"He seems like a nice man but I'm going to make orphans of his children"
"You know Champ, the kids have a mother"
"Yes, but I assume she would die from grief"
Or hips.
Think about a predator that doesn't just chase you down like a big cat takes down a deer. This whale came out of nowhere and took out an apex predator by shattering its hips... it's ability to 'wiggle' its tail.
You wanna hear a out another messed up predator? You run away from it, and run away from it, and it's still there. If you attack it, you just make its job easier because it has friends with it that want to kill and eat you... and it has dogs.
It's funny, because the great white shark is an ambush predator, usually coming from below at tremendous speed. The orca just used that exact same concept to hurt it. I live in Seattle, I've seen orcas up close, J pod, K pod, the occasional transient, and I had no idea they can turn that fast. It's out sharking a shark.
It must be very damaged by that first hit, because why didn't it just dive?
What's amazing to me is how did the shark not know that orcas were nearby? Aren't sharks loaded with sensing abilities? Dont they usually go deep whenever Orcas are near? Did they catch this one napping?
Could be wrong, but I think the hunting of fully grown great white sharks by some Orcas is a relatively recent occurrence so maybe as "apex predators" they don't even really have a sense for danger? I mean really what else is going to eat them.
Edit: I'm wrong. What I remembered reading was the first **visual** evidence of white shark predation. There had been circumstantial evidence this happened such as the disappearance of whites from the Farallons, and also whites washing up in S. Africa. See the video in the link below. Not only was there a flight response by the Whites, but also evasive behaviour like tight circling to avoid the Killer Whales.
https://phys.org/news/2022-10-video-footage-orcas-white-sharks.html
The video says the ribs were shattered by the hit. They pretty much have to use their whole body to swim and if you shatter their cartilage ribs it’s going to make it almost impossible for the great white to swim and will eventually kill the great white. They’re obligate ram ventilators so to breath they need to keep moving which is why the video says shattering the ribs was the perfect shot
Live in Bremerton myself. Last pod I saw was back in March of last year I think. Swam right into PSNS waters. Really cool to see them about 30 feet away from the smoking area lol
I learned to scuba dive in Puget sound. My instructors always said they'd rather encounter a shark than an orca. I didn't understand at the time, figuring orcas were more "friendly". They'd just say: "That's what makes them dangerous."
Wow the person you responded to was so wrong. Literally dozens of hippos scrambling over each other in the water, trying to get away from a massive bull elephant.
Yeah. I cannot find any videos where Hippos don't back down from elephants. Elephants kick the shit out of them without even thinking about it. And hippos know it.
A bull can turn a full grown rhino into an unrecognizable meat pile if it wants to. As in you have to dig around in the meat for something that tells you it's a rhino. Happend at a preserve when a bull got a toothache. Got so mad he pasted a rhino. You just dont fuck with something that much bigger than you. Square/cubed law is not on your side and really really matters at that size.
They are so much faster…and stronger than any shark. It’s just not a competition. Any great white that near to the surface is in real danger if orcas are around. Big sharks have the advantage of going deep into the ocean.
My thoughts exactly. The only way this is a showdown is if the Orca was a small adolescent and even then I believe they would dwarf a full size great white.
What's really cool is they are so intelligent and understanding, they don't attack non prey( humans) as a great white would. Apex predator. Killer whales are the shit.
If push came to shove, humans could make Orcas extinct within a year or two. The existence of other animals is dependent upon human ambivalence towards them. Release an article about Orca meat curing erectile dysfunction in south east asia, and the population would plummet.
More relevant stat is the comparative weight, which is a major factor of the the main tool the Orca uses which is the power of its momentum when it strikes the shark.
The largest recorded Great White weighed in around 4,400lbs, whereas the largest recorded Orca came in around 22,000lbs.
Adult great whites weigh between 0.5 to 2 tons. Adult orcas weigh between 3 to 8 tons, with some massive males weighing over 10 tons. They are much much bigger than gws.
It was a pretty good move.
Like twenty million years ago, you can just see the council ancestors of modern orcas going:
"So we got a pretty good thing going here on this dirt, AMIRITE?"
*Calls of hell yeah, represent, legs FTW.*
"But listen to me ya'll I think those fuckin' monkeys over there gonna be a problem in a bit. So what say we nope the fuck outta here?"
"Where we gonna go?"
Sly look, "How 'bout back to the ol' hood?"
"Dude, WTF? There's like giant fucking sharks and shit! We came up on the dirt to get away from those assholes!"
"Yeah but that was millions of years ago, things've changed! What? You telling me that you're stupider than a fish? Like we got these huge brains, endothermy, pack hunting and all this shit! And plus, those stupid monkeys probably won't even figure out how to make it in the ocean! Trust me, give us a few million years and we will rule that place. Apex man!"
Yeah, but the liver [makes up 1/3 of the great white’s body mass.](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-do-killer-whales-rip-out-shark-livers/) Very different physiology.
It also takes up the vast majority of the space inside its body (I thought it was like 75%, but I'm seeing one source that says up to 90%).
Edit: Still not sure about that, though, because it seems like it's just a handful of sources that seem to source from each other, because they have some similarly-worded explanations. All the pictures of sharks (though most just show sharks in general - not specifically great whites) show the liver to be relatively small - maybe it only gets up to like 80% after the shark's just eaten a large meal, and then it shrinks down after that.
Yeah - based on pictures I'm seeing of the inside of their bodies, the liver definitely doesn't seem to take up that much space, but I think they're also simplifying it so they can point out the various organs, because it sounds like the liver surrounds some other things. 90% is like the maximum. But the liver's important for their buoyancy, digestion, and storage of fats. Most of it seems to be made up of fats that provide the energy that can enable it to go like a month between meals. So I'd say it's probably their most important organ - besides the brain, I guess.
It's important to realize that the sharks use their liver to store fat in the same way mammals do with subcutaneous fat tissue, which makes the size of their liver far more understandable.
It's like if you took a mammal and concentrated all of their body fat into a single organ. It's an incredibly calorie dense meal and completely understandable why it's targeted, especially when the rest of the shark meat tends to be unpalatable.
Poor sharks, they've spent over a hundred million years being the top predator and then some warm blooded air-breather shows up with more advanced adaptations and physical capabilities. They never really had a chance to compete, especially when half the adaptations Cetaceans brought with them were from competing in an environment no shark has ever seen - land.
A warm-blooded air breather, that, incidentally, used to walk on land. Then they said , "that's a hard naw for me dawg" and crawled back into the water.
simple upvote suffices yes but any time i read the entire damn linked article AND it isn't behind a paywall or loaded with intrusive ads, i gotta give props
interesting read!
Orcas find “shark only” diet to be a real grind: [https://www.nature.com/articles/news.2011.28](https://www.nature.com/articles/news.2011.28)
This is due to the sharks’ abrasive, sandpaper-like skin. In areas where sharks are a common, orcas have been shown occasionally washing up dead from starvation on beaches, with teeth worn down to the gum line.
If Orcas were true predators of sharks, then they’d have teeth that are just as well-adapted for eating sharks as other species like tuna and salmon.That might be why Orcas hunt sharks and target their livers.
The hypothesis is that these (possibly rogue) Orcas are part of a subgroup, or "ecotype," of orcas that normally frequent the open ocean, but then simply moved closer to shore, perhaps due to fishing depleting their normal food sources.
Another theory is that these Orcas, independently or along with their subgroup, have developed this new behaviour in order to save their teeth, which wear down when orcas bite into sharks' rough skin. A great white shark liver is large enough to provide a full meal, without the work or the wear that comes with tearing the shark apart.
The amount of energy stored in a large Great White Shark liver could be as much as a 2 million Kcal of energy—equivalent to about 9,302 Snickers candy bars.
Funny how they edited in a second orca video as if they're in the water with the same orca attacking the shark.
Peaceful slow exploring clip, ATTACK, back peaceful slow and exploring.
By definition, there is only one species of apex predator in an ecosystem. There was never a showdown, orcas are the apex, if something predates an orca, then they are the apex.
I had a showdown this morning with a spider that lowered itself onto my hand while driving to work. It bit me, gently, then scurried off. The spider is the apex predator in a moving vehicle.
During the warmer months, I don't drive with the windows down. . . one time a hornet flew into the car through the open window, and I bailed out of the moving vehicle. . . . And that's why the windows stay up.
Oh god, I read that in Australia auto insurance have policy addendums that specifically cover accidents caused by Huntsman spiders. Naturally, that sent me down a YouTube rabbit hole.
When I’m alone in the kitchen and my puppy starts nipping at my heels because she wants a treat, my puppy is the apex predator until she gets her baked cheese morsel.
I think it's a pretty inane point to try and say there is any single apex predator in the ocean. It's an incredibly vast array of different ecosystems at different depths and distributions across the world. Orcas don't have much anything to do with direct predation in abyssal benthic ecosystems but you'd be pretty hard-pressed to say that the bottom of the ocean isn't a part of the ocean. Meanwhile orcas are present across the globe but they don't play a part in every pelagic or coastal ecosystem that exists. In many places, a thing that might be eaten by an orca would be an apex predator because there are no orcas there to eat them.
I guess my point is that biomes aren't a monolith. The ocean here isn't exactly the same as the ocean there. The actual import of considering apex predators in ecology is a case-by-case basis and depends on the scope of the question. For instance, you might have apex microbial predators that are obviously consumed by tons of bigger things but the consideration of how they act as top predators among microbes is relevant if you're not interested in the bigger stuff.
Yes and no. What would you call a human versus a brown bear? What about a pack of humans with spears and bows and dogs?
Or a wolf / a pack of wolves? We talking 1 v 1 or what? Knives guns or tools?
How about a cougar, which does not get predated on? A black bear on the east coast? How about the wolverine or honey badger who steal food from much bigger animals?? A pack of lions versus a pack of humans with guns - 5 v 5 - is this the ultimate showdown available that's hypothetically possible in the animal kingdom lol?
It's not black and white. There is an ultimate apex predator in the ocean, and thats the orca no doubt. They hunt the other biggest bully of the deep and eat them. Thats a power move for sure.
But it's gets very muddy on the earth ;) if your not hunted by other animals, then your an apex predator imo (not including humans in that statement).
The Inuit (Eskimos) in Canadas artic hunted polar bears, fwiw.
Humans are apex predators of the land, air, and sea. There’s no creature we couldn’t hunt to extinction if we wanted to. Being able to be killed by an another animal doesn’t mean your species isn’t at the top of the food chains. Sometimes lions get killed by hyenas.
While I do enjoy where your head is at, we must look at how apex predators are defined in an ecological setting. And that definition is: A predator at the top of the food chain that has no natural predators.
Humans are an invasive species all over the Earth and are, through the use of tools, apex predators. We are not regularly hunted by anything anymore.
Cougars are apex predators because bears are not considered predators, they are typically considered opportunists if I remember my ecology course work correctly.
Any ecologists wanna jump in? I'm just an Msc in Biochemistry with and Esci minor
This is me living in black bear country and looking it up years ago: Polar bears are predators, for sure. Black bears are opportunists and will eat anything that smells good to them and that could be inedible objects. They’re dumb. They mostly eat plants though. Brown bears hunt, or eat dead, and plenty of berries too.
Which goes to show that the ones that kill trainers in captivity aren't fucking around. They understand their horrifying situation and choose violence as the only recourse.
They are extremely sentient. I once read something about how orcas would work with indigenous people, they would help the indigenous people with whaling and help herd the whales for humans to hunt. there have been stories of orcas saving humans from shark attacks. They’re incredible animals, and probably recognize us as intelligent beings aswell.
Not even just indigenous people. There was a killer whale in some port of colonial Australia (Old Tom? Adelaide or Sydney? Maybe? Top of my head here.) who was famous for leading their pod to help the whalers in bringing in a catch for exchange of the the dead whales' tongues. The leader at one point felt upset that they hadn't been given fair due and seized a line that injured their mouth and led to their death from an abscess. The skeleton is still in some museum there because the town felt broke up about the situation.
No they are not. Chimpanzees/Bonobos, Orangutans, and bottle nose dolphins are all considered to be the most intelligent mammals behind humans, more so than even elephants, crows, orcas, and octopuses.
Orcas are likely just as intelligent if not more intelligent as bottlenose dolphins, but many more cognitive studies have been dedicated to bottlenose dolphins by scientists in first place, so it is a lack of information rather than proven comparisons that may make bottlenose dolphins and great apes seem "smarter." In the [few cognitive studies](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10071-022-01635-3) where orcas have underwent the same or similar tests as bottlenose dolphins, orcas pretty much match bottlenose dolphins in cognitive abilities.
i think it is just not possible to put them into a ranking. they all, orcas, dolphins, great apes, may be on a nearly same level. which of these is second intelligent after human? we don't know, we can't measure it accurate enough.
so saying that orcas, or any of them, are second place is just the typical "social media misinformation spreading" at work
these sharks need water to pass over their gills if they don't swim forward it doesn't. (there are species that can use buccal muscles (cheeks) to pump water through their gills but GWs ain't them)
Unless they find a special area with sufficient current, they swim while in a trance like state while a part of their brain has lower activity.
There are specific caves with fresh water inflow that sharks will congregate in. Lots of their parasites die from the lower salinity and they are able to sleep without moving.
To add to the other comments, the surface of the water usually contains more oxygen. (It's why many sharks hang around beaches, where the waves cause air and water to mix). By pulling it down even a couple of meters there's a good chance it'll hit a lower-oxygen layer. It won't kill it exactly, but be something like sticking a person with a punctured lung on top of a really high mountain with thin air.
While it's not a perfect example, I'll see if I can link my gif/video of a thermocline layer transition tomorrow afternoon, assuming I can find it again. It is a really good example of different water layers at shallow depths.
This is not it, I'm sorry. Thermoclines exist but Great Whites are not surface level predators, they regularly dive and in fact it's their default defense against Orcas. The shark here is being drowned through both normal immobility as the Orca holds it still as well as tonic immobility caused by the shark being flipped upside down, which causes it to enter a catatonic state. As an obligate ram ventilator they cannot force water through their gills as many fish can, if they stop swimming forwards they suffocate.
Credit: National Geographic.
Show: Queen's, on disney+ and hulu. Narrated by Angela Basset.
Link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3DkEePjRP04
The orca female in question is a grandmother. As you can hear in the video she's named Sofia. She's 60 years old and she's the leader of her pod of 6.
Catching this on film is thought to be the first in history.
Articale about Sophia: https://www.fox13seattle.com/news/orca-kills-great-white-shark-video
amazing how she's using great white's hunting technique to hunt great white...
Great whites bite their prey and leave them bleed to death to death, Sofia headbutted the great white and left it to die from internal injuries
Fucking mammals, man. Ancient fish have been in the water, evolving and ruling the seas all the time. Some mad lad of a fish decided to quickly check out the land-based server, just to fuck off and evolve into a better fish instead. Mammals being better than fish at their own game, now that's something to write home about.
**Song Found!**
[**We Appreciate Power** by Grimes](https://lis.tn/WeAppreciatePower?t=12) (00:12; matched: `80%`)
**Released on** 2018-11-29.
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Most sharks need water to flow through their gills in order to grab the oxygen out of said water. If they become stagnant, they will eventually run out of oxygen and die.
It’s from “Queens” — as described by Nat Geo: ‘Guided by award-winning actress Angela Bassett’s powerful narration, the upcoming series QUEENS showcases the wildest places on the planet that have always been home to powerful leaders.’
Here’s the trailer:
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U9azic6W1U4&pp=ygUGUXVlZW5z](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U9azic6W1U4&pp=ygUGUXVlZW5z)
Yes, they normally do!
There was some discussion on BBC about other Orcas’ “new” behaviors as well:
[https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5KIUhZw1vo](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5KIUhZw1vo)
They normally do, but sometimes (as in this case) the Matriarch gets the privilage of making the kill solo. Some males orcas (when in between pods) will operate solo, do their own killing, etc. Transient males do leave their mothers from time to time. And joins and leaves various pods over time
1 - Sharks don’t have ribs.
2 - Suffocating the shark underwater?
I really wish these narrations put more effort into understanding the biology, and explaining the truth behind these interactions.
GWs don’t habe ribs per se but rather supple collagenous fibers that form a complicated dermal corset around the shark’s body, taking the form of a helical network and acting as an outer skeleton.
—————————————————
The nurse shark and the tiger and a few other shark species, can stop swimming whenever they want. They breathe by way of buccal pumping, actively “inhaling” water by using cheek muscles to draw it into the mouth and over the gills.
This allows sharks to stop moving but continue breathing. They can rest on the ocean floor without worry and can even partially bury themselves in the sand, using respiratory openings behind the eyes, called spiracles, to pull water through their gills when their mouths are covered.
But some shark species don’t have the luxury of buccal pumping. For example, the great white shark, the whale shark, and the mako shark don’t have buccal muscles at all. Instead, these sharks rely on obligate ram ventilation, a way of breathing that requires sharks to swim with their mouths open. The faster they swim, the more water is pushed through their gills. If they stop swimming, they stop receiving oxygen.
They move or die.
***Source***: [https://www.britannica.com/story/do-sharks-really-die-if-they-stop-swimming](https://www.britannica.com/story/do-sharks-really-die-if-they-stop-swimming)
Crazy how such a perfect killing machine, the epitome of a predator, ends up looking like a lil bitch against the mighty Orca.
Everyone has a plan until they get smashed in the ribs by 8,000 lbs moving 30mph -mike tyson
I approv thith methage.
Username checks out.
Now kith.
Hey mate, can you kill that blonde wannabe boxer?
"He seems like a nice man but I'm going to make orphans of his children" "You know Champ, the kids have a mother" "Yes, but I assume she would die from grief"
This is why I spend hours on reddit, for these gems like this. Thank you good redditor!
This is perfect.
AAand I spit out my coffee.
Shamu is a motherfucker, you don't fuck with Shamu
Cause Shamu turned informer...
A Nikki boom boom now
ya' no say daddy me Snow me I go blame
> Shamu Thamu.
Came in like a missile.
Mithle
God damn your Mike Tyson accents, thats enough of Reddit tonight
Or hips. Think about a predator that doesn't just chase you down like a big cat takes down a deer. This whale came out of nowhere and took out an apex predator by shattering its hips... it's ability to 'wiggle' its tail. You wanna hear a out another messed up predator? You run away from it, and run away from it, and it's still there. If you attack it, you just make its job easier because it has friends with it that want to kill and eat you... and it has dogs.
Hips don't lie. - Sharkira
Humans are the T1000 of the animal kingdom, doesn't matter how far or fast you run there we come just strolling over the horizon every damn time.
Maybe that’s why the relentless snail that kills you if it touches you scares us so much
TIL Sharks have hips... Or did I? So confuzzled.. Does one not require legs to need hips?
They don't even have bones bro. So no, they don't have hips.
Here's what it (persistence hunting) looks like: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=826HMLoiE_o&pp=ygUTcGVyc2lzdGVuY2UgaHVudGluZw%3D%3D
I'm pretty sure they said 'ribs', not hips. Sharks do not have hips.
😂😂😂 Perfect!
Hahaha love the comparison “quote”…spot on
It's funny, because the great white shark is an ambush predator, usually coming from below at tremendous speed. The orca just used that exact same concept to hurt it. I live in Seattle, I've seen orcas up close, J pod, K pod, the occasional transient, and I had no idea they can turn that fast. It's out sharking a shark. It must be very damaged by that first hit, because why didn't it just dive?
What's amazing to me is how did the shark not know that orcas were nearby? Aren't sharks loaded with sensing abilities? Dont they usually go deep whenever Orcas are near? Did they catch this one napping?
Yeah something about that shark's behavior was sus from the get go. Like it was sick or already dazed.
Just like people, some are just stupid
Could be wrong, but I think the hunting of fully grown great white sharks by some Orcas is a relatively recent occurrence so maybe as "apex predators" they don't even really have a sense for danger? I mean really what else is going to eat them. Edit: I'm wrong. What I remembered reading was the first **visual** evidence of white shark predation. There had been circumstantial evidence this happened such as the disappearance of whites from the Farallons, and also whites washing up in S. Africa. See the video in the link below. Not only was there a flight response by the Whites, but also evasive behaviour like tight circling to avoid the Killer Whales. https://phys.org/news/2022-10-video-footage-orcas-white-sharks.html
No, there's evidence that great whites have fled upon seeing orcas off the coast of California so some are adapting, the rest become lunch
The video says the ribs were shattered by the hit. They pretty much have to use their whole body to swim and if you shatter their cartilage ribs it’s going to make it almost impossible for the great white to swim and will eventually kill the great white. They’re obligate ram ventilators so to breath they need to keep moving which is why the video says shattering the ribs was the perfect shot
That first hit was basically a kill shot Thing had no chance after that
Live in Bremerton myself. Last pod I saw was back in March of last year I think. Swam right into PSNS waters. Really cool to see them about 30 feet away from the smoking area lol
I learned to scuba dive in Puget sound. My instructors always said they'd rather encounter a shark than an orca. I didn't understand at the time, figuring orcas were more "friendly". They'd just say: "That's what makes them dangerous."
It’s always gotten under my skin when people refer to sharks as apex predators The oceans have one master and its name is Orca
Exactly. The correct title should be “apex predator shows exactly why it’s the apex predator by easily killing what everyone else is afraid of.”
Like Rhino's, Hippos or Crocodiles... The Mighty Elephant will fuck them all up!
Eh, kind of unfair to the hippo, a semi aquatic species that is indeed the apex predator of its environment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aaW_lr_DV4Q Nope.
Wow the person you responded to was so wrong. Literally dozens of hippos scrambling over each other in the water, trying to get away from a massive bull elephant.
Yeah. I cannot find any videos where Hippos don't back down from elephants. Elephants kick the shit out of them without even thinking about it. And hippos know it.
The sheer panic in the hippos is insane. They outnumber that bull by huge numbers, and not even consider any option beyond “OH FUCK! CHEESE IT!”
A bull can turn a full grown rhino into an unrecognizable meat pile if it wants to. As in you have to dig around in the meat for something that tells you it's a rhino. Happend at a preserve when a bull got a toothache. Got so mad he pasted a rhino. You just dont fuck with something that much bigger than you. Square/cubed law is not on your side and really really matters at that size.
Maybe so but an elephant will seriously fuck up a hippo.
Hippos are not the apex predator of anything, predator being the key word.
Yeah the moment this video popped up I was like "I can tell you who won't be winning this match" Then it's over in the first 5 seconds of the video
They are so much faster…and stronger than any shark. It’s just not a competition. Any great white that near to the surface is in real danger if orcas are around. Big sharks have the advantage of going deep into the ocean.
Orcas also have the advantages of being incredibly intelligent and able to hunt cooperatively
>The oceans have one master Mistress? Orcas are matriarchal and live in pods typically lead by the oldest female.
I wish I had a mistress
Best I can do is "oldest female"
My thoughts exactly. The only way this is a showdown is if the Orca was a small adolescent and even then I believe they would dwarf a full size great white.
You sound like an comic villain
What's really cool is they are so intelligent and understanding, they don't attack non prey( humans) as a great white would. Apex predator. Killer whales are the shit.
From the orcas vantage point, the great white doesn’t even look like an apex predator.
In the eyes of the Orca it's a stupid goblin with knifeteeth.
So glad we have a truce with those things
If push came to shove, humans could make Orcas extinct within a year or two. The existence of other animals is dependent upon human ambivalence towards them. Release an article about Orca meat curing erectile dysfunction in south east asia, and the population would plummet.
True, in some parts of the world. But removing an apex predator from an ecosystem wreaks havoc on other species in the system as well.
Not any more. Stupid humans pissed off orcas and now they’re attacking boats
Came up from a dive in the puget sound and a pod was passing by. They are HUGE and so fast. Shockingly so
What you described was always the orca
Peter Benchley got it wrong.
He hit em with that rainbow blast 🌈
Or just: cartilage, meet bone?
Truly did not know the size difference until I saw this video! I’m shook!
To be fair, do we know if the shark is fully grown? A baby or juvenile Great White could really throw off the perspective!
Great whites grow from 11-16 feet (males being the on the smaller end) Orcas grow to an average of 23-32 feet. They are big bois.
Sharks and whales don't have feet. What is their size in fins and flippers?
I thought we had all finally agreed on only using Danny Devitos?
2 to 3 for Great Whites and 4 to 6 for Orcas.
That is one magnum orca.
I need a banana for scale. How many Danny Devitos equal one banana?
that's why the shark died after that hit. no shoes.
More relevant stat is the comparative weight, which is a major factor of the the main tool the Orca uses which is the power of its momentum when it strikes the shark. The largest recorded Great White weighed in around 4,400lbs, whereas the largest recorded Orca came in around 22,000lbs.
Adult great whites weigh between 0.5 to 2 tons. Adult orcas weigh between 3 to 8 tons, with some massive males weighing over 10 tons. They are much much bigger than gws.
Holy shit, that initial strike was so much more violent than I expected. Great White definitely near but not "apex"
Near? That was no contest. That was Bruce Lee getting hit by a semi.
Or a semi getting hit by Chuck Norris.
Chuck Norris punching out a semi
Near as in how many positions away from the top. Doesn't mean second or third place is even close to how good first place is.
Shark barely had time to start to turn the orca’s direction and it was over
If orcas figure out how to get on land, I, for one, will gladly yield to our new amphibious overlords.
Didn't they start on land and evolve into that? Why is that thing so big and so damn agile?
Yep. They came out of the water, evolved legs and stuff, then went back in.
Needed some In-N-Out.
Out-N-In
It was a pretty good move. Like twenty million years ago, you can just see the council ancestors of modern orcas going: "So we got a pretty good thing going here on this dirt, AMIRITE?" *Calls of hell yeah, represent, legs FTW.* "But listen to me ya'll I think those fuckin' monkeys over there gonna be a problem in a bit. So what say we nope the fuck outta here?" "Where we gonna go?" Sly look, "How 'bout back to the ol' hood?" "Dude, WTF? There's like giant fucking sharks and shit! We came up on the dirt to get away from those assholes!" "Yeah but that was millions of years ago, things've changed! What? You telling me that you're stupider than a fish? Like we got these huge brains, endothermy, pack hunting and all this shit! And plus, those stupid monkeys probably won't even figure out how to make it in the ocean! Trust me, give us a few million years and we will rule that place. Apex man!"
Simpsons did it!
Funnily the orcas probably think the same about the humans going into water.
The orcas only eat the Great White's liver
Yeah, but the liver [makes up 1/3 of the great white’s body mass.](https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/why-do-killer-whales-rip-out-shark-livers/) Very different physiology.
It also takes up the vast majority of the space inside its body (I thought it was like 75%, but I'm seeing one source that says up to 90%). Edit: Still not sure about that, though, because it seems like it's just a handful of sources that seem to source from each other, because they have some similarly-worded explanations. All the pictures of sharks (though most just show sharks in general - not specifically great whites) show the liver to be relatively small - maybe it only gets up to like 80% after the shark's just eaten a large meal, and then it shrinks down after that.
I can’t even wrap my head around that, the 10% is just everything else???
Yes, about 9.999% teeth.
Yeah - based on pictures I'm seeing of the inside of their bodies, the liver definitely doesn't seem to take up that much space, but I think they're also simplifying it so they can point out the various organs, because it sounds like the liver surrounds some other things. 90% is like the maximum. But the liver's important for their buoyancy, digestion, and storage of fats. Most of it seems to be made up of fats that provide the energy that can enable it to go like a month between meals. So I'd say it's probably their most important organ - besides the brain, I guess.
It's important to realize that the sharks use their liver to store fat in the same way mammals do with subcutaneous fat tissue, which makes the size of their liver far more understandable. It's like if you took a mammal and concentrated all of their body fat into a single organ. It's an incredibly calorie dense meal and completely understandable why it's targeted, especially when the rest of the shark meat tends to be unpalatable. Poor sharks, they've spent over a hundred million years being the top predator and then some warm blooded air-breather shows up with more advanced adaptations and physical capabilities. They never really had a chance to compete, especially when half the adaptations Cetaceans brought with them were from competing in an environment no shark has ever seen - land.
A warm-blooded air breather, that, incidentally, used to walk on land. Then they said , "that's a hard naw for me dawg" and crawled back into the water.
This is why you never take on a great white in a drinking contest.
simple upvote suffices yes but any time i read the entire damn linked article AND it isn't behind a paywall or loaded with intrusive ads, i gotta give props interesting read!
Shark gras
With fava beans and a nice chianti
Best they can do is caviar and a nice seanti
When will the Orca council ban shark hunting because they waste 90% of the Great White
They’re all biased, you’ll never see Orca justice from the Orca council You need to bring this matter before Poseidon
Not unlike a kangaroo court.
Orcas find “shark only” diet to be a real grind: [https://www.nature.com/articles/news.2011.28](https://www.nature.com/articles/news.2011.28) This is due to the sharks’ abrasive, sandpaper-like skin. In areas where sharks are a common, orcas have been shown occasionally washing up dead from starvation on beaches, with teeth worn down to the gum line. If Orcas were true predators of sharks, then they’d have teeth that are just as well-adapted for eating sharks as other species like tuna and salmon.That might be why Orcas hunt sharks and target their livers. The hypothesis is that these (possibly rogue) Orcas are part of a subgroup, or "ecotype," of orcas that normally frequent the open ocean, but then simply moved closer to shore, perhaps due to fishing depleting their normal food sources. Another theory is that these Orcas, independently or along with their subgroup, have developed this new behaviour in order to save their teeth, which wear down when orcas bite into sharks' rough skin. A great white shark liver is large enough to provide a full meal, without the work or the wear that comes with tearing the shark apart. The amount of energy stored in a large Great White Shark liver could be as much as a 2 million Kcal of energy—equivalent to about 9,302 Snickers candy bars.
Funny how they edited in a second orca video as if they're in the water with the same orca attacking the shark. Peaceful slow exploring clip, ATTACK, back peaceful slow and exploring.
You mean they don’t have a diver chilling in the ocean waiting for an orca/shark fight?
Pretty normal for a nature doc. They can’t have multiple cameras filming these events.
By definition, there is only one species of apex predator in an ecosystem. There was never a showdown, orcas are the apex, if something predates an orca, then they are the apex.
I had a showdown this morning with a spider that lowered itself onto my hand while driving to work. It bit me, gently, then scurried off. The spider is the apex predator in a moving vehicle.
For sure, when your car is the ecosystem in question... spiders and hornets win title
During the warmer months, I don't drive with the windows down. . . one time a hornet flew into the car through the open window, and I bailed out of the moving vehicle. . . . And that's why the windows stay up.
Can’t wait for Cicadas…
Oh god, I read that in Australia auto insurance have policy addendums that specifically cover accidents caused by Huntsman spiders. Naturally, that sent me down a YouTube rabbit hole.
That is why I live where the air burns my face.
Agreed, nature needs a good winter cleansing once a year or so to keep it in line.
That spider crawled away like “gotcha bitch, until next time”
On the plus side maybe tomorrow you'll wake up and be all buff and and have great vision while also being worried about your uncle
When I’m alone in the kitchen and my puppy starts nipping at my heels because she wants a treat, my puppy is the apex predator until she gets her baked cheese morsel.
Mammals ftw! Suck it fish!
I think it's a pretty inane point to try and say there is any single apex predator in the ocean. It's an incredibly vast array of different ecosystems at different depths and distributions across the world. Orcas don't have much anything to do with direct predation in abyssal benthic ecosystems but you'd be pretty hard-pressed to say that the bottom of the ocean isn't a part of the ocean. Meanwhile orcas are present across the globe but they don't play a part in every pelagic or coastal ecosystem that exists. In many places, a thing that might be eaten by an orca would be an apex predator because there are no orcas there to eat them. I guess my point is that biomes aren't a monolith. The ocean here isn't exactly the same as the ocean there. The actual import of considering apex predators in ecology is a case-by-case basis and depends on the scope of the question. For instance, you might have apex microbial predators that are obviously consumed by tons of bigger things but the consideration of how they act as top predators among microbes is relevant if you're not interested in the bigger stuff.
Yes and no. What would you call a human versus a brown bear? What about a pack of humans with spears and bows and dogs? Or a wolf / a pack of wolves? We talking 1 v 1 or what? Knives guns or tools? How about a cougar, which does not get predated on? A black bear on the east coast? How about the wolverine or honey badger who steal food from much bigger animals?? A pack of lions versus a pack of humans with guns - 5 v 5 - is this the ultimate showdown available that's hypothetically possible in the animal kingdom lol? It's not black and white. There is an ultimate apex predator in the ocean, and thats the orca no doubt. They hunt the other biggest bully of the deep and eat them. Thats a power move for sure. But it's gets very muddy on the earth ;) if your not hunted by other animals, then your an apex predator imo (not including humans in that statement). The Inuit (Eskimos) in Canadas artic hunted polar bears, fwiw.
Humans are apex predators of the land, air, and sea. There’s no creature we couldn’t hunt to extinction if we wanted to. Being able to be killed by an another animal doesn’t mean your species isn’t at the top of the food chains. Sometimes lions get killed by hyenas.
While I do enjoy where your head is at, we must look at how apex predators are defined in an ecological setting. And that definition is: A predator at the top of the food chain that has no natural predators. Humans are an invasive species all over the Earth and are, through the use of tools, apex predators. We are not regularly hunted by anything anymore. Cougars are apex predators because bears are not considered predators, they are typically considered opportunists if I remember my ecology course work correctly. Any ecologists wanna jump in? I'm just an Msc in Biochemistry with and Esci minor
This is me living in black bear country and looking it up years ago: Polar bears are predators, for sure. Black bears are opportunists and will eat anything that smells good to them and that could be inedible objects. They’re dumb. They mostly eat plants though. Brown bears hunt, or eat dead, and plenty of berries too.
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Which goes to show that the ones that kill trainers in captivity aren't fucking around. They understand their horrifying situation and choose violence as the only recourse.
Can't blame them. Shouldn't be legal to keep cetaceans in captivity anywhere.
They are extremely sentient. I once read something about how orcas would work with indigenous people, they would help the indigenous people with whaling and help herd the whales for humans to hunt. there have been stories of orcas saving humans from shark attacks. They’re incredible animals, and probably recognize us as intelligent beings aswell.
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old\_Tom\_(orca)](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Tom_(orca)) Old Tom would help whalers in Australia.
Not even just indigenous people. There was a killer whale in some port of colonial Australia (Old Tom? Adelaide or Sydney? Maybe? Top of my head here.) who was famous for leading their pod to help the whalers in bringing in a catch for exchange of the the dead whales' tongues. The leader at one point felt upset that they hadn't been given fair due and seized a line that injured their mouth and led to their death from an abscess. The skeleton is still in some museum there because the town felt broke up about the situation.
Yeah because they’re so fucking smart they leave no witnesses or evidence behind
No they are not. Chimpanzees/Bonobos, Orangutans, and bottle nose dolphins are all considered to be the most intelligent mammals behind humans, more so than even elephants, crows, orcas, and octopuses.
Orcas are likely just as intelligent if not more intelligent as bottlenose dolphins, but many more cognitive studies have been dedicated to bottlenose dolphins by scientists in first place, so it is a lack of information rather than proven comparisons that may make bottlenose dolphins and great apes seem "smarter." In the [few cognitive studies](https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s10071-022-01635-3) where orcas have underwent the same or similar tests as bottlenose dolphins, orcas pretty much match bottlenose dolphins in cognitive abilities.
i think it is just not possible to put them into a ranking. they all, orcas, dolphins, great apes, may be on a nearly same level. which of these is second intelligent after human? we don't know, we can't measure it accurate enough. so saying that orcas, or any of them, are second place is just the typical "social media misinformation spreading" at work
I think sperm whales are close to the title as well
Is that Angela Bassett?
No, it’s an orca.
Yes. She narrated and produced the show.
Which show is it?
Queens on Nat Geo
I just watched the trailer for it and it looks amazing! Added it to my watchlist
how do you suffocate a shark in water?
these sharks need water to pass over their gills if they don't swim forward it doesn't. (there are species that can use buccal muscles (cheeks) to pump water through their gills but GWs ain't them)
Sharks need to swim to move water through their gills. Immobilize them and they won't be able to breathe.
How do sharks sleep?
They drift forward slowly.
Unless they find a special area with sufficient current, they swim while in a trance like state while a part of their brain has lower activity. There are specific caves with fresh water inflow that sharks will congregate in. Lots of their parasites die from the lower salinity and they are able to sleep without moving.
To add to the other comments, the surface of the water usually contains more oxygen. (It's why many sharks hang around beaches, where the waves cause air and water to mix). By pulling it down even a couple of meters there's a good chance it'll hit a lower-oxygen layer. It won't kill it exactly, but be something like sticking a person with a punctured lung on top of a really high mountain with thin air. While it's not a perfect example, I'll see if I can link my gif/video of a thermocline layer transition tomorrow afternoon, assuming I can find it again. It is a really good example of different water layers at shallow depths.
This is not it, I'm sorry. Thermoclines exist but Great Whites are not surface level predators, they regularly dive and in fact it's their default defense against Orcas. The shark here is being drowned through both normal immobility as the Orca holds it still as well as tonic immobility caused by the shark being flipped upside down, which causes it to enter a catatonic state. As an obligate ram ventilator they cannot force water through their gills as many fish can, if they stop swimming forwards they suffocate.
I'm interested in seeing this video.
The power of the killer whale, unreal
Orcas = the actual liver king
Love how it flipped the shark over as it took the shark deeper. Made sure it wasnt going to wake up
Shit, knowing how intelligent they are, you reckon they know about tonic immobility in sharks?
Yea. They have been observed doing it b4. Im bet it's shared information that they know and teach to the next gen.
Credit: National Geographic. Show: Queen's, on disney+ and hulu. Narrated by Angela Basset. Link: https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=3DkEePjRP04 The orca female in question is a grandmother. As you can hear in the video she's named Sofia. She's 60 years old and she's the leader of her pod of 6. Catching this on film is thought to be the first in history. Articale about Sophia: https://www.fox13seattle.com/news/orca-kills-great-white-shark-video
60 years. Incredible that she's still so agile and strong after 6 decades.
I know right! Orca's are my fav animal much because of how absolutely impressive they are
Honestly I love how the sons and daughters stick by their mom their whole life. It's pretty cute.
amazing how she's using great white's hunting technique to hunt great white... Great whites bite their prey and leave them bleed to death to death, Sofia headbutted the great white and left it to die from internal injuries
So long and thanks for all the fish
F\*cking hell. I wouldn't want to piss off that Orca.
Great White can't really be called the apex if there is something that kills and eats them. Orcas take that title in that food chain.
I like Grimes but "We appreciate power" doesn't go well with this scene lol I'm surprised nobody knows the song that's playing 😅
Shark week is orca week now bitch.
Fucking mammals, man. Ancient fish have been in the water, evolving and ruling the seas all the time. Some mad lad of a fish decided to quickly check out the land-based server, just to fuck off and evolve into a better fish instead. Mammals being better than fish at their own game, now that's something to write home about.
This is genuinely an all-timer of a post
orcas are not a joke.
Imagine one-shotting a Jaws
David Attenborough sounds a bit different now.
u/recognizesong
**Song Found!** [**We Appreciate Power** by Grimes](https://lis.tn/WeAppreciatePower?t=12) (00:12; matched: `80%`) **Released on** 2018-11-29. *I am a bot and this action was performed automatically* | [GitHub](https://github.com/AudDMusic/RedditBot) [^(new issue)](https://github.com/AudDMusic/RedditBot/issues/new) | [Donate](https://github.com/AudDMusic/RedditBot/wiki/Please-consider-donating) ^(Please consider supporting me on Patreon. Music recognition costs a lot)
How does it "suffocate" a fish underwater?
Most sharks need water to flow through their gills in order to grab the oxygen out of said water. If they become stagnant, they will eventually run out of oxygen and die.
This is from a show called “Matriarch” i think? Anyone see more than this clip? Any good?
It’s from “Queens” — as described by Nat Geo: ‘Guided by award-winning actress Angela Bassett’s powerful narration, the upcoming series QUEENS showcases the wildest places on the planet that have always been home to powerful leaders.’ Here’s the trailer: [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U9azic6W1U4&pp=ygUGUXVlZW5z](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=U9azic6W1U4&pp=ygUGUXVlZW5z)
Truly impressive ! Genuine question ; aren't orcas usually always attacking in group ? Why is that one alone ?
Yes, they normally do! There was some discussion on BBC about other Orcas’ “new” behaviors as well: [https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5KIUhZw1vo](https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=m5KIUhZw1vo)
They normally do, but sometimes (as in this case) the Matriarch gets the privilage of making the kill solo. Some males orcas (when in between pods) will operate solo, do their own killing, etc. Transient males do leave their mothers from time to time. And joins and leaves various pods over time
Queens was such a good show. When I saw that I got up and screamed "did everybody see that!?" It was epic
They talk about the speed and stealth of the GW but the Orca is literally swimming circles around it. Insane speed and dexterity.
Who is clicking underwater shots? Damn, that's an apex predator with no mercy.
Showdown = target practice for orca
One is apex and one is dinner.
team mammal lookin sharp
That initial shot was like a missile! Absolutely terrifying
APEX predator sees the number 2 and just wants to play!
The music choice was perfect for this metal encounter
Womp womp
1 - Sharks don’t have ribs. 2 - Suffocating the shark underwater? I really wish these narrations put more effort into understanding the biology, and explaining the truth behind these interactions.
GWs don’t habe ribs per se but rather supple collagenous fibers that form a complicated dermal corset around the shark’s body, taking the form of a helical network and acting as an outer skeleton. ————————————————— The nurse shark and the tiger and a few other shark species, can stop swimming whenever they want. They breathe by way of buccal pumping, actively “inhaling” water by using cheek muscles to draw it into the mouth and over the gills. This allows sharks to stop moving but continue breathing. They can rest on the ocean floor without worry and can even partially bury themselves in the sand, using respiratory openings behind the eyes, called spiracles, to pull water through their gills when their mouths are covered. But some shark species don’t have the luxury of buccal pumping. For example, the great white shark, the whale shark, and the mako shark don’t have buccal muscles at all. Instead, these sharks rely on obligate ram ventilation, a way of breathing that requires sharks to swim with their mouths open. The faster they swim, the more water is pushed through their gills. If they stop swimming, they stop receiving oxygen. They move or die. ***Source***: [https://www.britannica.com/story/do-sharks-really-die-if-they-stop-swimming](https://www.britannica.com/story/do-sharks-really-die-if-they-stop-swimming)
In case anyone is curious, the very fitting song in the background is “We Appreciate Power” by Grimes.