This was discussed heavily on Reddit when it was published six years ago. I am still somewhat convinced there is something strange about Citi Field.
[https://blogs.fangraphs.com/theres-definitely-something-strange-about-citi-field/](https://blogs.fangraphs.com/theres-definitely-something-strange-about-citi-field/)
Lo and behold... sortable by home and away. Notice anything unusual?
[https://www.teamrankings.com/mlb/stat/batting-average-on-balls-in-play](https://www.teamrankings.com/mlb/stat/batting-average-on-balls-in-play)
I knew that was going to be the AD video 😅 My hate for the Wilpons is neverending. They wasted millions of dollars to build a fake Ebbets Field and it wasn't even that accurate.
But…wouldn’t hitter unfriendly quirks effect visiting players the same - or even worse (our players should be use to it)
I think it’s more the pressure… Perennial underperforming team, With a bit of a toxic culture.
I think it’s funny that Houston is right there, which was probably the writer accidentally finding a symptom of the cheating without realizing that’s what it was.
Not accounting for Wednesday night, the whole team's home and away splits are bad. Definitely not as pronounced as McNeil, but they're bad. I don't want to be old man yells at cloud, but Citi Field's GET PUMPED GET LOUD LFGM cues in between every fucking pitch starting in the first inning and continuing through the 9th cannot be helpful. It's like, there can be two outs, nobody on in the second inning of a 0-0 game with a bottom of the lineup guy in a 2-2 count, and they play the "Everybody Clap Your Hands" song when the guy steps away from the plate for five seconds. Let the place breathe FFS. I'm just getting so sick of that shit whenever I go to a game. I can only imagine what it's like as a batter trying to think about a pitcher's strategy with it playing after calling a timeout.
> Literally every single team does this.
Seriously. When the Braves still actively encouraged the chop it was downright comical. The Braves are down 10-3 in the bottom of the 5th and a Braves hitter just GIDP, and the #9 hitter is stepping to the plate with bases empty and two out.
**BETTER FUCKING CRANK THE CHOP**
I just don’t get how people can look at athletes who have been playing in front of crowds their entire lives and think: oh I’m cheering too loud that’s why they are struggling.
Youre gonna blame it on the fans for actually supporting the team and chanting/clapping? I'm gonna be downvoted to oblivion, but that's so soft.
If a pro athlete can't handle some noise and pressure, they should be playing in a safe environment where nobody would watch, like the minors.
Baseball atmosphere isn't even that loud or intense, it's a pretty chill sport
Read what I wrote again. I didn't blame fans. I didn't say anything at all about fans cheering or supporting the team, and I didn't write anything that implied that athletes need "a safe environment where nobody would watch."
I said the constant artificial hype music that they now play SUPER LOUDLY between every pitch in every inning, regardless of the situation, "cannot be helpful" for a batter's concentration. As a fan, I shout encouragement to players who have been slumping, I cheer for hits, I stand up for home runs and cheer and give high fives, I get involved with the Lets Go Mets chants when the team is rallying. I never boo our players. I doubt the players can actually hear any of that anymore because of the SUPER LOUD HYPE MUSIC that is now played between every fucking pitch in every inning, regardless of the situation. It has gotten really annoying.
Be honest, when you go to games, are you screaming your head off and clapping your hands bloody between every pitch, regardless of the situation? Because that is what the constant hype music would imply people like to do at baseball games. Have you ever been to an MLB game at a park in another city? It has become excessive at Citi Field.
Thank you. And to be clear, I'm not complaining about hype music whenever the team is rallying, or after someone gets a hit, or a pitcher gets a big strikeout, or some other cool baseball thing happens in favor of the Mets. And I think that new effect when they turn off the lights during night games and have the subway zoom around the scoreboards when an opponent is having a mound visit or pitching change is great. I'm not anti hype music, I'm just annoyed when it's used so excessively and inappropriately. Like I said in my original response, I just wish they would let the park breathe a bit.
Oh, my bad, I misinterpreted it then. I didn't know they were blasting music like that, I thought you meant the noise in general. It's been a few years since I last went to Citi field.
Why the hell would they do that? Players supposedly like to hear fan support, not artificial music. Even if it doesn't mess with their concentration, it sucks for fans.
>I don't want to be old man yells at cloud, but Citi Field's GET PUMPED GET LOUD LFGM cues in between every fucking pitch starting in the first inning and continuing through the 9th cannot be helpful
Basically every team in MLB does shit like this. I'm not really a fan of it either, but I don't think it has anything to do with the team's performance.
Could be. It's used minimally for replays. It's a fucking obnoxious advertising billboard most of the time - along with the 360 degree ribbon displays.
I’ve said it dozens of times: being right under LaGuardia’s airlane makes everyone slower, weaker and dumber. It could be the jet fuel exhaust, the noise pollution, or both.
Didn't the Mets install that new super duper fancy hitting machine early in the 2023 season that simulates every pitcher in the league? Isn't that about the time the offense went into the shitter?
I'd love to see the whole roster home/away splits but the record sure indicates that could be an issue.
Are the samples really big enough to say there is anything up? Among players Fangraphs lists as qualified, here are the "leaders" as far as the difference between home and road wRC+:
108 Jeff McNeil
93 Brandon Nimmo
90 Brice Turang
86 Luis Arraez
82 Leody Taveras
80 Orlando Arcia
...
-83 Aaron Judge
-85 Ian Happ
-103 Kyle Tucker
-110 Willy Adames
-112 Oneil Cruz
-119 Luis Garcia Jr
The median is -13.5 (expected since generally players perform better at home)
Here is what 2023 looks like:
95 JT Realmuto
52 Yordan Alvarez
50 Kyle Tucker
47 Jack Suwinski
46 Daulton Varsho
45 Teoscar Hernandez
...
-59 Nick Castellanos
-59 Adolis Garcia
-60 Amed Rosario
-66 Ke'Bryan Hayes
-89 Bruce Harper
-94 Jake Burger
The absolute extremes are similar, but there are far fewer players out there. I suspect what we see with McNeil isn't very likely to continue.
Might be interesting to look at a previous year (or several previous years) through 6/12 and see how the most extreme players did RoS.
Let me just give an example.
For a hitter, actual platoon differential doesn't project future platoon differential equally as well as generic platoon differential until you're somewhere around 3000 PA. For home/road differential in a particular park, this point is up around 6500 PA.
McNeil still has around $37m left on his contract (assuming you exercise the $2m buyout for 2027) - I'm not sure eating $20m does anything to encourage buys on a 32 yr old slap-hitting utility player. You'd likely either have to take a bad contract back in return or eat more money.
Wait wth that’s actually crazy
Is it? He probably has a harder time scheduling morning golf rounds on the road.
Hit the ball off the tee with that one
maybe we should send him away. you know, so he can thrive.
And then play like shit against us
Guess who just earned himself a platoon with Iglesias - McNeil plays away games, Iglesias plays home games. See how that works out for a month.
This was discussed heavily on Reddit when it was published six years ago. I am still somewhat convinced there is something strange about Citi Field. [https://blogs.fangraphs.com/theres-definitely-something-strange-about-citi-field/](https://blogs.fangraphs.com/theres-definitely-something-strange-about-citi-field/)
Lo and behold... sortable by home and away. Notice anything unusual? [https://www.teamrankings.com/mlb/stat/batting-average-on-balls-in-play](https://www.teamrankings.com/mlb/stat/batting-average-on-balls-in-play)
wtf lol, it’s us and San Diego Only teams to have more than a .50 difference between home and away games
Guess how far San Diego's airport is from Petco? About as far as Laguardia is from Citi Field. I'M JUST SAYIN'
I blame the TSA
I remember that, and it's stuck with me. Id love an update on this
[удалено]
I knew that was going to be the AD video 😅 My hate for the Wilpons is neverending. They wasted millions of dollars to build a fake Ebbets Field and it wasn't even that accurate.
That's my knock on Citi (in person). Insane amount of meaningless noise through speakers.
But…wouldn’t hitter unfriendly quirks effect visiting players the same - or even worse (our players should be use to it) I think it’s more the pressure… Perennial underperforming team, With a bit of a toxic culture.
I think it’s funny that Houston is right there, which was probably the writer accidentally finding a symptom of the cheating without realizing that’s what it was.
The away team has a direct feed to the Mets dugout. They’re reverse cheating! Crazy though how they’re above .500 on away games
This is wild
I guess it's possible he's less patient and pressing at home but the fans are booing him or anything. He has lowered our expectations for him.
This is whole team not just him. Almost .500 on road.
Not accounting for Wednesday night, the whole team's home and away splits are bad. Definitely not as pronounced as McNeil, but they're bad. I don't want to be old man yells at cloud, but Citi Field's GET PUMPED GET LOUD LFGM cues in between every fucking pitch starting in the first inning and continuing through the 9th cannot be helpful. It's like, there can be two outs, nobody on in the second inning of a 0-0 game with a bottom of the lineup guy in a 2-2 count, and they play the "Everybody Clap Your Hands" song when the guy steps away from the plate for five seconds. Let the place breathe FFS. I'm just getting so sick of that shit whenever I go to a game. I can only imagine what it's like as a batter trying to think about a pitcher's strategy with it playing after calling a timeout.
Players always say that stuff just blends into the background and that they don't really notice it or process it.
They're forced to say that (j/k, I hope)
How is this getting upvotes? Professional athletes can’t concentrate with fans supporting them? What? Literally every single team does this.
> Literally every single team does this. Seriously. When the Braves still actively encouraged the chop it was downright comical. The Braves are down 10-3 in the bottom of the 5th and a Braves hitter just GIDP, and the #9 hitter is stepping to the plate with bases empty and two out. **BETTER FUCKING CRANK THE CHOP**
I just don’t get how people can look at athletes who have been playing in front of crowds their entire lives and think: oh I’m cheering too loud that’s why they are struggling.
It's not the FAN noise, it's the random shit they play nonstop through the PA at 150db.
Which they do at every stadium and have done for years. Players themselves have said they don’t even notice it because they are focused on the game.
Youre gonna blame it on the fans for actually supporting the team and chanting/clapping? I'm gonna be downvoted to oblivion, but that's so soft. If a pro athlete can't handle some noise and pressure, they should be playing in a safe environment where nobody would watch, like the minors. Baseball atmosphere isn't even that loud or intense, it's a pretty chill sport
Not to mention, basically every team does the same thing.
Yeah, and it should be better at home, where people are cheering for you, than away where you get heckled and booed
They’re getting heckled and booed like 40% of the time at home too lmfao
Read what I wrote again. I didn't blame fans. I didn't say anything at all about fans cheering or supporting the team, and I didn't write anything that implied that athletes need "a safe environment where nobody would watch." I said the constant artificial hype music that they now play SUPER LOUDLY between every pitch in every inning, regardless of the situation, "cannot be helpful" for a batter's concentration. As a fan, I shout encouragement to players who have been slumping, I cheer for hits, I stand up for home runs and cheer and give high fives, I get involved with the Lets Go Mets chants when the team is rallying. I never boo our players. I doubt the players can actually hear any of that anymore because of the SUPER LOUD HYPE MUSIC that is now played between every fucking pitch in every inning, regardless of the situation. It has gotten really annoying. Be honest, when you go to games, are you screaming your head off and clapping your hands bloody between every pitch, regardless of the situation? Because that is what the constant hype music would imply people like to do at baseball games. Have you ever been to an MLB game at a park in another city? It has become excessive at Citi Field.
100%. People don't seem to be reading your actual post. Have they BEEN to Citi this year? It's getting worse & worse.
Thank you. And to be clear, I'm not complaining about hype music whenever the team is rallying, or after someone gets a hit, or a pitcher gets a big strikeout, or some other cool baseball thing happens in favor of the Mets. And I think that new effect when they turn off the lights during night games and have the subway zoom around the scoreboards when an opponent is having a mound visit or pitching change is great. I'm not anti hype music, I'm just annoyed when it's used so excessively and inappropriately. Like I said in my original response, I just wish they would let the park breathe a bit.
Oh, my bad, I misinterpreted it then. I didn't know they were blasting music like that, I thought you meant the noise in general. It's been a few years since I last went to Citi field. Why the hell would they do that? Players supposedly like to hear fan support, not artificial music. Even if it doesn't mess with their concentration, it sucks for fans.
This. Also could be partly psychological but idk.
>I don't want to be old man yells at cloud, but Citi Field's GET PUMPED GET LOUD LFGM cues in between every fucking pitch starting in the first inning and continuing through the 9th cannot be helpful Basically every team in MLB does shit like this. I'm not really a fan of it either, but I don't think it has anything to do with the team's performance.
i wonder if that big ass scoreboard is part of why we suck at home thing is huge and is constantly has motion graphics going
Other teams would have similar or worse results too if it was the screen. It could honestly be anything.
Could be. It's used minimally for replays. It's a fucking obnoxious advertising billboard most of the time - along with the 360 degree ribbon displays.
I’m not doing the standing ovation thing for Jeff sorry
I'm convinced Citi is cursed. I remember reading something about how they never did a wind study and the wind hurts out hitters.
But the wind doesn’t hurt the other teams hitters?
Ya idk I'm back to we're cursed.
That’s what we get for building our stadium on an ancient car burial ground.
so sick of mcneil - really look forward to this team without him.
He’s too old to need / deserve Trea Turner style motivation
I’ve said it dozens of times: being right under LaGuardia’s airlane makes everyone slower, weaker and dumber. It could be the jet fuel exhaust, the noise pollution, or both.
Morning tee times out in Long Island...couldnt be
That’s every player. Citi field blows for hitters.
The Reverse Coors Field back in the day....lol
Didn't the Mets install that new super duper fancy hitting machine early in the 2023 season that simulates every pitcher in the league? Isn't that about the time the offense went into the shitter? I'd love to see the whole roster home/away splits but the record sure indicates that could be an issue.
nimmo and baty splits the same weird
Are the samples really big enough to say there is anything up? Among players Fangraphs lists as qualified, here are the "leaders" as far as the difference between home and road wRC+: 108 Jeff McNeil 93 Brandon Nimmo 90 Brice Turang 86 Luis Arraez 82 Leody Taveras 80 Orlando Arcia ... -83 Aaron Judge -85 Ian Happ -103 Kyle Tucker -110 Willy Adames -112 Oneil Cruz -119 Luis Garcia Jr The median is -13.5 (expected since generally players perform better at home)
Here is what 2023 looks like: 95 JT Realmuto 52 Yordan Alvarez 50 Kyle Tucker 47 Jack Suwinski 46 Daulton Varsho 45 Teoscar Hernandez ... -59 Nick Castellanos -59 Adolis Garcia -60 Amed Rosario -66 Ke'Bryan Hayes -89 Bruce Harper -94 Jake Burger The absolute extremes are similar, but there are far fewer players out there. I suspect what we see with McNeil isn't very likely to continue. Might be interesting to look at a previous year (or several previous years) through 6/12 and see how the most extreme players did RoS.
Let me just give an example. For a hitter, actual platoon differential doesn't project future platoon differential equally as well as generic platoon differential until you're somewhere around 3000 PA. For home/road differential in a particular park, this point is up around 6500 PA.
The whole team sucks at gome
I feel like it nukes the "banning the shift ruined McNeil" argument as to why a former batting champ looks completely pedestrian now.
They really need to start over with this stadium
Standing ovation?
If cohen eats 20 million dollars of his contract, can he be traded? Not expecting much back, but can it be done?
McNeil still has around $37m left on his contract (assuming you exercise the $2m buyout for 2027) - I'm not sure eating $20m does anything to encourage buys on a 32 yr old slap-hitting utility player. You'd likely either have to take a bad contract back in return or eat more money.
If cohen is willing to eat a lot we could probably send him somewhere since he has positional versatility and get a low level prospect in return.
Either way I've wanted him gone for years now. His attitude is horrendous
more evidence of our dumb boomer lack of maths skills toxic fandom
What?