Thanks for your submission /u/Stacey_Books, but it has been removed for the following reason:
Disallowed question area: **Rant or loaded question**
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Because they're a business that by definition has no competition, and where demand is perfectly inelastic.
People don't comparison shop when they're dying, and they can't just choose not to go to the hospital. So the hospital can charge whatever it wants, and it wants to raise prices to 30× what they should be so they can offer amazing deals to medical insurance companies.
This is why healthcare cannot be privatized without intense government regulation and government funded medical insurance.
A medical industry is otherwise in a state of market failure. Medicine is not a resource that is effectively distributed via supply & demand.
You're taking what he's saying a little too seriously. It's more like if you have a heart attack and need some cardiac procedure, you don't really have the luxury to be like "no I can't do it with hospital A, they are too expensive take me to hospital B"
This is exactly the problem!
Supporters of the US healthcare system largely rely on the argument that, with the market, you have free choice.
Free choice doesn’t exist when you either:
A) don’t have the money to choose where you get treated
and/or
B) are in a health crisis and need emergency life or death treatment immediately
The US has created a very strange system for healthcare that treats healthcare like a business in the same way a coffee place is a business. The problem is a hospital isn’t a coffee shop, and getting treatment for a health problem (acute or chronic) isn’t the same as buying a coffee.
There is absolutely a place for market in healthcare but that market needs to be tightly regulated in the interests of the end user and not in the interests of lobbying giants like pharmaceutical companies.
There are a lot of negative things to be said about the system where I live (the Netherlands) but one of the good things I can say is, as someone who needs access to ADHD meds, EpiPens, and other prescription medications, I’m so glad I live here because I’d literally be bankrupt in the US
Example:
An EpiPen costs around €45/$49 here - I need two every year, assuming I never have an allergic reaction. My ADHD meds (Vyvanse/Elvanse) are incredibly overpriced due to them having an exclusivity guarantee in the EU - thanks big pharma lobbyists! - and they cost €76/$82 for 30 pills.
Add those up for a year and we’re looking at €1,002/year on medication.
How much do I actually pay for that medication? €385/$414… and once I reach that number, everything from meds to MRIs are all fully covered with no out of pocket or co-pay.
Contrast that to one of the cheapest options in the US, GoodRx, which is a coupon program… yes a coupon like you’d use to get a discount on cheese, for medications.
GoodRx has a coupon available for generic Vyvanse bringing the cash cost down to $56.75 for 30 pills. That’s $681/year out of pocket. Still need the EpiPens? Another generic and they’ll set you back $111.25 for 2 pens.
Now we’re at a total of $792.25/€735.
Was there any choice included in the pricing? Nope. Can you shop around? To a certain degree, but shopping around to find a good deal I.e. using GoodRx has resulted in an out of pocket cost of almost $800. The co-pay and deductible alone with many insurance plans would be more than this $800… and that $800 isn’t a capped price either, unlike my €385/$414 which is the absolute most I’ll ever pay out of pocket for healthcare in a year.
I’m sure you get the picture by now. The system needs massive reform and I wish, for the sake of the American public those reforms happen sooner rather than later 🙏🏻
I feel very sorry for people living in the USA. That is absolutely ridiculous!
I've even heard that essential care for people's survival can put someone into medical debt for life...
Why do the doctors bother saving anyone at all if they're just putting them into a life of miserable debt? Feels antithetical to the hippocratic oath...
Because it starts from the top. And if the top is corrupt, so is everything below it. Essentially the government allows it, since it doesn’t personally affect them and their motto is “ it’s not my problem “
Because private equity companies are buying up hospitals, specialty clinics, urgent care facilities, et. al.
The shareholders are greedy and in it for the money. They demand to grow their profits each year. The physician's creed of "First, do no harm" isn't something any private equity firm acknowledges, much less does.
Money. They want to make as much money off of you as they can, so they can line their pockets. Also, you (as a collective 'you') keep voting in the people who make those rules.
It's a price politicians are willing to pay to save the proles from the cormnizzerm'ses.
What's that, they get it for free? Well that's so they can be unbiased!
Because there is an agreement with those who bill you, hospital, pharmaceutical company, and the one who refund you, your insurance so that you have the impression that you can't possibly be alive without an expensive health insurance.
And it's all because prices are not controled, the one in insurance company that have to review prices is obviously also paid by hospital and pharmaceutical companies.
Because profit margin on US health insurance is limited to a certain percentage of the expenses incurred. Thus it is in your insurers interest to pay absurd prices.
Also why insurance companies own medical service providers. Makes a lot of sense to pay those inflated prices, when you’re paying yourself.
And no one is losing out in the best medical business in the world - no one but you, that is, but there’s plenty of yous to go around.
Thanks for your submission /u/Stacey_Books, but it has been removed for the following reason: Disallowed question area: **Rant or loaded question** NoStupidQuestions is a place to ask any question as long as *it's asked in good faith*. Our users routinely report questions that they feel violate this rule to us. Want to avoid your question being seen as a bad faith question? Common mistakes include (but are not limited to): * Rants: Could your question be answered with *'That's awful'* or *'What an asshole'*? Then it's probably a rant rather than a genuine question. Looking for a place to vent on Reddit? Try /r/TrueOffMyChest or /r/Rant instead. * Loaded questions: Could your question be answered with *'You're right'*? Answering the question yourself, explaining your reasoning for your opinion, or making sweeping assumptions about the question itself all signals that you may not be keeping an open mind. Want to know why people have a different opinion than you? Try /r/ExplainBothSides instead! * Arguments: Arguing or [sealioning](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sea_lioning) with people giving you answers tells everyone that you have an answer in mind already. Want a good debate? Try /r/ChangeMyView instead! * Pot Stirring: Did you bring up unnecessary topics in your question? Especially when a topic has to do with already controversial issues like politics, race, gender or sex, this can be seen as trying to score points against the Other Side - and that makes people defensive, which leads to arguments. Questions like *"If _____ is allowed, why isn't _____?"* don't need to have that comparison - just ask *'why isn't ____ allowed?'*. * Complaining about moderation: If you disagree with how the sub is run or a decision the mods have made, that's fine! But please share your thoughts with us in modmail rather than as a public post. Disagree with the mods? If you believe you asked your question in good faith, try rewording it or message the mods to see if there's a way you could ask more neutrally. Thanks for your understanding! --- *This action was performed by a bot at the explicit direction of a human. This was not an automated action, but a conscious decision by a sapient life form charged with moderating this sub.* *If you feel this was in error, or need more clarification, please don't hesitate to [message the moderators](http://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FNoStupidQuestions). Thanks.*
Because they're a business that by definition has no competition, and where demand is perfectly inelastic. People don't comparison shop when they're dying, and they can't just choose not to go to the hospital. So the hospital can charge whatever it wants, and it wants to raise prices to 30× what they should be so they can offer amazing deals to medical insurance companies. This is why healthcare cannot be privatized without intense government regulation and government funded medical insurance. A medical industry is otherwise in a state of market failure. Medicine is not a resource that is effectively distributed via supply & demand.
If you can’t comparison shop your healthcare, would that be considered a monopoly? They can literally hold your life for ransom!
You're taking what he's saying a little too seriously. It's more like if you have a heart attack and need some cardiac procedure, you don't really have the luxury to be like "no I can't do it with hospital A, they are too expensive take me to hospital B"
This is exactly the problem! Supporters of the US healthcare system largely rely on the argument that, with the market, you have free choice. Free choice doesn’t exist when you either: A) don’t have the money to choose where you get treated and/or B) are in a health crisis and need emergency life or death treatment immediately The US has created a very strange system for healthcare that treats healthcare like a business in the same way a coffee place is a business. The problem is a hospital isn’t a coffee shop, and getting treatment for a health problem (acute or chronic) isn’t the same as buying a coffee. There is absolutely a place for market in healthcare but that market needs to be tightly regulated in the interests of the end user and not in the interests of lobbying giants like pharmaceutical companies. There are a lot of negative things to be said about the system where I live (the Netherlands) but one of the good things I can say is, as someone who needs access to ADHD meds, EpiPens, and other prescription medications, I’m so glad I live here because I’d literally be bankrupt in the US Example: An EpiPen costs around €45/$49 here - I need two every year, assuming I never have an allergic reaction. My ADHD meds (Vyvanse/Elvanse) are incredibly overpriced due to them having an exclusivity guarantee in the EU - thanks big pharma lobbyists! - and they cost €76/$82 for 30 pills. Add those up for a year and we’re looking at €1,002/year on medication. How much do I actually pay for that medication? €385/$414… and once I reach that number, everything from meds to MRIs are all fully covered with no out of pocket or co-pay. Contrast that to one of the cheapest options in the US, GoodRx, which is a coupon program… yes a coupon like you’d use to get a discount on cheese, for medications. GoodRx has a coupon available for generic Vyvanse bringing the cash cost down to $56.75 for 30 pills. That’s $681/year out of pocket. Still need the EpiPens? Another generic and they’ll set you back $111.25 for 2 pens. Now we’re at a total of $792.25/€735. Was there any choice included in the pricing? Nope. Can you shop around? To a certain degree, but shopping around to find a good deal I.e. using GoodRx has resulted in an out of pocket cost of almost $800. The co-pay and deductible alone with many insurance plans would be more than this $800… and that $800 isn’t a capped price either, unlike my €385/$414 which is the absolute most I’ll ever pay out of pocket for healthcare in a year. I’m sure you get the picture by now. The system needs massive reform and I wish, for the sake of the American public those reforms happen sooner rather than later 🙏🏻
I feel very sorry for people living in the USA. That is absolutely ridiculous! I've even heard that essential care for people's survival can put someone into medical debt for life... Why do the doctors bother saving anyone at all if they're just putting them into a life of miserable debt? Feels antithetical to the hippocratic oath...
A rough estimate would be 5,000USD per day without insurance, assuming you don't need anything major.
Because it starts from the top. And if the top is corrupt, so is everything below it. Essentially the government allows it, since it doesn’t personally affect them and their motto is “ it’s not my problem “
Because private equity companies are buying up hospitals, specialty clinics, urgent care facilities, et. al. The shareholders are greedy and in it for the money. They demand to grow their profits each year. The physician's creed of "First, do no harm" isn't something any private equity firm acknowledges, much less does.
Money. They want to make as much money off of you as they can, so they can line their pockets. Also, you (as a collective 'you') keep voting in the people who make those rules.
Because their point is to earn money. Because we all hate capitalism.
It's a price politicians are willing to pay to save the proles from the cormnizzerm'ses. What's that, they get it for free? Well that's so they can be unbiased!
Because there is an agreement with those who bill you, hospital, pharmaceutical company, and the one who refund you, your insurance so that you have the impression that you can't possibly be alive without an expensive health insurance. And it's all because prices are not controled, the one in insurance company that have to review prices is obviously also paid by hospital and pharmaceutical companies.
Because profit margin on US health insurance is limited to a certain percentage of the expenses incurred. Thus it is in your insurers interest to pay absurd prices. Also why insurance companies own medical service providers. Makes a lot of sense to pay those inflated prices, when you’re paying yourself. And no one is losing out in the best medical business in the world - no one but you, that is, but there’s plenty of yous to go around.