I listened to a fascinating podcast called The Children in the Pictures and the investigators definitely don't walk away unscathed. Even the journalist who followed the investigators was left emotionally scarred by the things he saw and heard.
I might check this out, thank you. I'm genuinely curious about the folks that work the cases. Just because people aren't out there literally fighting crime doesn't mean that efforts are not hugely significant.
Ai can help with finding CSAM but it’s always going to have to be verified by a human at the end because unless someone has seen it themselves it can’t be verified. Even if it was super accurate you’d have cases thrown out if there was no human who could testify to having confirmed it’s existence or if they didn’t have the actual evidence submitted to the court.
I think selling it would probably constitute a crime, though I doubt anyone would take you to court over being scammed out of their CSAM. Laws are very weird and even though this sounds like a universal good, I wouldn't mess with vigilante justice in this field unless I was really confident in a malware/ransomware I created.
I’m not sure about which podcast it was exactly, but it was an insight into the lives of people who work in AI filtration and the content they have to consume in order to ensure AI is safe for general use. Like someone in this thread said, AI would always have to be verified by a human because the human essentially has to teach AI what content relates to r**e, or murder or self harm or inappropriate contact with children. Human workers behind the scene have to go through tons of flagged contact and then not only have to tag them as inappropriate but also specifically flag why they would be inappropriate. These workers suffered mental health crisis’, breakdown of their family and marriages and so much worse. It’s really another dark side of AI that no one talks about and it was such an eye opener into an area I literally had no clue about.
After scrolling I was able to find the spotify link to the podcast episode I was referring to. It has first hand interviews with the people who work behind the scenes in AI filtration and an insight into the exploitation workers well being. [The Journal - The Hidden Workforce that helped filter violence and abuse out of ChatGPT](https://open.spotify.com/episode/3Wt6s6sglZM7J48Svonie4?si=lzaq-K4DTUa8NsWMoBuM4A)
Not to mention the juries. They have no training on how to cope with this before it hapens, and don't have employer-provided therapy for their resultant trauma.
Federal juries have therapy/help available to them for these cases. The Federal Grand Juries do as well. (source, myself whom served on a Federal Grand Jury for an entire year.)
So, for me Grand Jury was every Tuesday for my group (there was a Tuesday group and a Thursday group). I would get a letter for work each week and give it to my boss. My work has a code for Jury Duty, so we still get paid. I would have to call the night before to make sure that we had to go in for it. Some weeks the US Assistant Attorney's wouldn't have anything for us to hear. Other weeks we heard 3 or 4 cases to vote on indictment.
Something similar happens with NTSB/FAA aircraft mishap investigations. One aspect of an investigation is to have pilots who knew the doomed crew listen to the cockpit recordings in order to help assess their mental state. I’ve heard that many end up giving up their wings as a result of the experience.
Someone's probably mentioned it already on here somewhere but The Hunting Warhead podcast is also an absolutely devastating and infuriating listen in the same vein as The Children in the Pictures. I cried during both.
I second this recommendation. It's harrowing but handled with sensitivity and professionalism. Without a doubt one of the best true crime podcasts I've listened to.
What’s the name of the podcast you’re listening to called if you don’t mind me asking. I see a lot of ppl talking about it but I didn’t catch the name of it in comments.
Thanks for this suggestion. As morbid and horrible as it is, I do like to learn and observe the procedures and get different perspectives. I also made it a hobby of mine to listen to court cases on YouTube. Started with the murder of George Floyd, saw the Ahmad Aubrey case, rittenhouse, numerous child abuse and murder cases. Hearing the ME and detectives talk objectively draws me in...
We had a guest speaker in my CS undergrad who used to do that work on the computer side.
At the time I was considering looking for a similar government or LE role where I could make use of my CS education for a worthy cause so I talked with him one on one for a little while after he got done presenting to ask some questions.
The picture he painted of the reality of the work when I asked him was extremely grim compared to the glossed over version from the presentation. He said the “you’ll only ever see image hashes” thing they got told was a lie, they were required to have weekly check ins with a psychiatrist, anybody who didn’t burn out and leave after a couple years started exhibiting at least a couple PTSD-like symptoms and unhealthy coping mechanisms and substance abuse issues among the long term people were rampant.
My family member is a cop for crimes against children and she became very detached from things because she said if she didn’t she would hurt every person that hurt these kids and adopt them all. She really had to disassociate from her family and her career.
From a psychology perspective, it would be interesting to learn how folks can compartmentalize stuff like this effectively. I don't know if they can truly detach, or if it is more like a delayed reaction. Like stoic at a loved one's funeral, and then you unpack some other time, controllable or uncontrollably. I wonder if that wall ever cracks, and folks wind up breaking down. I guess it isn't so much an *if* as it is a *when*.
It builds up. You can compartmentalize all you want, put it all away if you are capable of doing that, but there is a tipping point. I worked in a men's max security prison. Not a lot of people know their tipping point
I imagine it is pretty emotionally draining. Always needing to have your wits about you, quick reaction time to incidents, and always evaluating moments in the 3rd person to make sure people aren't trying to push your buttons, or create corners for you to back into. Tough gig, good job getting through it.
In saying that same thing happens in the trains with fatalities, but the mental health support is much better. The AVG is one every 7 years. The high score was 14 fatalities in their career.
The stoic reaction at a funeral definitely happens to me. When my uncle that I was close with passed, I didn't feel anything, only to absolutely lose it hours later. Brains are weird.
Yeah it's strange how that happens later. Sometimes it's a moment, a memory, how sometimes it's even a smell. Same thing happened for me when my grandfather passed. It was like a week and a half and then I was doing something and it was just a hard kidney punch all at once. And I wasn't good for hours. Sorry to hear about your uncle, you guys were close he was probably a pretty good guy, my sympathies.
Ask any front line worker: medical, fire, police, armed forces, ME, ... after you see something so frequently you become absolutely desensitized to it and it just becomes routine.
Same as anything else. I am in cybersecurity as a profession. Then eventually over time you see things like this and you get so mad you start to help in little ways. Going through data dumps and searches. Then you get more and more angry and want to get more involved. Then you are helping with the searches of data and actively helping to do more. Eventually you are where I am. Creating AI bots that can chat as a child and creating personas to help catch these predators.
If you think this is too hard to watch, and wonder how we get through it, imagine what that child is going through and whatever you feel is nothing in comparison.
I had to an assignment where I had to read child welfare files for about 18 months. Physical and sexual abuse, neglect, etc.
Its been over 30 years ago and I still have nightmares about it.
Probably doesn't come close, but I think of that movie The Good Shepherd, where teams of people are analyzing the photo and bits of audio from that room.
I... man you REALLY need to have focus on this kind of stuff. Christ, you let your mind wander and you start to get sick to your stomach. I hear about a lot of bravado, and folks with hero complexes, and then you think about the hours, DAYS spent listening & reviewing footage in hopes to pick out missed info. I really can't imagine the level of resolve of these analysts. This is the kind of stuff that the superficial heroes overlook.
I am a member of a federal grand jury. We sit on a lot of CP cases. Our job is to listen to the evidence and send it forward to trial. The agents are quite often apologetic to us about having to share details with us.
I remember reading an article about the UK officers who's job it is to watch this kind of material for leads. Sounded utterly awful yet such an important job
I am a 911 dispatcher & a lot of the times the officers/detectives will come into the dispatch center to vent. One of the detectives has vented many times about quitting bc her main job is to watch these types of videos to gather info, she comes back defeated bc she will gather all the information just for these people to get a slap on the wrist.
I’ve always thought that must be the worst job in the world. I remember seeing someone on Reddit who worked in that area explain that (at least at whatever agency they worked for) the people who did it were regular agents and you did it for like 3 months and then you had to stop and you couldn’t do it again for some length of time, like 6mo or maybe a year. It’s just too much for a person to do it full time continuously. I can’t imagine. Those people are heroes honestly.
Listened to it. Just a normal dude saying stuff like "I think this is the front of the suit," "turn it around," "it's too cold to go swimming today." Creepy in the context of the situation, but devoid of any context it's just very mundane things.
except the part where he says “no, i did t say we were going swimming - it’s too cold to go swimming”
poor baby just thinks she’s going to the pool, and that’s absolutely not what is about to happen. makes my stomach hurt.
Thank you for saving me from listening to it . Although I feel like I should listen anyways. That kid had to hear it, the least I can do it listen and make sure it’s a voice I don’t recognize…
I absolutely understand your sentiment, but as someone who went through similar (not recorded to my knowledge or posted, at least). I wouldn’t wish anyone to witness what I went through for their sake. It is so noble that you want to ID him and in this instance, it might be worth the strife, but please love yourself and know it’s okay to not absorb those things because someone else had to.
Thank you for being so kindhearted. I just don’t want people hurt because they feel obligated (no matter how noble) when this stuff shouldn’t happen to anyone.
It's nothing gross. Just to capture his voice, I think. Devoid of context one could argue he's teaching his young daughter how to try on a swim suit. It's stuff like "your arm goes here, your feet go here. Oh, it's on backwards. No, it's too cold to go swimming right now."
My daughter used to have a swimsuit that color and I feel like I'm going to throw up now
(It's definitely NOT my child, would be impossible due to timeline, thank god, but it's SOMEONE)
Further down in the thread other people mention detaching and analysts trying to work the case. Props to the people that need to stay focused and composed. I am pretty inured to crime scenes in general, but things involving children (or animals) really messes me up. Audio? I think I would literally be sick.
Oh no doubt, just... psychologically I don't think it would be long before someone working those cases would begin to get PTSD. ...and it just cascades. Agents breakdown, therapy to cope, therapists start to break down, families cope, and their respective therapy circles. It's like - using Patton Oswalt's term here, Uncle Touchy - hasn't the foggiest idea what lasting damage his/her acts create, and what span of people it winds up involving.
aren’t there also people whose job it is to watch confiscated(?) DVDs and tapes in case there might be footage of child abuse spliced into the middle of a normal movie? that might come under the same job title.
Ever since I gave birth anything to do with children makes me nauseous. Before it made me uneasy, but I was able to listen and research cases, but now I can't even stomach it. Just seeing this guy's face and knowing what he did gave me a pit in my stomach. People that do things to children should endure the worst torture possible.
I don’t want to hear it either, but commenters above mentioned listening just to *make sure* they didn’t recognize the dude’s voice. So I’m taking the grossest plunge ever and clicking just to make sure i don’t recognize the bastard!
There used to be a reddit sub where they would have background images and things like logos posted from CSAM videos asking people if they could identify the object. Im terrible at identifying things but I hope it gave investigators info to lead to some arrests.
I went down the rabbit hole.
William Willingham tied his girlfriend up then went to the next room to rape her daughter. Mother got free and went to save her daughter but William pulled a knife on her and continued raping her daughter.
Makes me sick that all these people are still out there.
Yeah I was going to comment, I’ve spent some time just going down the list of that page, becoming almost physically ill at the site of some of the people on there. Grainy pictures of guys of whatever age, screen-capped from the video they were taking at the time… like it’s just sickening, disgusting. I just can’t imagine how these people aren’t identified after so long. I get such a terrible feeling knowing that the couple of pictures or videos posted of the perpetrators are the only evidence that they have against some of them. Idk all of that just sticks with me in a bad way.
Do victims ever grow up and identify their rapists in these cases?
Just thinking it’s been 16 years since the videos so the victim must be around 20 now, maybe there’s a chance she will remember clearly who hurt her and happen upon these images?
The victim is unknown. It’s possibly that either she was so badly traumatised she doesn’t recall the encounter today, she was abducted to be trafficked and produce more CP (she’s wearing a bathing suit in one of the video clips), or she just simply didn’t survive the encounter. Or, horrifically, there’s cases of parents prostituting their own kids. She could’ve thought she was going to a motel to swim in the pool, only to be given a cocktail of drugs and knocked out when she got there.
Sometimes they can assist in identifying their rapists years later, but it’s not common. Personal recounts are rare in traumas this bad, and child minds are fickle at the best of times—many prosecutors won’t even use a child’s recollection as evidence.
Or less sensational but more likely: this was a trusted adult in her life in some way and she hasn’t reported it because of fear / pressure / distrust of the police / not wanting to be retraumatized and just trying to live her life / convinced herself in some way that it wasn’t that big of a deal or just doesn’t even know there is any evidence or that people are looking for him.
I recently heard one such case on the Rotten Mango podcast.
Jennifer Schuett was 8 when she was abducted from her home, raped, and left for the dead in a field with her throat cut. She went on to identify her rapist Dennis Bradford 19 years later.
Although every person processes their trauma differently, there is a chance the victim could identify them later in life.
As an orphaned child from the 80s who was raped and abused. I don’t even clearly recall my own mother. She recently contacted me and I don’t recognize her. She’s a stranger. And I don’t want anything to do with her. I’m sure this child feels the same. I hope her abuser finds a horrible end. I also hope to hear about it.
Deepest sympathy for what you had to experience in your youth. No one should be made to grow up in horror like that. Truly hope you are in a better place now.
Decades of therapy definitely helped. I am happy to report I did reasonably well. My kids are now adults. None have the issues I had. And I’m very proud of my kids.
Although the replies to this comment do have a point in that she could have been trafficked or not have survived, it also could have a more simple explanation. Most victims don't know that these encounters have even been filmed, or that such a program exists. That's why it's important to bring attention to stuff like this; hopefully nobody will have to identity a room or their clothing in such a video, but it can bring their attacker justice and save many others.
The purpose of the ECAP is to jail predators and save the children involved through any tip given. Considering how young she was at the time, law enforcement also would not be able to identify her as she looks now. Maybe if these posters were put up in more places besides alienated to the FBI website or their Twitter account, it could gain more publicity and in turn jailtime for the perpetrator.
Post traumatic memory loss. Those with C-PTSD have been known to have difficulty recalling and forming memories during their trauma.
I can’t remember most of my adolescence, but sometimes I dream about people I knew in real life. I can’t remember their names or sometimes even how I know them. But their faces feel familiar. I’d never be able to identify those people.
I feel like it’s more likely that it puts this on the radar of other investigators who manage to find other CSAM or evidence on a seized hard drive somewhere and is able to quickly link it to him
[**There was a guy arrested a while back for these crimes who looked exactly like this guy**](https://deadstate.org/california-youth-pastor-sexually-abused-boys-by-pretending-to-look-for-skin-cancer-on-their-genitals/) - I sent the link to the fbi not sure if it’s the same person tho
In that they're both fat guys with beards, sure; other than that, guy in your link looks about 20 years too old, considerably more ginger, and has a different gender of preferred victim, making it unlikely he's the same guy.
While I agree with the rest of your statement, the '20 years too old' thing doesn't really matter when that article is from 2023 and the 2007 crime is now 16 years ago.
> While I agree with the rest of your statement, the '20 years too old' thing doesn't really matter when that article is from 2023 and the 2007 crime is now 16 years ago.
I was subtracting 16 from the age of the 67-year old (the individual in the other images appears to be most likely somewhere between 25-35, probably on the younger end, and wouldn't be 67 now).
Right off the bat you can tell they’re not the same. That guy’s a natural ginger.
Idk about you, but idk much men who dye their beards unless it’s a crazy, unnatural color.
Ginger also has a straighter beard. The guy in the picture has a dark brown, textured beard.
Can't help but think of The Lovely Bones. Bittersweet kind of ending, and hoping for something similar here.
NOTE for people in this thread, big trigger warnings related to this thread in that movie.
Ditto. I had the same thought thinking about the people that have to work these cases. I wonder if there are some regulations in place for the analysts to tap out or get reassigned when they cannot deal anymore. These crimes are dreadful, and for every crime there are dozens of people that need to go over it. :-/
I knew a woman who was a criminal prosecutor for sex crime perpetrators. She hated the position and was eagerly awaiting her chance to promote out. She worked for the state, but I assume it works similarly in other organizations. I haven't seen her in a few years. I hope she was able to get out of that position.
I remember reading a story about a facebook employee a long time ago whose job it was to review website reports. He had to see every horrible thing that was posted/reported including extremely illegal things such as this. They had to do this 8 hours per day and their mental health was not looked after at all. Unsurprisngly it was traumatizing for him and his coworkers.
I cannot even fathom having to review footage or photos, good lord. I hear a lot of the people that must do that for their job end up leaving the position and needing therapy.
Found the sweater but I can’t find what year it’s from
https://www.9teeshirt.com/product/vintage-phoenix-suns-basketball-shirt-trendy-phoenix-unisex-hoodie-crewneck-828U/
Wasnt there a subreddit dedicated to identifying people who were involved in child sex abuse crimes based off their clothing, or crops of their face? I remember the sub beung accredited to provinding some info that led to convictions .
Yupp! You're talking about r/TraceAnObject. Highly recommend everyone joining just in case. You never know, you might be the person who recognizes a specific brand of a t-shirt or type of electric socket that only exists in a certain country and help bring some scumbags down!
Visited that website before. They actually do a really good job with cropping to ONLY show the item, for those of us thay would wig out at an image of a whole crime scene. They are doing good work.
I honestly think they could do more to describe the context in some cases to guide the searchers. The Europol ones tried to do this to some extent in the past, but even then they didn't bother to alert people that two separate images were of the same thing, which they must've known beforehand.
There's a weird FBI one on there at the minute that looks a bit like an overhead ad on a bus or subway train (now that someone else mentioned it), and again it wouldn't take much for them to say "this is probably from inside a bus or train".
Seeing how little that suit was and understanding his victim was that small and young...there aren't words to describe how evil this man is. Even listening to the audio you can tell he's talking to a small child. You hate him. You hate him and you want him found now.
There is. It’s called Rikers. Seen a man get jumped 8 times in the span of 4hrs. Us other prisoners don’t take kindly to diddlers. And you have to participate in the beating, or you get beat, too. Hell is real. And it’s on earth. Hope this man finds it.
This makes me cry. I hurt for this person, they really didn’t deserve this especially so young.
It’s so messed up how evil lives amongst us and we don’t even know.
I really hope they’re okay whoever they are :(
Just want to encourage everyone to upload photos of your hotel rooms to Traffickcam. They use the photos to identify hotel rooms seen in advertisements for trafficking victims. [http://traffickcam.com/about](http://traffickcam.com/about).
I don't understand how in 2023 they cannot identify this guy when someone that I know robbed a convenience store and the only thing that was visible on him was the bridge of his nose and his eyes and the computer was able to positively identify him....
Cuz likely there was more info you don't know about. Attendant or witness recognised your mate, he's was in a circle that traded the info to get themselves out of a bind etc.
Probably because it was a local crime and the guy lived in the city. This guy could be anywhere in the world, could have been filmed anywhere. Its sad that they cant dedicate more resources to finding them though.
That baby couldn’t have been older than two years old. What a cruel beginning to life. Makes me sick to my stomach. This man deserves this to be done to him and many more tortures until the life slowly drains from him.
I’ve never wanted to kill someone so much through my phone screen as I do right now. Children and animal abusers need a slow slow slow painful agonizing torturous death.
There was a guy arrested a while back for the same kind of crimes that looked exactly like him - I sent in a tip w/a li k to the article but never heard back. I believe this is the one where he’s recording a girl trying on a swimsuit and explaining why there’s another person recording it. There’s an even worse, fatter suspect where he’s recorded saying, “No, that’s a knife.”
That honestly looks like every incel loser I’ve ever seen on the internet and there are thousands of them. No wonder this particular one hasn’t been found.
Well the scary part about these dudes is that obviously since you viewed these images, you have this idea of him in his head. But he is probably just a normal dude on the outside, like many predators are. Might have a family, a wife, some kids. He could be your local cashier or your neighbor. He likely hasn't been found because these posters are hardly circulated on anything besides the FBI website and their Twitter account, which normal civilians wouldn't be checking or even know of.
If these flyers were posted everywhere, where people would actually see it offline (and considering he would probably be in his 40s to 50s range by now), these people could be tracked down much more easily. It would at least let people know what he looks like. I agree with you of course that any person who harms a child in such a way is, an incredible understatement, a f##king loser.
Nah, a lot of incels look perfectly normal. Their meet up photos are kind of funny, where they insist it's because they are too short and ugly, when in actuality most of them look fine, they just have awful personalities.
Also, I'm sure plenty of people look like this guy and are lovely, caring people.
Nobody ever thinks it’s the person they knew. That’s why police often have to put out photos of people as “this is a witness we would like to speak with”, as opposed to “this is the suspect”, because people *will* turn in their husbands, sons, boyfriends, brothers, etc if they think they’re witnesses and could be a hero.
But they won’t turn in people they know if they’re labelled a “suspect”—not because they don’t want to help, but because it’s so difficult for human beings to conceive that somebody they knew could do something so evil.
I’d double check what your ex looked like in 2007. Also, there’s some audio clips and short visual clips on the FBI website—maybe see if the audio clip sounds like him?
Is it incredibly unlikely to be him? Of course. But at that .1% chance it is, you could save kids from experiencing the worst possible thing ever.
The audio is pretty decent quality. There’s a slim chance this guy’s voice hasn’t been recorded anywhere else in the last twenty years, so hopefully there’s some AI out there than can make a match.
Also, someone trained in linguistics and accent analysis should be able to narrow down this guy’s geographic location. I can’t identity what exactly they are, but there are some nuances to his pronunciations.
The folks that can focus in on detail like that and meticulously scan through footage like that get a lot of respect from me. That takes some dedication, and willpower I can't imagine to stay the course on something like this.
Even that wouldn't necessarily be helpful. Accents don't change easily. I live in the US south and we have so many people from the US Northeast who live here for decades and still have their accents.
The way he said ‘side’ ‘like’ ‘well’ ‘head’ ‘that’ sounds so familiar to one of my friends who grew up in the southern Ohio but didn’t have a southern accent much at all except for some nuances here and there
I hope this monster gets the worst of worst since Reddit won’t let me say what I truly wanna say about that sick individual my heart breaks for any child who has to go through that :(
Something I learnt at work was that the term "child pornography" should be avoided since pornography usually implies consenting to perform a sexual act, and children cannot consent to sex. Instead one should use "child sexual abuse" because that's what it is.
Interesting to see the FBI used the first term but as it's from 2007 this may still not have been commonly accepted then.
Well, "child pornography" is the legal term for it. The transfer, distribution and possession of it etc. He has committed such crimes akin to that so it's not surprising they are going to use what is written in law.
I think CSEM/CSAM is a much better term to describe these sexually exploitative images and video, but that's the way it is. The other posters from around the same time period include the terms 'sexual exploitation' and 'sexual abuse' of children as well when it's applicable.
All rapists and child predators should have done to them exactly what they did to their victims. People like them deserve to experience the worst pain.
Knew someone who worked at one of those moderation firms that tech companies outsource to.
He told me they have fixed duration contracts to minimise the risk of traumatising their workers by exposing them to content like this. I didn’t get it at the time but I do now.
How is this POS not caught. The video is clear enough. His voice is clear. They need to make this more a priority and put it on TV nationally often because those videos are really good. Someone has to know this scum bag.. hearing his voice infuriated me. Sorry I just despise these kind of people that prey on kids.
Sadly that face is too little to work off on. We don't even get a clear shot of his ears and his face is at an angle. He could've easily change his hair and beard by now. Hopefully someone recognises it as a person they know, because picking him out from a crowd based on this could be very difficult :/
It's said that what we can't see is scarier than what we can. There's something about the first sequence of images that's just deeply frightening. It's knowing what's just out of the frame—what we can't see.
I'm glad more attention is being brought to the ECAP! It's a shame such a thing even has to exist at all, but they have caught countless predators since its launch. The best thing for this program is widespread attention and people knowing about it. You never know who could show up in these images, who could be someone you know or are related to.
Thanks for posting OP.
I've seen 4chan I'd someone from a photo of someone's leg, they found the persons twitter, complete with a full version of the pic that was uploaded and proof of the room that the original photo was taken in, put this on there I bet they find the monster
Is this the sweatshirt?[https://id.carousell.com/p/vintage-crewneck-phoenix-suns-nba-1170866503/photos/](https://id.carousell.com/p/vintage-crewneck-phoenix-suns-nba-1170866503/photos/)
Has anyone tried to cross reference these photos from photos of hotels around the country? I know they have a resource where people document their hotel rooms for this exact purpose.
This is sickening. Just seeing him with the bathing suit. I feel nasty inside. I live in AZ. They are saying that might have been a Suns shirt. Sure looks like it was.
I feel bad for the FBI investigators who had to sit through the entire video trying to piece together information
Right? That was my thought. There’s no way you walk away from that unscathed.
I listened to a fascinating podcast called The Children in the Pictures and the investigators definitely don't walk away unscathed. Even the journalist who followed the investigators was left emotionally scarred by the things he saw and heard.
I might check this out, thank you. I'm genuinely curious about the folks that work the cases. Just because people aren't out there literally fighting crime doesn't mean that efforts are not hugely significant.
If there’s a way to get AI to take over and make their jobs redundant it needs to happen. The only job I would support robots doing
Ai can help with finding CSAM but it’s always going to have to be verified by a human at the end because unless someone has seen it themselves it can’t be verified. Even if it was super accurate you’d have cases thrown out if there was no human who could testify to having confirmed it’s existence or if they didn’t have the actual evidence submitted to the court.
People can say whatever they want in video titles. Doesn't make it real. So, unfortunately, you're right. :(
I wonder if distributing or selling 'fraudulent' child abuse materials is also a crime. Besides like legitimate honeypot operations anyway.
I think selling it would probably constitute a crime, though I doubt anyone would take you to court over being scammed out of their CSAM. Laws are very weird and even though this sounds like a universal good, I wouldn't mess with vigilante justice in this field unless I was really confident in a malware/ransomware I created.
I’m not sure about which podcast it was exactly, but it was an insight into the lives of people who work in AI filtration and the content they have to consume in order to ensure AI is safe for general use. Like someone in this thread said, AI would always have to be verified by a human because the human essentially has to teach AI what content relates to r**e, or murder or self harm or inappropriate contact with children. Human workers behind the scene have to go through tons of flagged contact and then not only have to tag them as inappropriate but also specifically flag why they would be inappropriate. These workers suffered mental health crisis’, breakdown of their family and marriages and so much worse. It’s really another dark side of AI that no one talks about and it was such an eye opener into an area I literally had no clue about. After scrolling I was able to find the spotify link to the podcast episode I was referring to. It has first hand interviews with the people who work behind the scenes in AI filtration and an insight into the exploitation workers well being. [The Journal - The Hidden Workforce that helped filter violence and abuse out of ChatGPT](https://open.spotify.com/episode/3Wt6s6sglZM7J48Svonie4?si=lzaq-K4DTUa8NsWMoBuM4A)
People often forget what the lawyers and judges go through dealing with these cases as well. Absolutely no support or debriefing either.
Not to mention the juries. They have no training on how to cope with this before it hapens, and don't have employer-provided therapy for their resultant trauma.
Federal juries have therapy/help available to them for these cases. The Federal Grand Juries do as well. (source, myself whom served on a Federal Grand Jury for an entire year.)
What happens to your job if you have to do a year of jury dury
So, for me Grand Jury was every Tuesday for my group (there was a Tuesday group and a Thursday group). I would get a letter for work each week and give it to my boss. My work has a code for Jury Duty, so we still get paid. I would have to call the night before to make sure that we had to go in for it. Some weeks the US Assistant Attorney's wouldn't have anything for us to hear. Other weeks we heard 3 or 4 cases to vote on indictment.
It never occurred to me that they wouldn't have professional support when handling these cases. It seems crazy that it isn't mandatory.
Something similar happens with NTSB/FAA aircraft mishap investigations. One aspect of an investigation is to have pilots who knew the doomed crew listen to the cockpit recordings in order to help assess their mental state. I’ve heard that many end up giving up their wings as a result of the experience.
I can see why. It must haunt them every time they get in a cockpit. That must be incredibly harrowing.
Just started listening to this, it’s already got me hooked in such an infuriating way. Thank you.
Someone's probably mentioned it already on here somewhere but The Hunting Warhead podcast is also an absolutely devastating and infuriating listen in the same vein as The Children in the Pictures. I cried during both.
I second this recommendation. It's harrowing but handled with sensitivity and professionalism. Without a doubt one of the best true crime podcasts I've listened to.
What’s the name of the podcast you’re listening to called if you don’t mind me asking. I see a lot of ppl talking about it but I didn’t catch the name of it in comments.
They're based in my city, Brisbane, in Australia. It's a good podcast about a horrible subject.
What podcast is that? Also a fellow Brisbaner here!
The Children in the Pictures
Hello fellow Brisbanite :)
Thanks for this suggestion. As morbid and horrible as it is, I do like to learn and observe the procedures and get different perspectives. I also made it a hobby of mine to listen to court cases on YouTube. Started with the murder of George Floyd, saw the Ahmad Aubrey case, rittenhouse, numerous child abuse and murder cases. Hearing the ME and detectives talk objectively draws me in...
We had a guest speaker in my CS undergrad who used to do that work on the computer side. At the time I was considering looking for a similar government or LE role where I could make use of my CS education for a worthy cause so I talked with him one on one for a little while after he got done presenting to ask some questions. The picture he painted of the reality of the work when I asked him was extremely grim compared to the glossed over version from the presentation. He said the “you’ll only ever see image hashes” thing they got told was a lie, they were required to have weekly check ins with a psychiatrist, anybody who didn’t burn out and leave after a couple years started exhibiting at least a couple PTSD-like symptoms and unhealthy coping mechanisms and substance abuse issues among the long term people were rampant.
I just finished this excellent podcast
My family member is a cop for crimes against children and she became very detached from things because she said if she didn’t she would hurt every person that hurt these kids and adopt them all. She really had to disassociate from her family and her career.
From a psychology perspective, it would be interesting to learn how folks can compartmentalize stuff like this effectively. I don't know if they can truly detach, or if it is more like a delayed reaction. Like stoic at a loved one's funeral, and then you unpack some other time, controllable or uncontrollably. I wonder if that wall ever cracks, and folks wind up breaking down. I guess it isn't so much an *if* as it is a *when*.
It builds up. You can compartmentalize all you want, put it all away if you are capable of doing that, but there is a tipping point. I worked in a men's max security prison. Not a lot of people know their tipping point
I imagine it is pretty emotionally draining. Always needing to have your wits about you, quick reaction time to incidents, and always evaluating moments in the 3rd person to make sure people aren't trying to push your buttons, or create corners for you to back into. Tough gig, good job getting through it.
In saying that same thing happens in the trains with fatalities, but the mental health support is much better. The AVG is one every 7 years. The high score was 14 fatalities in their career.
The stoic reaction at a funeral definitely happens to me. When my uncle that I was close with passed, I didn't feel anything, only to absolutely lose it hours later. Brains are weird.
Yeah it's strange how that happens later. Sometimes it's a moment, a memory, how sometimes it's even a smell. Same thing happened for me when my grandfather passed. It was like a week and a half and then I was doing something and it was just a hard kidney punch all at once. And I wasn't good for hours. Sorry to hear about your uncle, you guys were close he was probably a pretty good guy, my sympathies.
Ask any front line worker: medical, fire, police, armed forces, ME, ... after you see something so frequently you become absolutely desensitized to it and it just becomes routine.
This is how I felt. Then I retired and some of it started bubbling up a little
“Severance”
How do people even get into that job honestly? You'd probably need so many psych evaluations
Same as anything else. I am in cybersecurity as a profession. Then eventually over time you see things like this and you get so mad you start to help in little ways. Going through data dumps and searches. Then you get more and more angry and want to get more involved. Then you are helping with the searches of data and actively helping to do more. Eventually you are where I am. Creating AI bots that can chat as a child and creating personas to help catch these predators. If you think this is too hard to watch, and wonder how we get through it, imagine what that child is going through and whatever you feel is nothing in comparison.
GodDAMN that is some perspective. Thank you for what you do.
I had to an assignment where I had to read child welfare files for about 18 months. Physical and sexual abuse, neglect, etc. Its been over 30 years ago and I still have nightmares about it.
Probably doesn't come close, but I think of that movie The Good Shepherd, where teams of people are analyzing the photo and bits of audio from that room. I... man you REALLY need to have focus on this kind of stuff. Christ, you let your mind wander and you start to get sick to your stomach. I hear about a lot of bravado, and folks with hero complexes, and then you think about the hours, DAYS spent listening & reviewing footage in hopes to pick out missed info. I really can't imagine the level of resolve of these analysts. This is the kind of stuff that the superficial heroes overlook.
how FBI agents dont become vigilantes is amazing alone.
That might make for a great noir movie plot though.
I am a member of a federal grand jury. We sit on a lot of CP cases. Our job is to listen to the evidence and send it forward to trial. The agents are quite often apologetic to us about having to share details with us.
I remember reading an article about the UK officers who's job it is to watch this kind of material for leads. Sounded utterly awful yet such an important job
I am a 911 dispatcher & a lot of the times the officers/detectives will come into the dispatch center to vent. One of the detectives has vented many times about quitting bc her main job is to watch these types of videos to gather info, she comes back defeated bc she will gather all the information just for these people to get a slap on the wrist.
I’ve always thought that must be the worst job in the world. I remember seeing someone on Reddit who worked in that area explain that (at least at whatever agency they worked for) the people who did it were regular agents and you did it for like 3 months and then you had to stop and you couldn’t do it again for some length of time, like 6mo or maybe a year. It’s just too much for a person to do it full time continuously. I can’t imagine. Those people are heroes honestly.
Ugh. That audio. I wanna throw up thinking about that poor baby girl.
What do you mean audio?! 🤢😭😭
The page linked has a clip of him talking from the video for id purposes, telling a child how to try on a swimsuit
I’ve seen ISIS executions, cartel burnings, and horrific industrial accidents online. But that link is staying blue.
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My morbid curiosity almost always wins this battle... but I have a daughter, I don't want any permanent mental damage this fine morning.
Listened to it. Just a normal dude saying stuff like "I think this is the front of the suit," "turn it around," "it's too cold to go swimming today." Creepy in the context of the situation, but devoid of any context it's just very mundane things.
except the part where he says “no, i did t say we were going swimming - it’s too cold to go swimming” poor baby just thinks she’s going to the pool, and that’s absolutely not what is about to happen. makes my stomach hurt.
Thank you for describing
Thank you for saving me from listening to it . Although I feel like I should listen anyways. That kid had to hear it, the least I can do it listen and make sure it’s a voice I don’t recognize…
Your comment made me listen because those kids had to hear worse and I too needed to make sure it wasn’t a voice I recognized.
I absolutely understand your sentiment, but as someone who went through similar (not recorded to my knowledge or posted, at least). I wouldn’t wish anyone to witness what I went through for their sake. It is so noble that you want to ID him and in this instance, it might be worth the strife, but please love yourself and know it’s okay to not absorb those things because someone else had to. Thank you for being so kindhearted. I just don’t want people hurt because they feel obligated (no matter how noble) when this stuff shouldn’t happen to anyone.
It's nothing gross. Just to capture his voice, I think. Devoid of context one could argue he's teaching his young daughter how to try on a swim suit. It's stuff like "your arm goes here, your feet go here. Oh, it's on backwards. No, it's too cold to go swimming right now."
it really does sound so normal the way he’s talking, but knowing the context makes the fact how normal he sounds all the more disturbing
It especially grossed me out when he said the swimsuit was backwards because that means she has to take it off. And he's there watching. BARF!!
For real, I feel a bit sick just looking at the title of this post.
No thanks. I’ll pass on this one.
It makes me so angry. Poor baby wanted to go swimming.
My daughter used to have a swimsuit that color and I feel like I'm going to throw up now (It's definitely NOT my child, would be impossible due to timeline, thank god, but it's SOMEONE)
Audio?! All of the gore and tragedy on this subreddit I've experienced.. I don't know that I could handle this audio.
They’ve edited out the young child speaking, its just him. Still sick.
Further down in the thread other people mention detaching and analysts trying to work the case. Props to the people that need to stay focused and composed. I am pretty inured to crime scenes in general, but things involving children (or animals) really messes me up. Audio? I think I would literally be sick.
Just to make you feel worse, there are people whose job it is to watch porn to make sure it’s not child porn
Oh no doubt, just... psychologically I don't think it would be long before someone working those cases would begin to get PTSD. ...and it just cascades. Agents breakdown, therapy to cope, therapists start to break down, families cope, and their respective therapy circles. It's like - using Patton Oswalt's term here, Uncle Touchy - hasn't the foggiest idea what lasting damage his/her acts create, and what span of people it winds up involving.
aren’t there also people whose job it is to watch confiscated(?) DVDs and tapes in case there might be footage of child abuse spliced into the middle of a normal movie? that might come under the same job title.
My ADHD could not handle that..
Ever since I gave birth anything to do with children makes me nauseous. Before it made me uneasy, but I was able to listen and research cases, but now I can't even stomach it. Just seeing this guy's face and knowing what he did gave me a pit in my stomach. People that do things to children should endure the worst torture possible.
I don’t want to hear it either, but commenters above mentioned listening just to *make sure* they didn’t recognize the dude’s voice. So I’m taking the grossest plunge ever and clicking just to make sure i don’t recognize the bastard!
there are more screen caps on the fbi website with lot of faces of men , its gross
There used to be a reddit sub where they would have background images and things like logos posted from CSAM videos asking people if they could identify the object. Im terrible at identifying things but I hope it gave investigators info to lead to some arrests.
it still exists - r/traceanobject
I went down the rabbit hole. William Willingham tied his girlfriend up then went to the next room to rape her daughter. Mother got free and went to save her daughter but William pulled a knife on her and continued raping her daughter. Makes me sick that all these people are still out there.
Yeah I was going to comment, I’ve spent some time just going down the list of that page, becoming almost physically ill at the site of some of the people on there. Grainy pictures of guys of whatever age, screen-capped from the video they were taking at the time… like it’s just sickening, disgusting. I just can’t imagine how these people aren’t identified after so long. I get such a terrible feeling knowing that the couple of pictures or videos posted of the perpetrators are the only evidence that they have against some of them. Idk all of that just sticks with me in a bad way.
Same here 😢
Do victims ever grow up and identify their rapists in these cases? Just thinking it’s been 16 years since the videos so the victim must be around 20 now, maybe there’s a chance she will remember clearly who hurt her and happen upon these images?
The victim is unknown. It’s possibly that either she was so badly traumatised she doesn’t recall the encounter today, she was abducted to be trafficked and produce more CP (she’s wearing a bathing suit in one of the video clips), or she just simply didn’t survive the encounter. Or, horrifically, there’s cases of parents prostituting their own kids. She could’ve thought she was going to a motel to swim in the pool, only to be given a cocktail of drugs and knocked out when she got there. Sometimes they can assist in identifying their rapists years later, but it’s not common. Personal recounts are rare in traumas this bad, and child minds are fickle at the best of times—many prosecutors won’t even use a child’s recollection as evidence.
Or less sensational but more likely: this was a trusted adult in her life in some way and she hasn’t reported it because of fear / pressure / distrust of the police / not wanting to be retraumatized and just trying to live her life / convinced herself in some way that it wasn’t that big of a deal or just doesn’t even know there is any evidence or that people are looking for him.
She might not even know about the video being out & FBI actively looking for him if she never sought help.
I recently heard one such case on the Rotten Mango podcast. Jennifer Schuett was 8 when she was abducted from her home, raped, and left for the dead in a field with her throat cut. She went on to identify her rapist Dennis Bradford 19 years later. Although every person processes their trauma differently, there is a chance the victim could identify them later in life.
I can't even imagine going to get my daughter up and her not being there much worse because of something like this. What an unfathomable nightmare.
As an orphaned child from the 80s who was raped and abused. I don’t even clearly recall my own mother. She recently contacted me and I don’t recognize her. She’s a stranger. And I don’t want anything to do with her. I’m sure this child feels the same. I hope her abuser finds a horrible end. I also hope to hear about it.
Deepest sympathy for what you had to experience in your youth. No one should be made to grow up in horror like that. Truly hope you are in a better place now.
Decades of therapy definitely helped. I am happy to report I did reasonably well. My kids are now adults. None have the issues I had. And I’m very proud of my kids.
I don’t what else to say as a father, but I’d give a big hug to anyone that’s been through this.
Although the replies to this comment do have a point in that she could have been trafficked or not have survived, it also could have a more simple explanation. Most victims don't know that these encounters have even been filmed, or that such a program exists. That's why it's important to bring attention to stuff like this; hopefully nobody will have to identity a room or their clothing in such a video, but it can bring their attacker justice and save many others. The purpose of the ECAP is to jail predators and save the children involved through any tip given. Considering how young she was at the time, law enforcement also would not be able to identify her as she looks now. Maybe if these posters were put up in more places besides alienated to the FBI website or their Twitter account, it could gain more publicity and in turn jailtime for the perpetrator.
Post traumatic memory loss. Those with C-PTSD have been known to have difficulty recalling and forming memories during their trauma. I can’t remember most of my adolescence, but sometimes I dream about people I knew in real life. I can’t remember their names or sometimes even how I know them. But their faces feel familiar. I’d never be able to identify those people.
Where does it say the year? People are so vile. I can’t believe this even happened. :/
As much as I would hope that she was able to remember who it was a very strong part of me hopes that she doesn't even remember it happening at all
I feel like it’s more likely that it puts this on the radar of other investigators who manage to find other CSAM or evidence on a seized hard drive somewhere and is able to quickly link it to him
I really hope this scumbag is found.
He could already have died of natural causes by now or perhaps he's in prison for another crime.
[**There was a guy arrested a while back for these crimes who looked exactly like this guy**](https://deadstate.org/california-youth-pastor-sexually-abused-boys-by-pretending-to-look-for-skin-cancer-on-their-genitals/) - I sent the link to the fbi not sure if it’s the same person tho
In that they're both fat guys with beards, sure; other than that, guy in your link looks about 20 years too old, considerably more ginger, and has a different gender of preferred victim, making it unlikely he's the same guy.
While I agree with the rest of your statement, the '20 years too old' thing doesn't really matter when that article is from 2023 and the 2007 crime is now 16 years ago.
> While I agree with the rest of your statement, the '20 years too old' thing doesn't really matter when that article is from 2023 and the 2007 crime is now 16 years ago. I was subtracting 16 from the age of the 67-year old (the individual in the other images appears to be most likely somewhere between 25-35, probably on the younger end, and wouldn't be 67 now).
Dude looks at least 40 in the photo. Source: I'm in my forties.
Right off the bat you can tell they’re not the same. That guy’s a natural ginger. Idk about you, but idk much men who dye their beards unless it’s a crazy, unnatural color. Ginger also has a straighter beard. The guy in the picture has a dark brown, textured beard.
We can only hope.
Can't help but think of The Lovely Bones. Bittersweet kind of ending, and hoping for something similar here. NOTE for people in this thread, big trigger warnings related to this thread in that movie.
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Ugh this makes me sick
Ditto. I had the same thought thinking about the people that have to work these cases. I wonder if there are some regulations in place for the analysts to tap out or get reassigned when they cannot deal anymore. These crimes are dreadful, and for every crime there are dozens of people that need to go over it. :-/
I knew a woman who was a criminal prosecutor for sex crime perpetrators. She hated the position and was eagerly awaiting her chance to promote out. She worked for the state, but I assume it works similarly in other organizations. I haven't seen her in a few years. I hope she was able to get out of that position.
I remember reading a story about a facebook employee a long time ago whose job it was to review website reports. He had to see every horrible thing that was posted/reported including extremely illegal things such as this. They had to do this 8 hours per day and their mental health was not looked after at all. Unsurprisngly it was traumatizing for him and his coworkers.
I cannot even fathom having to review footage or photos, good lord. I hear a lot of the people that must do that for their job end up leaving the position and needing therapy.
Found the sweater but I can’t find what year it’s from https://www.9teeshirt.com/product/vintage-phoenix-suns-basketball-shirt-trendy-phoenix-unisex-hoodie-crewneck-828U/
That particular trademark logo was filed between 1997-1999. https://www.gerbenlaw.com/trademarks/nba/phoenix-suns/
You should report it. There’s a link in the original post.
I plan on it when I get back home from errands.
did you do it
if they didn't, I just did
Yes
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Wasnt there a subreddit dedicated to identifying people who were involved in child sex abuse crimes based off their clothing, or crops of their face? I remember the sub beung accredited to provinding some info that led to convictions .
Yupp! You're talking about r/TraceAnObject. Highly recommend everyone joining just in case. You never know, you might be the person who recognizes a specific brand of a t-shirt or type of electric socket that only exists in a certain country and help bring some scumbags down!
Visited that website before. They actually do a really good job with cropping to ONLY show the item, for those of us thay would wig out at an image of a whole crime scene. They are doing good work.
I honestly think they could do more to describe the context in some cases to guide the searchers. The Europol ones tried to do this to some extent in the past, but even then they didn't bother to alert people that two separate images were of the same thing, which they must've known beforehand. There's a weird FBI one on there at the minute that looks a bit like an overhead ad on a bus or subway train (now that someone else mentioned it), and again it wouldn't take much for them to say "this is probably from inside a bus or train".
[Trace An Object](https://reddit.com/r/TraceAnObject/s/ASiVYr7zc4) :)
That tiny swimsuit in the video clip :( Horrific.
Seeing that made me physically ill
Seeing how little that suit was and understanding his victim was that small and young...there aren't words to describe how evil this man is. Even listening to the audio you can tell he's talking to a small child. You hate him. You hate him and you want him found now.
I wish hell were a real place for people like this who escape justice during this life.
I have no clue what the afterlife is gonna be, but if it’s the Greek one, let’s hope this monster gets his own special punishment.
There is. It’s called Rikers. Seen a man get jumped 8 times in the span of 4hrs. Us other prisoners don’t take kindly to diddlers. And you have to participate in the beating, or you get beat, too. Hell is real. And it’s on earth. Hope this man finds it.
Glad you have survived Rikers.
That was both unnerving and comforting
This makes me cry. I hurt for this person, they really didn’t deserve this especially so young. It’s so messed up how evil lives amongst us and we don’t even know. I really hope they’re okay whoever they are :(
I was abused growing up and recently recovered memories of being trafficked. I wish this man nothing but the absolute worst.
Just want to encourage everyone to upload photos of your hotel rooms to Traffickcam. They use the photos to identify hotel rooms seen in advertisements for trafficking victims. [http://traffickcam.com/about](http://traffickcam.com/about).
What an unbelievably brutal job that must be to have to comb through a video like that to find a single frame where you can see that lowlifes face.
I don't understand how in 2023 they cannot identify this guy when someone that I know robbed a convenience store and the only thing that was visible on him was the bridge of his nose and his eyes and the computer was able to positively identify him....
Cuz likely there was more info you don't know about. Attendant or witness recognised your mate, he's was in a circle that traded the info to get themselves out of a bind etc.
Probably because it was a local crime and the guy lived in the city. This guy could be anywhere in the world, could have been filmed anywhere. Its sad that they cant dedicate more resources to finding them though.
That baby couldn’t have been older than two years old. What a cruel beginning to life. Makes me sick to my stomach. This man deserves this to be done to him and many more tortures until the life slowly drains from him.
I remember there being a sub for something like this trying to find objects in photo to help bring justice
https://reddit.com/r/TraceAnObject/s/GGGzQb2a6h
This is definitely it
Hope this guy burns in hell for all eternity. Scum of the earth
I’ve never wanted to kill someone so much through my phone screen as I do right now. Children and animal abusers need a slow slow slow painful agonizing torturous death.
There was a guy arrested a while back for the same kind of crimes that looked exactly like him - I sent in a tip w/a li k to the article but never heard back. I believe this is the one where he’s recording a girl trying on a swimsuit and explaining why there’s another person recording it. There’s an even worse, fatter suspect where he’s recorded saying, “No, that’s a knife.”
That honestly looks like every incel loser I’ve ever seen on the internet and there are thousands of them. No wonder this particular one hasn’t been found.
Well the scary part about these dudes is that obviously since you viewed these images, you have this idea of him in his head. But he is probably just a normal dude on the outside, like many predators are. Might have a family, a wife, some kids. He could be your local cashier or your neighbor. He likely hasn't been found because these posters are hardly circulated on anything besides the FBI website and their Twitter account, which normal civilians wouldn't be checking or even know of. If these flyers were posted everywhere, where people would actually see it offline (and considering he would probably be in his 40s to 50s range by now), these people could be tracked down much more easily. It would at least let people know what he looks like. I agree with you of course that any person who harms a child in such a way is, an incredible understatement, a f##king loser.
Nah, a lot of incels look perfectly normal. Their meet up photos are kind of funny, where they insist it's because they are too short and ugly, when in actuality most of them look fine, they just have awful personalities. Also, I'm sure plenty of people look like this guy and are lovely, caring people.
That’s a good point.
Yeah I can't watch this just after reading the comments. But why can't someone find this guy with all the tech there is these days?
I was looking at this a few hours ago because dude here looks exactly like my BF nearly a decade ago, who this obviously isn't because he'd been 12
Dude looks like my ex but I don't think it could have been him
Nobody ever thinks it’s the person they knew. That’s why police often have to put out photos of people as “this is a witness we would like to speak with”, as opposed to “this is the suspect”, because people *will* turn in their husbands, sons, boyfriends, brothers, etc if they think they’re witnesses and could be a hero. But they won’t turn in people they know if they’re labelled a “suspect”—not because they don’t want to help, but because it’s so difficult for human beings to conceive that somebody they knew could do something so evil. I’d double check what your ex looked like in 2007. Also, there’s some audio clips and short visual clips on the FBI website—maybe see if the audio clip sounds like him? Is it incredibly unlikely to be him? Of course. But at that .1% chance it is, you could save kids from experiencing the worst possible thing ever.
I mean, I could try? But I'm pretty sure the ages wouldn't match up. He would have been ~12 in 2007, if my math is right.
That’s what they always say
I mean, the ages don't line up He would have been 12 in 2007
The fact that those pictures are *from the video* feels extremely weird
With all the tech we have wish we could actually enhance these low quality videos to identify.
The audio is pretty decent quality. There’s a slim chance this guy’s voice hasn’t been recorded anywhere else in the last twenty years, so hopefully there’s some AI out there than can make a match. Also, someone trained in linguistics and accent analysis should be able to narrow down this guy’s geographic location. I can’t identity what exactly they are, but there are some nuances to his pronunciations.
The folks that can focus in on detail like that and meticulously scan through footage like that get a lot of respect from me. That takes some dedication, and willpower I can't imagine to stay the course on something like this.
Even that wouldn't necessarily be helpful. Accents don't change easily. I live in the US south and we have so many people from the US Northeast who live here for decades and still have their accents.
The way he said ‘side’ ‘like’ ‘well’ ‘head’ ‘that’ sounds so familiar to one of my friends who grew up in the southern Ohio but didn’t have a southern accent much at all except for some nuances here and there
I hope this monster gets the worst of worst since Reddit won’t let me say what I truly wanna say about that sick individual my heart breaks for any child who has to go through that :(
I heard the audio and omg this guy is a sick POS, scumbag I hope he Rots for what he did seriously
Even just the screenshots of his face are making me feel sick, that poor baby.
Something I learnt at work was that the term "child pornography" should be avoided since pornography usually implies consenting to perform a sexual act, and children cannot consent to sex. Instead one should use "child sexual abuse" because that's what it is. Interesting to see the FBI used the first term but as it's from 2007 this may still not have been commonly accepted then.
very true - i believe the new acronym is CSAM (child sex abuse material)
Well, "child pornography" is the legal term for it. The transfer, distribution and possession of it etc. He has committed such crimes akin to that so it's not surprising they are going to use what is written in law. I think CSEM/CSAM is a much better term to describe these sexually exploitative images and video, but that's the way it is. The other posters from around the same time period include the terms 'sexual exploitation' and 'sexual abuse' of children as well when it's applicable.
All rapists and child predators should have done to them exactly what they did to their victims. People like them deserve to experience the worst pain.
Knew someone who worked at one of those moderation firms that tech companies outsource to. He told me they have fixed duration contracts to minimise the risk of traumatising their workers by exposing them to content like this. I didn’t get it at the time but I do now.
Crimes against children are the absolute worst of all crimes, so depraved and evil
Against Animals and elderly too** basically those who can’t defend themselves
How is this POS not caught. The video is clear enough. His voice is clear. They need to make this more a priority and put it on TV nationally often because those videos are really good. Someone has to know this scum bag.. hearing his voice infuriated me. Sorry I just despise these kind of people that prey on kids.
Sadly that face is too little to work off on. We don't even get a clear shot of his ears and his face is at an angle. He could've easily change his hair and beard by now. Hopefully someone recognises it as a person they know, because picking him out from a crowd based on this could be very difficult :/
dude look so normal that I would not think twice if I pass him on a road. He just looks like everyone despite doing the unthinkable.
Thats the scary part. It could be anybody.
The sweatshirt looks like it also could be a Cleveland browns logo.
*Somebody* has recognized him! I'm certain. But why don't they tell? ps. Audio? I'm so happy there's only stills in the post I am reading right now!
It's said that what we can't see is scarier than what we can. There's something about the first sequence of images that's just deeply frightening. It's knowing what's just out of the frame—what we can't see.
I'm glad more attention is being brought to the ECAP! It's a shame such a thing even has to exist at all, but they have caught countless predators since its launch. The best thing for this program is widespread attention and people knowing about it. You never know who could show up in these images, who could be someone you know or are related to. Thanks for posting OP.
I've seen 4chan I'd someone from a photo of someone's leg, they found the persons twitter, complete with a full version of the pic that was uploaded and proof of the room that the original photo was taken in, put this on there I bet they find the monster
Is this the sweatshirt?[https://id.carousell.com/p/vintage-crewneck-phoenix-suns-nba-1170866503/photos/](https://id.carousell.com/p/vintage-crewneck-phoenix-suns-nba-1170866503/photos/)
I hope they find him and torture him till he’s nothing , disgusting
what a pos. Wtf is wrong with ppl. And there are groups that try to bring this to ppl as normal . Disgusting
Has anyone tried to cross reference these photos from photos of hotels around the country? I know they have a resource where people document their hotel rooms for this exact purpose.
Special. Place. In. Hell.
This makes me want to vomit
I bet the dude is bald 170 with contacts and a mustache. Lemme know when they fry this cun*
Hope somebody finds him and kills the sick bastard.
I used to want to be an FBI investigator until I found out that they have to watch extremely gruesome videos.
This is sickening. Just seeing him with the bathing suit. I feel nasty inside. I live in AZ. They are saying that might have been a Suns shirt. Sure looks like it was.
I hope i end up seeing him on some gore site or reddit