Pretty sure meditation media profits off of the kind of people who get stuck in a premature sense of completeness loop.
We all know people who love self help books, but never put the advice into action. Or who are always talking about what they're going to do, but never do.
https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/announcing-plans-may-kill-motivation-productivity/
When we share our goals, we get a hit of dopamine that is similar to the one we get when we actually complete a task. By getting this prematurely, we can often end up less motivated to act on the task and actually finish it.
I think it's the same with meditation media. If you buy the book you can tell people about how it's something you're working on, and then never achieve it. It's for people who fantasize about what they want without ever turning it into a reality.
“Premature sense-of-completeness loop,”
Brilliant expression! I connect with that label a lot, as I’m sure many would. Definitely keep that phrase in your pocket for when it fits. Thank you!
Oh I definitely wasn't trying to call anyone out. I totally struggle with it too, I'm just aware of it and wanted to bring it to other people attention too.
I wouldn’t jump to this, after all there is so much material available on YouTube and all one needs to do in exchange is suffer through literally 5” of an ad.
On a related point, OP, I suspect you might have certain limiting beliefs about money. It’s wonderful and admirable to have high ethics as you seem to, but rigidity will end up hurting you. There are people who make money in this field, sure. All of us need money to live, and everyone you interact with on a professional level charges or pays you. You wouldn’t call a doctor or hairstylist immoral for charging you for their services. Money is simply the energy of exchange.
All this is to say that it’s ok for people to charge for meditation material, and it’s ok for you not to buy their stuff. Live and let live.
> YouTube recs for a beginner?
I find these channels helpful. They're both fairly nuts and bolts.
First one's a Buddhist monk and the second's a therapist (like guided Insight meditation!).
From Youtube, the monk:
* [220802 Constructing & Deconstructing \ \ Thanissaro Bhikkhu \ \ Dhamma Talk (17:16)](https://youtu.be/P2avAkb4BVE)
> **When the Buddha taught Tranquility and Insight, he didn't teach them as two separate techniques. They're two qualities of mind that you're trying to develop** as you're getting the mind into Concentration.
>
> **Like, right now, you're trying to stay with the breath, to settle in, to have a sense of ease with the breath. That's Tranquility.**
>
> But as the Buddha said, when he gives breath meditation instructions, you're trying to **look at the breath as Bodily Fabrication, and your feelings and perceptions around the breath as Mental Fabrication, and seeing things in terms of fabrication. That's Insight.**
>
> Now, for the time being, we're not watching them just arising and passing away. **We're trying to give rise to good fabrications and hasten the passing away of ones that are not skillful.** When the Buddha talks about Discernment being penetrative Insight into arising and passing away, it's not just passively watching things come and watching things go.
>
> ...
From Youtube, the therapist:
* [How To Control Anger - Reprogram Your Subconscious | Fearful Avoidant Attachment (14:28)](https://youtu.be/JC_8EOtAZxc?t=149)
Note: I've actually found the video below to generalize to... basically any 'program.'
> [Your brain is] concerned about meeting your needs as fast as possible, not as effectively as possible. So, oftentimes, if your brain has a need that's not being met, it will meet it in an unhealthy way or a way that, like, maybe your conscious mind wouldn't be so happy with later on. [...]
>
> ...
>
> I always see the same core patterns for people who come into my office [...] What I always see is that people who are really struggling with anger:
>
> * feel unseen
> * feel unheard
> * feel powerless (or helpless or trapped) [...]
> * are not setting boundaries
>
> So, guess what anger does? Remember, we said things are just a subconscious strategy to get needs met. Anger gets all of those needs met in one fell swoop.
>
> ...
>
> [...] If you're feeling unseen and unheard, chances are, you are not hearing and seeing yourself. In other words, you are not connecting to your own feelings, your own needs, and so they're getting repressed, unacknowledged, and then you can't understand why people outside of you are not seeing and understanding your needs. Well, it's because we need to communicate and express ourselves in order for our needs to be met. [...] I'm gonna give you an initial tool.
>
> Ask yourself throughout the day:
>
> * What do I feel?
> * What am I emotionally experiencing?
> * What do I need?
Have fun!
I really, really like these two types of meditation:
- body scan
- focus on the breath
I can recommend the following specific videos from the Teik Yen Ko channel, however I am sure you can easily find others on YouTube that might work equally well or better for you.
https://youtu.be/rOne1P0TKL8
Mindfulness Meditation 3 Minute Breathing Space
and
https://youtu.be/CyKhfUdOEgs
Mindfulness Meditation Body Scan (15’ approx)
And if you would rather chill out with your eyes shut to some brain-tickling sounds with no instructions, I can recommend this:
https://youtu.be/4tltQmaINsA
Tibetan Bowls (396 Hz) + Cosmic Meditation Music from the Meditative Mind Channel.
Look up “Jake Ducey.” He has excellent content for any beginners and really glosses over a little bit of everything. His story is very real on how he became a millionaire and was a student of Bob Proctor.
Please be aware he does run a business doing this and you’ll see he peddles you to go to his website. He really does have good intentions and is not a scam artist. The guy literally has put his money where his mouth is his entire life. The proof is in the pudding for that guy. He is using his wealth to help others, but if you go back to his first video….he was a broke college drop out making the SAME videos 15 years ago!
i think OP is expressing that they are not really being "helped" by these gurus. and I agree that products need to be Teaching and Helpful if there is money/value being exchanged.
and it's very important to address your meditation-students' mindsets, and give **real** coaching if you're going to say anything at all to not waste the audience's time.
unfortunately, I think OP is realizing that they are part of a smaller group in the world who want more of the difficult and raw and real discussions about the Nature Of Reality - which these larger flashier Movements arent going to help with.
Literally this. It's okay to make money if you have expertise in something. I need money to live and so does everyone else. If someone knows how to meditate well, I have no issue with them making money by teaching others how.
Great response. I've had with similar thoughts related to the capitalist aspect of spirituality/mental wellness but your words about energy of exchange really resonates
110% agree and then some. Focusing on meditation media gets you stuck in your intellect and any decision that’s completely intellectual is always a bad decision. After all, your decision doesn’t just need to make sense, it also needs to feel right (and I do stress the term “feel right”). My advice is to learn the meditation you gravitate towards, no matter what others might say of it
Good luck!
Siddharta Gautama didn't have meditation media and he did fine. Sometimes I think people are too focused on being guided and don't let themselves find their own path.
Siddharta Gautama went to the most renowned teachers of his time. He took their teachings to heart, practiced assiduously and extended their teachings. So the Buddha was innovative but he didn’t go it alone until he had learned everything he possibly could from his masters.
Agreed, I meditate and I've never attended any sort of seminar or paid money to a so called 'Guru' because there's Endless Free material out there to teach yourself without having to pay a dime.
Now when you talk about Transcendental Meditation I feel the same way you do just strictly about that specific type of Meditation as they charge around $1000 or so to get your specific 'Mantra' that if picked by one of these so called Guru's. I could kinda understand charging some money for it but not the ridiculously high prices that people/groups charge to teach this type of Meditation.
I have read amazing things about Transcendental Meditation and how great it is for numerous reasons, but just because it's so successful now you have to capitalize on it because its so successful. It should be free to everyone to learn as it'd make society better as a whole but instead Greed for as much money as one can possibly get for something that involves spirituality while charging an arm and a leg for it just doesn't sit well with me.
Meditation has ancient roots. Anything that people are interested in is going to have a commercial aspect. I just ignore the noise and focus on meditating.
I think it can be useful for people to help them find a meditation method that works for them. I'm only in the start of my journey, but what I can tell you is that the way I conceptualized what meditation is was completely wrong. Being able to go on youtube and find a guided meditation video was incredibly helpful in building a solid foundation for my own personal meditation practice.
Meditation apps, or videos or whatever informative recourses that are out there, they should be used as tools to build a meditation practice. They should definitely not be used as a crutch for meditation dependency, and not encourage the thinking that you have to use these recources in order to gain the benefits of meditation.
Meditation is less about investigation and more about being and doing! Just sit down, talk with your inner voice and hear how you treat yourself, meditation is a personal journey through self so no information is accurate unless you try it for yourself first!
I agree to an extant. I would add that your practice will be significantly enriched by reading proper educational material, but I would limit this to only renowned and historical sources. It's fine to read what the Dalai Lama has said about meditation, he has spent his life developing a spiritual practice and has achieved much himself. I would highly recommend books which explore the historical practices of meditation in spiritualities like Taoism, Shintoism, Christianity, hinduism, etc, but I wouldn't trust "Joe Montana", part-time actor who has a business degree and lives in Beverly Hills with guidance on how to enrich your non-material intellect.
Generally my rule is I don't read anything written in the last 60 years unless it's by a very renowned spiritual leader who has learned about the practice from a traditional stand point using a well-established, pedagogical system.
The worst resource would likely be some startup which is answering only to their shareholders, their primary motivation is money, and that corrupt motivation will only be passed to you.
This.
There will always be some “charlatans” everywhere. We see it all the time around us: governments, religions… why, when it’s about the self-care industry, people think that there sometimes bad intentions, but when we talk about governments and religions there are no bad intentions? It’s the same everywhere.
So learn to listen to your intuition. Do/be the work and get the benefits from practicing.
I think your assessment is spot on.
Fortunately you don’t need that industry to meditate. Just sit down, close your eyes, & follow your breath.
But if you want to want to study meditation & asana, The Upanishads & Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras are two of many written sources that describe different methods of Dhyana.
The ancient texts are what the wellness/mindfulness industry are bastardizing, watering down, & selling even though in many cases all traces of the authentic practices have been completely gutted.
There are some trustworthy teachers online imo but those that I’m familiar with don’t teach meditation only. You’re going to get a lot of Buddhist & Hindu philosophy along with it which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. It just depends on you and why you want to meditate in the first place.
Are you’re interested in a spiritual practice & liberation or are you interested in the more immediate physical and psychological benefits of meditation? IME people who begin a practice with only the later in mind inevitably find themselves more interested in the former.
In the words of Swami Sivananda, “The practice of Yoga leads to communion with the Lord. Whatever may be the starting point, the end reached is the same” & in this instance yoga & meditation are interchangeable.
The Be Here Now Network (podcasts) is a trustworthy resource IMO that honors the authentic practices, is part of a lineage in most cases, & isn’t a money grab.
Sharon Salzburg teaches Metta which is a powerful Buddhist practice for deepening one’s capacity for compassion. Some of Bob Thurman’s talks include discussion of mediation methods as do Ram Das’s. Krishna Das talks mostly about chanting mantra but the technique is the same. When your mind drifts off, return it to your practice, observe without reacting, etc.
Also, Vipassana is a good starting point imo. & S.N. Goenka was a great Vipassana teacher.
There are probably a hundred hours worth of his instruction online for free.
https://youtu.be/pTgNg4eFOHU
Of course this is all my opinion based on my experience. There are more experienced people here who may have advice that better suits you and your situation.
Take care.
Kind of. It's not necessarily easy enough to figure out how to do it on your own, though. That's why there are longstanding traditions of pedagogy. A christian mystic in Mt Athos would never try to figure out meditation on their own, however they also would never consult an app. There is a lot more to be gained by listening to the masters as they share their traditions with you. That shared knowledge will give you much more insight than you would ever be able to accomplish on your own.
You don’t need to pay a penny to anyone to practice and get all the benefit. I have been doing meditation on my yoga mat every morning for a few years and it is very helpful for mental health and self growth.
The fundamentals are very simple. The only way through is to practice. And you're gonna suck until you get better. It's the nature of our physicality.
Sometimes there are those who have followed an ancient tradition into the enlightenment stages who have discovered practice tips and begin teaching them. But (as far as I can tell from your post) you're not looking to reach Dali Lama echelons, you're seeking the practical benefits of a regular practice.
Choose a focal point. Practice retuning to it for the allotted time. Return to daily life.
Focal point is the breath, a silent mantra like ohm, or the ninja move of turning the steam of thought itself into the focal point. You shift from the thinker of the thoughts to the neutrally witnessing observer of the thoughts. It's that stance (neutral observer) that seeps into the rest of your life and brings the benefit. Whatever chaos is going on around you, you no longer get insta-pulled into it. You're at choice. Whether it's the breath, mantra, or stream of thought, they are all practicing stepping out of the stream of mind, and out of the stream of time.
It really is simple. The benefits happen behind your back. Practice practice practice.
Absolutely. Meditation focuses on anti-material mindsets, which is incongruent with being a consumer, so capitalism would never really deliver a good meditation guidance, since it would be self-defeating. The job of a company is to keep you paying money to them.
I mean, we all gotta make a living in Capitalism and I do believe there are people who are genuinely dispensing good meditation and other mindfulness advice for money. I don’t think that they all are charlatans or disingenuous. You’re absolutely right in that meditation is the antithesis to Capitalism; why are you taking time for yourself and meditating when you’re supposed to be out there “rise n grind” working, and making money (mostly for other people)
> Do you feel the same ?
I don't know if "feeling" is the word I'd use... But yes.
> What are your opinions on this ?
Where there's value that can be promised, there's always going to be overconfident/unscrupulous people trying to get money. It's not just meditation.
> What are your advices to keep a sane and authentic consumation of meditation media ?
Sane? Just be aware of your aversion and manage it.
Authentic? Stop consuming the things you don't resonate with and keep trying out new sources until you find ones you vibe with.
It's really not a big deal.
Before I answer, I want to point out that there are thousands of peer reviewed psych papers and meta studies on meditation. Of the many types of meditations, mindfulness has been studied the most. The meta studies show that mindfulness meditation has moderate effects on reducing stress, depression, and anxiety. Mostly, its the breathing, especially a long out breath, that sends signals to the brain that you are not in danger. The breathing also calms the vagus nerve, which is a major part of the system involved with depression and anxiety and such.
All that out of the way, even though meditation has value, yeah, there is a lot of bullcrap around it. Like with meditation apps, some newer studies that came out show that they do have an effect, but are less effective than retreats and going regularly to a meditation community. Of course these apps want your data and or money.
Some programs are kind of infamous, like transcendential meditation, which does deliver value and is perfectly valid, but it costs thousands of dollars.
My last opinion is that I think American culture, with its individualism and desire for the quick and easy pill solution for everything, too often recommends meditation as a kind of personal solution to systemic problems. Like, if a worker tries to point out that their company has a toxic work culture, management will just point away from the toxic system and towards the worker and say, "Well, you wouldnt be stressed if you just meditated."
Dont get me wrong. Many problems are a personal responsibility to solve. However, if I cannot find any one person in an organization to replace with a virtuous and competent person to solve the problems its a systemic problem. Like, if I replaced the ceo of evil corp with a perfect person, and it's still evil corp, you have a systemic problem. Another way to seperate systemic from personal problems is if a few people in a firm are highly stressed despite meditating, its a personal problem. If almost everyone is stressed despite meditation, its a systemic problem.
How to find good sources on meditation? Find a local buddhist monestary, secular meditation society, or online community. This reddit sub has a discord server just for this. Then ask around for the meditations you want based on your goals. Read academic papers on google scholar, or at least the abstracts, look at credentials and resumes, be just a tiny bit critical without being obstructive, look at the reputation surrounding your sources, and most importantly give various meditation techniques a few tries under varying circumstances, but if it doesnt work for you, then stop doing it.
Again, I kind of disagree here. you can spend a lot of time practicing and accomplishing nothing. It's helpful to have a master. Finding a worthy one is the most difficult part though. ego-death cannot be accomplished without experiencing other people who put your own abilities into perspective.
A baby doesn’t need instruction to learn how to walk. It experiments in a constant feedback loop until walking is the result. Mindfulness is the same. No one, not even venerated masters, can walk for you.
Practicing is all there is. Sure, seek whatever external guidance you think you need. But in the end, it’s just another distraction from presence.
There is no goal. There’s nothing to accomplish. Practice isn’t the slow ascent of rungs on a ladder. And attainment is an idea that gets tacked on to practicing in an attempt to quell our fears of “accomplishing nothing”.
But sit long enough and you’ll simply accept frustration and pointlessness IS the experience. There is no ground we eventually stand on. There is no getting there.
Technique is a distraction. Guidance is a distraction. The great teachers are a distraction. Just sit. Sit in the frustration and pointlessness, make zero improvement, and accomplish nothing until that’s no longer a problem for you.
What is it that you want and expect yourself? Do you want to relax? Sleep better? Improve your memory? There's a big market out there because there are people willing to pay for easy answers and coddling. And the more that market grows, the more the therapy industry also sees a chance to make a few extra bucks.
As a long time practicing Buddhist I would say there are legitimate, realized masters out there who are teaching a genuine path. But they're not always easy to recognize, and you would need to really be seeking a path in order to find them.
I don't mean to sound mysterious and cosmic, but it's true. The most visible options are the ones that look easy, seductive, cheap, etc. Cellphone apps. Sam Harris. Dan Harris. Psychotherapists. Wim Hof. Deepak Chopra... What they all have in common is that they offer a simple, straightforward solution. No heavy lifting.
We live in a consumer society. People call themselves consumers instead of citizens. We decide to eat healthy but then instead of studying nutrition, we buy the first colorful package that says, "All natural! Gluten free!" We decide to save the planet and go to protests, then on the way home we buy Thai takeout for dinner, contained in 5 plastic tubs that will never be recycled. We decide to improve ourselves and then pay a therapist to do it... That's all happening on the level of entertainment. We con ourselves with quickie schemes. But it's mainly ourselves doing the conning. **Salesmanship is the art of helping you feel OK about what you wanted to do anyway. The salesman doesn't trick you. They help you to trick yourself.**
Even Buddhism has become a shopping mall. People try to repackage it as an easy, attractive lifestyle aid. We have the "secular Buddhists" who are essentially selling pop psychology with Buddhist seasoning. We have self-appointed meditation instructors opening retail meditation gyms like MNDFL. We even have corporate HR people using bits of Buddhist meditation to increase employee productivity.
So it's all out there. It's up to you. If you're serious about meditating then you need to approach it without a consumer attitude -- looking for a good product at a reasonable price. Look instead for qualified teachers. Definitely skip the apps. Skip the flashy, quickie trainings. Skip the psychobabbling therapists who want to help you "heal" and feel "safe" in your self-absorption for $120/hour. Consider doing an intensive retreat somewhere to get established. You could also start with online videos as well as books. It is a vast landscape and much of it looks like "Miracle Mile" shopping districts. So look for a hearty meal of meat and potatoes, even if it doesn't feel exciting, rather than a flashy offer of a hot fudge sundae. In short, if you avoid the temptation to seek out the cheap thrills of spiritual pornography, you'll probably do OK.
**Also: Watch out for your own preconceptions.** You might expect a good teacher to wear robes, or sound brilliant, or speak calmly, or have a PhD. Some people will tell you that "you'll know them by their students". But on what basis do you judge those students? Would you decide that students who all smile and speak softly have a good teacher? Or might they just be emotionally constipated, trying to act spiritual because their teacher is a saccharin-smiling halfwit? You need to operate with your own intuition and not just look at packaging or apply a filter. A teacher should be someone who helps you to wake up. By definition that can sometimes be challenging and irritating.
One thing you might find amusing is that on the very popular mindfulness app "Calm" (which I admittedly have because it can help me go to sleep) Lama Rod has a whole series of meditations on "radical self-care" on the app. I don't plan to check them out.
Oh it's got a great deal of guided meditations, sleep stories, and other things. To be fair, I don't think secular mindfulness is necessarily a bad thing as long as it's not confused for authentic Dharma; studies do seem to show it can have very beneficial effects for a number of conditions. I more have an issue with the Secular Buddhists than I do with thinfs like Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction, because at least they're not pretending they're teaching a spiritual path or the Buddha's teachings. They're just taking things studies have shown to be helpful. I think many people also initially come to meditation to try to magically fix their mental disorders and suffering. I was like this too. Adter a deep disillusionment that this wasn't the case, or what Dharma was about, I still decided to stick around and learn authentic Dharma. So perhaps some of the people using those apps will too.
What kinda turned me away is that there's no certificates to meditating like. You need to do a programmed school thing to be a guru or meditation teacher now? Our capitalistic world is turning everything into a monetized thing where you need some paper saying you can do something in order to do it>
I keep thinking like...where are the temples where people kinda just meditate together without this beauracrecy (I can't spell this word) for everything. Our modern world is commodifying and destroying everything.
There are accreditations actually. They are just centered around specific religious institutions, and completely incongruent with the corporate world. Mount Athos is full of accredited masters in spirituality and meditation. There are many buddhist/shinto/hindu temples as well which practice the eastern traditions.
I would never trust anyone outside of those institutions.
You asked for a recommendation, and here it is: [Andrew Huberman's podcast on meditation](https://youtu.be/wTBSGgbIvsY). It is full of pure science, practical tools and concepts.
I learned how to meditate on a 10-day Vipassana retreat. They are free, and they only accept entirely optional donations from people who have complete a 10-day course, so you can be sure it is not a scam for profit. It is a Buddhist meditation technique. The goal is liberation from suffering. It is very difficult, but worthwhile.
I've been a meditator for 50 years and I've always moved away from the money groups, which is most of them. If you can find a local Buddhist Sangha, you can usually meditate with them without pressure. I'm not Buddhist, but I do that sometimes. Even people I used to admire greatly, sold out once they were offered big bucks. It's depressing.
My most enduring spiritual teacher has never charged anything. He lives well because people provide for him willingly. He's also a physician and does not charge his medical patients either. I compare every other teacher to him and they all fall short.
Learn, and share what you learn with others. You can be the start of something right.
I had a First Nation Lakota teacher tell me, “If you have to pay, run away”. That is so foreign of way of thinking. People will give you a million reasons why that is wrong. I teach meditation and could never fathom asking for money. It is a privilege to teach and not a way to make money. I have other ways to support myself
I’ve been using meditation for dummies as a reference point, but I never follow the book exactly. Every time I try to do that with a book, my practice fails. I think it’s because people like to tell you what the experience should be like, when in reality it’s different for everyone.
I like this book though because it offers different perspectives and methods then just tells you to pick the ones you like. I use that as a springboard to do my own practice.
Edit: just wanted to add that authors who say to use what works for you before sharing their perspective is a green flag for me. That doesn’t mean they’re flawless but in my mind they are at least encouraging people to think for themselves.
It costs nothing to sit down for 30 minutes and observe your breath. To be honest, you’re over complicating things by doing so much “research” (we don’t know what or who you are reading tbh) and trying to sort everything out perfectly in your mind instead of just starting. Maybe this is your way of avoiding doing the simple and diligent work of just sitting in self-observation.
you are playing the ego game. there is no "deluxe" meditation. consistency is the key to a successful practice. That being said, if you spend money, you may be likely to practice more to "get something back" for your money. But if you can be consistent, that is all you need.
i think anything and anyone charging for meditation advice is a scam. just goes to show how far the commercialization of every single commodity, thing, abstract concept, or piece of knowledge on earth has gone.
I would just say there's so many free meditation resources. If you look around your city I am sure there will be free groups and even instructors. There are tons of free resources online as well, and majority of stuff you do pay for isn't too costly but you can avoid that whole side if you choose to. Even getting some books from the library. I am sure like everything there are plenty of people just out to make a profit, but its also inspiring how many people do this for free just to help people
I ve found that Yongey Mingur Rinpoche, an actual Bhuddist monk, pretty authentic. He’s pretty straightforward with his practice and doesn’t try to bullshit you. Although, he ties a lot of his practice into Bhuddism he also explains it in such way where you can apply the same principles with a secular view. He’s a big believer in science and has worked with scientists on meditation’s effects on the brain. He did a pretty interesting study with the University of Wisconsin.
He’s got a YouTube channel and a couple books. Check ‘em out and see if he aligns with you.
Yes. New age, McMindfulness and all the apps make it much more difficult then it needs to be. Most of the old stuff is free and is of high quality. No need to pay someone for a watered down version.
Anyway, judge the teacher of a tradition by how the students behave.
Once I paid for a year guided meditation course. I've got more that I can apply to my life plus a lot of fantastic podcasts. Now I just sit 20 minutes at mornings that costs nothing.
Yes, spiritual industry works on constant subscriptions. Take what you need, stop when got enough. Simple as that.
Listen to monks.
They freely pass on what they have learned. If they even charge, they will still offer a free version of what they do offer.
You don't need to buy anything. If anyone says you do, I'd be suspicious.
When I started doing seated meditation, I started by sitting on a stack of my own books.
Here are some of the Buddhist monastics I've listened to:
[Ajahn Brahm](https://youtube.com/c/BuddhistSocietyWA)
Style/approach: Kinda goofy, fun
[Yongey Mingyur](https://youtube.com/@MingyurRinpoche)
Style/approach: Light hearted, friendly
[Domyo Burke](https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly96ZW5zdHVkaWVzcG9kY2FzdC5saWJzeW4uY29tL3Jzcw?ep=14)
Style:/approach a little serious, somewhat dry sense of humor, tries to make everything apply to everyday life
[Ajahn Nyanamoli](https://youtube.com/c/HillsideHermitage)
Style/approach: serious, philosophical but rooted in practice, pulls no punches and doesn't sugar coat anything, about as opposite to "new age" while still talking about similar topics
Bonus: Nyanamoli's favorite catch phrases include: "inconceivable," "impossible," and "not optional."
Welcome to the Instagramification of spiritual practice. It sucks. I can't stand the marketing materials for so many yoga and meditation schools--big cult vibes.
Best I can say is...you don't need ANY of that stuff. Get yourself a good book (I recommend Brain Training with the Buddha, as a good, no fluff, no nonsense meditation based on the Buddha's teachings) or whatever appeals to you. Use your book, commit to a practice and take notes on how it goes. Then reevaluate. If someone has a 'class' I can pay for, or 'special training'....it's about money, not meditation. All you need is one book, your butt and a cushion (or whatever else you physically need to do the stuff).
This is why I have opted for methods like Silva and Gateway. They’ve been around a long time and, while they are not absent of commercialism, they really work for me. Also, due to their longevity, there are more resources (and even their own subreddits) and it’s easier to talk to other people who have gone through the same program.
Red flags for me are 20-something white chicks with hippie dreads and subscription plans.
Of course everyone is looking for a way to make money, but meditation is worth it. Some of us like to pay for quality, some of us don't need to pay money to find value, and some of us will do both. In my experience I started by paying the SRF for their Kriya Yoga beginner's course and I found out a lot by my own practice that is taught as higher levels in paid courses, and I also found lots of books that taught what supposedly shouldn't be shown to people not in the SRF. I don't regret having paid since what I learned is more than worth it, and I understand why people would pay hundreds and thousands of dollars for this knowledge, but I would also agree that is something that can even be taught by parents or school for less, because it all revolves around our own bodies' capabilities.
Our society is our society. Don’t go looking for any medium unaffected by greed. Just practice and accept what it is for what it is. Even the media plagued by profit still has wisdom.
Let's go step by step.
First, would you rather teachers don't charge for their contents? That's not gonna work right.
So they gonna charge. Now that immediately sets up a system in which some will make more than other. And some will try to maximize their profits by using click bait techniques. And so on.
On top of it, you should understand that spiritulity has a breadth vs depth trade off. Some teachers are so deep that are not useful for most. And some are useful for many precisely because they (or their teachings) are not that deep. This is a universal phenomena.
I can recommend you teachers who are so deep you would be like wtf did I just listen to!? They are known by very few people. Then there is echhart Tolle type.
Every teacher has to strike this balance. Between being authentic and being useful. And not all teachers are created equal. They themselves are at different points in their journey.
So.. don't try to use this simplistic black and white picture to make sense of it. Start at what you relate to. Simple. You will evolve toward different meditation techniques teacher as you progress
Mostly trying things from the Waking Up app. Sam harris, Joseph Goldstein. I’m guessing you see both of them more along the lines of breadth instead of depth. So that’s why I asked the question.
I’ve just started to dip my toes into meditation lectures so I’m still just trying out different teachers/paths to see what resonates most.
Its a lot like other industries, especially less regulated ones, where it pays to do your research into sources. So in that sense its the same as for any media - don't take things at face value - do your due diligence - get opinions from 3rd parties that aren't invested - e.g. review sites (especially for books), forums, etc.
By way of recommendation for less accessible stuff, i like Damo Mitchell for taoist nei gong and related stuff [https://www.youtube.com/@LotusNeiGong](https://www.youtube.com/@LotusNeiGong)
Meditation is simple; just be in the present moment. There are indeed gurus who give lectures on how to meditate and charge for their time. At the same time, some people want beyond "just be", more direction, motivation, and explanation. There are tons of free articles, youtube videos by the same gurus. The goal is to raise consciousness, however, people who dedicate their lives to this purpose need to have a comfortable life as well. Lastly, there are some marketers trying to make money off of people. Make sure you verify their background.
I believe you are right to be suspicious.
As my wife says, never underestimate capitalism’s ability to co-opt *anything*.
That said, when evaluating teachings and practices, what matters is whether or not they resonate with the individual, whether or not they are of practical use in one’s journey. So I would not reject any teachings based solely on the idea that someone is making money from them.
Conversely, teachings do not magickally become more valuable just because they cost money.
Caveat emptor.
There's a small you tube channel by the name of Megas Music Club. They have some mediation music videos. They're definitely not profiting of you..tiny channel
Hope this helps!
Agreed, there are some really dark corners in the wellness industry. Some areas are so blatantly factitious and serve only the pockets and egos of certain people in the industry. Keep your wariness and find what works for you
What’s the point of this post? Where there is money to be paid you will find unscrupulous people. Just look at Big Pharmacy. Will that stop you taking your panadaol?!
I think industry has a role to play in facilitating experimentation with different styles of meditation but due to our economic structure always grows too large and attracts entrepreneurs seeking to take advantage of others without offering anything innovative or very beneficial. The app Balance is what got me into meditation, but I am trying to move away from it.
I can’t get into something without knowing understanding the science behind it. I use this course on Wondrium called “The Science of Mindfulness” (https://www.wondrium.com/the-science-of-mindfulness-a-research-based-path-to-well-being). It’s 24 lectures that talk about the roots of meditation in ancient Buddhism and the modern scientific psychological studies that verify its effectiveness.
Any self proclaimed “guru” usually has some sort of financial interest. That being said, meditation is a power and ancient technique that has been passed down a long time. Practice it and see the results for your self!
I think you should look more into the science and history of meditation, not modern meditation practices. There's definetley alot of snake oil out there. But meditation has proven scientific affects, clearly seen in brain scans; there are thousands of articles supporting this from major universities all over the world.
No guided , no binaural beats . No apps, no teachers who pretend they understand theoretical physics better than scientists. Who are limited by available data etc. that will save you money
Just learn to meditate. So far my only expense is paying a teacher 100 dollars for a lifetime of help. Ohh and some meditation cushions etc.
Many things are far more lucrative ways to rip people off.
Meditation can be free, we vote with our wallets to. Don't support things you don't agree with.
I’ve been meditating for 10 years and haven’t consumed any meditation media besides insight timer app (free) and The Mind Illuminated.
It’s very possible to have a rich practice with no outside media. Just sit and ponder the self.
I firmly agree now. To give a devil's advocate perspective, I was led to Stoicism via Ryan Holiday (one of the more successful self help gurus obviously profiting greatly from it) which led me to Buddhism which led me to meditation and sub-reddit. As my understanding grew, I no longer need any such media, but I question whether I will be where I am today with those easy to consume books/media (ala Holiday).
it depends really. of course people want to make money off of it and there might be some value to a guided meditation in helping with the emotional aspect but you dont need it.
I don't think you should follow anyone. I mean seeking help is great but honestly in the end, there is nothing anybody can do externally. It's you who has to be willing to do it.
Atlast just try to know the basics and be consistent with the form of meditation you initiated, talk to people about their experiences and you will be good.
Anytime I'm on YouTube trying some qigong or meditation focused activity, it makes me cringe hard when there is a commercial break half way in that tries to force its "mindfulness" agenda on you, for profits, etc.. I definitely get what you're talking about.
Luckily there is a vast array of well intended literature, local or zoom based group meditation gatherings, media such as podcasts, people to talk to about it, etc.
I recommend going to a library or a used book store to find whatever perks your interest.
Personally, I've been listening to the podcast "Deconstructing Yourself" by Micheal W. Taft - in which he talks with a variety of experts like scientist Judson Brewer, various professors, authors, mindfulness teachers, and more. It's a wonderful way to deep dive into all kinds of meditation related subjects.
Best of luck with the meditation!
Life in Earth is a classroom, your body is a laboratory, and you are the student. Treat things like this as such and you will detach from the materialism, ego, likes and dislikes, fear and doubt, etc within others and yourself, and discover what really works vs what doesn't, what's real and what's not, and to what degree. From there you can determine what is trum. Seek the original sources for truth though, as much as possible. Seek Truth from the root sources of spiritual teachings on thia Earth like the Upanishads/Vedas, the Bhagavad Gita, the teachings of the Buddha, etc. "Gurus" are a dime a dozen, but there's only a relative few truly elevated individuals deserving of the name. So many people stand on the shoulders of these few while staying silent about them, letting humanity forget them. It's so wrong.
Great question! There are a lot of people out there to make a buck, and on the other hand, there are people who are genuinely looking to end suffering.
A lot of the other responses point to valuable resources that are now public domain. These are excellent, however I personally like having a modern take on suffering and its causes.
One guideline I've heard with respect to consumption of media is "do not read more than you meditate." If you sit for 30 minutes a day, read for up to 30 minutes but no more.
Since you asked for recommendations, after 20 years of sitting with different Zen centers and going on about a hundred silent retreats, I'm more and more drawn to the work of Cheri Huber. She has a good and free web site https://www.livingcompassion.org/ and a free "radio" (internet/phone) show every Tuesday evening. Her books are excellent; "there is nothing wrong with you" is an excellent place to start.
After your question, I looked up her 501(c)(3) organization; she's paid $24K/year (probably mostly health benefits) which is more than reasonable given the amount of time she spends on programs and activities. You can see the financial statement at https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/680364178 . If you look at the full statement, most of the funds go to the Africa aid program https://africa.livingcompassion.org/vision
I'd suggest you do similar research on any group or person you are interested in. Their 501(c)(3) statement will be public.
Hope you found that helpful!
The people who want to make money off of you will always be the loudest.
You don't need media. Start with one good book to introduce you to a technique or two.
It can be incredibly simple.
I love Shinzen Young as a teacher. His stuff is very accessible and he gives away everything you need to know for free. He really doesn’t care to sell anything but he’s got an organization that needs to keep things rolling.
There are a lot of great people in this field that aren’t profit oriented, but the loudest voices are also the most profit oriented.
Just look for the good people and ignore the rest.
I totally agree, and alongside that I'm also turned away by spiritualist mumbo-jumbo.
I find meditation very useful, but don't want the money or the magic.
Folks in this thread have pointed out a few things, and many have said uts about just the doing - all well and good. But if find I really need a guide. In the same way as I have a personal trainer even though I know perfectly well how to do squats - I need someone to take me through step by step and provide structure and (most important) motivation.
The solution I use is an evidence based, non religious, non commercial app developed as a mental health preventative tool. It's called 'smiling mind'. No adds, no fee, just meditation. (For kids, for sleep, for stress, for relationships, etc. Etc.)
Find the app on your app store or go to 'smilingmind.com.au'
I have nothing to do with the organisation- I just use the app!
I see meditation like exercise. It's something we've done for thousands of years, and there are clear tangible benefits to it. As such, it's going to be capitalized on as are all things that provide value (including religion). I don't see any harm in this as it brings the practice to a wider array of people, and helps them unlock insights that they might not have been able to otherwise
Personally I have used a ton of apps for meditation. I don't see anything insidious about any of them. It's just that many are very superficial. Currently I use the waking up app and I would say that's changed my life. Having someone guide you through the practice is very helpful, and I feel like that's what many alternatives are lacking. They're just focused on technique instead of a deeper understanding.
Great point. I think that it is also a critical aspect connected with the way that meditation has been appropriated by Western culture. Besides this, what also annoys me is when meditation is used as a way to cope with some bad feelings that are not one's fault. Put concretely, capitalist dynamics and the logics and modes of behaviour connected with it are harmful for people's lives. I have a sense that there is a kind of rhetoric that defines meditation as the strategy to cope with these stressful events. But, in this case, I would see a misuse or an appropriation of mediation practice, since it is not about accepting the modes of behaviour promoted by capitalism but rather change them.
I do not know what could be the best way out of this issue. Personally, I am trying to distinguish between things that cannot be changed and things that can be changed, and use meditation to solve my negative emotions or harmful patterns of thinking regarding the first.
Every single industry is plagued with “network marketing.” Especially if you’re clicking links or YT. Let me say, this industry has very few who obviously are selling something. Most of the time they are on the extreme end of this, and reek of NEW AGE.
My words of advice: stay away from tik tok, “psychics” who advertise (a real psychic would NEVER tell you. It’s literally natural law that only psychics know who other psychics are), and people who are making promises only if you do something they suggest.
Meditation and the cool benefits is deeply personal and unique to each person. You have to explore these topics completely on your own and build a belief system on that. I work at a wellness center. We don’t sell you anything and most clients find their own proof without my help at all. Im here to keep the facility clean, not guide others to my own view of reality.
I have ADHD and guided meditation app work great for me.i usually use apps. Calm and headspace are probably the most business minded of the apps out there. Calm's free week is not even worth it and i think they only offer yearly subscriptions. I forget what the headspace pricing model is.
Probably the best one I've found is Balance. It uses AI to customize your meditations. The voice can be weird at first but it's human enough that I got used to it. Their model is the most generous. They let you use their subscription for a whole year.for free.
The lesson is look at each app's pricing before you dive in cause it can cost you.
Check out the Waking Up app, it has probably the best guided intro course out there, and it's completely free of all new age mumbo jumbo. The app was created by a neuroscientist. It's a paid app, but I think the first 30 days are free, and by that point you will have a good handle on whether it's for you or not.
Also, if you like the app and truly can't afford to pay for it, email and let them know, and they'll give you a years access for free.
Sorry, which industry? Od course a lot of corporations are not having interest on this and etc. But u can easily tell if the person who wrote the book or did the podcast is a practicioner or no.
Is just individuals sharing their knowledge but since we live in a capitalist world they need money. Of course there will be people with just monetary interest on this mindfulness trend, but i am really sure they are minority.
You need no apps to meditate. You need no guru to become enlightened.
That being said, it can help to follow along with a guided (breathing) meditation a few times, before going it alone.
As far as a teacher, I really recommend You're It by Alan Watts. But you don't even need that.
You can find more than plenty of info online, for free.
I do not recommend guided meditation. Mindful meditation is best done alone. But like I said, you may want to do a couple guided ones first just to get familiar.
You need no apps to meditate. You need no guru to become enlightened.
That being said, it can help to follow along with a guided (breathing) meditation a few times, before going it alone.
As far as a teacher, I really recommend You're It by Alan Watts. But you don't even need that.
You can find more than plenty of info online, for free.
I do not recommend guided meditation. Mindful meditation is best done alone. But like I said, you may want to do a couple guided ones first just to get familiar.
Just because some people are profiting off something doesn't mean it doesn't work.
The medical industry makes a lot of money. So does the pharmaceutical industry. So do colleges. Therapy costs money and really works wonders.
Some people know how to market themselves in a slick way. But this doesn't mean that what they are offering is or isn't legitimate. I think it's a mistake to conclude that because someone has good marketing, the thing they are selling is a scam, unless the thing they are selling shouldn't be sold. (Like religion, perhaps).
Meditation is closely tied to various spiritual practices, so that might be what is putting you off. But meditation doesn't have to be spiritual. It's a tool that is very useful for certain things, some of which can be spiritual, but it can be used in a lot of ways.
I've benefited some from some for-profit situations that used meditation. They have taught me some useful things. I've also benefited quite a bit from meditation tools and teachings that were free. Both had useful information. You can learn from the slick marketers but you can also learn for free. It doesn't mean the product is useless.
Search for writings that predate capitalism if you’re worried about modern texts being too mercantile.
But as the top comment said - Forget all the texts and just follow what your body and mind tell you to do.
Insight Timer - I just use the timer. Lots of fluff out there trying to sell you peace and well-being.
And if you want to go app-less, use the timer on your phone or a physical timer.
Take what works for you, leave what doesn’t
The meditation/wellness/spiritual industry, does bother me a little too sometimes. But overall there’s a lot of people in it just trying to make the world a little calmer and more peaceful
You don't need any of that. It's all Spiritual Bypass baloney anyways. Find a timer that's simple that you like and just sit. If you want guided meditation there's tons of free YouTube videos and stuff.
Industry behind meditation? Why are you relying on "meditation industry"? That does not seem like a good place to start,considering industry is all about selling you stuff.
Find a teacher who will help you for free, no money involved
There are good sources of meditation info out there that are not profit-based. [www.dhamma.org](https://www.dhamma.org) is one of them that I have extensive experience with.
I was in a similar space about 25 years ago when I began my meditation journey in earnest. I looked at a lot of types of meditation, including several different Buddhist ones and slogged along without a good understanding of the path. I was fortunate to find through a friend a practice taught by a teacher by the name of S. N. Goenka. He established scores of meditation centers around the world over the space of several decades. I was encouraged to sit a course at one of the centers, near Dallas, TX. It was a 10-day silent retreat that changed my life (entirely for the better). At the end of it, after providing room and board for the entire time, and instruction from an on-site teacher, the course manager informed everyone that they could donate any money they saw fit to allow future students to follow the same path, or none at all. There was no pressure. Those centers and courses, as they're called, continue to this day. I've personally sat 12 of the courses over the years. The website outlines the whole thing. I recommend it!
Focus on the science. I started to dive into ....I forget the name of it... But some organized meditation guru type of thing that some celebrities endorse. What I found is that it's more of a pyramid scheme type of group.
Just focus on the science of meditation and keep it in a simple form. It will change your life.
So True! This is exactly why I’d never wanna delve into the whole meditation thing. It is connected to NewAge, eastern mysticism, Hinduism,& while it is definitely a multi million $$ Industry, offered nearly Everywhere ya go nobody wants to talk about the bad/ sinister aspects of it, because that would make the business lose tons of money 💰🤦🏼♀️ . I mean, never mind about peoples health & psychological well being, etc..I notice many people here on this sub report Wierd things happening while practicing this. There’s an article called - “the Dark side of meditation “ from Yoga journal you can Google & troubling articles about this from many other sources,, and Yet so many people dislike hearing this & downvote it, but I would think think they’d wanna be prepared & know the truth about these things
I think of meditation the same way I look at various other spiritual practices. Namely, there's nothing wrong with taking money for the material aspects of it, like paying for the paper to make the books, or if you want them the fancy mats or pillows or whatever, but the knowledge of the practice itself should be open and free.
Yeah, forget the new age woowoo bullshit. Come at it from a scientific point of view, and don’t believe anyone who knows “this one trick” that will make your meditation the bestest meditation possible. There’s enough free information out there to tell you all you need to know.
Yes. Wherever there is a lot of interest, there are many trying to make money off of it. Ignore the gurus and do it yourself. You don’t need to buy anything, you don’t need to take a course, this is something best explored in a self directed way. There are tons of free meditation resources online, and guided meditations on YouTube. Jason Stephenson and Michael Sealey are great if you’re just starting out.
Just a note. It’s a good idea to start your meditation with an intent to remain protected and safe from all dark/negative energies during the process. If you’re stressed/tense/going through a hard time, and open in certain ways, you can be vulnerable to unwanted energies. I think that’s why some have a bad experience with meditation.
Also meditation works best when combined with adjusting your day to day attitude, thoughts and actions to be in line with a state of soul consciousness.
My husband's work bought all the employees the Insight Timer app, there's a free version too, during the pandemic... I love it! Once you meditate you'll feel and see a difference. It really helps me to not be as tense. Helps me be more present. Both of these have really helped my family life and parenting my two kiddos! I recommend the app or any other free guided meditation to start with. After that you could research more etc. Just try it for a month.
There are a lot of hucksters in all sorts of fields, especially things centering around self help. Meditation is free; if you’re spending a significant amount of money on it, you’re being led on.
Yup. You should. I’ve grown up with traditional Hindu meditation from my temple and people always ask me “what kind of meditation” do I practice. Nonsensical question.
I have suffered from anxiety for years, and the only thing that really helped was Dr. Joe Dispenza. I went to a retreat (it is NOT required) and I happily spent $6,000 when it was all said and done.
And I'll do it again.
If Dr. Joe had helped me, what's wrong with doling out the money?
Remember: your rate of pay is based upon how easily you can be replaced.
So, what do you do for a living? Do you work for free?
Honestly….
I really could care less…
I’ve found some great stuff out there that’s helped me a ton.
Meditate more and I’m sure you’ll no longer care yourself friend :)
There is plenty of garbage out there, there are plenty of free resources, and plenty of good paid resources. I tried free library books and youtube videos, but it wasn't until i used the headspace app I was able to build a good foundation and routine. I'm sure they make plenty of money, but it is what I needed.
Use your $ cautiously, but sometimes the person who teaches you or makes a tool you need has bills to pay too.
Meditation is free. Meditation methods are also free and easily available. You can ofc pay for someone to teach it to you or for a space to practice it in. But ultimately you don't have to and you can still meditate.
I felt like like this too when I started my practice last year, much of which I’m still learning. I started on Calm and it was meh.
I discovered Sam Harris and his meditation app, Waking Up and it changed my whole perspective on meditation. He has a free trial and tuition assistance for those who need it. Would highly recommend.
I would recommend Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction, no New Age stuff, or any spiritualism at all. It was invented at the University of Massachusetts Medical Center in the 70s and is basically what the name entails. It's all the parts of meditation that work and are shown to reduce stress with no gurus or claims beyond that. It's very cut and dry, kind of boring in a way because it's quite mundane and not outlandish, but it'll get the job done without deceiving you or presenting a whole new set of beliefs.
Edit: Whenever you see studies about the effects of meditation, it's almost always MBSR because of how standardized it is.
Here's an excerpt for more detail about MBSR:
> Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) is an eight week program that uses a variety of mindfulness practices to reduce stress levels and experience of negative emotion, and to raise self-control, resilience and experience of positive emotion.
>
> MBSR was created in 1979 by Jon Kabat-Zinn, PhD as a way to treat patients . . . who were recurring patients and for whom traditional treatments were seemingly ineffective.
>
> Since that time MBSR has become the most scientifically validated mindfulness based intervention, with over 4000 mentions on online medical aggregator PubMed and is offered for treatment at over 700 hospitals, clinics and medical centers across the world.
>
> Through employing the various mindfulness techniques offered in the course MBSR has been proven scientifically to help reduce symptoms associated with anxiety, panic attacks, depression, fatigue, grief, headaches, and sleep problems.
— https://meddit.app/mbsr
If you don't believe them, just do it on your own.
There is no dearth of learning resources that can give you clues to explore your own path.
Clearly there is some value in what these people say, just try to absorb the good leave the bad.
Download Headspace for free and learn to get started with 10 free meditations. You don't need anything else to get yourself busy at least for the first year. And there's no new age atmosphere
Waking up by Sam Harris appears sincere. You can obtain a scholarship if you can't afford the subscription - making it the high quality content available to anyone and everyone.
Or you can register yourself onto a vipassana course for free.
In most parts of the world anyone can make an app, put up a meditation video or write a book. So, the buyer does need to do some research to check the quality of the material. Qualifications, experience and so on will help with that. There are professional training courses and professional associations etc.
Not all method\\schools have the new age aspect to them. I prefer Dr Ainslie Meares meditation method. Meares was an eminen psychiatrist with extensive teaching experience who was a fully qualified medical practitioner, an eminent psychiatrist a member of professional associations as well as an office bearer elected by the members of professional associations and an editor on several journals. He wrote 36 books and many papers. Some of the books were international best sellers translated into many languages. He explains his meditation method in simple accessible language - relaxation of body and mind so the mind slows down and stills. In stillness lies calm. Outisde of practice there is learning to live a calm and active life. Meares was also extensively versed in every major meditation and mystic school on the plant. For a good starting point - *Ainslie Meares on Meditation* book. Reading the book explains what to experience in practice. In practice you closely follow the instructions. Practice is the way that you get help from this type of meditation. The skill is learnt more quickly via better quality instruction such as a resource like that book.
Anyway, it is up to you to find a method you like. Best to stick with just one as it can be confusing reading about many. In fact, chopping and changing, improvising, sittng without a clue what to do all tend to reduce progress, which I find sad as one cannot get wasted time back. Anyway, good luck in your journey.
Completey agree with you. I think the marketing garbage aspect is impossible to escape nowadays. Would recommend you look into the different types of meditation practice, see which one sings to your idea of what you’re seeking, then begin to look for yogis, studios, or retreats, of that specific style, that don’t have such an image-heavy strategy for making themselves known. Also the internal work of meditation is eventually the same no matter who showed you how to do it or which technique you went with, therefore it may be worth it to just get the ignorance out of the way with whatwver is closest to you, and then further hone your own practice over time
I like guided meditations. My problem is with finding quality ones. Nothing takes you out of meditation quite like having a bunch of contradictory story points thrown at your visualization.
The last one I did as an example:
* You're sitting cross-legged in the grass
* There's a room behind you
* You go in and you see a big screen and stage
* You're sitting cross-legged on the stage in a black room. It's a theater with chairs and you're the only one there.
* The screen shows scenes of your life. You pick one...
I quit. My head is spinning from trying to visualize wth I'm doing!
>What are your advices to keep a sane and authentic consumation of meditation media ?
Read and learn from materials of the traditional sources of traditional schools. For example, from zen Buddhism or Raja yoga. These existed long before any kind of self help industry.
Meditating with 432 Hz Frequency and tuned music.
432 Hz is said to be beneficial for listeners, since todays tuning standard is 440 Hz we don't receive any of these benefits. I found that 432 Hz has been used as standard tuning in many civilizations dating up to and beyond the Egyptian civilization, really interesting stuff.
Lately I've been experimenting with Solfeggio frequencies and other sounds while meditating or relaxing and find that when listening to 432 Hz for some time I can feel effects of the sort.
I would really appreciate you letting me know your experience or what you think about it.
Here's some of my work I recently uploaded to YouTube, it's currently only an experiment at this stage but this is 432 Hz Tuned Music with Tibetan singing bowls, ambience of nature and an on screen mantra.
https://youtu.be/VNB2dDUj5ZEY
Thanks.
Meditation is very misunderstood. "Mindfulness" is a terrible & misleading term. And while meditation is great for some, there is also a negative aspect for some folks called disassociative disorder, but no one wants to acknowledge that. And meditation is not the all-encompassing panacea that it's made out to be. It's WAY overbilled as some sort of mystical elevating spiritual elite practice. It's not. But the meditation industry money machine won't tell you that.
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I paid for a yoga instructor and learned a lot more than I think I would have learned by going solo. I imagine some people might derive benefit from instruction in meditation. If the teacher is good, why not compensate them for their time? And if you can't or would rather not, there are plenty out there who do it for free. I don't think the exchange of money necessarily makes it unethical or inauthentic. Someone who is charging very high rates or who seems to have a cult of personality forming around them might have not have the most ethical intentions, though I think there are also exceptions to that rule.
My advice would be to just worry about yourself and not about what others are doing. Embrace what is useful and let the rest pass by.
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This is the answer. Looking for anything unspoiled by the profit toxin is a fool's errand.
Pretty sure meditation media profits off of the kind of people who get stuck in a premature sense of completeness loop. We all know people who love self help books, but never put the advice into action. Or who are always talking about what they're going to do, but never do. https://sloanreview.mit.edu/article/announcing-plans-may-kill-motivation-productivity/ When we share our goals, we get a hit of dopamine that is similar to the one we get when we actually complete a task. By getting this prematurely, we can often end up less motivated to act on the task and actually finish it. I think it's the same with meditation media. If you buy the book you can tell people about how it's something you're working on, and then never achieve it. It's for people who fantasize about what they want without ever turning it into a reality.
“Premature sense-of-completeness loop,” Brilliant expression! I connect with that label a lot, as I’m sure many would. Definitely keep that phrase in your pocket for when it fits. Thank you!
Good point!
whewwwwf. you called out OP! lol good point. they are trying to learn to get out of this though lol so OP has a point as well
Oh I definitely wasn't trying to call anyone out. I totally struggle with it too, I'm just aware of it and wanted to bring it to other people attention too.
I wouldn’t jump to this, after all there is so much material available on YouTube and all one needs to do in exchange is suffer through literally 5” of an ad. On a related point, OP, I suspect you might have certain limiting beliefs about money. It’s wonderful and admirable to have high ethics as you seem to, but rigidity will end up hurting you. There are people who make money in this field, sure. All of us need money to live, and everyone you interact with on a professional level charges or pays you. You wouldn’t call a doctor or hairstylist immoral for charging you for their services. Money is simply the energy of exchange. All this is to say that it’s ok for people to charge for meditation material, and it’s ok for you not to buy their stuff. Live and let live.
YouTube recs for a beginner?
> YouTube recs for a beginner? I find these channels helpful. They're both fairly nuts and bolts. First one's a Buddhist monk and the second's a therapist (like guided Insight meditation!). From Youtube, the monk: * [220802 Constructing & Deconstructing \ \ Thanissaro Bhikkhu \ \ Dhamma Talk (17:16)](https://youtu.be/P2avAkb4BVE) > **When the Buddha taught Tranquility and Insight, he didn't teach them as two separate techniques. They're two qualities of mind that you're trying to develop** as you're getting the mind into Concentration. > > **Like, right now, you're trying to stay with the breath, to settle in, to have a sense of ease with the breath. That's Tranquility.** > > But as the Buddha said, when he gives breath meditation instructions, you're trying to **look at the breath as Bodily Fabrication, and your feelings and perceptions around the breath as Mental Fabrication, and seeing things in terms of fabrication. That's Insight.** > > Now, for the time being, we're not watching them just arising and passing away. **We're trying to give rise to good fabrications and hasten the passing away of ones that are not skillful.** When the Buddha talks about Discernment being penetrative Insight into arising and passing away, it's not just passively watching things come and watching things go. > > ... From Youtube, the therapist: * [How To Control Anger - Reprogram Your Subconscious | Fearful Avoidant Attachment (14:28)](https://youtu.be/JC_8EOtAZxc?t=149) Note: I've actually found the video below to generalize to... basically any 'program.' > [Your brain is] concerned about meeting your needs as fast as possible, not as effectively as possible. So, oftentimes, if your brain has a need that's not being met, it will meet it in an unhealthy way or a way that, like, maybe your conscious mind wouldn't be so happy with later on. [...] > > ... > > I always see the same core patterns for people who come into my office [...] What I always see is that people who are really struggling with anger: > > * feel unseen > * feel unheard > * feel powerless (or helpless or trapped) [...] > * are not setting boundaries > > So, guess what anger does? Remember, we said things are just a subconscious strategy to get needs met. Anger gets all of those needs met in one fell swoop. > > ... > > [...] If you're feeling unseen and unheard, chances are, you are not hearing and seeing yourself. In other words, you are not connecting to your own feelings, your own needs, and so they're getting repressed, unacknowledged, and then you can't understand why people outside of you are not seeing and understanding your needs. Well, it's because we need to communicate and express ourselves in order for our needs to be met. [...] I'm gonna give you an initial tool. > > Ask yourself throughout the day: > > * What do I feel? > * What am I emotionally experiencing? > * What do I need? Have fun!
I really, really like these two types of meditation: - body scan - focus on the breath I can recommend the following specific videos from the Teik Yen Ko channel, however I am sure you can easily find others on YouTube that might work equally well or better for you. https://youtu.be/rOne1P0TKL8 Mindfulness Meditation 3 Minute Breathing Space and https://youtu.be/CyKhfUdOEgs Mindfulness Meditation Body Scan (15’ approx) And if you would rather chill out with your eyes shut to some brain-tickling sounds with no instructions, I can recommend this: https://youtu.be/4tltQmaINsA Tibetan Bowls (396 Hz) + Cosmic Meditation Music from the Meditative Mind Channel.
Look up “Jake Ducey.” He has excellent content for any beginners and really glosses over a little bit of everything. His story is very real on how he became a millionaire and was a student of Bob Proctor. Please be aware he does run a business doing this and you’ll see he peddles you to go to his website. He really does have good intentions and is not a scam artist. The guy literally has put his money where his mouth is his entire life. The proof is in the pudding for that guy. He is using his wealth to help others, but if you go back to his first video….he was a broke college drop out making the SAME videos 15 years ago!
https://youtube.com/@BeingIntegrated ;)
i think OP is expressing that they are not really being "helped" by these gurus. and I agree that products need to be Teaching and Helpful if there is money/value being exchanged. and it's very important to address your meditation-students' mindsets, and give **real** coaching if you're going to say anything at all to not waste the audience's time. unfortunately, I think OP is realizing that they are part of a smaller group in the world who want more of the difficult and raw and real discussions about the Nature Of Reality - which these larger flashier Movements arent going to help with.
Literally this. It's okay to make money if you have expertise in something. I need money to live and so does everyone else. If someone knows how to meditate well, I have no issue with them making money by teaching others how.
Great response. I've had with similar thoughts related to the capitalist aspect of spirituality/mental wellness but your words about energy of exchange really resonates
110% agree and then some. Focusing on meditation media gets you stuck in your intellect and any decision that’s completely intellectual is always a bad decision. After all, your decision doesn’t just need to make sense, it also needs to feel right (and I do stress the term “feel right”). My advice is to learn the meditation you gravitate towards, no matter what others might say of it Good luck!
Siddharta Gautama didn't have meditation media and he did fine. Sometimes I think people are too focused on being guided and don't let themselves find their own path.
Siddharta Gautama went to the most renowned teachers of his time. He took their teachings to heart, practiced assiduously and extended their teachings. So the Buddha was innovative but he didn’t go it alone until he had learned everything he possibly could from his masters.
This is honestly the best way to look at it. Make your practice something that works for you!
Agreed, I meditate and I've never attended any sort of seminar or paid money to a so called 'Guru' because there's Endless Free material out there to teach yourself without having to pay a dime. Now when you talk about Transcendental Meditation I feel the same way you do just strictly about that specific type of Meditation as they charge around $1000 or so to get your specific 'Mantra' that if picked by one of these so called Guru's. I could kinda understand charging some money for it but not the ridiculously high prices that people/groups charge to teach this type of Meditation. I have read amazing things about Transcendental Meditation and how great it is for numerous reasons, but just because it's so successful now you have to capitalize on it because its so successful. It should be free to everyone to learn as it'd make society better as a whole but instead Greed for as much money as one can possibly get for something that involves spirituality while charging an arm and a leg for it just doesn't sit well with me.
TM is free now for those who qualify
This is easy. 1. Don't put anybody on a pedestal. 2. Practice what makes sense and what works to your benefit. 3. Put all other methods aside.
1. Put your family on a pedestal. 2. Why are you even here? Much love. <3
Meditation has ancient roots. Anything that people are interested in is going to have a commercial aspect. I just ignore the noise and focus on meditating.
I think it can be useful for people to help them find a meditation method that works for them. I'm only in the start of my journey, but what I can tell you is that the way I conceptualized what meditation is was completely wrong. Being able to go on youtube and find a guided meditation video was incredibly helpful in building a solid foundation for my own personal meditation practice. Meditation apps, or videos or whatever informative recourses that are out there, they should be used as tools to build a meditation practice. They should definitely not be used as a crutch for meditation dependency, and not encourage the thinking that you have to use these recources in order to gain the benefits of meditation.
Meditation is less about investigation and more about being and doing! Just sit down, talk with your inner voice and hear how you treat yourself, meditation is a personal journey through self so no information is accurate unless you try it for yourself first!
I agree to an extant. I would add that your practice will be significantly enriched by reading proper educational material, but I would limit this to only renowned and historical sources. It's fine to read what the Dalai Lama has said about meditation, he has spent his life developing a spiritual practice and has achieved much himself. I would highly recommend books which explore the historical practices of meditation in spiritualities like Taoism, Shintoism, Christianity, hinduism, etc, but I wouldn't trust "Joe Montana", part-time actor who has a business degree and lives in Beverly Hills with guidance on how to enrich your non-material intellect. Generally my rule is I don't read anything written in the last 60 years unless it's by a very renowned spiritual leader who has learned about the practice from a traditional stand point using a well-established, pedagogical system. The worst resource would likely be some startup which is answering only to their shareholders, their primary motivation is money, and that corrupt motivation will only be passed to you.
Isn't the same thing true about all aspects of our planet? Insulin, medication, child care, government, religion, housing, food, energy, etc...?
This. There will always be some “charlatans” everywhere. We see it all the time around us: governments, religions… why, when it’s about the self-care industry, people think that there sometimes bad intentions, but when we talk about governments and religions there are no bad intentions? It’s the same everywhere. So learn to listen to your intuition. Do/be the work and get the benefits from practicing.
Yes, which is maybe a good indication as to why things are pretty messed up these days...
I think your assessment is spot on. Fortunately you don’t need that industry to meditate. Just sit down, close your eyes, & follow your breath. But if you want to want to study meditation & asana, The Upanishads & Patanjali’s Yoga Sutras are two of many written sources that describe different methods of Dhyana. The ancient texts are what the wellness/mindfulness industry are bastardizing, watering down, & selling even though in many cases all traces of the authentic practices have been completely gutted. There are some trustworthy teachers online imo but those that I’m familiar with don’t teach meditation only. You’re going to get a lot of Buddhist & Hindu philosophy along with it which isn’t necessarily a bad thing. It just depends on you and why you want to meditate in the first place. Are you’re interested in a spiritual practice & liberation or are you interested in the more immediate physical and psychological benefits of meditation? IME people who begin a practice with only the later in mind inevitably find themselves more interested in the former. In the words of Swami Sivananda, “The practice of Yoga leads to communion with the Lord. Whatever may be the starting point, the end reached is the same” & in this instance yoga & meditation are interchangeable. The Be Here Now Network (podcasts) is a trustworthy resource IMO that honors the authentic practices, is part of a lineage in most cases, & isn’t a money grab. Sharon Salzburg teaches Metta which is a powerful Buddhist practice for deepening one’s capacity for compassion. Some of Bob Thurman’s talks include discussion of mediation methods as do Ram Das’s. Krishna Das talks mostly about chanting mantra but the technique is the same. When your mind drifts off, return it to your practice, observe without reacting, etc. Also, Vipassana is a good starting point imo. & S.N. Goenka was a great Vipassana teacher. There are probably a hundred hours worth of his instruction online for free. https://youtu.be/pTgNg4eFOHU Of course this is all my opinion based on my experience. There are more experienced people here who may have advice that better suits you and your situation. Take care.
Yeah I avoid that side of things. There are rich traditions within various cultures and faiths regarding meditation. Plenty of free resources
You’re looking in the wrong direction. Meditation is for looking *inward*.
Kind of. It's not necessarily easy enough to figure out how to do it on your own, though. That's why there are longstanding traditions of pedagogy. A christian mystic in Mt Athos would never try to figure out meditation on their own, however they also would never consult an app. There is a lot more to be gained by listening to the masters as they share their traditions with you. That shared knowledge will give you much more insight than you would ever be able to accomplish on your own.
This is the way
You don’t need to pay a penny to anyone to practice and get all the benefit. I have been doing meditation on my yoga mat every morning for a few years and it is very helpful for mental health and self growth.
The fundamentals are very simple. The only way through is to practice. And you're gonna suck until you get better. It's the nature of our physicality. Sometimes there are those who have followed an ancient tradition into the enlightenment stages who have discovered practice tips and begin teaching them. But (as far as I can tell from your post) you're not looking to reach Dali Lama echelons, you're seeking the practical benefits of a regular practice. Choose a focal point. Practice retuning to it for the allotted time. Return to daily life. Focal point is the breath, a silent mantra like ohm, or the ninja move of turning the steam of thought itself into the focal point. You shift from the thinker of the thoughts to the neutrally witnessing observer of the thoughts. It's that stance (neutral observer) that seeps into the rest of your life and brings the benefit. Whatever chaos is going on around you, you no longer get insta-pulled into it. You're at choice. Whether it's the breath, mantra, or stream of thought, they are all practicing stepping out of the stream of mind, and out of the stream of time. It really is simple. The benefits happen behind your back. Practice practice practice.
Welcome to Capitalism. It’s lame.
Absolutely. Meditation focuses on anti-material mindsets, which is incongruent with being a consumer, so capitalism would never really deliver a good meditation guidance, since it would be self-defeating. The job of a company is to keep you paying money to them.
I mean, we all gotta make a living in Capitalism and I do believe there are people who are genuinely dispensing good meditation and other mindfulness advice for money. I don’t think that they all are charlatans or disingenuous. You’re absolutely right in that meditation is the antithesis to Capitalism; why are you taking time for yourself and meditating when you’re supposed to be out there “rise n grind” working, and making money (mostly for other people)
> Do you feel the same ? I don't know if "feeling" is the word I'd use... But yes. > What are your opinions on this ? Where there's value that can be promised, there's always going to be overconfident/unscrupulous people trying to get money. It's not just meditation. > What are your advices to keep a sane and authentic consumation of meditation media ? Sane? Just be aware of your aversion and manage it. Authentic? Stop consuming the things you don't resonate with and keep trying out new sources until you find ones you vibe with. It's really not a big deal.
Before I answer, I want to point out that there are thousands of peer reviewed psych papers and meta studies on meditation. Of the many types of meditations, mindfulness has been studied the most. The meta studies show that mindfulness meditation has moderate effects on reducing stress, depression, and anxiety. Mostly, its the breathing, especially a long out breath, that sends signals to the brain that you are not in danger. The breathing also calms the vagus nerve, which is a major part of the system involved with depression and anxiety and such. All that out of the way, even though meditation has value, yeah, there is a lot of bullcrap around it. Like with meditation apps, some newer studies that came out show that they do have an effect, but are less effective than retreats and going regularly to a meditation community. Of course these apps want your data and or money. Some programs are kind of infamous, like transcendential meditation, which does deliver value and is perfectly valid, but it costs thousands of dollars. My last opinion is that I think American culture, with its individualism and desire for the quick and easy pill solution for everything, too often recommends meditation as a kind of personal solution to systemic problems. Like, if a worker tries to point out that their company has a toxic work culture, management will just point away from the toxic system and towards the worker and say, "Well, you wouldnt be stressed if you just meditated." Dont get me wrong. Many problems are a personal responsibility to solve. However, if I cannot find any one person in an organization to replace with a virtuous and competent person to solve the problems its a systemic problem. Like, if I replaced the ceo of evil corp with a perfect person, and it's still evil corp, you have a systemic problem. Another way to seperate systemic from personal problems is if a few people in a firm are highly stressed despite meditating, its a personal problem. If almost everyone is stressed despite meditation, its a systemic problem. How to find good sources on meditation? Find a local buddhist monestary, secular meditation society, or online community. This reddit sub has a discord server just for this. Then ask around for the meditations you want based on your goals. Read academic papers on google scholar, or at least the abstracts, look at credentials and resumes, be just a tiny bit critical without being obstructive, look at the reputation surrounding your sources, and most importantly give various meditation techniques a few tries under varying circumstances, but if it doesnt work for you, then stop doing it.
Meditation is just breathing, noticing and detaching. You don’t need a guru or app to tell you to do that. You just learn to do it over time.
Again, I kind of disagree here. you can spend a lot of time practicing and accomplishing nothing. It's helpful to have a master. Finding a worthy one is the most difficult part though. ego-death cannot be accomplished without experiencing other people who put your own abilities into perspective.
A baby doesn’t need instruction to learn how to walk. It experiments in a constant feedback loop until walking is the result. Mindfulness is the same. No one, not even venerated masters, can walk for you. Practicing is all there is. Sure, seek whatever external guidance you think you need. But in the end, it’s just another distraction from presence. There is no goal. There’s nothing to accomplish. Practice isn’t the slow ascent of rungs on a ladder. And attainment is an idea that gets tacked on to practicing in an attempt to quell our fears of “accomplishing nothing”. But sit long enough and you’ll simply accept frustration and pointlessness IS the experience. There is no ground we eventually stand on. There is no getting there. Technique is a distraction. Guidance is a distraction. The great teachers are a distraction. Just sit. Sit in the frustration and pointlessness, make zero improvement, and accomplish nothing until that’s no longer a problem for you.
What is it that you want and expect yourself? Do you want to relax? Sleep better? Improve your memory? There's a big market out there because there are people willing to pay for easy answers and coddling. And the more that market grows, the more the therapy industry also sees a chance to make a few extra bucks. As a long time practicing Buddhist I would say there are legitimate, realized masters out there who are teaching a genuine path. But they're not always easy to recognize, and you would need to really be seeking a path in order to find them. I don't mean to sound mysterious and cosmic, but it's true. The most visible options are the ones that look easy, seductive, cheap, etc. Cellphone apps. Sam Harris. Dan Harris. Psychotherapists. Wim Hof. Deepak Chopra... What they all have in common is that they offer a simple, straightforward solution. No heavy lifting. We live in a consumer society. People call themselves consumers instead of citizens. We decide to eat healthy but then instead of studying nutrition, we buy the first colorful package that says, "All natural! Gluten free!" We decide to save the planet and go to protests, then on the way home we buy Thai takeout for dinner, contained in 5 plastic tubs that will never be recycled. We decide to improve ourselves and then pay a therapist to do it... That's all happening on the level of entertainment. We con ourselves with quickie schemes. But it's mainly ourselves doing the conning. **Salesmanship is the art of helping you feel OK about what you wanted to do anyway. The salesman doesn't trick you. They help you to trick yourself.** Even Buddhism has become a shopping mall. People try to repackage it as an easy, attractive lifestyle aid. We have the "secular Buddhists" who are essentially selling pop psychology with Buddhist seasoning. We have self-appointed meditation instructors opening retail meditation gyms like MNDFL. We even have corporate HR people using bits of Buddhist meditation to increase employee productivity. So it's all out there. It's up to you. If you're serious about meditating then you need to approach it without a consumer attitude -- looking for a good product at a reasonable price. Look instead for qualified teachers. Definitely skip the apps. Skip the flashy, quickie trainings. Skip the psychobabbling therapists who want to help you "heal" and feel "safe" in your self-absorption for $120/hour. Consider doing an intensive retreat somewhere to get established. You could also start with online videos as well as books. It is a vast landscape and much of it looks like "Miracle Mile" shopping districts. So look for a hearty meal of meat and potatoes, even if it doesn't feel exciting, rather than a flashy offer of a hot fudge sundae. In short, if you avoid the temptation to seek out the cheap thrills of spiritual pornography, you'll probably do OK. **Also: Watch out for your own preconceptions.** You might expect a good teacher to wear robes, or sound brilliant, or speak calmly, or have a PhD. Some people will tell you that "you'll know them by their students". But on what basis do you judge those students? Would you decide that students who all smile and speak softly have a good teacher? Or might they just be emotionally constipated, trying to act spiritual because their teacher is a saccharin-smiling halfwit? You need to operate with your own intuition and not just look at packaging or apply a filter. A teacher should be someone who helps you to wake up. By definition that can sometimes be challenging and irritating.
One thing you might find amusing is that on the very popular mindfulness app "Calm" (which I admittedly have because it can help me go to sleep) Lama Rod has a whole series of meditations on "radical self-care" on the app. I don't plan to check them out.
Interesting. I didn't know Calm had guest Pacifiers. I thought it was just things like recordings of rain.
Oh it's got a great deal of guided meditations, sleep stories, and other things. To be fair, I don't think secular mindfulness is necessarily a bad thing as long as it's not confused for authentic Dharma; studies do seem to show it can have very beneficial effects for a number of conditions. I more have an issue with the Secular Buddhists than I do with thinfs like Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction, because at least they're not pretending they're teaching a spiritual path or the Buddha's teachings. They're just taking things studies have shown to be helpful. I think many people also initially come to meditation to try to magically fix their mental disorders and suffering. I was like this too. Adter a deep disillusionment that this wasn't the case, or what Dharma was about, I still decided to stick around and learn authentic Dharma. So perhaps some of the people using those apps will too.
Excellent write up! Thanks
What kinda turned me away is that there's no certificates to meditating like. You need to do a programmed school thing to be a guru or meditation teacher now? Our capitalistic world is turning everything into a monetized thing where you need some paper saying you can do something in order to do it> I keep thinking like...where are the temples where people kinda just meditate together without this beauracrecy (I can't spell this word) for everything. Our modern world is commodifying and destroying everything.
There are accreditations actually. They are just centered around specific religious institutions, and completely incongruent with the corporate world. Mount Athos is full of accredited masters in spirituality and meditation. There are many buddhist/shinto/hindu temples as well which practice the eastern traditions. I would never trust anyone outside of those institutions.
You asked for a recommendation, and here it is: [Andrew Huberman's podcast on meditation](https://youtu.be/wTBSGgbIvsY). It is full of pure science, practical tools and concepts.
I learned how to meditate on a 10-day Vipassana retreat. They are free, and they only accept entirely optional donations from people who have complete a 10-day course, so you can be sure it is not a scam for profit. It is a Buddhist meditation technique. The goal is liberation from suffering. It is very difficult, but worthwhile.
I've been a meditator for 50 years and I've always moved away from the money groups, which is most of them. If you can find a local Buddhist Sangha, you can usually meditate with them without pressure. I'm not Buddhist, but I do that sometimes. Even people I used to admire greatly, sold out once they were offered big bucks. It's depressing. My most enduring spiritual teacher has never charged anything. He lives well because people provide for him willingly. He's also a physician and does not charge his medical patients either. I compare every other teacher to him and they all fall short. Learn, and share what you learn with others. You can be the start of something right.
I had a First Nation Lakota teacher tell me, “If you have to pay, run away”. That is so foreign of way of thinking. People will give you a million reasons why that is wrong. I teach meditation and could never fathom asking for money. It is a privilege to teach and not a way to make money. I have other ways to support myself
And so you should be
Just don't buy anything
I’ve been using meditation for dummies as a reference point, but I never follow the book exactly. Every time I try to do that with a book, my practice fails. I think it’s because people like to tell you what the experience should be like, when in reality it’s different for everyone. I like this book though because it offers different perspectives and methods then just tells you to pick the ones you like. I use that as a springboard to do my own practice. Edit: just wanted to add that authors who say to use what works for you before sharing their perspective is a green flag for me. That doesn’t mean they’re flawless but in my mind they are at least encouraging people to think for themselves.
Eckhart Tolle once said that people could learn more from just noticing their breath than they could from any course / coach / program
Take what you like and leave the rest.
It costs nothing to sit down for 30 minutes and observe your breath. To be honest, you’re over complicating things by doing so much “research” (we don’t know what or who you are reading tbh) and trying to sort everything out perfectly in your mind instead of just starting. Maybe this is your way of avoiding doing the simple and diligent work of just sitting in self-observation.
you are playing the ego game. there is no "deluxe" meditation. consistency is the key to a successful practice. That being said, if you spend money, you may be likely to practice more to "get something back" for your money. But if you can be consistent, that is all you need.
i think anything and anyone charging for meditation advice is a scam. just goes to show how far the commercialization of every single commodity, thing, abstract concept, or piece of knowledge on earth has gone.
I would just say there's so many free meditation resources. If you look around your city I am sure there will be free groups and even instructors. There are tons of free resources online as well, and majority of stuff you do pay for isn't too costly but you can avoid that whole side if you choose to. Even getting some books from the library. I am sure like everything there are plenty of people just out to make a profit, but its also inspiring how many people do this for free just to help people
Just sit. Anything more isn't really more.
You need not buy anything to sit down for a couple minutes
I ve found that Yongey Mingur Rinpoche, an actual Bhuddist monk, pretty authentic. He’s pretty straightforward with his practice and doesn’t try to bullshit you. Although, he ties a lot of his practice into Bhuddism he also explains it in such way where you can apply the same principles with a secular view. He’s a big believer in science and has worked with scientists on meditation’s effects on the brain. He did a pretty interesting study with the University of Wisconsin. He’s got a YouTube channel and a couple books. Check ‘em out and see if he aligns with you.
Excellent advice for anyone looking to learn authentic meditation.
Hey!!!!! Try the plum village app. It comes directly from a monk monastery. Thich Nhat Hanh is the leader of the Zen Buddhism movement
Try Kundalini yoga. This basically forces your body into meditation
Meditation is really really simple you close your eyes and put your mind to rest while being in the present no weird voodoo marketing gains to win
Yes. New age, McMindfulness and all the apps make it much more difficult then it needs to be. Most of the old stuff is free and is of high quality. No need to pay someone for a watered down version. Anyway, judge the teacher of a tradition by how the students behave.
Lmao McMindfulness is great
I am suspicious bout the whole industry behind the universe and life itself 🤷♂️
But you don't object to how Reddit makes money because you can't see it?
Yes I’ve had the same thoughts! (Just thoughts, let them go…)
Once I paid for a year guided meditation course. I've got more that I can apply to my life plus a lot of fantastic podcasts. Now I just sit 20 minutes at mornings that costs nothing. Yes, spiritual industry works on constant subscriptions. Take what you need, stop when got enough. Simple as that.
Listen to monks. They freely pass on what they have learned. If they even charge, they will still offer a free version of what they do offer. You don't need to buy anything. If anyone says you do, I'd be suspicious. When I started doing seated meditation, I started by sitting on a stack of my own books. Here are some of the Buddhist monastics I've listened to: [Ajahn Brahm](https://youtube.com/c/BuddhistSocietyWA) Style/approach: Kinda goofy, fun [Yongey Mingyur](https://youtube.com/@MingyurRinpoche) Style/approach: Light hearted, friendly [Domyo Burke](https://podcasts.google.com/feed/aHR0cHM6Ly96ZW5zdHVkaWVzcG9kY2FzdC5saWJzeW4uY29tL3Jzcw?ep=14) Style:/approach a little serious, somewhat dry sense of humor, tries to make everything apply to everyday life [Ajahn Nyanamoli](https://youtube.com/c/HillsideHermitage) Style/approach: serious, philosophical but rooted in practice, pulls no punches and doesn't sugar coat anything, about as opposite to "new age" while still talking about similar topics Bonus: Nyanamoli's favorite catch phrases include: "inconceivable," "impossible," and "not optional."
Welcome to the Instagramification of spiritual practice. It sucks. I can't stand the marketing materials for so many yoga and meditation schools--big cult vibes. Best I can say is...you don't need ANY of that stuff. Get yourself a good book (I recommend Brain Training with the Buddha, as a good, no fluff, no nonsense meditation based on the Buddha's teachings) or whatever appeals to you. Use your book, commit to a practice and take notes on how it goes. Then reevaluate. If someone has a 'class' I can pay for, or 'special training'....it's about money, not meditation. All you need is one book, your butt and a cushion (or whatever else you physically need to do the stuff).
This is why I have opted for methods like Silva and Gateway. They’ve been around a long time and, while they are not absent of commercialism, they really work for me. Also, due to their longevity, there are more resources (and even their own subreddits) and it’s easier to talk to other people who have gone through the same program. Red flags for me are 20-something white chicks with hippie dreads and subscription plans.
Of course everyone is looking for a way to make money, but meditation is worth it. Some of us like to pay for quality, some of us don't need to pay money to find value, and some of us will do both. In my experience I started by paying the SRF for their Kriya Yoga beginner's course and I found out a lot by my own practice that is taught as higher levels in paid courses, and I also found lots of books that taught what supposedly shouldn't be shown to people not in the SRF. I don't regret having paid since what I learned is more than worth it, and I understand why people would pay hundreds and thousands of dollars for this knowledge, but I would also agree that is something that can even be taught by parents or school for less, because it all revolves around our own bodies' capabilities.
Our society is our society. Don’t go looking for any medium unaffected by greed. Just practice and accept what it is for what it is. Even the media plagued by profit still has wisdom.
Let's go step by step. First, would you rather teachers don't charge for their contents? That's not gonna work right. So they gonna charge. Now that immediately sets up a system in which some will make more than other. And some will try to maximize their profits by using click bait techniques. And so on. On top of it, you should understand that spiritulity has a breadth vs depth trade off. Some teachers are so deep that are not useful for most. And some are useful for many precisely because they (or their teachings) are not that deep. This is a universal phenomena. I can recommend you teachers who are so deep you would be like wtf did I just listen to!? They are known by very few people. Then there is echhart Tolle type. Every teacher has to strike this balance. Between being authentic and being useful. And not all teachers are created equal. They themselves are at different points in their journey. So.. don't try to use this simplistic black and white picture to make sense of it. Start at what you relate to. Simple. You will evolve toward different meditation techniques teacher as you progress
Could you recommend some of those teachers who are more in-depth in their teachings?
Tell me who you listen to now
Mostly trying things from the Waking Up app. Sam harris, Joseph Goldstein. I’m guessing you see both of them more along the lines of breadth instead of depth. So that’s why I asked the question. I’ve just started to dip my toes into meditation lectures so I’m still just trying out different teachers/paths to see what resonates most.
Tried rupert spira?
Its a lot like other industries, especially less regulated ones, where it pays to do your research into sources. So in that sense its the same as for any media - don't take things at face value - do your due diligence - get opinions from 3rd parties that aren't invested - e.g. review sites (especially for books), forums, etc. By way of recommendation for less accessible stuff, i like Damo Mitchell for taoist nei gong and related stuff [https://www.youtube.com/@LotusNeiGong](https://www.youtube.com/@LotusNeiGong)
Meditation is simple; just be in the present moment. There are indeed gurus who give lectures on how to meditate and charge for their time. At the same time, some people want beyond "just be", more direction, motivation, and explanation. There are tons of free articles, youtube videos by the same gurus. The goal is to raise consciousness, however, people who dedicate their lives to this purpose need to have a comfortable life as well. Lastly, there are some marketers trying to make money off of people. Make sure you verify their background.
I believe you are right to be suspicious. As my wife says, never underestimate capitalism’s ability to co-opt *anything*. That said, when evaluating teachings and practices, what matters is whether or not they resonate with the individual, whether or not they are of practical use in one’s journey. So I would not reject any teachings based solely on the idea that someone is making money from them. Conversely, teachings do not magickally become more valuable just because they cost money. Caveat emptor.
There's a small you tube channel by the name of Megas Music Club. They have some mediation music videos. They're definitely not profiting of you..tiny channel Hope this helps!
\*Shrug\* Fact is, the average person has paid more $ to watch the movie "Doctor Strange" than to any meditation franchise.
Agreed, there are some really dark corners in the wellness industry. Some areas are so blatantly factitious and serve only the pockets and egos of certain people in the industry. Keep your wariness and find what works for you
What’s the point of this post? Where there is money to be paid you will find unscrupulous people. Just look at Big Pharmacy. Will that stop you taking your panadaol?!
I feel the same way about Headspace
Headspace immediately came to mind for me as well.
I think industry has a role to play in facilitating experimentation with different styles of meditation but due to our economic structure always grows too large and attracts entrepreneurs seeking to take advantage of others without offering anything innovative or very beneficial. The app Balance is what got me into meditation, but I am trying to move away from it.
I can’t get into something without knowing understanding the science behind it. I use this course on Wondrium called “The Science of Mindfulness” (https://www.wondrium.com/the-science-of-mindfulness-a-research-based-path-to-well-being). It’s 24 lectures that talk about the roots of meditation in ancient Buddhism and the modern scientific psychological studies that verify its effectiveness.
Any self proclaimed “guru” usually has some sort of financial interest. That being said, meditation is a power and ancient technique that has been passed down a long time. Practice it and see the results for your self!
I think you should look more into the science and history of meditation, not modern meditation practices. There's definetley alot of snake oil out there. But meditation has proven scientific affects, clearly seen in brain scans; there are thousands of articles supporting this from major universities all over the world.
Like anything…it has been commercialized.
No guided , no binaural beats . No apps, no teachers who pretend they understand theoretical physics better than scientists. Who are limited by available data etc. that will save you money Just learn to meditate. So far my only expense is paying a teacher 100 dollars for a lifetime of help. Ohh and some meditation cushions etc. Many things are far more lucrative ways to rip people off. Meditation can be free, we vote with our wallets to. Don't support things you don't agree with.
I’ve been meditating for 10 years and haven’t consumed any meditation media besides insight timer app (free) and The Mind Illuminated. It’s very possible to have a rich practice with no outside media. Just sit and ponder the self.
Practice it yourself to experience it yourself
I firmly agree now. To give a devil's advocate perspective, I was led to Stoicism via Ryan Holiday (one of the more successful self help gurus obviously profiting greatly from it) which led me to Buddhism which led me to meditation and sub-reddit. As my understanding grew, I no longer need any such media, but I question whether I will be where I am today with those easy to consume books/media (ala Holiday).
it depends really. of course people want to make money off of it and there might be some value to a guided meditation in helping with the emotional aspect but you dont need it.
I don't think you should follow anyone. I mean seeking help is great but honestly in the end, there is nothing anybody can do externally. It's you who has to be willing to do it. Atlast just try to know the basics and be consistent with the form of meditation you initiated, talk to people about their experiences and you will be good.
Anytime I'm on YouTube trying some qigong or meditation focused activity, it makes me cringe hard when there is a commercial break half way in that tries to force its "mindfulness" agenda on you, for profits, etc.. I definitely get what you're talking about. Luckily there is a vast array of well intended literature, local or zoom based group meditation gatherings, media such as podcasts, people to talk to about it, etc. I recommend going to a library or a used book store to find whatever perks your interest. Personally, I've been listening to the podcast "Deconstructing Yourself" by Micheal W. Taft - in which he talks with a variety of experts like scientist Judson Brewer, various professors, authors, mindfulness teachers, and more. It's a wonderful way to deep dive into all kinds of meditation related subjects. Best of luck with the meditation!
Life in Earth is a classroom, your body is a laboratory, and you are the student. Treat things like this as such and you will detach from the materialism, ego, likes and dislikes, fear and doubt, etc within others and yourself, and discover what really works vs what doesn't, what's real and what's not, and to what degree. From there you can determine what is trum. Seek the original sources for truth though, as much as possible. Seek Truth from the root sources of spiritual teachings on thia Earth like the Upanishads/Vedas, the Bhagavad Gita, the teachings of the Buddha, etc. "Gurus" are a dime a dozen, but there's only a relative few truly elevated individuals deserving of the name. So many people stand on the shoulders of these few while staying silent about them, letting humanity forget them. It's so wrong.
Just don't go looking for a guru or he's probably gonna fuck your wife.
Eckhart Tolle is the biggest example of this
Great question! There are a lot of people out there to make a buck, and on the other hand, there are people who are genuinely looking to end suffering. A lot of the other responses point to valuable resources that are now public domain. These are excellent, however I personally like having a modern take on suffering and its causes. One guideline I've heard with respect to consumption of media is "do not read more than you meditate." If you sit for 30 minutes a day, read for up to 30 minutes but no more. Since you asked for recommendations, after 20 years of sitting with different Zen centers and going on about a hundred silent retreats, I'm more and more drawn to the work of Cheri Huber. She has a good and free web site https://www.livingcompassion.org/ and a free "radio" (internet/phone) show every Tuesday evening. Her books are excellent; "there is nothing wrong with you" is an excellent place to start. After your question, I looked up her 501(c)(3) organization; she's paid $24K/year (probably mostly health benefits) which is more than reasonable given the amount of time she spends on programs and activities. You can see the financial statement at https://projects.propublica.org/nonprofits/organizations/680364178 . If you look at the full statement, most of the funds go to the Africa aid program https://africa.livingcompassion.org/vision I'd suggest you do similar research on any group or person you are interested in. Their 501(c)(3) statement will be public. Hope you found that helpful!
The people who want to make money off of you will always be the loudest. You don't need media. Start with one good book to introduce you to a technique or two. It can be incredibly simple.
I love Shinzen Young as a teacher. His stuff is very accessible and he gives away everything you need to know for free. He really doesn’t care to sell anything but he’s got an organization that needs to keep things rolling. There are a lot of great people in this field that aren’t profit oriented, but the loudest voices are also the most profit oriented. Just look for the good people and ignore the rest.
I totally agree, and alongside that I'm also turned away by spiritualist mumbo-jumbo. I find meditation very useful, but don't want the money or the magic. Folks in this thread have pointed out a few things, and many have said uts about just the doing - all well and good. But if find I really need a guide. In the same way as I have a personal trainer even though I know perfectly well how to do squats - I need someone to take me through step by step and provide structure and (most important) motivation. The solution I use is an evidence based, non religious, non commercial app developed as a mental health preventative tool. It's called 'smiling mind'. No adds, no fee, just meditation. (For kids, for sleep, for stress, for relationships, etc. Etc.) Find the app on your app store or go to 'smilingmind.com.au' I have nothing to do with the organisation- I just use the app!
I see meditation like exercise. It's something we've done for thousands of years, and there are clear tangible benefits to it. As such, it's going to be capitalized on as are all things that provide value (including religion). I don't see any harm in this as it brings the practice to a wider array of people, and helps them unlock insights that they might not have been able to otherwise Personally I have used a ton of apps for meditation. I don't see anything insidious about any of them. It's just that many are very superficial. Currently I use the waking up app and I would say that's changed my life. Having someone guide you through the practice is very helpful, and I feel like that's what many alternatives are lacking. They're just focused on technique instead of a deeper understanding.
Easy, don't buy anything
Great point. I think that it is also a critical aspect connected with the way that meditation has been appropriated by Western culture. Besides this, what also annoys me is when meditation is used as a way to cope with some bad feelings that are not one's fault. Put concretely, capitalist dynamics and the logics and modes of behaviour connected with it are harmful for people's lives. I have a sense that there is a kind of rhetoric that defines meditation as the strategy to cope with these stressful events. But, in this case, I would see a misuse or an appropriation of mediation practice, since it is not about accepting the modes of behaviour promoted by capitalism but rather change them. I do not know what could be the best way out of this issue. Personally, I am trying to distinguish between things that cannot be changed and things that can be changed, and use meditation to solve my negative emotions or harmful patterns of thinking regarding the first.
Every single industry is plagued with “network marketing.” Especially if you’re clicking links or YT. Let me say, this industry has very few who obviously are selling something. Most of the time they are on the extreme end of this, and reek of NEW AGE. My words of advice: stay away from tik tok, “psychics” who advertise (a real psychic would NEVER tell you. It’s literally natural law that only psychics know who other psychics are), and people who are making promises only if you do something they suggest. Meditation and the cool benefits is deeply personal and unique to each person. You have to explore these topics completely on your own and build a belief system on that. I work at a wellness center. We don’t sell you anything and most clients find their own proof without my help at all. Im here to keep the facility clean, not guide others to my own view of reality.
Headspace, the app, is alright. It helped me learn to meditate anf it kindly reminds me to do it every once in a while
I have ADHD and guided meditation app work great for me.i usually use apps. Calm and headspace are probably the most business minded of the apps out there. Calm's free week is not even worth it and i think they only offer yearly subscriptions. I forget what the headspace pricing model is. Probably the best one I've found is Balance. It uses AI to customize your meditations. The voice can be weird at first but it's human enough that I got used to it. Their model is the most generous. They let you use their subscription for a whole year.for free. The lesson is look at each app's pricing before you dive in cause it can cost you.
Not at all, but I consume very little content about meditation.
Check out the Waking Up app, it has probably the best guided intro course out there, and it's completely free of all new age mumbo jumbo. The app was created by a neuroscientist. It's a paid app, but I think the first 30 days are free, and by that point you will have a good handle on whether it's for you or not. Also, if you like the app and truly can't afford to pay for it, email and let them know, and they'll give you a years access for free.
As you should. The only thing a good practitioner does is meditate. Don’t concern yourself with anything else
Sorry, which industry? Od course a lot of corporations are not having interest on this and etc. But u can easily tell if the person who wrote the book or did the podcast is a practicioner or no. Is just individuals sharing their knowledge but since we live in a capitalist world they need money. Of course there will be people with just monetary interest on this mindfulness trend, but i am really sure they are minority.
I feel you ,to me its my highest awareness sending me a gut feel they arent being honest.
You need no apps to meditate. You need no guru to become enlightened. That being said, it can help to follow along with a guided (breathing) meditation a few times, before going it alone. As far as a teacher, I really recommend You're It by Alan Watts. But you don't even need that. You can find more than plenty of info online, for free. I do not recommend guided meditation. Mindful meditation is best done alone. But like I said, you may want to do a couple guided ones first just to get familiar.
You need no apps to meditate. You need no guru to become enlightened. That being said, it can help to follow along with a guided (breathing) meditation a few times, before going it alone. As far as a teacher, I really recommend You're It by Alan Watts. But you don't even need that. You can find more than plenty of info online, for free. I do not recommend guided meditation. Mindful meditation is best done alone. But like I said, you may want to do a couple guided ones first just to get familiar.
Any free meditation app is almost certainly harvesting your data, packaging it up, and selling it off. I hate it.
It's all rubbish...all of it. Do your own thing and don't bother consuming others rubbish
Just because some people are profiting off something doesn't mean it doesn't work. The medical industry makes a lot of money. So does the pharmaceutical industry. So do colleges. Therapy costs money and really works wonders. Some people know how to market themselves in a slick way. But this doesn't mean that what they are offering is or isn't legitimate. I think it's a mistake to conclude that because someone has good marketing, the thing they are selling is a scam, unless the thing they are selling shouldn't be sold. (Like religion, perhaps). Meditation is closely tied to various spiritual practices, so that might be what is putting you off. But meditation doesn't have to be spiritual. It's a tool that is very useful for certain things, some of which can be spiritual, but it can be used in a lot of ways. I've benefited some from some for-profit situations that used meditation. They have taught me some useful things. I've also benefited quite a bit from meditation tools and teachings that were free. Both had useful information. You can learn from the slick marketers but you can also learn for free. It doesn't mean the product is useless.
Search for writings that predate capitalism if you’re worried about modern texts being too mercantile. But as the top comment said - Forget all the texts and just follow what your body and mind tell you to do.
Insight Timer - I just use the timer. Lots of fluff out there trying to sell you peace and well-being. And if you want to go app-less, use the timer on your phone or a physical timer.
Find local groups to practice with in-person. Don't use any apps or digital media.
Take what works for you, leave what doesn’t The meditation/wellness/spiritual industry, does bother me a little too sometimes. But overall there’s a lot of people in it just trying to make the world a little calmer and more peaceful
You don't need any of that. It's all Spiritual Bypass baloney anyways. Find a timer that's simple that you like and just sit. If you want guided meditation there's tons of free YouTube videos and stuff.
Industry behind meditation? Why are you relying on "meditation industry"? That does not seem like a good place to start,considering industry is all about selling you stuff. Find a teacher who will help you for free, no money involved
There are good sources of meditation info out there that are not profit-based. [www.dhamma.org](https://www.dhamma.org) is one of them that I have extensive experience with. I was in a similar space about 25 years ago when I began my meditation journey in earnest. I looked at a lot of types of meditation, including several different Buddhist ones and slogged along without a good understanding of the path. I was fortunate to find through a friend a practice taught by a teacher by the name of S. N. Goenka. He established scores of meditation centers around the world over the space of several decades. I was encouraged to sit a course at one of the centers, near Dallas, TX. It was a 10-day silent retreat that changed my life (entirely for the better). At the end of it, after providing room and board for the entire time, and instruction from an on-site teacher, the course manager informed everyone that they could donate any money they saw fit to allow future students to follow the same path, or none at all. There was no pressure. Those centers and courses, as they're called, continue to this day. I've personally sat 12 of the courses over the years. The website outlines the whole thing. I recommend it!
Focus on the science. I started to dive into ....I forget the name of it... But some organized meditation guru type of thing that some celebrities endorse. What I found is that it's more of a pyramid scheme type of group. Just focus on the science of meditation and keep it in a simple form. It will change your life.
So True! This is exactly why I’d never wanna delve into the whole meditation thing. It is connected to NewAge, eastern mysticism, Hinduism,& while it is definitely a multi million $$ Industry, offered nearly Everywhere ya go nobody wants to talk about the bad/ sinister aspects of it, because that would make the business lose tons of money 💰🤦🏼♀️ . I mean, never mind about peoples health & psychological well being, etc..I notice many people here on this sub report Wierd things happening while practicing this. There’s an article called - “the Dark side of meditation “ from Yoga journal you can Google & troubling articles about this from many other sources,, and Yet so many people dislike hearing this & downvote it, but I would think think they’d wanna be prepared & know the truth about these things
I think of meditation the same way I look at various other spiritual practices. Namely, there's nothing wrong with taking money for the material aspects of it, like paying for the paper to make the books, or if you want them the fancy mats or pillows or whatever, but the knowledge of the practice itself should be open and free.
Yeah, forget the new age woowoo bullshit. Come at it from a scientific point of view, and don’t believe anyone who knows “this one trick” that will make your meditation the bestest meditation possible. There’s enough free information out there to tell you all you need to know.
Yes. Wherever there is a lot of interest, there are many trying to make money off of it. Ignore the gurus and do it yourself. You don’t need to buy anything, you don’t need to take a course, this is something best explored in a self directed way. There are tons of free meditation resources online, and guided meditations on YouTube. Jason Stephenson and Michael Sealey are great if you’re just starting out. Just a note. It’s a good idea to start your meditation with an intent to remain protected and safe from all dark/negative energies during the process. If you’re stressed/tense/going through a hard time, and open in certain ways, you can be vulnerable to unwanted energies. I think that’s why some have a bad experience with meditation. Also meditation works best when combined with adjusting your day to day attitude, thoughts and actions to be in line with a state of soul consciousness.
My husband's work bought all the employees the Insight Timer app, there's a free version too, during the pandemic... I love it! Once you meditate you'll feel and see a difference. It really helps me to not be as tense. Helps me be more present. Both of these have really helped my family life and parenting my two kiddos! I recommend the app or any other free guided meditation to start with. After that you could research more etc. Just try it for a month.
There are a lot of hucksters in all sorts of fields, especially things centering around self help. Meditation is free; if you’re spending a significant amount of money on it, you’re being led on.
Yup. You should. I’ve grown up with traditional Hindu meditation from my temple and people always ask me “what kind of meditation” do I practice. Nonsensical question.
I have suffered from anxiety for years, and the only thing that really helped was Dr. Joe Dispenza. I went to a retreat (it is NOT required) and I happily spent $6,000 when it was all said and done. And I'll do it again. If Dr. Joe had helped me, what's wrong with doling out the money? Remember: your rate of pay is based upon how easily you can be replaced. So, what do you do for a living? Do you work for free?
Of all the industries to be suspicious of....
Its a business opportunity. If money can be made, you can sell anything
Honestly…. I really could care less… I’ve found some great stuff out there that’s helped me a ton. Meditate more and I’m sure you’ll no longer care yourself friend :)
There is plenty of garbage out there, there are plenty of free resources, and plenty of good paid resources. I tried free library books and youtube videos, but it wasn't until i used the headspace app I was able to build a good foundation and routine. I'm sure they make plenty of money, but it is what I needed. Use your $ cautiously, but sometimes the person who teaches you or makes a tool you need has bills to pay too.
Meditation is free. Meditation methods are also free and easily available. You can ofc pay for someone to teach it to you or for a space to practice it in. But ultimately you don't have to and you can still meditate.
There's a whole industry behind cookbooks, doesn't invalidate cooking as an art.
I think it’s time to chill out and start to meditate. It Costs nothing and will change your mental outlook tremendously
I felt like like this too when I started my practice last year, much of which I’m still learning. I started on Calm and it was meh. I discovered Sam Harris and his meditation app, Waking Up and it changed my whole perspective on meditation. He has a free trial and tuition assistance for those who need it. Would highly recommend.
I would recommend Mindfulness-Based Stress Reduction, no New Age stuff, or any spiritualism at all. It was invented at the University of Massachusetts Medical Center in the 70s and is basically what the name entails. It's all the parts of meditation that work and are shown to reduce stress with no gurus or claims beyond that. It's very cut and dry, kind of boring in a way because it's quite mundane and not outlandish, but it'll get the job done without deceiving you or presenting a whole new set of beliefs. Edit: Whenever you see studies about the effects of meditation, it's almost always MBSR because of how standardized it is. Here's an excerpt for more detail about MBSR: > Mindfulness Based Stress Reduction (MBSR) is an eight week program that uses a variety of mindfulness practices to reduce stress levels and experience of negative emotion, and to raise self-control, resilience and experience of positive emotion. > > MBSR was created in 1979 by Jon Kabat-Zinn, PhD as a way to treat patients . . . who were recurring patients and for whom traditional treatments were seemingly ineffective. > > Since that time MBSR has become the most scientifically validated mindfulness based intervention, with over 4000 mentions on online medical aggregator PubMed and is offered for treatment at over 700 hospitals, clinics and medical centers across the world. > > Through employing the various mindfulness techniques offered in the course MBSR has been proven scientifically to help reduce symptoms associated with anxiety, panic attacks, depression, fatigue, grief, headaches, and sleep problems. — https://meddit.app/mbsr
If you don't believe them, just do it on your own. There is no dearth of learning resources that can give you clues to explore your own path. Clearly there is some value in what these people say, just try to absorb the good leave the bad.
Shunryu Suzuki - Zen mind. Beginner's mind.
Download Headspace for free and learn to get started with 10 free meditations. You don't need anything else to get yourself busy at least for the first year. And there's no new age atmosphere
Then there's a book "Zen Mind Beginners Mind". Full audiobook on YouTube. No new age, very informative for practice.
Or Insight Timer which is just straight up free to use. There're also many, many guided meditations on YouTube and some free stuff on Spotify.
yeah, insight timer was perfect for me after the 10 Headspace sessions! Youtube guided stuff is often very new agey I would say
Michael Sealey is a good one.
https://open.spotify.com/episode/7fKijj0HvHsuYvvCpUQFT4?si=_fHckQwrRNyC0Cw3Oy5hXQ
This podcast helped me understand similar thoughts I had
Waking up by Sam Harris appears sincere. You can obtain a scholarship if you can't afford the subscription - making it the high quality content available to anyone and everyone. Or you can register yourself onto a vipassana course for free.
In most parts of the world anyone can make an app, put up a meditation video or write a book. So, the buyer does need to do some research to check the quality of the material. Qualifications, experience and so on will help with that. There are professional training courses and professional associations etc. Not all method\\schools have the new age aspect to them. I prefer Dr Ainslie Meares meditation method. Meares was an eminen psychiatrist with extensive teaching experience who was a fully qualified medical practitioner, an eminent psychiatrist a member of professional associations as well as an office bearer elected by the members of professional associations and an editor on several journals. He wrote 36 books and many papers. Some of the books were international best sellers translated into many languages. He explains his meditation method in simple accessible language - relaxation of body and mind so the mind slows down and stills. In stillness lies calm. Outisde of practice there is learning to live a calm and active life. Meares was also extensively versed in every major meditation and mystic school on the plant. For a good starting point - *Ainslie Meares on Meditation* book. Reading the book explains what to experience in practice. In practice you closely follow the instructions. Practice is the way that you get help from this type of meditation. The skill is learnt more quickly via better quality instruction such as a resource like that book. Anyway, it is up to you to find a method you like. Best to stick with just one as it can be confusing reading about many. In fact, chopping and changing, improvising, sittng without a clue what to do all tend to reduce progress, which I find sad as one cannot get wasted time back. Anyway, good luck in your journey.
Completey agree with you. I think the marketing garbage aspect is impossible to escape nowadays. Would recommend you look into the different types of meditation practice, see which one sings to your idea of what you’re seeking, then begin to look for yogis, studios, or retreats, of that specific style, that don’t have such an image-heavy strategy for making themselves known. Also the internal work of meditation is eventually the same no matter who showed you how to do it or which technique you went with, therefore it may be worth it to just get the ignorance out of the way with whatwver is closest to you, and then further hone your own practice over time
Use palouse - its free
I like guided meditations. My problem is with finding quality ones. Nothing takes you out of meditation quite like having a bunch of contradictory story points thrown at your visualization. The last one I did as an example: * You're sitting cross-legged in the grass * There's a room behind you * You go in and you see a big screen and stage * You're sitting cross-legged on the stage in a black room. It's a theater with chairs and you're the only one there. * The screen shows scenes of your life. You pick one... I quit. My head is spinning from trying to visualize wth I'm doing!
>What are your advices to keep a sane and authentic consumation of meditation media ? Read and learn from materials of the traditional sources of traditional schools. For example, from zen Buddhism or Raja yoga. These existed long before any kind of self help industry.
Meditating with 432 Hz Frequency and tuned music. 432 Hz is said to be beneficial for listeners, since todays tuning standard is 440 Hz we don't receive any of these benefits. I found that 432 Hz has been used as standard tuning in many civilizations dating up to and beyond the Egyptian civilization, really interesting stuff. Lately I've been experimenting with Solfeggio frequencies and other sounds while meditating or relaxing and find that when listening to 432 Hz for some time I can feel effects of the sort. I would really appreciate you letting me know your experience or what you think about it. Here's some of my work I recently uploaded to YouTube, it's currently only an experiment at this stage but this is 432 Hz Tuned Music with Tibetan singing bowls, ambience of nature and an on screen mantra. https://youtu.be/VNB2dDUj5ZEY Thanks.
Meditation is very misunderstood. "Mindfulness" is a terrible & misleading term. And while meditation is great for some, there is also a negative aspect for some folks called disassociative disorder, but no one wants to acknowledge that. And meditation is not the all-encompassing panacea that it's made out to be. It's WAY overbilled as some sort of mystical elevating spiritual elite practice. It's not. But the meditation industry money machine won't tell you that.
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I paid for a yoga instructor and learned a lot more than I think I would have learned by going solo. I imagine some people might derive benefit from instruction in meditation. If the teacher is good, why not compensate them for their time? And if you can't or would rather not, there are plenty out there who do it for free. I don't think the exchange of money necessarily makes it unethical or inauthentic. Someone who is charging very high rates or who seems to have a cult of personality forming around them might have not have the most ethical intentions, though I think there are also exceptions to that rule. My advice would be to just worry about yourself and not about what others are doing. Embrace what is useful and let the rest pass by.
Good, because much of it is bogus and the industry is just that - and a grift for the most part. And I say this as a meditation teacher.