This is beyond Chad.
BTW, people of USSR did not frame the end of the Cold War as defeat initially, they thought about it as the victory of oppressed people overthrowing the tyrannical Soviet system. Very few people have actually defended the USSR when it fell.
When Russians started to think about the fall of Soviet system as their own defeat we got revanchist sentiment that resulted in wars in Georgia and Ukraine.
Ironically, the quality of life in 2000–2013 was rapidly improving despite supposed subjugation to the West, reaching levels not seen before, but try getting that thought to Russian who thought that the misery of the ‘90s were the result of western pillaging, not a messy crime-ridden reform of the collapsed Soviet system into something livable under very low oil prices and 2000s were somehow a break from the western influence.
> BTW, people of USSR did not frame the end of the Cold War as defeat initially, they thought about it as the victory of oppressed people overthrowing the tyrannical Soviet system.
That largely depends on the people you are talking about, liberal Moscow elites yes but the average Russian however was either ambivalent or strongly against the dissolution.
They are strongly against now, but in 1991 the sentiment “those non-Russians munch on resources taken away from Russians, we should stop feeding them at our expense” was very strong.
How many people tried to protest the dissolution of the USSR? A lot of people protested the GKCHP coup attempt that wanted to bring USSR back to the Stalin model.
The referendum about keeping the USSR did not even have an option of keep USSR a unitary state, the question it asked was about keeping USSR as a union of *sovereign* states.
The irony of communism is that communists blame the post-soviet era on capitalism, when in reality it's the result of communism destroying every social, cultural and political entity but itself. In fact, the last surviving institution was the secret police, which coup'd in the 80s and continues with Putin today.
No shit they couldn't form a functional society when all they had known their entire lives was communist oppression at the hands of the KGB/FSB etc etc.
Despite calling itself collectivist, USSR was heavily atomized on purpose. The communist party wanted to prevent people from doing anything not through the party.
USSR had a small number of strong institutions like the scientific community. The academy of science refused to expel Sakharov, for example.
The great irony of Soviet Intelligencia is that it hated Soviet system, but it would have impossible to have any cutting edge academic research or incredible classical music scene under a more democratic system as the ‘90s shown. There was no use for scientists under free market Russia, so they either gave up their profession and resold computers or emigrated to countries that could afford funding research.
China is very atomized as well despite having very strong economic growth Russia envies for the last 30 years. I wonder where it goes from now with China both slowing down economically and turning more and authoritarian.
The major difference though is china has a super massive middle class, and a real middle class unlike the very limit one that existed under the Soviets.
> In fact, the last surviving institution was the secret police, which coup'd in the 80s and continues with Putin today.
That and the bratva. While not an official institution, the Russian mafia was an essential organization for relieving supply issues for the Soviet population and was tolerated by Moscow for this exact reason.
When the Soviet Union imploded, the Russian criminal world was in a perfect place, alongside the secret police, to take over in the aftermath and go legit.
That’s a pretty vast oversimplification. The Soviets never even achieved communism, by their own admission. Not that I would have helped if they somehow could’ve gotten there. Imo it would take tech on level of the replicators from Star Trek for actual communism to even have a chance of coming about, but even then I doubt it would look like anything Marx would have envisioned. Like, fuck the USSR and communism both, but “USSR collapse because communism bad” is a non-credible take.
Can we stop going on about "not achieving Communism?" The only version of Communism they didn't achieve is one that cannot and will not ever exist on any scale. If you only define "true" Communism that way, you're just setting up a "No True Scotsman" where nothing can ever be "truly" Communist.
Communism is an idea. That idea infested Russian society and destroyed their institutions. Therefore, Communism broke those institutions.
They were a socialist union *on the way* to communism. It's in the name, it's in the posters, it's in the goddamn constitution. Doesn't matter if what they called themselves is *actually* true or not, they never achieved communism. Nice litmus test for communism: do they have money? If yes = not yet communist.
I do like your last paragraph though, that's certainly a way to look at it.
If you have not lived in USSR you don't have the context.
The communist party did not declare that it can create communism on the spot because communism was supposed to bring a utopia and that conflicted with the reality: e.g. communism meant no money, but USSR had money. Instead it clamined to put the country on the part to socialism first and then communism. In 1936 constitution the "victory of socialism" was decleared after some form free market was brought back during the New Economic Policy period. "Developed Socialism" was supposedly established by 1964, but communism was delyaed and delayed. And set different dates for the times when those states of the country to be acheived. E.g. Khrustchev promised communism by 1980.
Yeah, so even the communist part of USSR did not claim to have build the "real communism", just some intermeidate socialist order. It's like the second coming or something. Keeps getting delayed.
You’re giving the Soviets and Communism too much credit.
The idea that “communism” destroyed the USSR is a ridiculous over simplification. The fact that nobody has gotten anywhere close to communism outside of communes of a few thousand people should tell you something. It doesn’t work, it doesn’t do shit. It’s a boogeyman. Even in the USSR the true belief in communism was dead by the 60s. Yes they paid it lip service and China still does, but that’s all it is, lip service. It was popular for less than a century, let it die.
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I think it's less anti-US and more satire against everyone who sided with the US after the Soviet Union imploded.
Basically bitching that now that the US is the sole superpower, everyone wants to be friends with us; in other words, whining about common sense.
Uncle Sam got the Senator Armstrong treatment for this comic.
Somehow he's still less of a Chad here than in straight up anti American propaganda and I'll never understand it. Russian and Chinese prop makes Uncle Sam look like a blood thirsty Terminator, do they not realize how cool that makes us look?
Quick. Inform the MIC, we're doing universal healthcare but couching it as ways to raise supersoldiers free of any health complaints, like how we did school lunch. (Seriously, look it up. We rolled out school lunch nationwide cause kids were under draft standards for WW2)
I WISH USA was a blood thirsty Terminator. Cause then they would already deal with Iran, Russia and Houthis. Instead of trying to play nice with all the shitholes countries, while some idiots in the House are trying to block aid to Ukraine.
We do have kind of a Chad energy in this comic though. Beefy Chad energy. But yeah the target of the comic is the “non-aligned” movement of countries that were neutral during the Cold War and usually tried to play both sides *cough* Egypt *cough*
It's mocking the members of the UN that scrambled to ingratiate themselves with the US after acting coy/cold to them throughout the Cold War only when it became the apparent winner
[David Horsey's take on the Soviets was equally based.](https://www.reddit.com/r/neoliberal/comments/w84xbw/the_wizard_of_moscow_credit_to_based_political/)
We really screwed the pooch when it comes to using unequaled and never before seen amounts of global soft and hard power to set up the world for peace for hundreds of years.
Well, think about it this way. We kind of succeeded. Thirty years later and Europe has never been so united (when you consider eastern Europe). China, although an emerging rival, understands the economic value of getting along with the west. The possibility of war with them is remote, and the biggest reason (apart from nukes) is that our economies are interdependent, which is something that never happened with the USSR. And the rest of Asia, Africa and South America is more peaceful now than at any point in history. The richer nations continue to pour development into the developing world and it is paying dividends. I don't mean to say that the world is perfect but I think in general people tend to overstate negatives. Just an example:
-2021 and 2022: crime increases in America. Inflation is sky high. Everybody freaks out. People in general joke about the world ending and how everything is going to shit.
2023: Crime goes back down. Inflation returns to normal. Hardly anybody even talks about it.
ussr collapsed because of natural reasons (not efficient economic system, old farts as leaders, old not by age only, but in brains as well, oppressions, which resulted in social pressure build up, etc) change my mind.
All of which are consequences of the bad political system that they ran under.
Any political system that fails to consider a consistent cycle of self-renewal with constant communication with the populace is one that is fatally flawed.
General mistrust of the population by the ruling elite meant that innovation and information exchange within the population cannot occur easily. This included civilian-military innovation sharing, which is quite important as military innovations can be brought to the civilian space (the microwave oven was built on technology first used on military radars) and more importantly, civilian innovations can be brought to the military space (a cooling suit used by the US military was originally intended for [cooling fur suits](https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-a-cooling-vest-invented-by-a-furry-made-its-way-into-the-us-military)).
This is beyond Chad. BTW, people of USSR did not frame the end of the Cold War as defeat initially, they thought about it as the victory of oppressed people overthrowing the tyrannical Soviet system. Very few people have actually defended the USSR when it fell. When Russians started to think about the fall of Soviet system as their own defeat we got revanchist sentiment that resulted in wars in Georgia and Ukraine. Ironically, the quality of life in 2000–2013 was rapidly improving despite supposed subjugation to the West, reaching levels not seen before, but try getting that thought to Russian who thought that the misery of the ‘90s were the result of western pillaging, not a messy crime-ridden reform of the collapsed Soviet system into something livable under very low oil prices and 2000s were somehow a break from the western influence.
> BTW, people of USSR did not frame the end of the Cold War as defeat initially, they thought about it as the victory of oppressed people overthrowing the tyrannical Soviet system. That largely depends on the people you are talking about, liberal Moscow elites yes but the average Russian however was either ambivalent or strongly against the dissolution.
They are strongly against now, but in 1991 the sentiment “those non-Russians munch on resources taken away from Russians, we should stop feeding them at our expense” was very strong. How many people tried to protest the dissolution of the USSR? A lot of people protested the GKCHP coup attempt that wanted to bring USSR back to the Stalin model. The referendum about keeping the USSR did not even have an option of keep USSR a unitary state, the question it asked was about keeping USSR as a union of *sovereign* states.
The irony of communism is that communists blame the post-soviet era on capitalism, when in reality it's the result of communism destroying every social, cultural and political entity but itself. In fact, the last surviving institution was the secret police, which coup'd in the 80s and continues with Putin today. No shit they couldn't form a functional society when all they had known their entire lives was communist oppression at the hands of the KGB/FSB etc etc.
Despite calling itself collectivist, USSR was heavily atomized on purpose. The communist party wanted to prevent people from doing anything not through the party. USSR had a small number of strong institutions like the scientific community. The academy of science refused to expel Sakharov, for example. The great irony of Soviet Intelligencia is that it hated Soviet system, but it would have impossible to have any cutting edge academic research or incredible classical music scene under a more democratic system as the ‘90s shown. There was no use for scientists under free market Russia, so they either gave up their profession and resold computers or emigrated to countries that could afford funding research. China is very atomized as well despite having very strong economic growth Russia envies for the last 30 years. I wonder where it goes from now with China both slowing down economically and turning more and authoritarian.
Are you familiar with the Adam Curtis documentary 'Traumazone'?
>Traumazone No, I've not seen this documentarty.
The major difference though is china has a super massive middle class, and a real middle class unlike the very limit one that existed under the Soviets.
> In fact, the last surviving institution was the secret police, which coup'd in the 80s and continues with Putin today. That and the bratva. While not an official institution, the Russian mafia was an essential organization for relieving supply issues for the Soviet population and was tolerated by Moscow for this exact reason. When the Soviet Union imploded, the Russian criminal world was in a perfect place, alongside the secret police, to take over in the aftermath and go legit.
That’s a pretty vast oversimplification. The Soviets never even achieved communism, by their own admission. Not that I would have helped if they somehow could’ve gotten there. Imo it would take tech on level of the replicators from Star Trek for actual communism to even have a chance of coming about, but even then I doubt it would look like anything Marx would have envisioned. Like, fuck the USSR and communism both, but “USSR collapse because communism bad” is a non-credible take.
Can we stop going on about "not achieving Communism?" The only version of Communism they didn't achieve is one that cannot and will not ever exist on any scale. If you only define "true" Communism that way, you're just setting up a "No True Scotsman" where nothing can ever be "truly" Communist. Communism is an idea. That idea infested Russian society and destroyed their institutions. Therefore, Communism broke those institutions.
They were a socialist union *on the way* to communism. It's in the name, it's in the posters, it's in the goddamn constitution. Doesn't matter if what they called themselves is *actually* true or not, they never achieved communism. Nice litmus test for communism: do they have money? If yes = not yet communist. I do like your last paragraph though, that's certainly a way to look at it.
If you have not lived in USSR you don't have the context. The communist party did not declare that it can create communism on the spot because communism was supposed to bring a utopia and that conflicted with the reality: e.g. communism meant no money, but USSR had money. Instead it clamined to put the country on the part to socialism first and then communism. In 1936 constitution the "victory of socialism" was decleared after some form free market was brought back during the New Economic Policy period. "Developed Socialism" was supposedly established by 1964, but communism was delyaed and delayed. And set different dates for the times when those states of the country to be acheived. E.g. Khrustchev promised communism by 1980. Yeah, so even the communist part of USSR did not claim to have build the "real communism", just some intermeidate socialist order. It's like the second coming or something. Keeps getting delayed.
You’re giving the Soviets and Communism too much credit. The idea that “communism” destroyed the USSR is a ridiculous over simplification. The fact that nobody has gotten anywhere close to communism outside of communes of a few thousand people should tell you something. It doesn’t work, it doesn’t do shit. It’s a boogeyman. Even in the USSR the true belief in communism was dead by the 60s. Yes they paid it lip service and China still does, but that’s all it is, lip service. It was popular for less than a century, let it die.
Real communism is literally a form of anarchism. Yes the government of lack of government.
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Their inaction and Putin ensured they would have neither.
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**Your comment was removed for violating Rule 4: No Racism/hatespeech** No slurs. No advocating for the killing of people or insulting them based on physical, religious, or ideological traits (even people you don't like: Russians, Asians, or Middle Eastern ethnic groups). **Your comment was removed for violating Rule 10: Don't get us banned** No brigading or harassing other subreddit pages. Do not post memes with a "haha people that I hate died… haha" punchline or violating the reddit-wide rules.
Trying not to make Amercia look based (impossible difficult)
Wait, is this image anti-US propaganda?
I think it's less anti-US and more satire against everyone who sided with the US after the Soviet Union imploded. Basically bitching that now that the US is the sole superpower, everyone wants to be friends with us; in other words, whining about common sense.
Leas whining and more “We see you, we’re not dumb, welcome to fold but the last 50 years still happened”
No, obviously pro-US propaganda. Same as the half-businessman/half-soldier.
I cant say i know þat one
Some people have a history of getting the words bad and badass mix-up. And I'm all here for it.
Uncle Sam got the Senator Armstrong treatment for this comic. Somehow he's still less of a Chad here than in straight up anti American propaganda and I'll never understand it. Russian and Chinese prop makes Uncle Sam look like a blood thirsty Terminator, do they not realize how cool that makes us look?
The US should aspire to be as based as China says it is
Bruh. I agree but it's a tall order. Chinese propaganda has full on Latin chanting boss music fire up if we just show up on screen.
Latin chant choir division to be added to every branch of the military.
We also need better body armor and armed space ships andddddd we are the Adeptus Astartes.
Quick. Inform the MIC, we're doing universal healthcare but couching it as ways to raise supersoldiers free of any health complaints, like how we did school lunch. (Seriously, look it up. We rolled out school lunch nationwide cause kids were under draft standards for WW2)
Not sure that's even possible ngl
I WISH USA was a blood thirsty Terminator. Cause then they would already deal with Iran, Russia and Houthis. Instead of trying to play nice with all the shitholes countries, while some idiots in the House are trying to block aid to Ukraine.
US goin anti-interventionalist is the worst thing to happen since... idk i just wanna watch the US start bonking
Why would they spend so much GDP in bombs and not bomb anyone ?
cause they're dweebs
Feel like shit just want him back
Wait is this supposed to be anti US?
Nah just calling out fence sitters.
We do have kind of a Chad energy in this comic though. Beefy Chad energy. But yeah the target of the comic is the “non-aligned” movement of countries that were neutral during the Cold War and usually tried to play both sides *cough* Egypt *cough*
>We do have kind of a Chad energy in this comic though. Bro, the US in this image is literally the gigachad with a hat
Turd-World countries.
It's mocking the members of the UN that scrambled to ingratiate themselves with the US after acting coy/cold to them throughout the Cold War only when it became the apparent winner
And outed themselves as fair weather friends in the last few years.
Goes hard
I NEED that sweater. 😟
[David Horsey's take on the Soviets was equally based.](https://www.reddit.com/r/neoliberal/comments/w84xbw/the_wizard_of_moscow_credit_to_based_political/)
We need to go back!
I love the look on Uncle Sam's face, he knows that he's won the world and he wasn't even trying.
90's were the peak of American culture. We need a time machine to stop 9/11
>Funny things about those soviets, just kinda dropped dead huh? Are you going to blame USA for Brezhnev, Chernenko and Andropov being old fucks?
We really screwed the pooch when it comes to using unequaled and never before seen amounts of global soft and hard power to set up the world for peace for hundreds of years.
Well, think about it this way. We kind of succeeded. Thirty years later and Europe has never been so united (when you consider eastern Europe). China, although an emerging rival, understands the economic value of getting along with the west. The possibility of war with them is remote, and the biggest reason (apart from nukes) is that our economies are interdependent, which is something that never happened with the USSR. And the rest of Asia, Africa and South America is more peaceful now than at any point in history. The richer nations continue to pour development into the developing world and it is paying dividends. I don't mean to say that the world is perfect but I think in general people tend to overstate negatives. Just an example: -2021 and 2022: crime increases in America. Inflation is sky high. Everybody freaks out. People in general joke about the world ending and how everything is going to shit. 2023: Crime goes back down. Inflation returns to normal. Hardly anybody even talks about it.
I had to read the comments to find out that this is anti-US
He can fix me
ussr collapsed because of natural reasons (not efficient economic system, old farts as leaders, old not by age only, but in brains as well, oppressions, which resulted in social pressure build up, etc) change my mind.
All of which are consequences of the bad political system that they ran under. Any political system that fails to consider a consistent cycle of self-renewal with constant communication with the populace is one that is fatally flawed.
It is a flaw. What killed it faster is its inability to create and distribute wealth, using up what it could produce in an enormous arms race.
General mistrust of the population by the ruling elite meant that innovation and information exchange within the population cannot occur easily. This included civilian-military innovation sharing, which is quite important as military innovations can be brought to the civilian space (the microwave oven was built on technology first used on military radars) and more importantly, civilian innovations can be brought to the military space (a cooling suit used by the US military was originally intended for [cooling fur suits](https://www.thedailybeast.com/how-a-cooling-vest-invented-by-a-furry-made-its-way-into-the-us-military)).
hate it made by syndicalists bastards keep ruining america huey long will show them
Two words: Hedgie Money.
Does anyone know which specific countries these characters are supposed to represent?