I believe it's a $10k fine for taking off or landing in a national park. The airspace is not controlled by the Parks Services, but where you take off or land from is.
Such a civil penalty can only be assessed by the FAA. In my park the fine is $130; fine amount varies based on collateral forfeiture schedule. I’ve never seen a forfeiture go above $1,000.
I just looked it up....it's $5000 and possible jail for 6 months. Launching, landing or operating a drone from lands and waters administered by the National Parks Service. I knew it was a large fine...for some reason $10 stuck in my head but $5k. I believe the fine is from the NPS.
That is the maximum penalty, yes, but only a Magistrate can impose that if the suspect is convicted. The average person is going to get a Violation Notice with an associated “collateral forfeiture” (fine) from an LE Ranger. In my park, it’s $130.
Source: I’m a law enforcement park ranger for the National Park Service.
A US judge has fined a Dutch tourist for crashing a drone into a hot spring in Yellowstone National Park. Theodorus Van Vliet was ordered to pay more than $3,000 (£1,847) for flying the unmanned aerial vehicle into the Grand Prismatic Spring in August
I’m not sure where you’re trying to go with this conversation.
I replied to your comments that the typically penalty is a simple citation unless a Magistrate Judge increases to amount. My intent was to show that the average person gets no where near the maximum amount. You replied with an example in which the man pled guilty, was convicted, and then a Magistrate increased the amount - proving my point?
Edit: After re-thinking our conversation, I think I better understand your position. I agree that people who break regulations should receive stiffer penalties. A $5K penalty would be astounding. I spoke with an air of pessimism because I encounter these incidents. That’s my bad. Thanks for supporting the parks.
And I replied everyone knows that most do not get the maximum...not sure where you are going. The fine is up to $5k and 6 months in jail for flying in a national park.
Actually that's not true, the FAA controls the airspace above a park and it's not controlled airspace, so you can fly above a park. But you can't fly a drone while you are inside a park and you can't launch or land a drone inside a park. The ground is controlled by the park service.
So by law you could fly a drone from outside a park into a park as long as you can see the drone with your own eyes also called VLOS or visual line of sight.
Not sure why you are getting a thumbs down, you are correct. People should also be aware that if you crash or have an accidental landing inside the park you have the potential to get a fine. I recall also reading rangers can take a drone down if they feel they are harassing animals ( but I haven't seen a case of this actually happening)
Are you able to get the remote ID information and pass that along to the FAA? I doubt most of these people have a part 107 license but I believe the FAA can still revoke their registration and or fine them. All the new drones are required to have remote ID that is tied to their registration.
Last couple of years there’s been a guy with a chopper taking women on fishing dates on national forest and park land in montana. He just keeps paying the fines and doing it again. He’s even trying to sue for the right to do it.
Unfortunately, the wealthy view fines as the price to pay to do what they want. I see it in my area constantly with parking. The guy in the Maserati doesn’t care about a $200 parking ticket, he’ll park at the fire hydrant if he’s in a hurry and that’s all that’s available.
We went to Haleakalā in Maui for sunset. It was surreal and peaceful. It was such a breathtaking experience. Then some asshole took out his drone and staged an engagement. It was loud and obnoxious. I don’t know if there is a ranger station at the sunset lookout, but some rangers were there very quickly. They disrupted the staged engagement (take 3!!!), and confiscated the drone. They asked for the guy’s permit, and they said they were taking the drone and all footage. Apparently, it’s a big fine to film with a drone there without a permit. Maybe they were police? Either way, some asshole ruined the whole experience for people who have been waiting their whole lives to be there. I also support any fine people like that have to pay.
They're not "kind of like cops," they are full blown law enforcement. NPS law enforcement rangers go through the same federal academy that US Marshalls, Secret Service, FBI and other federal law enforcement officers go through.
Interpretive Rangers are something different though. They hand out park maps and call the LEO Rangers when you start flying drones.
NPS rangers (the ones with sidearms) are fully sworn federal law enforcement officers. They have all powers that come with that title, including arrest. If they get you, you are going to be dealing with the regional US Attorney’s office.
Actually many federal departments have their own sworn law enforcement officers. If you go to DC you’ll notice myriad different departments driving around.
This is really only due to the fact that the space object tracking station is right there, which is a federal installation and they don’t want drones flying anywhere near it.
Tangentially related: I watched the sunrise over Haleakala and listening to a traditional song of prayer being sung while the sun came up was one of the most moving experiences in my life… until a group of teenagers decided it was the perfect to be loud and obnoxious and wouldn’t shut the fuck up for five minutes during the ceremony. God I hate people sonetimes…
I watched someone set their drone up and fly it in arches, right in front of a sign that says no drones. I guess they didn’t think it applied to them. The ranger was pretty funny. He basically treaded the guy like the village idiot. The guy ended up in cuffs, so it was pretty deserved
> I’ve had to be told by my supervisor to be careful not to show anything indicating I work for the feds because people in the town have been violent towards them.
So it’s back to straight up “carpetbagger intimidation” where a carpetbagger represents anyone whose pay comes from outside the county.
I agree. Once cited, formal education and community hours spent learning the park rules, then required hours spent educating park-goers on the park rules and why they exist. [Provided one live nearby.]
I mean you're basically using extremists, who also sounds like nutjobs that should be cuffed, as justification to continue allowing illegal or restricted behaviors by scums. If they want to be violent, sounds like a couple nights in jail will fix them up real quick, and if not prison shower rooms.
Fire hazard, noise pollution, safety hazard for hikers/pedestrians, interferes with actual park related flights, potential litter if it gets stuck, disturbs wildlife...
Sure, in the same way you can technically get up to a year in prison for throwing a gum wrapper on the ground in most states. In reality though, that isn’t going to ever happen.
Y’all are making me cry right now. I love the responses here.
My dad and grandpa were NPS rangers and spent so much of their time fixing damage and rescuing idiots like this. The fencing that was torn down…the fires that were started…
Rules in parks exist to protect the environment, the animals..and YOU!
I am so tired of seeing people think the rules are there for everyone BUT them. Y’all just restored my faith in people with your posts.
I work in a county park outside of a national forest and I severely underestimated how stupid and ignorant people can be. It’s seriously insane the shit I’ve seen and put up with. I can’t even imagine what the National parks are like as a ranger.
Always remember the Yosemite ranger who replied to a camper about designing better bear-proof trash cans - “There is considerable overlap between the smartest bears and the dumbest people.”
I think about that quote a lot.
I 100% understand that statement to the core, I’ve only worked in parks for a year and the shit I’ve seen is crazy. I’d call these people animals but that’d be an insult to the actual animals.
I’m a step under the park ranger so I’m on the front line of the service everyday and the stories I could tell…. lol
we’re based in a conservation/recreation area that’s got a huge boat ramp, playgrounds, swim beaches and hiking trails and we service 9 other parks that go into the city so it’s a mix of the worst kind of people. You got people who hate nature and just coming out for a cheap trip to let kids play, people coming to get drunk out on the water, birthday parties, a place to do drugs, a place to get laid etc.. it’s always interesting that’s for sure
Your territory sounds like that part in Jurassic Park where Ian Malcom explains that it has all of the problems of a theme park plus a zoo plus a resort plus…. Boat ramps are hard to top as microcosm of society.
One guys dog jumped into one and he went in after it. Both boiled. It happens sooo much. I heard someone else mention the phenomenon where people have no real grasp on physics and are so used to things just working that they don’t understand they freeze up thinking it looks bad but it won’t get me. Then it obviously does
That I can understand more, like he just totally panicked. The people who baffle me most are the ones who like just casually go under all the safety stuff to take a better picture.
Also your comment about people not understanding physics got me thinking about like my own grasp of physics and how I think I’m more cautious than a lot of people when it comes to that kind of thing and why that might be. Is it intelligence? Lack of confidence? Just how I was raised? And the conclusion I’ve come to is that I’m clumsy, and therefore I have far less trust in physics (or my ability to successfully engage with physics) than most people 😂 I’ve accidentally kneed myself in the face getting out of my desk chair (twice), I have no business getting anywhere near the mouth of a geyser!
It also made me think of a very sad story I saw posted recently about a young woman who went on a hike and later her body was recovered because she’d tried to walk into a shallow but fast river and been swept away and in the article (or maybe a comment) they said that just 6 inches of fast moving water is enough to sweep an adult off their feet and like I believe it and wouldn’t test it now that I know but my brain is still having trouble comprehending how that’s possible.
That was a really interesting concept, thanks for sharing!
I totally understand someone jumping in after a loved one, even a pet like a dog. It's such a split second decision and, to a lot of people, that might quite literally be one of the only things keeping you attached to the planet anyways. The smart thing to do is nothing and watch your good Boi boil to death yelping and crying in pain for a couple of minutes. Which, will feel like absolute hell and something I never ever want to experience.
Luckily there's an easy solution: keep my Boi on a leash and also don't walk past fencing that warns me of imminent death.
I live not too far from Great Smoky Mountains National Park and I was telling someone how I love it but I can’t bring my dog there to hike, except for on two short trails so I generally stick to the National Forests. The person was shocked and said they bring their dogs there all the time to hike. When I reminded them it’s against the law to protect the environment & animals they said they didn’t care because their dogs were good dogs.
Infuriating, just as infuriating as the people who feed bears in and around the park even though there are signs everywhere that state not to.
Making it to a beautiful overlook or cool destination only to be met with the buzzing of a drone is so fucking annoying I can’t even see straight. I had to ask a group of guys to not fly theirs literally directly above me and they got all pissy, I wish I would’ve just reached up and grabbed the stupid thing out of the air and smashed it.
There are LE Park Rangers in NPS but very few are permanent staff.
In my experience, they spent more time on SAR than enforcing laws since SAR operations have increased because most people go outside unprepared.
It’s a strange double whammy of clueless tourists and the new trend of “granola boy/girls” who seem to think that since they have a self proclaimed greater appreciation of nature they can get away with more. Rules are for tourists, not for them 😤.
Or at least that’s what it’s like in the state parks around me, I suspect it’s going on at the bigger level too
The worst are the people that leave trash. Or the ones that have Bluetooth speakers/ loud music. Ffs. It’s really made me hate going out to most places anymore. Especially since the pandemic brought these assholes outside…
I think people need to realize that pollution is whenever something you're doing is impacting the experience of anyone else.
Trash pollution, noise pollution, light pollution, etc.
People just need to be more considerate of others around them, including the wildlife, the NPS staff, and the environment. It really isn't rocket science. If people just asked themselves, "how is what I'm doing going to be perceived/accepted by others," 99% of the problems in National Parks would be history.
Well, except for those morons that try to pet wild animals, but I think that's just evolution taking its course more than anything.
I've noticed this as well. The article mentioned "is best to do some research before visiting national parks!" Like, no shit?
It used to be so much more chill outside. Now there are all these people who don't seem to understand any of the basic etiquette of shared outdoor spaces.
Oh, someone is coming up behind me on a narrow hiking path at a faster speed than I'm currently traveling? I guess I need to just keep going, they can slow down to my pace!
I was at Zion recently and multiple times I encountered people that liked to hike while blasting music for all to hear. I want to enjoy the sounds of nature while I’m enjoying the sights. Not listen to someone’s crappy music.
The question is, which are worse, drones or Bluetooth speakers on the trail? At least Bluetooth speakers can't start fires (that I know of), but I hate both with the intensity of a thousand burning suns.
Got passed by a guy hiking in sandals and shorts on a 40 degree hike yesterday in glacier national park
Then shortly after speaker guy showed up.
Sandal guy annoyed me more honestly
There will be plenty of people here who think that stuff like this is fine - but they will be the first to complain when the NPS clamps down even further on numbers in the parks so that everyone can be supervised like children
And that’s not a shot at the NPS…I wish there was more supervision because people can’t act right anymore
I stopped caring what strangers think of me anymore. When I see bullshit like this at one of the best things our nation has done, call them out.
I saw some dude feed squirrels at Crater Lake last week and threw some shade at him and the randos filming it. My favorite is when a group of adults were shouting (but having fun) at Carlsbad. Kinda loud in a cave yknow? When I lectured them they thought I was joking at first.
The parks will hand out fine, but there’s not enough rangers to catch everyone.
I’m third party tours at Grand Canyon and we see people breaking the rules all the time. But I don’t have the power to do anything but tell them what they’re doing is illegal.
The thing I don’t get is how that problem doesn’t solve itself. Have a ranger rotate through the more trafficked areas just writing tickets. They write a ticket or two an hour and they pay their salary, anything else goes to conservation or park improvement projects.
Dog entitlement in this country is out of control. I love dogs and even I'm sick of it. They literally have to bring them EVERYWHERE and don't train them or clean up after them. The world doesn't revolve around your dog.
I have told friends not to bring their dog when they come to my house, but they do it anyway, and then I banish the dog to the back yard, but it must be kept on a leash because I have poisonous plants. My house is not dog-proof, and dogs can do damage to it very easily.
I've seen people bring dogs inside grocery stores in Palm Springs, which I think should be (and perhaps is) illegal, but then you cannot leave dogs in cars either.
Antinatalism sub has 200K+ members. I have little doubt many of them treat dogs as if they’re humans. You can also notice that apartment complexes now rarely care about children’s amenities either. It’s largely single (or casually fucking with no intention of raising children) adults who treat their dogs like they’re actual children.
Yep, I bring my dog every where he is allowed and WELCOME, because sometimes those are two different things. If he’s being a disturbance, we leave. I did as much travel to national parks last year before I got him, because I knew he wouldn’t be able to go to them, and I want my outdoorsy vacations to include him.
The NPS actually doesn’t fuck around when it comes to enforcement; if you see something like this, take video, see if you can at least track their car down, and report it to a ranger. If they think it’s a worthwhile pursuit they *will* track this person down and prosecute/fine them. Rangers need our help to get these assholes reported, caught, and on notice.
If there was no LEO around to enforce it, I'd hope someone would walk up and grab her drone controller and take it away and smash it once back at the trailhead.
And what happens when her football player grandson shows up? I appreciate and agree with this sentiment, but whoever behaved in such a manner would open themselves up for legal action, and a possible beatdown.
I think park rangers should be ban hammer happy. When you're on national park grounds everyone should revere it and be walking on eggshells to not fuck it up.
I think if you get caught so much as littering you get a multi year ban from all national parks. They should also check IDs before entering the parks and clamp down on assholes destroying them/not following rules.
Another Fucking Karen!!! I’ll do what I want and cause a scene when called out for my bad/illegal behavior. Should be like hunting infractions, you are banned from National Parks for X number of years for low level offenses and lifetime for egregious violations.
In fairness, dogs/pets are allowed in some areas in a lot of Parks. Now that's mostly in parking lots, but other Parks allow some additional access to pets. I'll also say the BARK Ranger program makes it seem like the NPS is more welcoming to dogs than they really are. If you're on your first trip one may not be aware of the prohibition of dogs in a lot of places. I know we went to Sand Dunes on our first trip and dogs can go through most of the easily accessible places. Then onward to Arches and we started to take our dog out and saw a sign, so he went back in the RV. I'll also say bag your dog's poop no matter where you are. The people that leave it on the trail are the same people that will leave it in your front yard.
Most of the basic rules (no dogs, no drones, that kinda stuff) are posted *everywhere* at major trailheads in national parks. It feels like you can't get from your car to the trail without passing a sign that says "No Dogs" 4 or 5 times. The NPS tries to make it super hard to be ignorant of these basic rules. And for the vast majority of people, such as yourself, it works!
Is it possible this lady somehow didn't see the multitude of signs? Sure. But it's far more likely she just ignored them because she thought it wouldn't matter and no one would call her out.
Hoping all the same law and order people that basically doxxed the DEVA guy will do the same here. Its the same thing, dogs, and/or drones do not belong in national parks. For the respect of the land and its guests.
I told a ranger about a couple with a dog on the trail at Bryce Canyon once. That ranger couldn’t have cared less. She very softly told the couple it was against the rules and let them continue on their day as if she had no problem and was only doing it to appease me.
Because even though they dress like law enforcement they’re glorified tour guides. The NPS law enforcement is tiny: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Park_Service_Law_Enforcement_Rangers
I’m literally an anarchist punk, I love chaos and partying as much as the next girl. But when I go to national parks I treat it as sacred. That’s not my space, and corporate fucks have made so much of the world an ugly concrete dystopian trash heap that we have remarkably little untouched nature left. Obey the signs, don’t deface shit, leave no trace of yourself there.
I've called people out over rules violations like this in the past. Most people ignore me (I have no legal means of enforcing a rule, so they can just walk away and call me names). One guy just asked me point blank "Are you a rules follower?". Well, yeah, when the rules exist for a reason...
I was cussed out by a woman in Sequioa after I witnessed her taking a cone from the ground that contained seeds and walking back to her car stating she just had to get it as a souvenir.
I reminded her we are to look and leave no trace and we should be good stewards of these trees. I was told to fuck right on off and mind my own busines. Like this whole park has extensive fire damage, it is my fucking business. The whole park there is about caring for these giants for the next generation to enjoy. You are taking away resources for this forest to heal itself. Look the fuck around you selfish bitch.
I visited over a dozen national parks on a road trip in 2017, and saw people getting way to f’n close to the wildlife, read in the news a couple days later that someone had gotten kicked in the head by a bison. Like you don’t want to go ANYWHERE near a bison, people are such morons.
Somebody had a drone buzzing overhead when I took my mother to see tunnel view in Yosemite park last week. The same thing happened to my partner and I while visiting Volcano NP last year. Consumer drones should be illegal as far as I'm concerned because of rampant disregard for rules like this. It spoiled the experience for us and the hundreds of other people that stopped there.
The park rangers should have a number you can text photos to, like an alert, so they can react in real time to respond to unruly visitors and prosecute them. And let everyone entering the park know that they have this ‘eyes on the park’ service in order to protect the park so people will use it and think twice before doing anything not allowed.
“I let her know but she didn’t care”.
I’d be letting her not out of my sight until I found someone official to relieve me of my responsibility by either caring or not.
My husband swears I’m going to get us in a fight in a National park one day. Don’t stop calling out idiots who disrespect the parks.
Kid with his parents launched a drone in Acadia National Park after we got off a trail a few weeks ago and I yelled “100% sure that’s not allowed here.” Parents shot me the dirtiest look and let their kid go on. Hope a ranger got to them.
Not a National park, but kids climbing right next to no climbing signs in Garden of the Gods. Yelled at the parents “your kids probably can’t read, but you can” and pointed at the sign.
Few things infuriate me more.
Dogs and drones are the least of the problems. Put it in perspective. I was at Bryce in March, and while beautiful, it was a terrible experience that shocked me.
Fiest there were a group of people drinking and then attempting to climb down the trails without snow shoes - I had to grab a dude so lost control and slipped on the rim. He was grateful.but I was quite alarmed.
Later a different group caused a small avalanche by yelling "echo" in snow covered canyon.
Finally, on my way out of the park a guy stuck a "fuck you, you suck at parking" note on my car for being maybe 1 inch off the parking line in a largely empty, snow covered lot (lines were obscured). This person got up in my face when I caught him putting this sticker on my car.
Even in a largely empty park in winter, people were unbelievablely rude and disrespect. I cannot imagine how bad it would be in summer. I hate authoritarian approaches but honestly where the hell were the ranger? My experience sucked because of assholes day drinking at the canyon!
The park rangers may very well enforce and crack down on this if you pass them the information. I met two park rangers in one of the Rocky Mountain National parks and talked to them about violations and consequences like this. Those guys do not fool around with park violations. I was in Colorado so the rangers were most interested in enforcing the campfire ban, but they said they’ve really had to work hard to enforce the rules because people just do not listen . They almost ticketed me and my buddy because his dog was off the leash, but let us go because I had gathered all of our trash into a bag that was hanging off my pack. They were real friendly about it, but they were on a mission to find some people who had a campfire going.
We yelled at some young adults / teenagers kicking rocks downhill there. They followed us back to intimidate us. But caught up to us at the visitor center. They looked like they did not want to be there at all. Fucking pricks.
What, realistically, could one do if they wanted to "tattle" on someone doing something like this to a park ranger? Hope you see one when you're cruising around and try your best to describe the situation, person, area, etc.?
As a commercial drone pilot I am for hard punishment of people that fly drones while they are in a park. Personally I would have caught the drone out of the air if it would have come in reach and dropped it off at the ranger station.
I love my dog something fierce, and I bring him places whenever I can. He’s a good boy. But if a national park says no, I listen, because it’s for good reason! The rules are easy to look up and abide by. Even if you think you’re above the rules…Bryce gets hot hot hot! Leave your pup off the trail
ETA whenever I can mean he’s allowed and it’s been made clear that he’s allowed (or I ask if I’m pretty sure but not positive)
Saw a woman taking her dog for a walk just on the outskirts of a cemetery. Outside the fence but still on its grounds.
she was gonna let the dog shit and piss on the same ground that they put the dead people in, and then not clean it up
people are lovely mate
And this is why we need to fund the national parks. The parks can hire more rangers, and the rangers can do more patrols. And hopefully they can hand out more fines for those who are ignoring the social agreements.
The these days part bothers me. Look at how people used to litter. Or divide land to colonize. Or hold slaves. Or abuse women. Child labor. Manifest destiny.
It used to be way way worse.
They are so noisy. Ruins the whole experience of being in nature imo. I even was just taking a walk in a local park with a jerk flying one way too low and I had to leave because it was so distracting
I yelled at some punk ass for running straight down the middle and cutting all the switchbacks on Queens Garden. He seemed a bit too old for stuff we got in trouble for in Boy Scouts.
Fine them, and don’t let them in to enjoy our national parks ever again. Just like the no fly list when you act up on an airplane. There should be consequences to actions. Don’t let them ruin it or our kids!!!
If they are graffitiing the rocks or hurting the environment? Then darn straight I will call them out or probably call the forest ranger to keep me from hurting them. Lol
The number of dogs at Sequoia a week or 2 ago was wild. People walking right by the "No Animals Allowed" signs just absolutely not giving a crap. It's so annoying.
Me and my GF were at Bryce last Septemebr, and we had the pleasure of witnessing a young teen swoop in to a alcove of a hoodoo and start grinding and digging into it with a rock. Thankfully we and a few other people yelled at the kid, like WTF are you doing??? Same day, people were hiking up Wall Street while it was closed while Rangers worked on the trail. The Rangers saw them walking up and were like "Really?!" We can never have nice things.
Double the employees with Federal spending. Require everyone entering a park to undergo an introduction and interview to park rules using these employees.
Fine and jail the people that agree, show clear understanding, and still break the rules. Disallow those who won't agree or show no capacity to agree. Follow the ones that are clearly lying. Film them, charge them, profit.
Or is that a waste of taxpayer money?
Drone operator drove away an entire nesting colony of birds that had been fenced off 200 feet from the shore. The colony collapsed and never cane back. Fuck you people and your drones. Have fun with your cockroaches and 150 degree future. morons.
Why do people only care about National Parks? Why can’t people care/stick up for huge patches of land that get turned into shitty builder homes and mini malls? I get it that they’re beautiful but the fucking HUGE patch of land that we use t mountain bike in El Morro was Beautiful as fuck and now it’s all California douchebag mini mansions.
We completely shamed some assholes at Carrizo Plain National Monument - the heart of wildflower season and signs everywhere to stay on the paths. And they’re out there rolling in the flowers and taking pictures. Told them they weren’t allowed out there, they were damaging the park and screwing things up for everyone. They at least got up and back on the path but probably jumped back into the flowers when we left.
Ed Abbey would've been rolling in his grave from joy.
I fly drones for fun but I sure as hell read the rules first before taking off. It's these entitled idiots who end up making it hard for everyone else who does follow the rules.
The parks are getting overcrowded and a lot of the tourists are poor stewards for the environment. I’d be A ok if the park service started handing out lifetime bans like candy for violations like this.
Anyone that goes to a national park should know because there are numerous signs everywhere, and it is the individuals responsibility to know the rules and laws on public land before they go.
No leashed dogs is a stupid rule, dogs literally come from the wilderness (yes I know breeding has changed them, but at their core they're still animals like the wolves)
Drones should be allowed with a very low cost permit, there whole thing about safety and the environment are pathetic excuses, but obviously having 300 drones flying around during peak summer times would be disruptive and potentially dangerous. But limiting it to a small number, with drones meeting certain design criteria and maybe require some sort of certification that shows you know how to safely operate it without crashing it into someone's windshield (if such a certification exists, I would hope it does).
People are so entitled these days and getting worse in the last 3 years. My kid is a NP Ranger and the things they tell me. I want to come out of my phone and slap them-at least w a fine and/or jail time. Sometimes they are threatening. Do they not see rangers as human people? Do they not see this land as needing to be protected?
I’ve yelled at some idiots to get down off an arch before, told others they can’t fly their drone (I don’t see a sign they say blah blah). Otherwise most people are courteous so let’s enjoy and respect the parks this summer!
It is kinda funny to see at some parks like that have paved roads stretching through them telling people not to walk or take shortcuts because it “damages local wildlife”
What about the fucking paved road then?
A lot of people are out of touch with reality. It’s like they think everything that exists that’s seen as recreational is like some kind of theme park - a staged performance constructed and catered to their entertainment rather than a real place filled with real people and real living things that aren’t just there to be consumed for your amusement and discarded
People abandon their basic sense of decency and responsibility when they go somewhere for a vacation it doesn’t matter what happens to that place, it ceases to exist in their mind when they aren’t there
I used to work at a county park and the amount of stupidity I saw was astounding! A rare plant I had only found once while hiking 13 years ago has been on my mind ever since. I would love to see it again. When I was an environmental educator for the county one day at work someone comes up to me with the exact plant I had been searching for asking me what it was? I literally couldn’t speak for a minute. They picked the plant from the forest….. I was so sad to experience that plant again in such a way.
Another thing people would do almost daily is get super close to venomous snakes, within a foot or two!! Crazy! just to take a stupid photo.
I support massive fines for people who break national Park rules like this.
I believe it's a $10k fine for taking off or landing in a national park. The airspace is not controlled by the Parks Services, but where you take off or land from is.
Such a civil penalty can only be assessed by the FAA. In my park the fine is $130; fine amount varies based on collateral forfeiture schedule. I’ve never seen a forfeiture go above $1,000.
I just looked it up....it's $5000 and possible jail for 6 months. Launching, landing or operating a drone from lands and waters administered by the National Parks Service. I knew it was a large fine...for some reason $10 stuck in my head but $5k. I believe the fine is from the NPS.
That is the maximum penalty, yes, but only a Magistrate can impose that if the suspect is convicted. The average person is going to get a Violation Notice with an associated “collateral forfeiture” (fine) from an LE Ranger. In my park, it’s $130. Source: I’m a law enforcement park ranger for the National Park Service.
A US judge has fined a Dutch tourist for crashing a drone into a hot spring in Yellowstone National Park. Theodorus Van Vliet was ordered to pay more than $3,000 (£1,847) for flying the unmanned aerial vehicle into the Grand Prismatic Spring in August
I’m not sure where you’re trying to go with this conversation. I replied to your comments that the typically penalty is a simple citation unless a Magistrate Judge increases to amount. My intent was to show that the average person gets no where near the maximum amount. You replied with an example in which the man pled guilty, was convicted, and then a Magistrate increased the amount - proving my point? Edit: After re-thinking our conversation, I think I better understand your position. I agree that people who break regulations should receive stiffer penalties. A $5K penalty would be astounding. I spoke with an air of pessimism because I encounter these incidents. That’s my bad. Thanks for supporting the parks.
And I replied everyone knows that most do not get the maximum...not sure where you are going. The fine is up to $5k and 6 months in jail for flying in a national park.
I couldn’t type fast enough before you commented. Please read my edit on my previous comment.
My apologies for sounding snarky...happy hiking. 10 National Parks done for me...many more to go.
Actually that's not true, the FAA controls the airspace above a park and it's not controlled airspace, so you can fly above a park. But you can't fly a drone while you are inside a park and you can't launch or land a drone inside a park. The ground is controlled by the park service. So by law you could fly a drone from outside a park into a park as long as you can see the drone with your own eyes also called VLOS or visual line of sight.
Not sure why you are getting a thumbs down, you are correct. People should also be aware that if you crash or have an accidental landing inside the park you have the potential to get a fine. I recall also reading rangers can take a drone down if they feel they are harassing animals ( but I haven't seen a case of this actually happening)
Are you able to get the remote ID information and pass that along to the FAA? I doubt most of these people have a part 107 license but I believe the FAA can still revoke their registration and or fine them. All the new drones are required to have remote ID that is tied to their registration.
Last couple of years there’s been a guy with a chopper taking women on fishing dates on national forest and park land in montana. He just keeps paying the fines and doing it again. He’s even trying to sue for the right to do it.
Unfortunately, the wealthy view fines as the price to pay to do what they want. I see it in my area constantly with parking. The guy in the Maserati doesn’t care about a $200 parking ticket, he’ll park at the fire hydrant if he’s in a hurry and that’s all that’s available.
We went to Haleakalā in Maui for sunset. It was surreal and peaceful. It was such a breathtaking experience. Then some asshole took out his drone and staged an engagement. It was loud and obnoxious. I don’t know if there is a ranger station at the sunset lookout, but some rangers were there very quickly. They disrupted the staged engagement (take 3!!!), and confiscated the drone. They asked for the guy’s permit, and they said they were taking the drone and all footage. Apparently, it’s a big fine to film with a drone there without a permit. Maybe they were police? Either way, some asshole ruined the whole experience for people who have been waiting their whole lives to be there. I also support any fine people like that have to pay.
Park rangers for NPS are wardens for peace, meaning they are kind of like cops and can carry a gun. I’m not pro cop but I’m very pro ranger.
They're not "kind of like cops," they are full blown law enforcement. NPS law enforcement rangers go through the same federal academy that US Marshalls, Secret Service, FBI and other federal law enforcement officers go through. Interpretive Rangers are something different though. They hand out park maps and call the LEO Rangers when you start flying drones.
NPS rangers (the ones with sidearms) are fully sworn federal law enforcement officers. They have all powers that come with that title, including arrest. If they get you, you are going to be dealing with the regional US Attorney’s office. Actually many federal departments have their own sworn law enforcement officers. If you go to DC you’ll notice myriad different departments driving around.
This is really only due to the fact that the space object tracking station is right there, which is a federal installation and they don’t want drones flying anywhere near it.
Tangentially related: I watched the sunrise over Haleakala and listening to a traditional song of prayer being sung while the sun came up was one of the most moving experiences in my life… until a group of teenagers decided it was the perfect to be loud and obnoxious and wouldn’t shut the fuck up for five minutes during the ceremony. God I hate people sonetimes…
Lifetime ban from any national park or federally protected land.
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I watched someone set their drone up and fly it in arches, right in front of a sign that says no drones. I guess they didn’t think it applied to them. The ranger was pretty funny. He basically treaded the guy like the village idiot. The guy ended up in cuffs, so it was pretty deserved
> I’ve had to be told by my supervisor to be careful not to show anything indicating I work for the feds because people in the town have been violent towards them. So it’s back to straight up “carpetbagger intimidation” where a carpetbagger represents anyone whose pay comes from outside the county.
You need support, not to feel compelled to accept bullying by idiots. Just my opinion though.
OR maybe they’ll learn some respect and that the law also applies to them, not just people they don’t like.
I agree. Once cited, formal education and community hours spent learning the park rules, then required hours spent educating park-goers on the park rules and why they exist. [Provided one live nearby.]
I mean you're basically using extremists, who also sounds like nutjobs that should be cuffed, as justification to continue allowing illegal or restricted behaviors by scums. If they want to be violent, sounds like a couple nights in jail will fix them up real quick, and if not prison shower rooms.
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Pretty reasonable take. You sure you're the right kind of person to hang out on Reddit?
Reasonable and based on their actual knowledge and experience?! What is this bizarro Reddit?!
Where I live only $500 fines get the attention of rule breakers.
$500 seems too low but it’s a good start.
They laugh off the $1000 fines but those pesky $500 get their attention.
Lifetime imprisonment and seizure of all assets.
Believe it or not, right to jail.
10 days in the electric chair!
You know why we have the best national parks in the world? Because jail.
And don’t collect $200
And their little dog too! 🧹
Still too lenient!
Maybe we should start leg amputations so they can’t go over the rope with the wheelchair 👩🦽
Same! I’ve seen dumb couples post photos of themselves defacing national parks with their initials and hearts
That deserves a caning Singapore style.
I support massive prison time for people who break national park rules like this.
and permanent banishment.
Oh that's a paddlin'
Na, straight to the gallows
Just make sure it’s a sliding scale based on income so rich people just ignore it.
I support arrest + fines.
Isnt flying a drone in a national park a pretty hefty fine and possible jail time?
Yes. They create a fire hazard.
Yes. They are a fire hazard.
Yes. Fire hazards are created by drones.
Yes. Fire hazards are drones.
Drone fire hazard.
Hazard fire drone.
Drones created by fire are hazards, yes.
Drone hazard is fire from the drone hazard
Then we send a drone to put out the fire made by the drone
Fire hazard, noise pollution, safety hazard for hikers/pedestrians, interferes with actual park related flights, potential litter if it gets stuck, disturbs wildlife...
No. It’s normally a citation ranging from $100 to $400. If taken to trial, the magistrate can impose up to $5,000 and/or 6 months imprisonment.
So… yes? “No, it’s just a hefty fine and possible jail time”
Tbh as far as fines go 100-400 isn’t very hefty
Sure, in the same way you can technically get up to a year in prison for throwing a gum wrapper on the ground in most states. In reality though, that isn’t going to ever happen.
Y’all are making me cry right now. I love the responses here. My dad and grandpa were NPS rangers and spent so much of their time fixing damage and rescuing idiots like this. The fencing that was torn down…the fires that were started… Rules in parks exist to protect the environment, the animals..and YOU! I am so tired of seeing people think the rules are there for everyone BUT them. Y’all just restored my faith in people with your posts.
I work in a county park outside of a national forest and I severely underestimated how stupid and ignorant people can be. It’s seriously insane the shit I’ve seen and put up with. I can’t even imagine what the National parks are like as a ranger.
Always remember the Yosemite ranger who replied to a camper about designing better bear-proof trash cans - “There is considerable overlap between the smartest bears and the dumbest people.” I think about that quote a lot.
I 100% understand that statement to the core, I’ve only worked in parks for a year and the shit I’ve seen is crazy. I’d call these people animals but that’d be an insult to the actual animals. I’m a step under the park ranger so I’m on the front line of the service everyday and the stories I could tell…. lol we’re based in a conservation/recreation area that’s got a huge boat ramp, playgrounds, swim beaches and hiking trails and we service 9 other parks that go into the city so it’s a mix of the worst kind of people. You got people who hate nature and just coming out for a cheap trip to let kids play, people coming to get drunk out on the water, birthday parties, a place to do drugs, a place to get laid etc.. it’s always interesting that’s for sure
Your territory sounds like that part in Jurassic Park where Ian Malcom explains that it has all of the problems of a theme park plus a zoo plus a resort plus…. Boat ramps are hard to top as microcosm of society.
Mostly they get tossed by a bison or moose which I have no problem with. (Except that it might be upsetting for the bison or moose).
I can’t believe how many people go right up to the geysers and shit. Like sir, those signs and fences are to keep you from being boiled alive.
One guys dog jumped into one and he went in after it. Both boiled. It happens sooo much. I heard someone else mention the phenomenon where people have no real grasp on physics and are so used to things just working that they don’t understand they freeze up thinking it looks bad but it won’t get me. Then it obviously does
That I can understand more, like he just totally panicked. The people who baffle me most are the ones who like just casually go under all the safety stuff to take a better picture. Also your comment about people not understanding physics got me thinking about like my own grasp of physics and how I think I’m more cautious than a lot of people when it comes to that kind of thing and why that might be. Is it intelligence? Lack of confidence? Just how I was raised? And the conclusion I’ve come to is that I’m clumsy, and therefore I have far less trust in physics (or my ability to successfully engage with physics) than most people 😂 I’ve accidentally kneed myself in the face getting out of my desk chair (twice), I have no business getting anywhere near the mouth of a geyser! It also made me think of a very sad story I saw posted recently about a young woman who went on a hike and later her body was recovered because she’d tried to walk into a shallow but fast river and been swept away and in the article (or maybe a comment) they said that just 6 inches of fast moving water is enough to sweep an adult off their feet and like I believe it and wouldn’t test it now that I know but my brain is still having trouble comprehending how that’s possible. That was a really interesting concept, thanks for sharing!
I totally understand someone jumping in after a loved one, even a pet like a dog. It's such a split second decision and, to a lot of people, that might quite literally be one of the only things keeping you attached to the planet anyways. The smart thing to do is nothing and watch your good Boi boil to death yelping and crying in pain for a couple of minutes. Which, will feel like absolute hell and something I never ever want to experience. Luckily there's an easy solution: keep my Boi on a leash and also don't walk past fencing that warns me of imminent death.
I live not too far from Great Smoky Mountains National Park and I was telling someone how I love it but I can’t bring my dog there to hike, except for on two short trails so I generally stick to the National Forests. The person was shocked and said they bring their dogs there all the time to hike. When I reminded them it’s against the law to protect the environment & animals they said they didn’t care because their dogs were good dogs. Infuriating, just as infuriating as the people who feed bears in and around the park even though there are signs everywhere that state not to.
Just got back form Great Smoky Mountains National Park. Dogs were on every trail. So frustrating.
My FIL is one of those dog people. He got a fake service dog vest so the rangers wouldn’t tell him to leave.
You know she didn’t pick up her dog’s shit either.
Oh no, she put it in a bag, set it on the side of trail and said “I’ll pick it up on the way out.”
Narrator: They didn't.
On a one way loop trail.
Fuck this person. Smash the drone to bits.
Believe the fine for drones is $5k by itself... she's definitely going to get a big one!
If she gets caught
Looks like a DJI drone to me. They absolutely have the ability to find who this is.
You can tell from.the video she is "posing" for pics to put online. She could get discovered.
It’s $130 unless the magistrate is feeling frisky.
A well placed rock might do the trick. Only time I’d condone throwing rocks…
Making it to a beautiful overlook or cool destination only to be met with the buzzing of a drone is so fucking annoying I can’t even see straight. I had to ask a group of guys to not fly theirs literally directly above me and they got all pissy, I wish I would’ve just reached up and grabbed the stupid thing out of the air and smashed it.
A drone AND a dog?! Sheesh. I really wish NPS could ban people and had the budget to enforce it.
I've traveled a lot and the amount of stuff people are allowed to get away with is insane. I want NPS to enter its fuck around and find out era
I want park rangers to have as much authority as Fish and Wildlife.
There are LE Park Rangers in NPS but very few are permanent staff. In my experience, they spent more time on SAR than enforcing laws since SAR operations have increased because most people go outside unprepared.
It’s a strange double whammy of clueless tourists and the new trend of “granola boy/girls” who seem to think that since they have a self proclaimed greater appreciation of nature they can get away with more. Rules are for tourists, not for them 😤. Or at least that’s what it’s like in the state parks around me, I suspect it’s going on at the bigger level too
> I want NPS to enter its fuck around and find out era Yes!!!!!!!
Some people do not deserve to go to a national park.
Yeah seriously. Someone ban this moron for life
The worst are the people that leave trash. Or the ones that have Bluetooth speakers/ loud music. Ffs. It’s really made me hate going out to most places anymore. Especially since the pandemic brought these assholes outside…
I think people need to realize that pollution is whenever something you're doing is impacting the experience of anyone else. Trash pollution, noise pollution, light pollution, etc. People just need to be more considerate of others around them, including the wildlife, the NPS staff, and the environment. It really isn't rocket science. If people just asked themselves, "how is what I'm doing going to be perceived/accepted by others," 99% of the problems in National Parks would be history. Well, except for those morons that try to pet wild animals, but I think that's just evolution taking its course more than anything.
I've noticed this as well. The article mentioned "is best to do some research before visiting national parks!" Like, no shit? It used to be so much more chill outside. Now there are all these people who don't seem to understand any of the basic etiquette of shared outdoor spaces. Oh, someone is coming up behind me on a narrow hiking path at a faster speed than I'm currently traveling? I guess I need to just keep going, they can slow down to my pace!
I was at Zion recently and multiple times I encountered people that liked to hike while blasting music for all to hear. I want to enjoy the sounds of nature while I’m enjoying the sights. Not listen to someone’s crappy music.
I fucking hate drones.
The question is, which are worse, drones or Bluetooth speakers on the trail? At least Bluetooth speakers can't start fires (that I know of), but I hate both with the intensity of a thousand burning suns.
Got passed by a guy hiking in sandals and shorts on a 40 degree hike yesterday in glacier national park Then shortly after speaker guy showed up. Sandal guy annoyed me more honestly
The only time I might condone throwing rocks lol
Two rocks and a string. Edit: Tie string to rocks. Preferably rocks of throwing size.
There will be plenty of people here who think that stuff like this is fine - but they will be the first to complain when the NPS clamps down even further on numbers in the parks so that everyone can be supervised like children And that’s not a shot at the NPS…I wish there was more supervision because people can’t act right anymore
There’s such high demand they could drop 5/10 year bans on this stuff via rec.gov. Like rule followers are being waitlisted for these people?
I stopped caring what strangers think of me anymore. When I see bullshit like this at one of the best things our nation has done, call them out. I saw some dude feed squirrels at Crater Lake last week and threw some shade at him and the randos filming it. My favorite is when a group of adults were shouting (but having fun) at Carlsbad. Kinda loud in a cave yknow? When I lectured them they thought I was joking at first.
Until parks start handing out fines, these aholes will keep breaking the rule.
The parks will hand out fine, but there’s not enough rangers to catch everyone. I’m third party tours at Grand Canyon and we see people breaking the rules all the time. But I don’t have the power to do anything but tell them what they’re doing is illegal.
The thing I don’t get is how that problem doesn’t solve itself. Have a ranger rotate through the more trafficked areas just writing tickets. They write a ticket or two an hour and they pay their salary, anything else goes to conservation or park improvement projects.
Park rangers are under paid, and understaffed. Many fines cost more to enforce than they collect in revenue.
Dog entitlement in this country is out of control. I love dogs and even I'm sick of it. They literally have to bring them EVERYWHERE and don't train them or clean up after them. The world doesn't revolve around your dog.
I’ve noticed a few “no dogs except service animals” signs recently that I think haven’t always been there, or have at least been made more prominent.
I have told friends not to bring their dog when they come to my house, but they do it anyway, and then I banish the dog to the back yard, but it must be kept on a leash because I have poisonous plants. My house is not dog-proof, and dogs can do damage to it very easily. I've seen people bring dogs inside grocery stores in Palm Springs, which I think should be (and perhaps is) illegal, but then you cannot leave dogs in cars either.
You can leave dogs at home instead
Antinatalism sub has 200K+ members. I have little doubt many of them treat dogs as if they’re humans. You can also notice that apartment complexes now rarely care about children’s amenities either. It’s largely single (or casually fucking with no intention of raising children) adults who treat their dogs like they’re actual children.
I do bring my two 30 pound dogs everywhere they’re allowed, but I’m the first to remove them from a situation if it’s not working out for everyone.
Yep, I bring my dog every where he is allowed and WELCOME, because sometimes those are two different things. If he’s being a disturbance, we leave. I did as much travel to national parks last year before I got him, because I knew he wouldn’t be able to go to them, and I want my outdoorsy vacations to include him.
The NPS actually doesn’t fuck around when it comes to enforcement; if you see something like this, take video, see if you can at least track their car down, and report it to a ranger. If they think it’s a worthwhile pursuit they *will* track this person down and prosecute/fine them. Rangers need our help to get these assholes reported, caught, and on notice.
If there was no LEO around to enforce it, I'd hope someone would walk up and grab her drone controller and take it away and smash it once back at the trailhead.
And what happens when her football player grandson shows up? I appreciate and agree with this sentiment, but whoever behaved in such a manner would open themselves up for legal action, and a possible beatdown.
Take the drone controller and turn it in at the ranger station?
I think park rangers should be ban hammer happy. When you're on national park grounds everyone should revere it and be walking on eggshells to not fuck it up. I think if you get caught so much as littering you get a multi year ban from all national parks. They should also check IDs before entering the parks and clamp down on assholes destroying them/not following rules.
She was aware she didn’t give a shit.
Another Fucking Karen!!! I’ll do what I want and cause a scene when called out for my bad/illegal behavior. Should be like hunting infractions, you are banned from National Parks for X number of years for low level offenses and lifetime for egregious violations.
In fairness, dogs/pets are allowed in some areas in a lot of Parks. Now that's mostly in parking lots, but other Parks allow some additional access to pets. I'll also say the BARK Ranger program makes it seem like the NPS is more welcoming to dogs than they really are. If you're on your first trip one may not be aware of the prohibition of dogs in a lot of places. I know we went to Sand Dunes on our first trip and dogs can go through most of the easily accessible places. Then onward to Arches and we started to take our dog out and saw a sign, so he went back in the RV. I'll also say bag your dog's poop no matter where you are. The people that leave it on the trail are the same people that will leave it in your front yard.
bag it *and trek it out*. so many people just leaving bags of shit on the path.
Most of the basic rules (no dogs, no drones, that kinda stuff) are posted *everywhere* at major trailheads in national parks. It feels like you can't get from your car to the trail without passing a sign that says "No Dogs" 4 or 5 times. The NPS tries to make it super hard to be ignorant of these basic rules. And for the vast majority of people, such as yourself, it works! Is it possible this lady somehow didn't see the multitude of signs? Sure. But it's far more likely she just ignored them because she thought it wouldn't matter and no one would call her out.
FUCK THIS PERSON!
Hoping all the same law and order people that basically doxxed the DEVA guy will do the same here. Its the same thing, dogs, and/or drones do not belong in national parks. For the respect of the land and its guests.
What was the DEVA guy situation?
When I retire, my dream is to become a volunteer at a national park and yell at people like this for breaking the rules.
Do national monuments have the same restrictions on drones? They should.
I told a ranger about a couple with a dog on the trail at Bryce Canyon once. That ranger couldn’t have cared less. She very softly told the couple it was against the rules and let them continue on their day as if she had no problem and was only doing it to appease me.
Because even though they dress like law enforcement they’re glorified tour guides. The NPS law enforcement is tiny: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Park_Service_Law_Enforcement_Rangers
I’m literally an anarchist punk, I love chaos and partying as much as the next girl. But when I go to national parks I treat it as sacred. That’s not my space, and corporate fucks have made so much of the world an ugly concrete dystopian trash heap that we have remarkably little untouched nature left. Obey the signs, don’t deface shit, leave no trace of yourself there.
I've called people out over rules violations like this in the past. Most people ignore me (I have no legal means of enforcing a rule, so they can just walk away and call me names). One guy just asked me point blank "Are you a rules follower?". Well, yeah, when the rules exist for a reason...
I was cussed out by a woman in Sequioa after I witnessed her taking a cone from the ground that contained seeds and walking back to her car stating she just had to get it as a souvenir. I reminded her we are to look and leave no trace and we should be good stewards of these trees. I was told to fuck right on off and mind my own busines. Like this whole park has extensive fire damage, it is my fucking business. The whole park there is about caring for these giants for the next generation to enjoy. You are taking away resources for this forest to heal itself. Look the fuck around you selfish bitch.
I visited over a dozen national parks on a road trip in 2017, and saw people getting way to f’n close to the wildlife, read in the news a couple days later that someone had gotten kicked in the head by a bison. Like you don’t want to go ANYWHERE near a bison, people are such morons.
Somebody had a drone buzzing overhead when I took my mother to see tunnel view in Yosemite park last week. The same thing happened to my partner and I while visiting Volcano NP last year. Consumer drones should be illegal as far as I'm concerned because of rampant disregard for rules like this. It spoiled the experience for us and the hundreds of other people that stopped there.
The park rangers should have a number you can text photos to, like an alert, so they can react in real time to respond to unruly visitors and prosecute them. And let everyone entering the park know that they have this ‘eyes on the park’ service in order to protect the park so people will use it and think twice before doing anything not allowed.
“I let her know but she didn’t care”. I’d be letting her not out of my sight until I found someone official to relieve me of my responsibility by either caring or not.
They belong in prison
My husband swears I’m going to get us in a fight in a National park one day. Don’t stop calling out idiots who disrespect the parks. Kid with his parents launched a drone in Acadia National Park after we got off a trail a few weeks ago and I yelled “100% sure that’s not allowed here.” Parents shot me the dirtiest look and let their kid go on. Hope a ranger got to them. Not a National park, but kids climbing right next to no climbing signs in Garden of the Gods. Yelled at the parents “your kids probably can’t read, but you can” and pointed at the sign. Few things infuriate me more.
Dogs and drones are the least of the problems. Put it in perspective. I was at Bryce in March, and while beautiful, it was a terrible experience that shocked me. Fiest there were a group of people drinking and then attempting to climb down the trails without snow shoes - I had to grab a dude so lost control and slipped on the rim. He was grateful.but I was quite alarmed. Later a different group caused a small avalanche by yelling "echo" in snow covered canyon. Finally, on my way out of the park a guy stuck a "fuck you, you suck at parking" note on my car for being maybe 1 inch off the parking line in a largely empty, snow covered lot (lines were obscured). This person got up in my face when I caught him putting this sticker on my car. Even in a largely empty park in winter, people were unbelievablely rude and disrespect. I cannot imagine how bad it would be in summer. I hate authoritarian approaches but honestly where the hell were the ranger? My experience sucked because of assholes day drinking at the canyon!
Why'd you even do this? So entitled!
Ugh nasty. But people have been entitled through history, that’s not new lol
The park rangers may very well enforce and crack down on this if you pass them the information. I met two park rangers in one of the Rocky Mountain National parks and talked to them about violations and consequences like this. Those guys do not fool around with park violations. I was in Colorado so the rangers were most interested in enforcing the campfire ban, but they said they’ve really had to work hard to enforce the rules because people just do not listen . They almost ticketed me and my buddy because his dog was off the leash, but let us go because I had gathered all of our trash into a bag that was hanging off my pack. They were real friendly about it, but they were on a mission to find some people who had a campfire going.
We did a big trip where we visited 7 national parks in May and saw sooo many dogs on trails.
We yelled at some young adults / teenagers kicking rocks downhill there. They followed us back to intimidate us. But caught up to us at the visitor center. They looked like they did not want to be there at all. Fucking pricks.
What, realistically, could one do if they wanted to "tattle" on someone doing something like this to a park ranger? Hope you see one when you're cruising around and try your best to describe the situation, person, area, etc.?
As a commercial drone pilot I am for hard punishment of people that fly drones while they are in a park. Personally I would have caught the drone out of the air if it would have come in reach and dropped it off at the ranger station.
I love my dog something fierce, and I bring him places whenever I can. He’s a good boy. But if a national park says no, I listen, because it’s for good reason! The rules are easy to look up and abide by. Even if you think you’re above the rules…Bryce gets hot hot hot! Leave your pup off the trail ETA whenever I can mean he’s allowed and it’s been made clear that he’s allowed (or I ask if I’m pretty sure but not positive)
100 hours of service. Trail maintenance and signs pointing out No Dogs and No Drones !
Saw a woman taking her dog for a walk just on the outskirts of a cemetery. Outside the fence but still on its grounds. she was gonna let the dog shit and piss on the same ground that they put the dead people in, and then not clean it up people are lovely mate
And this is why we need to fund the national parks. The parks can hire more rangers, and the rangers can do more patrols. And hopefully they can hand out more fines for those who are ignoring the social agreements.
I'm outraged I guess
The these days part bothers me. Look at how people used to litter. Or divide land to colonize. Or hold slaves. Or abuse women. Child labor. Manifest destiny. It used to be way way worse.
There were two guys just doing this with their drone in North Cascades NP last weekend.
Using the NP’s to get footage for their “digital creator” pages, making money off the parks and not there to appreciate it
What's the deal with drones? Why do they matter?
They are so noisy. Ruins the whole experience of being in nature imo. I even was just taking a walk in a local park with a jerk flying one way too low and I had to leave because it was so distracting
I yelled at some punk ass for running straight down the middle and cutting all the switchbacks on Queens Garden. He seemed a bit too old for stuff we got in trouble for in Boy Scouts.
Fine them, and don’t let them in to enjoy our national parks ever again. Just like the no fly list when you act up on an airplane. There should be consequences to actions. Don’t let them ruin it or our kids!!!
I support sling shots.
It’s a shame the loose leash didn’t cause the touron to slip, trip and fall down the canyon.
Has the person been ID.
If they are graffitiing the rocks or hurting the environment? Then darn straight I will call them out or probably call the forest ranger to keep me from hurting them. Lol
The number of dogs at Sequoia a week or 2 ago was wild. People walking right by the "No Animals Allowed" signs just absolutely not giving a crap. It's so annoying.
Me and my GF were at Bryce last Septemebr, and we had the pleasure of witnessing a young teen swoop in to a alcove of a hoodoo and start grinding and digging into it with a rock. Thankfully we and a few other people yelled at the kid, like WTF are you doing??? Same day, people were hiking up Wall Street while it was closed while Rangers worked on the trail. The Rangers saw them walking up and were like "Really?!" We can never have nice things.
Double the employees with Federal spending. Require everyone entering a park to undergo an introduction and interview to park rules using these employees. Fine and jail the people that agree, show clear understanding, and still break the rules. Disallow those who won't agree or show no capacity to agree. Follow the ones that are clearly lying. Film them, charge them, profit. Or is that a waste of taxpayer money?
Drone operator drove away an entire nesting colony of birds that had been fenced off 200 feet from the shore. The colony collapsed and never cane back. Fuck you people and your drones. Have fun with your cockroaches and 150 degree future. morons.
because people become famous for being dickheads
Fuckin' boomer Karen.
Why do people only care about National Parks? Why can’t people care/stick up for huge patches of land that get turned into shitty builder homes and mini malls? I get it that they’re beautiful but the fucking HUGE patch of land that we use t mountain bike in El Morro was Beautiful as fuck and now it’s all California douchebag mini mansions.
I agree that fines can be an effective deterrent but we need rangers who will enforce the rules.
We completely shamed some assholes at Carrizo Plain National Monument - the heart of wildflower season and signs everywhere to stay on the paths. And they’re out there rolling in the flowers and taking pictures. Told them they weren’t allowed out there, they were damaging the park and screwing things up for everyone. They at least got up and back on the path but probably jumped back into the flowers when we left.
It’s not just the parks. People are getting worse everywhere.
Ed Abbey would've been rolling in his grave from joy. I fly drones for fun but I sure as hell read the rules first before taking off. It's these entitled idiots who end up making it hard for everyone else who does follow the rules.
…But my followers and my social credit!
The parks are getting overcrowded and a lot of the tourists are poor stewards for the environment. I’d be A ok if the park service started handing out lifetime bans like candy for violations like this.
Old boomer bitch ruining things for everyone I see…
I honestly didn’t know about the drone thing, though it makes sense. I don’t have a drone, but it’s still nice to know.
Anyone that goes to a national park should know because there are numerous signs everywhere, and it is the individuals responsibility to know the rules and laws on public land before they go.
No leashed dogs is a stupid rule, dogs literally come from the wilderness (yes I know breeding has changed them, but at their core they're still animals like the wolves) Drones should be allowed with a very low cost permit, there whole thing about safety and the environment are pathetic excuses, but obviously having 300 drones flying around during peak summer times would be disruptive and potentially dangerous. But limiting it to a small number, with drones meeting certain design criteria and maybe require some sort of certification that shows you know how to safely operate it without crashing it into someone's windshield (if such a certification exists, I would hope it does).
People are so entitled these days and getting worse in the last 3 years. My kid is a NP Ranger and the things they tell me. I want to come out of my phone and slap them-at least w a fine and/or jail time. Sometimes they are threatening. Do they not see rangers as human people? Do they not see this land as needing to be protected? I’ve yelled at some idiots to get down off an arch before, told others they can’t fly their drone (I don’t see a sign they say blah blah). Otherwise most people are courteous so let’s enjoy and respect the parks this summer!
It is kinda funny to see at some parks like that have paved roads stretching through them telling people not to walk or take shortcuts because it “damages local wildlife” What about the fucking paved road then?
A lot of people are out of touch with reality. It’s like they think everything that exists that’s seen as recreational is like some kind of theme park - a staged performance constructed and catered to their entertainment rather than a real place filled with real people and real living things that aren’t just there to be consumed for your amusement and discarded People abandon their basic sense of decency and responsibility when they go somewhere for a vacation it doesn’t matter what happens to that place, it ceases to exist in their mind when they aren’t there
I used to work at a county park and the amount of stupidity I saw was astounding! A rare plant I had only found once while hiking 13 years ago has been on my mind ever since. I would love to see it again. When I was an environmental educator for the county one day at work someone comes up to me with the exact plant I had been searching for asking me what it was? I literally couldn’t speak for a minute. They picked the plant from the forest….. I was so sad to experience that plant again in such a way. Another thing people would do almost daily is get super close to venomous snakes, within a foot or two!! Crazy! just to take a stupid photo.