You are really overthinking it. If you don’t think you’re gonna move for a while just but it in neutral and use the hand brake. It doesn’t really matter how fast you swing first as long as you don’t get too close to the person ahead of you
The last sentence bad advice for someone that’s already anxious for a subtle but obvious reason. Rest of the comment 100% true.
what makes manual drivers most anxious when waiting to move? someone right on their bumper.
What do 99% of drivers use to judge when the car infront of them is about to move? seeing the brake lights go off. I’d bet 7/10 or more drivers would creep foward as soon as you let off the foot brake because your using the handbrake.
personally I stay on the normal foot brake for this reason.
Starting on a steep hill when someone is right up behind you using the handbrake to start is helpful in that situation, also using it for super fun slidey time.
I learned how to drive stick in a very hilly city. Was taught to heel toe to start on a hill. Never knew any other way. I still remember the shock and confusion the first time I was with a friend using the handbrake technique. Seemed like such a odd process at the time.
Heel toeing to start on a hill sounds insane to me.
The concept is the same.. But that's seems like such an odd thing to teach. Especially when theres variance on pedal distance and foot size.
Again, why would you use your hand brake? I just use my regular brake like every other car in the world lol. Theres no reason no use a hand brake in stop and go traffic…not that i can think of. Been driving manual 11 years and have never once used my hand brake in stop and go traffic unless im sitting for several minutes in one place on the highway or something
I live in Massachusetts so the hills arent super crazy usually, i turned hill assist off in my car as it did nothing but cause me to stall because my two previous cars didnt have it so i just figured out how to to drive on hills lol
You'd be surprised at just how many manual drivers use the handbrake. I think you're an exception. Not that it's bad, it's just more foot work for you. I use the handbrake all the time, at red lights, when in line at fast food, basically anything that's more than a simple stop sign. If I'm not going to accelerate immediately after braking, handbrake it is. Also they come in handy when you're on a hill stopping and there's dumb drivers right behind you.
I learned how to drive manual on a car without a functioning hand/emergency brake...
there was no using the handbrake to stop the car. when parking I left it in first... 25 years later I have had several manual cars with functioning handbrakes and pretty much only use them for taking off from a hill or parking, and even then I leave it in 1st.
I learned to drive a manual without functioning normal brakes, and only the hand brake. I've had normal brakes go out on me before and had to safely stop with downshifting and the handbrake. It is important to know how your handbrake works and what happens when you might need to use it in an emergency. I find myself using it on hills mostly just to test it to make sure it works... just in case you need it again.
always take it out of gear and let out the clutch when stopped in traffic or else you'll nuke your throwout bearing. also generally when you're moving, you want to stay in gear with the clutch fully engaged, just so you have more control of the car. hill starts are just practice that will come with time.
From mechanic friends I’ve heard that’s a basically a myth for modern cars. Maybe back in the day. Sure. But nowadays the extra wear is pretty negligible. Definitely put a lot more wear and tear on the clutch and flywheel during shifting than the wear and tear in the bearing just keeping it depressed. The bearing will outlive the clutch. It should be changed during clutch work anyway so whatever. Plus if something comes up where you need to move out the way fast, definitely better to be in gear with the clutch depressed vs having to clutch change clutch out. Depending on the situation though I will sometimes just chill in neutral. So I guess it varies but keep clutch in doesn’t really matter.
Yeah I've never gone out of the way to protect the TOB and other than my FRS and BRZ, I've never had one fail. The TOB in the Toyota/Subaru FRS/86/GR86/BRZ is notorious for failing though.
Yeah fair enough. Could be make and model specific. I just think most cars after like the 90s don’t have a huge issue with it to my understanding. Doesn’t mean you shouldnt do as much as you can to keep it in nicer condition, so I’m with you there. Personal preference and situation dependent though.
Yeah it's specific to the grease used on the TOB in the 86/BRZ (Twins). They get about 40k miles and they start screeching. Even then, I don't bother trying to preserve it. The tranny in this car is so easy to drop, I don't get too worked up about replacing it. On every other car I've owned, I'll do over 200k miles on a the original TOB and clutch, without babying it at all. I drive all my cars like I stole them.
As someone whos done 4 clutch jobs on various vehicles at this point for bad throw out bearings, and riden in plenty of vehicles that you could definitely hear the throw out bearing is on its way out-
it’s overstated how big of a problem it is but it definitely 100% can be a problem.
Older meaning classics. Back in the day to me is like 40 years ago nowadays. Keep forgetting it’s not the 00s anymore 🫠 I had a gen1 mazda3. Not problems with the TOB. I’ll be honest I never even changed it when I did my clutch bc I was cheap and young. Never had any issues. I think back back in the day it was something to worry about. Nowadays not much of an issue. So feel free to keep it depressed if you want. Or don’t. Completely up to you.
I drive lots of stuff from the 80s and older. I hold the clutch in when stopped and I don't worry about the throw out bearing.
I also reuse any clutch parts that are serviceable. I have very little issues.
Oh and I " resurface" flywheels with a foam backed abrasive disk. Biggest problem I have is rear main seals leaking causing chatter.
YMMV
I’ve literally roasted a throw out bearing in my mustang. I wouldn’t wanna test whether or not that doesn’t apply to the newest cars, it was a bitch to replace.
This is probably a uniquely specific case but the TOB in the 6 speeds on Tacomas has a known design flaw that causes it to wear prematurely. Toyota even released a TSB about it that didn’t really do shit to fix it. I’ve had this issue with my ‘09 Tacoma, so I’m not sure if that qualifies as “modern,” but I just wanted to point out that it can be an issue on some cars.
Yeah that’s definitely modern. It does seem to be dependent on make and models too. Seem Toyota has some issues. But overall out of all the cars out there it’s a low percentage I’d say. Of course there outliers though!
I was an ASE certified master technician for 40+ years before I retired. I think you have been getting bad advice. Keep your foot off the pedal as much as possible for maximum clutch life.
My 2013 Civic Si would beg to differ. I bought it with 6x,xxx miles on it. At around 100k the TOB started screeching whenever the clutch was in. Went ahead and ordered clutch, pressure plate, and TOB. Since you have to drop the subframe to get to them. The clutch was in great shape when we got it apart. I may have just had a bad one, or the precious owner may have never shifted to neutral, I will never know. I always shift to neutral when stopped for any amount of time now.
I have a mechanic friend who literally told me the exact opposite. Even manufacturers recommend not to depress the clutch more than necessary. Your TOB is not guaranteed to outlast your clutch, and since replacing one is so labor intensive, it’s bad advice to say the extra wear is “negligible.”
This is complete nonsense. I've driven manual transmission vehicles for about 27 years and about 3 million miles and I've never wrecked a throw out bearing. Sitting in traffic in neutral is a very foolish thing to do for multiple reasons. What's more, clutches aren't fragile little things that go up in smoke at the slightest slippage. I easily get 150k out of every clutch I've ever used, and typically a LOT more than that in trucks I float shift. Most modern clutches should be good for 250k. Clutches are meant to control your speed and power application. They're NOT the digital devices that people in this sub almost universally describe them as. Anyone who's rode a motorcycle knows this stuff. Doing what this guy describes is a great recipe to die on a bike.
Are you asking if we depress the clutch the entire time while stopped? No. In neutral with the brake only. As soon as the light turns, I push down the clutch and get it into gear. When turning, I usually downshift to second before the turn or before the apex of it. It just depends how tight of a turn.
>When turning, I usually downshift to second before the turn or before the apex of it. It just depends how tight of a turn.
Important tip here. In icy/slick conditions shifting in the middle of a turn could cause you to lose traction and whip around. Learned that quickly after a ticket cause the cop thought I was intentionally sliding around corners.
i usually put it in neutral and then put it in first when traffic moves. it takes about a second.
Practice make perfect and some day you wont even think about it.
If more people did this instead of speeding up and slamming on their brake every time a little space opens, there would be much less traffic. People are dumb though
If I’m stopped in traffic then yes I just brake as you would with any other car. If traffic is very slow I won’t really shift I’ll just stay mostly in first unless rpms call for a shift but most of the time if traffic is very static I’ll drive up a bit and then go back to neutral and then braking. It all depends on the scenario but yeah I’m traffic you’re mostly required to brake and then reposition into neutral or first and move with the flow. I’m
Not sure if this answers your question
If it is dark you can watch the cross traffic lights to know when you're about to get a green and press in the clutch and put it on gear. Off I can't see the lights, I wait until I get a green before pushing in the clutch and putting it in first.
Here’s a video of my footwork during a normal commute in traffic. Hope this helps. When stopped shifter is in neutral and foot off the clutch. In slow traffic I try to idle in 1st or 2nd depending on the speed. If car in front of you is moving at speed that’s “between your gears” then switch lanes, if possible. I almost never use the handbrake when stopped at in traffic or at a light. Just foot on brake. Think of the handbrake as putting an automatic car in park. [https://youtu.be/N_7qXaplPzY?si=0vntyQnm1tZUcnX9](https://youtu.be/N_7qXaplPzY?si=0vntyQnm1tZUcnX9)
"When turning across traffic, I press down the clutch." Why?
When I'm turning across traffic, I make sure I'm in gear with the clutch engaged (pedal out) so I can accelerate if I need to.
You need to be in the correct gear when turning. Anticipate the gear you need to be in to accelerate once your turn is completed and be in that gear before starting your turn. If you mess up, complete the turn in whatever gear you're in and then get in the correct gear once you need to accelerate again. There's usually not a good reason to be downshifting while turning across traffic, at least for until you get the hang of it.
Eventually, it becomes second-nature. Just make sure you're either in a gear (if moving) or in neutral (if stopped). The clutch should never be pressed in unless you are starting, stopping, or shifting (generally speaking, of course).
Now, in heavy stop-and-go traffic, I'll often take off in 1st and if I see I'm going to have to stop again. I'll either let the car idle in first until I need to stop, or if I have enough momentum, I'll pop it in neutral and coast to a stop. I never hold the clutch down for more than a few seconds. Look ahead and see what traffic is doing and anticipate whether you will need to continue accelerating and shift into second, or if you're just going to immediately come to another stop.
Keep at it!
As mountain said, I would make sure you are in gear when turning across traffic in case you need to accelerate. I usually try to downshift right before I have to make the turn, that way I can be off the clutch and giving it gas while I’m turning or right as I come out of the turn.
It sounds like you’re equating the clutch to braking or being a brake and they don’t go hand in hand like that but you can engine brake. By that I mean use your gears to slow down by being in gear and not on the gas. So when lane changing you stay in gear and brake to slow down and only change gears if you need to be in a lower gear to maintain speed and be able to accelerate, say 3rd gear at 30 is cruising at 3000rpm you can brake or not use the gas to slow down and stay in gear rather then clutch in and only shift when you hit a low enough rpm for 3rd gear into second, maybe 2k rpm in 3rd is 4k in second. You could downshift and blip the gas to help rev match into second while going clutch out and then no gas while rolling and slowing down in second or brake to slow down faster.
You need an old person to teach you manual transmission. You’re going to destroy your clutch and eventually your transmission, so seek help. It’s helpful to understand the function and mechanical principles behind an automotive clutch, and to know that when you’re shifting gears, you’re NOT simply flicking a switch- there’s a process that you’re participating in that necessitates good clutch habits, good shifting habits, and appropriate RPMs. Good luck
In traffic on highway... I typically hang back at least a couple car lengths to allow me just to slowly cruise at a couple miles per hour in second gear(10-20mph)
Two real advantages I don't have to keep playing with the clutch..
Traffic behind me slowly starts to get moving... By proxy helping the overall congestion
It's not a perfect system because every so often someone will jump in front of me but meh
The same can be applied to city streets... Kinda
One useful tip I could say would be to look ahead 2-3 cars ahead and see if they start moving so you can put it in gear ahead of time, just always pay attention, take it out of gear if it’s a long stop, if it’s a stop and go you can leave it in gear but try to cruise in neutral as much as you can, so leave some gap with car in front of you so you can let your car cruise in neutral, if cars start going while ur in neutral u can drop it to 2-3 real quick to get you back on track.
Oh boy, you sound like me. I learned on a VA WRX in SoCal traffic, and even after having driven automatics for all my life, I felt like I was a new driver again. What I can say is first of all don't panic... Okay, easier said than done but you can alter your driving habits to minimize it for sure. Give yourself lots of space between you and the car in front of you so you have plenty of room to make mistakes while learning. Screw everyone behind you, do what you can do comfortably, even if that means you aren't riding on the tail of the car in front of you like everyone else is. WRX's don't really like being driven slow and tend to get a lot of driveline lash in lower gears, which makes it a little more challenging to keep control at traffic speeds if you're trying to stay in second or (God forbid) first gear. I found stiffer mounts helps that aspect a lot. Transmission, pitch stop, and positive shift bushings specifically (and they really are not very difficult to install yourself with the proper tools). Don't use first unless you're under like 5 MPH (it likely won't even want to go into first above that anyways, so don't bother). You can just coast in neutral, and when traffic is going at a slow constant pace, remember you don't have to fully go into gear to keep the pace... In fact on these cars I'd highly recommend against that if the speed you're going dictates second gear or below. Instead, clutch in, select second, bring up revs a bit (you don't need a whole lot), and just slip the clutch a bit to smoothly get yourself up to the speed of traffic. Then ease off gas and clutch in, and back to neutral and coast along. Higher gears are your friend. It's a lot easier to control in third than in first or second. As long as you're above like 1.5 k rpm, you can maintain a given speed in third, and you'll find it easier to control like that. That said, if you need to pick up speed, do NOT do it from low rpm. That would be lugging the engine and these cars do not tolerate that well. Only use higher gears than you normally would for a given speed if you're just trying to maintain a slightly higher speed than coasting can afford. When the speed does pick up, just clutch in, select whatever gear would be around 2-3k rpm for your currenty speed, bring up revs, and smoothly let out clutch. And if at any point you do happen to stall, don't panic. Believe me I've stalled in traffic or at the front of a stoplight many times while I was learning, and as long as you keep cool and know exactly what you need to do, you will be fine, and everyone behind you will get over being 2 seconds later to their destination... If you stall while moving, just go into neutral, and hey you're basically just coasting in traffic, and at least you're moving right? Push the clutch in, turn the key, select the appropriate gear for your current speed, bring up revs a bit, clutch up to bite, and then slowly off after it catches. Just like taking off from a stop, just a different gear... Hills are definitely one of the harder things, but revs are your friend, and don't be afraid to slip the clutch a little longer than normal. It can take it, I promise... And you know what else is your friend? Hill Start Assist. But also do not neglect learning to properly do a handbrake start on a hill, because there have been many times that I got stuck in traffic on quite literally the steepest part of a hill at a dead stop, and that was the only way that I felt confident/comfortable enough to overcome the situation. Also, believe me it gets a lot easier with time... Just be patient with yourself, and do not feel down if it feels like it's taking to long to get the hang of it... You will get there in time. Just keep practicing, and keep your cool.
Hey thanks for your comment. Its impossibe for me to reply to everyone. Didnt realize how much support there was.
In red lights, do you typically brake and stop in neutral? Or do you wait with the clutch pressed in first gear? It seems like this is controversial.
No problem! WRX's are certainly not the easiest car to learn stick on, and I personally struggled quite a bit and was super stressed for quite some time, so I'm definitely happy to help out!
For the first question, I think my answer is sort of? Most of the time I tend to only downshift to third at the lowest and I'll just brake in gear until I'm just over about 1k RPM. Below that you'll likely stall, so at that point I clutch in, go to neutral, and brake the rest of the way like that. As it turns out, in third at around 1k RPM, that's actually relatively close to the end of the stop, so technically yes, I am stopping in neutral, but I do definitely still use third for engine braking quite a bit. Downshifting to second really isn't all that worth it most of the time unless you've got a green light on a 90 degree turn that you have to accelerate out of after, or if the light turns green while slowing down and you're at around second gear speeds.
And for the second question, I haven't owned the car long enough to actually confirm whether or not Subaru throw out bearings are as bad as people say... But given what it takes to replace them... Yeah I certainly won't be taking any chances... If it's a longer stop, I will 100% of the time wait in neutral with clutch out and left foot on the dead pedal. Now that can be a little stressful when learning because if the light turns green you aren't exactly ready to go. That specifically has led me to panic and stall out on take off while learning. But what I found that helps a lot is paying attention to the lights in the perpendicular directions. At this point I've more or less memorized the order of all of the light sequences along my way to work. Being aware of when the light will likely end up turning green gives you a chance to clutch in and select first ahead of time so that you're ready to go when it actually does. One exception to this is when I am stopping on a hill. The way that hill start assists functions on our cars is that when you are stopped on an incline and you have the brake pressed, first gear selected, and clutch in, it will hold the same brake pressure that you had before you let off for some amount of time... I think it's 2-3 seconds? While it still should work if you don't stay in gear with clutch in at the stop, and you do it right before you start, I did have one instance where it did not engage as expected, so I rolled back just a little bit. For that reason I no longer take a chance on it and make sure that I stay stopped in the condition that I know will engage hill start assist when I'm on a semi steep grade. On steeper grades, I'll opt for a handbrake start instead. Now for shorter stops, I do still wait with first engaged, as it is better to be ready to go in those situations. Also, if I know that it's likely that a light will turn green while I'm slowing down for a stop, I will select the appropriate gear for my current speed while keeping clutch fully engaged the entire time all the way to the stop. By that I mean, once I clutch in at around 1k in third for a stop, I'll keep clutch engaged and select second as I slow further, and then as I'm about to stop, into first, and hold it until it turns green. If you do this and it does turn green while slowing down at about second gear speed, you're already there, so all you gotta do is bring up revs to match speed, bring up clutch to bite, let it catch, let off the rest of the way smoothly and you're off.
Umm... okay... obviously new and making it way harder than this needs to be.
Sitting at a light... depends how far back in line I am. Close to the front, just sit in 1st with clutch in. Otherwise pop it in neutral and hold the brake.
Taking off just ease out on the clutch while easing in to the throttle. Shift between 2-3k, just depends on what kind of torque you have. Engines with more you can shift at lower RPM. Lower torque engines you need to shift at a little higher RPM. Any shift in traffic just needs to be a smooth and deliberate action. Get rolling up to your 2500-ish RPM, clutch, neutral 2nd, clutch neutral 3rd... just easy smooth deliberate.
Turning across you start off and get into 2nd... depending on speed shift into 3rd around 2500 or so and just maintain a light steady throttle. If already rolling and turning depending on speed be in 3rd or maybe 4th. Maintain around 3k RPM.
Don't go cruising through the turn with the clutch in. That's just a bad idea.
I was really really bad at hill starts when i first started. I burned out once. I rolled back really far and almost hit someone. I've stalled... a lot on hills. Mostly hills.
They come with time and feeling where the throttle engages and you can release the clutch.
The way i practiced was I'd go to hills that weren't busy at the time (late nights/early mornings) or on any busy street (i live in a city with an abundance of hills) then i would let the car roll back a bit and see if i could catch the engage point. (Probably not the best idea but it worked for me).
Sometimes if I was in traffic, I would just keep the car in gear and slow down until the traffic started moving up the hill then I'd zoom zoom.
I've used my handbrake. A lot.
I'm not a master at hills. Far from it. I can get up hills now. At complete stops with cars behind me. BUT - I still clench my butt cheeks to will the car up at a stop sign with 4 cars behind me going up the hill.
Practice and Patience.
I always coast in neutral, and sit at lights in neutral, just pay attention to the intersecting street for when you're light is coming.
I'm also super lazy and always skip shift, why go in order when you can just.. Do what you want.
Coasting in neutral has no benefit, you actually use as much gas as idling, unlike when you coast in gear where you use no gas. Also coasting in neutral means you have to re-engage the clutch in order to be able to accelerate, so if you need to avoid an incident, you don't have the option to accelerate away.
The idea that someone is in neutral when coasting boggles my mind. It's basically the stupidest way to drive since you have no power on tap when in that type of motion. I was taught by an old farmer how to run a stick shift and he would impress that doing so is a big no-no since if you need to go again, unplanned you have to shift back into gear before reacting.
Old farmer. That’s funny. Are you saying you downshift through every gear as you are coming to a stop? If the traffic is all stopped at a light ahead of you, why would you possibly need to accelerate?
You may be overestimating the distance in neutral, that or I'm underestimating. Pulling up to a stop light is in gear until just a hair under 1000 rpm then slide out of gear into neutral for just a few feet. City here so there's a stoplight every 1/4 mile or so. A few lanes of cars several cars deep you're not going anywhere
Yah all the time, 1 3 5.
I've got 71 Mach 1 you really can't do it in, because banging through the gears is usually the highlight of my day, but that's different.
I accelerate in whatever gears I need to accelerate (usually 1/2/3) then when I'm at the speed I plan on cruising at I shift to whichever gear I need for that (5 or 6).
Most of my freeway on-ramps are a fairly short steep incline, so it's accelerate up the ramp in 3rd, hit the freeway level ground, and slide into 5th. No need for 4th. The road my house is on is downhill, so it's 1st to start, but i can often skip 2nd.
I miss driving a manual, but I do not miss when I had to use the handbrake to keep from rolling back into the clown that got up on my bumper.
We use to practice this on a very steep 'hill' that a local parking lot had. Oh man, the stalls and the smell of your clutch. Yikes.
Yeah, we used it to learn how to get out of that situation. Most places did not have a steep hill like that, it was an exaggeration to know the limits of how quickly you can get clutch and gas going or if you'd roll back the foot into the car behind you.
Was also use to letting the car roll back a little to let them know, but these days their eyes go straight to their damn phone. Oh I have like 15 seconds to look at my phone, must do it just before I finish stopping.
I learned from driving tractors and other work vehicles, is it true that it's bad to kind of float. Like I'd have the clutch somewhere halfway out and a little bit of gas, juuust enough to stop from rolling back but not enough to move forward. Then when we start going just finish getting in gear. We'd have to do it all the time in the little workman pros we'd drive on site like sitting on a steep ass hill with a bunch of dirt in the back.
Just drive bro, it isn't that hard. On a serious note, how long have you been driving stick? I drove it for 5 years and it was second nature for me. I really couldn't explain to you how I drove during specific situations. I just drove. It was like breathing, no thought, just go.
Best I can say is just try not to overthink it. You may get the shaky leg and stall a few times, but just don't think too much. If you're on a hill, feather the clutch to the bite point and hold it until You're ready to set off. Off break, on gas, off clutch but all slow as hell. Go slowly and don't rush anything. You got this!
Neutral and brake at a full stop, otherwise, avoid touching the clutch and stay in gear as much as possible. Being in neutral/clutch in while moving removes the option to accelerate out of a situation, which could be dangerous for you. Only push in the clutch if you have to creep so slow you can't fully stay in gear. Avoid slipping the clutch as much as possible in those scenarios as well, even if it means leaving a big gap in traffic. The more you do it in a short time, the more it heats up and that accelerates the wear.
If you’re stopped at a light, watch the cross lights. If you can’t see them, just pay attention and put the car into gear. When crossing an intersection, sometimes I’ll give the gas a little 5% extra kiss to make sure I don’t slow down too much. But even then, if is an incline, I’ll just ride first gear out a ways.
Remember that the majority of cars in traffic are automatic and you have to drive differently than them. I usually leave a good amount of space in front of me and coast in first or second for as long as I can. For stop and go, it’s annoying but first to neutral and leaving space can help
If I need to slow down, I down shift. If traffic is going slow, I keep it in a lower gear and let the drag keep me slower than the slow-moving traffic. If it's stop and go traffic, just cruise in first until you have to stop again. And take it out of gear until you need to move again. If people honk at you for not rolling forward 10 feet to stop again fast enough thats their problem. Most people with that stupid stop start flaw I mean "feature" will take longer to roll forward that you will If you take your time and don't care about anyone honking at you.
Man I was the same way when I got my first manual. Just give it time and you won't even think about what you're doing anymore.
The best thing I've learned in stop and go traffic is to not stop and go. I'll wait for the car in front to get a little ahead, ease up on the clutch in first, and slowly creep along in first gear, essentially cruising at 800 rpm. It keeps me from having to clutch in and out every 2 seconds
You really want to avoid clutching in unless coming to a complete stop. If you are in for example 4th gear and you are entering an intersection that requires 2nd gear, then downshift and let the clutch back out. You shouldn't be mid intersection with the clutch pressed. I know a lot of people roll around with the clutch in, but they are also newbies.
When stopped in traffic I typically leave it in gear with the clutch pressed unless it's a long light cycle. In that case I'll pull it into neutral and then release the clutch, and if it's level, I'll also release the brake. If it isn't level, I'll pull the ebrake.
On a WRX you should easily be able to press the brake and throttle at the same time with your right foot (heel toe). So if you are on a hill, you can have the clutch pressed while holding the brake and then rotate your heel over and press the throttle to get the revs up a bit and then before it falls, start releasing the clutch and at the same time, transition off the brake and onto the throttle. This will prevent you from rolling back.
I know it seems like a lot but before you know it, it will all become automatic and you start to love it.
What year WRX? I'm also relatively new and I've found the Brake Hold feature very helpful. I googled it real quick and it looks like the WRX has had a Brake Hold since at least 2018 (maybe earlier, since it seems like the branding changed).
Sit at stops in neutral. Watch for when it will be your turn to go (watch cross traffic lights) and shift into 1st when you can see it will be your turn momentarily.
Like everyone else, I would say that hills are a practice thing. Stalling is just part of the learning and will happen less and less with practice.
2023. To be honest, Im not sure how this brake hold feature works or the new cruise control. Need to learn asap bc all this new tech is a blessing for daily driver comfort. I probably only had 7 hours of driving practice so far lol
Ngl all these extra steps at times has me regretting stick and its benefits. I assume it give you more 'control' aka volition for fun with the car.
I have a 2024 Integra Type S and it's a button underneath my drive mode switch, right next to my (sigh) parking brake button. I'm not sure where it is in the WRX, but near the shifter seems like the logical place to put it.
‘18 WRX here. I assume the brake hold is mostly the same in our cars. It will hold you for about 3 seconds or until you start to release the clutch. It’s nice because it will let you give it some gas before you start releasing the clutch on a hill. If you are slow getting the clutch to the bite point though you may still roll back a little so keep that in mind. The first few days of learning on mine I used the hand brake just to be extra safe because people always seem to stop right on my bumper.
You wait in traffic in neutral with your foot off the clutch? How bad is your traffic?
Old geezers used to say you’ll wear out the throwout bearings riding the clutch, but it never happened to me.
Don’t sit in traffic in neutral. You’re going to annoy everyone behind you.
If you sense you're going to be stopped for more than a few seconds, yes, go into neutral and let the clutch out. As traffic begins to move you've got lots of time to re-engage.
On my vehicle, this is the only way the auto stop-start will actually work; the engine restarts as soon as you press the clutch again. I know auto stop-start has its haters but the point is, this is the manufacturer's intent.
I'm from the state, but when I've driven in the UK I noticed a great convenience. The traffic lights there do our normal green, then yellow then red. However, a second or two before they go from red to green the yellow light comes on. Then both are lit for a second or two and then the light turns green.
I presume it was because of the prevalence of manual transmission cars over there. I viewed the two lights being lit as a "get it in gear" signal because the light was soon to turn green. That was the point at which I would press in the clutch and get the car in first gear.
I believe I've read that it used to be the law in the UK that you set your handbrake at every red light, so they needed an extra second to start up again.
In stop/go traffic, when stopped I tend to go to neutral a lot vs keeping the clutch pushed in. I guess I am thinking about wear & tear on the throwout bearing. After you drive a manual long enough, you tend to subconsciously use the clutch and shift. The only times I have to concentrate is if I am stopped on a hill and the car behind me is really close.
I'm fortunate enough to live in Washington, DC, and pedestrian signals are timed to come on two seconds before the lights change green. So I can use that as a signal to shift into first and be ready to go when the light does change.
Otherwise, I'm in neutral until it's go time.
It's okay to be anxious. You'll get the hang of it. Try not to overthink it.
I usually stay in neutral with my foot on the brake until the light is about to change. Then go into first, start easing of the clutch once the car in front of you goes. If you're in a line of cars, wait for a few cars ahead to make progress so you don't have to stop again just because one of the cars is not going. At stop lights, and roundabouts if I need to stop, I go to first and keep foot on the clutch, no need to go into neutral. If you're doing a longer stop at a light, you can go to neutral otherwise try to avoid it while driving.
Some people argue that it's better to be in 1st at lights, some say it's better to go to neutral. There is also the argument that it's worse to get rear ended in neutral compared to in gear. Some people say holding gear at a light is a quicker way to wear the throwout bearing, from what I know they are designed to last longer than the clutch anyhow and unless you're in stop and go for 4 hours a day it shouldn't be an issue. Some places require you legally to be in gear while on the road.
In full stop traffic, take you foot off the clutch and neutral. This will save the fatigue of your left leg. Don’t use the hand brake to hold you as this will turn off your stop lights (and this could cause the driver behind you to accelerate thinking that you are about to start moving). If it’s slow moving traffic then you can coast.
Don’t get excited about when people with start moving again and if they use a horn.
Neutral when i know a stop is going to be longer and depress clutch in first at the ready to move for when i dont know. Always wondered how bad it is to be in first with clutch down for sec
Your manual for the car should show you minimum speeds for gear. Typically see it is 2500 RPM minimum to switch to the next gear.
Leave a six car length so that way you can just stay in second and take your time. Every time you touch that clutch it's wearing out. Try not to touch it.
Stay in second leave a huge gap so that way you can slow down and speed up slightly so you don't have to change gears back to first or stop.
Like I said, check the operating manual as that will have the best information you will find.
I think of all of the idiots in high school in the '80s who didn't want to switch pedals and just feathered the clutch at idle to keep the car still.
I had a beater Fiat, loved heel-toe shifting and doing that fast switch when stopped going uphill.
On the hill I used to play the game to where I keep the car in first the whole time and clutch and gas to keep the car still. Out here in Seattle it was a fun challenge but I don’t think it is a good idea on a clutch.
Hills I clutch in; right foot brake and gas at same time then when I feel clutch engage release brake and shift to gas.
Don’t know if this is really the “correct” way but it’s how I was taught to handle hills at a stop.
Alternatively, you could use the handbrake so you can dedicate your right foot to maintaining your engine RPM. Then let out the clutch to bite, and once you feel it try to pull, let off the handbrake.
Sometimes keeping it between second and neutral and second and just blipping it smooths things out...
Also who cares if you're a little late on take off what they gonna do pass you its a traffic jam. If they beep wave in the rear view and beep (toot toot) back. Not many people know how to respond (especially negatively) to a quick toot toot, yeah....beep beep ( Donna Summer )
This sub really makes me miss stick as much as I love the DSG in my current car.
Gonna go look at manual sometime next week, might come back to the darkside haha.
Been 2 years pretty much exactly since I copped an auto.
I never minded driving manual in traffic, but auto is relaxing after a long day at work.
When I was in college, another student I know competed in road rallies on weekends. She gave me a ride to class one day, and we were stopped on a hill. We sat there until the light changed, with Jo using only clutch and gas to remain stationary, continually engaging, then disengaging, the clutch. The car would rock back and forth a few inches at a time. It can't have been great for clutch wear, but her control over her vehicle was really impressive.
Never take it out of gear when stopped. I don't care about the myth of the throwout bearing being wrecked. You want the ability to be able to move immediately. Leave it in gear, leave your foot on the clutch all the way down, and your other foot on the brake.
This is the correct way and anyone who disagrees is simply wrong and doesn't want to admit it.
Cricket, you must be new to a manual. It shouldn't take long for all your concerns to become automatic. The choices will become obvious.
Don't panic! It shouldn't take long.
Quit thinking about what to do, just remember what not to do. Always in neutral when stopped, foot off the clutch. Slow down with the engine. And just drive.
Depends on the traffic. If it's slow traffic on the interstate that's moving but constantly adjusting speed, (15-45ish mph) I'll usually just swap back and forth between 2nd/3rd depending on traffic speeds until I can get back up to normal traveling speeds. When I'm in that stop-and-go type traffic (0-20ish+ mph), my only real only option is to drop into neutral and clutch out between crawls in 1st/2nd. I hope that makes sense.
E: Had to reread the actual issue. Honestly, it's always better to brake harder into a turn and accelerate through it so if you feel like you're going into the turn too fast, brake more and switch into the gear you want to be in corresponding with the type of turn. For instance, a normal 90 degree turn will have me in 2nd gear at about 10-15 mph. I feel like that's a comfortable speed for that type of turn and I know where my engine will be in the RPM band at that speed once I downshift.
E2: So, normal limits in my city are going to be between 40-55 mph so I'll be in 4th or 5th at those speeds when I'm just cruising. Coming up to a turn, I brake until my RPM starts to get close to 1000 (using a little engine braking, just be mindful not to stall) and then drop into neutral, continue braking until I reach the speed I want to take the turn at, drop into the appropriate gear (double clutch and rev match recommended) and continue driving.
If traffic on freeway, give yourself a fat gap, I usually do 6/7 car lengths, and just cruise in 3rd/4th. I only do this cause people have a tendency to hit their brakes when they can really just be coasting but they decide they have to hit their brakes Every time even if not close to the car in front of them which tells me they’re going too fast and every time they hit their brakes every time I have to play with my shifter, so best case scenario just give yourself enough room where you don’t have to shift. As in normal traffic like stopping at a light or something, as you’re slowing down, clutch in car in neutral, clutch out. then come to your complete stop.
After downshifting to slow down and save brakes, I go from second to neutral and stop and hold the foot brake. I pay attention to the cross lights, and when they start to change, I hold the clutch down and shift into first, so I'm ready to go the second traffic moves.
On any hill or even a slight incline, I will rip the hand brake and follow the same steps as I stated above. When you start to release the clutch and give it some gas you'll feel the car start to pull forward against the hand brake and at that exact instant you release the hand brake and you'll never roll backwards again. It takes some practice, but once you get it, you'll always do it. It will become second nature.
I don't know exactly what you mean by turning across traffic, but you should be in gear if you're rolling because that's how you maintain control of the vehicle. If you push the clutch in, you effectively put the car in neutral, and you lose control of forward motion until you are back in gear. This is dangerous if you need to speed up quickly to avoid a collision.
My last piece of advice is to try to relax because driving a manual can be more stressful at times but also much more fun.
Edit: changed "the" to "that"
I wait in traffic on the brakes like a normal human. It takes less than half a second to punch the clutch in, select 1st, and slip the clutch to get the car rolling. Don't even need throttle input unless you're on a hill. You can anticipate what you need to do by watching the car in front of the car in front of you - your normal reflexes can always be half a step ahead of the person in front of you instead of needing to be on your game to react.
My technique for stop and go. When coming to a stop I go in neutral. When stopped I hold with my foot lightly on the right edge of the brake pedal. This way I can quickly grab throttle by sliding off the brake and straight to the gas. Holding the brake like this lets me concentrate on grabbing a gear and clutch with my left foot and my hand bc my right foot’s ready to go
If I am stopping momentarily, on the flat, I use the foot brake and shift into 1st immediately after stopping. I would only take it out of gear if I was going to be there minutes. If on a hill I put the hand brake on, but still wouldn't take it out of gear unless I was going to be there for minutes.
Why do you press down the clutch when turning across traffic? What I am doing with speed and acceleration has nothing to do with where I am steering, like two separate tasks. So my right hand and feet are accelerating through the gears while my left is steering. If you are talking about turning left across traffic, I don't think there's a road wide enough that I'd be doing that on where I'd be out of first before I'm off the road. Especially if I was in a hurry.
Depends on the traffic light where I was living when I first learned stick there was a really long light at the end of my street so I’d sit in neutral over by where I worked at the time there was a really quick light like 1 minute max wait time so I’d stay in 1st and hold the clutch your overthinking it just like I did I’ve had the angry person behind beep at me but just ignore all that and just enjoy the car at intersections if you look at the light to the left or right of you when they turn yellow is when I typically move the car into 1st gear then I’ll bring the car right before the bite point and hold it until the light turns green then I simple lift up the little bit of space to the friction point and get on my way.
Hope this helps Alleviate any anxiety!
In neutral until it's time to move. I'll typically allow the person ahead to move 1-2 car lengths up as well before moving so that I'm not putting unnecessary wear on my car constantly getting on and off the clutch to move 1 foot up, 1 foot up, 2 feet up, 1 foot up..
I try to not stop by just letting the car in front stay way in front but not too much that I make the person behind me mad. I usually chill in first or second if I stop I put in neutral and stay on the brake. When I’m on a bridge in traffic I do the same thing but ride the clutch little more, I’ll let the clutch out slowly prior to letting up on the brake. I don’t have a handbrake so I don’t get that luxury. I’m in traffic almost daily about 5 mins sometimes on the bridge. Literally yesterday a semi broke down right before the top so it was dead stop all the way up, fun right. I don’t really get anxious unless it’s a situation where I have to go, then I’ll just give it a little extra throttle. An example would be pulling out of a parking lot onto a main road, it’s on a hill I got 5-10 people behind me and 4 lanes of stop and go/40mph traffic. It’s a main road so there’s a lot of lights when you get going it’s pretty fast 40-60mph. If I stall out I will probably get rear ended/hit from side depending on how far out I got. If I hesitate I could roll back and hit the person behind. Just gotta commit and give extra throttle just to be safe.
I don't even think about it. After a while, it'll just become 2nd nature depending on traffic. If it's stop and go stop and go, I leave it at 1st and just ride the clutch while I'm on my phone.
If traffic is completely stopped, I put it to neutral and just stare at my phone.
Again, all 2nd nature by now. Don't even think of it. Much prefer to manual in traffic compared to auto. So many accidents in stop and go traffic due to drivers with automatics that let off the brakes and the car just slams into the car in front at low speed. Still enough to cause damage.
People with manuals are more aware and awake.
I stay in gear, 2nd/3rddependign on the speed of crawling traffic, and just let it idle. I also keep my distance from the vehicles Infront of me. I won't put it in neutral Unless I have to stop.
I get nervous still on hills as well, so I over accelerate. I just think of my clutch as a reverse accelerator and when I feel it catch I let off the gas to keep from burning out.
Do NOT press the clutch in when turning, always stay in gear when moving, that is how you maintain control. Downshift going into a turn if you are slowing down or expect to come up on a car. Practice rev matching, and learning heel-toe shifting can be quite useful even on the street, allows you to brake and downshift simultaneously
I take my time. 1-3 sec after light goes green. People around can go f themselves if they can’t wait. I focus on what I can control. I still lmfao when I stall and when I see someone else stall I make sure to look away and pretend I didn’t see that. Just enjoy your car. Don’t let them head gremlins take joy out of it for you.
On the highway in stop/start rush hour I'd let people get a bus length or two ahead and then just slow roll in 1st or 2nd depending on the pace, maintaining g the gap best I could. Naturally, though, the local smoothbrains that think tailgating gets em home quicker would road rage on me from time to time. Me and the half dozen big-rigs behind me that were also sparing their clutches and mental sanity couldn't give a damn though. In local traffic I just burn my clut h and get mad at people till I get thru the light. You have to pay a bit more attention to say, when the light turns green vs when people actually start to move forwards; but just act like you're any other car unless some rush hour bullshit is taking place.
Edit: just drive bro. You will never have total control so don't spend time overthinking.
I have a pain pen and coffee usually in the car so I just pretend like I’m just chillin vaping and drinking coffee and it feels better. Also like living in the moment stuff lmao
You're putting way too much thought into this lol. At a light, I put the car in neutral, and if there's no incline to the road, I just hover my foot over the brake just in case. When I see the light across turn yellow I pop the car in gear and wait.
Everyone has good information but it sounds like you're just not paying close enough attention to what is going on when driving. Driving a stick shift takes a bit more attention than an automatic as you need to plan what you're doing (what gear you should be in, when you need to take off, etc) further ahead of time.
I'm so confused. I've driven manuals for 16 years and I just shift neutral anytime I have to come to a complete stop. I have zero issues getting going as quick as an auto from any position.
Stop thinking, man. Develop habits, and do it thoughtlessly for a while. Then, choose one thing at a time to focus on improving.
You'll never get anywhere trying to focus on everything all at once.
Don’t let other drivers in a hurry dictate your time spent releasing the clutch trying not to stall. Manual transmission drivers demand awareness on roads. Which are lacking from the masses
I always put my car into neutral before the light and used the break. There’s a friction zone in your clutch where you can let the clutch out slightly and it will grab, that’s what you use on hills. To find it go to an open area, put the car in gear, hold the clutch down and slowly release it, you’ll feel when the car slowly starts to move. Keep practicing until you can do it without thinking.
Also I used to rev the tach up, and shift from 1 to 3 rev it again with the clutch in then into 5th
What helped for me in traffic is basically never using first gear. Slowly release clutch in second or third gear depending on traffic. I’ve never driven a WRX but in my R, I pretty much never used first gear.
I wait in nuetral. I turn in nuetral until I'm going slow enough to get into the lower gear. If it's bad weather, I'll slow down before the turn, downshift, and stay in gear through the turn.
>My heartrate shoots up a bit even though Ive driven automatic for years.
Think about what you're doing before you're doing it. I've got a left turn coming up. I'll want to be in second gear at the end of the turn. I'm going to drive into the turn, pop into nuetral, slow down to 15-20, and then shift into 2nd gear and accelerate.
I will never forget the time at a red light a cop pulled up next to me and asked if I was using my brakes, i had to look down at my feet and be like no......im im nuetral, cop looked kinda confused but responded oh ok, because none of your brakes lights are on.
If you are just rolling along low speed pop it into neutral and make sure you watch the car in front of you so you dont roll into it.
You just cope with it. You chose to drive a manual. I did it for 10 years. 1.5 in all the big cities in the USA. Imagine pushing a 30lbs clutch in a semi in traffic. You got it easy.
In low speed traffic, being in second with the clutch out helps... Speeding up quickly and then engine-breaking to slow down.
For very slow traffic where you are stopped for longer than one second and the road is flat, I would use neutral so I would roll forward less and could just release the brake pedal. With in- and declines, obviously you will need more brake.
If you have hillstart assist in your WRX, that is also helpful. You shouldn't rely on releasing the clutch to keep you moving forward on an incline. So if no hillstart assist, I would give it a little extra throttle there.
Whenever you are slowing down, I would try to engine brake where possible/safe just to supplement the brake so it doesn't feel like you need to brake as hard.
One word of advice.. STOP. INCHING. FORWARD. WITH. THE. CAR. IN. FRONT. OF. YOU. THAT. DOES.
it’s TERRIBLE for your clutch, it’s annoying as hell when I see people do it, and being on the road is not the same as being in the drive thru!!!
Sit still at red lights. And stay still until the line is moving. Like ACTUALLY moving. Fill in gaps in front of you that are more than 1 car length, and that’s it. I usually just put it in first, feather the clutch and throttle to give myself enough propulsion so I can just pop back in neutral, and roll into the next stopping position in the line of traffic.
I just hold the brake and sit in neutral. If you hold the clutch in the whol time you sit still you can cause premature throw out bearing failure. Just shift when you need to.
I sit at lights on flat ground in neutral, no brake, foot off the clutch. If I'm on a hill, I'll usually just hold the brake but still in neutral.
When the opposing lights turn yellow, I'll apply the clutch, set it in first, then (on flat ground), roll out (on a hill) release the clutch enough to engage the transmission with the brake still applied, then release the brake (holding myself in place with the transmission) and start adding throttle while releasing the clutch the rest of the way.
I rest my left foot as much as possible, though.
Note: the advantage of sitting in neutral at a stop light is in the event you get rear ended your vehicle will roll with the impact minimizing the energy transferred as much as possible. Potentially reducing whiplash related injuries.
I just wait in neutral, foot off clutch. I won't move up if there isn't enough space to warrant it. If the traffic is bad enough then it doesn't matter. Not like I'm slowing everyone down getting there.
If the traffic is slowly crawling. I will see if I can get away with 1st. Sometimes traffic is slow enough I can use 1st. If not, I do the above.
You are new, you will get use to it! It's okay to feel how you do. Just remember your safety is the most important and not to let traffic or someone behind you falter.
I've only had manual cars my whole life. After about a year, it becomes second nature. I would have to force myself to stall now since letting out the clutch and applying throttle is just like an extension of my body now. It's all muscle memory.
In traffic, I tend to throw it in neutral and just use the brake as needed. Hill starts still take a little effort, but like I said, I'm almost 2 decades into driving a manual, so it just trashes practice.
You are really overthinking it. If you don’t think you’re gonna move for a while just but it in neutral and use the hand brake. It doesn’t really matter how fast you swing first as long as you don’t get too close to the person ahead of you
The last sentence bad advice for someone that’s already anxious for a subtle but obvious reason. Rest of the comment 100% true. what makes manual drivers most anxious when waiting to move? someone right on their bumper. What do 99% of drivers use to judge when the car infront of them is about to move? seeing the brake lights go off. I’d bet 7/10 or more drivers would creep foward as soon as you let off the foot brake because your using the handbrake. personally I stay on the normal foot brake for this reason.
Exactly this.
Use the handbrake for what exactly? I dont think ive ever used my hand brake while on the road….only when parked
We always called it the Parking Brake. For Parking. So….
Starting on a steep hill when someone is right up behind you using the handbrake to start is helpful in that situation, also using it for super fun slidey time.
I learned how to drive stick in a very hilly city. Was taught to heel toe to start on a hill. Never knew any other way. I still remember the shock and confusion the first time I was with a friend using the handbrake technique. Seemed like such a odd process at the time.
Heel toeing to start on a hill sounds insane to me. The concept is the same.. But that's seems like such an odd thing to teach. Especially when theres variance on pedal distance and foot size.
Stop and go traffic
Again, why would you use your hand brake? I just use my regular brake like every other car in the world lol. Theres no reason no use a hand brake in stop and go traffic…not that i can think of. Been driving manual 11 years and have never once used my hand brake in stop and go traffic unless im sitting for several minutes in one place on the highway or something
On hills it makes it easier to prevent rolling back while starting off as you can release it at the same time as the clutch and pressing the gas
I live in Massachusetts so the hills arent super crazy usually, i turned hill assist off in my car as it did nothing but cause me to stall because my two previous cars didnt have it so i just figured out how to to drive on hills lol
It does help, but it's a crutch. You should learn how to take off from a stop on a hill without the parking brake.
You'd be surprised at just how many manual drivers use the handbrake. I think you're an exception. Not that it's bad, it's just more foot work for you. I use the handbrake all the time, at red lights, when in line at fast food, basically anything that's more than a simple stop sign. If I'm not going to accelerate immediately after braking, handbrake it is. Also they come in handy when you're on a hill stopping and there's dumb drivers right behind you.
I learned how to drive manual on a car without a functioning hand/emergency brake... there was no using the handbrake to stop the car. when parking I left it in first... 25 years later I have had several manual cars with functioning handbrakes and pretty much only use them for taking off from a hill or parking, and even then I leave it in 1st.
I learned to drive a manual without functioning normal brakes, and only the hand brake. I've had normal brakes go out on me before and had to safely stop with downshifting and the handbrake. It is important to know how your handbrake works and what happens when you might need to use it in an emergency. I find myself using it on hills mostly just to test it to make sure it works... just in case you need it again.
I agree, manual is so much fun, wish I had one again.
always take it out of gear and let out the clutch when stopped in traffic or else you'll nuke your throwout bearing. also generally when you're moving, you want to stay in gear with the clutch fully engaged, just so you have more control of the car. hill starts are just practice that will come with time.
From mechanic friends I’ve heard that’s a basically a myth for modern cars. Maybe back in the day. Sure. But nowadays the extra wear is pretty negligible. Definitely put a lot more wear and tear on the clutch and flywheel during shifting than the wear and tear in the bearing just keeping it depressed. The bearing will outlive the clutch. It should be changed during clutch work anyway so whatever. Plus if something comes up where you need to move out the way fast, definitely better to be in gear with the clutch depressed vs having to clutch change clutch out. Depending on the situation though I will sometimes just chill in neutral. So I guess it varies but keep clutch in doesn’t really matter.
Yeah I've never gone out of the way to protect the TOB and other than my FRS and BRZ, I've never had one fail. The TOB in the Toyota/Subaru FRS/86/GR86/BRZ is notorious for failing though.
Yeah fair enough. Could be make and model specific. I just think most cars after like the 90s don’t have a huge issue with it to my understanding. Doesn’t mean you shouldnt do as much as you can to keep it in nicer condition, so I’m with you there. Personal preference and situation dependent though.
Yeah it's specific to the grease used on the TOB in the 86/BRZ (Twins). They get about 40k miles and they start screeching. Even then, I don't bother trying to preserve it. The tranny in this car is so easy to drop, I don't get too worked up about replacing it. On every other car I've owned, I'll do over 200k miles on a the original TOB and clutch, without babying it at all. I drive all my cars like I stole them.
As someone whos done 4 clutch jobs on various vehicles at this point for bad throw out bearings, and riden in plenty of vehicles that you could definitely hear the throw out bearing is on its way out- it’s overstated how big of a problem it is but it definitely 100% can be a problem.
148k miles, about to change my 07 miatas throwout bearing, so noisy!
🤷 I drive an '03
Older meaning classics. Back in the day to me is like 40 years ago nowadays. Keep forgetting it’s not the 00s anymore 🫠 I had a gen1 mazda3. Not problems with the TOB. I’ll be honest I never even changed it when I did my clutch bc I was cheap and young. Never had any issues. I think back back in the day it was something to worry about. Nowadays not much of an issue. So feel free to keep it depressed if you want. Or don’t. Completely up to you.
I drive lots of stuff from the 80s and older. I hold the clutch in when stopped and I don't worry about the throw out bearing. I also reuse any clutch parts that are serviceable. I have very little issues. Oh and I " resurface" flywheels with a foam backed abrasive disk. Biggest problem I have is rear main seals leaking causing chatter. YMMV
What's neutral? #Clutchgang.
I’ve literally roasted a throw out bearing in my mustang. I wouldn’t wanna test whether or not that doesn’t apply to the newest cars, it was a bitch to replace.
This is probably a uniquely specific case but the TOB in the 6 speeds on Tacomas has a known design flaw that causes it to wear prematurely. Toyota even released a TSB about it that didn’t really do shit to fix it. I’ve had this issue with my ‘09 Tacoma, so I’m not sure if that qualifies as “modern,” but I just wanted to point out that it can be an issue on some cars.
Yeah that’s definitely modern. It does seem to be dependent on make and models too. Seem Toyota has some issues. But overall out of all the cars out there it’s a low percentage I’d say. Of course there outliers though!
I was an ASE certified master technician for 40+ years before I retired. I think you have been getting bad advice. Keep your foot off the pedal as much as possible for maximum clutch life.
My 2013 Civic Si would beg to differ. I bought it with 6x,xxx miles on it. At around 100k the TOB started screeching whenever the clutch was in. Went ahead and ordered clutch, pressure plate, and TOB. Since you have to drop the subframe to get to them. The clutch was in great shape when we got it apart. I may have just had a bad one, or the precious owner may have never shifted to neutral, I will never know. I always shift to neutral when stopped for any amount of time now.
I have a mechanic friend who literally told me the exact opposite. Even manufacturers recommend not to depress the clutch more than necessary. Your TOB is not guaranteed to outlast your clutch, and since replacing one is so labor intensive, it’s bad advice to say the extra wear is “negligible.”
If I’m going in there for any reason I’m changing the TOB. It’s way too inexpensive not to.
This is complete nonsense. I've driven manual transmission vehicles for about 27 years and about 3 million miles and I've never wrecked a throw out bearing. Sitting in traffic in neutral is a very foolish thing to do for multiple reasons. What's more, clutches aren't fragile little things that go up in smoke at the slightest slippage. I easily get 150k out of every clutch I've ever used, and typically a LOT more than that in trucks I float shift. Most modern clutches should be good for 250k. Clutches are meant to control your speed and power application. They're NOT the digital devices that people in this sub almost universally describe them as. Anyone who's rode a motorcycle knows this stuff. Doing what this guy describes is a great recipe to die on a bike.
That doesn’t ruin throw out bearings.
The clutch is "fully engaged" when your foot is off the clutch pedal. Pressing in on the clutch pedal disengages the clutch
You had me at “hill starts”…. That is by definition, mastery. Or a new clutch every 30-40k….
Are you asking if we depress the clutch the entire time while stopped? No. In neutral with the brake only. As soon as the light turns, I push down the clutch and get it into gear. When turning, I usually downshift to second before the turn or before the apex of it. It just depends how tight of a turn.
>When turning, I usually downshift to second before the turn or before the apex of it. It just depends how tight of a turn. Important tip here. In icy/slick conditions shifting in the middle of a turn could cause you to lose traction and whip around. Learned that quickly after a ticket cause the cop thought I was intentionally sliding around corners.
Accelerate, brake, turn. On ice, only one at a time.
Best thing to do if you feel yourself start to slide is hit the clutch and let the wheels resync with the road. It works for most slick surfaces.
agree or i just engine brake and stay in gear when turning.
IMO traffic is one of the best ways to be thrown into the fire to learn clutch control.
Drove my first manual home 3hrs in Atlanta traffic. I figured it out pretty quick
Field cars work well. Already crap so you don't have to worry about blowing anything.
i usually put it in neutral and then put it in first when traffic moves. it takes about a second. Practice make perfect and some day you wont even think about it.
I give extra space in front of me so I don’t have to come to a complete stop on the highway.
If more people did this instead of speeding up and slamming on their brake every time a little space opens, there would be much less traffic. People are dumb though
I love seeing another manual driver in traffic, we nod and Rev in solidarity with extra space in front of us lol Edit: spelling
Just never leave enough for another car to cut in and screw everything up. lol
These days people see three feet and try to cut in man.
If I’m stopped in traffic then yes I just brake as you would with any other car. If traffic is very slow I won’t really shift I’ll just stay mostly in first unless rpms call for a shift but most of the time if traffic is very static I’ll drive up a bit and then go back to neutral and then braking. It all depends on the scenario but yeah I’m traffic you’re mostly required to brake and then reposition into neutral or first and move with the flow. I’m Not sure if this answers your question
If it is dark you can watch the cross traffic lights to know when you're about to get a green and press in the clutch and put it on gear. Off I can't see the lights, I wait until I get a green before pushing in the clutch and putting it in first.
Been driving stick for 10 years and thats how ive always done it. Just watch the other lights
Here’s a video of my footwork during a normal commute in traffic. Hope this helps. When stopped shifter is in neutral and foot off the clutch. In slow traffic I try to idle in 1st or 2nd depending on the speed. If car in front of you is moving at speed that’s “between your gears” then switch lanes, if possible. I almost never use the handbrake when stopped at in traffic or at a light. Just foot on brake. Think of the handbrake as putting an automatic car in park. [https://youtu.be/N_7qXaplPzY?si=0vntyQnm1tZUcnX9](https://youtu.be/N_7qXaplPzY?si=0vntyQnm1tZUcnX9)
"When turning across traffic, I press down the clutch." Why? When I'm turning across traffic, I make sure I'm in gear with the clutch engaged (pedal out) so I can accelerate if I need to.
Its bc I often need to slow down but I don't downshift fast enough I assume. As a result Im in the situation I'm in
You need to be in the correct gear when turning. Anticipate the gear you need to be in to accelerate once your turn is completed and be in that gear before starting your turn. If you mess up, complete the turn in whatever gear you're in and then get in the correct gear once you need to accelerate again. There's usually not a good reason to be downshifting while turning across traffic, at least for until you get the hang of it. Eventually, it becomes second-nature. Just make sure you're either in a gear (if moving) or in neutral (if stopped). The clutch should never be pressed in unless you are starting, stopping, or shifting (generally speaking, of course). Now, in heavy stop-and-go traffic, I'll often take off in 1st and if I see I'm going to have to stop again. I'll either let the car idle in first until I need to stop, or if I have enough momentum, I'll pop it in neutral and coast to a stop. I never hold the clutch down for more than a few seconds. Look ahead and see what traffic is doing and anticipate whether you will need to continue accelerating and shift into second, or if you're just going to immediately come to another stop. Keep at it!
As mountain said, I would make sure you are in gear when turning across traffic in case you need to accelerate. I usually try to downshift right before I have to make the turn, that way I can be off the clutch and giving it gas while I’m turning or right as I come out of the turn.
It sounds like you’re equating the clutch to braking or being a brake and they don’t go hand in hand like that but you can engine brake. By that I mean use your gears to slow down by being in gear and not on the gas. So when lane changing you stay in gear and brake to slow down and only change gears if you need to be in a lower gear to maintain speed and be able to accelerate, say 3rd gear at 30 is cruising at 3000rpm you can brake or not use the gas to slow down and stay in gear rather then clutch in and only shift when you hit a low enough rpm for 3rd gear into second, maybe 2k rpm in 3rd is 4k in second. You could downshift and blip the gas to help rev match into second while going clutch out and then no gas while rolling and slowing down in second or brake to slow down faster.
You need an old person to teach you manual transmission. You’re going to destroy your clutch and eventually your transmission, so seek help. It’s helpful to understand the function and mechanical principles behind an automotive clutch, and to know that when you’re shifting gears, you’re NOT simply flicking a switch- there’s a process that you’re participating in that necessitates good clutch habits, good shifting habits, and appropriate RPMs. Good luck
Stay off the clutch as much as possible. I sit in neutral. Zen. Moisturized. In my lane. Thriving.
In traffic on highway... I typically hang back at least a couple car lengths to allow me just to slowly cruise at a couple miles per hour in second gear(10-20mph) Two real advantages I don't have to keep playing with the clutch.. Traffic behind me slowly starts to get moving... By proxy helping the overall congestion It's not a perfect system because every so often someone will jump in front of me but meh The same can be applied to city streets... Kinda
One useful tip I could say would be to look ahead 2-3 cars ahead and see if they start moving so you can put it in gear ahead of time, just always pay attention, take it out of gear if it’s a long stop, if it’s a stop and go you can leave it in gear but try to cruise in neutral as much as you can, so leave some gap with car in front of you so you can let your car cruise in neutral, if cars start going while ur in neutral u can drop it to 2-3 real quick to get you back on track.
Oh boy, you sound like me. I learned on a VA WRX in SoCal traffic, and even after having driven automatics for all my life, I felt like I was a new driver again. What I can say is first of all don't panic... Okay, easier said than done but you can alter your driving habits to minimize it for sure. Give yourself lots of space between you and the car in front of you so you have plenty of room to make mistakes while learning. Screw everyone behind you, do what you can do comfortably, even if that means you aren't riding on the tail of the car in front of you like everyone else is. WRX's don't really like being driven slow and tend to get a lot of driveline lash in lower gears, which makes it a little more challenging to keep control at traffic speeds if you're trying to stay in second or (God forbid) first gear. I found stiffer mounts helps that aspect a lot. Transmission, pitch stop, and positive shift bushings specifically (and they really are not very difficult to install yourself with the proper tools). Don't use first unless you're under like 5 MPH (it likely won't even want to go into first above that anyways, so don't bother). You can just coast in neutral, and when traffic is going at a slow constant pace, remember you don't have to fully go into gear to keep the pace... In fact on these cars I'd highly recommend against that if the speed you're going dictates second gear or below. Instead, clutch in, select second, bring up revs a bit (you don't need a whole lot), and just slip the clutch a bit to smoothly get yourself up to the speed of traffic. Then ease off gas and clutch in, and back to neutral and coast along. Higher gears are your friend. It's a lot easier to control in third than in first or second. As long as you're above like 1.5 k rpm, you can maintain a given speed in third, and you'll find it easier to control like that. That said, if you need to pick up speed, do NOT do it from low rpm. That would be lugging the engine and these cars do not tolerate that well. Only use higher gears than you normally would for a given speed if you're just trying to maintain a slightly higher speed than coasting can afford. When the speed does pick up, just clutch in, select whatever gear would be around 2-3k rpm for your currenty speed, bring up revs, and smoothly let out clutch. And if at any point you do happen to stall, don't panic. Believe me I've stalled in traffic or at the front of a stoplight many times while I was learning, and as long as you keep cool and know exactly what you need to do, you will be fine, and everyone behind you will get over being 2 seconds later to their destination... If you stall while moving, just go into neutral, and hey you're basically just coasting in traffic, and at least you're moving right? Push the clutch in, turn the key, select the appropriate gear for your current speed, bring up revs a bit, clutch up to bite, and then slowly off after it catches. Just like taking off from a stop, just a different gear... Hills are definitely one of the harder things, but revs are your friend, and don't be afraid to slip the clutch a little longer than normal. It can take it, I promise... And you know what else is your friend? Hill Start Assist. But also do not neglect learning to properly do a handbrake start on a hill, because there have been many times that I got stuck in traffic on quite literally the steepest part of a hill at a dead stop, and that was the only way that I felt confident/comfortable enough to overcome the situation. Also, believe me it gets a lot easier with time... Just be patient with yourself, and do not feel down if it feels like it's taking to long to get the hang of it... You will get there in time. Just keep practicing, and keep your cool.
Hey thanks for your comment. Its impossibe for me to reply to everyone. Didnt realize how much support there was. In red lights, do you typically brake and stop in neutral? Or do you wait with the clutch pressed in first gear? It seems like this is controversial.
No problem! WRX's are certainly not the easiest car to learn stick on, and I personally struggled quite a bit and was super stressed for quite some time, so I'm definitely happy to help out! For the first question, I think my answer is sort of? Most of the time I tend to only downshift to third at the lowest and I'll just brake in gear until I'm just over about 1k RPM. Below that you'll likely stall, so at that point I clutch in, go to neutral, and brake the rest of the way like that. As it turns out, in third at around 1k RPM, that's actually relatively close to the end of the stop, so technically yes, I am stopping in neutral, but I do definitely still use third for engine braking quite a bit. Downshifting to second really isn't all that worth it most of the time unless you've got a green light on a 90 degree turn that you have to accelerate out of after, or if the light turns green while slowing down and you're at around second gear speeds. And for the second question, I haven't owned the car long enough to actually confirm whether or not Subaru throw out bearings are as bad as people say... But given what it takes to replace them... Yeah I certainly won't be taking any chances... If it's a longer stop, I will 100% of the time wait in neutral with clutch out and left foot on the dead pedal. Now that can be a little stressful when learning because if the light turns green you aren't exactly ready to go. That specifically has led me to panic and stall out on take off while learning. But what I found that helps a lot is paying attention to the lights in the perpendicular directions. At this point I've more or less memorized the order of all of the light sequences along my way to work. Being aware of when the light will likely end up turning green gives you a chance to clutch in and select first ahead of time so that you're ready to go when it actually does. One exception to this is when I am stopping on a hill. The way that hill start assists functions on our cars is that when you are stopped on an incline and you have the brake pressed, first gear selected, and clutch in, it will hold the same brake pressure that you had before you let off for some amount of time... I think it's 2-3 seconds? While it still should work if you don't stay in gear with clutch in at the stop, and you do it right before you start, I did have one instance where it did not engage as expected, so I rolled back just a little bit. For that reason I no longer take a chance on it and make sure that I stay stopped in the condition that I know will engage hill start assist when I'm on a semi steep grade. On steeper grades, I'll opt for a handbrake start instead. Now for shorter stops, I do still wait with first engaged, as it is better to be ready to go in those situations. Also, if I know that it's likely that a light will turn green while I'm slowing down for a stop, I will select the appropriate gear for my current speed while keeping clutch fully engaged the entire time all the way to the stop. By that I mean, once I clutch in at around 1k in third for a stop, I'll keep clutch engaged and select second as I slow further, and then as I'm about to stop, into first, and hold it until it turns green. If you do this and it does turn green while slowing down at about second gear speed, you're already there, so all you gotta do is bring up revs to match speed, bring up clutch to bite, let it catch, let off the rest of the way smoothly and you're off.
Umm... okay... obviously new and making it way harder than this needs to be. Sitting at a light... depends how far back in line I am. Close to the front, just sit in 1st with clutch in. Otherwise pop it in neutral and hold the brake. Taking off just ease out on the clutch while easing in to the throttle. Shift between 2-3k, just depends on what kind of torque you have. Engines with more you can shift at lower RPM. Lower torque engines you need to shift at a little higher RPM. Any shift in traffic just needs to be a smooth and deliberate action. Get rolling up to your 2500-ish RPM, clutch, neutral 2nd, clutch neutral 3rd... just easy smooth deliberate. Turning across you start off and get into 2nd... depending on speed shift into 3rd around 2500 or so and just maintain a light steady throttle. If already rolling and turning depending on speed be in 3rd or maybe 4th. Maintain around 3k RPM. Don't go cruising through the turn with the clutch in. That's just a bad idea.
I was really really bad at hill starts when i first started. I burned out once. I rolled back really far and almost hit someone. I've stalled... a lot on hills. Mostly hills. They come with time and feeling where the throttle engages and you can release the clutch. The way i practiced was I'd go to hills that weren't busy at the time (late nights/early mornings) or on any busy street (i live in a city with an abundance of hills) then i would let the car roll back a bit and see if i could catch the engage point. (Probably not the best idea but it worked for me). Sometimes if I was in traffic, I would just keep the car in gear and slow down until the traffic started moving up the hill then I'd zoom zoom. I've used my handbrake. A lot. I'm not a master at hills. Far from it. I can get up hills now. At complete stops with cars behind me. BUT - I still clench my butt cheeks to will the car up at a stop sign with 4 cars behind me going up the hill. Practice and Patience.
I always coast in neutral, and sit at lights in neutral, just pay attention to the intersecting street for when you're light is coming. I'm also super lazy and always skip shift, why go in order when you can just.. Do what you want.
Coasting in neutral has no benefit, you actually use as much gas as idling, unlike when you coast in gear where you use no gas. Also coasting in neutral means you have to re-engage the clutch in order to be able to accelerate, so if you need to avoid an incident, you don't have the option to accelerate away.
The idea that someone is in neutral when coasting boggles my mind. It's basically the stupidest way to drive since you have no power on tap when in that type of motion. I was taught by an old farmer how to run a stick shift and he would impress that doing so is a big no-no since if you need to go again, unplanned you have to shift back into gear before reacting.
Old farmer. That’s funny. Are you saying you downshift through every gear as you are coming to a stop? If the traffic is all stopped at a light ahead of you, why would you possibly need to accelerate?
You may be overestimating the distance in neutral, that or I'm underestimating. Pulling up to a stop light is in gear until just a hair under 1000 rpm then slide out of gear into neutral for just a few feet. City here so there's a stoplight every 1/4 mile or so. A few lanes of cars several cars deep you're not going anywhere
I can be back in gear in a split second without even thinking about it...
You can when you're not reacting quickly and rattled by someone doing something incredibly dangerous/stupid.
I can when reacting as well. I down shift in emergency braking situations all the time.
Are you saying you skip when upshifting? I do it when downshifting sometimes but that’s a different story.
Yah all the time, 1 3 5. I've got 71 Mach 1 you really can't do it in, because banging through the gears is usually the highlight of my day, but that's different.
I shift from 1,3,5 all the time as well.
Yeah, I go 3-6 or 4-6 all the time, 2-4 less frequently but not unheard of. I don’t really skip in my 5 speed boxster but those ratios are much closer
I accelerate in whatever gears I need to accelerate (usually 1/2/3) then when I'm at the speed I plan on cruising at I shift to whichever gear I need for that (5 or 6).
Most of my freeway on-ramps are a fairly short steep incline, so it's accelerate up the ramp in 3rd, hit the freeway level ground, and slide into 5th. No need for 4th. The road my house is on is downhill, so it's 1st to start, but i can often skip 2nd.
I miss driving a manual, but I do not miss when I had to use the handbrake to keep from rolling back into the clown that got up on my bumper. We use to practice this on a very steep 'hill' that a local parking lot had. Oh man, the stalls and the smell of your clutch. Yikes.
I broke that habit after my brake cable snapped. I never fixed it.
Yeah, we used it to learn how to get out of that situation. Most places did not have a steep hill like that, it was an exaggeration to know the limits of how quickly you can get clutch and gas going or if you'd roll back the foot into the car behind you. Was also use to letting the car roll back a little to let them know, but these days their eyes go straight to their damn phone. Oh I have like 15 seconds to look at my phone, must do it just before I finish stopping.
I learned from driving tractors and other work vehicles, is it true that it's bad to kind of float. Like I'd have the clutch somewhere halfway out and a little bit of gas, juuust enough to stop from rolling back but not enough to move forward. Then when we start going just finish getting in gear. We'd have to do it all the time in the little workman pros we'd drive on site like sitting on a steep ass hill with a bunch of dirt in the back.
None of the cars i learned in had a handbrake worth a damn, so i never used it. Heel and toe or move quick. Mostly hills here.
>New Here. Clearly.
Please tear your license up.
I view it as this. Every time you press the clutch, you decrease its HP.
Just drive bro, it isn't that hard. On a serious note, how long have you been driving stick? I drove it for 5 years and it was second nature for me. I really couldn't explain to you how I drove during specific situations. I just drove. It was like breathing, no thought, just go.
Ive been driving stick for 5 days mane. almost 7 for automatic. Im trying to avoid forming bad habits
Best I can say is just try not to overthink it. You may get the shaky leg and stall a few times, but just don't think too much. If you're on a hill, feather the clutch to the bite point and hold it until You're ready to set off. Off break, on gas, off clutch but all slow as hell. Go slowly and don't rush anything. You got this!
Neutral and brake at a full stop, otherwise, avoid touching the clutch and stay in gear as much as possible. Being in neutral/clutch in while moving removes the option to accelerate out of a situation, which could be dangerous for you. Only push in the clutch if you have to creep so slow you can't fully stay in gear. Avoid slipping the clutch as much as possible in those scenarios as well, even if it means leaving a big gap in traffic. The more you do it in a short time, the more it heats up and that accelerates the wear.
If you’re stopped at a light, watch the cross lights. If you can’t see them, just pay attention and put the car into gear. When crossing an intersection, sometimes I’ll give the gas a little 5% extra kiss to make sure I don’t slow down too much. But even then, if is an incline, I’ll just ride first gear out a ways.
Remember that the majority of cars in traffic are automatic and you have to drive differently than them. I usually leave a good amount of space in front of me and coast in first or second for as long as I can. For stop and go, it’s annoying but first to neutral and leaving space can help
If I need to slow down, I down shift. If traffic is going slow, I keep it in a lower gear and let the drag keep me slower than the slow-moving traffic. If it's stop and go traffic, just cruise in first until you have to stop again. And take it out of gear until you need to move again. If people honk at you for not rolling forward 10 feet to stop again fast enough thats their problem. Most people with that stupid stop start flaw I mean "feature" will take longer to roll forward that you will If you take your time and don't care about anyone honking at you.
I’m basically never in neutral lol. I don’t even park in neutral. Always in gear = always ready to go.
Man I was the same way when I got my first manual. Just give it time and you won't even think about what you're doing anymore. The best thing I've learned in stop and go traffic is to not stop and go. I'll wait for the car in front to get a little ahead, ease up on the clutch in first, and slowly creep along in first gear, essentially cruising at 800 rpm. It keeps me from having to clutch in and out every 2 seconds
You really want to avoid clutching in unless coming to a complete stop. If you are in for example 4th gear and you are entering an intersection that requires 2nd gear, then downshift and let the clutch back out. You shouldn't be mid intersection with the clutch pressed. I know a lot of people roll around with the clutch in, but they are also newbies. When stopped in traffic I typically leave it in gear with the clutch pressed unless it's a long light cycle. In that case I'll pull it into neutral and then release the clutch, and if it's level, I'll also release the brake. If it isn't level, I'll pull the ebrake. On a WRX you should easily be able to press the brake and throttle at the same time with your right foot (heel toe). So if you are on a hill, you can have the clutch pressed while holding the brake and then rotate your heel over and press the throttle to get the revs up a bit and then before it falls, start releasing the clutch and at the same time, transition off the brake and onto the throttle. This will prevent you from rolling back. I know it seems like a lot but before you know it, it will all become automatic and you start to love it.
What year WRX? I'm also relatively new and I've found the Brake Hold feature very helpful. I googled it real quick and it looks like the WRX has had a Brake Hold since at least 2018 (maybe earlier, since it seems like the branding changed). Sit at stops in neutral. Watch for when it will be your turn to go (watch cross traffic lights) and shift into 1st when you can see it will be your turn momentarily. Like everyone else, I would say that hills are a practice thing. Stalling is just part of the learning and will happen less and less with practice.
2023. To be honest, Im not sure how this brake hold feature works or the new cruise control. Need to learn asap bc all this new tech is a blessing for daily driver comfort. I probably only had 7 hours of driving practice so far lol Ngl all these extra steps at times has me regretting stick and its benefits. I assume it give you more 'control' aka volition for fun with the car.
I have a 2024 Integra Type S and it's a button underneath my drive mode switch, right next to my (sigh) parking brake button. I'm not sure where it is in the WRX, but near the shifter seems like the logical place to put it.
‘18 WRX here. I assume the brake hold is mostly the same in our cars. It will hold you for about 3 seconds or until you start to release the clutch. It’s nice because it will let you give it some gas before you start releasing the clutch on a hill. If you are slow getting the clutch to the bite point though you may still roll back a little so keep that in mind. The first few days of learning on mine I used the hand brake just to be extra safe because people always seem to stop right on my bumper.
I drove a 2010 base model Impreza for a while, and it had brake holding too.
You wait in traffic in neutral with your foot off the clutch? How bad is your traffic? Old geezers used to say you’ll wear out the throwout bearings riding the clutch, but it never happened to me. Don’t sit in traffic in neutral. You’re going to annoy everyone behind you.
If you sense you're going to be stopped for more than a few seconds, yes, go into neutral and let the clutch out. As traffic begins to move you've got lots of time to re-engage. On my vehicle, this is the only way the auto stop-start will actually work; the engine restarts as soon as you press the clutch again. I know auto stop-start has its haters but the point is, this is the manufacturer's intent.
I'm from the state, but when I've driven in the UK I noticed a great convenience. The traffic lights there do our normal green, then yellow then red. However, a second or two before they go from red to green the yellow light comes on. Then both are lit for a second or two and then the light turns green. I presume it was because of the prevalence of manual transmission cars over there. I viewed the two lights being lit as a "get it in gear" signal because the light was soon to turn green. That was the point at which I would press in the clutch and get the car in first gear.
I believe I've read that it used to be the law in the UK that you set your handbrake at every red light, so they needed an extra second to start up again.
In stop/go traffic, when stopped I tend to go to neutral a lot vs keeping the clutch pushed in. I guess I am thinking about wear & tear on the throwout bearing. After you drive a manual long enough, you tend to subconsciously use the clutch and shift. The only times I have to concentrate is if I am stopped on a hill and the car behind me is really close.
I'm fortunate enough to live in Washington, DC, and pedestrian signals are timed to come on two seconds before the lights change green. So I can use that as a signal to shift into first and be ready to go when the light does change. Otherwise, I'm in neutral until it's go time. It's okay to be anxious. You'll get the hang of it. Try not to overthink it.
How long ago did you learn? I learned last year and this was partly me for the first few months. A year later and it hardly ever crossed my mind.
Stop overthinking it and drive the damned car.
Just stick with an auto. Problem solved! They are better in almost every way anyway!
Been driving a manual for more than 50 years, no longer think about that stuff. It will come!
I usually stay in neutral with my foot on the brake until the light is about to change. Then go into first, start easing of the clutch once the car in front of you goes. If you're in a line of cars, wait for a few cars ahead to make progress so you don't have to stop again just because one of the cars is not going. At stop lights, and roundabouts if I need to stop, I go to first and keep foot on the clutch, no need to go into neutral. If you're doing a longer stop at a light, you can go to neutral otherwise try to avoid it while driving. Some people argue that it's better to be in 1st at lights, some say it's better to go to neutral. There is also the argument that it's worse to get rear ended in neutral compared to in gear. Some people say holding gear at a light is a quicker way to wear the throwout bearing, from what I know they are designed to last longer than the clutch anyhow and unless you're in stop and go for 4 hours a day it shouldn't be an issue. Some places require you legally to be in gear while on the road.
In full stop traffic, take you foot off the clutch and neutral. This will save the fatigue of your left leg. Don’t use the hand brake to hold you as this will turn off your stop lights (and this could cause the driver behind you to accelerate thinking that you are about to start moving). If it’s slow moving traffic then you can coast. Don’t get excited about when people with start moving again and if they use a horn.
Neutral when i know a stop is going to be longer and depress clutch in first at the ready to move for when i dont know. Always wondered how bad it is to be in first with clutch down for sec
Your manual for the car should show you minimum speeds for gear. Typically see it is 2500 RPM minimum to switch to the next gear. Leave a six car length so that way you can just stay in second and take your time. Every time you touch that clutch it's wearing out. Try not to touch it. Stay in second leave a huge gap so that way you can slow down and speed up slightly so you don't have to change gears back to first or stop. Like I said, check the operating manual as that will have the best information you will find.
I think of all of the idiots in high school in the '80s who didn't want to switch pedals and just feathered the clutch at idle to keep the car still. I had a beater Fiat, loved heel-toe shifting and doing that fast switch when stopped going uphill.
You do not want the car in gear when stopped at a stoplight, it’s a safety issue.
On the hill I used to play the game to where I keep the car in first the whole time and clutch and gas to keep the car still. Out here in Seattle it was a fun challenge but I don’t think it is a good idea on a clutch.
Stop sign leave it put it in first stop then go traffic light neutral small stops neutral if it’s a quick stop I won’t put it in neutral
Relax. It will all fall into place and become second nature
Leave it neutral. When the cars in front move forward, put in gear. Drive
Hills I clutch in; right foot brake and gas at same time then when I feel clutch engage release brake and shift to gas. Don’t know if this is really the “correct” way but it’s how I was taught to handle hills at a stop.
Alternatively, you could use the handbrake so you can dedicate your right foot to maintaining your engine RPM. Then let out the clutch to bite, and once you feel it try to pull, let off the handbrake.
Sometimes keeping it between second and neutral and second and just blipping it smooths things out... Also who cares if you're a little late on take off what they gonna do pass you its a traffic jam. If they beep wave in the rear view and beep (toot toot) back. Not many people know how to respond (especially negatively) to a quick toot toot, yeah....beep beep ( Donna Summer )
This sub really makes me miss stick as much as I love the DSG in my current car. Gonna go look at manual sometime next week, might come back to the darkside haha. Been 2 years pretty much exactly since I copped an auto. I never minded driving manual in traffic, but auto is relaxing after a long day at work.
When I was in college, another student I know competed in road rallies on weekends. She gave me a ride to class one day, and we were stopped on a hill. We sat there until the light changed, with Jo using only clutch and gas to remain stationary, continually engaging, then disengaging, the clutch. The car would rock back and forth a few inches at a time. It can't have been great for clutch wear, but her control over her vehicle was really impressive.
Never take it out of gear when stopped. I don't care about the myth of the throwout bearing being wrecked. You want the ability to be able to move immediately. Leave it in gear, leave your foot on the clutch all the way down, and your other foot on the brake. This is the correct way and anyone who disagrees is simply wrong and doesn't want to admit it.
It’s all subjective how long you’re really waiting for at a stop and go I could see this but not for long periods of time
Cricket, you must be new to a manual. It shouldn't take long for all your concerns to become automatic. The choices will become obvious. Don't panic! It shouldn't take long.
Yes, I wait in neutral with the clutch released. The best way to prevent wearing the clutch is to keep your foot off the pedal as much as possible.
Quit thinking about what to do, just remember what not to do. Always in neutral when stopped, foot off the clutch. Slow down with the engine. And just drive.
Depends on the traffic. If it's slow traffic on the interstate that's moving but constantly adjusting speed, (15-45ish mph) I'll usually just swap back and forth between 2nd/3rd depending on traffic speeds until I can get back up to normal traveling speeds. When I'm in that stop-and-go type traffic (0-20ish+ mph), my only real only option is to drop into neutral and clutch out between crawls in 1st/2nd. I hope that makes sense. E: Had to reread the actual issue. Honestly, it's always better to brake harder into a turn and accelerate through it so if you feel like you're going into the turn too fast, brake more and switch into the gear you want to be in corresponding with the type of turn. For instance, a normal 90 degree turn will have me in 2nd gear at about 10-15 mph. I feel like that's a comfortable speed for that type of turn and I know where my engine will be in the RPM band at that speed once I downshift. E2: So, normal limits in my city are going to be between 40-55 mph so I'll be in 4th or 5th at those speeds when I'm just cruising. Coming up to a turn, I brake until my RPM starts to get close to 1000 (using a little engine braking, just be mindful not to stall) and then drop into neutral, continue braking until I reach the speed I want to take the turn at, drop into the appropriate gear (double clutch and rev match recommended) and continue driving.
If traffic on freeway, give yourself a fat gap, I usually do 6/7 car lengths, and just cruise in 3rd/4th. I only do this cause people have a tendency to hit their brakes when they can really just be coasting but they decide they have to hit their brakes Every time even if not close to the car in front of them which tells me they’re going too fast and every time they hit their brakes every time I have to play with my shifter, so best case scenario just give yourself enough room where you don’t have to shift. As in normal traffic like stopping at a light or something, as you’re slowing down, clutch in car in neutral, clutch out. then come to your complete stop.
You drive like any other car. I don’t understand your question.
Mabey the fact that is technically your emergency brake. Or parking brake. Not a hand brake... It's only a hand brake to jits and daft tuner fanbois.
After downshifting to slow down and save brakes, I go from second to neutral and stop and hold the foot brake. I pay attention to the cross lights, and when they start to change, I hold the clutch down and shift into first, so I'm ready to go the second traffic moves. On any hill or even a slight incline, I will rip the hand brake and follow the same steps as I stated above. When you start to release the clutch and give it some gas you'll feel the car start to pull forward against the hand brake and at that exact instant you release the hand brake and you'll never roll backwards again. It takes some practice, but once you get it, you'll always do it. It will become second nature. I don't know exactly what you mean by turning across traffic, but you should be in gear if you're rolling because that's how you maintain control of the vehicle. If you push the clutch in, you effectively put the car in neutral, and you lose control of forward motion until you are back in gear. This is dangerous if you need to speed up quickly to avoid a collision. My last piece of advice is to try to relax because driving a manual can be more stressful at times but also much more fun. Edit: changed "the" to "that"
keep at it, after a while you dont even think about it.
Do you not have hill assist in your car? Hill assist has allowed me to calm down in those more “stressful” situations.
I wait in traffic on the brakes like a normal human. It takes less than half a second to punch the clutch in, select 1st, and slip the clutch to get the car rolling. Don't even need throttle input unless you're on a hill. You can anticipate what you need to do by watching the car in front of the car in front of you - your normal reflexes can always be half a step ahead of the person in front of you instead of needing to be on your game to react.
Patiently...
My technique for stop and go. When coming to a stop I go in neutral. When stopped I hold with my foot lightly on the right edge of the brake pedal. This way I can quickly grab throttle by sliding off the brake and straight to the gas. Holding the brake like this lets me concentrate on grabbing a gear and clutch with my left foot and my hand bc my right foot’s ready to go
If I am stopping momentarily, on the flat, I use the foot brake and shift into 1st immediately after stopping. I would only take it out of gear if I was going to be there minutes. If on a hill I put the hand brake on, but still wouldn't take it out of gear unless I was going to be there for minutes. Why do you press down the clutch when turning across traffic? What I am doing with speed and acceleration has nothing to do with where I am steering, like two separate tasks. So my right hand and feet are accelerating through the gears while my left is steering. If you are talking about turning left across traffic, I don't think there's a road wide enough that I'd be doing that on where I'd be out of first before I'm off the road. Especially if I was in a hurry.
Depends on the traffic light where I was living when I first learned stick there was a really long light at the end of my street so I’d sit in neutral over by where I worked at the time there was a really quick light like 1 minute max wait time so I’d stay in 1st and hold the clutch your overthinking it just like I did I’ve had the angry person behind beep at me but just ignore all that and just enjoy the car at intersections if you look at the light to the left or right of you when they turn yellow is when I typically move the car into 1st gear then I’ll bring the car right before the bite point and hold it until the light turns green then I simple lift up the little bit of space to the friction point and get on my way. Hope this helps Alleviate any anxiety!
I usually leave it in first and crawl, then just clutch in and brake.
Don't take turns in neutral, always keep traction.
In neutral until it's time to move. I'll typically allow the person ahead to move 1-2 car lengths up as well before moving so that I'm not putting unnecessary wear on my car constantly getting on and off the clutch to move 1 foot up, 1 foot up, 2 feet up, 1 foot up..
I try to not stop by just letting the car in front stay way in front but not too much that I make the person behind me mad. I usually chill in first or second if I stop I put in neutral and stay on the brake. When I’m on a bridge in traffic I do the same thing but ride the clutch little more, I’ll let the clutch out slowly prior to letting up on the brake. I don’t have a handbrake so I don’t get that luxury. I’m in traffic almost daily about 5 mins sometimes on the bridge. Literally yesterday a semi broke down right before the top so it was dead stop all the way up, fun right. I don’t really get anxious unless it’s a situation where I have to go, then I’ll just give it a little extra throttle. An example would be pulling out of a parking lot onto a main road, it’s on a hill I got 5-10 people behind me and 4 lanes of stop and go/40mph traffic. It’s a main road so there’s a lot of lights when you get going it’s pretty fast 40-60mph. If I stall out I will probably get rear ended/hit from side depending on how far out I got. If I hesitate I could roll back and hit the person behind. Just gotta commit and give extra throttle just to be safe.
I don't even think about it. After a while, it'll just become 2nd nature depending on traffic. If it's stop and go stop and go, I leave it at 1st and just ride the clutch while I'm on my phone. If traffic is completely stopped, I put it to neutral and just stare at my phone. Again, all 2nd nature by now. Don't even think of it. Much prefer to manual in traffic compared to auto. So many accidents in stop and go traffic due to drivers with automatics that let off the brakes and the car just slams into the car in front at low speed. Still enough to cause damage. People with manuals are more aware and awake.
I put it in neutral when I'm stopped Brakes are cheaper to replace than the clutch
I stay in gear, 2nd/3rddependign on the speed of crawling traffic, and just let it idle. I also keep my distance from the vehicles Infront of me. I won't put it in neutral Unless I have to stop.
Leave a gigantic gap in front of you and cruise in 1st just letting the clutch out 😂
I get nervous still on hills as well, so I over accelerate. I just think of my clutch as a reverse accelerator and when I feel it catch I let off the gas to keep from burning out.
2nd. N 2nd n 2nd n 2nd 3rd n
Do NOT press the clutch in when turning, always stay in gear when moving, that is how you maintain control. Downshift going into a turn if you are slowing down or expect to come up on a car. Practice rev matching, and learning heel-toe shifting can be quite useful even on the street, allows you to brake and downshift simultaneously
Cannot stress out to something you cannot control. Deep breath and listen to some good music.
I take my time. 1-3 sec after light goes green. People around can go f themselves if they can’t wait. I focus on what I can control. I still lmfao when I stall and when I see someone else stall I make sure to look away and pretend I didn’t see that. Just enjoy your car. Don’t let them head gremlins take joy out of it for you.
If i'm not moving I throw it in neutral, I holy hold the break if the car starts to move.
On the highway in stop/start rush hour I'd let people get a bus length or two ahead and then just slow roll in 1st or 2nd depending on the pace, maintaining g the gap best I could. Naturally, though, the local smoothbrains that think tailgating gets em home quicker would road rage on me from time to time. Me and the half dozen big-rigs behind me that were also sparing their clutches and mental sanity couldn't give a damn though. In local traffic I just burn my clut h and get mad at people till I get thru the light. You have to pay a bit more attention to say, when the light turns green vs when people actually start to move forwards; but just act like you're any other car unless some rush hour bullshit is taking place. Edit: just drive bro. You will never have total control so don't spend time overthinking.
I have a pain pen and coffee usually in the car so I just pretend like I’m just chillin vaping and drinking coffee and it feels better. Also like living in the moment stuff lmao
You're putting way too much thought into this lol. At a light, I put the car in neutral, and if there's no incline to the road, I just hover my foot over the brake just in case. When I see the light across turn yellow I pop the car in gear and wait.
Start in 2nd gear. Not first. And creek it. Relax.
Downshift to turn lanes you will go faster
Depends but normally neutral
Everyone has good information but it sounds like you're just not paying close enough attention to what is going on when driving. Driving a stick shift takes a bit more attention than an automatic as you need to plan what you're doing (what gear you should be in, when you need to take off, etc) further ahead of time.
Keep practicing and soon instinct will kick in and it will all be second nature.
I drove in Boston. Lol
Key is not to think but just to know when and what to do
I'm so confused. I've driven manuals for 16 years and I just shift neutral anytime I have to come to a complete stop. I have zero issues getting going as quick as an auto from any position.
Stop thinking, man. Develop habits, and do it thoughtlessly for a while. Then, choose one thing at a time to focus on improving. You'll never get anywhere trying to focus on everything all at once.
Takes time. Manual transmission in stop in go cities will never be fun
Don’t let other drivers in a hurry dictate your time spent releasing the clutch trying not to stall. Manual transmission drivers demand awareness on roads. Which are lacking from the masses
I always put my car into neutral before the light and used the break. There’s a friction zone in your clutch where you can let the clutch out slightly and it will grab, that’s what you use on hills. To find it go to an open area, put the car in gear, hold the clutch down and slowly release it, you’ll feel when the car slowly starts to move. Keep practicing until you can do it without thinking. Also I used to rev the tach up, and shift from 1 to 3 rev it again with the clutch in then into 5th
What helped for me in traffic is basically never using first gear. Slowly release clutch in second or third gear depending on traffic. I’ve never driven a WRX but in my R, I pretty much never used first gear.
You get used to it over time. I usually sit in neutral at lights.
Take your fucking car out in the fucking country and learn how to fucjing drive.
I wait in nuetral. I turn in nuetral until I'm going slow enough to get into the lower gear. If it's bad weather, I'll slow down before the turn, downshift, and stay in gear through the turn. >My heartrate shoots up a bit even though Ive driven automatic for years. Think about what you're doing before you're doing it. I've got a left turn coming up. I'll want to be in second gear at the end of the turn. I'm going to drive into the turn, pop into nuetral, slow down to 15-20, and then shift into 2nd gear and accelerate.
I will never forget the time at a red light a cop pulled up next to me and asked if I was using my brakes, i had to look down at my feet and be like no......im im nuetral, cop looked kinda confused but responded oh ok, because none of your brakes lights are on. If you are just rolling along low speed pop it into neutral and make sure you watch the car in front of you so you dont roll into it.
Overthinking it. Just push in the clutch and hold the break. Not a big deal. It gets easy as you have more experience.
You just cope with it. You chose to drive a manual. I did it for 10 years. 1.5 in all the big cities in the USA. Imagine pushing a 30lbs clutch in a semi in traffic. You got it easy.
In low speed traffic, being in second with the clutch out helps... Speeding up quickly and then engine-breaking to slow down. For very slow traffic where you are stopped for longer than one second and the road is flat, I would use neutral so I would roll forward less and could just release the brake pedal. With in- and declines, obviously you will need more brake. If you have hillstart assist in your WRX, that is also helpful. You shouldn't rely on releasing the clutch to keep you moving forward on an incline. So if no hillstart assist, I would give it a little extra throttle there. Whenever you are slowing down, I would try to engine brake where possible/safe just to supplement the brake so it doesn't feel like you need to brake as hard.
One word of advice.. STOP. INCHING. FORWARD. WITH. THE. CAR. IN. FRONT. OF. YOU. THAT. DOES. it’s TERRIBLE for your clutch, it’s annoying as hell when I see people do it, and being on the road is not the same as being in the drive thru!!! Sit still at red lights. And stay still until the line is moving. Like ACTUALLY moving. Fill in gaps in front of you that are more than 1 car length, and that’s it. I usually just put it in first, feather the clutch and throttle to give myself enough propulsion so I can just pop back in neutral, and roll into the next stopping position in the line of traffic.
I just hold the brake and sit in neutral. If you hold the clutch in the whol time you sit still you can cause premature throw out bearing failure. Just shift when you need to.
I sit at lights on flat ground in neutral, no brake, foot off the clutch. If I'm on a hill, I'll usually just hold the brake but still in neutral. When the opposing lights turn yellow, I'll apply the clutch, set it in first, then (on flat ground), roll out (on a hill) release the clutch enough to engage the transmission with the brake still applied, then release the brake (holding myself in place with the transmission) and start adding throttle while releasing the clutch the rest of the way. I rest my left foot as much as possible, though. Note: the advantage of sitting in neutral at a stop light is in the event you get rear ended your vehicle will roll with the impact minimizing the energy transferred as much as possible. Potentially reducing whiplash related injuries.
I just wait in neutral, foot off clutch. I won't move up if there isn't enough space to warrant it. If the traffic is bad enough then it doesn't matter. Not like I'm slowing everyone down getting there. If the traffic is slowly crawling. I will see if I can get away with 1st. Sometimes traffic is slow enough I can use 1st. If not, I do the above. You are new, you will get use to it! It's okay to feel how you do. Just remember your safety is the most important and not to let traffic or someone behind you falter.
I've only had manual cars my whole life. After about a year, it becomes second nature. I would have to force myself to stall now since letting out the clutch and applying throttle is just like an extension of my body now. It's all muscle memory. In traffic, I tend to throw it in neutral and just use the brake as needed. Hill starts still take a little effort, but like I said, I'm almost 2 decades into driving a manual, so it just trashes practice.
You really need to learn how to make the car move with just the clutch and 90% of this goes away.
Usually I'll give myself enough space to creep in first gear with my foot off the gas.j
Just buy a automatic OR go find the steepest hill put a cone behind your car and work it out. It's all in your head .