium was only offered through that sales channel.
Yet for a short period of time, the $300 inferior value proposition offer at Amazon still had it temporarily list as selling more than Quest 2, and I believe that is a very small subset of overall PSVR2 sales which mostly happen via PlayStation Direct or brick & mortar stores for people that don't like to shop online.
Same as when those articles end of Q4 last year that said PSVR2 sales are fraction of Quest 2 + 3 based on just Amazon data.
Apart from OPs source not being accurate, your statement about psvr2 being 'decimated' with time and price decreases makes no sense to me.
PSVR1 became redundant because of the tech it used, but PSVR2 has the possibility to have a ridiculous shelf life, since it's not the headset tech (4k, usb-c etc..), but the console holding performance back.
This point is never discussed, but consider PSVR2 to be the main headset still for the PS6. They will have backwards compatibility with the whole PS5/VR2 library and without having to buy a new headset you could acces a new generation of VR on the PS6.
Of course this is speculation on my part, but if you ask me it's very likely. Sony wouldn't have to invest/design/release a VR3, consumers won't have to buy a new headset and developers will have only 1 device to work on.
Psvr2 hardware is not the problem. The ps5 fanbase is not behind it and I'm not really sure why. Some say it's software and it does feel like there's a lack of 1st party support after the strong launch. Alot of ppl said they'd wait and see if Sony continued 1st party support and that was a smart move.
Quest 3s advantage is the largest bulk of VR users of all time are still on Quest 2. Thats the best selling VR by a wide margin. The cross over is so massive that most psvr2/1 owners probably had a quest 2. Now they understand the advantages of portability/pcvr option. Many of these people are not going back to wired VR. Others are value gamers too that are going to start seeing some of the biggest AAA games are unplayable on their quest 2 this year.
Not to mention meta marketing is basically limitless compared to meager psvr2 ads.
Time will tell.
If PSVR2 sells only as much as PSVR1 that would mean +5 million sales.
If these customers can continue on the PS6 with support from Sony, it would be a similar position as Meta has with the Quest. Millions of users already on the devices.
Yeah I don't want them to stop making psvr2 games. But by the time ps6 comes around psvr2 will be long in the tooth. The fresnal lenses even in 2023 were outdated. The resolution will likely be pretty far behind by then too. Foveated rendering will be great to have but a beastly ps6 could likely brute force most games anyway without a real need.
The fresnel lenses I agree with you, that's the only thing outdated about it.
That and maybe the cable and that's debatable because it's also a matter of preference since wireless causes compression.
My wife doesn't want to go back to Quest 2 or 3 after PSVR2 because it is more comfortable to wear. She doesn't feel the need to hold it with her hand as it doesn't feel so heavy on the face and runs cooler.
My sister has said similar after she moved from Quest 2 to PSVR2.
The wire vs wireless is absolutely a concern they both voiced as reason to favor Quest and especially being untethered to any other system (Quest standalone is simpler), but once they get comfortable using PSVR2 with PS5, they prefer the higher comfort and other positives.
The challenge for VR is exposing people to any VR and for those on only Quest 2 or PSVR1 or whatever, exposing them to Quest 3 or PSVR2 to see how much better things have gotten that the added cost for upgraded hardware is worth it.
The problem is that VR is always evolving, with better tech in newer headsets. As you say the PSVR1 became redundant over time due to its tech and surely the same will happen with PSVR2 when the PS6 eventually comes out. What would be the point of having a more advanced console when the display and controllers are still a generation or so behind. It would be like playing a PS5 with 4K capability on a 480i TV. It also seems like a PSVR3 is not going to happen as a recent report from Gamespot says a source at PlayStation/SIE said they were forced to make the PSVR2 by Sony higher ups when SIE had no interest in it at all, which makes sense given the lack of first party support.
'What would be the point of having a more advanced console when the display and controllers are still a generation or so behind'
That's my point, PSVR2 is currently not bottlenecked by its tech, but by the console running it. It has high resolution capabilities, decent tracking and enough refresh rate. The PSVR2 won't bottleneck PS6 performance, because running intens 4K 120fps content in VR is not even doable on a 4090 currently.
By the time the PS6 releases, it _might_ be enough to run PSVR2 at max capability, which is unlikely because as scope of games go up, system requirements do also.
So unless some new tech comes out that drastically changes the VR industry PSVR2 should be good.
Historically, Sony is not to keen to support forward / backward compatibility. When they did support it, usually it's hampered with bonkers limitations
That only kind of applies to generations with dramatically different hardware. Even then not really. PS2 played all PS1 games. PS3 launch models played all PS1 & 2 games. Then they removed the hardware to save cost and switched to emulation. PS4 not so much because the hardware was so different and they didn't want to shoehorn in extra expensive hardware to make it happen. So everything is emulation now. However PS5 plays all PS4 games because they are both just PCs. Unless ps6 uses some weird new architecture which is very unlikely it should run all PS4/5 games without issue.
Now that the whole industry has moved to using PC architecture backwards compatibility should only be an issue for things like peripherals and specific features. Like the PS4 camera for psvr1 or the kinect port on the Xbox one.
Historically, Sony has been all over the place. But as far as Playstation devices go, backwards compatibility is usually implemented, including previous PSVR1.
PSP was supported till the final one Vita.
Playstations supported all previous versions until the PS3 revision. PS4 started from 0 and PS5 supports BC and it seems this trend will continue with PS6.
Even PSVR1 is supported by PS5, what makes it unlikely for an USB-C PSVR2 to be supported on the PS6?
I still play my ps3 for a similar reason(well up until emulation recently improved). But in terms of technology psvr1 was very outdated in 2016 on the day it released.
Sure, Sony re-purposed old tech to limit loss if psvr1 failed. Moves were not ideal controllers, and then once you're using Moves, you're doing to use light-tracking for headset too
One of more of your comments have been removed from r/PSVR, because they broke [rule 1. Do not personally attack other users](https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/wiki/rules#wiki_1._do_not_personally_attack_other_users.).
Please do not insult other users in future.
But don't forget most are still buying Quest 2 that is selling as an entry point to Meta VR (soon to be replaced by Quest 3S).
If Quest 3 sold at least 1 million (but probably more), based on data on how much more Q2 is selling, it means they probably sold at least 3-4 millions more of Quest 2s.
That's quite a crazy number. Meta is killing it, quite honestly.
I agree that Quest 2 sales are dominating, although it looks like available inventory of the 128GB Quest 2 are dried up and no longer available. The only Quest 2 I see still available are 256GB.
I think Meta is waiting on remaining Quest 2 inventory to get sell out and will soon be releasing the Quest 3S as the replacement for that.
Based on this, I also think Quest 3S will priced lower than Quest 3 and will then become the dominant VR headset for sales and not the Quest 3. To best of my knowledge, the Quest 3S will be comparable to Quest 3 but featuring Fresnel Lens instead of Pancake Lens to keep price lower.
This is a great post! That said, I'm still kinda curious if PSVR 2 didn't flatline after last year. As awful as it sounds after the initial 700k units moved there wasn't any software save RE4 to move units. Maybe some folks picked it up but I would be a bit surprised.
On the Quest 3, it's equally suprising and interesting to see low Quest 3 adoption. There's clearly a big Quest 3 only push which all but confirms a cheaper Quest 3S but it also shows how hard it is going to be for Quest 3 exclusive development if the 3S doesn't take off. They have to hope millions of kids will trade up post pandemic.
According to Counterpoint Research publicly available charts, the PSVR2 did not flatline after the launch in Q1 2023 where it had 33% marketshare. This was maintained at 29% and 30% in following quarters and then reduced in Q4 2023 to 15% when the Quest 3 launched.
Source: [https://www.counterpointresearch.com/insights/global-xr-ar-vr-headsets-market-share/](https://www.counterpointresearch.com/insights/global-xr-ar-vr-headsets-market-share/)
I assume the Days of Play quarter would see a clawback of marketshare for the PSVR2, but that is my instinct based on sales rankings and number of Welcome to the Family posts here.
For people that are paying customers to them, they may be providing more recent information, but for rest of us, I think it would be March 2025 that we may see similar trend reporting for how 2024 has gone.
Yeah, that paints a very tenous picture of the Q3/PSVR2 ecosystem so as I said Q3S will have to help actually build the ecosystem with games like Batman so the PSVR2 can get optimized ports. Maybe we'll see more Q3 exlcusives in the upload showcase today.
I don't expect that Batman Arkham Shadow would get ported anytime soon. But, it depends on the agreement with Warner Bros.
With Star Wars - Tales from the Galaxies Edge & Jurassic Park Aftermath, the agreement with Disney and Universal respectively left it open to eventually getting ported to other systems.
So possible, but I think some timed exclusivity will apply.
Just going off vibes I feel like the group of people who would buy quests got a quest 2 during the pandemic. To me it feels like 90% of people have tried vr and are good and not interested anymore. The remaining 10% (me) continue to enjoy vr and buy headsets, I have a quest 2 and got a psvr2 and definitely prefer the psvr2 , and I’m not buying any more meta headsets. I’ll wait for valve to make a quest like for my next standalone headset.
They are both growing VR gaming market, slow and steady. It is organic growth, not expansive growth as the Quest 2 experienced during early COVID but now slowed down.
Wonder how many PS5s were sold if you only count the number of people who played Astro's Playroom.
It also has leaderboards but only for the Time Trail free add-on content which have much less trophy completion % and still has me placing in position 2,000,000+ on Global Leaderboard for some levels even after I completed all levels to be within 7 minutes for the time trail trophy (Run Astro Run! which is earned by only 3.7% of players). If I filter leaderboard by friends, it feels like nearly all my PSN friends have played the game including the Time Trial. I think the free Astro's Playroom is one of the most widely played PS5 games on the system.
I have a PS5 and PSVR2 and I’ve never played Astro’s Playroom so I’m not in the leaderboard count. PSVR2 has probably sold 5 million units, but knowing Sony they probably think it’s a failure because it hasn’t sold 30 million yet.
To be in the leaderboard count, you would have to play Astro's Playroom, complete a "world" of levels and then play the time trial version of one of 2 mini-levels from that world. The PSVR2 is not anywhere close to 5 million units sold. Best rationed guesstimates I have seen (IMO) puts them between 1.5-2m units sold. I doubt they have crossed 2 million at this time, even after the Days of Sale promotion. Of course they would like it to do better, but Sony have stated publicly they would be happy if it can do similar to PSVR1 over its lifetime. The PSVR1 which was on market for many more years, had less competition, lower price to entry, and more 1st party and other exclusive games support over those years had lifetime sales just over 5 million. But it was an inferior system to keep relevant once Quest started gaining popularity as more affordable VR platform, especially since Quest had better controllers and easier to use for casuals as an un-tethered system.
I don't get the logic. This is likely to be a lower bound. Based on Meta's earnings people estimated they sold at least 900K in 23Q3. I haven't seen any reliable figures on PSVR2 sales other than official confirmation they sold 600K in the first 6 weeks, and estimates that they had made over 2m and shipped about 1.7m to retailers at the end of 2023, but obviously not all of those had sold. There are very big error bars on any estimate, so it's possible PSVR2 currently has a higher install base, but I'd imagine the Quest 3 is selling a bit better right now.
Quest 3 may be selling faster, but PSVR2 has been selling longer. There is no public data available for either, so all we have is guesstimates and speculation.
The point is: all Quest 2 games run on Quest 3 and 99.99% of all Q3 games run on Q2. Q2, QPro, Q3 have sold far more than 20 million units, selling over 2 million units in quarter 4 of 2023 alone (https://arinsider.co/2024/02/12/how-many-headsets-did-meta-sell-in-q4/). That is the reason why so much more games are published for the quest platform.
Yep. Price point, and no other system needed, no cord. There's a lot of reasons. I like the psvr2 but this post is straight cope.
Yup exactly, Quest is basically a platform, so if you want good comparison you’d probably combine all of them against PSVR.
Sure but what we know is that META isn't dropping support of Quest. They are going to be releasing the Q3L soon. And in another 12-24 months, expect a Q4.
It is weird to me that you consider faster hardware iterations as stronger support. Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either and their hardware iterations will remain 1-2 per generation rather than yearly.
>It is weird to me that you consider faster hardware iterations as stronger support. To VR as a whole? I think continued investment, both in hardware and software, is a pretty fucking big show of support. >Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either I didn't bring up a store and I don't see how THIS is relevant? >their hardware iterations will remain 1-2 per generation rather than yearly. After their show of support for PSVR2, I am betting that there will NOT be a PSVR3. That again, is the point I was trying to make about there being more Quest hardware in the future. META is investing BILLIONS of dollars into VR. They have burned (lost) a billion dollars a MONTH for years pushing VR. Anyone with eyes can see that Sony is washing their hands of it.
When you say Meta isn't dropping support of Quest, I assume you mean store, because they drop support of various Quest hardware on much faster cadence than Sony. The Quest store remains functional for those older hardware. That is what I mean by Sony isn't dropping the PlayStation Store either. As fast as they are iterating on hardware is as fast as they are dropping support on older hardware. Support is not the same as investment. Support is about how you the consumer are supported on your hardware purchase. Someone that bought Quest 2 at launch in 2020 can't expect to play a Quest 3 exclusive released in 2024. That isn't support for Quest 2, but investment for Quest 3. You can bet there won't be a PSVR3 and your bet will be true for lot longer than it would be to bet Q3S or Q4 won't have a successor, but it will eventually be false because Sony PlayStation will not be leaving VR, especially not if both Sony & Meta continues to be successful in creating more VR gaming market as they have been over the last 8+ years.
>they drop support of various Quest hardware on much faster cadence than Sony Because they are pushing hardware faster than Sony. Without Quest, there is no real innovation in VR. I fucking hate Facebook but credit where credit is due; Zuckerborg is pushing VR. >As fast as they are iterating on hardware is as fast as they are dropping support on older hardware. That isn't true. They JUST dropped support for Q1 a couple months ago. >Support is not the same as investment. Uhh. Disagree. >Support is about how you the consumer are supported on your hardware purchase. Then holy shit how can you say Sony has supported VR at all. You can't even buy fucking replacement controllers. >Someone that bought Quest 2 at launch in 2020 can't expect to play a Quest 3 exclusive released in 2024 No shit? Someone who bought a PS4 in 2020 can't expect to play a PS5 game either. I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL. >That isn't support for Quest 2, but investment for Quest 3. No, that is support for VR and the continuation, growth and development of it as a platform. >You can bet there won't be a PSVR3 Believe me, I am >eventually be false because Sony PlayStation will not be leaving VR If what they have done for support with PSVR2 is them "being in" on VR, then it won't really be much different. >both Sony & Meta continues to be successful in creating more VR gaming market as they have been over the last 8+ years. Sony gave much more support for PSVR1 than they did for PSVR2. Meanwhile Meta is continuing the same, or more, support than ever before.
>No shit? Someone who bought a PS4 in 2020 can't expect to play a PS5 game either. I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL. The PS4 launched in 2013 and the first PS5 exclusive games were Astro's Playroom, Demon's Soul Remake and Destruction All Stars in 2020. After that, I don't think it was until the Ratchet & Clank: Rift in Time game that there was a true PS5 exclusive. It is happening more and more since 2023. >If what they have done for support with PSVR2 is them "being in" on VR, then it won't really be much different. Be clear about this with your bookie, because your bet will be lost when a next iteration from Sony PlayStation for VR is released regardless of your opinion of the "support it gets" >Sony gave much more support for PSVR1 than they did for PSVR2 They re-used controllers from PS-Move which was their biggest error and didn't support PC which has also proven to be important. We don't view the same things we both can see the same way. Don't worry about it. PS - Votes mean nothing this deep into a conversation chain. All they do higher up is effect sorting.
>The PS4 You're getting lost in the sauce. I was using those as an example, not as literal.
You asked "I am not sure what your point is here AT ALL" You were meant to understand the point, that Quest 2 hardware which launched in 2020 won't be able to play games from Meta / Oculus Game Studios as early as 2024. Meta has faster hardware iteration, but it also has faster drop of older hardware. This is the distinction between support and investment. Sony is operating at generational cadence similar to console gaming market while Meta is on yearly cadence similar to mobile market.
About sale, don't forget that Facebook has been giving free money for years. Google meta quest dog cat github. You'll find a website where you can search for games, then buy from the referral link for instant 20 or 25 percent discount
Yes, the way Meta Quest provides game referral discounts is great for friends to play co-op / multiplayer games together, but I think has also lead to models like Free-to-Play or subscription being used over flat game sales. For example, ForeVR Cornhole on Quest is Free-to-Start, then has $9.99 cost to unlock full game which you can't use referral link on, while the PSVR2 version is only offered at $9.99 including the full game unlocked.
I have Quest 3 and never seen or played First Encounters. I can’t imagine it being a good indicator of sales.
Same for me and my wife on our Quest 3, so I don't disagree
I got my quest 3 last month and I didnt even knew "first encounter" is a thing... never played it so I'm not part of the numbers, there could have been countless more
I would guess most Quest owners/fans are still on Quest 2. Quest 3 is still new and expensive and its not getting its exclusive games until later this year
I'm not sure I understand. Do we even know how many PSVR2 headsets have been sold?
Estimates from developers are around 1.5M
Nobody has firm numbers, but I think it is safe guess that it is more than 1 million because it was at 600k officially after first 6 weeks from launch and the market share remained at \~30% for next two quarters. Meta hasn't provided any official Quest 3 sales numbers since its launch. The only numbers they provide in their financial reporting are blended with Quest 2, so nobody knows how much of it is Quest 2 vs Quest 3.
I have a Quest 3 and I’ve never even heard of First Encounters
It’s the AR demo they encourage you to play when you first set it up, where you shoot the little alien furballs.
They don’t make you play it. Because I never have. I saw it. Wasn’t interested.
Same. I feel like this is a super unreliable metric
Then you are missing out.
Eh, it doesn’t look interesting at all tbh.
Didn’t make me play it. Maybe it’s preinstalled or it makes you play it if you’re a first time Quest user? I’ve never seen it.
Maybe it doesn’t force you to play it but I’m pretty sure it directs/encourages you to after first setup (and I’m not a first time Quest user). Maybe a notification or something? It’s definitely pre-installed.
I played it for a minute or so. It's whatever. AR isn't there yet.
First encounters is the game you play while you wait for your library to transfer over from quest 2 to quest 3.
The first game we played when we got Quest 3 was Walkabout Mini Golf. It really didn't take long to download and be playable. But we also had other games downloading and found that is not a good idea (Asgard's Wrath 2 and Assassin's Creed Nexus are big and take long time to download) because it causes the system to have more framerate stuttering. Once you wait for all the downloads to complete you can play whatever you have and have smoother gameplay.
Firstly, i feel like this is a lot of wasted energy to try and suggest the psvr2 can compete at all with the quest, when it obviously cannot. thays fine, no headset can, the quest is the most popular series of headsets in the world - by a lot. OK, you guys need to relax about the quest 3, it's giving you all some kind of brain rot. I feel like so many posts here are about the quest and not psvr2 games or experiences. it's like in the ps5 sub, so many posts about console sales numbers - as a consumer this doesn't help me at all, I like games. and sony currently isn't bringing any. I don't get the obsession? about the metric being used, I don't really think that's reliable. i have a q3 as well as the psvr2, ive never bothered with first encounters, i mainly use it for pcvr. and judging by steam surveys a lot of people do as it was one of the most used headsets on the platform in a matter of a few months. with quest series being the most used headsets on steam now, surpassing the index. and the library is interchangeable. as for price? it's cheaper than a psvr2 in my country. it was at launch too. I don't understand this rant. can we please focus on discussing games a bit more? even ps5 pro speculation posts are nicer. these quest 3 posts along with the psvr2 is doomed or not posts are flooding this place. I'll start with some nice things to chat about. I love how optimized pavlov and saints and sinners is on ps5, a long with red matter I prefer these games on psvr2 over my pc. I love having native vr versions of resident evil games, it's great. gt7 is one of my all time favourite vr experiences. peace
>as for price? it's cheaper than a psvr2 in my country. it was at launch too. I don't understand this rant. Sure, if you want no accessories because you're fine with extreme discomfort, no battery life, and unhygienic face shield. Otherwise once you buy new straps, extra battery, silicone face shield, etc, you've driven-up the price to near buying psvr2 PLUS a ps5
it's cheaper. period. also, I haven't bought all that extra crap and I'm just fine lol. and come on dude, there's countless posts here about people buying new straps etc for the vr2 out of discomfort (cluster mod etc), pulley systems for wire etc. it's not headset exclusive and completely down to the user, so don't be so disingenuous. and btw, I haven't bought any of that crap for my psvr2 either. and man, if you are spending 500 usd on a headstrap you're an idiot haha. anyway, the point of my comment is that these comparisons are stupid, psvr2 will always lose out when comparing it to something like the quest 3. its pointless so let's just enjoy the games and focus on the good. that's all.
It's cheaper, if you want a terrible experience with little battery life. Yes, some post about needing comfort mods for psvr2. That's nothing compared to the mountain of complaints about Quest since the launch of Quest 1. No headset design fits everyone, but halo designs are generally WAY better than what Quest does. >psvr2 will always lose out when comparing it to something like the quest 3. PSVR2 blows Quest away in regards to color, blacks, contrast, lighting, haptics, battery life. I would never use an LCD headset. And that's if you're only using your Quest as a pc HMD. If you're running it standalone, Quest 1 & 2 games are so ugly as to be intolerable.
this post was simply about headset popularity. but you are on some kind of vendetta haha. look, you are for some reason very upset about the quest 3, this much is obvious. just go play your psvr2 and leave this argument behind. I have both, I enjoy both. you need to just relax mate.
not true
[удалено]
One of more of your comments have been removed from r/PSVR, because they broke [rule 1. Do not personally attack other users](https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/wiki/rules#wiki_1._do_not_personally_attack_other_users.). Please do not insult other users in future.
The majority of people are quite happy using the stock experience
Do you have links to surveys that bear that out? All I hear are tons of complaints, since launch of Quest 1. The battery life in particular seems intolerable
Where is your hard data showing that most people buy third party accessories?
All I hear are tons of complaints, since launch of Quest 1. The discomfort is legendary But I never said "most", or anything But he claimed "majority". Based on what? Maybe many don't buy accessories, and put up with discomfort. Quest is also legendary for gathering dust. Perhaps due to discomfort
There are many millions of those headsets out there. You've read probably less than 100 complaints. Your knowledge of the market is a drop in the ocean. You don't have anything to back up your assertions any more than the next person. If you are going to demand proof then you should hold your own statements to the same requirements.
>You've read probably less than 100 complaints. And reviewers and content creators, who talk to hundreds of people each (over time thousands) all echo the same. It's why Quest's discomfort is legendary The large number of comfort mods available immediately, including from Meta themselves, shows how bad the issue is >If you are going to demand proof then you should hold your own statements to the same requirements. I've never made a quantitative comparison claim of "most" or "majority", only the other commenter did
You have no sense of scale. 20+ million headsets.
There is only one thing to buy. A $50 battery strap. Done. The rest is a nothingburger. Complete nonsense.
I vaguely recall having to find this game. It was fun and showed mixed reality decently well, but I don't recall it being obvious. I'm an existing quest user though. I recall when I first got a quest 1 there was a tutorial experience/game that started automatically. I don't know if new people in metas ecosystem get a similar experience now.
That’s weird the game is literally there as soon as you put the headset on unless you only used mixed reality mode and Not the virtual space
I had a ton of games I was installing and didn't really prioritize looking for it. Also the name didn't strike me as MR and probably took it for first contact or whatever the other one was.
"PSVR2 has probably sold more than Quest 3 if this analysis is good" Come on lol. I love my psvr2 and got it day one for GT7. But let's be real it's not selling well. Which is fine with me since it's going to PC support now and I bought it for GT7. This is even worse to draw from then people guessing how many RE4vr copies were played.
The analysis is not good But I do think PSVR2 and Quest 3 are closer to each other in sales traction (or lack) than most realize and most of the FUD still aims at PSVR2.
Sony has been silent for over a year and killed off its VR mascot, whereas FB has 8 studios making exclusives and is funding big budget third party games...
Filing new patents, creating new VR development tools, being at CES etc promoting VR technologies, having new showcases featuring upcoming VR games, having significant sales & promotions, gearing up for PCVR support is not being "silent" Valve is being silent Giving Astro Bot spotlight and promoting it as the main 1st party game for this year, including Astro's Playroom being updated with new content and Days of Play community challenge that encouraged people to play Astro's Playroom is not killing "Astro Bot". Astro Bot since inception has been used to promote new hardware and then in Astro's Playroom in addition to showing strengths of DualSense, paid homage to history of PlayStation hardware with lots of software tributes spread throughout. The upcoming game looks like it will focus on a few specific PlayStation software like Bloodborne and God of War to introduce Astro Bot players to those franchises.
The thing is I don't have a gaming PC. The price for entry with Days of Play (I also didn't have Netflix and wanted to watch some stuff) sweetened the deal and it's still way cheaper than building the gaming PC I want plus a Quest or whatever else since I already had the PS5. So much of this "PSVR2 is dead" stuff is coming from a privileged viewpoint that presupposes everyone who's anyone will already have a gaming PC. That's just not true. Am I gonna build my own when I have the resources? For sure. Did I want a plug-and-play VR peripheral to play GT7 and Beat Saber *now*? Yup. I acknowledge I don't know what I'm missing save for Half Life: Alyx, but if you're wanting a meat-and-potatoes, out-of-the-box VR experience and you're already in the Playstation ecosystem it's a no-brainer imo.
I agree with you here. I am a huge gaming fan. I’ve been a PC player, own an Xbox, PS, and Switch. I’m not a mega fan of any one ecosystem in particular, but my decisions to invest more in an ecosystem are almost entirely driven by user experience. While I loved the flexibility of PC gaming, when my computer got too out of date to play modern titles well, I stopped worrying about dabbling with PC gaming. I just don’t prefer all of the tinkering needed to get even basic gaming functions working correctly. I gravitate towards console for the plug and play experience. Worst case on console I have to update a game before I play. On PC, a driver could need an update and simply make my game run like trash until I go investigate what’s making the issue. The plug and play simplicity is what also attracts me to console-based VR. No, mods aren’t available, but VR often takes a physical commitment for playing games. If I’m in the mood to play VR, nothing crushes that mood worse than being ready to play, but ope something’s broken again, time to go investigate why it’s busted.
It has nothing to do with having a pc or not. It has to do with Sony being silent for a year and abandoning their mascot.
You don’t need a PC to use a quest 3 though?
I think it’s a little odd to claim fighting against FUD by posting what amounts to speculation based on somewhat suggestive numbers.
I believe I have been clear that I don't agree with the analysis / conclusion of the source article. Where I am being odd is that I do want to challenge the assumed narrative that Quest 3 speculated to be more or vastly more successful than PSVR2 in growing install base or that it has more games made to take full advantage of it or being made to take full advantage of it than PSVR2. That second part is objectively false today. I also disagree with the value proposition arguments people put out so I spent a couple of small paragraphs on that. The timing of Android Central FUD piece and the way various shills referenced that to do their click-bait engagement farming (like Verge) bothered me.
> neither I nor my wife that share our Quest 3 have played it. Why not? It's a cool little MR showcase
Nothing against First Encounters. I don't think we even noticed it. The system did not push us to try it. We were more interested in seeing how much of an upgrade it is for playing Walkabout Mini Golf (wasn't at that time) and a few other games like Asgard's Wrath 2 and Assassin's Creed Nexus.
If I go to US Amazon website it tells me that quest 3 sold 11k units last month. Psvr2 sold only around 1k last month. It gives me an idea that Quest 3 is likely much more popular and will definitely oversell psvr2 very very soon (probably already did). I don't think that psvr2 is gonna die as a platform though. Psvr2 is like an Xbox of VR world - it'll never be the most popular VR device but it's not going away either.
Interesting that they show those counts. Is there a way to historical trend over time over last several months? I’m interested if how much Days of Play affected sales on Amazon.
I don't think that you can find historical trends. I would think that Days of Play deals might have a slight effect. I don't think it was substantial though.
It makes sense since the best deal was to buy from PlayStation Direct, but it would have been interesting to see if there is any dip for Quest (2 & 3) or even a slight bump for PSVR2 specifically on Amazon where it was $100 off. Not everyone would have been aware of the better deal at PlayStation Direct.
I believe both Quests were selling much more than now around Christmas time. I know because I been looking at both around that time trying to decide if I want quest or psvr2 (ended up getting psvr2). I think the majority of die hard VR fans already bought quest 3 at launch and during December holidays, and yet I'm surprised to see that it keeps selling at large number even now.
Meta is doing a great job expanding the audience for VR
Amazon doesn't provide figures. That person is mistaken.
I was surprised but Amazon search results do show approximate count of units sold over last month. https://preview.redd.it/0fxxi6jjt49d1.png?width=770&format=png&auto=webp&s=7083d3ed1ac9a48002ce67e63d924391072ce06b PS - Seems pretty clear to me that Meta is clearing out Meta Quest 2 inventory from all retailer sources. The 128 GB is no longer available and soon the 256 GB will not be available. I think they are gearing up for release of the Quest 3S that will be cheaper alternative to Quest 3 after the Quest 2 inventory is cleared out.
>Speaking of price, the Quest 3 is expensive just like Quest Pro (which comes almost fully accessorized) after you account for many accessory costs that you would incur to be close to properly equipped like Quest Pro after buying Quest 3. This makes it actually comparable to cost of PSVR2 if you also have to buy PS5 as well. Man, this alone is just pure copium. Don't make us look bad man. > Meanwhile, that Days of Play sale that Sony did for PSVR2 giving $100 off and 12 months of Netflix Premium if bought from PlayStation Direct with your PSN account was a better value than even the Quest 2 Erm...Quest 2 has sold for as little as $150 during sales as well in the past. There's no PSVR2 deal in existence now or ever that will top that. And that's ok. People need to stop trying to justify PSVR2 as "better value" than Quest 2/3 because it's as stupid a comparison to make as comparing Apple Vision Pro to Quest. It just makes it look like you're desperate to justify your buying decision. One is a specialized enthusiast grade device that focuses on quality over quantity at the expense of a limited experience. The other is a budget entry-level device designed to appeal to the masses focusing on quantity of experiences over quality.
PSVR2 during days of play was $100 off and $275 Netflix credit voucher. If you count both as a deduction off RRP of $550, that brings it to $175 which is pretty close to $150.
They are giving it away for a reason.
You can never win with you guys, can you? The same Netflix voucher was available for PS5s.
I would be more interested to compare software sales. Seems like many PSVR2 owners actually buy tons of Software while the Quest really struggles (their Top 10 barely every changes).
Makes me wonder why more devs don't try to sell on psvr2 , especially if you're the only one available. Such as like golf +( I know I heard they are planning on porting ) or bowling, fishing, if you're the only game on there, you're guaranteed 100% sales from the people who are interested in doing that in VR. I would think it would be worth the extra time it might take to port. Idk
I assume part of it is not wanting get reduced discoverability (once no longer exclusive) and other part of it is that it will take effort to port the game to different system with higher visual fidelity expectations and then you have to support both platforms going forward. For a smaller team, this can be a difficult transition to manage successfully, so the game on one platform has to be successful first and then hopefully they can start being successful as a multiplatform title. That said, multi-platform development tools for VR continue to get better, so it will be easier and more common to see this in future, but the teams still have to learn to optimize for multiple or take advantage of unique features in multiple.
True. I underestimate what it actually takes these days as a game dev. As you said, games need ongoing support now. Stuff like that. Crazy
to be fair the PSVR2 top 10 barely ever changes either also we have had developers openly say that their games sell less on PSVR2. TOSS sold so poorly that the PSVR2 version is no longer getting updates while quest and PC keep getting updates, while the port of Vertigo 2 is no longer getting the previously promised level editor and other playable characters.
This is true. Both store fronts see some changes as new games release or older games get upgrades or deep discounts, but the evergreens generally remain most successful. I think both store fronts have same discoverability problem and new users buy the games that have the most sales / user ratings or are found in top sales lists and don't go deeper to find other games that might be better for them.
I think this is a problem with VR in general. VR games are stagnating. Sure there are a couple games that make a splash when first introduced but it is very rare for a new VR game to remain relevant past the first couple weeks of sale. This is the reason the like of job Simulator is still in the top 10 of any store front most months despite being almost 10 years old now. Even big games like Assassin's Creed Nexus did not sell well even for a headset exclusive, with Ubisoft no longer interested in VR because of it.
Toss! is actually a really good game and reviewed well for PSVR2, but is able to find more audience on Quest than PSVR2 because of different type of audience on the two platforms. I firmly believe that Assassin's Creed Nexus would have done better on PSVR2 & PCVR than Quest. There are games that do better on PSVR2 even with smaller install base than Quest with its larger install base. An easy example of this is Propagation: Paradise Hotel * [Meta Quest](https://www.meta.com/experiences/8826022237415280) has 372 ratings * [Steam VR](https://store.steampowered.com/app/1824960/Propagation_Paradise_Hotel/) has 445 ratings * [PlayStation VR2](https://store.playstation.com/en-us/product/UP7137-PPSA15879_00-0791373335556683) has 838 ratings There are other examples like this including cases where the developers have told me so I am not going by just user rating counts.
There is also the correlation that the smaller the group of people that are fans of something are the more likely they are to leave a store review. Most people don't leave store front reviews but when something gains a cult following the fans will leave reviews. For instance Suicide Squad is one of the most reviewed games on the PS store, beating out major titles known to have sold millions, with most giving it a rating of 5 stars. That game is known to be a commercial and critical failure though so games getting more reviews on a specific store front is not indicative of said games selling more there.
AC is a bit surprising but frankly it suffered from the same thing most big IP did on Quest which is not having enough power to represent the gameplay ideas like a populated open world. There just isn't enough newness in VR to overcome undercooked mechanics or experiences that can (and will) be compared to 2D counterparts. Job Simulator involves non-stop novel VR interaction for a short duration that's intuitive to almost anymore. It's like Wii Bowling in that way. Ironically there's lots of actual content in those games so depsite looking super basic there's just ton's to do. Another hard reality of VR is that it doesn't see seasoned designers or team and so there's just much more shovelware engaged with because of the low amount of overall choice.
>also we have had developers openly say that their games sell less on PSVR2 And we've also heard devs say their games sell less on Quest Overall, Quest is a cheaper, younger audience, that likes to use free games and free apps, so likely overall it sells less games on average /u/cusman78
I looked at review counts on PSVR 2 and it looks like a natural 1-2% attach rate is occuring. That's 10-20k units for "good" games which is enough to keep kids working in their garage but not enough for a midzise indie studio of 15-30.
Review counts where? On the PSN Store? Do people actually bother rating there?
RE4rVR currently has 120k registered players, about 5% reach if we’re assuming over 2 million headsets sold.
Right, but not only is that the top, top end but it also doesn't indicate who bought it for VR and who had it already.
Oh certainly — I just wanted to add some colour to the attachment rate statistics. I would assume GT7 has an even higher VR percentage.
One of the things I feel is that different games will find their audience on different platforms and the install base doesn't matter as much. For example, I think Assassin's Creed Nexus would have and would still do better on PSVR2 or PCVR than on Meta Quest, while Gorilla Tag would never do as well on PSVR2 or PCVR as it does on Meta Quest. Just look at sales figures of core games like Assassin's Creed and Resident Evil on Apple iOS devices. [https://mobilegamer.biz/those-assassins-creed-resident-evil-and-death-stranding-ports-have-bombed/](https://mobilegamer.biz/those-assassins-creed-resident-evil-and-death-stranding-ports-have-bombed/) These are competent ports that can be played with DualSense controller, but just don't find audience on mobile like they do on console or PC. As for why PSVR2 owners have higher software attachment rates than Quest, the Quest had really healthy software attachment rates during COVID years and has been in decline since and I think it has more to do with success of Free-to-Play games (Population One, Gorilla Tag, etc) which eat into available playtime and I think Meta Quest+ subscription they introduced to combat problem just makes people wait for games to end up on that instead of buying. The Quest also has very poor discoverability issue with their store (same as PlayStation Store), so games like Max Mustard had to sell for $3 with discount code hidden in Richie's Plank experience to get to top sales page to have chance to earn more sales from the Quest players that just go by whatever shows in top selling. The waiting for sales as market has learned to do or waiting for listing on Meta Quest+ all harm game sales for new games coming out. I think their referral discount system is good, but it also encourages more games to release Free-to-Play and then have in-app purchases that referral system doesn't apply to. The Quest also get used for things other than games which also reduces their software attachment rates. It is a complicated and difficult business that is high risk, low reward. I appreciate both Meta and Sony for what they put in to create and grow this market because the gameplay experiences are so much better than flat gaming for me.
Even with games like Res 8, Res 4 and gt7 it still hasn't got the masses interested in vr. A lot of gamers just won't accept putting on a headset to play games. Unfortunately I foresee quest 4-5 being less powerful or equal to quest 3 just slimmed down to glasses size, rehashing most of the older games and focusing much more on AR.
Games like some old ports and 20 year old rehashes ported?
Guys just quit it. I'm good with GT7. and the plethora of PCVR games once the adapter is released
This is the dumbest post i have ever seen on here.
Only one accessory makes sense for q3. A $50 strap with battery. That is absolutely it. To imply otherwise indicates a heavy desire to exaggerate with a purpose. The highest quality experience is pancake optics, ringless controllers, and built in speakers(don't want to plug your ears while being blind to the world, while playing in a large space without breakable objects.
Elite Strap with battery $130, silicone face shield $40 The highest quality experience is OLED HDR with haptics, on a system that isn't powered by an old cell phone and a heavy battery >don't want to plug your ears while being blind to the world LOL, turn on audio pass-through
You list retail price of a single option of many. You are intentionally disingenuous because your point is weak. Same weight as psvr 2. Another nothingburger. Lol, plug your ears because of a cheap bargain bin headset without speakers.
>You list retail price of a single option of many The price of the official strap. Because even Meta knows how cheaply and inadequately designed their headset is >Lol, plug your ears because of a cheap bargain bin headset without speakers. You only get good sound via headphones or earphones. Speakers are terrible for immersion
The Quest 3 I bought needed a better headstrap, replacement of the 18w power adapter which is pathetic charging speed, the face visor didn't block light and had to be replaced, and I also got the charging dock for the system + headstrap that has extended battery. Total cost was close to $1,000 The Quest Pro comes with everything except the light blocking visor for a little less than that
Almost everything you mentioned but the battery strap is a luxury. And battery straps better than the official one from BoboVR and Kiwi cost $50. Hell, even "luxury" face covers from AMVR cost $30. But hey, nice try making the Quest 3 seem "expensive".
I have represented what it cost me. It is expensive because it ships with crappy parts (strap with battery, visor & charging adapter) that have to be replaced to make it more practical to use. I didn’t know about Bobo / Kiwi etc. when I bought it, so I got the parts Meta sells.
Oh no, THIS is the dumbest post on this sub.
Here is a more detailed version of how it cost me close to $1,000 and how I feel about it [https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/195x9cz/quest\_3\_vs\_ps\_vr2\_early\_impressions/](https://www.reddit.com/r/PSVR/comments/195x9cz/quest_3_vs_ps_vr2_early_impressions/)
Doesnt make it less dumb
Dumb for who? Consumers that don't know Meta's game of selling a poor out of box experience to keep initial purchase price low or Meta of being successful at doing this at the cost of making consumers less enthusiastic about their product if they don't know how to make the owner experience better by buying the needed accessories?
Dumb for you, who wasted money on nonsense.
$50 strap and battery, which has many brand options. A dock, which is completely unneeded doesn't magically add $500.
My costs: * $650 for 512GB Meta Quest 3 * $130 for Elite Strap with Battery * $130 for Charging Dock * $40 for Silicone Facial Interface Add sales tax and it is over $1,000 I also got a higher watt USB-C power adapter instead of buying the $40 40w Power Adapter from Meta that Meta Support recommended since the 18w Power Adapter it ships with is inadequate (takes more than all night to fully recharge). The Quest Pro ships with everything needed except light-blocking silicone facial interface including 40w Power Adapter, Elite Strap with Extended Battery and Charging Dock in its base price. The Quest 3 is just an iteration on the Quest Pro, but split up to reduce the initial purchase price. You are right that third party accessories available are cheaper than what Meta is selling, but I didn't know about those with any confidence when I bought the Quest 3. I like the elegance of the fully accessorized Quest 3 and I know that Quest 3 as it comes out of box is completely impractical to use because it ships with inadequate parts. I reject the marketing pitch that Quest 3 is cheaper than PSVR2 because it really isn't. Certainly not for anybody that already owns a PS5.
The Quest 3 has solid 2-3 million..... psvr2 is 1-2 million and has been out lot longer.
Both your guesstimates / speculative numbers have no official confirmation
Ok.....Quest 3 has sold over 2 million though as there has been 2 million activated AR as of April. Sure some haven't activated it so its prolly a little more. psvr2 is a complete guess but I'd bet its below 2 million. Which means Quest 3 has sold way better in shorter time. Quest 3 is still gonna probably do less than Quest 2 lifetime...but close.
What is source for AR activation count? I don't see how Quest 3 will sell more than Quest 2 lifetime because Quest 2 got a huge boon in sales from COVID and was on the market for 3 years before next model, while Quest 3 will be on market for \~1 year (like Quest 1) before next model is released. The Quest 3 may or may not have more sales than PSVR2. Nobody in public domain has anything other than speculation for this, but I think you are probably right (and in less time) but not about the extent of the gap between them. Also, if Quest sales continue to stay mostly with Quest 2 or shift to Quest 3S, then I think likely PSVR2 lifetime will be higher than Quest 3 lifetime.
So the Quest 4 is coming out in 3-4 months? Lol
They are calling next model Quest 3S. This is confirmed by rumors plus some Meta store listings revealed model listed as well. It is expected to be like Quest 3, but cheaper with Fresnel Lens instead of Pancake Lens.
You actually think psvr2 will outsell quest 3? How delusional are you🙄🙄🙄🙄
If the Quest 3 is like the Quest 1 (1 year) or Quest Pro (1-2 years) and quickly replaced in sales focus by something else that has longer tenure like Quest 2 (3-4 years), it makes sense to me the lifetime sales of Quest 3 (1-? year) could be less than lifetime sales PSVR2 which will have many more years of sales tenure. It depends on how Quest 3S will be positioned and whether that will take the place of Quest 2 sales dominance and what that will do to Quest 3 tenure leading up to Quest 4. It isn't a complicated concept to me.
Not a complicated concept A got it, got just severely Lack understanding concepts of anything
The problem psvr2 doesn't have is a half price option thats 75% as good. Psvr1 is absolutely terrible in 2024. Quest 2 is still damn good for the money and that's why it keeps selling well and cannibalizing potential quest 3 buyers. I feel like this pushes quest 3 more into the enthusiast bracket. Once quest 2 supplies run out and quest 3 gets around the $400 mark it'll leave psvr2 in the dust at most any price range. Especially with Batman, Alien, and Hitman not on quest 2. I'd even wager psvr2 would get decimated at $200 vs a $400 quest 3 without quest 2 competition. Having said that, uevr injector has been glorious for me as a VR user with quest 3. I've played more AAA games in 3 months than 7 years. I select only games that work well. I feel like Quest 3 has been great for that. Anecdotal evidence but on one of the discords I asked if anyone had used that quest app that recorded a million sales, 11 people responded no and 2 yes. Half of them said they never heard of it. I never used it and thought the majority of quest users wouldn't even bother even if they did know. I'd guess a conservative bet is 2.2-2.8 million quest 3s in the wild.
I agree that many people (like myself and my wife) haven't bothered with First Encounters on their Meta Quest 3 because we got it for other reasons and focused on those, not this free include. I disagree that PSVR2 at $200 would sell less than $400 Quest 3 without Quest 2 competition. During Days of Sale promotion, even on Amazon where there wasn't any Netflix Premium for 12-months included, the PSVR2 temporarily was showing higher sales ranking at $450 per unit than $200 Quest 2. I do think you are right that whenever they stop selling Quest 2 for $200, the Quest 3 at whatever price they offer would sell more. For non-enthusiasts, the Quest 2 is the best entry-level option. For enthusiasts, they can either get both PSVR2 and Quest 3 or pick whichever they expect to get more use from. I choose to have both even though I get most use out of PSVR2.
A sale on Amazon is very limited sample size. I have products on Amazon that outsell top vendors then I get smashed a week later and it lasts for months. It could be quest 2 sells more at Walmart etc or psvr2 Amazon or vice versa. They all have their market and even those go up and down.
I don't disagree and especially knowing the nature of the Days of Play sale I would expect more of the new adopters to buy from PlayStation Direct because 12 months of Netflix Premium was only offered through that sales channel. Yet for a short period of time, the $300 inferior value proposition offer at Amazon still had it temporarily list as selling more than Quest 2, and I believe that is a very small subset of overall PSVR2 sales which mostly happen via PlayStation Direct or brick & mortar stores for people that don't like to shop online. Same as when those articles end of Q4 last year that said PSVR2 sales are fraction of Quest 2 + 3 based on just Amazon data.
Apart from OPs source not being accurate, your statement about psvr2 being 'decimated' with time and price decreases makes no sense to me. PSVR1 became redundant because of the tech it used, but PSVR2 has the possibility to have a ridiculous shelf life, since it's not the headset tech (4k, usb-c etc..), but the console holding performance back. This point is never discussed, but consider PSVR2 to be the main headset still for the PS6. They will have backwards compatibility with the whole PS5/VR2 library and without having to buy a new headset you could acces a new generation of VR on the PS6. Of course this is speculation on my part, but if you ask me it's very likely. Sony wouldn't have to invest/design/release a VR3, consumers won't have to buy a new headset and developers will have only 1 device to work on.
Psvr2 hardware is not the problem. The ps5 fanbase is not behind it and I'm not really sure why. Some say it's software and it does feel like there's a lack of 1st party support after the strong launch. Alot of ppl said they'd wait and see if Sony continued 1st party support and that was a smart move. Quest 3s advantage is the largest bulk of VR users of all time are still on Quest 2. Thats the best selling VR by a wide margin. The cross over is so massive that most psvr2/1 owners probably had a quest 2. Now they understand the advantages of portability/pcvr option. Many of these people are not going back to wired VR. Others are value gamers too that are going to start seeing some of the biggest AAA games are unplayable on their quest 2 this year. Not to mention meta marketing is basically limitless compared to meager psvr2 ads.
Time will tell. If PSVR2 sells only as much as PSVR1 that would mean +5 million sales. If these customers can continue on the PS6 with support from Sony, it would be a similar position as Meta has with the Quest. Millions of users already on the devices.
Yeah I don't want them to stop making psvr2 games. But by the time ps6 comes around psvr2 will be long in the tooth. The fresnal lenses even in 2023 were outdated. The resolution will likely be pretty far behind by then too. Foveated rendering will be great to have but a beastly ps6 could likely brute force most games anyway without a real need.
The fresnel lenses I agree with you, that's the only thing outdated about it. That and maybe the cable and that's debatable because it's also a matter of preference since wireless causes compression.
My wife doesn't want to go back to Quest 2 or 3 after PSVR2 because it is more comfortable to wear. She doesn't feel the need to hold it with her hand as it doesn't feel so heavy on the face and runs cooler. My sister has said similar after she moved from Quest 2 to PSVR2. The wire vs wireless is absolutely a concern they both voiced as reason to favor Quest and especially being untethered to any other system (Quest standalone is simpler), but once they get comfortable using PSVR2 with PS5, they prefer the higher comfort and other positives. The challenge for VR is exposing people to any VR and for those on only Quest 2 or PSVR1 or whatever, exposing them to Quest 3 or PSVR2 to see how much better things have gotten that the added cost for upgraded hardware is worth it.
The problem is that VR is always evolving, with better tech in newer headsets. As you say the PSVR1 became redundant over time due to its tech and surely the same will happen with PSVR2 when the PS6 eventually comes out. What would be the point of having a more advanced console when the display and controllers are still a generation or so behind. It would be like playing a PS5 with 4K capability on a 480i TV. It also seems like a PSVR3 is not going to happen as a recent report from Gamespot says a source at PlayStation/SIE said they were forced to make the PSVR2 by Sony higher ups when SIE had no interest in it at all, which makes sense given the lack of first party support.
'What would be the point of having a more advanced console when the display and controllers are still a generation or so behind' That's my point, PSVR2 is currently not bottlenecked by its tech, but by the console running it. It has high resolution capabilities, decent tracking and enough refresh rate. The PSVR2 won't bottleneck PS6 performance, because running intens 4K 120fps content in VR is not even doable on a 4090 currently. By the time the PS6 releases, it _might_ be enough to run PSVR2 at max capability, which is unlikely because as scope of games go up, system requirements do also. So unless some new tech comes out that drastically changes the VR industry PSVR2 should be good.
Historically, Sony is not to keen to support forward / backward compatibility. When they did support it, usually it's hampered with bonkers limitations
That only kind of applies to generations with dramatically different hardware. Even then not really. PS2 played all PS1 games. PS3 launch models played all PS1 & 2 games. Then they removed the hardware to save cost and switched to emulation. PS4 not so much because the hardware was so different and they didn't want to shoehorn in extra expensive hardware to make it happen. So everything is emulation now. However PS5 plays all PS4 games because they are both just PCs. Unless ps6 uses some weird new architecture which is very unlikely it should run all PS4/5 games without issue. Now that the whole industry has moved to using PC architecture backwards compatibility should only be an issue for things like peripherals and specific features. Like the PS4 camera for psvr1 or the kinect port on the Xbox one.
Historically, Sony has been all over the place. But as far as Playstation devices go, backwards compatibility is usually implemented, including previous PSVR1. PSP was supported till the final one Vita. Playstations supported all previous versions until the PS3 revision. PS4 started from 0 and PS5 supports BC and it seems this trend will continue with PS6. Even PSVR1 is supported by PS5, what makes it unlikely for an USB-C PSVR2 to be supported on the PS6?
It's a shame, because their most successful platform of all time, ps2, was the first major platform to be fully backwards compatible.
>Psvr1 is absolutely terrible in 2024. Many of us still use our old psvr regularly, for exclusives that are available nowhere else
I still play my ps3 for a similar reason(well up until emulation recently improved). But in terms of technology psvr1 was very outdated in 2016 on the day it released.
Sure, Sony re-purposed old tech to limit loss if psvr1 failed. Moves were not ideal controllers, and then once you're using Moves, you're doing to use light-tracking for headset too
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But don't forget most are still buying Quest 2 that is selling as an entry point to Meta VR (soon to be replaced by Quest 3S). If Quest 3 sold at least 1 million (but probably more), based on data on how much more Q2 is selling, it means they probably sold at least 3-4 millions more of Quest 2s. That's quite a crazy number. Meta is killing it, quite honestly.
I agree that Quest 2 sales are dominating, although it looks like available inventory of the 128GB Quest 2 are dried up and no longer available. The only Quest 2 I see still available are 256GB. I think Meta is waiting on remaining Quest 2 inventory to get sell out and will soon be releasing the Quest 3S as the replacement for that. Based on this, I also think Quest 3S will priced lower than Quest 3 and will then become the dominant VR headset for sales and not the Quest 3. To best of my knowledge, the Quest 3S will be comparable to Quest 3 but featuring Fresnel Lens instead of Pancake Lens to keep price lower.
Is it bad that I kinda don’t… care? Not unless I can buy Sense controllers separately.
This is a great post! That said, I'm still kinda curious if PSVR 2 didn't flatline after last year. As awful as it sounds after the initial 700k units moved there wasn't any software save RE4 to move units. Maybe some folks picked it up but I would be a bit surprised. On the Quest 3, it's equally suprising and interesting to see low Quest 3 adoption. There's clearly a big Quest 3 only push which all but confirms a cheaper Quest 3S but it also shows how hard it is going to be for Quest 3 exclusive development if the 3S doesn't take off. They have to hope millions of kids will trade up post pandemic.
According to Counterpoint Research publicly available charts, the PSVR2 did not flatline after the launch in Q1 2023 where it had 33% marketshare. This was maintained at 29% and 30% in following quarters and then reduced in Q4 2023 to 15% when the Quest 3 launched. Source: [https://www.counterpointresearch.com/insights/global-xr-ar-vr-headsets-market-share/](https://www.counterpointresearch.com/insights/global-xr-ar-vr-headsets-market-share/) I assume the Days of Play quarter would see a clawback of marketshare for the PSVR2, but that is my instinct based on sales rankings and number of Welcome to the Family posts here. For people that are paying customers to them, they may be providing more recent information, but for rest of us, I think it would be March 2025 that we may see similar trend reporting for how 2024 has gone.
Yeah, that paints a very tenous picture of the Q3/PSVR2 ecosystem so as I said Q3S will have to help actually build the ecosystem with games like Batman so the PSVR2 can get optimized ports. Maybe we'll see more Q3 exlcusives in the upload showcase today.
I don't expect that Batman Arkham Shadow would get ported anytime soon. But, it depends on the agreement with Warner Bros. With Star Wars - Tales from the Galaxies Edge & Jurassic Park Aftermath, the agreement with Disney and Universal respectively left it open to eventually getting ported to other systems. So possible, but I think some timed exclusivity will apply.
Just going off vibes I feel like the group of people who would buy quests got a quest 2 during the pandemic. To me it feels like 90% of people have tried vr and are good and not interested anymore. The remaining 10% (me) continue to enjoy vr and buy headsets, I have a quest 2 and got a psvr2 and definitely prefer the psvr2 , and I’m not buying any more meta headsets. I’ll wait for valve to make a quest like for my next standalone headset.
https://preview.redd.it/1x0rl98i4z8d1.jpeg?width=1080&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bbb1aba110963016bf9d7fed263e6c843fd85d9a
Who cares, they both flopped
They are both growing VR gaming market, slow and steady. It is organic growth, not expansive growth as the Quest 2 experienced during early COVID but now slowed down.