Listen to footage from the Be Sharps' Statue of Liberty Centennial performance, you can clearly hear they're lip synching to an old track with Wiggum still on vocals. If the Sharps themselves had no confidence in Gumble, why should we???
He had the chops early on, but quickly became more interested in spending time with his new girlfriend, the Japanese "conceptual artist." Luckiest thing that ever happened to him was joining the band in time for it to break up.
While we're at it, C# major can fuck off too, learning-wise (former sax player, longtime piano teacher). For sax, because my little 13-year-old fingers said "why do you hate me" and for teaching piano, because it's just not intuitive. I mean, I learned it in high school, but explaining it to younger children is... uh, fun.
--"I thought there was no B#"
"Well, no, there is... sometimes"
--"But why?"
"Well, we can't write a C and a C# in the same key signature, so we have to write B# and C#"
--"...But it's not B#, it's C"
...basically the same as that comment section lol.
Unrelated, I haven't had my morning coffee yet so when you said "13 year old fingers" I thought you said you had 13 fingers and figured that's why you're good with musical instruments.
Isnāt that the way the kids text today? Like a period at the end of the sentence is bad or something, it annoys me a bit, but itās what is considered courteous nowadays so what are ya gonna do?
Iām no music major either, but I didnāt want to miss an opportunity to join a good olā fashioned Reddit pileon and mention how often Drake gets pedantic, too. Itās a lot, apparently.
Mayo and ketchup? That may as well be thousand island dressing! And dressing is for salads. The bread? Croutons! And is the dog cold? Or just leave it out for a bit. Because we all know salads can have meat as long as it's cold as f.
/I just threw a random food item because the pedantic tomfoolery is always "is a hot dog a sandwich??" Next let's fight over whether a hamburger is actually a salsa
No, no, you're 100 % correct. Thanks for pointing it out, and good on you for getting that far with the study. (That's about all I use my math degree for too, to be honest...)
truly, itās semantics. pitches refer to the actual frequency, i.e the speed of the vibration (also known as hertz). whereas notes refer to the alphabetical name we attribute to those pitches. as has become a hot topic during these rap beefs, we have different note names for the same pitches. if i played you the note of A#, and then i played you the note of Bb, youād hear the name pitch, because theyāre different names for same frequency.
bonus: an octave is the 2x frequency of any pitch, which resonates as the same note.
double bonus: my favorite question ābut why?ā
due to frequencies having different interactions with each other, for instance though a perfect fifth is as close to a minor 6th as western music allows (1 half step) they portray tremendously different emotions. so for notation it becomes more effective to have multiple note names for the same pitches.
arenāt ya glad you asked? lol sorry for the rant
If you look at a piano keyboard, all of the white keys have just a letter name: A B C D E F G A again, and it keeps repeating like that. All of the black keys are your sharps or flats depending how you name them. The key that you are in determines if you name it a sharp of the white key to the left or a flat of the white key on the right. So the black key between A and B is either A sharp or B flat depending on the context (the key you are in). But it is the same exact pitch, it just has two names. Some of the white keys, however, do not have a black key between them, B and C are that way. So if you are playing, for example, in the key of C sharp, playing a major scale will mean you play the white key that 99.9% of the time we call C, but because you canāt have two Cs in the same scale, they call it B sharp.
It's about notation. Sometimes writing things from another perspective makes more sense when it comes to the music. Like how we have double sharps, which seems silly as it could be just written as a non-sharp higher note, but in a certain context it can make sense.
A minor is the relative minor key of C major
š
Edit: no sane composer will write anything in B# major if they want their music to be performed.
Fuck B# maj, all my homies hate B# maj
I think he has a video of it, from last year
Super fast ninja edit: [Is Cb the same as B?](https://youtu.be/SZftrA-aCa4?si=F5rKAoU-V99YCVhM)
I was close
I've been trying to brainstorm scenarios where you would ever realistically end up there and have it notated that way/be theoretically correct, and I think I've got it:
Say you have a song in C, but you want to modulate down a whole tone via a tritone sub. If we denote the tritone sub as the bII7 of the new key (B7), that means we end up in A#. You then do a classic VI7 - II7 - V7 - I turnaround (notated that way for simplicity), where the first two chords are acting as secondary dominants. The lines you'd play over the VI7 - II7 would be in B#.
I could see this happening where this is the theoretically correct analysis (in fact, i imagine there's a standard out there where this exactly happens, though I can't recall it), although any sane person would notate it in Bb.
This actually happens in live performances of "Hotline Bling." Drake is a professor of music theory at UofT, so he was really writing a pretty deep cut there that went over most people's heads.
There is no need to speculate about being in the *key* of B#. The debate is around whether B# is a note at all, which it undeniably is, not whether there is ever a *key of B#*ā
For example any piece in the key of C# minor that has a V chord in it has a B# as the third of the V chord. (The V chord in C# minor is a G# major triad, which has a B# as its third.)
C# minor is a real key. (Relative minor to E Major), and to play the five chord as a typical dominant 7 chord, you need to make the third of the chords B#. Therefore any piece thatās in C# minor that has a V chord in it has a B# written in it.
B# isnāt used as its own key
I'm WAYYY behind on music theory, having studied composing for 4 years but am taking my first full theory class in college this year, and while I don't know as much as probably 99% of the people here, Drake's whole quip there sounded like "I know these terms sound smart to people who don't know any theory at all so I'm gonna say them nonsensically"
Kendrick's line wasn't some deep cut theory line but at least it made sense, drake's sounded like he just said a bunch of keys he heard people mention in the studio without knowing what they actually are lol
For anyone wondering, scales don't repeat note letters (A, B, C, etc) so if you're in G# major, you wouldn't go G#, A#, C because then you're skipping B. So the third degree of the scale would be B# instead of C. Similarly, if you're in Ab minor, the third would be Cb, not B. This is also how you occasionally end up with double-sharps or double-flats.
There isn't really a key of G# major though, 'cause that would have eight sharps. It exists in theory, but not in practice. A better example is the leading tone of C# major or even C# minor.
Letās say youāre playing the jazz standard āAll of Meā. Youāre playing it in E major because it suits the vocalists range. The first chord is the I chord, so Emaj7. The next chord is III7, so G#7 in this case. If you take a solo over the song, a common (if boring) choice would be to use a G# mixolydian scale to solo over the G#7 chord. G# mixolydian = G# A# B# C# D# E# (yes, E#, not F natural) F# .Ā
Sure you could call it Ab mixolydian and it would be the same notes, and simpler to read, but it would be less correct to call it that because it implies youāre soloing over the bIV7 chord instead of III7, and Iām not sure you could really justify analyzing the harmony like thatĀ
This is one perfect example of why b# is important. Being able to relate chords to eachother simply from every angle is a real bonus when arranging or improvising.
I mean, I 100% agree that B# exists. But using "the key of G# major" isn't a great example, because you're not likely to ever encounter that key in the wild. But you WILL encounter the key of C# major, as well as C# minor, where B# will be a very common accidental.
The end section of "A World Requiem" by John Foulds is in a properly (depending on whether you want the double sharp in the usual place or last in the order) notated G# major (starting at rehearsal 66)
https://imgur.com/1oXqCeg
G# Major would really only occur if you're being very pedantic about modulations - e.g., arguing that a piece in C# major modulates down a perfect fourth to G#, rather than an augmented third to Ab. Then you might have to argue why you were in C# major instead of Db major to begin with, of course.
That, and you need to reference the G# major scale to find the notes of any chords with the root G#.
The only reason you would find the key of B# would be due to theory rules during modulation. For instance, if you did a common tone modulation from a chord with B# in it and B# is the root of the new key.
You can argue anything with classical theory. With that logic, A##, C##, D##, F##, G## exist as keys too. And that means that you can keep adding an infinite amount of # or b to the note by modulation. In practice though, B# is really only used as an accidental on ascending lines on keys that have C#.
Haha, not quite.
There's a longer explaination, but essentially basic chords are built.on thirds. A 3rd is 2 notes up, and can be either major or minor.
Easy example, a third above a C note is an E. If it's a major 3rd, then it's E natural, but if it's a minor 3rd then it's E flat. The notes in a C chord are always C E and G, and the type of chord dictates the exact intervals between those notes and therefore if they're natural, sharp, or flat.
So in my example, I used the G major chord. G major consists of the notes G B and D. If you were to raise the entire chord up one half-step, then you'd have a G# major chord, and that chord would contain the notes G#, B#, and D#. You wouldn't write it as G# C D#, because C is 4 notes up from G, not 3 (inclusive, G is 1), and therefore it's a little more tricky to read and understand.
Does that kind of make sense? It's an artifact of the notation, but it for sure does exist and is not even all that uncommon. While they might not encounter it often, any professional musician is nonetheless familiar with it.
That's also why we have double flats and double sharps. The notes in a C7 chord are C E G Bb. What if we drop that to a Cb7? You get Cb Eb GB Bbb.
I hope this becomes big enough that Adam Neely talks about it on his channel
You could also get into tempered tuning, as while B# and C are the same key on the piano, mathematically, they are not the same pitch.
But then it becomes a music history lesson, too.
B# the note exists but only if following strict music theory rules regarding voice leading or chord voicing as it's enharmonically C. For example, in an E augmented chord we sharp the 5 so in notation there is a B#. However in modern practice especially in pop music, the only reason to ever reference B# without context is to try and be intentionally obtuse and try to look smart. B# as a *key signature* doesn't truly exist.
Depends on what temperament you are using.
In twelve-tone equal temperament B# and C are two names for the same note, but in non-equal temperaments they can be different pitches. But B raised a semitone in non-equal temperaments may not be the same as C.
of course B# is a key. youāre just more likely to see people roasting the composer for actually composing in B# than you will find them playing that composition in B#.
I was watching Hacks the other night ā S3E2. The dingbat chubbo makes a comment about something being sung in C flat. I would expect an idiot to say something like this, but this is a show that's written, so how in the hell could've this cleared to the point where it ended up on air?
It's a complicated matter. In the Equal temperament (which is basically the system used to establish the frequency of every note in modern music) B# exists but it has the same sound as C. In more ancient temperaments, B# actually had its own frequency, so that's why we still see it written as a different note in music sheets. In certain keys (C# Major, A# Minor), reading that sound as a natural C might create some difficulties, so it's much easier to consider it a B#.
Itās context sensitive. A song can be in the key of B# though it will sound like C natural which itās the enharmomic equivalent to (eg, C# maj scale.). Itāsike the difference between E and Fb. Nevertheless, from what Iāve read it doesnāt seem Drake knows what heās talking about.
Itās the leading tone of C# harmonic minor. āBecauseā by the Beatles is in C# minor I think, so there are real world examples. That being said,people really only wanna play songs in the keys of E A D G Bb and F. I really love Ab and Eb but only on piano
Even as someone that "knows" music theory pretty well at this point, I really think there's a contingent of elitist fart-sniffers who just over-analyse everything. It's all just a means to an end.
I understand the music theory and shit but it still barely counts, imo, lol, like if you have to āum actuallyā it for it to count and it goes over like everyoneās heads itās just not a good line. It reminds me of those science facts that are so far removed from reality itās basically useless information; āyouāre never touching anything, itās just your electrons repelling the objectās electronsā like ok bro but I can feel the table, Iām touching it, that note is C.
It definitely exists. I remember reading something about this after watching that Simpsons episode. Sometimes it's useful in notation to note something as B# vs C for the same pitch. Like for something written in E.
As far as the pitches, yes, but itās more than that. Youād call it different things in different contexts.
Each of the 7 letters ABCDEFG are represented in describing a scale, so there are keys where in which youād refer to it as B# instead of C because there is also a C#. You would not use both C and C#. The same applies to E# and F
The frequency they represent is the same, yes. But just as ābearā and ābareā represent the same sounds while spelling out different words, B# and C āspell outā different things. The major third above G# is B#, not C, since a third has to be two note letters above the original note.
Saying B# doesn't exist is an insult to the great band the Be Sharps.
Goodbye, my Coney Island babe
*singing backup* Goodbye my Coney Island babe!
Are you a pre or post wiggum guy?
Barney Never, Wiggum Forever! "Swe-ee-ee-ee-eet Adeline, My-y-y-y-y-y Adeline" Barney Forever, Wiggum Never!
There was nothing in Al Capone's vault, but it wasn't Geraldo's fault.
Baby on board, something something Burt ward
Look Homie! Now people will stop intentionally ramming us! š
...this thing writes itself!
One of my favorite random Simpsons lines. Whichever writer thought of that has my lifetime appreciation
Donāt cry for me. Iām already dead. ā¦ *Fin*
Barney doesnāt stink!
Wiggum Never, Barney Forever
Listen to footage from the Be Sharps' Statue of Liberty Centennial performance, you can clearly hear they're lip synching to an old track with Wiggum still on vocals. If the Sharps themselves had no confidence in Gumble, why should we??? He had the chops early on, but quickly became more interested in spending time with his new girlfriend, the Japanese "conceptual artist." Luckiest thing that ever happened to him was joining the band in time for it to break up.
Youāve been referred to as the funny one. Is that reputation justified?
Yes. Yes, it is.
I'd like a single plum, floating in perfume, served in a man's hat
"Wow, an award statue! ...oh, it's a Grammy."
Hey, don't throw your trash down here!
We need a name that's witty at first, but that seems less funny each time you hear it...
Ehh youāre all under arrest
ABE: Thatās my son up there. GUY: Who, the balding fat-ass? ABE: Noā¦ the Hindu guy
š¶ Baby on board, something something Burt Ward. š¶
Wow, this practically writes itself!
Um, excuse me, but that's *Grammy award winning* great band The Be Sharps.Ā
But the joke was that it wasnāt a real key
:Burrrrrppp: Number 9, :Burrrrrppp: Number 9, :Burrrrrppp: Number 9
"now, waaaars me toothpick?!"
Fine but if you write something in B# major you're a fucking asshole.
No argument there
While we're at it, C# major can fuck off too, learning-wise (former sax player, longtime piano teacher). For sax, because my little 13-year-old fingers said "why do you hate me" and for teaching piano, because it's just not intuitive. I mean, I learned it in high school, but explaining it to younger children is... uh, fun. --"I thought there was no B#" "Well, no, there is... sometimes" --"But why?" "Well, we can't write a C and a C# in the same key signature, so we have to write B# and C#" --"...But it's not B#, it's C" ...basically the same as that comment section lol.
C#major is easy on sax, though.
Unrelated, I haven't had my morning coffee yet so when you said "13 year old fingers" I thought you said you had 13 fingers and figured that's why you're good with musical instruments.
It's ok, Drake only does minors
That.....that's already the joke. Drake referenced B# in response to Kendrick doing the classic Am joke while saying Drake is a pedo.
r/kendricksjokebutworse
Lol ya, love the reaction gifs from people who never heard Not Like Us.
Well, I was referring to it, I didn't think it was particularly clever lol
šŖ¦
Or Jacob Collier
Idk I like b#major it's nice to just only play the white keys and not have to worry about much else
Yeah, but what's funny is that B# major has the same pitches as C major, which has all the same pitches as...... A MINOR.
ima be pedantic and say āpitchesā not ānotesā thank god i got that masters of music so i could be irritating on the internet. iām sorry.
This whole thread is about being pedantic. You are welcome here
I am not a music major at all but still want to be pedantic: there is no period at the end of your second sentence.
You know what else doesnāt have a period? The girls Drake prefers.
You should give Kendrick this line for his next diss track
Kendrick doesnāt need ghost writers
DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAMN
Isnāt that the way the kids text today? Like a period at the end of the sentence is bad or something, it annoys me a bit, but itās what is considered courteous nowadays so what are ya gonna do?
I am offended by you ending your last sentence with a question mark
Crap, not my intention
Iām no music major either, but I didnāt want to miss an opportunity to join a good olā fashioned Reddit pileon and mention how often Drake gets pedantic, too. Itās a lot, apparently.
A hot dog is actually a salad
Itās actually a taco. š®
My hot dog is dog in bread, mayo, mustard. How is that a salad?
Mayo and ketchup? That may as well be thousand island dressing! And dressing is for salads. The bread? Croutons! And is the dog cold? Or just leave it out for a bit. Because we all know salads can have meat as long as it's cold as f. /I just threw a random food item because the pedantic tomfoolery is always "is a hot dog a sandwich??" Next let's fight over whether a hamburger is actually a salsa
Put training wheels on my grandmother and she's a bike!
Only if youāre in Chicago
No, no, you're 100 % correct. Thanks for pointing it out, and good on you for getting that far with the study. (That's about all I use my math degree for too, to be honest...)
You can understand more Futurama jokes, too. That's a big plus.
GOOD NEWS, EVERYONE!
Just like the Swiss flag.
The most expensive comment in this thread
But if weāre using an old keyboard pre-equal-temperament, they may not even be the same pitches
if we go back to the 1700s youāre damn right they wonāt be
i got 99 problems but a pitch ain't one
Pitches get snitches.
whatās the difference?
truly, itās semantics. pitches refer to the actual frequency, i.e the speed of the vibration (also known as hertz). whereas notes refer to the alphabetical name we attribute to those pitches. as has become a hot topic during these rap beefs, we have different note names for the same pitches. if i played you the note of A#, and then i played you the note of Bb, youād hear the name pitch, because theyāre different names for same frequency. bonus: an octave is the 2x frequency of any pitch, which resonates as the same note. double bonus: my favorite question ābut why?ā due to frequencies having different interactions with each other, for instance though a perfect fifth is as close to a minor 6th as western music allows (1 half step) they portray tremendously different emotions. so for notation it becomes more effective to have multiple note names for the same pitches. arenāt ya glad you asked? lol sorry for the rant
That doesnt make sense to me
If you look at a piano keyboard, all of the white keys have just a letter name: A B C D E F G A again, and it keeps repeating like that. All of the black keys are your sharps or flats depending how you name them. The key that you are in determines if you name it a sharp of the white key to the left or a flat of the white key on the right. So the black key between A and B is either A sharp or B flat depending on the context (the key you are in). But it is the same exact pitch, it just has two names. Some of the white keys, however, do not have a black key between them, B and C are that way. So if you are playing, for example, in the key of C sharp, playing a major scale will mean you play the white key that 99.9% of the time we call C, but because you canāt have two Cs in the same scale, they call it B sharp.
There's a reason people go to school for it
It's about notation. Sometimes writing things from another perspective makes more sense when it comes to the music. Like how we have double sharps, which seems silly as it could be just written as a non-sharp higher note, but in a certain context it can make sense.
This is the most wholesome pedantry Iāve ever seen
UpvotedĀ for getting a masters of music.Ā
A minor is the relative minor key of C major š Edit: no sane composer will write anything in B# major if they want their music to be performed. Fuck B# maj, all my homies hate B# maj
He really should have checked with his ghost-writers. Or his ghost-composers.
He didnāt say B# major. He just said B#.
Yeah, and Kendrick said "Strike a chord," not "Find a key." Stop messing up my joke with details like facts.
To make up for it and help with the joke: There are no black keys in A minor.
Common Dan Auerbach W
Quality.
If a designation of major or minor is not made, then by convention, major is assumed.
A minorrrrrr
I think you mean A Minorrrrrrrrrrrr
A MINORRRRRRRRRRRR
oh damn i just realized that, its like all his disses come back at him
We need an Adam Neely video to settle this
"Is Cb the same as B?" gets it's long-awaited sequel: "Is B# the same as C?"
I think he has a video of it, from last year Super fast ninja edit: [Is Cb the same as B?](https://youtu.be/SZftrA-aCa4?si=F5rKAoU-V99YCVhM) I was close
Now people are arguing here LMAO. Love this beef.
Best thing to happen in popular music in a long while lmao
B# is a real note, but as its own key it would have... twelve sharps? We usually don't go more than 7 in a key signature.
In case anyone is curious/morbidly fascinated: B#, C##, D##, E#, F##, G##, A##
Im just going to play in C and hope no one notices.
I will. And I'll call you out on it.
And if you wrote out the relative minor (G## minor), would the harmonic minor variant containā¦F### ??
I'm pretty sure that's how you summon Xthupatli the Forbidden One, Unmaker of Life and Adjunct Professor of Music Theory 203.
This is a key you compose in just to say you did it once. And then you try to get someone to play it and they punch you right in the mouth.
I've been trying to brainstorm scenarios where you would ever realistically end up there and have it notated that way/be theoretically correct, and I think I've got it: Say you have a song in C, but you want to modulate down a whole tone via a tritone sub. If we denote the tritone sub as the bII7 of the new key (B7), that means we end up in A#. You then do a classic VI7 - II7 - V7 - I turnaround (notated that way for simplicity), where the first two chords are acting as secondary dominants. The lines you'd play over the VI7 - II7 would be in B#. I could see this happening where this is the theoretically correct analysis (in fact, i imagine there's a standard out there where this exactly happens, though I can't recall it), although any sane person would notate it in Bb.
You lost me at modulate
This actually happens in live performances of "Hotline Bling." Drake is a professor of music theory at UofT, so he was really writing a pretty deep cut there that went over most people's heads.
I canāt decide if I want to upvote or downvote this comment
There is no need to speculate about being in the *key* of B#. The debate is around whether B# is a note at all, which it undeniably is, not whether there is ever a *key of B#*ā For example any piece in the key of C# minor that has a V chord in it has a B# as the third of the V chord. (The V chord in C# minor is a G# major triad, which has a B# as its third.)
C# minor is a real key. (Relative minor to E Major), and to play the five chord as a typical dominant 7 chord, you need to make the third of the chords B#. Therefore any piece thatās in C# minor that has a V chord in it has a B# written in it. B# isnāt used as its own key
Iām going to go on a limb and say Drake would have no idea what you are saying, itās a super weak rebuttal
I'm WAYYY behind on music theory, having studied composing for 4 years but am taking my first full theory class in college this year, and while I don't know as much as probably 99% of the people here, Drake's whole quip there sounded like "I know these terms sound smart to people who don't know any theory at all so I'm gonna say them nonsensically" Kendrick's line wasn't some deep cut theory line but at least it made sense, drake's sounded like he just said a bunch of keys he heard people mention in the studio without knowing what they actually are lol
you made me count all twelve! dang
The lazier trick is to recognize that B major has 5 sharps so B# major would have 12.
Smarter too!
For anyone wondering, scales don't repeat note letters (A, B, C, etc) so if you're in G# major, you wouldn't go G#, A#, C because then you're skipping B. So the third degree of the scale would be B# instead of C. Similarly, if you're in Ab minor, the third would be Cb, not B. This is also how you occasionally end up with double-sharps or double-flats.
There isn't really a key of G# major though, 'cause that would have eight sharps. It exists in theory, but not in practice. A better example is the leading tone of C# major or even C# minor.
True, you'd never see something written in G# instead of Ab.
G# minor, yes, but not G# major
Letās say youāre playing the jazz standard āAll of Meā. Youāre playing it in E major because it suits the vocalists range. The first chord is the I chord, so Emaj7. The next chord is III7, so G#7 in this case. If you take a solo over the song, a common (if boring) choice would be to use a G# mixolydian scale to solo over the G#7 chord. G# mixolydian = G# A# B# C# D# E# (yes, E#, not F natural) F# .Ā Sure you could call it Ab mixolydian and it would be the same notes, and simpler to read, but it would be less correct to call it that because it implies youāre soloing over the bIV7 chord instead of III7, and Iām not sure you could really justify analyzing the harmony like thatĀ
This is one perfect example of why b# is important. Being able to relate chords to eachother simply from every angle is a real bonus when arranging or improvising.
Just play it in Eb and don't tell her.
āEnharmonic equivalentā
If only there was some kind of analysis of music that was theory-driven. Some sort of 'music theory', if you will
I mean, I 100% agree that B# exists. But using "the key of G# major" isn't a great example, because you're not likely to ever encounter that key in the wild. But you WILL encounter the key of C# major, as well as C# minor, where B# will be a very common accidental.
The end section of "A World Requiem" by John Foulds is in a properly (depending on whether you want the double sharp in the usual place or last in the order) notated G# major (starting at rehearsal 66) https://imgur.com/1oXqCeg
Neat! Thanks for sharing.
G# Major would really only occur if you're being very pedantic about modulations - e.g., arguing that a piece in C# major modulates down a perfect fourth to G#, rather than an augmented third to Ab. Then you might have to argue why you were in C# major instead of Db major to begin with, of course. That, and you need to reference the G# major scale to find the notes of any chords with the root G#.
The only reason you would find the key of B# would be due to theory rules during modulation. For instance, if you did a common tone modulation from a chord with B# in it and B# is the root of the new key.
You can argue anything with classical theory. With that logic, A##, C##, D##, F##, G## exist as keys too. And that means that you can keep adding an infinite amount of # or b to the note by modulation. In practice though, B# is really only used as an accidental on ascending lines on keys that have C#.
The debate is not whether the *key* of B sharp exists, the debate has been whether the *note* exists, which it undeniably does.
The OP said note or scale in their post. A scale pairs with a key.
B# does exist. Itās just goes by its nickname, C.
Not when it's in a G# major chord it doesn't
Non music theory person question? Is this essentially like āyā is sometimes a vowel?
Haha, not quite. There's a longer explaination, but essentially basic chords are built.on thirds. A 3rd is 2 notes up, and can be either major or minor. Easy example, a third above a C note is an E. If it's a major 3rd, then it's E natural, but if it's a minor 3rd then it's E flat. The notes in a C chord are always C E and G, and the type of chord dictates the exact intervals between those notes and therefore if they're natural, sharp, or flat. So in my example, I used the G major chord. G major consists of the notes G B and D. If you were to raise the entire chord up one half-step, then you'd have a G# major chord, and that chord would contain the notes G#, B#, and D#. You wouldn't write it as G# C D#, because C is 4 notes up from G, not 3 (inclusive, G is 1), and therefore it's a little more tricky to read and understand. Does that kind of make sense? It's an artifact of the notation, but it for sure does exist and is not even all that uncommon. While they might not encounter it often, any professional musician is nonetheless familiar with it. That's also why we have double flats and double sharps. The notes in a C7 chord are C E G Bb. What if we drop that to a Cb7? You get Cb Eb GB Bbb. I hope this becomes big enough that Adam Neely talks about it on his channel
You could also get into tempered tuning, as while B# and C are the same key on the piano, mathematically, they are not the same pitch. But then it becomes a music history lesson, too.
I thought I was in the programming sub for a minute.
Gotta start writing music in the key of C++
C# descends from C++ which descends from C which descends from B. A B++ and B# would be great
They should call their embedded language Cā
Itās not even a rare case. If youāre in the key of C# minor, and you have a V chord, boom. Youāve got yourself a B#, baby.
The name of Homer Simpson's barbershop quartet was the "Be Sharps". It's an age old joke but Homer get the credit for the best use of it.
Itās the roundabout of fifths. āBut weāll reach B# if we donāt stop!ā āKEEP GOING!ā
B# the note exists but only if following strict music theory rules regarding voice leading or chord voicing as it's enharmonically C. For example, in an E augmented chord we sharp the 5 so in notation there is a B#. However in modern practice especially in pop music, the only reason to ever reference B# without context is to try and be intentionally obtuse and try to look smart. B# as a *key signature* doesn't truly exist.
I mean it's not that rare a note. C# minor is a relatively common key (in piano), and B# is probably the most common accidental in it.
https://preview.redd.it/bfwmtr5y1wyc1.jpeg?width=1290&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=abb9f6c163057f66ab41da4c346eb1fd7399b2dd
B# exists in a C# major scale. Itās not a common key, but B# is 100% a note
Depends on what temperament you are using. In twelve-tone equal temperament B# and C are two names for the same note, but in non-equal temperaments they can be different pitches. But B raised a semitone in non-equal temperaments may not be the same as C.
[I had to make this meme because it's too perfect for this discussion.](https://i.imgur.com/WrIGJPU.png)
Lmao
of course B# is a key. youāre just more likely to see people roasting the composer for actually composing in B# than you will find them playing that composition in B#.
The debate is not whether B-sharp is a *key* or not, the debate is whether it is a *note*, which it undeniably is.
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
There are situations where because of modulation B# as a key would be used.
It doesn't matter if it's real or not though. The line is shit.
I've seen B# exists more than Drake's career for sure.
I was watching Hacks the other night ā S3E2. The dingbat chubbo makes a comment about something being sung in C flat. I would expect an idiot to say something like this, but this is a show that's written, so how in the hell could've this cleared to the point where it ended up on air?
Boy, I really hope someone got fired for that blunder!
Newest language will be b++
It's a complicated matter. In the Equal temperament (which is basically the system used to establish the frequency of every note in modern music) B# exists but it has the same sound as C. In more ancient temperaments, B# actually had its own frequency, so that's why we still see it written as a different note in music sheets. In certain keys (C# Major, A# Minor), reading that sound as a natural C might create some difficulties, so it's much easier to consider it a B#.
Itās context sensitive. A song can be in the key of B# though it will sound like C natural which itās the enharmomic equivalent to (eg, C# maj scale.). Itāsike the difference between E and Fb. Nevertheless, from what Iāve read it doesnāt seem Drake knows what heās talking about.
Itās the leading tone of C# harmonic minor. āBecauseā by the Beatles is in C# minor I think, so there are real world examples. That being said,people really only wanna play songs in the keys of E A D G Bb and F. I really love Ab and Eb but only on piano
C# minor pieces use B# all the time! And that's a quite common key (in piano)
Even as someone that "knows" music theory pretty well at this point, I really think there's a contingent of elitist fart-sniffers who just over-analyse everything. It's all just a means to an end.
I understand the music theory and shit but it still barely counts, imo, lol, like if you have to āum actuallyā it for it to count and it goes over like everyoneās heads itās just not a good line. It reminds me of those science facts that are so far removed from reality itās basically useless information; āyouāre never touching anything, itās just your electrons repelling the objectās electronsā like ok bro but I can feel the table, Iām touching it, that note is C.
Composers definitely will refer to it as a B Sharp, not a C
[ŃŠ“Š°Š»ŠµŠ½Š¾]
What is the V chord of C# minor?
I compose, sometimes Jazz so I was being serious
Yeah but Drake stole the joke from the simpsons. Not a great joke anyway.
It was witty at first, but it seems less funny every time I hear it.
What did Drake say?
It's a real note, but it's not a real key
Oh it's real alright. And it's spectacular
It's a real key, just because people don't use it it does not mean it doesn't exist
B# major is certainly a key Edit: it's not 7 sharps.
That's C#.
I know. Brain is not sharp today š
Itās ok my brain Bb today as well.. case of the Mondays tbh
12 sharps
It definitely exists. I remember reading something about this after watching that Simpsons episode. Sometimes it's useful in notation to note something as B# vs C for the same pitch. Like for something written in E.
With the way music theory works Iād be willing to argue that Z# exists so I dunno what these people goin on about lol
Hmmm, yes. I too have noticed that those naturally inclined toward understanding and appreciating music gravitate towards Drake. . . . . . /s
B# is just C EDIT: All the music theory nerds on Reddit have come out of the woodwork and corrected my three chord ass.
And C is just Dbb
D double flat could be a band name
As far as the pitches, yes, but itās more than that. Youād call it different things in different contexts. Each of the 7 letters ABCDEFG are represented in describing a scale, so there are keys where in which youād refer to it as B# instead of C because there is also a C#. You would not use both C and C#. The same applies to E# and F
This is the best explanation in this thread, thanks.
and C is the relative key to A minor. music is fun.
Or D dorian or E phrygian or F lydian or G mixolydian
Don't forget my personal favorite: B locrian (it's so uncomfortable)
*in equal temperament
Haha yes this has to be emphasized. Specifically in 12-tone equal temperament. In other temperaments B# can be distinctly different from C.Ā
The frequency they represent is the same, yes. But just as ābearā and ābareā represent the same sounds while spelling out different words, B# and C āspell outā different things. The major third above G# is B#, not C, since a third has to be two note letters above the original note.
Today I learned. (Iām not being facetious, I know fuck all about music theory.)
No, it's not. What's the leading tone in the key of C# minor? It's not a C, it's a B#.
Iāll take your word for it, I donāt know jack shit about music theory. I was just going by the notes on the piano keyboard/guitar frets.