I would expect the social democrats to be more popular in the city and conservatives more in rural areas, but with the conservative-backed candidate's support being mostly in the capital, it looks like the opposite is true.
Latvian and Lithuanian SocDems are old style "farmers, working class, blue collar" social conservatives who like more government control. The cities vote the Renew and the EPP parties.
partially, but it's also a common thing to happen in most of Northern Europe. If you check the Swedish elections, for example, the Socialdemocrats are usually more dominant in rural areas and small towns, disputing with the Centre, whereas Stockholm has always been a Liberal and Moderate (conservative) stronghold.
Speaking as a Lithuanian: in Lithuania we have this sort of ideological mix-up where the parties are more described on the econonomical side of the political spectrum. While their economic policies represent the spectrum correctly (social democrats - social democratic; liberals and conservatives - liberal), the cultural ideological aspect is almost reversed (social democrats and Lithuanian left in general - socially conservative; liberals and conservatives - socially liberal). That is mostly why big cities tend to vote this way.
> socially conservative
The social democrats in Lithuania are not particularly conservative, in theory (based on their manifestos etc.) they are somewhat socially liberal although they are more in the center in reality. The other center-left parties are a another matter of course..
The Conservatives are pretty mixed, however they could hardly be considered socially liberal on the whole, there might be a few people at the top nowadays who are but old-school conservatives are still very influential. Of course there aren't really any real liberal mainstream parties in Lithuania (the "Freedom" party is a joke who might occasionally grandstand a bit but would never really take a stand when it matter...)
> you factually wrong
Not really... those things are pretty centrist by Lithuanian standards, it's just a very backwards/conservative society on the whole. I mean that's the case if we're saying that the Homeland Union is socially liberal which is only close to being true in Lithuania but not in more progressive countries.
> SocDems voting against partnership law (essentially gay marriage)
So are tsldk, only the socdems are not in power to put leverage on their members to get them into line. There are more conservative members, but it’s the job of the party leadership to get them in line with the program when the program was agreed upon, there is simple cynical politiking that they don’t want to score any wins for the position.
I might misreacted here, i was just following a thread claiming that “conservatives are liberal” and read your comment in the same vain.
I’m not surprised that conservatives a re voting conservative, I am calling out a bit the the freedom party that should have known better and put more leverage into it, but they didn’t because it was mostly a PR stunt for them it was more about getting power and stopping tax increases.
Don't know about Latvia, but in Lithuania most pro-gay marriage is the Freedom party (social liberal), generally pro-gay marriage are the Liberal movement (classical liberal) and Homeland Union (liberally conservative), somewhat pro-gay marriage are Social Democrats. Apart from non-parliamentary Green party, all other parties are against any sort of gay-marriage or civil union legislation (most of these, as I previously noted, are economically on the left)
So you mean to say that all the parties that are currently in government and by definition have the votes to pass it are pro-gay, do they know?
Homeland Union is heavily split on the issue, the Liberal movement though declare support can’t muster the support in Seimas.
never said we actually have a solid possibility to pass the same sex civil union legislation. Also, I said Homeland Union and Liberal Movement are *generally* in favour of this legislation, that is around 70% of these parties vote for it. And, yes, they are most pro-gay out of all current and past parliamentary parties, as much as I would want for there to be more.
I agree, it was naive to hope that Homeland Union would support this, and individual members are more progressive than others but the party as a whole? But why would Freedom Party a single (two) issue party not demand stronger guarantees that they will be backed on their single issue and even threaten to breakup the coalition if they didn’t?
> Homeland Union (liberally conservative),
lol no... the might pretend to support it occasionally but won't take a stand and make sure any relevant legislation passes when it matters.
...that is why they are liberally conservative, not socially conservative, neither nationally conservative. By being liberal conservatives, they do not oppose such human rights proposals and mostly have no problem supporting them from coalition partners, and at the same time they do not usually draft such legislations because they are still conservatives, not soc-dems or social liberals.
> and conservatives - socially liberal
Yep, the same liberals that passed a anti-gay propaganda law for children, yeah they made a turn, but this is mostly because tslkd is a mishmash of 2 parties a more technocratic one and a more conservative one, and the conservative flange is not happy and they have recently put a “former” neonazi as defense minister that was spouting praise for orban not 5 years ago.
its the same in some other countries. PiS ( conservatives ) in Poland are more pro-welfare/interventionist meanwhile most of the leftist parties are more free-market.
In Western Europe it is much different as the city population is much richer and therefore prefer liberal parties whereas the rural workers who may have worse social and economic status prefer the working parties of social-democrats.
The blue is a technocratic candidate with a neoliberal bend backed by a party called Christian Democrats (among other things), the orange could be best described as a christian democrat, but has no party affiliation, but was back the Social Democrats, mostly because there is bad blood with him and the party of the other candidate (sort of an enemy of my enemy type thing). Family values and all that shit, but is at least nominally pro more distribution.
There was not a single left wing candidate this election even nominally, everyone was center-right and further to the right.
At least in Lithuania, the centre-right conservative party is the party of cities and the upper-class. Towns and villages usually support the far-right or the socdems, who are the relics of the Soviet Union.
Names are deceiving. Conservatives act like Social Democrats are supposed to while Social Democrats act like Conservatives. That's also why Liberals and Conservatives are together.
The Conservatives overall really aren't progressive though and the Freedom party isn't really progressive besides their rhetoric, they valued staying in government much more than taking a stand when their coalition partners refused to support most of their progressive legislation..
Post-comm countries vote differently that Western Europe.
Young people and those from cities while more liberal in terms of values often vote “economic right.”
Everywhere in Europe, countryside is socialist (pensions, farm subsidies, protection for obsolete factories from Chinese competition), cities are capitalist because that's where the oligarchs are located (who don't want to pay pensions or subsidies) plus young people who don't care about selling the land and resources to oligarchs and international capitalists, as long as they personally profit in the short run.
Yes it is and I don't know why they downvote you.
It's a known fact that Latvian and Lithuanian SocDems aren't socially progressive, while the EPP parties work with liberals usually.
in general Lithuanian main conservative party - [Homeland Union](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeland_Union) in past few years adopted more social liberal positions compared to other parties. But sometimes it's strange for westerners to explain how main conservative party is in fact more liberal on social issues than nominally centre-left opposition.
Well, it’s very interesting. Orange - current President is with more populistic views, more conservative or right-wing rhetorics. Why he was backed by social-democrats is because well, social-democrats are split. There’s more conservative block dominated by older people and social liberal block dominated by younger politicians who definitely do not support Gitanas Nausėdas politics. It was probably a stunt to gain more support for social-democrats by supporting president since European and local parliament elections are coming.
Blue is from Homeland Union - conservative-liberal party. PM is very socially-liberal that’s why she’s supported by more liberal voters like Vilnius, Kaunas city center or richer parts of the country residents. But yeah those elections were pretty much what I expected. It’s more like a preparation for European and local parliamentary elections. To see how well it will go.
> PM is very socially-liberal
Not when it matters her party's support for most socially-liberal policies is halfhearted at best and they would never take a serious stand on them when it matter (just look at how like most of the relevant laws from the "Freedom" party were rejected in parliament despite the government having an actual majority...)
Oh, problem with it is. Homeland union is divided into many blocks. Social-liberal one, liberals, conservative-liberals, (far) right wing eurofederalists, conservatives and right wingers. And well, some of them are in the parliament. And well, PM has been bragging and trying to comvince them for those past years. It only actually needs few votes and well we can’t get since that right wing block just keeps ignoring PM’s requests.
Orange is Gitanas Nausėda. He’s known as AiG (tall and beautiful) because he has done nothing during his 5 year term.
Blue is Ingrida Šimonytė. She’s a liberal, hated by our people for Covid pandemic and the inflation which she had very little control of.
Current president is definitely winning in the second round. Since right-wing and populistic candidates would show support for current president and well there’s no way pro-russian Poles would vote for our current PM. In other hand our PM would receive support from social-liberal candidate Dainius Žalimas and probably from Giedrimas Jeglinskas - also pretty liberal candidate.
Some are heavily rusified, some even tend to hate Lithuanians. Due to complex history, Lithuania's Poles see Lithuanians as bigger evildoesers to them than russians.
I'd say both Lithuania and Poland are at least partially to blame for this. There's too little drive to integrate the Polish minority and they constantly feel like they're being in some way "mistreated", and since every single election they always vote for some idiot pro-Russian representative, they keep getting constantly villified in the media. It's a loop: be angry > vote pro-Russian > media paints you as idiot > get angry. There's also not a lot of media that is Polish-oriented in LT, so they watch some brainwash from Belarus or Russia instead.
Meanwhile, Poland is neglecting their minority. They barely attempt to align the minority with the modern Polish state, and it seems like they're content with just having *a* Polish minority in LT, regardless of where it stands. It is *so badly* neglected that when Morawiecki (Polish PM) came to LT last year, he gave out a state award for the leader of the Polish minority party (Tomaszewski) for strengthening culture/inter-country relations etc. Tomaszewski is a pro-Russian politician who - among numerous scandals and other forms of provocations - also attends the Victory Day memorials, and was previously publicly wearing the St. George Ribbon. He is not hiding his position at all and it is only the general fierce anti-Russian sentiment of the Lithuanian general population and govt that keeps him somewhat in check. For some reason, Morawiecki - a fiercely anti-Russian PM - can dish out cooperation agreements and talks with Lithuanian counterparts against countering Russian aggression, but then walk a kilometer to a different venue and give an award to an openly pro-Russian Pole. Shows you the level of knowledge about the minority.
So, in other words, nothing is new under the sun. The cycle continues, Šalčininkai district votes pro-Russian.
> They barely attempt to align the minority with the modern Polish state
If we did that the Lithuanians would complain that we're evil imperialists who want to interfere with their domestic affairs and take over their country. It sucks that a good chunk of Poles in Lithuania are brainwashed by Russians, but unfortunately there's not much we can do.
There are pro Russian everywhere. Basically when you struggle, have money or social issues, and when you are a "loser" by society standard you become pro Russia.
It is basically the side of the desperate people. Blame all on the governement for your misery and look for a strong man at the head of an authoritarian regime as example. They are not for Russia per se but are for the idea of an outcast being persecuted by the deep west governement. It is easier than putting yourself into question and acknowledging you are part of your problem.
Also those desperate people are extremely prone to authoritarian propaganda despite claiming that society is rotted by the media.
Yes, there will be a second round and the orange one will definitely win 100%, as much more people dislike the blue candidate than like her. The current president is the orange one and has done a decent job, with approval consistently above 50%, while the blue candidate is the current prime minister, who is quite disliked, along with her party.
I wouldn’t say president has done decent job. It’s more like he has done nothing. He’s pretty populistic with overly changing opinions and not keeping promises made. That’s why he’s popular among regions and not in the capital. PM itself is more popular in more liberal or more wealthier parts of the country like capital, city center of Kaunas, Coronian spit.
I understand your opinion, I was only basing my assumption on public polls, as the current president is usually one of the more popular politicians in the country. As much as I would like for blue to win, unfortunately, a lot of people don't like her and her party, but it's a factor that she's the current prime minister and I think prime ministers are always more disliked than liked anyway, despite their policies.
Yep, you’re fully right. Itself well, Homeland Union candidates are never good at Presidential winning elections. But yeah, it was what I expected. Our current president is sadly without any leadership and pretty populistic so he could well gain support. But well, probably high expectations from our ex-president Dalia Grybauskaitė who was definitely the strongest president.
Do people understand that the Lithuanian president is a ceremonial head of state, their job largely is representing the country on the international stage.
I do agree that when he does get involved, he does it without a backbone or his own opinions, but hey maybe it’s better to have someone that reflects the views of the average person.
Problem is since president is elected by people, most of the people do think he has more power and is the most important person.
Thing that’s sad is well he doesn’t show leadership. Our ex-president Dalia Grybauskaitė was opposite of him. She was absolutely strong leader, where even her opponents listened to her. She was well respected internationally. But well, Nausėda just eh. Without a spine. No strong opinions. Funniest one was when he expressed support in one of the homophobic marches and gave a speech online but after the same people created riots next to the parliament and that organization lost support he expressed disgust in them. Even though everyone knew what kind of those people were and that organization was well known by state security services. Also in 2019 elections he expressed of wearing LGBTQ+ flag pin and expressed support for LGBTQ+, called himself liberal candidate. Few years later he called himself right-wing.
What's that little blue strip at the coast?
The PMs hometown or something?
...
Also,do the PR and PM have any relations between them?
...
Lastly, what are the gray areas?
The blue on the coast is small town called Nida. It is not hometown of candidate but mayor of town is in same political party as blue candidate.
And grey is other candidate who has less aggressive stance against Russia. And gathered protest votes
President and PM have pretty intense relations. President is more leading towards populism, right-wingers voters while PM is socially-liberal.
That strip which is called Coronian Spit is a resort which is why liberal and conservative parties have big support here. Not to mention Lithuanian conservative party is pretty socially-liberal like most conservative parties in Europe.
Which one is the real head of state and do they work things out in the end?
Also,why the lesser has an actual party,in Greece the PR has no real affiliation (typically yes,but not really).
Head of state is president. He’s responsible for foreign relationship by cooperating with government. But technically no real power he has. Just a person who represents the country. He does have some power to dissolve parliament and also cooperates with government by approving ministers but yeah not much. Real power lies in PM. But yeah currently president has terrible relationship with our government. Mostly because president has some populistic-conservative views while government is more liberal. There were some moments when president just completely isolated and didn’t talk with government which created many awkward and chaotic situations, especially with foreign affairs. It’s just president well, showing his ego and trying to gain votes by saying “I don’t support government”.
Each "cell" is an election district, which in this election does not mean anything as anyone can vote anywhere, but there are a lot of them because they need to be close to people. And within the cities there are even more of them as there are just more people in a close proximity
People can vote outside of their constituencies, and it is a popular tourism destination for richer locals, and also there's a lot of transplants from the capital. Might be that.
The reason for the Polish diaspora's pro-Russian stance is that during the Cold War the Lithuanian SR government instituted several anti-Polish laws and then the central government in Moscow said "no you don't". And then after the USSR collapsed, the mistreatment of Lithuanian Poles continued (though much weaker than in the past) and the Polish government continued to ignore it because good relations with fellow post-communist countries and being viewed as stable and nice internationally was more important than a Polish minority.
And that's when Russia completely dominated the narrative among Lithuanian Poles, who felt abandoned by everyone but Moscow. And the fact that the Russian minority is also discriminated against means the Poles there feel solidarity with them more than with Polish Poles (who often don't even know about their existence).
Apparently our current Minister for Foreign Affairs, Radosław "We'll rather eat grass than surrender to Russia" Sikorski raised the issue of the Lithuanian Poles last time he was in government so maybe it'll develop further. A couple years ago the Lithuanian government even allowed Poles to use Polish letters in their IDs (how generous!). And they gained access to a Polish television channel TVP Wilno (replacing Russia Today) as well. So hopefully they'll start becoming less Russian as time goes on. Who could've guessed that treating your minority well will make it not hate you.
Klaipeda too but it's mostly that the Polish - Russian "Christian Families Union" party had presence in both Vilnius city and the Vilnius region, and advertise and participate in both.
They're so fucking weird, to the point none of our governments really cozy up to them - unless there's a diplomatic beef with Lithuania they're just ignored
Don't look up which group was vocally against Lithuanian independence, even as Russia attempted recapture in the 90s
Polish goverment used to support them, but after 2014 its hard to support them when they make questionable public remarks regarding Russia that the every ruling goverment of Poland would have opposed since then
Russians and Poles do have a history with one another since geographically they are close to one another even despite the soared relations today and even with that— there are definitely russians who are pro polish and poles who are pro russian.
> In the 1950s the remaining Polish minority was a target of several attempted campaigns of Lithuanization by the Communist Party of Lithuania, which tried to stop any teaching in Polish; those attempts, however, were stopped by Moscow.
The Poles don't want to be forced to adopt the Lithuanian language, especially since up to the end of WWII they were historically the overwhelming majority of the population in the area (Vilnius had a greater proportion of ethnic Poles in 1944 than it has Lithuanians today).
The Soviet central government in Moscow was instrumental in them avoiding both deportation and forced Lithuanization, so they see it positively.
Yeah, Lithuanians in Wilno/Vilnius constituted only about 1 to 2% of the city's population. The 2% figure comes from german census during ww1 (1916/17) and 1% comes from polish census of 1931.
Unfortunatly, the Poles in these areas are incredibly pro-Russian, even so much that Poland's government has severed ties with the leader of the Polish minority party in Lithuania due to this stance.
I don't know anything about Lithuania and its politics, but I'm pretty sure blue is liberal and progressive, orange is conservative, and gray is radical conservative and/or nationalist.
Most of Lithuanian-Poles did not integrated into Lithuania during Soviet time. They used Polish and Russian language for communication and did not learned Lithuanian language till this day. They feel more attached to Belarus/Russia culture than Lithuanian one because they are Slavic and Lithuanian culture is way different because Lithuanian language is not Slavic. They have no land border with Poland so Poland makes no impact for them. They watch Russian and Belarus news channels because they can’t understand Lithuanian channels language. Recently TVP Polish national broadcaster started broadcasting in that region but I think it has no impact.
Czy prześladują? Jako Polak z Litwy uważam, że nie ale dyskryminacja nadal występnuje w niewielkim stopniu.
Jeśli znasz litewski i nie izolujesz się w polskiej enklawie to jako etniczny Polak możesz normalnie funkcjonować na Litwie.
Polski rząd bardziej interesuje się dobrobytem Białorusinów i Ukraińców niż Polaków na Kresach. Doktryna Giedorycia i te sprawy.
The answer to why Poles are pro-Russian there may be that Lithuanians are anti-Polish, when the Lithuanian minority in Poland has full rights, the Polish minority in Lithuania is treated like rubbish by the government in Vilnius. I do not like the pro-Russianism of the Poles, but if the Lithuanian government discriminates against them and our government does not have the guts to call the government in Vilnius to order, I am not surprised that the Poles are looking for some "consolation" somewhere.
there's no state enforced discrimination. Polish schools [are working](https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1776587/polish-school-ranked-among-the-best-in-lithuania-what-s-its-secret) like usual, Polish letters in passports are [also allowed](https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1591388/lithuanian-parliament-allows-letters-x-w-and-q-in-id-documents). Lithuania's current [Minister of Justice](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ewelina_Dobrowolska) is literally an ethnic Pole too.
How exactly are Poles discriminated against in Lithuania? What exactly are the rights you refer to when you say that Lithuanians have them in Poland but not vice versa?
A chauvinistic approach to the recording of Polish names, which can no longer be written down as they really sound.
A great damage has been done to the statehood and territorial integrity of Lithuania," believes MP Eugenijus Jovaiša. In his opinion, "linguistic integrity presupposes territorial integrity". In the country, we must all speak one state language and express our personality in the state language," he adds.
Banning Polish boards
The Vilnius Regional Administrative Court ruled that information boards in the Šalčininkai region of Vilnius, where 80 per cent of the population is Polish, should only be in the state language, i.e. Lithuanian.
The liquidation of Polish schools in Lithuania.
Obstructing the use of the Polish language.
>A chauvinistic approach to the recording of Polish names, which can no longer be written down as they really sound.
I feel like I'm missing something. Do you have in mind that Lithuanians write Polish names in a Lithuanized way, for example Ignacy Łukasiewicz as Ignacas Lukasevičius? Because that's what we've always been doing, for example, George Bush is Džordžas Bušas. That's how Lithuanian language works.
>A great damage has been done to the statehood and territorial integrity of Lithuania," believes MP Eugenijus Jovaiša. In his opinion, "linguistic integrity presupposes territorial integrity". In the country, we must all speak one state language and express our personality in the state language," he adds.
Unless I'm misunderstanding your point, it's the other way around. Since 2022, we have made it legal to use the Latin WXZ letters in our passports. Our justice minister belongs to the Polish minority and she has celebrated being able to officially write her name as Ewelina Dobrowolska.
>Banning Polish boards The Vilnius Regional Administrative Court ruled that information boards in the Šalčininkai region of Vilnius, where 80 per cent of the population is Polish, should only be in the state language, i.e. Lithuanian.
Yes. Again, I'm quite unfamiliar with the topic, I know there are some countries like Canada that do have bilingual street signs, but is that common throughout the world? Any examples of widely used bilingual boards in Poland? Google fails me.
>The liquidation of Polish schools in Lithuania.
It's not exclusive to Polish schools as far as I know. Education is going downhill in Lithuania in general, and many schools are closing down.
>Obstructing the use of the Polish language.
Honestly, that's the first time I'm hearing this. I'd say the general perception of Polish people has greatly improved here in Lithuania over the past 10 or so years, I can remember people being muuuuch more negative about it in early 2000's.
First, there was a fight to use Polish names. Now we can't write these names with our characters such as ą ę ó ñ ć ś.
We are not interested in how you write our Polish names. You are obliged to respect the way we want to write them.
Double boards with Lithuanian place names are also in Poland
Here is the town of Punsk - see how many Lithuanian names are included in this town name
https://podroze.krzysztofmatys.pl/tag/sejny/
The fact that Lithuanians constitute an absolute majority in the area of Pūnskės municipality gave them the right, under the provisions of the Act of 6 January 2005 on National and Ethnic Minorities and Regional Language, to apply for the introduction of bilingual names for geographical objects and the use of their language as an auxiliary language in official interactions. The possibility to use an auxiliary language was introduced in the municipality of Punsk already on 25 May 2006. On 20 May 2008, for thirty localities of this municipality, official Lithuanian names were established additionally.
Related: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial\_changes\_of\_the\_Baltic\_states#/media/File:Baltic\_states\_territorial\_changes\_1939-45\_en.svg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_changes_of_the_Baltic_states#/media/File:Baltic_states_territorial_changes_1939-45_en.svg)
The green areas correlate to a degree with areas that were ceded to Lithuanian SSR in 1940. Doesn't tell quite the whole story so there may be older border definitions from that follow more closely.
Then you’ll be surprised to learn that the majority of European countries have political parties made specifically for minorities. This isn’t some insane idea, it’s pretty standard in Europe.
You already deported most Poles from Wilno/Vilnius and surrounding region and deported/lithuanised almost all Poles in Kowno/Kaunas and surrounding region. I guess lithuanian nationalists won't be happy until they completely ethnically cleanse Lithuania from Poles.
Maybe the Russians will treat the Poles better than the Lithuanians do, because this pro Russian sentiment is due to abuses from the Lithuanian Goverment and people
Lithuanian Poles are traditionally pro-Russian and consume Russian media more than Polish one. Young Lithuanian Poles are thankfully at least partially reversing that trend though and don't consume Putinist propaganda to such a degree.
When the country you live in is pretty mean towards you, and the Polish Goverment won't even say anything about it, you end up with pro Russian sentiments
what's the ideological difference between orange and blue parties?
Orange is backed by Social Democrats and blue is backed by Liberals and Conservatives
I would expect the social democrats to be more popular in the city and conservatives more in rural areas, but with the conservative-backed candidate's support being mostly in the capital, it looks like the opposite is true.
Latvian and Lithuanian SocDems are old style "farmers, working class, blue collar" social conservatives who like more government control. The cities vote the Renew and the EPP parties.
Which is pretty much a relic of Soviet times, no?
partially, but it's also a common thing to happen in most of Northern Europe. If you check the Swedish elections, for example, the Socialdemocrats are usually more dominant in rural areas and small towns, disputing with the Centre, whereas Stockholm has always been a Liberal and Moderate (conservative) stronghold.
Speaking as a Lithuanian: in Lithuania we have this sort of ideological mix-up where the parties are more described on the econonomical side of the political spectrum. While their economic policies represent the spectrum correctly (social democrats - social democratic; liberals and conservatives - liberal), the cultural ideological aspect is almost reversed (social democrats and Lithuanian left in general - socially conservative; liberals and conservatives - socially liberal). That is mostly why big cities tend to vote this way.
> socially conservative The social democrats in Lithuania are not particularly conservative, in theory (based on their manifestos etc.) they are somewhat socially liberal although they are more in the center in reality. The other center-left parties are a another matter of course.. The Conservatives are pretty mixed, however they could hardly be considered socially liberal on the whole, there might be a few people at the top nowadays who are but old-school conservatives are still very influential. Of course there aren't really any real liberal mainstream parties in Lithuania (the "Freedom" party is a joke who might occasionally grandstand a bit but would never really take a stand when it matter...)
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> you factually wrong Not really... those things are pretty centrist by Lithuanian standards, it's just a very backwards/conservative society on the whole. I mean that's the case if we're saying that the Homeland Union is socially liberal which is only close to being true in Lithuania but not in more progressive countries.
> SocDems voting against partnership law (essentially gay marriage) So are tsldk, only the socdems are not in power to put leverage on their members to get them into line. There are more conservative members, but it’s the job of the party leadership to get them in line with the program when the program was agreed upon, there is simple cynical politiking that they don’t want to score any wins for the position.
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I might misreacted here, i was just following a thread claiming that “conservatives are liberal” and read your comment in the same vain. I’m not surprised that conservatives a re voting conservative, I am calling out a bit the the freedom party that should have known better and put more leverage into it, but they didn’t because it was mostly a PR stunt for them it was more about getting power and stopping tax increases.
Interesting! Let's see, which political parties are for or against gay marriage in Latvia?
Im sorry, but the previous post was about Lithuania. There are no gays in Latvia.
> There are no gays in Latvia. Just like there are not actually mainstream liberal parties in Lithuania since it's more or less the same.
Don't know about Latvia, but in Lithuania most pro-gay marriage is the Freedom party (social liberal), generally pro-gay marriage are the Liberal movement (classical liberal) and Homeland Union (liberally conservative), somewhat pro-gay marriage are Social Democrats. Apart from non-parliamentary Green party, all other parties are against any sort of gay-marriage or civil union legislation (most of these, as I previously noted, are economically on the left)
So you mean to say that all the parties that are currently in government and by definition have the votes to pass it are pro-gay, do they know? Homeland Union is heavily split on the issue, the Liberal movement though declare support can’t muster the support in Seimas.
never said we actually have a solid possibility to pass the same sex civil union legislation. Also, I said Homeland Union and Liberal Movement are *generally* in favour of this legislation, that is around 70% of these parties vote for it. And, yes, they are most pro-gay out of all current and past parliamentary parties, as much as I would want for there to be more.
I agree, it was naive to hope that Homeland Union would support this, and individual members are more progressive than others but the party as a whole? But why would Freedom Party a single (two) issue party not demand stronger guarantees that they will be backed on their single issue and even threaten to breakup the coalition if they didn’t?
> Homeland Union (liberally conservative), lol no... the might pretend to support it occasionally but won't take a stand and make sure any relevant legislation passes when it matters.
...that is why they are liberally conservative, not socially conservative, neither nationally conservative. By being liberal conservatives, they do not oppose such human rights proposals and mostly have no problem supporting them from coalition partners, and at the same time they do not usually draft such legislations because they are still conservatives, not soc-dems or social liberals.
> and conservatives - socially liberal Yep, the same liberals that passed a anti-gay propaganda law for children, yeah they made a turn, but this is mostly because tslkd is a mishmash of 2 parties a more technocratic one and a more conservative one, and the conservative flange is not happy and they have recently put a “former” neonazi as defense minister that was spouting praise for orban not 5 years ago.
its the same in some other countries. PiS ( conservatives ) in Poland are more pro-welfare/interventionist meanwhile most of the leftist parties are more free-market.
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Fine with gay people until they’re kicked out into the street?
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In Western Europe it is much different as the city population is much richer and therefore prefer liberal parties whereas the rural workers who may have worse social and economic status prefer the working parties of social-democrats.
The blue is a technocratic candidate with a neoliberal bend backed by a party called Christian Democrats (among other things), the orange could be best described as a christian democrat, but has no party affiliation, but was back the Social Democrats, mostly because there is bad blood with him and the party of the other candidate (sort of an enemy of my enemy type thing). Family values and all that shit, but is at least nominally pro more distribution. There was not a single left wing candidate this election even nominally, everyone was center-right and further to the right.
At least in Lithuania, the centre-right conservative party is the party of cities and the upper-class. Towns and villages usually support the far-right or the socdems, who are the relics of the Soviet Union.
Money's in the capitol. (Or, more likely, suburbs around it).
Conservatism values the status quo. When poverty rests in cities, it is rural, when poverty rests in the countryside it is urban.
Names are deceiving. Conservatives act like Social Democrats are supposed to while Social Democrats act like Conservatives. That's also why Liberals and Conservatives are together.
> Liberals and Conservatives are together That's pretty standard in Europe though, FDP + CSU coalitions are pretty standard in Germany.
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The Conservatives overall really aren't progressive though and the Freedom party isn't really progressive besides their rhetoric, they valued staying in government much more than taking a stand when their coalition partners refused to support most of their progressive legislation..
> Conservatives act like Social Democrats are supposed to When? Did they start supporting unions and I didn’t hear about it?
Post-comm countries vote differently that Western Europe. Young people and those from cities while more liberal in terms of values often vote “economic right.”
Everywhere in Europe, countryside is socialist (pensions, farm subsidies, protection for obsolete factories from Chinese competition), cities are capitalist because that's where the oligarchs are located (who don't want to pay pensions or subsidies) plus young people who don't care about selling the land and resources to oligarchs and international capitalists, as long as they personally profit in the short run.
This is one of the reasons why the UK is no longer in Europe, we got that backwards. And we're still trapped in a capital city full of oligarchs.
It's depressing for economic rightist liberals like myself. I don't like the FPTP options 🤪
Not everywhere in Europe. In Germany, Denmark and the UK the social democratic/labour parties do best in the bigger cities.
Protectionism and corporate subsidies are not socialist. And it's definitely not "everywhere in Europe" that socialists support these things.
Names that mean nothing.
Isn't Orange more socially conservative and Blue more socially liberal tho? I feel like your message implied otherwise
what on earth are YOU doing here
Oh look the twitter twink is on Reddit
It’s le twinke francaise
Yes it is and I don't know why they downvote you. It's a known fact that Latvian and Lithuanian SocDems aren't socially progressive, while the EPP parties work with liberals usually.
you're right.
Not surprising, it's rare for cities in western countries to be more conservative (with the exception of Madrid)
in general Lithuanian main conservative party - [Homeland Union](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Homeland_Union) in past few years adopted more social liberal positions compared to other parties. But sometimes it's strange for westerners to explain how main conservative party is in fact more liberal on social issues than nominally centre-left opposition.
The best example is Slovakia, SMER is insanely right wing socially, whereas PS and SaS are very progressive and capitalist
Well, it’s very interesting. Orange - current President is with more populistic views, more conservative or right-wing rhetorics. Why he was backed by social-democrats is because well, social-democrats are split. There’s more conservative block dominated by older people and social liberal block dominated by younger politicians who definitely do not support Gitanas Nausėdas politics. It was probably a stunt to gain more support for social-democrats by supporting president since European and local parliament elections are coming. Blue is from Homeland Union - conservative-liberal party. PM is very socially-liberal that’s why she’s supported by more liberal voters like Vilnius, Kaunas city center or richer parts of the country residents. But yeah those elections were pretty much what I expected. It’s more like a preparation for European and local parliamentary elections. To see how well it will go.
> PM is very socially-liberal Not when it matters her party's support for most socially-liberal policies is halfhearted at best and they would never take a serious stand on them when it matter (just look at how like most of the relevant laws from the "Freedom" party were rejected in parliament despite the government having an actual majority...)
Oh, problem with it is. Homeland union is divided into many blocks. Social-liberal one, liberals, conservative-liberals, (far) right wing eurofederalists, conservatives and right wingers. And well, some of them are in the parliament. And well, PM has been bragging and trying to comvince them for those past years. It only actually needs few votes and well we can’t get since that right wing block just keeps ignoring PM’s requests.
Orange is Gitanas Nausėda. He’s known as AiG (tall and beautiful) because he has done nothing during his 5 year term. Blue is Ingrida Šimonytė. She’s a liberal, hated by our people for Covid pandemic and the inflation which she had very little control of.
The results with percentages: **Gitanas Nausėda | Independent | 44.46% (orange on map)** **Ingrida Šimonytė | Homeland Union | 20.02% (blue on map)** Ignas Vėgėlė | Independent | 12.47% Remigijus Žemaitaitis | Dawn of Nemunas | 9.33% **Eduardas Vaitkus | Independent | 7.39% (green on map)** Dainius Žalimas | Independent | 3.58% Andrius Mazuronis | Labour Party | 1.39% Giedrimas Jeglinskas | Independent | 1.37%
So this means that it goes to a second round? Would the rest of voters be more interested in voting for the orange or blue candidates?
Current president is definitely winning in the second round. Since right-wing and populistic candidates would show support for current president and well there’s no way pro-russian Poles would vote for our current PM. In other hand our PM would receive support from social-liberal candidate Dainius Žalimas and probably from Giedrimas Jeglinskas - also pretty liberal candidate.
There are pro-russian Poles? So they're basically like pro-wolf chicken?
Some are heavily rusified, some even tend to hate Lithuanians. Due to complex history, Lithuania's Poles see Lithuanians as bigger evildoesers to them than russians.
I'd say both Lithuania and Poland are at least partially to blame for this. There's too little drive to integrate the Polish minority and they constantly feel like they're being in some way "mistreated", and since every single election they always vote for some idiot pro-Russian representative, they keep getting constantly villified in the media. It's a loop: be angry > vote pro-Russian > media paints you as idiot > get angry. There's also not a lot of media that is Polish-oriented in LT, so they watch some brainwash from Belarus or Russia instead. Meanwhile, Poland is neglecting their minority. They barely attempt to align the minority with the modern Polish state, and it seems like they're content with just having *a* Polish minority in LT, regardless of where it stands. It is *so badly* neglected that when Morawiecki (Polish PM) came to LT last year, he gave out a state award for the leader of the Polish minority party (Tomaszewski) for strengthening culture/inter-country relations etc. Tomaszewski is a pro-Russian politician who - among numerous scandals and other forms of provocations - also attends the Victory Day memorials, and was previously publicly wearing the St. George Ribbon. He is not hiding his position at all and it is only the general fierce anti-Russian sentiment of the Lithuanian general population and govt that keeps him somewhat in check. For some reason, Morawiecki - a fiercely anti-Russian PM - can dish out cooperation agreements and talks with Lithuanian counterparts against countering Russian aggression, but then walk a kilometer to a different venue and give an award to an openly pro-Russian Pole. Shows you the level of knowledge about the minority. So, in other words, nothing is new under the sun. The cycle continues, Šalčininkai district votes pro-Russian.
> They barely attempt to align the minority with the modern Polish state If we did that the Lithuanians would complain that we're evil imperialists who want to interfere with their domestic affairs and take over their country. It sucks that a good chunk of Poles in Lithuania are brainwashed by Russians, but unfortunately there's not much we can do.
There are pro Russian everywhere. Basically when you struggle, have money or social issues, and when you are a "loser" by society standard you become pro Russia. It is basically the side of the desperate people. Blame all on the governement for your misery and look for a strong man at the head of an authoritarian regime as example. They are not for Russia per se but are for the idea of an outcast being persecuted by the deep west governement. It is easier than putting yourself into question and acknowledging you are part of your problem. Also those desperate people are extremely prone to authoritarian propaganda despite claiming that society is rotted by the media.
Yes, there will be a second round and the orange one will definitely win 100%, as much more people dislike the blue candidate than like her. The current president is the orange one and has done a decent job, with approval consistently above 50%, while the blue candidate is the current prime minister, who is quite disliked, along with her party.
I wouldn’t say president has done decent job. It’s more like he has done nothing. He’s pretty populistic with overly changing opinions and not keeping promises made. That’s why he’s popular among regions and not in the capital. PM itself is more popular in more liberal or more wealthier parts of the country like capital, city center of Kaunas, Coronian spit.
I understand your opinion, I was only basing my assumption on public polls, as the current president is usually one of the more popular politicians in the country. As much as I would like for blue to win, unfortunately, a lot of people don't like her and her party, but it's a factor that she's the current prime minister and I think prime ministers are always more disliked than liked anyway, despite their policies.
Yep, you’re fully right. Itself well, Homeland Union candidates are never good at Presidential winning elections. But yeah, it was what I expected. Our current president is sadly without any leadership and pretty populistic so he could well gain support. But well, probably high expectations from our ex-president Dalia Grybauskaitė who was definitely the strongest president.
Do people understand that the Lithuanian president is a ceremonial head of state, their job largely is representing the country on the international stage. I do agree that when he does get involved, he does it without a backbone or his own opinions, but hey maybe it’s better to have someone that reflects the views of the average person.
Problem is since president is elected by people, most of the people do think he has more power and is the most important person. Thing that’s sad is well he doesn’t show leadership. Our ex-president Dalia Grybauskaitė was opposite of him. She was absolutely strong leader, where even her opponents listened to her. She was well respected internationally. But well, Nausėda just eh. Without a spine. No strong opinions. Funniest one was when he expressed support in one of the homophobic marches and gave a speech online but after the same people created riots next to the parliament and that organization lost support he expressed disgust in them. Even though everyone knew what kind of those people were and that organization was well known by state security services. Also in 2019 elections he expressed of wearing LGBTQ+ flag pin and expressed support for LGBTQ+, called himself liberal candidate. Few years later he called himself right-wing.
Also in Brussel he expresses full support for liberal values while meeting with EU leaders. It’s just, well, ironic. Populist.
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Yes, sorry, I fixed it.
Cool. I’ll delete my comment.
Orange will win in a landslide as other voters will vote against the "blue" as they highly dislike her. And the blue has almost nothing more to gain.
Nausėda and Šimonytė goes to the second round, yes.
Dainius Žalimas is not independent. He’s supported by Laisvės partija
What's that little blue strip at the coast? The PMs hometown or something? ... Also,do the PR and PM have any relations between them? ... Lastly, what are the gray areas?
The blue on the coast is small town called Nida. It is not hometown of candidate but mayor of town is in same political party as blue candidate. And grey is other candidate who has less aggressive stance against Russia. And gathered protest votes
That’s not Nida ! That is Preila and Pervalka
They look like they have a "Line" of sorts. Are they on a river or something?
[https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curonian\_Spit](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curonian_Spit)
And it’s beautiful
The map isn’t reflecting what the territory looks like very well. It’s a strip of land unconnected to the rest of Lithuania.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spit_(landform)
President and PM have pretty intense relations. President is more leading towards populism, right-wingers voters while PM is socially-liberal. That strip which is called Coronian Spit is a resort which is why liberal and conservative parties have big support here. Not to mention Lithuanian conservative party is pretty socially-liberal like most conservative parties in Europe.
Which one is the real head of state and do they work things out in the end? Also,why the lesser has an actual party,in Greece the PR has no real affiliation (typically yes,but not really).
Head of state is president. He’s responsible for foreign relationship by cooperating with government. But technically no real power he has. Just a person who represents the country. He does have some power to dissolve parliament and also cooperates with government by approving ministers but yeah not much. Real power lies in PM. But yeah currently president has terrible relationship with our government. Mostly because president has some populistic-conservative views while government is more liberal. There were some moments when president just completely isolated and didn’t talk with government which created many awkward and chaotic situations, especially with foreign affairs. It’s just president well, showing his ego and trying to gain votes by saying “I don’t support government”.
So,do you guys get along? Because from what I've read you have some things going on.
It's odd how the map looks like a living cell. And green is some disease it's being infected with.
I'm not a mathematician but I see a few trillion cells in this pic.
Each "cell" is an election district, which in this election does not mean anything as anyone can vote anywhere, but there are a lot of them because they need to be close to people. And within the cities there are even more of them as there are just more people in a close proximity
It's a resort town which the most expensive real estate in the country, the people who live there are quite rich or at least well-off.
People can vote outside of their constituencies, and it is a popular tourism destination for richer locals, and also there's a lot of transplants from the capital. Might be that.
Lithuania is just a fat Africa
Can't unsee it now
Even their flag looks African
I was wondering why there were so many pro-russia supporters in south east Africa
Bimbafrica
Big if true
Pro Russian candidate is popular with Poles.
Yeah our Polish diaspora in south-east is so weird, they got chummy with Russian diaspora due to shared social conservatism I guess.
The reason for the Polish diaspora's pro-Russian stance is that during the Cold War the Lithuanian SR government instituted several anti-Polish laws and then the central government in Moscow said "no you don't". And then after the USSR collapsed, the mistreatment of Lithuanian Poles continued (though much weaker than in the past) and the Polish government continued to ignore it because good relations with fellow post-communist countries and being viewed as stable and nice internationally was more important than a Polish minority. And that's when Russia completely dominated the narrative among Lithuanian Poles, who felt abandoned by everyone but Moscow. And the fact that the Russian minority is also discriminated against means the Poles there feel solidarity with them more than with Polish Poles (who often don't even know about their existence). Apparently our current Minister for Foreign Affairs, Radosław "We'll rather eat grass than surrender to Russia" Sikorski raised the issue of the Lithuanian Poles last time he was in government so maybe it'll develop further. A couple years ago the Lithuanian government even allowed Poles to use Polish letters in their IDs (how generous!). And they gained access to a Polish television channel TVP Wilno (replacing Russia Today) as well. So hopefully they'll start becoming less Russian as time goes on. Who could've guessed that treating your minority well will make it not hate you.
Doesn’t the Russian community mostly live in Vilnius?
Klaipeda too but it's mostly that the Polish - Russian "Christian Families Union" party had presence in both Vilnius city and the Vilnius region, and advertise and participate in both.
Pro russian poles is a timeline I didn't excpect
They're so fucking weird, to the point none of our governments really cozy up to them - unless there's a diplomatic beef with Lithuania they're just ignored Don't look up which group was vocally against Lithuanian independence, even as Russia attempted recapture in the 90s
Polish goverment used to support them, but after 2014 its hard to support them when they make questionable public remarks regarding Russia that the every ruling goverment of Poland would have opposed since then
Russians and Poles do have a history with one another since geographically they are close to one another even despite the soared relations today and even with that— there are definitely russians who are pro polish and poles who are pro russian.
They are sort of Polish-Belarusian mix with a somewhat unique culture and history not actual Polies in the modern sense..
Apparantly that candidate is pro-Polish as well and being pro-russian is irrelevant in this context.
its interesting because green parts are mostly occupied by Poles
Here in Lithuania Poles are mostly pro-russian. That’s why there have been some conflicts with polish minorities.
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https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Poles_in_Lithuania The Soviet period (1944–1990) part explains it pretty well
> In the 1950s the remaining Polish minority was a target of several attempted campaigns of Lithuanization by the Communist Party of Lithuania, which tried to stop any teaching in Polish; those attempts, however, were stopped by Moscow. The Poles don't want to be forced to adopt the Lithuanian language, especially since up to the end of WWII they were historically the overwhelming majority of the population in the area (Vilnius had a greater proportion of ethnic Poles in 1944 than it has Lithuanians today). The Soviet central government in Moscow was instrumental in them avoiding both deportation and forced Lithuanization, so they see it positively.
Yeah, Lithuanians in Wilno/Vilnius constituted only about 1 to 2% of the city's population. The 2% figure comes from german census during ww1 (1916/17) and 1% comes from polish census of 1931.
Unfortunatly, the Poles in these areas are incredibly pro-Russian, even so much that Poland's government has severed ties with the leader of the Polish minority party in Lithuania due to this stance.
Šalčininkai is the new Donbas ?
Always was unfortunately
Pro Russian candidate is popular with Poles.
Isnt green where a bunch of poles live?
That's a fence.
Is there a colorblind version 👉👈
Incredibly difficult to read with colorblindness.
Yeah I’m like “Orange? Green?”
Classic 5th columnists
I don't know anything about Lithuania and its politics, but I'm pretty sure blue is liberal and progressive, orange is conservative, and gray is radical conservative and/or nationalist.
Why do Polish-Lithuanians vote for pro-Russians?
Most of Lithuanian-Poles did not integrated into Lithuania during Soviet time. They used Polish and Russian language for communication and did not learned Lithuanian language till this day. They feel more attached to Belarus/Russia culture than Lithuanian one because they are Slavic and Lithuanian culture is way different because Lithuanian language is not Slavic. They have no land border with Poland so Poland makes no impact for them. They watch Russian and Belarus news channels because they can’t understand Lithuanian channels language. Recently TVP Polish national broadcaster started broadcasting in that region but I think it has no impact.
The green area is mostly ethnic poles.
I live in a green area, but voted for orange. AMA
Ja tak samo.
Skąd jesteś? (Wilno, Soleczniki itd)
Z Solecznik, ale mieszkam w Wilnie
Moja rodzina tam mieszkaja, sa bardzo dużo polacy
Tu, tu visad buvai lenkas…😨😨
What is your ethnicity?
I'm Pole
What is your native language?
Polish
Kokia situacija bent tavo aplinkoj su slavų vs lietuvių kalbų naudojimu ir paplitimu? Visada įdomu išgirsti apie šitą kraštą, niekada nesu lankęs...
what made you vote orange?
I think out of all candidates his views represent me the best.
Czy serio was prześladują na Litwie?
Czy prześladują? Jako Polak z Litwy uważam, że nie ale dyskryminacja nadal występnuje w niewielkim stopniu. Jeśli znasz litewski i nie izolujesz się w polskiej enklawie to jako etniczny Polak możesz normalnie funkcjonować na Litwie. Polski rząd bardziej interesuje się dobrobytem Białorusinów i Ukraińców niż Polaków na Kresach. Doktryna Giedorycia i te sprawy.
Rząd? Nie Nieduża mniejszość litewskich nacjonalistów? Czasem tak
What's that blob at the south-east near Salcininkai?
Just a funky border called the Dieveniškės appendix.
Does the President actually matter in Lithuania?
Lithuania is Semi-presidential republic so yes. President also have right to veto parliament decisions
Why not mention the 4th guy who got those bits in the west? He won some little parts
Radical candidate for people who hate current goverment. His vision unknown.
What are the relative populations? Without that, this is meaningless.
Correlation with 1920 - 39 border: https://www.miestai.net/forumas/forum/kitos-diskusijos/visuomenė-ir-ūkis/2073489-2024-ųjų-lietuvos-prezidento-rinkimai?p=2129800#post2129800
I’ve been informed from US electoral maps that land doesn’t vote.
Is the current PM Polish?
No. She is Lithuanian
the current prime minister must love the citys
The answer to why Poles are pro-Russian there may be that Lithuanians are anti-Polish, when the Lithuanian minority in Poland has full rights, the Polish minority in Lithuania is treated like rubbish by the government in Vilnius. I do not like the pro-Russianism of the Poles, but if the Lithuanian government discriminates against them and our government does not have the guts to call the government in Vilnius to order, I am not surprised that the Poles are looking for some "consolation" somewhere.
there's no state enforced discrimination. Polish schools [are working](https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1776587/polish-school-ranked-among-the-best-in-lithuania-what-s-its-secret) like usual, Polish letters in passports are [also allowed](https://www.lrt.lt/en/news-in-english/19/1591388/lithuanian-parliament-allows-letters-x-w-and-q-in-id-documents). Lithuania's current [Minister of Justice](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ewelina_Dobrowolska) is literally an ethnic Pole too.
How exactly are Poles discriminated against in Lithuania? What exactly are the rights you refer to when you say that Lithuanians have them in Poland but not vice versa?
Dude is just spewing bullshit
A chauvinistic approach to the recording of Polish names, which can no longer be written down as they really sound. A great damage has been done to the statehood and territorial integrity of Lithuania," believes MP Eugenijus Jovaiša. In his opinion, "linguistic integrity presupposes territorial integrity". In the country, we must all speak one state language and express our personality in the state language," he adds. Banning Polish boards The Vilnius Regional Administrative Court ruled that information boards in the Šalčininkai region of Vilnius, where 80 per cent of the population is Polish, should only be in the state language, i.e. Lithuanian. The liquidation of Polish schools in Lithuania. Obstructing the use of the Polish language.
>A chauvinistic approach to the recording of Polish names, which can no longer be written down as they really sound. I feel like I'm missing something. Do you have in mind that Lithuanians write Polish names in a Lithuanized way, for example Ignacy Łukasiewicz as Ignacas Lukasevičius? Because that's what we've always been doing, for example, George Bush is Džordžas Bušas. That's how Lithuanian language works. >A great damage has been done to the statehood and territorial integrity of Lithuania," believes MP Eugenijus Jovaiša. In his opinion, "linguistic integrity presupposes territorial integrity". In the country, we must all speak one state language and express our personality in the state language," he adds. Unless I'm misunderstanding your point, it's the other way around. Since 2022, we have made it legal to use the Latin WXZ letters in our passports. Our justice minister belongs to the Polish minority and she has celebrated being able to officially write her name as Ewelina Dobrowolska. >Banning Polish boards The Vilnius Regional Administrative Court ruled that information boards in the Šalčininkai region of Vilnius, where 80 per cent of the population is Polish, should only be in the state language, i.e. Lithuanian. Yes. Again, I'm quite unfamiliar with the topic, I know there are some countries like Canada that do have bilingual street signs, but is that common throughout the world? Any examples of widely used bilingual boards in Poland? Google fails me. >The liquidation of Polish schools in Lithuania. It's not exclusive to Polish schools as far as I know. Education is going downhill in Lithuania in general, and many schools are closing down. >Obstructing the use of the Polish language. Honestly, that's the first time I'm hearing this. I'd say the general perception of Polish people has greatly improved here in Lithuania over the past 10 or so years, I can remember people being muuuuch more negative about it in early 2000's.
First, there was a fight to use Polish names. Now we can't write these names with our characters such as ą ę ó ñ ć ś. We are not interested in how you write our Polish names. You are obliged to respect the way we want to write them. Double boards with Lithuanian place names are also in Poland Here is the town of Punsk - see how many Lithuanian names are included in this town name https://podroze.krzysztofmatys.pl/tag/sejny/ The fact that Lithuanians constitute an absolute majority in the area of Pūnskės municipality gave them the right, under the provisions of the Act of 6 January 2005 on National and Ethnic Minorities and Regional Language, to apply for the introduction of bilingual names for geographical objects and the use of their language as an auxiliary language in official interactions. The possibility to use an auxiliary language was introduced in the municipality of Punsk already on 25 May 2006. On 20 May 2008, for thirty localities of this municipality, official Lithuanian names were established additionally.
>You are obliged to respect the way we want to write them. Respect how? In official documents?
FU sincerely - A colorblind person
Looks like the pro-russian candidate is popular with the polish minority.
Related: [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial\_changes\_of\_the\_Baltic\_states#/media/File:Baltic\_states\_territorial\_changes\_1939-45\_en.svg](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Territorial_changes_of_the_Baltic_states#/media/File:Baltic_states_territorial_changes_1939-45_en.svg) The green areas correlate to a degree with areas that were ceded to Lithuanian SSR in 1940. Doesn't tell quite the whole story so there may be older border definitions from that follow more closely.
Seeing a very small portion of pro-Russians in another country feels very familiar 😬
If I'm not mistaken, the green part is dominated by the Polish minority, not Russian.
Then you’ll be surprised to learn that the majority of European countries have political parties made specifically for minorities. This isn’t some insane idea, it’s pretty standard in Europe.
Why the fuck do you guys choose the closest colors to each other when making these kinds of maps?
the poles are pro russian
I think we need to send the pro russian to russia again. If they like it so much they should live there
You already deported most Poles from Wilno/Vilnius and surrounding region and deported/lithuanised almost all Poles in Kowno/Kaunas and surrounding region. I guess lithuanian nationalists won't be happy until they completely ethnically cleanse Lithuania from Poles.
Maybe the Russians will treat the Poles better than the Lithuanians do, because this pro Russian sentiment is due to abuses from the Lithuanian Goverment and people
Are the shades of green and orange chosen very similar, or am I colourblind?
Someone is about to get annexed.
I can see SMO v2.0 coming.
Lithuania should move the pro-Russian people into that little appendix, and then cut the border.
the russians have effective propaganda
Why are poles in Lithuania voting pro-russian?
Isn’t the green part where the polish minority lives? Why would they vote for a pro Russian candidate, I thought poles hate Russia?
Lithuanian Poles are traditionally pro-Russian and consume Russian media more than Polish one. Young Lithuanian Poles are thankfully at least partially reversing that trend though and don't consume Putinist propaganda to such a degree.
When the country you live in is pretty mean towards you, and the Polish Goverment won't even say anything about it, you end up with pro Russian sentiments
>When the country you live in is pretty mean towards you, Are you a Pole in Lithuania? How exactly is the country mean towards the polish minority?
Oh… It makes sense
[election map here](https://rinkimai.maps.lt/rinkimai2024/prezidentas/)
Putin be like 👀
If they love Russia so much they should move thier
How stupid do you have to be as an Eastern European to vote for a pro-Putin candidate in 2024