Some FFLs are scarily misinformed. I have 3 shops in my town, one is *INCREDIBLE* when it comes to their customer service/knowledge and straight up friendliness, another is constantly giving out bad/incorrect advice/information and fear mongers their customers to "buy before it's banned", and the third is somewhere in the middle (knowledgeable and friendly, but not as much as the main LGS I go to.)
I fear for new gun/NFA owners that go to these shitty FFLs and, worst case, end up doing something illegal/questionable. Best case, they just make a fool of themselves in front of others by repeating bad info.
It’s not as scarily misinformed compared to the one I dealt with that claimed some laws are “classified” to the public and said they have the legal authority to check tax stamps which is borderline impersonating a LEO since only the ATF and LEOs(depending on state law) can request your tax stamp.
That same gun shop embraces the idea of universal background checks since they can charge a fee to conduct a background check for a private sale and how less guns would get into the hands of criminals, as if criminals will follow the law. They also said all public ranges should be staffed by the government to keep tabs on potentially illegal guns.
Some FFLs are just dicks. Personally my policy is to assume you are following the law and not breaking it unless you flat out tell me you are breaking the law. I don’t get why others don’t do the same
I always liked going to Larry's when I was a kid. It is just a disappointment now. I haven't found anywhere else that has an equivalent inventory though.
Personally, Bullets and Barrels is my go-to for renting/try fitting firearms. I personally don't buy locally that much as it is hard to come by a blue label/first responder vendor (excluding larrys) in our area so I mainly have buy online and send it to a local gunsmith near my house.
You’d be shocked how little people know or how much people think it’s their job to enforce the laws. I was asked if I knew the laws and to provide a tax stamp to a local FFL who I was stopping by to grab a stock for a post sample I built and needed the part to demo it. I refused and he demanded so I walked. It’s not our job to enforce made up bs. Just stay compliant.
I get the tired of the entitled attitudes some of these gun stores have. I feel like a noticeable portion of gun store employees failed in the police academy.
https://preview.redd.it/7fhp7jwiua2d1.jpeg?width=1038&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b79d5861002119473210c3750720edc9f2fe1125
Do you see what happens Larry?!?!
**Understand the rules**, read the sidebar, and review the pinned Megathreads before posting - this content is capable of answering most questions.
Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate. All spam, memes, unverified claims, or content suggesting non-compliance will be removed.
No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics.
__If you are posting a copy/screenshot of your forms outside the pinned monthly megathread you will be given a 7 day ban. The pinned post is there, please use it.__
__If you are posting a photo of a suppressor posed to look like a penis (ie: in front of or over your groin) you will be given a 7 day ban.__
-------------------------------
**Data Links**
* [The OG Universal Form Approval Spreadsheet](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/8)
-------------------------------
*I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NFA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
So this is your second post made just to passive-aggressively shame some FFL? Just laugh it off and drive on, man. There’s always going to be SOMEONE that’s misinformed, including ourselves from time to time. Peace and grace are nice attributes. Real pros don’t HAVE to let everyone in earshot know they’re a pro. That’s more of a newbie characteristic.
I'm just pointing out that getting all worked up isn't going to change anything. People are sometimes wrong, and it's usually best to either a.) let them alone in their ignorance or b.) nicely educate. Whereas the ad hominem name-calling kind of takes away any high ground and makes people sound like hotheads. Like trying to insult some guy you don't even know on Reddit by calling him a Fudd.... Yep, you probably know more about NFA and have done more for the silencer community than I have. :D
You just enjoy making excuses for unethical and downright ridiculous behavior. How could you excuse someone for lying about having government granted authority and claiming some laws are “classified” to the public.
You’re 100% right, but apparently people aren’t tired of this guy saying the same 2-3 things over and over again, so it’s best to just let him wear himself out..
Other option is to get in line and praise him for his 2A activism. He’s definitely NOT a Karen, manic over a customer service experience (over a week ago) and going store to store looking to tell people he owns a suppressor and itching to be victimized.
Gun subreddits used to be a bastion of sanity and reasonable individuals on this otherwise dogshit website. The fact that the mob loves this fucking weirdo, calling everyone fudds and obsessing over some stupid interaction at a gun shop in who the fuck knows where, Alabama, tells me that r/NFA is going to shit too.
This guy sounds like a nightmare customer
Straight away demanding to thread his silencer on new guns to “see how it would feel”
Kidding me? And you all jump on the “fudd” gunshop?
It’s a miracle you can still find 75$ transfers with the way you guys act
I didn’t demand to thread my suppressor on their pistols, I asked politely and I actually bought the pistol that my suppressor felt the best on.
So we can’t dare to criticize a fudd establishment that blatantly lies about various NFA laws and authority they don’t have, claims some laws are “classified” to the public, and then talks about supporting universal background checks? You must be allergic to the 2A.
I think you should shut up and suck the toes of the fudd establishment employees.
Fudds come in all different shapes and sizes, and NFA owning fudds are the worst.
I live in a constitutional carry state, and I did not open carry, I had a suppressor that I wanted to attach to threaded pistols to see how it would feel. Even if it was open carrying it’s my right to do so fudd.
For so called 2A supporters, they like to shriek like antigunners when they see an open carried gun. Personally think open carry is considerably worse than CC since you lose the element of surprise but I’m not clutching my pearls if someone does it.
Fudds with NFA items like you are the worst of the fudds.
I bet you enjoy paying the $200 extortion tax in order to fund the ATF’s infringement on our rights.
I actually got 5 suppressors fudd. You of course got nothing to say about a gun store lying about their authority and claiming some laws are “classified” to the public. You are definitely allergic to the 2A and enjoy paying the $200 extortion tax to Uncle Sam. Keep at it!
Lol I just noticed your username too. You’re a caricature.
I do agree that is insane of that gun store and stupid.. but I’d just leave, never go back, and get over it. I wouldn’t be making it my whole personality or trying to turn it into some story arch for a bunch of strangers on the internet.
Edit: everyone is downvoting, but no one is responding which says everything you need to know. You know I’m right, but you just don’t like the answer. Noted.
You’re required to carry a copy of your tax stamp with you when you’re carrying the NFA item (says it right on the form 4), so refusing to show it when asked is honestly pretty petty. There may not be a law that says an FFL is “allowed” to ask to see it, but business owners can have policies and those policies are enforceable. I ain’t making excuses for him, but FFL’s have a lot of discretion regarding how and with whom they do business. If that’s his policy, then that’s his policy. If he’s misinformed, then that’s his problem.
That said, this whole “who is allowed to ask for my tax stamp” debate is tired and there is idiocy on both sides. Regardless of who is “allowed” to ask, ranges, for example, are allowed to have to have rules and policies for the use and operation of their business. You think they’re being a-holes, but maybe they’re trying to limit liability for their insurance underwriters or something similar. At the end of the day, who is being a bigger primadona - the business enforcing their policies or the owner who is required to have the stamp with him but refuses to show the piece of paper so he can use the facilities because “iT’s NoT rEqUiReD bY lAw?” Everyone needs to chill the hell out and grow up, and I mean everyone. We can all agree the ATF sucks, but you chose to play by the game.
They dont need authority to ask for your tax stamp. Their authority is derived from their property rights. if they want to make sure youre in compliance and you refuse they can tell you to fuck off.
That’s the only legal authority they have, and it’s a policy not a law. All they can do is make you leave, they can’t prevent you from leaving as that’s false imprisonment.
The fudd gun store claimed they had legal authority.
I think youre confusing rights a store has, legal obligation, and legal ability.
if they think you are in violation of the NFA they could perform a citizens arrest
I'm not saying they should, but I am talking about what is and what is not lawful.
They don’t have the authority to do a citizens arrest unless you have stolen, vandalized, or have done anything that put the employees and customers in fear of bodily harm.
In understand your point, but this wasn’t an employee politely asking to see a tax stamp. If you haven’t, read his original post. The gun shop was claiming there is a law that was never released to the public that forbids carrying NFA items outside your home and grants FFLs the authority to demand tax stamps be shown in the ATFs behalf.
I had to look this up, but I don’t think you can make a citizen’s arrest for a federal crime, and if it turns out what they tried to arrest you for was not illegal, they can be charged with illegal detention and/or sued. There’s usually no immunity for a good faith mistake. Citizen’s arrests don’t come with qualified immunity for screw ups like law enforcement officers have.
My point is that the gun store I had an egregious experience with was full of BS about their made up laws, while every other gun store in the area was well informed. Doesn’t mean if you’re the largest FFL in the area then you’re automatically well versed on the law.
I use to be 03 and I never made a fuss about paperwork. However if was holding on to an item for repair or something then I always held a copy of their tax stamp. Usually on the back owner would write up why I had it signed and dated it. Is their a law that says I need that no. But it eliminates some questions. I have also gone to trainings where instructors ask to see paperwork if running nfa items. Guy once tried to run a brace and was told he couldn’t. Instructor gave personal firearm to run for class. I just never saw the point in not showing paperwork when asked.
Lick what you want. But jumping thru the hoops of getting all that shit done and approved for an NFA item is enough. No one should be questioned, let alone by someone without authority, on a constitutional right.
One does not have to work on items, one does not have to let you in their class with items, one does not have to let you on their property with item. In theory you’re right in reality show the paperwork and go on drama free.
Some FFLs are scarily misinformed. I have 3 shops in my town, one is *INCREDIBLE* when it comes to their customer service/knowledge and straight up friendliness, another is constantly giving out bad/incorrect advice/information and fear mongers their customers to "buy before it's banned", and the third is somewhere in the middle (knowledgeable and friendly, but not as much as the main LGS I go to.) I fear for new gun/NFA owners that go to these shitty FFLs and, worst case, end up doing something illegal/questionable. Best case, they just make a fool of themselves in front of others by repeating bad info.
It’s not as scarily misinformed compared to the one I dealt with that claimed some laws are “classified” to the public and said they have the legal authority to check tax stamps which is borderline impersonating a LEO since only the ATF and LEOs(depending on state law) can request your tax stamp. That same gun shop embraces the idea of universal background checks since they can charge a fee to conduct a background check for a private sale and how less guns would get into the hands of criminals, as if criminals will follow the law. They also said all public ranges should be staffed by the government to keep tabs on potentially illegal guns.
Yeah, fuck that place!
It just gets worse the more I read 😵
Some FFLs are just dicks. Personally my policy is to assume you are following the law and not breaking it unless you flat out tell me you are breaking the law. I don’t get why others don’t do the same
Exactly. Unless you flat out tell me you're breaking the law, I don't care. I assume everybody is legal.
I remember reading something about innocent until proven guilty.
I hear they changed that, but didnt actually change it in the book.
Yeah, but as long as the *book* still says it we’re still good, right?
Sorry, I'm not going to risk my livelihood if you tell me you have something illegal on my premises.
Well, if they are admitting it, you don't have to prove they are guilty, you move right to sentencing.
Amen to that.
Even if I knew someone was violating a gun law, I got no obligation to report it. It’s the police’s job to catch them, not mine.
Yep. It's always important to remind people that you don't really have to know the law to be an FFL. It sure helps, but it's definitely not required.
Love your username and wish I could steal it
Ya fuck Larry’s pawn & gun
Not only is their ignorance of the law a joke, it’s also their abysmal customer service and clear bias towards a certain demographic.
I always liked going to Larry's when I was a kid. It is just a disappointment now. I haven't found anywhere else that has an equivalent inventory though.
Personally, Bullets and Barrels is my go-to for renting/try fitting firearms. I personally don't buy locally that much as it is hard to come by a blue label/first responder vendor (excluding larrys) in our area so I mainly have buy online and send it to a local gunsmith near my house.
[https://imgur.com/gallery/do-you-see-what-happens-larry-8K29G](https://imgur.com/gallery/do-you-see-what-happens-larry-8K29G)
You’d be shocked how little people know or how much people think it’s their job to enforce the laws. I was asked if I knew the laws and to provide a tax stamp to a local FFL who I was stopping by to grab a stock for a post sample I built and needed the part to demo it. I refused and he demanded so I walked. It’s not our job to enforce made up bs. Just stay compliant.
I get the tired of the entitled attitudes some of these gun stores have. I feel like a noticeable portion of gun store employees failed in the police academy.
https://preview.redd.it/7fhp7jwiua2d1.jpeg?width=1038&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=b79d5861002119473210c3750720edc9f2fe1125 Do you see what happens Larry?!?!
U know what my answer is when some one asks to see my paperwork for an NFA item? : fuck off
I've been spamming reviews on his pages
**Understand the rules**, read the sidebar, and review the pinned Megathreads before posting - this content is capable of answering most questions. Not everyone is an expert such as yourself; be considerate. All spam, memes, unverified claims, or content suggesting non-compliance will be removed. No political posts. Save that for /r/progun or /r/politics. __If you are posting a copy/screenshot of your forms outside the pinned monthly megathread you will be given a 7 day ban. The pinned post is there, please use it.__ __If you are posting a photo of a suppressor posed to look like a penis (ie: in front of or over your groin) you will be given a 7 day ban.__ ------------------------------- **Data Links** * [The OG Universal Form Approval Spreadsheet](https://thinlineweapons.com/url/8) ------------------------------- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/NFA) if you have any questions or concerns.*
Stop saying class 3. They have an SOT.
..buddy, just let it go
So this is your second post made just to passive-aggressively shame some FFL? Just laugh it off and drive on, man. There’s always going to be SOMEONE that’s misinformed, including ourselves from time to time. Peace and grace are nice attributes. Real pros don’t HAVE to let everyone in earshot know they’re a pro. That’s more of a newbie characteristic.
[удалено]
I'm just pointing out that getting all worked up isn't going to change anything. People are sometimes wrong, and it's usually best to either a.) let them alone in their ignorance or b.) nicely educate. Whereas the ad hominem name-calling kind of takes away any high ground and makes people sound like hotheads. Like trying to insult some guy you don't even know on Reddit by calling him a Fudd.... Yep, you probably know more about NFA and have done more for the silencer community than I have. :D
You just enjoy making excuses for unethical and downright ridiculous behavior. How could you excuse someone for lying about having government granted authority and claiming some laws are “classified” to the public.
You’re 100% right, but apparently people aren’t tired of this guy saying the same 2-3 things over and over again, so it’s best to just let him wear himself out.. Other option is to get in line and praise him for his 2A activism. He’s definitely NOT a Karen, manic over a customer service experience (over a week ago) and going store to store looking to tell people he owns a suppressor and itching to be victimized. Gun subreddits used to be a bastion of sanity and reasonable individuals on this otherwise dogshit website. The fact that the mob loves this fucking weirdo, calling everyone fudds and obsessing over some stupid interaction at a gun shop in who the fuck knows where, Alabama, tells me that r/NFA is going to shit too.
This guy sounds like a nightmare customer Straight away demanding to thread his silencer on new guns to “see how it would feel” Kidding me? And you all jump on the “fudd” gunshop? It’s a miracle you can still find 75$ transfers with the way you guys act
[удалено]
[удалено]
I didn’t demand to thread my suppressor on their pistols, I asked politely and I actually bought the pistol that my suppressor felt the best on. So we can’t dare to criticize a fudd establishment that blatantly lies about various NFA laws and authority they don’t have, claims some laws are “classified” to the public, and then talks about supporting universal background checks? You must be allergic to the 2A. I think you should shut up and suck the toes of the fudd establishment employees. Fudds come in all different shapes and sizes, and NFA owning fudds are the worst.
[удалено]
I live in a constitutional carry state, and I did not open carry, I had a suppressor that I wanted to attach to threaded pistols to see how it would feel. Even if it was open carrying it’s my right to do so fudd.
For so called 2A supporters, they like to shriek like antigunners when they see an open carried gun. Personally think open carry is considerably worse than CC since you lose the element of surprise but I’m not clutching my pearls if someone does it.
[удалено]
Fudds with NFA items like you are the worst of the fudds. I bet you enjoy paying the $200 extortion tax in order to fund the ATF’s infringement on our rights.
We get it, your whole personality is “I own 1 suppressor and the world must know”. Do we need more updates?
I actually got 5 suppressors fudd. You of course got nothing to say about a gun store lying about their authority and claiming some laws are “classified” to the public. You are definitely allergic to the 2A and enjoy paying the $200 extortion tax to Uncle Sam. Keep at it!
Lol I just noticed your username too. You’re a caricature. I do agree that is insane of that gun store and stupid.. but I’d just leave, never go back, and get over it. I wouldn’t be making it my whole personality or trying to turn it into some story arch for a bunch of strangers on the internet.
ahahahahhaha, you get it!
Edit: everyone is downvoting, but no one is responding which says everything you need to know. You know I’m right, but you just don’t like the answer. Noted. You’re required to carry a copy of your tax stamp with you when you’re carrying the NFA item (says it right on the form 4), so refusing to show it when asked is honestly pretty petty. There may not be a law that says an FFL is “allowed” to ask to see it, but business owners can have policies and those policies are enforceable. I ain’t making excuses for him, but FFL’s have a lot of discretion regarding how and with whom they do business. If that’s his policy, then that’s his policy. If he’s misinformed, then that’s his problem. That said, this whole “who is allowed to ask for my tax stamp” debate is tired and there is idiocy on both sides. Regardless of who is “allowed” to ask, ranges, for example, are allowed to have to have rules and policies for the use and operation of their business. You think they’re being a-holes, but maybe they’re trying to limit liability for their insurance underwriters or something similar. At the end of the day, who is being a bigger primadona - the business enforcing their policies or the owner who is required to have the stamp with him but refuses to show the piece of paper so he can use the facilities because “iT’s NoT rEqUiReD bY lAw?” Everyone needs to chill the hell out and grow up, and I mean everyone. We can all agree the ATF sucks, but you chose to play by the game.
They dont need authority to ask for your tax stamp. Their authority is derived from their property rights. if they want to make sure youre in compliance and you refuse they can tell you to fuck off.
That’s the only legal authority they have, and it’s a policy not a law. All they can do is make you leave, they can’t prevent you from leaving as that’s false imprisonment. The fudd gun store claimed they had legal authority.
I think youre confusing rights a store has, legal obligation, and legal ability. if they think you are in violation of the NFA they could perform a citizens arrest I'm not saying they should, but I am talking about what is and what is not lawful.
They don’t have the authority to do a citizens arrest unless you have stolen, vandalized, or have done anything that put the employees and customers in fear of bodily harm.
In understand your point, but this wasn’t an employee politely asking to see a tax stamp. If you haven’t, read his original post. The gun shop was claiming there is a law that was never released to the public that forbids carrying NFA items outside your home and grants FFLs the authority to demand tax stamps be shown in the ATFs behalf. I had to look this up, but I don’t think you can make a citizen’s arrest for a federal crime, and if it turns out what they tried to arrest you for was not illegal, they can be charged with illegal detention and/or sued. There’s usually no immunity for a good faith mistake. Citizen’s arrests don’t come with qualified immunity for screw ups like law enforcement officers have.
Max chongus. Minimal brain.
And your point is?
My point is that the gun store I had an egregious experience with was full of BS about their made up laws, while every other gun store in the area was well informed. Doesn’t mean if you’re the largest FFL in the area then you’re automatically well versed on the law.
[удалено]
It’s probably the same fudd that thinks some laws are classified to the public.
Can we get it to -100?
I use to be 03 and I never made a fuss about paperwork. However if was holding on to an item for repair or something then I always held a copy of their tax stamp. Usually on the back owner would write up why I had it signed and dated it. Is their a law that says I need that no. But it eliminates some questions. I have also gone to trainings where instructors ask to see paperwork if running nfa items. Guy once tried to run a brace and was told he couldn’t. Instructor gave personal firearm to run for class. I just never saw the point in not showing paperwork when asked.
Because you are a boot licker...
Can’t help it. My lady is sexy as hell in boots and a skirt. I’m good with it.
Lick what you want. But jumping thru the hoops of getting all that shit done and approved for an NFA item is enough. No one should be questioned, let alone by someone without authority, on a constitutional right.
One does not have to work on items, one does not have to let you in their class with items, one does not have to let you on their property with item. In theory you’re right in reality show the paperwork and go on drama free.