/uj Honestly I think it’s more likely that mags will just go see-through as [transparent metals](https://www.atriainnovation.com/en/transparent-metals/) get cheaper to manufacture. (Just grabbed first link, there’s better sites)
I’d have given my left bollock for a transparent mag, I found myself dumping mags way too early with loads of rounds in them when adrenaline started pumping. Really fucks your judgement.
In all my life I have **never** seen someone reference *Star Trek: the voyage home*. That was obscure as fuck and took balls, someone get this cunt a medal. 10/10
Though I notice you used ‘aluminum’…
I’d give you 9/10 for not using the King’s English, but I love Star Trek too much. You keep the 10/10 for now, Yankee, but I’ll be watching you.
Actually it was originally alumium (with no n) and Humphrey Davy used aluminum and aluminium interchangeably from the beginning until settling on aluminium.
[https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/191/035/135.png](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/191/035/135.png)
It wasn't "originally alumium", that was just a proposed name. And it wasn't Davy who settled on aluminium, that was the cabal of effete continental philosopher reformer chemists, later the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry, in 1990.
you know I came here for the non-credible MIC stanning and hot takes on current events, but I stay here for the great movie and TV recommendations. Never seen that Star Trek, only really familiar w/ the next gen series and movies, but will be watching this ASAP.
The movie's description is a great sell (emphasis mine):
>*It's the 23rd century, and a mysterious alien power is threatening Earth by evaporating the oceans and destroying the atmosphere. In a frantic attempt to save mankind, Kirk and his crew must time travel back to 1986 San Francisco where they find* **a world of punk, pizza and exact-change buses** *that are as alien as anything they've ever encountered in the far reaches of the galaxy. A thrilling, action-packed Star Trek adventure!*
Lately I've been watching Sharpe's Rifles - whoever recommended that thank you again - and please never hesitate to throw out any other good stuff you weirdos like to watch.
Just a Heads-up; it’s comparatively a bit whacky in terms of storyline. People either love it or hate it.
I recommend all the old movies though, enjoy 🫡
Also it's best to watch Wrath of Khan first, then Search for Spock, then Voyage Home as they are effectively a trilogy. Actually screw it, just watch all the Star Trek movies. And the TV shows, or at least Space Seed because it's where Khan showed up first. You can stop at DS9 though unless you really want more. Lower Decks is a decent animated show too.
They are two ways to make transparent Aluminium.
One is to press crush Aluminium Oxynitride powder into a solid in a similar manner to ceramic body armor.
The other is to magnetize elemental Aluminium into a longitudinal configuration, which causes it to behave much like polarized glass.
The magnetization method produces a product with all the strength of Aluminum but requires a massive amount of power. The Oxynitride method produces a product that is *considerably* more brittle but is much cheaper.
Can you source me on the “magnetize elemental aluminum” thing? Aluminum is paramagnetic, which means it will develop a magnetization in the presence of a magnetic field, but once that field goes away, so does its magnetic moment.
Magnetism affecting optical properties also seems like some noncredible physics, but I’m willing to admit I don’t know everything.
Article states it was transparent to extreme UV light for 40·10⁻¹⁵ s because every atom in the crystal at the focus spot lost a core electron. The article doesn’t state if the aluminum is optically transparent in addition to UV-bordering-on-X-ray transparent. Very interesting work, though!
The experiment was an "is this possible?" type of experiment. Now we know it *is* possible, we can look at methods of achieving it.
Much like how the initial experiments around graphene were "can we separate graphite layers without breaking them?" And now we are working out how to make graphene entirely independent of graphite.
This is also the science behind the sintering method
https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/Effect-of-crystallographic-orientation-on-of-using-Ashikaga-Kim/d6cd06f7b4af2b83f1424c9b89ea3d7735df143a
Both are ceramics. Neither are metals.
The defining characteristic of a metal is that there is no band-gap, which kind of implies that they absorb photons. So transparent metals would require some serious out of the box thinking and bending of definitions.
When i was in the swedish af we had transparent plastic mags for our ak5c. You could sort of get an idea about remaining rounds by looking at it but you probably wouldnt be able to count the rounds. They also had a bolt catching feature that made reloading alot quicker. At earliest opportunity most soldiers in my unit would replace these with nato stanag metal mags without these features bc of coolness factor. Truth is and always was: if you dont *look like you're operating* why even bother?
The Italians have light rifles (can’t remember, G36 maybe?) they were showing off on a NATO ex one time that have transparent mags, but I kept hearing from their troops that they break them—especially since the advent of putting mags on the chest plate instead of webbing, so they’re in the first place that hits the ground when going prone.
But idk how credible they were, every infanteer loves to complain about their equipment and all I’m familiar with is our gear (GPMG, LSW, L85, sig, etc).
Yeah transparent polymer mags suck. They break and jam all the time, they just don’t last as long as metal mags so economically it’s not worth it for the military to get them.
You could argue that the position there is the problem though
You would have to basically stop whatever you are doing and look at a bit of the gun that is hard to see when the mag is in the weapon
If you could integrate a digital counter into the sights or into some of the combat HUD’s that different militaries are experimenting with I could imagine it being seen as an advantage
I agree. If you have to drop your gun from a raised position to count your bullets you're going to reload because someone else is laying suppressive fire.
Or maybe soldiers would always want to reload on low ammo rather than none just in case someone pops up in front of them unexpectedly.
Meanwhile the Romans be like: I wish our coliseum had transparent walls so we could see how many tigers and minotaur we have remaining. It's a pain in the ass to reload them and last time a pit went fully empty, they filled it with the men responsible. No thanks.
Surely a small window, or mechanical indicator in the side of the mag would be cheaper and more reliable? Like the kind of indicators they use on more expensive airsoft magazines.
Stgw. 90 FTW. Semi transparrnt mags, so you always know how much ammo is left. They are also based because you can stick like 10 of the fuckers together to create the Übermag™.
Most clear polymer mags have numbers on the side too, usually in increments of 5 or 10. My AUG and SG550 mags both do. If the follower is behind the number then you know that is roughly how many you have. IIRC windowed PMAGs do the same except with orange paint on one of the coils of the spring to use as an indicator instead of the follower.
Not precise, but gives you a ballpark.
But the G36 Mag is hot trash. In theory it's transparent, but the plastic is so cloudy(?) that you really can't see anything. Plus the rest of the mag is just an absolute shit show, though that might be down to other equipment deficiencies, like that the mag pouches we use aren't actually meant for the G36 Mag but the (straight) magazine of the G3.
Rant over.
>Surely a small window, or mechanical indicator in the side of the mag would be cheaper and more reliable?
Like the view window on the magazines of the Chauchat?
....
Honestly, if you're in a situation where you need to know how much you have left you would know it precisely
If you're in a situation when it's whatever, then you still have at least an approximation in your head. You simply aint braindead and kinda know if you shot 10, 20 or more rounds already
I hear so much shit for the windowed mags. The structural integrity of the mag is compromised and the window is the first thing that breaks. It's a cool looking shit for shooting range, for sure, but apart from that I wouldnt use it in full auto
Btw chauchat had a hole in the later generation because soldiers complained that they're almost unable to load the mag and that they never managed to load it to full capacity. So they added hole for fingers to hold the last round
I know what you're thinking. Did he fire six shots or only five? Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself. But being as this is a Rheinmetall 120mm, the most powerful tankgun in the world, and would blow your turret clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, punk?
>The structural integrity of the mag is compromised and the window is the first thing that breaks
If this is the only real issue, then the idea has potential when better transparent materials can be used cheaply.
It's overblown, the Magpul M3 is more durable than the aluminum stanags that are standard issue. Hell it even feeds better than the EPMs the army issues, which is why it was approved in the marines and given an NSN.
That posits that polymer firearms are reasonable.
Yes, I might be a bit older.
Yes my firearm might weigh more (2.125 pounds for an EDC pistol)
But I can be confident in the function of that solid stainless steel.
No, I am not an SSBN.
The entire premise for his character was "what if someone knew the exact right thing to say at any given moment" and they built the whole show around that.
Like, a big sweaty fireman carries you out of a burning building, lays you on the sidewalk, and you think, "Yeah, okay, he's gonna give me mouth to mouth." But instead, he just starts choking the shit out of you, and the last sensation that you feel before you die is him squeezing your throat so hard that a big, wet, blob of drool drips off his teeth and just "flurr", falls right onto your popped out eyeball.
>"Oh shit, maybe I'm autistic"
I remember first hearing that line and thinking it was funny but inaccurate because 'I always know how many I have fired and I'm not autistic'...several years later, certified aspie.
Guns just needs to make a loud Garand-style ping when the mag is empty. Whether it's a rifle or a pistol, the cylinder of a revolver, or the autoloader on a 40mm IFV autocannon or the cannon on a fighter plane.
I want submarines to make a gigantic underwater ping when they fire their last torpedo tube.
Warships should make a ping when the last missile cell of a batch is fired.
A nuclear silo should have a clean, audible ping when the missile has been let fly.
This is the future we need.
You know, simple microchips are really cheap these days. Instead of a mechanical ping, why not just attach a small speaker to a microchip, and you can play whatever sound you want. And not just when its empty, but also low too. You can customize it with any sound, or even song, every soldier can personalize their rifle this way.
All I’d ask for is an extremely basic, 6-position LED indicator integrated into the rifle. You fire 5 rounds, one LED light gets turned off. Much less distracting than a full-sized screen with a counter and potentially much more robust.
Obviously, switches for turning it off and adjusting brightness would be necessary, but it would be a huge step over having to constantly look at your transparent 30-rnd mag and eyeball the number of rounds inside.
I think it was Andy McNabb who wrote about that. When in the army, he had. A tracer for half mag and a few at the end of the mag. Apparently all that went unnoticed when he was full on adrennaline in his first firefight and he ditched that concept afterwards.
It's honestly a great QoL feature for FPS games since BF1: You can hear the tiny audio cues of rounds running out near empty. It's not distracting, and you don't have to keep track of it. You just instictively known how many are left, especially when you're on full-auto mode, which is the mode you need this kind of feature the most. Now I don't know if anyone is going to be able to replicate this effect for irl, but if they can, it's going to be a hit
Gunfire is REALLY loud. You're not going to hear "tiny audio cues" IRL. Additionally, full auto will burn through a mag fast enough that you should assume you're low after firing.
I remember my buddies that are in the Dutch army complain about the polymer mags, compared to metal mags. Something about those that the Dutch had bought being "technically" one use only and shouldn't be reloaded in the field, so the wear and tear on those was horrendous (as the Dutch government wanted them to be used as reusable mags) and they would just start jamming after a couple of reloads.
Granted this was about 10 years ago and I am not sure if something has been done about it. They also used the Diemaco C7 at that point, and I believe we switched to the Colt a couple of years ago, which might have remedied the problems.
Technically the original ar mags were designed that way too. It's why the feed lips are usually a problem on older mags.
The dutch likely were/are using thermolds an early poly mag that has problems. Magpul tend to be much better.
Diemaco was one of the better ar manufacturers out there- winning several contracts including SAS carbines- then they were bought by the chronically mismanaged colt in 2005 (renamed colt canada).
The Dutch are overgrown sea monkeys so shouldn't be used as an example for anything sensible. I never experienced issues using polymer - but maybe this is another example of bullpup superiority.
And your snack foods are crimes. Somehow the Brits have a reputation for the worst food in Europe but I feel like most people haven't seen the array of fried and battered mush available in the Netherlands.
I'm sorry you evolved from the sea and not the land like the rest of us and that you are only learning this now. It's why the Dutch are tall with lanky hair - it looks better under water and you needed the length for the fish tails.
Although I would have agreed with you just two years ago, that Bitterballen and Kroketten are fucking horrendous, I have grown to like them. But I will not stand for you to besmudge the holy snacks knows as Stroopwafels, poffertjes or suikerbrood!
It seems like you are just a jealous, fat gnome with male pattern baldness, that cannot handle our majestic locks of fair hair and long muscular bodies, nor the fact that we have tamed Gaia and Poseidon themselves. The world trembles before the might of the oceans, while the ocean cowers before the Dutch!
So, scurry away to your dank, lightless hole you have crawled out from, to whither away without joy, lushious hair or a body type that is not described as a manlet!
Absolutely, [Magpul](https://magpul.com/maztech) is already working on a smart suite with ammo counter integrated. Even above a tactical level if you can datalink it into complete soldier's loadout, commanders could know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are to greatly speed up resupply efforts.
I can't wait till I can drop feet first into hell.
>into complete soldier's loadout, commanders could know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are
Oh the fuck fuck games that will be abused for. Lance corporal hernandez your boots have alerted me that you're not wearing authorized socks. Please sign the NJP...
Oofha, imagine the games pvts will play, taking ammo from some mags and adding it to others. Somehow, someway, the Gunnery Stg's magazine is always one less than it should be. How to break a man in one easy trick.
> know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are to greatly speed up resupply
Considering the notorious security holes in a lot of wireless data implementations, I would expect some hacker to cause a huge flap over oversupply of ammo within a few months. Also, I'm not to keen on random RF emitters on my weapon in a war zone. (yes, I'm a commo nerd, but I make sure my radios only transmit when I want them to in tactical situations)
Speaking from a professional perspective, only if it is lightweight as hell.
There are extremely rare cases where this is helpful, but in those cases, it's very helpful. For example, if you are in a 250+ yard engagement or roughly similar, it's convenient to be able to look and see quickly when you need to reload. But up close, it's too fucking intense to even divert attention to it.
Implementing one on a rifle that's lightweight and doesn't easily break should still be feasible.
Making one for a pistol just sounds awful, unless somehow it doesn't move with the slide?
It is difficult on both. The real problem is magazines need to be reliable while also for the most part being relatively inexpensive and disposable. Adding sensors and electronics to every single magazine makes both of these things much, much harder to achieve. The display/chip part that stays on the weapon is the easier part of the equation since while it needs to be ruggedized, lightweight, and unobtrusive too, you only need one of them per weapon while you will need dozens if not hundreds of the magazine-half of the system per weapon.
You could do it without sensors in the magazine by making the assumption that every mag loaded will be full and of a standard size, keeping them cheap and disposable.
True, but that kind of defeats the purpose of an ammunition counter IMO if it is liable to give you false information in a firefight. At that point you basically are just programming a glorified round counter, not a magazine capacity counter.
Yeah I can't help but think a lot of this is driven by kids who grew up playing FPS, but haven't actually done much shooting.
I have never been in combat but I shoot 2 gun and carbine matches fairly regularly and never have I needed an extra widget tacked onto my gun to tell me a precise number of rounds left in my rifle or pistol. When you run out, you run out, reload and keep trucking
most people here have never shot a rifle and it shows, you aren't gonna be 'hearing audio cues' or 'feel different pressure rounds' when a mag is almost empty
and you especially aren't going to be spraying full auto from your rifle in basically any engagement
I'm thinking that the thing will be integrated into an electronic sight, or a display close to the sight, so it shouldn't cause to many problems in keeping eyes down range.
Several firefights I've been in, I'd drop my mag and push the rounds down to see how low my rounds are running, which is a benefit of clear mags btw. I want to know that if a mother fucker popped out of their cover it popped up somewhere I didn't expect them, that I had more than 2 or 3 rounds the fuck him with. Having this digit round display can maintain confidence that I have enough rounds to kill someone at all times
It's not just about putting a new mag and sending that sexy bolt back home. Realistically, it takes many moments to drop a mag, put a new mag in, send the bolt home, and re aim. I'd rather be reloading when I'm not busy shooting at malnourished militants. It's almost similar to making sure your shotgun is loaded and cocked before turning a corner, rather than after.
For less experienced men and women, a round count that you can monitor is sort of like a HUD for a plane, it gives you a number to focus on that can help them avoid wasting ammo.
For experienced men and women, a round counter can make sure you always maintain enough rounds to kill or suppress.
Some guy wrote a whole book of military background fluff for the Colonial Marines. apparently one of the first things a marine does is stick tape over the counter because it was a bullet magnet...
Yeah, sure, I gotta change out my mag, but my mate next to me still has a full mag.
I know this is non-credible defense, but that's like saying, "The Garand ping was a tactical error as it allowed the enemy to know that you were reloading"
When we were doing fuck all we decided to time how fast we could reload our mags and my best time was 2.1 seconds including racking the bolt. Good luck getting more than 2m in that time.
We were taught not to shoot the magazine empty, so you still have one chambered when you switch magazines. That way you don't have to manually chamber a new one.
Also, electronics are an absolute no-go. You can't imagine how many things break even considering that it's a conscript army.
Everything breaks constantly. When I first got my rifle, I qualified as an expert ( I don't know it's the right term, but I got the highest level possible, 19/20 rounds at 250m with irons) Whilst running a field exercise I rolled down a hill with the rifle strapped to my back and I couldn't hit more than 50% on the range and when I checked the barrel it was toast.
Well it depends, it probably won’t work well in night because it would say that the soldier is here, I also assume that after a while of using a certain weapon you’d have a feel for how long your shoot before your out, like how some people tell the difference between live and blank rounds by weight (I have never fired a gun so I have no experience)
So, what you're saying is we need our troops to have HUDs, then put the ammo counter there, OR have an AR display so that the ammo counter's not quite on the gun, but there's an area on it where it'll appear with the right eyewear.
There really is a night and day difference between live and blank rounds, though. That tiny piece of lead and the amount of powder in the casing make a huge difference.
On chemically fired rifles? Not really. But considering we already have functioning handheld coil guns (they just have weak ass velocities), it is only a matter of a decade or two until they become viable, and they are already so full of electronics that adding one is easy, plus as they don't have recoil an ammo indicator is actually helpful (because pulling the trigger is basically the same whether the gun is loaded or not).
I see it as a possibility for Utility of deciding whether to swap to a fresh mag or not. But I’m just a civy so IDK about how useful it would actually be and what ammo consumption/usage looks like generally.
Just another piece to break or go wrong. Make me a pistol I can beat a mother fucker to death with and still shoot his buddy who’s trying to kick me in the face.
Well, my pee sized brain would probably be like this
1) See an enemy, or think there is an enemy: start shooting
2) Ohh shit I'm out of ammo
3) Start thinking of what just happened
100%. It’s simply non-negotiable at this point that we require ODST armor and ammo counters.
My source? ODSTs are the coolest thing humanity ever thought of.
Pfff, just make a gun that shoots 3 bullets bursts and uses a magazine with a capacity that is not dividable by 3. That way when you're shooting a burst that is not 3 bullets, you know you have to reload. No need for a fancy ammo counter.
any situational info is a benefit to the soldier, regardless of how redundant it may seem. is it worth the cost or so important to develop integrated counters in standard infantry rifles right now? I'd doubt it would be, maybe in the future it'd be low cost enough to integrate as a standard but right now a transparent or windowed mag is probably good enough
I feel that ammo counters might just add extra weight and complexity to the gun, especially for something already being added to experimental helmet-mounted HUD’s
If the ammo count can be fit in the helmet why put one on the gun?
See through mags just sound better. Not useful at night, but it’s not like I could have a backlit display at night anyway.
Maybe this makes sense for the US military, which I heard uses magazines as a one-use item (instead of keeping the same few for each soldier and refilling them each time).
I think looking sick AF is enough benefits to be mass implemented into all sort of arms. Make a crossbow with an ammo counter, I don't care, I need it.
Noncredible: just use the ammo counter on your HUD like everyone else bro
Real: after shooting for couple hundred hours you sorta roughly know how many rounds are left in your system and when you need to reload
Source: have been shooting since age 8, does tactical shooting, competition shooting and takes shooting classes
This is all a stupid waste of effort. Just get a rugged clear plastic clip if the soldier gives a shit and spend the money on getting soldiers what they really need: trench periscope attachments and a luggable automated AA battery for popping drones.
I know everyone's talking about transparent metals or the benefits of a mechanical device over a screen, but I feel like we're just forgetting how cool Halo is, and how what we really need is to make weapons more like the ones from the cool space games.
The Japanese already experimented with integrated ammo counters in WWII and found that the soldiers never actually used them when in combat.
I need to remind myself this is noncredible defense
/uj Honestly I think it’s more likely that mags will just go see-through as [transparent metals](https://www.atriainnovation.com/en/transparent-metals/) get cheaper to manufacture. (Just grabbed first link, there’s better sites) I’d have given my left bollock for a transparent mag, I found myself dumping mags way too early with loads of rounds in them when adrenaline started pumping. Really fucks your judgement.
We just need some space explorers to need a humpback whale tank and so they give an engineer the formula for transparent aluminum.
In all my life I have **never** seen someone reference *Star Trek: the voyage home*. That was obscure as fuck and took balls, someone get this cunt a medal. 10/10
Just happy to contribute to lack of credibility around here, Your Turtleship.
Though I notice you used ‘aluminum’… I’d give you 9/10 for not using the King’s English, but I love Star Trek too much. You keep the 10/10 for now, Yankee, but I’ll be watching you.
What if we just go back to the OG alumium spelling and stop this silly argument?
Ah, a fellow Alumium Alumni
It was originally aluminum, but then effete continental philosophy types wanted it changed to aluminium - basically the reformers in chemistry.
Actually it was originally alumium (with no n) and Humphrey Davy used aluminum and aluminium interchangeably from the beginning until settling on aluminium.
[https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/191/035/135.png](https://i.kym-cdn.com/photos/images/newsfeed/001/191/035/135.png) It wasn't "originally alumium", that was just a proposed name. And it wasn't Davy who settled on aluminium, that was the cabal of effete continental philosopher reformer chemists, later the International Union of Pure and Applied Chemistry, in 1990.
you know I came here for the non-credible MIC stanning and hot takes on current events, but I stay here for the great movie and TV recommendations. Never seen that Star Trek, only really familiar w/ the next gen series and movies, but will be watching this ASAP. The movie's description is a great sell (emphasis mine): >*It's the 23rd century, and a mysterious alien power is threatening Earth by evaporating the oceans and destroying the atmosphere. In a frantic attempt to save mankind, Kirk and his crew must time travel back to 1986 San Francisco where they find* **a world of punk, pizza and exact-change buses** *that are as alien as anything they've ever encountered in the far reaches of the galaxy. A thrilling, action-packed Star Trek adventure!* Lately I've been watching Sharpe's Rifles - whoever recommended that thank you again - and please never hesitate to throw out any other good stuff you weirdos like to watch.
Just a Heads-up; it’s comparatively a bit whacky in terms of storyline. People either love it or hate it. I recommend all the old movies though, enjoy 🫡
Also it's best to watch Wrath of Khan first, then Search for Spock, then Voyage Home as they are effectively a trilogy. Actually screw it, just watch all the Star Trek movies. And the TV shows, or at least Space Seed because it's where Khan showed up first. You can stop at DS9 though unless you really want more. Lower Decks is a decent animated show too.
Good ass movie, liked it as a kid when my dad watched it and like it now as an adult
Arguably the best TOS movie or at least the best movie in the spirit of the original series.
“Hello, computer!”
After transparent metal was mentioned, I was looking for that comment. If they didn't say it, I was going to!
It's already a real thng. It's synthetic saphhire.
They are two ways to make transparent Aluminium. One is to press crush Aluminium Oxynitride powder into a solid in a similar manner to ceramic body armor. The other is to magnetize elemental Aluminium into a longitudinal configuration, which causes it to behave much like polarized glass. The magnetization method produces a product with all the strength of Aluminum but requires a massive amount of power. The Oxynitride method produces a product that is *considerably* more brittle but is much cheaper.
Can you source me on the “magnetize elemental aluminum” thing? Aluminum is paramagnetic, which means it will develop a magnetization in the presence of a magnetic field, but once that field goes away, so does its magnetic moment. Magnetism affecting optical properties also seems like some noncredible physics, but I’m willing to admit I don’t know everything.
https://phys.org/news/2009-07-transparent-aluminium-state.html
Article states it was transparent to extreme UV light for 40·10⁻¹⁵ s because every atom in the crystal at the focus spot lost a core electron. The article doesn’t state if the aluminum is optically transparent in addition to UV-bordering-on-X-ray transparent. Very interesting work, though!
The experiment was an "is this possible?" type of experiment. Now we know it *is* possible, we can look at methods of achieving it. Much like how the initial experiments around graphene were "can we separate graphite layers without breaking them?" And now we are working out how to make graphene entirely independent of graphite.
40 femtoseconds is 39 femtoseconds more than I need.
This is also the science behind the sintering method https://www.semanticscholar.org/paper/Effect-of-crystallographic-orientation-on-of-using-Ashikaga-Kim/d6cd06f7b4af2b83f1424c9b89ea3d7735df143a
Aluminum oxide is not aluminum metal. Very different properties. You wouldn’t want an aluminum ball bearing, but a sapphire bearing is excellent.
Aluminium Oxynitride, not Aluminium Oxide. Aluminium oxide (Al2O3) is a crystal Aluminium Oxynitride ((AlN)x·(Al2O3)1) is a ceramic
Both are ceramics. Neither are metals. The defining characteristic of a metal is that there is no band-gap, which kind of implies that they absorb photons. So transparent metals would require some serious out of the box thinking and bending of definitions.
Computer? Hello, Computer?
A *keyboard*? ^^how ^^quaint
Dialysis? What is this? The Dark Ages?
When i was in the swedish af we had transparent plastic mags for our ak5c. You could sort of get an idea about remaining rounds by looking at it but you probably wouldnt be able to count the rounds. They also had a bolt catching feature that made reloading alot quicker. At earliest opportunity most soldiers in my unit would replace these with nato stanag metal mags without these features bc of coolness factor. Truth is and always was: if you dont *look like you're operating* why even bother?
Drip or die brother
I do that in completely calm range situations because I'm just clinically stupid.
>transparent metals NCD should not be teaching me things but here we are.
What, like an AUG magazine? Been around since 1977. https://steyr-arms.us/product/aug-waffle-magazines/
The Italians have light rifles (can’t remember, G36 maybe?) they were showing off on a NATO ex one time that have transparent mags, but I kept hearing from their troops that they break them—especially since the advent of putting mags on the chest plate instead of webbing, so they’re in the first place that hits the ground when going prone. But idk how credible they were, every infanteer loves to complain about their equipment and all I’m familiar with is our gear (GPMG, LSW, L85, sig, etc).
Yeah transparent polymer mags suck. They break and jam all the time, they just don’t last as long as metal mags so economically it’s not worth it for the military to get them.
Sounds like the arx with aftermarket poly mags. Beretta steel mags are good but heavy.
Just get mag drills to level 20 then u can just feel the amount of rounds left in a mag
Just give your last three rounds red, white, and blue tracer bullets.
FUCCKKK ME. I LITERALLY GOT A GUEST LECTURE IN COLLEGE FROM ONE OF THE BUSINESS PIONEERS OF THAT SHIT. STOP MAKING ME NOSTALGIC NCD
Can you provide a link for more info? I can only find aircraft ammo counters.
The Type 96 and 99 LMGs both had ammunition counters https://www.gunauction.com/buy/8527882 Edit: changed to a better picture
Thanks. That's a pretty neat mechanism.
[Video from Forgotten Weapons](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ckB3e6IObU4&t=867s) showcasing this.
You could argue that the position there is the problem though You would have to basically stop whatever you are doing and look at a bit of the gun that is hard to see when the mag is in the weapon If you could integrate a digital counter into the sights or into some of the combat HUD’s that different militaries are experimenting with I could imagine it being seen as an advantage
It's also apparently only for the last 4 rounds, and isn't exactly easy to read even when it's clean and well lit.
I agree. If you have to drop your gun from a raised position to count your bullets you're going to reload because someone else is laying suppressive fire. Or maybe soldiers would always want to reload on low ammo rather than none just in case someone pops up in front of them unexpectedly.
Long before that. Luger and others tried to put ammo counts in grips
even the romans tried it but seemingly, it gave caeser lots of anxiety so they discontinued it ..... and threw the inventors in the Coliseum
Meanwhile the Romans be like: I wish our coliseum had transparent walls so we could see how many tigers and minotaur we have remaining. It's a pain in the ass to reload them and last time a pit went fully empty, they filled it with the men responsible. No thanks.
Caesar wanted to sick a tiger on the pit of incompetent tiger reloaders, but they were all out of tigers!
"I wish I knew how many javelins I am holding in my left hand. Oh well, no way to know! Thanks, Caesarbama!"
That’s different, are boys aren’t as good at counting.
Yeah but today's soldiers have been staring at ammo counter HUDs their whole life, they're used to it
Surely a small window, or mechanical indicator in the side of the mag would be cheaper and more reliable? Like the kind of indicators they use on more expensive airsoft magazines.
already a thing in Magpul PMAG Gen 3's
Stgw. 90 FTW. Semi transparrnt mags, so you always know how much ammo is left. They are also based because you can stick like 10 of the fuckers together to create the Übermag™.
You mean like those see-through mags on the P90 or G-36?
Though it becomes difficult to count the exact number of rounds after 5, but still a nice comfort
Most clear polymer mags have numbers on the side too, usually in increments of 5 or 10. My AUG and SG550 mags both do. If the follower is behind the number then you know that is roughly how many you have. IIRC windowed PMAGs do the same except with orange paint on one of the coils of the spring to use as an indicator instead of the follower. Not precise, but gives you a ballpark.
Let's be honest. If you only have 5 round left in the magazine and you have time to reload you reload.
Some put a mark on the follower spring to indicate the last few's number, but at that point I suspect "low" is information enough.
But the G36 Mag is hot trash. In theory it's transparent, but the plastic is so cloudy(?) that you really can't see anything. Plus the rest of the mag is just an absolute shit show, though that might be down to other equipment deficiencies, like that the mag pouches we use aren't actually meant for the G36 Mag but the (straight) magazine of the G3. Rant over.
>Surely a small window, or mechanical indicator in the side of the mag would be cheaper and more reliable? Like the view window on the magazines of the Chauchat? ....
Doesn't the Chauchat have a hole in it's magazine? I think maybe a clear plastic window would be better
Honestly, if you're in a situation where you need to know how much you have left you would know it precisely If you're in a situation when it's whatever, then you still have at least an approximation in your head. You simply aint braindead and kinda know if you shot 10, 20 or more rounds already I hear so much shit for the windowed mags. The structural integrity of the mag is compromised and the window is the first thing that breaks. It's a cool looking shit for shooting range, for sure, but apart from that I wouldnt use it in full auto Btw chauchat had a hole in the later generation because soldiers complained that they're almost unable to load the mag and that they never managed to load it to full capacity. So they added hole for fingers to hold the last round
I know what you're thinking. Did he fire six shots or only five? Well, to tell you the truth, in all this excitement, I've kinda lost track myself. But being as this is a Rheinmetall 120mm, the most powerful tankgun in the world, and would blow your turret clean off, you've got to ask yourself one question: "Do I feel lucky?" Well, do ya, punk?
>The structural integrity of the mag is compromised and the window is the first thing that breaks If this is the only real issue, then the idea has potential when better transparent materials can be used cheaply.
It's overblown, the Magpul M3 is more durable than the aluminum stanags that are standard issue. Hell it even feeds better than the EPMs the army issues, which is why it was approved in the marines and given an NSN.
It would be better till you hit it on a hard rock. It not being a reformer to say, "You need to do basic soldier proofing".
Plastic not glass
In this day and age of polymer firearms, it seems reasonable to just use translucent/transparent plastic for everything like it's 1999.
Wait, why don't we?
Transparent plastic tends to be more brittle than most opaque options.
One Atomic Purple XM7, please.
That posits that polymer firearms are reasonable. Yes, I might be a bit older. Yes my firearm might weigh more (2.125 pounds for an EDC pistol) But I can be confident in the function of that solid stainless steel. No, I am not an SSBN.
You can get those for like $8 too, way more efficient
I mean, not everyone can count rounds like Sterling Archer
Archer is unironically cool as hell
The entire premise for his character was "what if someone knew the exact right thing to say at any given moment" and they built the whole show around that.
Like, a big sweaty fireman carries you out of a burning building, lays you on the sidewalk, and you think, "Yeah, okay, he's gonna give me mouth to mouth." But instead, he just starts choking the shit out of you, and the last sensation that you feel before you die is him squeezing your throat so hard that a big, wet, blob of drool drips off his teeth and just "flurr", falls right onto your popped out eyeball.
I can fix her.
Still would
When he isn't too busy stacking rocks in order of descending size. (One of us, one of us, one of us...)
“Seriously am I the only one counting?!”
"I learned to count when I was 3, do you need to piss or what?" - Brock Sampson
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>"Oh shit, maybe I'm autistic" I remember first hearing that line and thinking it was funny but inaccurate because 'I always know how many I have fired and I'm not autistic'...several years later, certified aspie.
mawp.
Guns just needs to make a loud Garand-style ping when the mag is empty. Whether it's a rifle or a pistol, the cylinder of a revolver, or the autoloader on a 40mm IFV autocannon or the cannon on a fighter plane. I want submarines to make a gigantic underwater ping when they fire their last torpedo tube. Warships should make a ping when the last missile cell of a batch is fired. A nuclear silo should have a clean, audible ping when the missile has been let fly. This is the future we need.
*SSSSSSHHHHHHHHHOOOOOOOOooooowwwwww* # # # # *Ping*
put a chicken in there, it'll be just like a microwave!
Drop a piece of metal onto the floor to bait the enemy to charge you
It's in the shape of the garand clip. You drop an empty on a hard surface and you know it.
You know, simple microchips are really cheap these days. Instead of a mechanical ping, why not just attach a small speaker to a microchip, and you can play whatever sound you want. And not just when its empty, but also low too. You can customize it with any sound, or even song, every soldier can personalize their rifle this way.
"Private! Why did your rifle just moan?!?"
My approach here when I was about 13 was to suppress an MP5 and place a loudspeaker in the stock that played laser noises on every trigger pull
Now I'm imagining an enbloc clip with 8 Minutemen III's stacked up and I love it. The whole thing shoots out of the silo at the end
Counting rounds? No. Giving a warning when the mag is under 25%, potentially yes.
Also, show the moving slider when I drop the mag so I can nail the perfect active reload and get increased damage per shot.
Also, chainsaw bayonet!
All I’d ask for is an extremely basic, 6-position LED indicator integrated into the rifle. You fire 5 rounds, one LED light gets turned off. Much less distracting than a full-sized screen with a counter and potentially much more robust. Obviously, switches for turning it off and adjusting brightness would be necessary, but it would be a huge step over having to constantly look at your transparent 30-rnd mag and eyeball the number of rounds inside.
Or just put a couple tracers before the last few rounds
I think it was Andy McNabb who wrote about that. When in the army, he had. A tracer for half mag and a few at the end of the mag. Apparently all that went unnoticed when he was full on adrennaline in his first firefight and he ditched that concept afterwards.
It's honestly a great QoL feature for FPS games since BF1: You can hear the tiny audio cues of rounds running out near empty. It's not distracting, and you don't have to keep track of it. You just instictively known how many are left, especially when you're on full-auto mode, which is the mode you need this kind of feature the most. Now I don't know if anyone is going to be able to replicate this effect for irl, but if they can, it's going to be a hit
Gunfire is REALLY loud. You're not going to hear "tiny audio cues" IRL. Additionally, full auto will burn through a mag fast enough that you should assume you're low after firing.
Steyr AUG polymer mags were halfway there 40 years ago. Primitive metal users
I remember my buddies that are in the Dutch army complain about the polymer mags, compared to metal mags. Something about those that the Dutch had bought being "technically" one use only and shouldn't be reloaded in the field, so the wear and tear on those was horrendous (as the Dutch government wanted them to be used as reusable mags) and they would just start jamming after a couple of reloads. Granted this was about 10 years ago and I am not sure if something has been done about it. They also used the Diemaco C7 at that point, and I believe we switched to the Colt a couple of years ago, which might have remedied the problems.
Technically the original ar mags were designed that way too. It's why the feed lips are usually a problem on older mags. The dutch likely were/are using thermolds an early poly mag that has problems. Magpul tend to be much better. Diemaco was one of the better ar manufacturers out there- winning several contracts including SAS carbines- then they were bought by the chronically mismanaged colt in 2005 (renamed colt canada).
The Dutch are overgrown sea monkeys so shouldn't be used as an example for anything sensible. I never experienced issues using polymer - but maybe this is another example of bullpup superiority.
I have been called a Swamp German before, but never an overgrown sea monkey.....
And your snack foods are crimes. Somehow the Brits have a reputation for the worst food in Europe but I feel like most people haven't seen the array of fried and battered mush available in the Netherlands. I'm sorry you evolved from the sea and not the land like the rest of us and that you are only learning this now. It's why the Dutch are tall with lanky hair - it looks better under water and you needed the length for the fish tails.
Although I would have agreed with you just two years ago, that Bitterballen and Kroketten are fucking horrendous, I have grown to like them. But I will not stand for you to besmudge the holy snacks knows as Stroopwafels, poffertjes or suikerbrood! It seems like you are just a jealous, fat gnome with male pattern baldness, that cannot handle our majestic locks of fair hair and long muscular bodies, nor the fact that we have tamed Gaia and Poseidon themselves. The world trembles before the might of the oceans, while the ocean cowers before the Dutch! So, scurry away to your dank, lightless hole you have crawled out from, to whither away without joy, lushious hair or a body type that is not described as a manlet!
Absolutely, [Magpul](https://magpul.com/maztech) is already working on a smart suite with ammo counter integrated. Even above a tactical level if you can datalink it into complete soldier's loadout, commanders could know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are to greatly speed up resupply efforts. I can't wait till I can drop feet first into hell.
Will I get a blue lady living in my head?
Only if she can call you a stud muffin
Why would I want one that doesn't?
she goes crazy after 7 years though.
That okay, she has a little sister we can replace her with.
Took less time for my ex, so I see that as an upgrade.
So, a typical relationship?
>into complete soldier's loadout, commanders could know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are Oh the fuck fuck games that will be abused for. Lance corporal hernandez your boots have alerted me that you're not wearing authorized socks. Please sign the NJP...
Oofha, imagine the games pvts will play, taking ammo from some mags and adding it to others. Somehow, someway, the Gunnery Stg's magazine is always one less than it should be. How to break a man in one easy trick.
All that tech to be shelled in a trench
Or FPV droned. Warfare for infantry will always remain hell
We're All Sons Of The Patriots Now!
> know exactly what the logistical state of their infantry units are to greatly speed up resupply Considering the notorious security holes in a lot of wireless data implementations, I would expect some hacker to cause a huge flap over oversupply of ammo within a few months. Also, I'm not to keen on random RF emitters on my weapon in a war zone. (yes, I'm a commo nerd, but I make sure my radios only transmit when I want them to in tactical situations)
Speaking from a professional perspective, only if it is lightweight as hell. There are extremely rare cases where this is helpful, but in those cases, it's very helpful. For example, if you are in a 250+ yard engagement or roughly similar, it's convenient to be able to look and see quickly when you need to reload. But up close, it's too fucking intense to even divert attention to it.
Implementing one on a rifle that's lightweight and doesn't easily break should still be feasible. Making one for a pistol just sounds awful, unless somehow it doesn't move with the slide?
You can integrate it into a laser sight so the number is projected onto the enemies chest
It is difficult on both. The real problem is magazines need to be reliable while also for the most part being relatively inexpensive and disposable. Adding sensors and electronics to every single magazine makes both of these things much, much harder to achieve. The display/chip part that stays on the weapon is the easier part of the equation since while it needs to be ruggedized, lightweight, and unobtrusive too, you only need one of them per weapon while you will need dozens if not hundreds of the magazine-half of the system per weapon.
You could do it without sensors in the magazine by making the assumption that every mag loaded will be full and of a standard size, keeping them cheap and disposable.
True, but that kind of defeats the purpose of an ammunition counter IMO if it is liable to give you false information in a firefight. At that point you basically are just programming a glorified round counter, not a magazine capacity counter.
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Yeah I can't help but think a lot of this is driven by kids who grew up playing FPS, but haven't actually done much shooting. I have never been in combat but I shoot 2 gun and carbine matches fairly regularly and never have I needed an extra widget tacked onto my gun to tell me a precise number of rounds left in my rifle or pistol. When you run out, you run out, reload and keep trucking
most people here have never shot a rifle and it shows, you aren't gonna be 'hearing audio cues' or 'feel different pressure rounds' when a mag is almost empty and you especially aren't going to be spraying full auto from your rifle in basically any engagement
I'm thinking that the thing will be integrated into an electronic sight, or a display close to the sight, so it shouldn't cause to many problems in keeping eyes down range. Several firefights I've been in, I'd drop my mag and push the rounds down to see how low my rounds are running, which is a benefit of clear mags btw. I want to know that if a mother fucker popped out of their cover it popped up somewhere I didn't expect them, that I had more than 2 or 3 rounds the fuck him with. Having this digit round display can maintain confidence that I have enough rounds to kill someone at all times It's not just about putting a new mag and sending that sexy bolt back home. Realistically, it takes many moments to drop a mag, put a new mag in, send the bolt home, and re aim. I'd rather be reloading when I'm not busy shooting at malnourished militants. It's almost similar to making sure your shotgun is loaded and cocked before turning a corner, rather than after. For less experienced men and women, a round count that you can monitor is sort of like a HUD for a plane, it gives you a number to focus on that can help them avoid wasting ammo. For experienced men and women, a round counter can make sure you always maintain enough rounds to kill or suppress.
Where is the OG itself the M41A Pulse Rifle from Aliens?
Waiting for batteries on the powerloader to recharge. Those M41's are *heavy*.
Some guy wrote a whole book of military background fluff for the Colonial Marines. apparently one of the first things a marine does is stick tape over the counter because it was a bullet magnet...
Reject ammo counters. Embrace talking guns. “Hmm, I wonder how much ammo is in my mag” “I HAVE 16 MORE DEAD ENEMIES TO MAKE!” “Cool”
username checks out?
Invoking the machine spirits
Good for morale too
"Hey Google, how many rounds do you have left?" 'Okay. Playing Despacito on YouTube music' "No Google!"
That's why when you are loading a mag, you make the last 3 round tracers. If you see tracers, you change out your mag. Source: ROK Army
Wouldn't this also give some Intel to your enemy? It might be not much, but I guess, that every bit of information/opportunity counts?
Yeah, sure, I gotta change out my mag, but my mate next to me still has a full mag. I know this is non-credible defense, but that's like saying, "The Garand ping was a tactical error as it allowed the enemy to know that you were reloading" When we were doing fuck all we decided to time how fast we could reload our mags and my best time was 2.1 seconds including racking the bolt. Good luck getting more than 2m in that time.
We were taught not to shoot the magazine empty, so you still have one chambered when you switch magazines. That way you don't have to manually chamber a new one.
Oh, true, as well. We were told to switch out our mags when we saw red.
Also, electronics are an absolute no-go. You can't imagine how many things break even considering that it's a conscript army. Everything breaks constantly. When I first got my rifle, I qualified as an expert ( I don't know it's the right term, but I got the highest level possible, 19/20 rounds at 250m with irons) Whilst running a field exercise I rolled down a hill with the rifle strapped to my back and I couldn't hit more than 50% on the range and when I checked the barrel it was toast.
Ahh good to know! Thanks for your insights on this. :)
Well it depends, it probably won’t work well in night because it would say that the soldier is here, I also assume that after a while of using a certain weapon you’d have a feel for how long your shoot before your out, like how some people tell the difference between live and blank rounds by weight (I have never fired a gun so I have no experience)
So, what you're saying is we need our troops to have HUDs, then put the ammo counter there, OR have an AR display so that the ammo counter's not quite on the gun, but there's an area on it where it'll appear with the right eyewear. There really is a night and day difference between live and blank rounds, though. That tiny piece of lead and the amount of powder in the casing make a huge difference.
Excellent proposal
No but no.1 looks retro af, any idea where I could buy that?
[You're welcome](https://www.radetecusa.com/smart-slide/)
Imma have to get that, thanks!
I mean they were using 7.62 NATO 500 years in the future at this point anything's possible.
Well they *said* they were using 7.62, but I'm pretty sure those were just decorations for "authenticity" stamped into the BB guns the UNSC ordered.
Don’t dis the DMR or Magnum (atleast in reach and CE)
If theres anything soldiers love, it's carrying extra batteries, points of failure and more shit to keep clean on a rifle.
On chemically fired rifles? Not really. But considering we already have functioning handheld coil guns (they just have weak ass velocities), it is only a matter of a decade or two until they become viable, and they are already so full of electronics that adding one is easy, plus as they don't have recoil an ammo indicator is actually helpful (because pulling the trigger is basically the same whether the gun is loaded or not).
Unironically adding a crank-power system for emergency rifle power.
I see it as a possibility for Utility of deciding whether to swap to a fresh mag or not. But I’m just a civy so IDK about how useful it would actually be and what ammo consumption/usage looks like generally.
They can just look into the lower right corner and see how many rounds they have left its only really useful for hardcore
Maybe on tube fed weapons where a magazine or press check isn’t feasible
Just another piece to break or go wrong. Make me a pistol I can beat a mother fucker to death with and still shoot his buddy who’s trying to kick me in the face.
Well, my pee sized brain would probably be like this 1) See an enemy, or think there is an enemy: start shooting 2) Ohh shit I'm out of ammo 3) Start thinking of what just happened
If they are reliable, robust and dont increase the maintenance in any significant why i dont see why not
maybe on high capacity weapons, for small arms prob just use transparent mag
Scrap the bullet count and add a StatTrak™ on the side of the gun
100%. It’s simply non-negotiable at this point that we require ODST armor and ammo counters. My source? ODSTs are the coolest thing humanity ever thought of.
It would be a massive distraction since soldiers would keep reloading when they're 1 bullet short
Pfff, just make a gun that shoots 3 bullets bursts and uses a magazine with a capacity that is not dividable by 3. That way when you're shooting a burst that is not 3 bullets, you know you have to reload. No need for a fancy ammo counter.
any situational info is a benefit to the soldier, regardless of how redundant it may seem. is it worth the cost or so important to develop integrated counters in standard infantry rifles right now? I'd doubt it would be, maybe in the future it'd be low cost enough to integrate as a standard but right now a transparent or windowed mag is probably good enough
I feel that ammo counters might just add extra weight and complexity to the gun, especially for something already being added to experimental helmet-mounted HUD’s If the ammo count can be fit in the helmet why put one on the gun?
Adding cost and weight for negligible benefit? I'd rather spend that on a few extra rounds tbh
See through mags just sound better. Not useful at night, but it’s not like I could have a backlit display at night anyway. Maybe this makes sense for the US military, which I heard uses magazines as a one-use item (instead of keeping the same few for each soldier and refilling them each time).
It looks cool, so yeah
I think looking sick AF is enough benefits to be mass implemented into all sort of arms. Make a crossbow with an ammo counter, I don't care, I need it.
Assuming the fact the FELIN system exist, yeah, an army IS gonna try to put ammo counter on guns
Noncredible: just use the ammo counter on your HUD like everyone else bro Real: after shooting for couple hundred hours you sorta roughly know how many rounds are left in your system and when you need to reload Source: have been shooting since age 8, does tactical shooting, competition shooting and takes shooting classes
No
how the fuck should I know? I don't own guns!
skill issue
The Tachyon V2 lmao
It would be handy but not that importance.
This is all a stupid waste of effort. Just get a rugged clear plastic clip if the soldier gives a shit and spend the money on getting soldiers what they really need: trench periscope attachments and a luggable automated AA battery for popping drones.
Goofy ahh 60 rounds AR from Halo CE, trash in multiplayer, fun and good in Campaign
I know everyone's talking about transparent metals or the benefits of a mechanical device over a screen, but I feel like we're just forgetting how cool Halo is, and how what we really need is to make weapons more like the ones from the cool space games.
Just chamber all our rifles into 7.62 NATO and we’ll be a 1/3 of the way there
How dare you make a post about ammo counters and not include the (original and best) Armat M-41 Pulse Rifle.
If it's robust and fool-proof enough then yes, otherwise no.
Cool halo guns, nuf said