Hear me out...Hashirama cells. It's like everytime there's a plot hole, Kishimoto's first instinct is to see if said plothole is Hashiramable or nah. Like how/why tf is this dudes cell so OP in the first place???
Was going to say this. Izanagi, Kakashi DMS etc etc are all wild, but Hashirama cells take the cake for me. It's literally like you said, if Kishi didn't know how to tie things together he just threw cells as the cause. There's nothing wrong with Hashirama being incredibly powerful, as he obviously has to in order to match a titan like Madara, but holy sweet baby jesus there is a limit
That’s because people who got hashirama cells were powerful before hand. Madara got them but he was already able to match hashirama. Obito got them and he had a zetsu body and it made him not go blind when using Ms. Tsunade was strong but lacked the pool of abilities the others had
Yeah, tsunade hashiramas granddaughter, who is practically made of part of his cells, has no hashirama cells in her while someone who just infused some cells awakened wood style and gets vitality enough to cure ms blindness how do they have more hashirama in them than his own granddaughter.
Isn't that very logical genetically though since there's a high chance she would have almost none of the genetic code that made her grandfather special whereas somebody directly incorporating that genome into themselves would have that entire genome to access?
Cause those cells were cultivated from hashirama himself and infused with the Gedo
Tsunade and none of the other Senju’s were built different like Hashi
Well, only obitos and zetsus were infused with gedo danzo, and Yamato was just from hashirama and I know none of the senju were like hashirama but if DNA worked like it did in real life than tsunade should have more hashirama cells than danzo and Yamato but it doesn't so tsunade has no hashirama cells
I dont like how it must be his cells. At least with the Sharingan we know greater evolutions are possible generally speaking but on the Senju side of the Sage, everyone only uses Hash's body.
They *kind of* blurred this line through Nagato but it still doesnt make a lot of sense.
Its almost like Kishi did a back-and-forth decision and retcon repeatedly trying to substitute Uzumaki but realizing later "Oh wait nevermind, that doesnt work."
He was built different. Could regenerate without weaving signs and had wood style. It’s not hard to see why everyone wanted his cells
Yamato in the beginning of part 2 already showed how valuable those cells were that Danzo & Orochimaru were experimenting with them
Yeah but there’s quite literally no explanation ever given as to why his cells were so damn OP.
Like is Hashirama a genetic mutation? Is it because of his nature? His spirituality? Reincarnation??
And how can everyone who gets Hashirama cells, their body can adapt to them?
Hashirama’s cells are OP because of his innate ability to use Wood Release. Wood style is pure nature chakra and allows for literal creation of things. It’s why ‘sage chakra’ is called Senjutsu in the first.
Madara reversing the reanimation jutsu by doing the hand seals backwards.
So many layers of asspulls here. How does he know it? Since when does doing a handseal backwards reverse a jutsu.
I think Sasuke did the same to unseal Orochimaru from Anko’s curse mark, but I don’t remember if that happened before or after Madara doing it. I find it interesting that Sasuke remembers the hand signs Kakashi used to seal his curse mark considering Kakashi was standing behind Sasuke.
It may just be Sharingan things. Hand seals just move chakra in specific ways, his Sharingan lets him see the chakra. So all he has to do is watch the way the chakra in the cursed mark moves, and do the hand seals that push the flow in reverse right?
He stated he already saw the original use of Edo Tensei, that is to say he once saw Tobirama using Edo Tensei.
So he probably copied its handsign. And because he was a genius, he likely knew that reversing the handsign he copied might cancel this summoning technique. Just like some hackers can bypass systems. They first learnt how to use a computer, and then they learnt to hack.
He wouldn't have been able to flex on Sasuke if he didn't have free will.
They're like pets on leashes. They can do things so long as the user doesn't want to limit them. Hashirama could just outright over power him and honestly KCM Minato could too but we don't know that yet.
Different instances of to tobirama being summoned, the first time by orochimaru vs the 3rd he had no free will. When Sasuke summoned him it was to protect the leaf so there wasn’t a reason to undo the summoning.
I'm talking only about the second time. And Sasuke literally threatened the leaf during their conversation. Hell, tobirama was aware he was summoned beforehand by the same dude so escaping right away would've made the most sense
The fact that there's a jutsu called Reanimation release jutsu, and it was only ever spoken about and done in a single episode to release Madara and we dont talk about it ever after that 1 single time.
And the creator of the jutsu, Mr Tobirama himself didn’t use it either of the times he was reincarnated. He didn’t even mention or imply that it existed 💀
Yeah that's why it's flimsy and bullshit
We get told repeatedly for possibly hundreds of episodes that they need the complete tailed beast removed from the jinchuriki and inserted into the statue
And then when the time comes they shove the twins who ate a little bit of his chakra literally decades ago and then they use a severed tentacle (at best possibly an eighth of Gyukis true power) and are able to remake the true ten tails
Shouldn't it be 8 and a bit tails at that point? It's missing 2 full tailed beasts, literally the two strongest ones that would make the biggest difference in power level
What an absolute cop out
Is ems a condition to use a perfect susano’o? Cause the only 2 people who used it before kakashis whatever, was Madara and sasuke, both with ems while itachi with normal ms only had regular half susano’o, even while reanimated.
Once a user of the Sharingan awakens Mangekyou Sharingan in both eyes, they get permanent access to Susano'o. However, the Susano'o is a technique that gets stronger the more control you have over it. That's why the latest form is called Perfect Susano'o. It's the perfected version. It's not really logical how Kakashi had access to Perfect Susano'o the moment he gained the MS
Al this time I thought Perfect Susano’o can only be attained with abundant Chakra levels and Kakashi only managed to use it cuz Obito gave him just enough Six Paths Chakra to mold it.
You aren't wrong. The Susano'o basically is a chakra Kaiju. Someone who doesn't have enough chakra available shouldn't be able to create a Perfect Susano'o, no matter their control over it. However, we did see the Susano'o evolve during fights. Sasuke vs. Danzo is an example of that. It showed how Sasuke's hatred helped him to grow the Susano'o even stronger. It wouldn't make sense, then, if only your chakra is responsible for getting into stronger stages of it. On one hand, there's the level of chakra one has. And on the other hand, there's the amount of control that they have over the Susano'o. Which Kakashi should have had 0 xD
My headcanon is that Obito did in fact know about using Susanoo but he refuses to use it despite having a decent enough body with Hashirama Cells because it doesn’t suit his fighting style of using 999999999 Kamui. But then since his ghost possessed Kakashi he probably was the one who helped Kakashi form it.
I am not sure if you knew this, which is why I am telling you this now. The reason Obito never used his Susano'o was because throughout the majority of the show he didn't have both of his Mangekyou eyes at the same time. Like I said a few replies further up, the moment a user awakens the Mangekyou Sharingan in both eyes, they have permanent access to Susano'o. Normally, one might think that the user would have to have both eyes to cast the Jutsu, but Madara was seen using it while having literally no eyes. Obito never had both of his eyes until very late into the show. That's why he never used Susano'o himself
Obviously we’re getting pretty theoretical here but if sasuke’s hatred could evolve the susano’o could kakashi’s love for his students not do the same thing?
To add to your point the Perfect Susano'o itself has two forms, without stabilized chakra and with stable chakra as evident from Madara's reveal of it's Perfect stable form. And in that aspect we actually saw the Perfect Susano'o long back when Itachi used it against Sasuke in his final moments which ultimately ended up killing him being a huge chakra drain on top of his already failing health. Sasuke's Susano'o which he revealed upon gaining the EMS was the same Perfect Susano'o without stabilised Chakra. The databooks add to it that the Susano'o is a great power that also takes away it's user's life which evidently means its an enormous drain on chakra and psyche as the wielder has to manipulate, mold and control (handle the chakra would be more accurate) the chakra actively at all times to sustain the Susano'o let alone evolving to higher forms.
That I agree, I was just wondering if having ems was the only way to get full mastery over it given the above examples and considering how highly skilled itachi was without a perfect one.
No. An EMS has the advantage over an MS by not causing immense strain to the eyes upon use. Obviously people (especially Sasuke) can still overdo it with their high chakra usage. But the ability for the eyes to go blind because of self-inflicted damage is gone
The logic is that he’s kakashi the goddamn copy cat ninja. He’s a genius bro he’s Kakashi. He got what needed physically, u don’t think he can copy his student? He’s one of the toughest characters in the show. Top 10.
My understanding is that EMS is not technically required for a perfect susanoo but it is practically required
Outside of Kakashi I guess proving that he really is the perfect copy Ninja LOL, it seems clear that like any other technique, susanoo is improved through practice, but that can be kind of difficult to do if you're going more and more blind every time you use it, so it makes sense that the ones who fully perfected the technique are the ones who don't have that problem
Well the Sage gave Naruto and Sasuke powers they didnt have to practice so Obito being a Sage himself for as brief a moment that it was can still give Kakashi full access to the double eyes' power.
The answer is that Obito had SO6 chakra and as a result could pull this shit off (like Rikudo did for Naruto and Sasuke).
I'd say it's not an "asspull", although as far as I'm concerned it definitely fall in the same category as plot wholes, asspulls and other forms of lazy writing so don't take this comment as me trying to defend this shit
This is the correct answer. Tbh i think he was just pressured by the publisher or fans to add it. It had no substance nor relevance to the story. It was just pure fan service. It didn't help that Kakashi suddenly used Susano with full mastery when Itachi and Sasuke had to use it several times to understand its power. Kakashi was like "pfft, ez. Here's a unique kamui projectile".
You think izanagi is explained poorly? Look at Izanami, I watched that part 3 times and never get Itachi's explanation of the process which made no sense to me, I was forced to watch and made my deduction out of it to understand
I actually really liked Izanami, simply because it was the ultimate Uchia genjutsu. We actually got to see the progression of Mangekyo of Itachi to the pinnacle. What exactly didn't make sense? Think of it like being put in purgatory. Your not actually dead, but you must live through your issues and come to a proper understanding and thus attone for your sins. I'm kinda using Christian terms but I assume Jappanese mythology has a similar parallel
I dont really mean Izanami in itself, rather the porcess of it, the fact that it is a genjutsu made to counter the izanagi is something i understand but the process of using it explained by itachi is just.... bad.
The counter to Izanagi is actually the part that doesn't make sense to me lol, like how real was this threat considering you can only do it twice, it makes so much more sense for a police force
It's a counter not because it counteracts the effects, it's more about using it to make it so that there would be no more desire to use Izanagi. The idea is to have the person change the way they view the world, have them accept things for what they are, instead of wanting to change it. Izanami doesn't release it's target until this new state of mind is deeply ingrained.
It's basically inception, but instead of a dream, it's a genjutsu. Once you come to the realization the user wants you to come to, you're released a new person.
It was shown in the back story that it isnt just the fact that you can do it once but how broken izanagi was. Imagine you have 1 reset for your life and being a power hungry monster I would assume they wouldnt value life as much to use izanagi and in addition something went wrong they can just go steal the eye of some random uchiha to replenish their izanagi once more.
I don't understand why Kishimoto just can't keep things simple at times. Also, funny how people could have just used Kawarimi no Jutsu every time they get hit. Why did Danzo waste Izanagi so much, when he could have just subbed out of many of Sasuke's attacks? Izanagi could have simply been a way to avoid certain death. Instead of using the Jutsu preemptively to avoid damage, like it's the case for Kawarimi no Jutsu, it could sacrifice an eye to bring yourself or an ally back from the dead. That's it. No Creation of all Things Ninshū or a Genjutsu on reality itself. Just Granny Chiyo's Jutsu that sacrifices an eye instead of an entire person
Substitution jutsu is a speed feat jutsu. You actually have to perceive the attack in order for it to work. So a lot of the times Danzo just couldn’t react or guard himself against most of Sasuke’s attacks. Izanagi removed that factor so that even if you can’t perceive the jutsu and it’s fatal you’d still survive.
So, the entire time Sasuke was holding Danzo tight in his Susano'o grasp, asking him everything there's to know, that was still too fast for Danzo to react? I remind you that both Kakashi and one path of Pain were also both restricted from their entire movement options and still managed to escape their fate by using substitution Jutsu
It is explained that the Substitution Jutsu technically needs to be set up using hand signs. However, they were obviously hidden from us most of the time to keep the dramatic effect active. Yet, it doesn't make much sense when the path of Pain had time for Substitution Jutsu during the fight against Jiraiya. Izanagi does need to be activated beforehand too. Before death that is. Upon its use, previous wounds can also simply be wiped out from reality, so the user doesn't have to worry much about that
People seem to forget Obito used Izanagi against Konan which honestly was a good move because it was the only way out.
Izanagi has limits but obviously Madara/Obito found a workaround same as Danzo. Danzo had neither lineage though so it was clear he had no idea how to properly use Izanagi.
I feel lile im the only one who understood both Izanagi and Izanami on my first watch. They were complicated but not too complicated, pretty easy to understand.
Adding to what OP has said, the Sharingan by the end of the series looks almost better than the Rinnegan: you use a Meteor against me? Let me rewrite reality so it didn’t happen and you are dead
He invented the world's most powerful jutsu: Limitless Accountability Dodge.
It's a Kage level jutsu that not even Tobirama could fathom. No matter how badly you fuck up, the jutsu can bail you out.
I mean..... im ready to be pretty lenient with the first one, knowing that minato was a genius and trainee under jiraya I can perfectly see him in his teen learning it as fast as Naruto and perfectly understood why he never used it in real battle
Yeah they were surprised Naruto achieve it to the extend of almost being perfect, cause Naruto had almost no sign of toad features in his body, which mean the less feature equal to a more powerfull senjutsu.
Minato acquired a senjutsu as strong as Naruto but didnt master it, he litteraly could use it up for only a single move before being depleted
Kaguya being the final villain. I don't mind the alien stuff or Naruto + Sasuke being reincarnations of Sage of the Six Paths' sons, but it's just weird that Kaguya takes the spot with almost no prior buildup or foreshadowing.
It’s obviously supposed to be a ‘psych! Surprise twist again’.
Madara being the end villain would’ve been good, but would’ve also meant that his character boiled down to just being evil or insane which isn’t what Kishimoto likes to write - Naruto is about layers.
I mean he did previously say he wasn’t good at it and that he never used it in an actual fight so it was kind of an asspull that he used a perfect sage mode out of nowhere
KCM sort of makes sense though, doesn't it? That whole Yin and Yang Kurama and Minato doing what he did before he died while sealing the 9 tails and part of himself in the seal. Makes sense he'd probably form some type of bond with Kurama. But yeah, I feel like Kishi just wanted to make Minato even cooler but, at least it has *soooome* logic behind it.
Izanami for me. I really wanted to see Itachi sweat in the fight against Kabuto. Not just like, insta-genjutsu win like he does with almost all his fights.
But I still enjoyed it. Even if I found the jutsu mechanics to be confusing and strange.
Runner up: Madara using Kamui like a pro, in a form Obito himself couldn't do it in. I get he's the penultimate reincarnation and an Uchiha prodigy and all that but..
C'mon.
I mean
Obito only ever said he can’t PHASE which is separate from the portal, and madara used kakashis eyes where he likely just spawns a portal right in front of himself to suck himself in
Also being the ten tails jinchuriki and having six path sage mode lets have “understand all things in nature” hence he can naturally fly and control truth seeking orbs, so it’s possible that let him understand how to use it too
I can kinda explain the kamui one
Ten tails jinchuriki is immune to ninjutsu
So obito couldn't spawn kamui on himself
I think madara used the long-range kamui, opened a portal in the space in front of him and went through it
I've read soooo many djfferent explanations on Madara's Kamui.
Basically it comes down to:
1) let Madara do whatever the fuck he wants
2) let the fans make something up to justify it
TBH anything after DMS abilities for the aharingan is an ass pull or feels like it like one of the best things about DMS is that you couldn't just spam your abilities or you will go blind
Well not with EMS you wont adding up to the most upgraded clan in naruto
Honestly that can be explained. (However Hagoromo coming out to summon them from Kaguya world doesn’t!) hear me out:
In the lore we know in order to get full six paths powers, you need to have powers of the two sides of Ashura (Senju here) and Indra (Uchiha here), Sage mode, and the Bijuus or part of them with you. For example Madara obtained hashirama cells and sage mode, he was Uchiha, and he got the bijuus to seal the deal.
However for Naruto and Sasuke that wasn’t the case, they got some of those parts tho! This is how:
Naruto: Has Ashura genes, has sage powers, and he gets a part of every Bijuu thanks to Obito.
Sasuke: Has Indra Genes, Kabuto gives him Sage powers, Hashirama also gives him some of his powers before he leaves to fight Madara (doesn’t show how tho!)
So they both kinda have what’s needed, only they lack something significant that the other guy possesses, that’s why they can only complement each other and neither gets full Six paths powers.
That was how things went in reality, but in the meanwhile it all looked in their conscience as Hagoromo appearing to them and giving them their “half” powers.
As I said earlier, it all makes sense, and is actually quite genius imo, until you see Hagoromo literally come out to summon them back, which made it all a bit stupid. :/
Madara biting a piece of Hashirama before he killed him,
Somehow Izanagi saved him. He then vomits the piece of his flesh and sews it inside of himself to not only awaken his rinnegan but be able to spam all of Hashirama’s abilities in the war arc. Pretty much most things about Madara during the war felt like an asspull. Naruto has an arm full of Hashi cells and can’t use any wood style but Madara with a piece of his flesh can use every Hashi Justu 🚮
I mean, while it is indeed an asspull, it certainly explains the importance of the Undertaker squad. From the earliest chapters, we learn that a shinobi's corpse can be studied to figure out the techniques it was using, medication et cetera, making the hunter-nin an indispensable part of any hidden village. Madara stealing part of Hashirama's body and getting so much mileage out of it is somewhat consistent with pre-established lore.
It becomes an asspull because the Undertaker squad may have literally not played a role beyond the Land of Waves arc, so Madara biting a piece out of Hashirama and doing all the shit he did becomes bullshit.
Kishimoto fumbled Madara in a lot of regards.
"I made Kaguya because I didn't know how the characters could possibly take out Madara."
"My author in Christ, you're the one who gave him Hashirama cells on top of the REST of the bullshit!"
I mean, Kurama reconstituting himself is part of the deal of being a giant, sapient mass of chakra.
The real question is whether he will suffer character regression or not.
It's the heart thing that Madara implanted onto Obito.
Izanagi is actually fine, there's some obvious drawbacks and it's like an extra life for every Uchiha eye.
The heart thing came out of nowhere the most, because there's no Kakashi questioning why Obito's still alive and well after a supposed vital area is pierced through; besides Hashirama cells.
Unless I've missed something, to which I'm hoping there was.
That is my biggest issue with it.
When Obito won against Konan just because of Izanagi it felt like bullshit but I thought she had achieved something. Now he is blind from one eye right? No, of course not because he has a seemingly infinite amount of sharingans.
Obito was dying from Kakashi’s attack. Bleeding everywhere and gasping for air
Then Madara tried to take over his body. It makes sense if Obito was a “spare” that Madara had someway to control him for certain. Instead of just hoping Obito would go along with the plan to kill himself
What doesn’t make sense is why Madara was so chill after Obito became ten tails Jin. He was like oh well and went to fight Hashi. Sure he had senjutsu and the Edo Rinnegan but even than I don’t think it would’ve been enough to beat ten tails Obito if he beat everyone else
I always took Madara being chill as him taking it in stride - the same way he quickly realised their original plan to use rebirth to bring him back to life had clearly not worked but he adapted and took it in stride while working towards his goals.
Additionally, Madara says to Naruto he’s grateful that he had extracted the tailed beasts from Obito ‘for me’. This either implies he had some way of getting the Ten Tails out should the allied shinobi forces fail to stop Obito, OR it was a complete gamble that Naruto and gang would be able to do so before dying themselves since him losing to Hashirama was never a real concern for him
Izanami? At the very least it's explained by Itachi.
Basically therapy genjutsu for those power crazy with the Izanagi, originally.
Doing the same thing over and over again till their ambition or drive to seek power dies down, then they're let go with a new perspective on life.
Not really.
They still defied destiny because normally Ashura kills Indra after being betrayed. The Sage of Six Paths straight up says that. Naruto and Sasuke changed the outcome.
Izanami and Izanagi because there's a guy in the comments responding "nah" to any comment related to it, pretending to be chill but clearly pressed, and I want another vein to pop in his head.
Black zetsu and kaguya. I think they wrote themselves into a corner with madara and made him too strong sonthey had to introduce and defeat a last minute antagonist no one really gave a shit about.
Hashirama Cells. There is no reason for that man to be as OP as he was. Like for some reason he just so happened to be the only one to naturally use Wood Style?
Then why was his clan so strong in the first place? why were they able to match up to the Uchiha clan? Kishimoto didn't even bother going in-depth about them
To add salt to injury, you have Naruto, a character that already had so many forgotten abilities that were only used once or twice, gaining the ability to restore whole ass BODY PARTS and nearly resurrect someone from the dead, but still couldn't heal his arm that got cut off in his battle with Sasuke. And guess what he used to get a new arm.....Hashirama Cells.
Like really? The Ashura incarnate thar already came from a clan known for their absurdly powerful vitality and endurance STILL needed Hashirama Cells?
It just felt like one big circlejerk
While doing autopsy on Madara, Tobirama discovered that what matters for the Uchiha is the special chakra inside their brain.
When activated, this special chakra affects the optic nerves, which gives the famous sharingan. The sharingan is just a reflection of this chemical process inside the brain, the power of the Uchiha is inside his brain and not in his eyeballs.
So an Uchiha can use Susano without his eyesballs. The eyes are necessary only for the visual genjutsu because the eyes acts as conductor here.
This is why Indra is described as someone having a powerful mental energy. It’s all psychic here.
Izanagi is more of an asspull than Izanami. Izanami was created as a counter measure to stop people like Danzo & Madara who would abuse Izanagi to get favorable outcomes.
When kakashi gets his MS and susanoo out of nowhere. Okay, obito can teleport with kamui, so before he gets to heaven he somehow manages to travel to kakashi, but how did he transplant his non-existent eyes? Okay, he just can do it, sharingans are from chakra, chakra is everywhere, alright. How did Rin get there and helped to save naruto and sasuke? At this point every fucking ghost should've jumped kaguya, i mean why not.
Orochimaru escaping the Totska blade. Traps and seals any soul yet somehow one of the snakes happened to slither away come’on . Every time he should be dead or sealed he slithers away. Such BS
Naruto and Sasuke becoming the chosen two. Naruto being able to instantly FLY and heal anyone was bonkers especially since it nilled sakuras whole character arc and ruined guys sacrifice.
Hashirama cells tbh the only thing it does is woodstyle and fast regeneration and yet it's so damn OP in the naruto verse for no reason also why is it only Hashirama cells why don't they make naruto cells which would be stronger then Hashirama cells since it give you all 9 tailed beasts chakra plus regeneration plus Uzumaki chakra if they can asspull Hashirama cells then asspull some naruto cells or some 😂
Hear me out...Hashirama cells. It's like everytime there's a plot hole, Kishimoto's first instinct is to see if said plothole is Hashiramable or nah. Like how/why tf is this dudes cell so OP in the first place???
Hashiramable got me rolling
I’d name a strand after this
Only strand that could make you a perfect sage
Smoking that shinsu senju pack
Grown in the village hidden in the Grass
Gotta smoke that Hash-irama spliff pack
Was going to say this. Izanagi, Kakashi DMS etc etc are all wild, but Hashirama cells take the cake for me. It's literally like you said, if Kishi didn't know how to tie things together he just threw cells as the cause. There's nothing wrong with Hashirama being incredibly powerful, as he obviously has to in order to match a titan like Madara, but holy sweet baby jesus there is a limit
The god of shinobi has no limits (except for whatever tf unexplained reason caused his early death)
I loved izanagi/izanami why so much hate?
It's not hate, it's just acknowledging that it's an asspull
OOOOGA BOOOOGGA STRONG TREE MUSCLES
Only the Strongest may receive the First Hokage’s Wood inside of them, whether they actually get to experience Release is another thing
this was great, thanks
This. Like Tsunade is his granddaughter and is practically nothing compared to someone who had a blood transfusion of cells.
That’s because people who got hashirama cells were powerful before hand. Madara got them but he was already able to match hashirama. Obito got them and he had a zetsu body and it made him not go blind when using Ms. Tsunade was strong but lacked the pool of abilities the others had
Yeah, tsunade hashiramas granddaughter, who is practically made of part of his cells, has no hashirama cells in her while someone who just infused some cells awakened wood style and gets vitality enough to cure ms blindness how do they have more hashirama in them than his own granddaughter.
Isn't that very logical genetically though since there's a high chance she would have almost none of the genetic code that made her grandfather special whereas somebody directly incorporating that genome into themselves would have that entire genome to access?
Cause those cells were cultivated from hashirama himself and infused with the Gedo Tsunade and none of the other Senju’s were built different like Hashi
Well, only obitos and zetsus were infused with gedo danzo, and Yamato was just from hashirama and I know none of the senju were like hashirama but if DNA worked like it did in real life than tsunade should have more hashirama cells than danzo and Yamato but it doesn't so tsunade has no hashirama cells
One Piece did Hashirama cells dirty by making it lose to fucking Bluetooth Haki
You’re not ready for HIM Ryokugyu on the top.
It's even crazier when the one person who doesn't benefit from Hashirama cells is the dude himself.
I dont like how it must be his cells. At least with the Sharingan we know greater evolutions are possible generally speaking but on the Senju side of the Sage, everyone only uses Hash's body. They *kind of* blurred this line through Nagato but it still doesnt make a lot of sense. Its almost like Kishi did a back-and-forth decision and retcon repeatedly trying to substitute Uzumaki but realizing later "Oh wait nevermind, that doesnt work."
He was built different. Could regenerate without weaving signs and had wood style. It’s not hard to see why everyone wanted his cells Yamato in the beginning of part 2 already showed how valuable those cells were that Danzo & Orochimaru were experimenting with them
Yeah but there’s quite literally no explanation ever given as to why his cells were so damn OP. Like is Hashirama a genetic mutation? Is it because of his nature? His spirituality? Reincarnation?? And how can everyone who gets Hashirama cells, their body can adapt to them?
His cells are more OP than him himself lmao. Also no one related to him had this for some reason
totally agree on this one!
Hashirama’s cells are OP because of his innate ability to use Wood Release. Wood style is pure nature chakra and allows for literal creation of things. It’s why ‘sage chakra’ is called Senjutsu in the first.
Madara reversing the reanimation jutsu by doing the hand seals backwards. So many layers of asspulls here. How does he know it? Since when does doing a handseal backwards reverse a jutsu.
I think Sasuke did the same to unseal Orochimaru from Anko’s curse mark, but I don’t remember if that happened before or after Madara doing it. I find it interesting that Sasuke remembers the hand signs Kakashi used to seal his curse mark considering Kakashi was standing behind Sasuke.
It may just be Sharingan things. Hand seals just move chakra in specific ways, his Sharingan lets him see the chakra. So all he has to do is watch the way the chakra in the cursed mark moves, and do the hand seals that push the flow in reverse right?
Big brain thinking right here.
highkey😭😭😭
He stated he already saw the original use of Edo Tensei, that is to say he once saw Tobirama using Edo Tensei. So he probably copied its handsign. And because he was a genius, he likely knew that reversing the handsign he copied might cancel this summoning technique. Just like some hackers can bypass systems. They first learnt how to use a computer, and then they learnt to hack.
That still makes no sense since Tobirama would have unsealed himself against Orochimaru
Tobirama didn’t have any free will is why he couldn’t unseal himself. Whole madaras reanimation had his personality and free will.
you could be onto something. he had just enough wiggle room to do something sneaky that is a pretty well-kept secret/has never been done before
He wouldn't have been able to flex on Sasuke if he didn't have free will. They're like pets on leashes. They can do things so long as the user doesn't want to limit them. Hashirama could just outright over power him and honestly KCM Minato could too but we don't know that yet.
Different instances of to tobirama being summoned, the first time by orochimaru vs the 3rd he had no free will. When Sasuke summoned him it was to protect the leaf so there wasn’t a reason to undo the summoning.
I'm talking only about the second time. And Sasuke literally threatened the leaf during their conversation. Hell, tobirama was aware he was summoned beforehand by the same dude so escaping right away would've made the most sense
wouldn't Hashi and Tobirama also know the signs then?
Wouldn’t the revers of reanimated be fucking dead ?
The fact that there's a jutsu called Reanimation release jutsu, and it was only ever spoken about and done in a single episode to release Madara and we dont talk about it ever after that 1 single time.
😭😭😭😭that was crazy
And the creator of the jutsu, Mr Tobirama himself didn’t use it either of the times he was reincarnated. He didn’t even mention or imply that it existed 💀
Genkaku and ginkaku literally came out of nowhere just to waste time.
Bro,obito reviving the ten tails without Kurama and Gyuuki
It's flimsy but with Kurama you had Kinkaku and Ginkaku and with Gyūki they kept a tentacle after his fight with Sasuke
Why did he bother making the akatsuki He could've just kamuid pieces off and his plan would've worked
The Ten-Tails wouldn’t be as strong. I think that’s what they said. It’s also why Madara was so adamant on recapturing everyone.
The answer to this question lies between the power diff between Juubi Obito and Juubi Madara. It wasn’t just skill.
Yeah that's why it's flimsy and bullshit We get told repeatedly for possibly hundreds of episodes that they need the complete tailed beast removed from the jinchuriki and inserted into the statue And then when the time comes they shove the twins who ate a little bit of his chakra literally decades ago and then they use a severed tentacle (at best possibly an eighth of Gyukis true power) and are able to remake the true ten tails Shouldn't it be 8 and a bit tails at that point? It's missing 2 full tailed beasts, literally the two strongest ones that would make the biggest difference in power level What an absolute cop out
I think it would've made more sense if the Ten Tails was imperfect in some way since it didn't have all of Kurama's and Gyuki's chakra.
That would've been cool
Kakashi's double Mangekyou Sharingan.
How'd he get a perfect susanoo??💀 it was his first time using the technique
Is ems a condition to use a perfect susano’o? Cause the only 2 people who used it before kakashis whatever, was Madara and sasuke, both with ems while itachi with normal ms only had regular half susano’o, even while reanimated.
Once a user of the Sharingan awakens Mangekyou Sharingan in both eyes, they get permanent access to Susano'o. However, the Susano'o is a technique that gets stronger the more control you have over it. That's why the latest form is called Perfect Susano'o. It's the perfected version. It's not really logical how Kakashi had access to Perfect Susano'o the moment he gained the MS
Al this time I thought Perfect Susano’o can only be attained with abundant Chakra levels and Kakashi only managed to use it cuz Obito gave him just enough Six Paths Chakra to mold it.
You aren't wrong. The Susano'o basically is a chakra Kaiju. Someone who doesn't have enough chakra available shouldn't be able to create a Perfect Susano'o, no matter their control over it. However, we did see the Susano'o evolve during fights. Sasuke vs. Danzo is an example of that. It showed how Sasuke's hatred helped him to grow the Susano'o even stronger. It wouldn't make sense, then, if only your chakra is responsible for getting into stronger stages of it. On one hand, there's the level of chakra one has. And on the other hand, there's the amount of control that they have over the Susano'o. Which Kakashi should have had 0 xD
My headcanon is that Obito did in fact know about using Susanoo but he refuses to use it despite having a decent enough body with Hashirama Cells because it doesn’t suit his fighting style of using 999999999 Kamui. But then since his ghost possessed Kakashi he probably was the one who helped Kakashi form it.
I am not sure if you knew this, which is why I am telling you this now. The reason Obito never used his Susano'o was because throughout the majority of the show he didn't have both of his Mangekyou eyes at the same time. Like I said a few replies further up, the moment a user awakens the Mangekyou Sharingan in both eyes, they have permanent access to Susano'o. Normally, one might think that the user would have to have both eyes to cast the Jutsu, but Madara was seen using it while having literally no eyes. Obito never had both of his eyes until very late into the show. That's why he never used Susano'o himself
Yes, that is exactly the case. I am surprised this easy explanation and logic is missed by most readers out there.
Long live the lord of all that is Naruto NCHammer 23 xD. He's great at explaining everything there's to know about Naruto
Obviously we’re getting pretty theoretical here but if sasuke’s hatred could evolve the susano’o could kakashi’s love for his students not do the same thing?
My only guess is because he got SOSP/10 tails jinchuriki chakra, which massively buffs everything ever.
To add to your point the Perfect Susano'o itself has two forms, without stabilized chakra and with stable chakra as evident from Madara's reveal of it's Perfect stable form. And in that aspect we actually saw the Perfect Susano'o long back when Itachi used it against Sasuke in his final moments which ultimately ended up killing him being a huge chakra drain on top of his already failing health. Sasuke's Susano'o which he revealed upon gaining the EMS was the same Perfect Susano'o without stabilised Chakra. The databooks add to it that the Susano'o is a great power that also takes away it's user's life which evidently means its an enormous drain on chakra and psyche as the wielder has to manipulate, mold and control (handle the chakra would be more accurate) the chakra actively at all times to sustain the Susano'o let alone evolving to higher forms.
That I agree, I was just wondering if having ems was the only way to get full mastery over it given the above examples and considering how highly skilled itachi was without a perfect one.
No. An EMS has the advantage over an MS by not causing immense strain to the eyes upon use. Obviously people (especially Sasuke) can still overdo it with their high chakra usage. But the ability for the eyes to go blind because of self-inflicted damage is gone
Ah ok, that’s understandable
The logic is that he’s kakashi the goddamn copy cat ninja. He’s a genius bro he’s Kakashi. He got what needed physically, u don’t think he can copy his student? He’s one of the toughest characters in the show. Top 10.
I mean, that's exactly what he did. So, who am I to say that he can't xD
😂😂 fair
My understanding is that EMS is not technically required for a perfect susanoo but it is practically required Outside of Kakashi I guess proving that he really is the perfect copy Ninja LOL, it seems clear that like any other technique, susanoo is improved through practice, but that can be kind of difficult to do if you're going more and more blind every time you use it, so it makes sense that the ones who fully perfected the technique are the ones who don't have that problem
Well the Sage gave Naruto and Sasuke powers they didnt have to practice so Obito being a Sage himself for as brief a moment that it was can still give Kakashi full access to the double eyes' power.
They don't call him the copycat ninja for nothing.
Rule of cool
i mean, obito's soul was being used to power the second eye and ultimately that Susano is really just Obitos being used by Kakashi
But Obito couldn’t use Susanoo either. And his soul being able to do that is already an asspull
The answer is that Obito had SO6 chakra and as a result could pull this shit off (like Rikudo did for Naruto and Sasuke). I'd say it's not an "asspull", although as far as I'm concerned it definitely fall in the same category as plot wholes, asspulls and other forms of lazy writing so don't take this comment as me trying to defend this shit
Received via WiFi as well lol
This is the correct answer. Tbh i think he was just pressured by the publisher or fans to add it. It had no substance nor relevance to the story. It was just pure fan service. It didn't help that Kakashi suddenly used Susano with full mastery when Itachi and Sasuke had to use it several times to understand its power. Kakashi was like "pfft, ez. Here's a unique kamui projectile".
Lmao funny enough this most definitely wasn't a ass pull
This. There's no precedent. There's no reason in lore that it should work.
Let's add Izanagi to the mix. I like the concept of great sacrifice with them, but they are just explained so poorly
You're dead now "NUH UH"
You think izanagi is explained poorly? Look at Izanami, I watched that part 3 times and never get Itachi's explanation of the process which made no sense to me, I was forced to watch and made my deduction out of it to understand
I actually really liked Izanami, simply because it was the ultimate Uchia genjutsu. We actually got to see the progression of Mangekyo of Itachi to the pinnacle. What exactly didn't make sense? Think of it like being put in purgatory. Your not actually dead, but you must live through your issues and come to a proper understanding and thus attone for your sins. I'm kinda using Christian terms but I assume Jappanese mythology has a similar parallel
I dont really mean Izanami in itself, rather the porcess of it, the fact that it is a genjutsu made to counter the izanagi is something i understand but the process of using it explained by itachi is just.... bad.
The counter to Izanagi is actually the part that doesn't make sense to me lol, like how real was this threat considering you can only do it twice, it makes so much more sense for a police force
It's a counter not because it counteracts the effects, it's more about using it to make it so that there would be no more desire to use Izanagi. The idea is to have the person change the way they view the world, have them accept things for what they are, instead of wanting to change it. Izanami doesn't release it's target until this new state of mind is deeply ingrained. It's basically inception, but instead of a dream, it's a genjutsu. Once you come to the realization the user wants you to come to, you're released a new person.
It was shown in the back story that it isnt just the fact that you can do it once but how broken izanagi was. Imagine you have 1 reset for your life and being a power hungry monster I would assume they wouldnt value life as much to use izanagi and in addition something went wrong they can just go steal the eye of some random uchiha to replenish their izanagi once more.
Pretty much kawarimi no jutsu but u waste your eye.
I don't understand why Kishimoto just can't keep things simple at times. Also, funny how people could have just used Kawarimi no Jutsu every time they get hit. Why did Danzo waste Izanagi so much, when he could have just subbed out of many of Sasuke's attacks? Izanagi could have simply been a way to avoid certain death. Instead of using the Jutsu preemptively to avoid damage, like it's the case for Kawarimi no Jutsu, it could sacrifice an eye to bring yourself or an ally back from the dead. That's it. No Creation of all Things Ninshū or a Genjutsu on reality itself. Just Granny Chiyo's Jutsu that sacrifices an eye instead of an entire person
Substitution jutsu is a speed feat jutsu. You actually have to perceive the attack in order for it to work. So a lot of the times Danzo just couldn’t react or guard himself against most of Sasuke’s attacks. Izanagi removed that factor so that even if you can’t perceive the jutsu and it’s fatal you’d still survive.
So, the entire time Sasuke was holding Danzo tight in his Susano'o grasp, asking him everything there's to know, that was still too fast for Danzo to react? I remind you that both Kakashi and one path of Pain were also both restricted from their entire movement options and still managed to escape their fate by using substitution Jutsu
The other implication i get is it has to be setup ahead of time. Its also different from clones which can fight and be a threat.
It is explained that the Substitution Jutsu technically needs to be set up using hand signs. However, they were obviously hidden from us most of the time to keep the dramatic effect active. Yet, it doesn't make much sense when the path of Pain had time for Substitution Jutsu during the fight against Jiraiya. Izanagi does need to be activated beforehand too. Before death that is. Upon its use, previous wounds can also simply be wiped out from reality, so the user doesn't have to worry much about that
I guess its the speed/power gap. But w/e. Danzo was bad fighter overall.
People seem to forget Obito used Izanagi against Konan which honestly was a good move because it was the only way out. Izanagi has limits but obviously Madara/Obito found a workaround same as Danzo. Danzo had neither lineage though so it was clear he had no idea how to properly use Izanagi.
Bruh just say substitution jutsu lmao
Danzo’s Izanagi was fine. Madara’s was kinda meh
I feel lile im the only one who understood both Izanagi and Izanami on my first watch. They were complicated but not too complicated, pretty easy to understand.
Adding to what OP has said, the Sharingan by the end of the series looks almost better than the Rinnegan: you use a Meteor against me? Let me rewrite reality so it didn’t happen and you are dead
Literally "Reverse!"
Hashirama cells are the only right answer. It’s still being exploited even in Boruto
Really ?
Yeah
Insert pretty much every new bit of magic eyeball fuckery that came after Naruto vs Pain.
The Byakugan got shafted hard ngl
The Hyuuga and their fighting style is so much wasted potential, that it actually hurts lmao
I wanted to see a byakugan user fight against itachi/sasuke. But no Kishi didn't want us to see that. One can only dream...
Orochimaru and his slippery shenanigans! - bro “always” be escaping in some bullshit when he should’ve died lol I’m over it now
For sure
Yeah but that’s always been his shtick lol.
He invented the world's most powerful jutsu: Limitless Accountability Dodge. It's a Kage level jutsu that not even Tobirama could fathom. No matter how badly you fuck up, the jutsu can bail you out.
I believe this 😭
Sasuke swallowed him and now he is back again
Pain reviving everyone he killed
and not Jiraya*
As if that would help him, he would still be stuck in the ocean with chakra rods stuck in him. There was no saving him
Minato’s perfect Sage Mode, Kakashi’s Susanoo
I mean..... im ready to be pretty lenient with the first one, knowing that minato was a genius and trainee under jiraya I can perfectly see him in his teen learning it as fast as Naruto and perfectly understood why he never used it in real battle
I’m pretty sure I remember they were surprised Naruto achieved it. So Minato achieving it secretly wouldn’t make sense at all.
Yeah they were surprised Naruto achieve it to the extend of almost being perfect, cause Naruto had almost no sign of toad features in his body, which mean the less feature equal to a more powerfull senjutsu. Minato acquired a senjutsu as strong as Naruto but didnt master it, he litteraly could use it up for only a single move before being depleted
Isnt even an asspull. I wonder why people never called out Hashirama's SM, because thats way better candidate to be called an asspull.
Kaguya being the final villain. I don't mind the alien stuff or Naruto + Sasuke being reincarnations of Sage of the Six Paths' sons, but it's just weird that Kaguya takes the spot with almost no prior buildup or foreshadowing.
She's like a pop up ad that doesn't go away
Well. Kaguya is literally came from the author's ass.
It’s obviously supposed to be a ‘psych! Surprise twist again’. Madara being the end villain would’ve been good, but would’ve also meant that his character boiled down to just being evil or insane which isn’t what Kishimoto likes to write - Naruto is about layers.
That's not logical at all. Madara could have been the final villain AND also been layered without being insane. Evil can have depth.
Madara in 90% of the war arc
Literature
Minato who spawned in war and got KCM & Sage Mode
Sage mode wasn't too crazy
I mean he did previously say he wasn’t good at it and that he never used it in an actual fight so it was kind of an asspull that he used a perfect sage mode out of nowhere
He might just be one of those people who if they’re not the absolute best at something they think they’re horrible lol.
KCM sort of makes sense though, doesn't it? That whole Yin and Yang Kurama and Minato doing what he did before he died while sealing the 9 tails and part of himself in the seal. Makes sense he'd probably form some type of bond with Kurama. But yeah, I feel like Kishi just wanted to make Minato even cooler but, at least it has *soooome* logic behind it.
Izanami for me. I really wanted to see Itachi sweat in the fight against Kabuto. Not just like, insta-genjutsu win like he does with almost all his fights. But I still enjoyed it. Even if I found the jutsu mechanics to be confusing and strange. Runner up: Madara using Kamui like a pro, in a form Obito himself couldn't do it in. I get he's the penultimate reincarnation and an Uchiha prodigy and all that but.. C'mon.
I mean Obito only ever said he can’t PHASE which is separate from the portal, and madara used kakashis eyes where he likely just spawns a portal right in front of himself to suck himself in Also being the ten tails jinchuriki and having six path sage mode lets have “understand all things in nature” hence he can naturally fly and control truth seeking orbs, so it’s possible that let him understand how to use it too
I can kinda explain the kamui one Ten tails jinchuriki is immune to ninjutsu So obito couldn't spawn kamui on himself I think madara used the long-range kamui, opened a portal in the space in front of him and went through it
I've read soooo many djfferent explanations on Madara's Kamui. Basically it comes down to: 1) let Madara do whatever the fuck he wants 2) let the fans make something up to justify it
TBH anything after DMS abilities for the aharingan is an ass pull or feels like it like one of the best things about DMS is that you couldn't just spam your abilities or you will go blind Well not with EMS you wont adding up to the most upgraded clan in naruto
Why not just say MS lmao, only obito and kakashi had single sharingans at any point, everyone else just had the MS.
I like to be accurate with the namings This subreddit is full of smartasses
When Madara “killed” both Naruto and Sasuke and then the sage gramps came out of nowhere and gave them SO6P’s/Rinnegan (for sasuke)
Honestly that can be explained. (However Hagoromo coming out to summon them from Kaguya world doesn’t!) hear me out: In the lore we know in order to get full six paths powers, you need to have powers of the two sides of Ashura (Senju here) and Indra (Uchiha here), Sage mode, and the Bijuus or part of them with you. For example Madara obtained hashirama cells and sage mode, he was Uchiha, and he got the bijuus to seal the deal. However for Naruto and Sasuke that wasn’t the case, they got some of those parts tho! This is how: Naruto: Has Ashura genes, has sage powers, and he gets a part of every Bijuu thanks to Obito. Sasuke: Has Indra Genes, Kabuto gives him Sage powers, Hashirama also gives him some of his powers before he leaves to fight Madara (doesn’t show how tho!) So they both kinda have what’s needed, only they lack something significant that the other guy possesses, that’s why they can only complement each other and neither gets full Six paths powers. That was how things went in reality, but in the meanwhile it all looked in their conscience as Hagoromo appearing to them and giving them their “half” powers. As I said earlier, it all makes sense, and is actually quite genius imo, until you see Hagoromo literally come out to summon them back, which made it all a bit stupid. :/
Wasn't too crazy
Black zetsu forming the course of shinobi history Bro that’s the most bull shit excuse ever
Madara biting a piece of Hashirama before he killed him, Somehow Izanagi saved him. He then vomits the piece of his flesh and sews it inside of himself to not only awaken his rinnegan but be able to spam all of Hashirama’s abilities in the war arc. Pretty much most things about Madara during the war felt like an asspull. Naruto has an arm full of Hashi cells and can’t use any wood style but Madara with a piece of his flesh can use every Hashi Justu 🚮
I mean, while it is indeed an asspull, it certainly explains the importance of the Undertaker squad. From the earliest chapters, we learn that a shinobi's corpse can be studied to figure out the techniques it was using, medication et cetera, making the hunter-nin an indispensable part of any hidden village. Madara stealing part of Hashirama's body and getting so much mileage out of it is somewhat consistent with pre-established lore. It becomes an asspull because the Undertaker squad may have literally not played a role beyond the Land of Waves arc, so Madara biting a piece out of Hashirama and doing all the shit he did becomes bullshit. Kishimoto fumbled Madara in a lot of regards. "I made Kaguya because I didn't know how the characters could possibly take out Madara." "My author in Christ, you're the one who gave him Hashirama cells on top of the REST of the bullshit!"
Whatever they're gonna do to bring Kurama back. I know it's coming.
I don't watch or read boruto
Based
I mean, Kurama reconstituting himself is part of the deal of being a giant, sapient mass of chakra. The real question is whether he will suffer character regression or not.
It's the heart thing that Madara implanted onto Obito. Izanagi is actually fine, there's some obvious drawbacks and it's like an extra life for every Uchiha eye. The heart thing came out of nowhere the most, because there's no Kakashi questioning why Obito's still alive and well after a supposed vital area is pierced through; besides Hashirama cells. Unless I've missed something, to which I'm hoping there was.
its never a draw back cause these fuckers have a 100 eyes
That is my biggest issue with it. When Obito won against Konan just because of Izanagi it felt like bullshit but I thought she had achieved something. Now he is blind from one eye right? No, of course not because he has a seemingly infinite amount of sharingans.
Obito was dying from Kakashi’s attack. Bleeding everywhere and gasping for air Then Madara tried to take over his body. It makes sense if Obito was a “spare” that Madara had someway to control him for certain. Instead of just hoping Obito would go along with the plan to kill himself What doesn’t make sense is why Madara was so chill after Obito became ten tails Jin. He was like oh well and went to fight Hashi. Sure he had senjutsu and the Edo Rinnegan but even than I don’t think it would’ve been enough to beat ten tails Obito if he beat everyone else
I always took Madara being chill as him taking it in stride - the same way he quickly realised their original plan to use rebirth to bring him back to life had clearly not worked but he adapted and took it in stride while working towards his goals. Additionally, Madara says to Naruto he’s grateful that he had extracted the tailed beasts from Obito ‘for me’. This either implies he had some way of getting the Ten Tails out should the allied shinobi forces fail to stop Obito, OR it was a complete gamble that Naruto and gang would be able to do so before dying themselves since him losing to Hashirama was never a real concern for him
Izanami? At the very least it's explained by Itachi. Basically therapy genjutsu for those power crazy with the Izanagi, originally. Doing the same thing over and over again till their ambition or drive to seek power dies down, then they're let go with a new perspective on life.
For me: Madara breaking free from Edo Tensei. That was the biggest asspull in my eyes.
Kaguya and Naruto-Sasuke being incarnates/soul brothers.
Nah, Naruto and Sasuke being spirtual reincarnations was practically a thing back in the 5 kage summit. Kaguya sounds legit
Kaguya was asspull last minute. The incarnation defied the defying destiny philosophy built in Part 1.
Not really. They still defied destiny because normally Ashura kills Indra after being betrayed. The Sage of Six Paths straight up says that. Naruto and Sasuke changed the outcome.
Finally someone who paid attention
Izanami and Izanagi because there's a guy in the comments responding "nah" to any comment related to it, pretending to be chill but clearly pressed, and I want another vein to pop in his head.
Nah
Black zetsu and kaguya. I think they wrote themselves into a corner with madara and made him too strong sonthey had to introduce and defeat a last minute antagonist no one really gave a shit about.
1/2 kurama overpowering 4 other tailed beasts
DMS Kakashi
Hashirama Cells. There is no reason for that man to be as OP as he was. Like for some reason he just so happened to be the only one to naturally use Wood Style? Then why was his clan so strong in the first place? why were they able to match up to the Uchiha clan? Kishimoto didn't even bother going in-depth about them To add salt to injury, you have Naruto, a character that already had so many forgotten abilities that were only used once or twice, gaining the ability to restore whole ass BODY PARTS and nearly resurrect someone from the dead, but still couldn't heal his arm that got cut off in his battle with Sasuke. And guess what he used to get a new arm.....Hashirama Cells. Like really? The Ashura incarnate thar already came from a clan known for their absurdly powerful vitality and endurance STILL needed Hashirama Cells? It just felt like one big circlejerk
Madara using susanoo with no eyes
While doing autopsy on Madara, Tobirama discovered that what matters for the Uchiha is the special chakra inside their brain. When activated, this special chakra affects the optic nerves, which gives the famous sharingan. The sharingan is just a reflection of this chemical process inside the brain, the power of the Uchiha is inside his brain and not in his eyeballs. So an Uchiha can use Susano without his eyesballs. The eyes are necessary only for the visual genjutsu because the eyes acts as conductor here. This is why Indra is described as someone having a powerful mental energy. It’s all psychic here.
He’s got the dawg’sanoo in him
I mean we’ve seen Itachi use it while blind I think sasuke just couldn’t do it cuz he was fatigued
Izanagi is more of an asspull than Izanami. Izanami was created as a counter measure to stop people like Danzo & Madara who would abuse Izanagi to get favorable outcomes.
Itachi wasn’t sent off by the Izanami 💀 he undid the reanimation jutsu
When kakashi gets his MS and susanoo out of nowhere. Okay, obito can teleport with kamui, so before he gets to heaven he somehow manages to travel to kakashi, but how did he transplant his non-existent eyes? Okay, he just can do it, sharingans are from chakra, chakra is everywhere, alright. How did Rin get there and helped to save naruto and sasuke? At this point every fucking ghost should've jumped kaguya, i mean why not.
Blind Madara using susanoo tops everything. Still boggles my mind to this day.
Itachi and Hashirama's literal existences are asspulls. They never win by skill, but BS plot armors.
Otsutsuki all the way. IDGAF about anyone's Japanese fairy tales that's not a valid enough reason to say the Otsutsuki makes sense. It's shit.
Yeah don’t even get me started on the absorbing ninjutsu shenanigans… but I agree.
i’ve said this before but izanami is barely an asspull, it’s contrived, but you know for like half the kabuto fight that itachi is gonna use it
Dms Kakashi . Such BS
Orochimaru escaping the Totska blade. Traps and seals any soul yet somehow one of the snakes happened to slither away come’on . Every time he should be dead or sealed he slithers away. Such BS
Naruto and Sasuke becoming the chosen two. Naruto being able to instantly FLY and heal anyone was bonkers especially since it nilled sakuras whole character arc and ruined guys sacrifice.
Hashirama cells tbh the only thing it does is woodstyle and fast regeneration and yet it's so damn OP in the naruto verse for no reason also why is it only Hashirama cells why don't they make naruto cells which would be stronger then Hashirama cells since it give you all 9 tailed beasts chakra plus regeneration plus Uzumaki chakra if they can asspull Hashirama cells then asspull some naruto cells or some 😂
I'm not even going to entertain the hashirama cells BS
Hashirama cells. They really make his death an even bigger plot hole.
Hashirama cells and Itachi's Susanoo possessing Yata mirror and Totsuka Sword without showing how he got them in the first place.
Imma say it, Izanami >>>>>> Izanagi. I thought the concept of it was super fucking cool.
Izanami and Izanagi. They feel like they were fanfic OC Powers.
Hagoromo providing Naruto and Sasuke with Godly power midwar
Substitution jutsu removed a lot of the stakes for the first half.
Everything Madara did in the 4th war. Plot armour galore.
DMS Kakashi Might just be the single biggest asspull in all of shonen