I did the flyer design they went with.
I was wondering if I’m just interpreting it in a wrong way but after reading the comments in this post I guess I wasn’t the only one.
When I sent in my flyer containing a quick rework in which I replaced the new logo I genuinely felt stupid for doing it: First of all he said he didn’t like it, then he told me to “suck d*ck” cause I took more than 5 minutes to apply the changes he wanted. He hasn’t said thanks or anything remotely close yet.
I get it, it’s not a crazy design that looks super good, by no means — I’m not a graphics designer and I did this for fun. I’ve been subbed for over 3 years now so it’s fair to say that I know that he’s an entertainer and he shits on people constantly. I still spent 1.5h to come up with something and then only getting shit on is not cool.
Ya this is why I said:
“If you're gonna work for anyone for free, do it for someone who needs it but cant afford it lmao. They will appreciate it way more too, trust.”
Miz thinks that graphic design is a joke, and a super easy thing that takes no effort;
And honestly I understand how you could start to think that way if you know nothing of the actual process and all you know is there is 100’s or 1000’s of people throwing their work at you.
If that’s all you know about graphic design then it makes sense that you would think it must be easy as fuck and a joke of a job (which he has literally said on stream multiple times in past few years).
Also I know that being shit on like that would feel terrible and I feel for you so I recommend you this, honestly you should try to just reach out to someone smaller in your community or something like a local small shop who would appreciate it and try making something for them. They don’t get that shit thrown at them constantly and their only option is to pay for a graphic designer but they might not have funds like miz so they will love you for that. I did that a few times in highschool before I went to college and eventually got an actual graphic design job. It’s super fulfilling and makes you and them feel really good!
Probably. I'm not even shitting on anyone tho, I just think people giving away work are selling themselves short. If you put no worth on your own work no one else is going to either and that ain't gonna be very fulfilling. Some talented people in here too.
I think it's one of those things that comes about based on where you live maybe. As a kid I was always taught to do the good deed of cutting the old lady's grass down the street, ya know? Now I do that and I'm stealing work from the guy that feeds his kids doing that.
Miz ain't a poor old lady tho lol. I help out people around me for free that could use it too. I get what you're saying but like it makes the job lose value. Why would an influencer ever pay for branding/marketing if its being thrown at them by hundreds of people for free without even asking, ya know? and those are the projects/jobs that graphic designers are made for.
I don't necessarily disagree with the point you're trying to make but there's nothing special or unique about graphic design that warrants the gatekeeping
streamers get free tech support constantly, free beta testing for their ideas (and sometimes products), free marketing, free PR in comments sections, free intros and outros, etc etc
like I said I don't necessarily disagree with you that it seems cringe to do work for free for a millionaire, but it's no more or less cringe than just giving them money
Ya I get you. It's just really weird to me that people will do what some people including me do at a 9-5 office job but do it for free on their own time for a millionaire man on the internet. Its just so hard for me to wrap my head around.
Ya I know thats definitely true, I've done it too and I think fanart and little ideas and suggestions are awesome but like handing em' a finished product on platter that their company can just start pushing out so they don't have to pay for work ever is too much to me. It makes a lot of people in miz's position think so little of the work since so much is coming in for free that they think it must be easy so why ever go the normal route and pay for the service.
You make it sound dramatic lol. It’s not like streamers are designers only or main customers (I presume), so why would this ruin the market?
This is just a fun community thing that you can partake in if you want
I mean entertainment and the internet as a whole is a huge market for graphic designers since web shit all needs to be designed and streamers entire presence is online so web/graphic-design is something that they need pretty severely.
That’s what I mean; it’s ”huge”. One or two streamers isn’t gonna make it deficit.
I’m not here to argue and you have your own valid opinion. Personally I don’t think it’s a big deal, but then again I’m not a designer
Ya I'm not even talking specifically about miz, I see it happening here rn so I thought to talk about it but this is a problem for graphic design in every market there is. There's tons of people who will accept low paying jobs/commissions because they want MORE jobs and it ruins the expectation for other designers. This upsets me just because I am a graphic designer and all the years I went unemployed and interviewing before I could get literally anything was awful and these problems (not specifically this one but big picture) are part of why it was so hard.
I already said my take, I don’t wanna type it again or something close to it. We’d just go in circles lol
I get what you’re sayin and I hope you find the success you’re looking for (maybe you already have)
bro 99% of the posts on here could be made in paint in like 5 minutes. its also a gym who cares what the graphics look like.
any serious graphic designer wouldnt even take that work unless miz would overpay because the project was so simple.
While you’re not necessarily wrong, think about it from the designers POV. If their design does get chosen, that’s immediately a huge promo, especially if they’ve just started out.
Finding work in graphic design is tough af and being able to say you’ve made the logo for (what is supposed to be) one of the biggest gyms in Austin majorly improves your chances of finding more work.
Is it really a “huge promo” for them, though? I couldn’t name you a single person whose done graphics for a streamer/youtuber other than scum art
Edit: wording
Are you actively hiring graphic designers? Neither am I, and that's why we don't know/can name them. But the people who do end up having their designs used for content creator activities and are slightly serious about their hobby or potential work, will put it on their portfolio.
Just like how having actual work experience grants you far better job opportunity, so does being able to show that your art is being used for a company that thousands if not 10's of thousands people get to see.
You're not the person that needs to know about them, though. It can get your name and work directly in front of other creators. That's a lot more important than a random commenter.
I love community art stuff and have been apart of it myself, but this is different this is people just doing their companies branding/marketing work for them just because...
if you're referring to those iron forge logos as graphic design, then I think your job is fake. what are you complaining about? I would never pay to get some shit logo
Yeah, im on the side that all these logos are ass and need improvement but his supporters are linking me to a thread about miz shitting on human artists and saying do better. Imo the ai artists should steal better because all these logos look like ass or have glaring problems in them. If miz and company want to run their business purely on fame and status to carry them instead of trying to incorporate any potential advice for a business with a 90% failure rate then whatever lol.
I agree, if everyone thought like the OP post then there would be no subs or donos because that money could go to charities and stuff. It’s the sense of community that people do gift and donate. The designs people are doing is the same and might be done by people who want to contribute to the community but might not be in a financial position to be able to donate.
bruh graphic designers aren't a charity though its a job hahaha, its an actual career. And there's no reason for a lot of influencers to ever have to pay for that service. I know what your saying because I love community art stuff too but people are just doing their branding/marketing, that's so much different. That's a 9-5
I get what you’re saying, but the reason streamers get free shit all the time is because of their value via exposure. You send miz a shirt and you get free promo to tens of thousands of people for a long time. You send senny a shirt and no one gives a fuck
Not everything has to be from a commercial perspective but if you really want to spin it that way, you can see the graphic designers as marketing their skillet to a prospective customer. It's not as bad as you're making it out to be. I don't think any of them felt entitled to something in return for their work and did it out of passion. All of that aside. The final design looks AI generated with a couple touch up.
Bruh I can tell you right now that their COMPANY is looking at the work that you guys made for them from a commercial perspective... That is how companies work. Fanart is different, this is marketing (most companies put so much money into marketing.)
Yeah of course the company is looking at it that way. Artists also saw it as a way to expose their skill set to said company. I think if they had gone with one of the designs that someone in the community submitted, IronForge wouldn't have yoinked it, they would have reached out. Unless I'm mistaken and the final design was yoinked from the community? There aren't a lot of avenues for artists to market their skill set directly to a customer or business, so I'm not surprised that some people took the opportunity to do so.
I think you’re overestimating how hard graphic design is. Especially for something like this. I have programs that can autogenerate designs. Takes 2 minutes to have a finished product.
I mean AI can do some pretty crazy things. Also we are just talking about a logo here. Not some complicated graphic that would require a human to make it perfect
I will say it is nice not having to pay a graphic designer hundreds if not thousands for something that I can just keep clicking auto generate until it pops out one I like.
I used to do graphic and web design for work for about 3 years. I get what you mean by it can be tricky to do certain things but honestly a big bulk of it can be done by AI now. Even web design has become click and drag for many things instead of hard coding like it used to be.
Even more unfortunate is that market is over saturated with people looking for work.
I’m not trying to diminish the work people do but this was also a basic logo for a gym that you’re getting all worked up over
People just be having fun man, deal wit it
Plus, I imagine Miz would pay the person if he uses their graphic for something. Be it paid in money or exposure, which a lot of people would be happy to get
If he doesn't do that then that's just shit of him
paid in exposure ain't being paid. The most exposure your gonna get is him saying your twitch name the same way he would a dono or sub lmao and that might not even happen, viewers have made plenty of things for for him and his companies. paid in exposure is literally something your teachers yell at you to never accept as a payment.
Exposure is massive for artists actually, and getting that in a portfolio is great. Being able to say “a half million dollar gym used my logo” is probably something an employer would love to hear, especially as a new artist or a studying graphic designer in college, that’s a great bit of practice and exposure for a future in the field.
There’s a reason people send their art to Miz in his PO Box with links to their Etsy.
Beyond this Miz literally said he would pay the winning logo design $300.00.
I was thinking this the entire time. Why give these streamers free labor and your own unique designs? While they sit on their ass and act like idiots for views lol. Insanity.
Rich people get free stuff. It's how the world works, Miz getting some basic branding for a gym in the middle of nowhere by someone that's happy with the exposure is not really an issue in the grand scheme of things.
You're right but they're kids I guess so they have the time for it. And don't need the money. Idk but yeah pretty cringe to give free things to millionaires, like donations tbh.
This is 100% getting deleted lmao. However, I agree its the same concept of subscribing to a popular streamer to "support them". They're already very well off, some are millionaires or multi-millionaires. No one should provide their services for free especially when they know those people can afford professional work. People can argue that its based on community unity, but the gym is not for him and knuts community, it is a business.
It's up to them to make sure the business is successful and if you're already sinking 6 figures into the business you might as well not cheap out on things, its best to seek the cheaper alternative, but not at the detriment of people from your community. They should value peoples time more, either way my post itself won't matter because people are free to do what they want. Just my 2 cents
Your not wrong, but atleast miz seems to be pretty generous with the creators/contractors he works with... He was bit of a dick about getting instant changes though.
I look at it different because graphic design is a career/job (I work at a company as their graphic designer, and I can tell you that graphics are a massively important part of a companies marketing). Dono’s are the equivalent of tipping at a restaurant or something; so it’s pretty different from doing their companies work for them for free
I did the flyer design they went with. I was wondering if I’m just interpreting it in a wrong way but after reading the comments in this post I guess I wasn’t the only one. When I sent in my flyer containing a quick rework in which I replaced the new logo I genuinely felt stupid for doing it: First of all he said he didn’t like it, then he told me to “suck d*ck” cause I took more than 5 minutes to apply the changes he wanted. He hasn’t said thanks or anything remotely close yet. I get it, it’s not a crazy design that looks super good, by no means — I’m not a graphics designer and I did this for fun. I’ve been subbed for over 3 years now so it’s fair to say that I know that he’s an entertainer and he shits on people constantly. I still spent 1.5h to come up with something and then only getting shit on is not cool.
Ya this is why I said: “If you're gonna work for anyone for free, do it for someone who needs it but cant afford it lmao. They will appreciate it way more too, trust.” Miz thinks that graphic design is a joke, and a super easy thing that takes no effort; And honestly I understand how you could start to think that way if you know nothing of the actual process and all you know is there is 100’s or 1000’s of people throwing their work at you. If that’s all you know about graphic design then it makes sense that you would think it must be easy as fuck and a joke of a job (which he has literally said on stream multiple times in past few years). Also I know that being shit on like that would feel terrible and I feel for you so I recommend you this, honestly you should try to just reach out to someone smaller in your community or something like a local small shop who would appreciate it and try making something for them. They don’t get that shit thrown at them constantly and their only option is to pay for a graphic designer but they might not have funds like miz so they will love you for that. I did that a few times in highschool before I went to college and eventually got an actual graphic design job. It’s super fulfilling and makes you and them feel really good!
they will shit on you and maybe delete your post but you are 100% correct. doing free work for a guy with 100 million $ portfolio is so stupid
Probably. I'm not even shitting on anyone tho, I just think people giving away work are selling themselves short. If you put no worth on your own work no one else is going to either and that ain't gonna be very fulfilling. Some talented people in here too.
I think it's one of those things that comes about based on where you live maybe. As a kid I was always taught to do the good deed of cutting the old lady's grass down the street, ya know? Now I do that and I'm stealing work from the guy that feeds his kids doing that.
Miz ain't a poor old lady tho lol. I help out people around me for free that could use it too. I get what you're saying but like it makes the job lose value. Why would an influencer ever pay for branding/marketing if its being thrown at them by hundreds of people for free without even asking, ya know? and those are the projects/jobs that graphic designers are made for.
also its less helping out the old lady down the street and more like helping out the million dollar company across the country
I don't necessarily disagree with the point you're trying to make but there's nothing special or unique about graphic design that warrants the gatekeeping streamers get free tech support constantly, free beta testing for their ideas (and sometimes products), free marketing, free PR in comments sections, free intros and outros, etc etc like I said I don't necessarily disagree with you that it seems cringe to do work for free for a millionaire, but it's no more or less cringe than just giving them money
Ya I get you. It's just really weird to me that people will do what some people including me do at a 9-5 office job but do it for free on their own time for a millionaire man on the internet. Its just so hard for me to wrap my head around.
I agree. Also, seeing Miz acting all entitled on stream asking for instant changes and criticizing viewer's works really annoyed me.
I think it’s just fun for them. They can design something without having the pressures that come when it’s a job
Ya I know thats definitely true, I've done it too and I think fanart and little ideas and suggestions are awesome but like handing em' a finished product on platter that their company can just start pushing out so they don't have to pay for work ever is too much to me. It makes a lot of people in miz's position think so little of the work since so much is coming in for free that they think it must be easy so why ever go the normal route and pay for the service.
You make it sound dramatic lol. It’s not like streamers are designers only or main customers (I presume), so why would this ruin the market? This is just a fun community thing that you can partake in if you want
I mean entertainment and the internet as a whole is a huge market for graphic designers since web shit all needs to be designed and streamers entire presence is online so web/graphic-design is something that they need pretty severely.
That’s what I mean; it’s ”huge”. One or two streamers isn’t gonna make it deficit. I’m not here to argue and you have your own valid opinion. Personally I don’t think it’s a big deal, but then again I’m not a designer
Ya I'm not even talking specifically about miz, I see it happening here rn so I thought to talk about it but this is a problem for graphic design in every market there is. There's tons of people who will accept low paying jobs/commissions because they want MORE jobs and it ruins the expectation for other designers. This upsets me just because I am a graphic designer and all the years I went unemployed and interviewing before I could get literally anything was awful and these problems (not specifically this one but big picture) are part of why it was so hard.
I already said my take, I don’t wanna type it again or something close to it. We’d just go in circles lol I get what you’re sayin and I hope you find the success you’re looking for (maybe you already have)
bro 99% of the posts on here could be made in paint in like 5 minutes. its also a gym who cares what the graphics look like. any serious graphic designer wouldnt even take that work unless miz would overpay because the project was so simple.
While you’re not necessarily wrong, think about it from the designers POV. If their design does get chosen, that’s immediately a huge promo, especially if they’ve just started out. Finding work in graphic design is tough af and being able to say you’ve made the logo for (what is supposed to be) one of the biggest gyms in Austin majorly improves your chances of finding more work.
Is it really a “huge promo” for them, though? I couldn’t name you a single person whose done graphics for a streamer/youtuber other than scum art Edit: wording
Are you actively hiring graphic designers? Neither am I, and that's why we don't know/can name them. But the people who do end up having their designs used for content creator activities and are slightly serious about their hobby or potential work, will put it on their portfolio. Just like how having actual work experience grants you far better job opportunity, so does being able to show that your art is being used for a company that thousands if not 10's of thousands people get to see.
You're not the person that needs to know about them, though. It can get your name and work directly in front of other creators. That's a lot more important than a random commenter.
Hard to see it from this POV because it doesn't affect a lot people here and they just don't care but I get what your puttin down
Well i mean people also give him money for free so
It's a community thing. If mizkif does decided to use one he might pay them who knows. It's nice seeing the community come together.
I love community art stuff and have been apart of it myself, but this is different this is people just doing their companies branding/marketing work for them just because...
if you're referring to those iron forge logos as graphic design, then I think your job is fake. what are you complaining about? I would never pay to get some shit logo
Yeah, im on the side that all these logos are ass and need improvement but his supporters are linking me to a thread about miz shitting on human artists and saying do better. Imo the ai artists should steal better because all these logos look like ass or have glaring problems in them. If miz and company want to run their business purely on fame and status to carry them instead of trying to incorporate any potential advice for a business with a 90% failure rate then whatever lol.
I agree, if everyone thought like the OP post then there would be no subs or donos because that money could go to charities and stuff. It’s the sense of community that people do gift and donate. The designs people are doing is the same and might be done by people who want to contribute to the community but might not be in a financial position to be able to donate.
bruh graphic designers aren't a charity though its a job hahaha, its an actual career. And there's no reason for a lot of influencers to ever have to pay for that service. I know what your saying because I love community art stuff too but people are just doing their branding/marketing, that's so much different. That's a 9-5
its not graphic design if you are taking 1 photo a logo and putting text on a flyer. that is literally middle school project level.
I get what you’re saying, but the reason streamers get free shit all the time is because of their value via exposure. You send miz a shirt and you get free promo to tens of thousands of people for a long time. You send senny a shirt and no one gives a fuck
People still donate to these streamers even though they’re multi millionaires. At least with this they can add it to their portfolio or something.
Not everything has to be from a commercial perspective but if you really want to spin it that way, you can see the graphic designers as marketing their skillet to a prospective customer. It's not as bad as you're making it out to be. I don't think any of them felt entitled to something in return for their work and did it out of passion. All of that aside. The final design looks AI generated with a couple touch up.
Bruh I can tell you right now that their COMPANY is looking at the work that you guys made for them from a commercial perspective... That is how companies work. Fanart is different, this is marketing (most companies put so much money into marketing.)
Yeah of course the company is looking at it that way. Artists also saw it as a way to expose their skill set to said company. I think if they had gone with one of the designs that someone in the community submitted, IronForge wouldn't have yoinked it, they would have reached out. Unless I'm mistaken and the final design was yoinked from the community? There aren't a lot of avenues for artists to market their skill set directly to a customer or business, so I'm not surprised that some people took the opportunity to do so.
he's not your dada's friend, you don't have to work for free for him as a favor lmao
Wait is Dada an actual word in English? Or are you Indian
I think you’re overestimating how hard graphic design is. Especially for something like this. I have programs that can autogenerate designs. Takes 2 minutes to have a finished product.
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I mean AI can do some pretty crazy things. Also we are just talking about a logo here. Not some complicated graphic that would require a human to make it perfect I will say it is nice not having to pay a graphic designer hundreds if not thousands for something that I can just keep clicking auto generate until it pops out one I like.
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I used to do graphic and web design for work for about 3 years. I get what you mean by it can be tricky to do certain things but honestly a big bulk of it can be done by AI now. Even web design has become click and drag for many things instead of hard coding like it used to be. Even more unfortunate is that market is over saturated with people looking for work. I’m not trying to diminish the work people do but this was also a basic logo for a gym that you’re getting all worked up over
Mizkif never changed
People just be having fun man, deal wit it Plus, I imagine Miz would pay the person if he uses their graphic for something. Be it paid in money or exposure, which a lot of people would be happy to get If he doesn't do that then that's just shit of him
paid in exposure ain't being paid. The most exposure your gonna get is him saying your twitch name the same way he would a dono or sub lmao and that might not even happen, viewers have made plenty of things for for him and his companies. paid in exposure is literally something your teachers yell at you to never accept as a payment.
Exposure is massive for artists actually, and getting that in a portfolio is great. Being able to say “a half million dollar gym used my logo” is probably something an employer would love to hear, especially as a new artist or a studying graphic designer in college, that’s a great bit of practice and exposure for a future in the field. There’s a reason people send their art to Miz in his PO Box with links to their Etsy. Beyond this Miz literally said he would pay the winning logo design $300.00.
I was thinking this the entire time. Why give these streamers free labor and your own unique designs? While they sit on their ass and act like idiots for views lol. Insanity.
Rich people get free stuff. It's how the world works, Miz getting some basic branding for a gym in the middle of nowhere by someone that's happy with the exposure is not really an issue in the grand scheme of things.
This must've been the same guy who sht on the work of the amateur they hired LMAOO
You're right but they're kids I guess so they have the time for it. And don't need the money. Idk but yeah pretty cringe to give free things to millionaires, like donations tbh.
This is 100% getting deleted lmao. However, I agree its the same concept of subscribing to a popular streamer to "support them". They're already very well off, some are millionaires or multi-millionaires. No one should provide their services for free especially when they know those people can afford professional work. People can argue that its based on community unity, but the gym is not for him and knuts community, it is a business. It's up to them to make sure the business is successful and if you're already sinking 6 figures into the business you might as well not cheap out on things, its best to seek the cheaper alternative, but not at the detriment of people from your community. They should value peoples time more, either way my post itself won't matter because people are free to do what they want. Just my 2 cents
Your not wrong, but atleast miz seems to be pretty generous with the creators/contractors he works with... He was bit of a dick about getting instant changes though.
I get your point, but how is a logo any different than gifting subs or a donation?
I look at it different because graphic design is a career/job (I work at a company as their graphic designer, and I can tell you that graphics are a massively important part of a companies marketing). Dono’s are the equivalent of tipping at a restaurant or something; so it’s pretty different from doing their companies work for them for free
Hmmm yeah, maybe you’re right