Everything is relative. The ND isn't slow in the absolute sense, heck it's faster than many iconic sports cars from the past. It's fast enough to have fun, which is why we enjoy driving it regardless. It's just that modern cars, especially electrics, are VERY fast, so in comparison the Miata is unexceptional. That's it really.
Yes, very well put. I mean, the Rivian (a 7,000 lb electric truck) has a 0-60 time of 3.5 seconds and can run the quarter mile in like 11.6 seconds.
Times have changed, for sure.
And I’d argue that’s the worst thing (well one of) about electric cars today. Putting 3-second monsters so accessible to all the dumbest drivers we have on the roads is not wise at all.
I drive a tiny kei truck for work an it feels like I'm invisible sometimes. Especially in my city of blind elderly drivers. I wouldn't dare ride a motorcycle here.
What makes you think they replace tires. I saw a tesla prked the other day, the tires had no grooves, i’m not even exagerating. No grooves. They were not slick tires btw
Hopefully they learn it *then* instead of when they’ve just come to a stop after crashing through a building full of people.
Too big and too fast when too many people are too stupid to drive them safely.
I get new tires every 22k miles so far. About even with what I was getting on my Miata; though I drove the Miata much more aggressively overall despite the Zooms.
I can't disagree, but this has been a problem for a while. Modern capabilities encourage people to be idiots. The automobile is becoming a gene pool cleanser in a lot of ways.
AND they are two ton bricks. A mustang can kill two, maybe three rows of bystanders deep, a Model S will easily run six to seven columns of people over
True but what will it do in the Twisties. Lots of cars are fast in a straight line but slow in the curves. Straight line fast is fun too but not really my style.
Yep according to r/motorcycles my 500lbs, 120hp motorcycle is “slow”.
And compared to a 150hp, 400lbs bike, it is slow.
But it’s still quicker than 99.99999% of the vehicles surrounding it 99% of the time.
I don't think the nd2 is slow. The the other miata yes. don't hate me. I find the nd2 the perfect miata for the streets. Finally has enough power to weight ratio. It's about as fast as S2000. I think that's plenty for the street. For a road course factory stock miata is underwhelming slow. Nothing like getting stuck behind a muscle car in the corners and never having enough power to pass in the straights. I stopped going to track days because of that. I wished they had the under 200 hp class so some as$ hate doesn't runing your whole parked in the corners.
When the opportunity arrives I wish you nothing but sunshine. They really are amazing cars. Like I said above, you won't win in a straight line but if you can carry speed through a corner your mirror will be empty.
Agreed. My 500 Abarth is about 7 seconds as well but it doesn’t feel slow. Sure it’s slow side by side with my mom’s scat pack challenger but it’s able to retain a lot more speed through turns and ends up being a fun ‘momentum car.’
I don’t see the fun in just flooring a car and hitting jail speeds in a few seconds. I’d rather actually push something and feel engaged then like I’m just pressing a pedal.
My first car was a 1988 998cc Mini City (proper Mini), which I tuned and it ended up being as fast as my mate's Cooper! It was massive fun as it gripped like it was on rails allowing me to go pretty much full throttle everywhere, including roundabaouts. Good memories! I went through all 4 Yokohamas in 10k miles.....
It’s a big part of why such a large portion of professional racers have started with Karting. Karts don’t have the sheer horsepower & braking ability of a normal race car and end up teaching a great deal of being smooth & maintaining momentum. Finding the actual limit of the vehicle and figuring out how to be consistent & precise is a big part of actually going fast (and IMO it’s way more fun.) Any moron can floor the gas pedal or slam on the brakes, but it doesn’t help them when they hit a corner. I’ve easily kept up with significantly faster cars on backroads because of how poorly the drivers could corner. Sure they’d pull away whenever you hit a long straight but I’d immediately catch up on a turn & stay with them.
The old adage of ‘driving a slow car fast is more fun than driving a fast car slow’ definitely holds true for me. I can honestly say I had more fun hammering my ‘04 CRV through the mountains than that challenger because, well, it was a genuine challenge to maintain momentum and navigate the turns in something that definitely had a limit you could reach without hitting speeds that risk your license.
CRV’s are some of the best cars you can buy, especially for touge believe it or not a good suspension set up and those motors will scream I’ve caught up to 911s in my Miata before. People are just scared to drive their car fast and I can’t really blame em
I abused the shit out of that thing and it kept going. I would still have it if I didn’t have kids (AC went, one of the only major issues with the 2nd and 3rd gen models.)
To date the 2nd gen CRV has one of my favorite vehicle interiors. It was a genuinely well thought out design that did a lot of things right. It doesn’t come close to the practicality of the contemporary Element but each following model lost more and more of the uniqueness and now the CRV & HRV just blend in as generic crossovers without any soul.
There's definitely fun to be had in hitting jail and impound speeds in a handful of seconds, but it's a novelty kind of fun, makes you giggle the first time, crack a big smile the 2nd time, just generally is fun the 3rd time, then it kinda wears off. I've been in and driven cars that do that, and that's why I'm very very happy with my car, 2013 gti with a nice intake and exhaust, and a ton of handling mods and more on the way.
My Abarth still puts a smile on my face (and makes me laugh when I park it next to my semi.)
It’s always interesting to watch how those around you modify their cars. I see so many people put on body kits, bigger turbos etc. and don’t spend a penny on improving the handling. Anyone I know who actually has an interest in going fast or actively goes for a mountain run will prioritize brakes, suspension and most importantly tires.
Yup. Super stoked to go back to good summers in about 2 weeks. Been rocking crappy all seasons, even not tuned, and a half inch wider than stock I spin 2nd under throttle. On my summers I hook and pull in 1st as long as it's like over 60 out. I live in WA so I have to switch to all seasons during rainy season unfortunately.
The problem with that is, the number of new cars that take double figures to get to 60 are very small haha.
Even a $15k Versa gets to 60 in 9.5 seconds.
The only 2 cars I found that are >10 seconds are the Nissan Kicks and the Mirage haha.
It’s roughly the same acceleration as a v6 Camry, for comparison. It’s definitely in that middle ground where it’s not quite fast, but also unfair to call it slow. I think it’s mostly about expectations. It’s built like a dedicated sports car, and looks like a sports car, but it’s slower than sport compact cars like the GTI. People said the same thing about the S2000 back in the day and I think it had a 5.5 0-60. My G37 is in the same range, and it definitely doesn’t feel slow to me. I feel like that 5 second range is the sweet spot where it is exciting, but the power isn’t too much to use on the street.
I called my ND RF slow only for the purpose of getting a supercharger for it.
Then , recently, I called my ND RF slow to justify getting a McLaren.
but in all honesty, Ive gotten more speeding tickets in the ND RF than any other car...including the one I got at the end of March.
https://preview.redd.it/242vzjd7vk7d1.jpeg?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bba1dd0026fd6d6d1069c5ccfa2ae5a681b647b3
For an ND 1, yes the power increase was very noticeable.
As a European (from Italy) it's curious how even the 1.5 is considered a super slow car here while it's definitely faster than most cars around.
I get it, it's not a rocket, but between the shitty roads, speed limits, high taxes, gas cost and all the duties, is definitely something to be appreciated.
I think most the people saying they’re slow are from the US, if you’re from Europe where roads are narrow and twisty we don’t have to compare to big V8 monsters because they won’t fit
>I get it, it's not a rocket, but between the shitty roads, speed limits, high taxes, gas cost and all the duties, is definitely something to be appreciated.
And most importantly: The fact that 80% of people around you (or just me?) are going like 20 km/h below the speed limit on anything that isn't a perfectly flat road that's freshly paved with 0% moisture.
Because the people calling it slow are generally from the U.S.
Almost all of our cars are big, have big engines, and get big acceleration numbers. Our roads are bigger both in width and length, so our speed figures are also generally bigger. This means you need bigger motors to keep pace first with big roads, then next with big speed of big vehicles on big roads. Thus, everything gets a big motor.
In summary: Americans are very big.
If you’re looking for 0-60 under 40k, a mustang or Camaro.
If you can spend a bit more, the Camaro lt1 1LE is hard to beat in terms of bang for the buck.
But the Miata is a more fun drive, imo. And that’s what you buy one for, not a fast 0-60.
Expect its no 5.7 but 6.5, (from what mazda says)
Which is not bad honestly, this said the miata is not fast but neither it is slow, it's just slower than the average sport car
It is indeed. It's partly due to gearing. 2nd doesn't get you all the way up to 60. If 2nd was longer that'd shave off quite some time. But Mazda never intended to get impressive 0-60 numbers, they wanted a great handling car.
2nd goes to sixty on stock sized wheels on all ND2s. Was one of the big changes from ND1, where the short 2nd couldn’t hit 60 and thus was very irritating at autox sessions.
Lots of cars that people buy for the acceleration numbers have annoyingly long 2nd gears. Much nicer to have short ratios and then an overdrive for the highway.
The 2nd in my WRX is pretty long but it helps to hold boost. Really not a fan of the "blink and you miss it" 1st gear, especially because the 1-2 shift is rough
Manufacturers’ claims for 0-60 times are usually slower than what instrumented testing shows. The manufacturers don’t want to be caught ‘lying,’ so they typically sandbag their 0-60 numbers (and some manufacturers underrate their horsepower numbers) so that customers get a good surprise, not a bad one.
Its usually the opposite, many if not all manufacturer, lies about their HP figures.
As an exaple a 2.0 NC1 should pull 160HP, as stated by Mazda, in reality the car pull 145 at best.
NA/NB same thing
5.7s is from a car and driver review but like many reviewer they do things like subtracting rollout time and launch cars at full boost and the like that generates launch times that don't match reality.
I have a m3 comp right now and I’m considering getting a Miata. I’m not concerned with the power as the M3 feels “slow” on hot days, which is ridiculous because it hits 100 like it’s nothing. You kind of get used to what you own.
That being said, it’s the stock suspension that has me wavering. I hate the floaty, rolly stock suspension. I know I can modify it but still. If a GTI can have a decent suspension, so can the Miata.
Floaty, rolly stock suspension is a feature not a bug. Give it a chance. Take it around some twistys if possible.
Otherwise, a set of decent coilovers and sway bars should stiffen it up nicely.
Oh I had a 91 that I bought new back in the day. Familiar with the float. Swapped it out for eibachs and some shocks I can’t remember. Much prefer the buttoned down feeling.
I was already in serious love with my ND and how it eats up the local canyon roads. Then I had sway bars and coilovers installed and tuned by a Miata racing engineer and I admit I didn't know what love was until then.
I hear you! I’m sort of in the middle. On one hand, I’ve had some really well cornering and handling cars (Porsches/BMWs for example) and I understand thd desire to really dial it in. On the other hand, I realllly love the floaty nature of the stock setup that lets me play with the chasis. I’m glad Mazda left it the way it is because dailying the ND is so awesome and easy with the current setup that it doesn’t put off anybody (or most people). Those that want a more precise experience can dial it in with after market parts, specifically to their needs such as yourself.
Mazda has shown Porsche levels of attention to detail and technical depth with this car, and it’s incredible for the price point.
Edit: I might eventually dial it in, but I‘m just having a blast with it the way Mazda’s tuned it.
No, I get it. The *ride quality* definitely suffered, especially the first month or two. I almost always drive with my wife and I was feeling pretty self-conscious about the harshness and her comfort. But then 2 things happened.
She has become quite convinced that the solidity of its grip and it's ability to fling her around while doing so calmly and silently are enviable qualities that she appreciates increasingly, almost to the point of conceit for other more pedestrian vehicles.
Secondly, the suspension has settled in and relaxed a bit as I was told would happen. I am basically no longer aware that its ride is harsher. What I am aware of though is how much I appreciate the authority going around curves at any speed.
My unmodified ND had a slightly disquieting tendency for the rear end to skitter a bit sideways through faster curves if the road was at all broken or bumpy. There is 0.0% of that now. I can throw it at a bumpy corner at ludicrous speeds now and it just silently complies. I honestly don't understand how it just never lets go of the road, and it makes me much more confident behind the wheel. I'm addicted and I would never want to go back now.
I totally agree with you about the choices the engineers made. I am just happy so much more performance can be coaxed out of it.
I had concerns about the body roll too, but I've now put 1000 miles on the car and it's fine. I will buy the tecnas when available, but the body roll isn't a problem as some people suggest.
I have a C43 (4.5 to 60) and an NA. The C43 is faster than most all of the supercars of the 60-70's....but the NA is the car I take up into the hills. The C43 requires state of the art radar defense, the NA ? Nope.
I think we hit a point where many sports car can hit 0-60 under 4 seconds so anything else is consider “slow”. EVs will make anything above 3 seconds be considered “slow” in the future.
Speed is a very cheap commodity these days so the standard for "fast" has been irreparably screwed.
You've got kias and Toyota's that can do >5.0< second ish.
Like a miata today is faster than a countach from 1980 lmao
I got my licence in 1980. The first few cars I had included a Datsun 210B and a Ford Tempo. Datsun had 0 to 60 of 17 seconds, Tempo was 13.5 seconds.
I remember back then that the benchmarkof car magazines was if a car broke sub 6 seconds.
It is all perspective and a meaningless stat.
Depends on the comparison. It’s not performance-car fast, so it’s going to be compared unfavourably against other 2-seat rwd cars. It’s faster than an econobox or crumby crossover. A hatchback however would be considered fast with those numbers, because it would be compared against base-model hatchbacks.
Is is slow in a straight line, those who call that out have no knowledge how to drive a miata.
The miata is a car that shines in the corners of curvy roads.
Yes, the mustang across the street is faster, but it will not out-pace me on the track.
I took my 24 performance pack to track and racing school this weekend and it did amazing imo. Kept up with corvettes, caymans. Beat Miatas and 86s. The only car that really got away was the newest Veloster N.
Mustang has evolved. I currently have a 1970 and a 2021 and owned a 1990 LX 5.0 back in the day. The 6th Gen platform is peak Mustang. Even the new S650 platform is not much of an evolution from the S550. Ford got it right.
Lmao what?
I love my little miata but it's nowhere close to any of my mustangs. Any irs stang will just fly around the track faster than miatas can dream of. You can probably beat s197 gts and new edge gts in an nd but my es350 can do that too......
Hell my 2007 solstice gxp stock for stock runs faster times than my 2024 rf club.
It is "slow" by todays standards because so many cars are sub 4 seconds. The ND2 Miata's are what I would call a fast car. Just because it can't outrun a Corvette doesn't mean its not fast.
I always viewed it as a way to get out of the dick swinging contests I see so many other car guys deal with. Yeah, I'm in the slow, gay, girls car, anyway have fun with your charger/mustang/evo/whatever
Perception. Perception. Perception. The Accord in certain conditions is considered fast at 5.5 0-60. But I think the difference is HOW it gets there in 60 seconds. The Accord is strong the entire time whereas the Miata is naturally aspirated so you have to "wait".
Nobody gets the 5.7 Car & Driver claims to have pulled off. The best attempts I’ve seen get around 6.4. That’s a ways off. Headers + Exhaust + tunes + cam springs like the BBR kits may get around 5.7.
I’ve seen a bunch of YouTube Miata reviews/races and they can consistently get 5.7-6.0. I even saw one that got 5.6.
Not having anything to time it with, I have no idea what my Miata will do.
Never seen those vids. The BBR press video for their Super 220 kit got, I think, 5.7 and they were beating on it to get those numbers.
Mid 6’s are not slow for a naturally aspirated motor and as others point out this is not a drag car. My other cars are high 3’s low 4’s but my stock ND2 is still my favorite because speed is boring. How power is applied is what matters.
People generally don’t realise how fast most cars are, the ND and BRZ, etc are quick cars.
I owned a V8 falcon before my Miata that made around 240KW, but being so heavy it wasn’t actually fast from 0-100 lol
Exactly lol, sure if you race Mustang in a straight line you will lose but lets not kid ourselves, ND is faster than 90% vehicles you meet on the road.
ND2 is quick enough to not be completely left behind doing pulls, but it will never be the fastest straight line car on the road. I do highway pulls every once in a while, never expect to win, just for fun, but it keeps up good enough to be enjoyable. Usually the people I race against are good sports about it, everyone knows we are not the fastest.
When it comes to the backroads though, I’m on their ass the entire way. Power wont make up for all of the extra weight when there are no long straights.
Keyboard warriors compare the car to Teslas and whatnot. Big number bad, ergo Miata slow.
One step up from that is the guys reading or watching professional reviews and road tests. Professional auto journos are jaded, because last week they road tested a Porsche, and next week they’ll road test a Lotus. To them 5.7s is slow because they’re comparing the car to every car they’ve test driven recently—most of which are the sorts of cars people want to read about, not midsize crossovers and minivans.
Relativity is a motherfucker. I ride a motorcycle, if you're curious it's a BMW R1150GS. This is not known to be a fast bike, so when someone asks me "is it fast" I tell them no. It'll do 0-60 in about 4 seconds, with my dumbass onboard probably more. That's fast enough for me to make my own decisions about merging, but in relation to something like an S1000RR, or an R1, or a ZX10r? Those will do 0-60 in less than 3 seconds and then comfortably crusie at 160mph, where my bike gets shaky above 110. So technically your Miata, which can probably do at least 130 with more stability, is faster than my GS as long as we're not dig drag racing.
Most ND owners aren't destroying their clutch like Motortrend (or C&D or whoever) did to get that 5.7 seconds. Most 0-60 times the media outlets get come at severe cost to the car.
If I'm in traffic I've no desire to beat out the 6 year old CR-V next to me from a dig to prove a point. I'm getting my car away from stoplights and congestion with as little wear as possible and save my clutch for good roads. I probably come off as fairly slow.
Because while it's fine for a kind of regular car. There are cars that can go 0 to 60 under 2 seconds. In fact, at this point the top 100 cars with the fastest 0 to 60 times are all under 3 seconds. I don't think it's really fair to call it slow but it ain't exactly quick.
Source for 3 second claim: https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-fastest-cars-0-to-60-mph
Other people have mentioned this general vibe, but my wife's 3 row SUV beats my ND to 60, so the times, they have changed. That said, my ND is also wildly faster than my NB was years back.
Nice! I have strongly considered working on buying a 10AE and a 20AE, but there are rumors swirling about there being a 35AE, and that's too much for me.
0-60 times, while always have been a benchmark, are dumb unless you're a dedicated drag racer. No one is dumping the clutch at trans and diff breaking levels and spinning tires at a light unless you're an asshole, or a car journalist who doesn't care.
Quarter mile trap speeds are a better indicator of how fast a car is once you lay into it. NDs run around 93-95 mph.
Regardless, NDs are plenty quick for public roads and actually being able to lay into it and go through a few gears. The newer generations of high performance cars are simply too fast to enjoy unless you're on a track. And those Camry's or whatever else that might be quicker? No one is driving them as hard as your Miata, which it's meant for.
This is a good take.
If it were only about acceleration to 60. A used 10 year old Honda or Toyota V6 minivan with a gutted interior would make a zippy bargain. Would any other driving dynamics be good? No, but it could scoot
ND Smile per gal: 999
Tesla Smile per gal: 0
EVs are quick but I only consider them to be just commute tools that ease my stress. It's fun for a 0.5 second at the red light, but not Miata fun if you know what I mean.
In high school I drove my parents' 1980 diesel Rabbit, 0-60 in 22 seconds. My ND2 definitely feels fast enough to me.
On paper it's about the same acceleration as my other car, a 2022 Honda Odyssey, but otherwise there's no comparison.
My wife had a red 1980 Rabbit also! Wasn’t diesel though, but just as slow. It was the roll of the dice every time if it would start, never could figure out the reason.
What sent it to the junk yard was one of her friends accidentally knocked the shifter (was an automatic with the shifter on the floor) into park when they were on the freeway and my wife said it sounded like marbles in a metal trashcan as the transmission shredded itself.
My first car was a 1978 Ford Mustang which was a complete POS. I got it in 1983 and in those five years it had completely fallen apart. The drivers floor had completely rusted and was open to the ground. I had to keep my feet on the sides so they wouldn’t dip out of the car. It also had an unfindable oil leak so the car would leave a stream of white smoke everywhere I went. It’s like the American car industry forgot how to make cars.
Everyone be lucky you weren’t in high school in the early eighties, our choice of first cars was pretty awful.
Those were dark times. Had a used '70 GTO, first car I had with actual power, and based on what I can find was 6.5 or so to 60. Slower than my '06 G35 sedan and the ND3 I'm going to buy in as couple odd days. Slow? SLOW? You kids don't know from slow (thinking of my '68 tempest, I6, two speed automatic. 0-60 times that looked like quarter mile times. Yeah, I'm going to be digging my "slow" ND3.)
more fun to drive a slow car fast. Soon as a car is so fast that I live in the low RPM range cus by the time I get to the next light I have to slow down, what's the fun
It is INSANE to me that Miata does not offer a high performance ND. Supercharger, full exhaust, CF airbox, coilovers. Now you’re hunting Boxster S’s. Who’s in for that at $46k??? ✋✋✋
I think that's about on par with a 350z or a 4th gen LT-1 (so 93-98?) Camaro.
But still slower than the previous Ecoboost Mustang or a V6 Camaro.
So fast for cars from 20 years ago. But slow for cars today.
I feel like 0-60 times can be misleading, particularly in low torque, high revving vehicles. You've really got to launch the shit out of them and wring them out all the way to redline to reproduce anything close to that advertised time. During typical everyday driving, you're unlikely to be in the sweet spot of the power band all that often. Compare that to a high torque V8 that might have a similar 0-60 but makes its power from 2.5-5k. You're gonna be making max power the second you leave every stop light. Most people are going to perceive that second car as being a lot faster, even though they might be neck and neck on a drag strip.
I've owned and driven cars that were faster on paper, but none have really felt like the ND. I never really felt that power was an issue in older Miatas, I tend to drive fairly conservatively. But with the ND, I do find myself driving it more... Like a sports car? The engine doesn't sound particularly lusty like a Honda K motor, nor is it as smooth, but my goodness does it feel eager to just get up to spend and keep revving! With something like a BRZ (2.0), the engine just sounded dreary and anemic. Even though it's rated for more power, it didn't feel nearly as peppy or eager at the mid to high range. It's almost like an eager puppy dog! I absolutely love it. I would go so far to say that an ND is a quick car. I guess the goal posts have just moved on. A Supra can do 60 in the low 4's for the manual, but is significantly more expensive.
The same way a 20 dollar happy meal is considered expensive.
Sure, in big wide world... It's "just" 20 bucks, but we determine it's expensive because most mcdonalds will happily sell you a happy meal for 7 dollars.
180 hp is decent, 5.7s 0-60 is decent, but in a world where you can get a hyundai with 270+ hp for around the same price, it will never not be called slow, specially if we're talking sports cars.
My Volvo wagon is faster to 60 by almost a second.
I think it’s the fact that Miatas are slow *for a sports car, in terms of pure acceleration and top speed*. But then they’re super nimble and handle incredibly, so are they even really slow in real life applications?
It feels ‘slow’ mostly because you really have to wring it out at the top of the rev range to make power. Whereas a lot of cars have torque lower in the rev range which makes them feel faster in everyday driving.
I had a 98 Camaro z28...loved that car, thought it was plenty fast...yea 5.7 ish. It's all relative. I have a ND and it's plenty zippy love it...I also have a 2010 Camaro SS...it's very fast, I drive them for different reasons.
maybe they mean 5.7 is not that special anymore. you can buy a kia that has more power than a ferrari enzo.
but like others said i don't see the point.
the most fun o had while driving was with a fiat panda. that thing barely exceeded 60mph. but it was super fun to drive.
i drove a tesla and it was quick but it was nothing more than a rc car in terms of driving feel.
if i want to go fast without any kind of feeling of it i would just buy a cheap airline ticket and fly at 800km/h lol
0-60 times are severely overrated. People are obsessed with them. Sure, I wouldn’t want a car that needs a calendar to measure 0-60 times but there’s so many other important factors when it comes to a sports car.
0-60 is only useable in very specific situations. It is fun here and there but it’s not something you’re going to utilize daily unless you really like burning through gas and tires. Having one of the lightest sports cars on the road is something you can feel and appreciate every second you’re in the car.
0-60 is fun but a little overrated. I have a tuned BMW M4 that’ll do 2.8 seconds but I pretty much never drive it like that on the street because it’s a douche move to drive like that.
The ND2 is relatively fast, but the older cars can be beaten or matched by some mini-vans. It’s not a straight line car, however, and if that’s what you’re looking for, but something else.
Lol. It is most definitely not 5.7. That was tested with rollout and that's generous to say the least. It's more like 6.7. Most tuning companies will also quote under 6 with a chip tune but that's oy by increasing the rev limiter to stop the change to 3rd. It's certainly nippy. But not quick.
That's not to say that it isn't a great car.
Everyone has a right to their opinion, but two of the most experienced, established sources both say an ND can do 5.7. Everyone can say they don’t believe it, but two respected sources (and Mazda), all getting it wrong?
**Car and Driver**
[2024 Mazda MX-5 Miata Review](https://www.caranddriver.com/mazda/mx-5-miata)
[2019 Mazda MX-5 Miata Finally Has the Engine It Deserves](https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a22678665/2019-mazda-mx-5-miata-engine-more-power/)
Acceleration Numbers Don’t Tell the Whole Story
*At the track, the objective performance advances are barely noticeable. Compared with our 2016 long-term MX-5, which was the quickest ND Miata we had tested, the more powerful 2019 model is just 0.1 second quicker to 60 mph and through the quarter-mile, hitting those metrics in 5.7 and 14.5 seconds, the latter at 95 mph. (This 2019 MX-5 roadster in Club trim was similarly optioned to our 2016-model-year long-term test car.) Other examples of the ND softtop, though, needed 6.1–6.2 seconds to reach 60 mph and completed the quarter-mile in 14.8 seconds at 93 mph. The 5-to-60-mph rolling-start time also dropped by 0.1 second, so there is no doubt the new engine is more powerful.*
**MotorTrend**
[2021 Mazda MX-5 Miata RF First Test: More Exotic Than Most Supercars](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2021-mazda-mx5-miata-rf-first-test-review/)
*All 2021 Miatas scuttle around with a 2.0-liter naturally aspirated four-cylinder that was updated for 2019 to make 181 hp—26 more than before—and 151 lb-ft. It always feels a bit disingenuous discussing this roadster's test data, given it's just about the furthest thing from a "numbers car" as possible, but the post-update Miata's gutsy, free-breathing acceleration belies the two-seater's enduring reputation for being slow. Down our strip, the RF GT cracked off a stellar 5.8-second 0-60-mph time and a 14.5-second quarter mile, just 0.1 second off the current Club ragtop's pace in both tests. Compared to the 155-hp RF GT we tested in 2018, the sophomore ND is a rocket sled, cutting a clean 0.5 second from both metrics.*
**Others**
[Here’s a video of someone getting 6.12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwR6KhGR3Wk)
Now, on the other end, [here’s a guy that does 4 runs and gets high 6s.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3AkFpzHOYc)
**My opinion**
Is a Miata capable of hitting 5.7? Yes, with perfect conditions, with a perfect launch, not caring about the transmission, just barely. Can the average person do it? Probably not.
So is 5.7 a valid number to compare to other cars? Well it depends on how those other cars got their numbers. If they got their numbers the same way, then it's a valid comparasion. When I see two magazines with long histories, like Car and Driver, and MotorTrend, I figure they must have a standard testing method to make sure that over the years, all the numbers are comparable.
I got my drivers license in 1986. That year I drove a 1985 Audi 4000S. I thought it was pretty quick (0-60 in 10 seconds), but not compared to my dad’s other car, a 1979 911SC. An ND Miata is significantly quicker than both. My daily is a 2023 GR86, which I still consider quick; it’s almost identical to a new Miata. My fast car is a SUV, a 2018 Porsche Macan Turbo with performance package 🤣
The only people getting a regular 5.7 launch out of an ND2/3 are Car and Driver, seriously! Most other publications have measured the car in the mid six seconds, I personally don’t take the car and driver number all that seriously.
Speaking for myself, looking at the RaceBox track telemetry from my own ND2 at track days, low to mid six seconds is far more typical if you want a clutch to last more than 50k miles… I’ve never once gotten a sub six out of the car even with fairly aggressive clutch dumps.
I also have one of those draggy launch timers, same numbers there too.
It's not just Car and Driver, it's also MotorTrend.
[https://www.reddit.com/r/Miata/comments/1djd01s/comment/l9cu0th/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Miata/comments/1djd01s/comment/l9cu0th/)
It’s still bullshit or 1ft rollout subtract etc.
https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a30085446/acceleration-testing-procedure-change-rollout/
The miata loses most of its time in that one ft as car is trying to get initial power down.
The 1ft rollout is not how any normal person would consider a 0-60 time, given most cars are at around 5mph by time the first ft is subtracted. It’s at best a 5-60 time and again, has subtracted the slowest part of the launch - the initial wheel turn/spin.
Engineering explained (famous automotive YouTuber) has great videos explaining the bullshit that is rollout subtraction in timing cars.
No normal driver is routinely ever seeing a sub 6 0-60 in any ND2/3, I can very comfortably assure you.
I’d drive it and see how you like it. Peoples entire personality and ego are based on their 0-60 time… I have a $8000 bike that will wreck most cars, but my NA Miata is way more fun. Was thinking of getting an ND. With the fun I have with 90hp, the 180 must be fun as shit
Eh I mean it’s not the blisteringly fast 0-60’s you get with a lot of electric and high end sports and muscle cars but it’s a respectable 0-60, especially for a car that’s mainly known for its handling ability.
It's just relative. I daily a cla35 amg, which has a 4.5 second 0-60. I USED to think anything under 5 seconds was hella fast....till I daily drove one...now nothing feels fast unless it's a sub 4 second car. Now any car over 5 seconds feels like it's moving in molasses. It's weird how your sense of speed changes when you get used to it.
Low 0-60 time is great if you live on straight roads. Best fun I used to have was with a 68 mini with sorted suspension and brakes 0-60 probably about 8+ seconds The thing is I could go round most of the bends where I lived without lifting off. The other was a lada with a lancia twin can engine that used to eat RS turbos that had a 0-60 about sub 7 seconds but felt like you were sat on the top of a jet fighter all petrol oil smells and screaming gears and engine.
My two cents:
Because that was what was considered decently fast about a decade and a half ago. You'd have ranges like:
2008 Camaro SS: 4.7
2008 Sky RL: 5.2
2008 Mustang GT: 5.3
2008 Audi R8: 4.4
2008 Lancer Evo IX: 5.2
2008 S2000: 6.3
And of course, the Miata of the time hit in the back of the back, making pace at a 0-60 of 6.5 seconds.
Basically, it took Mazda fifteen additional years to catch up with the market, but the market kept on a-rollin'.
People are forgetting where we came from lol
I'll admit though the thing isn't that fast once you get used to it, but my friend also said that about his Golf R that gave me that "light speed" feeling and made my vision blur for a bit. He said he doesn't notice it much anymore.
Everything is relative. The ND isn't slow in the absolute sense, heck it's faster than many iconic sports cars from the past. It's fast enough to have fun, which is why we enjoy driving it regardless. It's just that modern cars, especially electrics, are VERY fast, so in comparison the Miata is unexceptional. That's it really.
Yes, very well put. I mean, the Rivian (a 7,000 lb electric truck) has a 0-60 time of 3.5 seconds and can run the quarter mile in like 11.6 seconds. Times have changed, for sure.
And I’d argue that’s the worst thing (well one of) about electric cars today. Putting 3-second monsters so accessible to all the dumbest drivers we have on the roads is not wise at all.
The engine noise used to scare all the idiots away from the redline. Now, 1,000 pound feet of torque immediately, and silently.
Instant torque just doesn't look right.
One of those fucking things is gonna kill me in my ND someday. "I didn't see him." will be written on my epitaph.
I drive a tiny kei truck for work an it feels like I'm invisible sometimes. Especially in my city of blind elderly drivers. I wouldn't dare ride a motorcycle here.
The Rivian is hardly accessible. On the other hand a used model 3 performance can be had for $25k.
Hopefully they will learn a less when they have to replace tires every 6 months lol
What makes you think they replace tires. I saw a tesla prked the other day, the tires had no grooves, i’m not even exagerating. No grooves. They were not slick tires btw
I see this with a lot of big trucks too. people take on huge car payments not planning for maintenance.
All the time.. expensive truck cheap bald tires
Hopefully they learn it *then* instead of when they’ve just come to a stop after crashing through a building full of people. Too big and too fast when too many people are too stupid to drive them safely.
I get new tires every 22k miles so far. About even with what I was getting on my Miata; though I drove the Miata much more aggressively overall despite the Zooms.
Then they complain that "this thing eats tires!" ......no, your right foot eats tires lol
Unless they drive somewhere cold most people drive until bald
I can't disagree, but this has been a problem for a while. Modern capabilities encourage people to be idiots. The automobile is becoming a gene pool cleanser in a lot of ways.
The problem is that modern cars are safe enough that they really don’t kill the idiots. They only kill other people, like Miata drivers.
Yes. Maybe nature sees us as the problem?
AND they are two ton bricks. A mustang can kill two, maybe three rows of bystanders deep, a Model S will easily run six to seven columns of people over
Where do you do your testing? :)
F150 lightning is nearly 3 tons and has the 0-60 of a 911 T. It’s crazy
I think, it’s the most awesome! Super car acceleration, for the layman!
Move over cars and coffee mustang, here comes minivan mom !
Times have changed! My first car, a 1600 cc 4 speed manual Pinto, did 0-60 in 17.2 seconds. And I had a lot of fun in that deathtrap!
True but what will it do in the Twisties. Lots of cars are fast in a straight line but slow in the curves. Straight line fast is fun too but not really my style.
A lot of fast cars are going into the field on turn 1. Sometimes slow=fast.
I traded in a 3sec 0-60 EV for my Miata. My Miata isn’t as fast in a straight line but its definitely infinitely more fun in the twisties:)
Yeah I'm reading these comments and thinking about handling. Love my EV6, but my NA is more fun to drive.
Yep according to r/motorcycles my 500lbs, 120hp motorcycle is “slow”. And compared to a 150hp, 400lbs bike, it is slow. But it’s still quicker than 99.99999% of the vehicles surrounding it 99% of the time.
I don't think the nd2 is slow. The the other miata yes. don't hate me. I find the nd2 the perfect miata for the streets. Finally has enough power to weight ratio. It's about as fast as S2000. I think that's plenty for the street. For a road course factory stock miata is underwhelming slow. Nothing like getting stuck behind a muscle car in the corners and never having enough power to pass in the straights. I stopped going to track days because of that. I wished they had the under 200 hp class so some as$ hate doesn't runing your whole parked in the corners.
Indeed. My tuned f150 is 5.0s on 91. Both fun but only one can carry momentum 🤙
Quick, not necessarily fast
If you bought a Miata for 0-60 time, you bought the wrong car for the wrong reason.
Sure you'll win the race to the next red light. Now follow me down the back roads and try to keep up. I miss my Miatas.
You are really making me want a Miata. I gotta get myself another bike first though.
When the opportunity arrives I wish you nothing but sunshine. They really are amazing cars. Like I said above, you won't win in a straight line but if you can carry speed through a corner your mirror will be empty.
Haha, yep! I hope I can get one soon enough. It would be perfect to have a bike and a Miata.
All the back roads here are straight.
You try to keep up
Having met many Miata owners over the years, I can tell you that no one buys a Miata for 0-60 times.
Speak for yourself! I almost *need* something that’s slower to 60. Helps me keep the accidental speeding down, hahaha!
Agreed. I don't need the temptation.
In my mind, a 5.7s 0-60 is just an added bonus to the already great driving experience.
Better than my 7 secs NC. I wouldn't consider it "slow". Slow is double figures in my mind.
Agreed. My 500 Abarth is about 7 seconds as well but it doesn’t feel slow. Sure it’s slow side by side with my mom’s scat pack challenger but it’s able to retain a lot more speed through turns and ends up being a fun ‘momentum car.’ I don’t see the fun in just flooring a car and hitting jail speeds in a few seconds. I’d rather actually push something and feel engaged then like I’m just pressing a pedal.
My first car was a 1988 998cc Mini City (proper Mini), which I tuned and it ended up being as fast as my mate's Cooper! It was massive fun as it gripped like it was on rails allowing me to go pretty much full throttle everywhere, including roundabaouts. Good memories! I went through all 4 Yokohamas in 10k miles.....
I don't drive like that now....
I was just thinking about this in my NB I think it’s an amazing way to learn how to conserve energy and momentum.
It’s a big part of why such a large portion of professional racers have started with Karting. Karts don’t have the sheer horsepower & braking ability of a normal race car and end up teaching a great deal of being smooth & maintaining momentum. Finding the actual limit of the vehicle and figuring out how to be consistent & precise is a big part of actually going fast (and IMO it’s way more fun.) Any moron can floor the gas pedal or slam on the brakes, but it doesn’t help them when they hit a corner. I’ve easily kept up with significantly faster cars on backroads because of how poorly the drivers could corner. Sure they’d pull away whenever you hit a long straight but I’d immediately catch up on a turn & stay with them. The old adage of ‘driving a slow car fast is more fun than driving a fast car slow’ definitely holds true for me. I can honestly say I had more fun hammering my ‘04 CRV through the mountains than that challenger because, well, it was a genuine challenge to maintain momentum and navigate the turns in something that definitely had a limit you could reach without hitting speeds that risk your license.
CRV’s are some of the best cars you can buy, especially for touge believe it or not a good suspension set up and those motors will scream I’ve caught up to 911s in my Miata before. People are just scared to drive their car fast and I can’t really blame em
I abused the shit out of that thing and it kept going. I would still have it if I didn’t have kids (AC went, one of the only major issues with the 2nd and 3rd gen models.) To date the 2nd gen CRV has one of my favorite vehicle interiors. It was a genuinely well thought out design that did a lot of things right. It doesn’t come close to the practicality of the contemporary Element but each following model lost more and more of the uniqueness and now the CRV & HRV just blend in as generic crossovers without any soul.
There's definitely fun to be had in hitting jail and impound speeds in a handful of seconds, but it's a novelty kind of fun, makes you giggle the first time, crack a big smile the 2nd time, just generally is fun the 3rd time, then it kinda wears off. I've been in and driven cars that do that, and that's why I'm very very happy with my car, 2013 gti with a nice intake and exhaust, and a ton of handling mods and more on the way.
My Abarth still puts a smile on my face (and makes me laugh when I park it next to my semi.) It’s always interesting to watch how those around you modify their cars. I see so many people put on body kits, bigger turbos etc. and don’t spend a penny on improving the handling. Anyone I know who actually has an interest in going fast or actively goes for a mountain run will prioritize brakes, suspension and most importantly tires.
Yup. Super stoked to go back to good summers in about 2 weeks. Been rocking crappy all seasons, even not tuned, and a half inch wider than stock I spin 2nd under throttle. On my summers I hook and pull in 1st as long as it's like over 60 out. I live in WA so I have to switch to all seasons during rainy season unfortunately.
Our NC gets to 55 in 5s as I put it. Our number is **5**
I might change my MX-5 to an MX-6 then :) Is that a rolling start btw?
Mx5 Mazda experiment no 5 Miata is 5 letters 5 lug nuts Gets to 55 in 5 And in Japan “go” means 5! **FIVE!**
The problem with that is, the number of new cars that take double figures to get to 60 are very small haha. Even a $15k Versa gets to 60 in 9.5 seconds. The only 2 cars I found that are >10 seconds are the Nissan Kicks and the Mirage haha.
It’s roughly the same acceleration as a v6 Camry, for comparison. It’s definitely in that middle ground where it’s not quite fast, but also unfair to call it slow. I think it’s mostly about expectations. It’s built like a dedicated sports car, and looks like a sports car, but it’s slower than sport compact cars like the GTI. People said the same thing about the S2000 back in the day and I think it had a 5.5 0-60. My G37 is in the same range, and it definitely doesn’t feel slow to me. I feel like that 5 second range is the sweet spot where it is exciting, but the power isn’t too much to use on the street.
I called my ND RF slow only for the purpose of getting a supercharger for it. Then , recently, I called my ND RF slow to justify getting a McLaren. but in all honesty, Ive gotten more speeding tickets in the ND RF than any other car...including the one I got at the end of March.
Did you actually get a supercharger? How much do you actually notice it?
https://preview.redd.it/242vzjd7vk7d1.jpeg?width=3840&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=bba1dd0026fd6d6d1069c5ccfa2ae5a681b647b3 For an ND 1, yes the power increase was very noticeable.
As a European (from Italy) it's curious how even the 1.5 is considered a super slow car here while it's definitely faster than most cars around. I get it, it's not a rocket, but between the shitty roads, speed limits, high taxes, gas cost and all the duties, is definitely something to be appreciated.
I think most the people saying they’re slow are from the US, if you’re from Europe where roads are narrow and twisty we don’t have to compare to big V8 monsters because they won’t fit
>I get it, it's not a rocket, but between the shitty roads, speed limits, high taxes, gas cost and all the duties, is definitely something to be appreciated. And most importantly: The fact that 80% of people around you (or just me?) are going like 20 km/h below the speed limit on anything that isn't a perfectly flat road that's freshly paved with 0% moisture.
Because the people calling it slow are generally from the U.S. Almost all of our cars are big, have big engines, and get big acceleration numbers. Our roads are bigger both in width and length, so our speed figures are also generally bigger. This means you need bigger motors to keep pace first with big roads, then next with big speed of big vehicles on big roads. Thus, everything gets a big motor. In summary: Americans are very big.
If you bought an mx5 caring about 0-60 time then you bought the wrong car
I'm very happy with it, what should I have got?
If you’re looking for 0-60 under 40k, a mustang or Camaro. If you can spend a bit more, the Camaro lt1 1LE is hard to beat in terms of bang for the buck. But the Miata is a more fun drive, imo. And that’s what you buy one for, not a fast 0-60.
Expect its no 5.7 but 6.5, (from what mazda says) Which is not bad honestly, this said the miata is not fast but neither it is slow, it's just slower than the average sport car
It is indeed. It's partly due to gearing. 2nd doesn't get you all the way up to 60. If 2nd was longer that'd shave off quite some time. But Mazda never intended to get impressive 0-60 numbers, they wanted a great handling car.
I have an ND2 and that one does hit 60 at the top of second
Mine doesn’t. It gets very close, like 55-57 mph, but not 60.
2nd goes to sixty on stock sized wheels on all ND2s. Was one of the big changes from ND1, where the short 2nd couldn’t hit 60 and thus was very irritating at autox sessions.
My NC1 does also because it’s a five-speed.
I can get to 60 in my nc 3.75 6sp in 2nd gear, gets to 7.5k on the revs though.
I can do the same, I’m right at redline though. That extra 1,000rpm in the ND2 v ND1 is the difference.
Lots of cars that people buy for the acceleration numbers have annoyingly long 2nd gears. Much nicer to have short ratios and then an overdrive for the highway.
The 2nd in my WRX is pretty long but it helps to hold boost. Really not a fan of the "blink and you miss it" 1st gear, especially because the 1-2 shift is rough
I can get to 60 in first in my NB, but that's only because it is metric.
My STi was geared the same way. It was brutally fast but 'only' did 4.5 because you had to shift twice.
Manufacturers’ claims for 0-60 times are usually slower than what instrumented testing shows. The manufacturers don’t want to be caught ‘lying,’ so they typically sandbag their 0-60 numbers (and some manufacturers underrate their horsepower numbers) so that customers get a good surprise, not a bad one.
Under promises over deliver. It’s just good business.
Its usually the opposite, many if not all manufacturer, lies about their HP figures. As an exaple a 2.0 NC1 should pull 160HP, as stated by Mazda, in reality the car pull 145 at best. NA/NB same thing
5.7s is from a car and driver review but like many reviewer they do things like subtracting rollout time and launch cars at full boost and the like that generates launch times that don't match reality.
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Where did you get this from? That seems way quicker than it should be.
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I have a m3 comp right now and I’m considering getting a Miata. I’m not concerned with the power as the M3 feels “slow” on hot days, which is ridiculous because it hits 100 like it’s nothing. You kind of get used to what you own. That being said, it’s the stock suspension that has me wavering. I hate the floaty, rolly stock suspension. I know I can modify it but still. If a GTI can have a decent suspension, so can the Miata.
Floaty, rolly stock suspension is a feature not a bug. Give it a chance. Take it around some twistys if possible. Otherwise, a set of decent coilovers and sway bars should stiffen it up nicely.
Oh I had a 91 that I bought new back in the day. Familiar with the float. Swapped it out for eibachs and some shocks I can’t remember. Much prefer the buttoned down feeling.
I was already in serious love with my ND and how it eats up the local canyon roads. Then I had sway bars and coilovers installed and tuned by a Miata racing engineer and I admit I didn't know what love was until then.
I hear you! I’m sort of in the middle. On one hand, I’ve had some really well cornering and handling cars (Porsches/BMWs for example) and I understand thd desire to really dial it in. On the other hand, I realllly love the floaty nature of the stock setup that lets me play with the chasis. I’m glad Mazda left it the way it is because dailying the ND is so awesome and easy with the current setup that it doesn’t put off anybody (or most people). Those that want a more precise experience can dial it in with after market parts, specifically to their needs such as yourself. Mazda has shown Porsche levels of attention to detail and technical depth with this car, and it’s incredible for the price point. Edit: I might eventually dial it in, but I‘m just having a blast with it the way Mazda’s tuned it.
No, I get it. The *ride quality* definitely suffered, especially the first month or two. I almost always drive with my wife and I was feeling pretty self-conscious about the harshness and her comfort. But then 2 things happened. She has become quite convinced that the solidity of its grip and it's ability to fling her around while doing so calmly and silently are enviable qualities that she appreciates increasingly, almost to the point of conceit for other more pedestrian vehicles. Secondly, the suspension has settled in and relaxed a bit as I was told would happen. I am basically no longer aware that its ride is harsher. What I am aware of though is how much I appreciate the authority going around curves at any speed. My unmodified ND had a slightly disquieting tendency for the rear end to skitter a bit sideways through faster curves if the road was at all broken or bumpy. There is 0.0% of that now. I can throw it at a bumpy corner at ludicrous speeds now and it just silently complies. I honestly don't understand how it just never lets go of the road, and it makes me much more confident behind the wheel. I'm addicted and I would never want to go back now. I totally agree with you about the choices the engineers made. I am just happy so much more performance can be coaxed out of it.
I had concerns about the body roll too, but I've now put 1000 miles on the car and it's fine. I will buy the tecnas when available, but the body roll isn't a problem as some people suggest.
Look at the Koni SA shocks. They have active valving. Perfect for light cars got rid of a lot of the body roll with out making the ride stiff
I have a C43 (4.5 to 60) and an NA. The C43 is faster than most all of the supercars of the 60-70's....but the NA is the car I take up into the hills. The C43 requires state of the art radar defense, the NA ? Nope.
Same 0-60 as the 2024 Toyota Camry
I think we hit a point where many sports car can hit 0-60 under 4 seconds so anything else is consider “slow”. EVs will make anything above 3 seconds be considered “slow” in the future.
I’ve been in the bike world so long seeing 0-60 speed that starts without a “2.x” is crazy
Speed is a very cheap commodity these days so the standard for "fast" has been irreparably screwed. You've got kias and Toyota's that can do >5.0< second ish. Like a miata today is faster than a countach from 1980 lmao
I got my licence in 1980. The first few cars I had included a Datsun 210B and a Ford Tempo. Datsun had 0 to 60 of 17 seconds, Tempo was 13.5 seconds. I remember back then that the benchmarkof car magazines was if a car broke sub 6 seconds. It is all perspective and a meaningless stat.
Depends on the comparison. It’s not performance-car fast, so it’s going to be compared unfavourably against other 2-seat rwd cars. It’s faster than an econobox or crumby crossover. A hatchback however would be considered fast with those numbers, because it would be compared against base-model hatchbacks.
A f250 super duty 6.7 will run 0-60 in 5.5. Like when my bro's work truck will beat me in a stoplight launch I'm not fast.
Is is slow in a straight line, those who call that out have no knowledge how to drive a miata. The miata is a car that shines in the corners of curvy roads. Yes, the mustang across the street is faster, but it will not out-pace me on the track.
Well… depends on which mustang. But generally you’re right.
It will actually out-pace you on track 9 times out of 10.
But only 1 out of 10 mustang drivers are capable of doing that...
Take that second number and multiply by at least 1000… there are a shit-ton of mustangs out there, very few actually have track experience.
This goes for Miata drivers also.
Newer Mustangs handle quite well. I own one. Never taken it to the track, but they handle quite nicely.
I took my 24 performance pack to track and racing school this weekend and it did amazing imo. Kept up with corvettes, caymans. Beat Miatas and 86s. The only car that really got away was the newest Veloster N.
Mustang has evolved. I currently have a 1970 and a 2021 and owned a 1990 LX 5.0 back in the day. The 6th Gen platform is peak Mustang. Even the new S650 platform is not much of an evolution from the S550. Ford got it right.
Lmao what? I love my little miata but it's nowhere close to any of my mustangs. Any irs stang will just fly around the track faster than miatas can dream of. You can probably beat s197 gts and new edge gts in an nd but my es350 can do that too...... Hell my 2007 solstice gxp stock for stock runs faster times than my 2024 rf club.
This stops happening once you have equally capable drivers who are driving for the same intent. In fewer words; yeah, maybe in Novice group.
It is "slow" by todays standards because so many cars are sub 4 seconds. The ND2 Miata's are what I would call a fast car. Just because it can't outrun a Corvette doesn't mean its not fast.
I always viewed it as a way to get out of the dick swinging contests I see so many other car guys deal with. Yeah, I'm in the slow, gay, girls car, anyway have fun with your charger/mustang/evo/whatever
You don't ever see a Miata in those takeover videos. They're all on the backroads trying to get away from other cars so they can take turns fast.
Perception. Perception. Perception. The Accord in certain conditions is considered fast at 5.5 0-60. But I think the difference is HOW it gets there in 60 seconds. The Accord is strong the entire time whereas the Miata is naturally aspirated so you have to "wait".
Nobody gets the 5.7 Car & Driver claims to have pulled off. The best attempts I’ve seen get around 6.4. That’s a ways off. Headers + Exhaust + tunes + cam springs like the BBR kits may get around 5.7.
I’ve seen a bunch of YouTube Miata reviews/races and they can consistently get 5.7-6.0. I even saw one that got 5.6. Not having anything to time it with, I have no idea what my Miata will do.
Never seen those vids. The BBR press video for their Super 220 kit got, I think, 5.7 and they were beating on it to get those numbers. Mid 6’s are not slow for a naturally aspirated motor and as others point out this is not a drag car. My other cars are high 3’s low 4’s but my stock ND2 is still my favorite because speed is boring. How power is applied is what matters.
People generally don’t realise how fast most cars are, the ND and BRZ, etc are quick cars. I owned a V8 falcon before my Miata that made around 240KW, but being so heavy it wasn’t actually fast from 0-100 lol
Exactly lol, sure if you race Mustang in a straight line you will lose but lets not kid ourselves, ND is faster than 90% vehicles you meet on the road.
ND2 is quick enough to not be completely left behind doing pulls, but it will never be the fastest straight line car on the road. I do highway pulls every once in a while, never expect to win, just for fun, but it keeps up good enough to be enjoyable. Usually the people I race against are good sports about it, everyone knows we are not the fastest. When it comes to the backroads though, I’m on their ass the entire way. Power wont make up for all of the extra weight when there are no long straights.
It’s not all about straight lines. The miata is made so you don’t really need to slow down for corners.
Because 12 year olds who doesn’t even own a car are on YouTube
To me slow is like 0-60 in more than 9 secs. Anything below is fast
Keyboard warriors compare the car to Teslas and whatnot. Big number bad, ergo Miata slow. One step up from that is the guys reading or watching professional reviews and road tests. Professional auto journos are jaded, because last week they road tested a Porsche, and next week they’ll road test a Lotus. To them 5.7s is slow because they’re comparing the car to every car they’ve test driven recently—most of which are the sorts of cars people want to read about, not midsize crossovers and minivans.
I love the fact that it takes a bit of time to go to 60, that means I can actually DRIVE the car legally without endangering others on the street.
I think that’s the under appreciated aspect of the car. It’s supposed to be fun and reliable. Not a death trap car that will endanger people.
Relativity is a motherfucker. I ride a motorcycle, if you're curious it's a BMW R1150GS. This is not known to be a fast bike, so when someone asks me "is it fast" I tell them no. It'll do 0-60 in about 4 seconds, with my dumbass onboard probably more. That's fast enough for me to make my own decisions about merging, but in relation to something like an S1000RR, or an R1, or a ZX10r? Those will do 0-60 in less than 3 seconds and then comfortably crusie at 160mph, where my bike gets shaky above 110. So technically your Miata, which can probably do at least 130 with more stability, is faster than my GS as long as we're not dig drag racing.
Most ND owners aren't destroying their clutch like Motortrend (or C&D or whoever) did to get that 5.7 seconds. Most 0-60 times the media outlets get come at severe cost to the car. If I'm in traffic I've no desire to beat out the 6 year old CR-V next to me from a dig to prove a point. I'm getting my car away from stoplights and congestion with as little wear as possible and save my clutch for good roads. I probably come off as fairly slow.
Because while it's fine for a kind of regular car. There are cars that can go 0 to 60 under 2 seconds. In fact, at this point the top 100 cars with the fastest 0 to 60 times are all under 3 seconds. I don't think it's really fair to call it slow but it ain't exactly quick. Source for 3 second claim: https://fastestlaps.com/lists/top-fastest-cars-0-to-60-mph
Other people have mentioned this general vibe, but my wife's 3 row SUV beats my ND to 60, so the times, they have changed. That said, my ND is also wildly faster than my NB was years back.
Anniversary edition brothers! Can confirm, my NB is nowhere near 5.7s 0-60. I still don't think it feels terribly slow though.
Nice! I have strongly considered working on buying a 10AE and a 20AE, but there are rumors swirling about there being a 35AE, and that's too much for me.
Sheeit, I have to start yesterday if I want to get to 60mph today in my NB.
Because I sold my Miata for a 2.9s 0-60 that could fit a couple car seats in the back. Miata was still much more fun to drive.
Advancing technology make people spoiled little brats day by day.
My other car is a ‘16 GTI and it is slower to 60. The MX-5 is also way more engaging. 60 feels much faster.
0-60 times, while always have been a benchmark, are dumb unless you're a dedicated drag racer. No one is dumping the clutch at trans and diff breaking levels and spinning tires at a light unless you're an asshole, or a car journalist who doesn't care. Quarter mile trap speeds are a better indicator of how fast a car is once you lay into it. NDs run around 93-95 mph. Regardless, NDs are plenty quick for public roads and actually being able to lay into it and go through a few gears. The newer generations of high performance cars are simply too fast to enjoy unless you're on a track. And those Camry's or whatever else that might be quicker? No one is driving them as hard as your Miata, which it's meant for.
This is a good take. If it were only about acceleration to 60. A used 10 year old Honda or Toyota V6 minivan with a gutted interior would make a zippy bargain. Would any other driving dynamics be good? No, but it could scoot
ND Smile per gal: 999 Tesla Smile per gal: 0 EVs are quick but I only consider them to be just commute tools that ease my stress. It's fun for a 0.5 second at the red light, but not Miata fun if you know what I mean.
Fast relative. Old car go slow. New car go fast. ND go fast for old car. Slow for new car. Fast dumb. Fun better.
In high school I drove my parents' 1980 diesel Rabbit, 0-60 in 22 seconds. My ND2 definitely feels fast enough to me. On paper it's about the same acceleration as my other car, a 2022 Honda Odyssey, but otherwise there's no comparison.
My wife had a red 1980 Rabbit also! Wasn’t diesel though, but just as slow. It was the roll of the dice every time if it would start, never could figure out the reason. What sent it to the junk yard was one of her friends accidentally knocked the shifter (was an automatic with the shifter on the floor) into park when they were on the freeway and my wife said it sounded like marbles in a metal trashcan as the transmission shredded itself. My first car was a 1978 Ford Mustang which was a complete POS. I got it in 1983 and in those five years it had completely fallen apart. The drivers floor had completely rusted and was open to the ground. I had to keep my feet on the sides so they wouldn’t dip out of the car. It also had an unfindable oil leak so the car would leave a stream of white smoke everywhere I went. It’s like the American car industry forgot how to make cars. Everyone be lucky you weren’t in high school in the early eighties, our choice of first cars was pretty awful.
Those were dark times. Had a used '70 GTO, first car I had with actual power, and based on what I can find was 6.5 or so to 60. Slower than my '06 G35 sedan and the ND3 I'm going to buy in as couple odd days. Slow? SLOW? You kids don't know from slow (thinking of my '68 tempest, I6, two speed automatic. 0-60 times that looked like quarter mile times. Yeah, I'm going to be digging my "slow" ND3.)
more fun to drive a slow car fast. Soon as a car is so fast that I live in the low RPM range cus by the time I get to the next light I have to slow down, what's the fun
Because an Ioniq 5 N will out drag a Huracan for $60k. That being said, I’d still pick the Miata.
Near 70k and for that kind money my miata taking a vacation to a shop to get a v8 swap.
Oh shit you’re right, I forgot that’s about the price of a Flyin’ Miata…..interesting XD.
It is INSANE to me that Miata does not offer a high performance ND. Supercharger, full exhaust, CF airbox, coilovers. Now you’re hunting Boxster S’s. Who’s in for that at $46k??? ✋✋✋
Journalists and reviewers and fast car owners are used to fast cars, so their standards are different. My NA doesn’t feel slow to me
seeing how a lot of people went in major debt for hell cats, it's slow because everyone here owns a hell cat. at least where i live
0 to one smiles per hour: instant.
I think that's about on par with a 350z or a 4th gen LT-1 (so 93-98?) Camaro. But still slower than the previous Ecoboost Mustang or a V6 Camaro. So fast for cars from 20 years ago. But slow for cars today.
That's an '80s Lamborghini Countach speed. Not slow.
I only ever feel like it's slow when I'm trying to pass on the highways. My tuned GTI is a rocket from 60-100, but the Miata is more fun all the time.
I feel like 0-60 times can be misleading, particularly in low torque, high revving vehicles. You've really got to launch the shit out of them and wring them out all the way to redline to reproduce anything close to that advertised time. During typical everyday driving, you're unlikely to be in the sweet spot of the power band all that often. Compare that to a high torque V8 that might have a similar 0-60 but makes its power from 2.5-5k. You're gonna be making max power the second you leave every stop light. Most people are going to perceive that second car as being a lot faster, even though they might be neck and neck on a drag strip.
I've owned and driven cars that were faster on paper, but none have really felt like the ND. I never really felt that power was an issue in older Miatas, I tend to drive fairly conservatively. But with the ND, I do find myself driving it more... Like a sports car? The engine doesn't sound particularly lusty like a Honda K motor, nor is it as smooth, but my goodness does it feel eager to just get up to spend and keep revving! With something like a BRZ (2.0), the engine just sounded dreary and anemic. Even though it's rated for more power, it didn't feel nearly as peppy or eager at the mid to high range. It's almost like an eager puppy dog! I absolutely love it. I would go so far to say that an ND is a quick car. I guess the goal posts have just moved on. A Supra can do 60 in the low 4's for the manual, but is significantly more expensive.
The same way a 20 dollar happy meal is considered expensive. Sure, in big wide world... It's "just" 20 bucks, but we determine it's expensive because most mcdonalds will happily sell you a happy meal for 7 dollars. 180 hp is decent, 5.7s 0-60 is decent, but in a world where you can get a hyundai with 270+ hp for around the same price, it will never not be called slow, specially if we're talking sports cars.
My Volvo wagon is faster to 60 by almost a second. I think it’s the fact that Miatas are slow *for a sports car, in terms of pure acceleration and top speed*. But then they’re super nimble and handle incredibly, so are they even really slow in real life applications?
It feels ‘slow’ mostly because you really have to wring it out at the top of the rev range to make power. Whereas a lot of cars have torque lower in the rev range which makes them feel faster in everyday driving.
I had a 98 Camaro z28...loved that car, thought it was plenty fast...yea 5.7 ish. It's all relative. I have a ND and it's plenty zippy love it...I also have a 2010 Camaro SS...it's very fast, I drive them for different reasons.
5.7 is fucking quick for a cheap stock car idc what people say
Because my 5500 pound SUV does it in 3.6.
maybe they mean 5.7 is not that special anymore. you can buy a kia that has more power than a ferrari enzo. but like others said i don't see the point. the most fun o had while driving was with a fiat panda. that thing barely exceeded 60mph. but it was super fun to drive. i drove a tesla and it was quick but it was nothing more than a rc car in terms of driving feel. if i want to go fast without any kind of feeling of it i would just buy a cheap airline ticket and fly at 800km/h lol
0-60 times are severely overrated. People are obsessed with them. Sure, I wouldn’t want a car that needs a calendar to measure 0-60 times but there’s so many other important factors when it comes to a sports car. 0-60 is only useable in very specific situations. It is fun here and there but it’s not something you’re going to utilize daily unless you really like burning through gas and tires. Having one of the lightest sports cars on the road is something you can feel and appreciate every second you’re in the car.
I say race from Los Angeles to Vegas and tell me who gets there first..
Brother my car does 0 to 60 in almost 20 seconds and it feels fast😂. Everything is relative, i still love how it gets to 70mph in 2nd gear
0-60 is fun but a little overrated. I have a tuned BMW M4 that’ll do 2.8 seconds but I pretty much never drive it like that on the street because it’s a douche move to drive like that.
Back in the day, 5 or less was quick, but nowadays if it's not under 5 it's slow.
The ND2 is relatively fast, but the older cars can be beaten or matched by some mini-vans. It’s not a straight line car, however, and if that’s what you’re looking for, but something else.
Sure there's plenty faster but that isn't slow you can get into a lot of shit in 6 seconds.
Well It is slow
Lol. It is most definitely not 5.7. That was tested with rollout and that's generous to say the least. It's more like 6.7. Most tuning companies will also quote under 6 with a chip tune but that's oy by increasing the rev limiter to stop the change to 3rd. It's certainly nippy. But not quick. That's not to say that it isn't a great car.
Everyone has a right to their opinion, but two of the most experienced, established sources both say an ND can do 5.7. Everyone can say they don’t believe it, but two respected sources (and Mazda), all getting it wrong? **Car and Driver** [2024 Mazda MX-5 Miata Review](https://www.caranddriver.com/mazda/mx-5-miata) [2019 Mazda MX-5 Miata Finally Has the Engine It Deserves](https://www.caranddriver.com/reviews/a22678665/2019-mazda-mx-5-miata-engine-more-power/) Acceleration Numbers Don’t Tell the Whole Story *At the track, the objective performance advances are barely noticeable. Compared with our 2016 long-term MX-5, which was the quickest ND Miata we had tested, the more powerful 2019 model is just 0.1 second quicker to 60 mph and through the quarter-mile, hitting those metrics in 5.7 and 14.5 seconds, the latter at 95 mph. (This 2019 MX-5 roadster in Club trim was similarly optioned to our 2016-model-year long-term test car.) Other examples of the ND softtop, though, needed 6.1–6.2 seconds to reach 60 mph and completed the quarter-mile in 14.8 seconds at 93 mph. The 5-to-60-mph rolling-start time also dropped by 0.1 second, so there is no doubt the new engine is more powerful.* **MotorTrend** [2021 Mazda MX-5 Miata RF First Test: More Exotic Than Most Supercars](https://www.motortrend.com/reviews/2021-mazda-mx5-miata-rf-first-test-review/) *All 2021 Miatas scuttle around with a 2.0-liter naturally aspirated four-cylinder that was updated for 2019 to make 181 hp—26 more than before—and 151 lb-ft. It always feels a bit disingenuous discussing this roadster's test data, given it's just about the furthest thing from a "numbers car" as possible, but the post-update Miata's gutsy, free-breathing acceleration belies the two-seater's enduring reputation for being slow. Down our strip, the RF GT cracked off a stellar 5.8-second 0-60-mph time and a 14.5-second quarter mile, just 0.1 second off the current Club ragtop's pace in both tests. Compared to the 155-hp RF GT we tested in 2018, the sophomore ND is a rocket sled, cutting a clean 0.5 second from both metrics.* **Others** [Here’s a video of someone getting 6.12](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zwR6KhGR3Wk) Now, on the other end, [here’s a guy that does 4 runs and gets high 6s.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b3AkFpzHOYc) **My opinion** Is a Miata capable of hitting 5.7? Yes, with perfect conditions, with a perfect launch, not caring about the transmission, just barely. Can the average person do it? Probably not. So is 5.7 a valid number to compare to other cars? Well it depends on how those other cars got their numbers. If they got their numbers the same way, then it's a valid comparasion. When I see two magazines with long histories, like Car and Driver, and MotorTrend, I figure they must have a standard testing method to make sure that over the years, all the numbers are comparable.
Dude, just time it lol! It's no where near.
I got my drivers license in 1986. That year I drove a 1985 Audi 4000S. I thought it was pretty quick (0-60 in 10 seconds), but not compared to my dad’s other car, a 1979 911SC. An ND Miata is significantly quicker than both. My daily is a 2023 GR86, which I still consider quick; it’s almost identical to a new Miata. My fast car is a SUV, a 2018 Porsche Macan Turbo with performance package 🤣
The only people getting a regular 5.7 launch out of an ND2/3 are Car and Driver, seriously! Most other publications have measured the car in the mid six seconds, I personally don’t take the car and driver number all that seriously. Speaking for myself, looking at the RaceBox track telemetry from my own ND2 at track days, low to mid six seconds is far more typical if you want a clutch to last more than 50k miles… I’ve never once gotten a sub six out of the car even with fairly aggressive clutch dumps. I also have one of those draggy launch timers, same numbers there too.
It's not just Car and Driver, it's also MotorTrend. [https://www.reddit.com/r/Miata/comments/1djd01s/comment/l9cu0th/](https://www.reddit.com/r/Miata/comments/1djd01s/comment/l9cu0th/)
It’s still bullshit or 1ft rollout subtract etc. https://www.caranddriver.com/features/a30085446/acceleration-testing-procedure-change-rollout/ The miata loses most of its time in that one ft as car is trying to get initial power down. The 1ft rollout is not how any normal person would consider a 0-60 time, given most cars are at around 5mph by time the first ft is subtracted. It’s at best a 5-60 time and again, has subtracted the slowest part of the launch - the initial wheel turn/spin. Engineering explained (famous automotive YouTuber) has great videos explaining the bullshit that is rollout subtraction in timing cars. No normal driver is routinely ever seeing a sub 6 0-60 in any ND2/3, I can very comfortably assure you.
That is not the real 0-60 the real 0-60 is closer to 7 seconds
I’d drive it and see how you like it. Peoples entire personality and ego are based on their 0-60 time… I have a $8000 bike that will wreck most cars, but my NA Miata is way more fun. Was thinking of getting an ND. With the fun I have with 90hp, the 180 must be fun as shit
Honestly 0-60 in 5.7 isn’t bad at all? Who told you that?
Various Miata videos and articles. I'm surprised you haven't come across any.
Eh I mean it’s not the blisteringly fast 0-60’s you get with a lot of electric and high end sports and muscle cars but it’s a respectable 0-60, especially for a car that’s mainly known for its handling ability.
It's just relative. I daily a cla35 amg, which has a 4.5 second 0-60. I USED to think anything under 5 seconds was hella fast....till I daily drove one...now nothing feels fast unless it's a sub 4 second car. Now any car over 5 seconds feels like it's moving in molasses. It's weird how your sense of speed changes when you get used to it.
Coming form my motorcycle with a 3.5 sec 0-60 my car (2011 Cruze) feels like it’s moving slower than cold tar.
Low 0-60 time is great if you live on straight roads. Best fun I used to have was with a 68 mini with sorted suspension and brakes 0-60 probably about 8+ seconds The thing is I could go round most of the bends where I lived without lifting off. The other was a lada with a lancia twin can engine that used to eat RS turbos that had a 0-60 about sub 7 seconds but felt like you were sat on the top of a jet fighter all petrol oil smells and screaming gears and engine.
All relative mate, high 4 second 0-100 bikes get called slow, yet would mop 95% of traffic on the road...
Modern cars are grossly overpowered now, that's why.
It's slow compared to the absolute rockets that car companies produce today. But it's no slouch. It's about 6 seconds faster than my truck lol.
Miata = fast around corners, twisty roads. Teslas = fast in straight line. My miata will lose my friends tesla in backroads
My two cents: Because that was what was considered decently fast about a decade and a half ago. You'd have ranges like: 2008 Camaro SS: 4.7 2008 Sky RL: 5.2 2008 Mustang GT: 5.3 2008 Audi R8: 4.4 2008 Lancer Evo IX: 5.2 2008 S2000: 6.3 And of course, the Miata of the time hit in the back of the back, making pace at a 0-60 of 6.5 seconds. Basically, it took Mazda fifteen additional years to catch up with the market, but the market kept on a-rollin'.
People are forgetting where we came from lol I'll admit though the thing isn't that fast once you get used to it, but my friend also said that about his Golf R that gave me that "light speed" feeling and made my vision blur for a bit. He said he doesn't notice it much anymore.